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Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 22 (view)

Extra Terrestrial Life Posted: 11/18/2009 11:06:53 AM
I believe any conclusion we must base on the existance of alien life must be based on our actual observations of the universe. And everywhere we look in the universe, we see it is outright hostile to all forms of life. >>>In my opinion, ET is out there, but wisely maintains a 'hands off' policy towards our primitive, warlike species. How do you know the intentions of aliens? How do you know they, too, are not warlike? And why would they give a damn about us eitherway? Or are you simply making shit up? >>>to suppose that Earth is the only cradle of life and even intelligence is arrogant Why? There have been Billions upon Billions of speices, and only a dozen or so reached a level of intelligence that can be considered human-like. You claim its arrogant to think the universe doesn't have another intelligent life- I say its arrogant to look at the vast and varied history of life on our planet, with billions of lifeforms having existed, thrived, then gone extinct, and to conclude the universe must have lifeforms that act and think identical to the kind of life you see in your lifetime. Even if there is life in the universe, why -must- there be other intelligent life? Clearly intelligent life is the minority, and evolution does not exist to gear life towards intelligent life. >>> Europa and Mars are known to possess the 'right stuff'...water and trace chemicals plus time. Mars has no Magnetic Sphere, and Europa is far too close to Jupiter, and thus both planets experience waves of radiation slaming against it- it would be an absolute mircle for life to survive in such a place. Saying wheres theres water theres life is like saying that where theres wood, theres fire. And thats simply not the case. >>>you are right man, and may i add that we are not even the most intelligent on our own planet, what dumbasses we are if compared to ants or bees. If you believe a human existance is so futile and stupid, then why not abandon all technology and conviences and live the more intelligent life amoungst nature? >>>Are there more universes? Thats a contradiction in terms. Uni in Universe implies one. >>>Humans evolved in Antartica 5 million years ago when it was still moderately warm and before any Ice Age. Uhhh.....No. Heres how the planet looked FIFTY million years ago- they aren't touchin' http://www.scotese.com/newpage9.htm >>>So you take a 1% chance one of those planets can support life 20,000,000 So you take a 1% chance one of those planets HAS life on it 200,000 Finally, you take a 1% chance one of those life bearing planets has intelligent life on it and your still left with thousands of planets. These are all made up numbers, though. If you want serious debate, you must be willing to use actual observations, not "wouldn't it be nice if" scenerios Also, I'm pretty sure the chances of intelligent life would be more like 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000001% or even worse odds. The other stats- we don't know, so all discussion of it is moot, because its like asking how many Watermelons are on the surface of Jupiter.- but intelligent life? we have an example of the odds right here on Earth. >>>If intelligent life could evolve here, it's impossible that it couldn't have happened else where. So then are there mermaids? I mean, mathicatially speaking, not only is it possible intelligent life could be in the Oceans, but its far more likely than on Land, because life has been in the Oceans longer, and is more diverse. Math doesn't make fact- esspecially when you're making up the numbers.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 332 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 10/31/2009 1:42:41 PM
Bah- Frogo made such excellent points, it really discouraged me from continuing my arguments, since they look like crap in comparison lol Nonetheless; >>>I fail to understand the association with electricty and harvesting animals for unnecessary consumption. I'm arguing that electricity and computers are an unnessary consumption of resources and causes animals to suffer and die. Just as you do not need to eat animals- that using animals as livestock lowers their standard of living- you do not need to surf the net, or own a computer. You're arguing that raising animals for consumption is unfair, and cruel, and that you are morally superior because you do not cause animal suffering in this regard. I'm arguing that destorying animals habitats for the production of electricity and the extraction of resources it takes to construct such things as computers, wires, and pipes, is wasteful, and equally cruel, and unfair- and you are not morally superior, but rather, are on the same moral pretense as the rest of us. Basically, refusing to cause animals to suffer on one issue does not negate the fact that you are causing animals to suffer on the premise that it inconviences you if you don't. If you were truly as saintly and morally superior as you claim and wish for others to believe, you wouldn't so calliously throw away the lives of animals so you can surf the net. >>>And if it be said, veganism is a great way to show you care for the planet re: climate change. Howso? Don't heavy farming equipment, such as combines, use a great deal of gas and oil? And, again, if the greatest contributor of climate change is electricity and cars, then why aren't you renouncing those? Its as if you, I, and all our friends go around starting forest fires- but you believe you are morally superior because you stamp out the fire if it touches weeds. It isn't about saving the planet- you're destorying it, just like everyone else- and it isn't about saving lives- because you're not willing to save lives if it means you can't visit Facebook. Its about you trying to feel better about your impact- morality has nothing to do with it. >>> Nuclear power is a clean source of energy This I actually agree on- I just assumed you'd be anti-nuclear, so I didn't feel the need to present it as an alterative and open that can of worms. >>>So because many lives were taken from the result of building computers/internet, I should continue to take lives because I want to? No, you don't get it- lives are continuely being taken for the production and maintaince of these products. Its not as if we have all the plastic in the world now, so the damage is done- the damage is still being made, and every time your tax dollars pay for pipe repairs, cable repairs or upgrades or extentions, and, of course, resources, from silcon to plastic to metal to wood- whenever you turn on a light, a computer, a TV or charge your cell phone- all of these cause the death, disease and destruction of animals and their habitats >>> We should continue to rape and harvest the natural world for our own self interest, because we always have? Again, statements like those is why I feel my arguments are justified. When you wrote "rape and harvest the nautral world", you intended its use to mean the consumption of animals- I feel the rape and harvest of natural resources is equally an important issue, if not a more important one- and I find it offensive that you would attempt to gain a sense of superiority, while claiming others are your inferiors, because of ideals that only go so far as to not inconvience you. >>>Someone who doesn't take into consideration what they are eating. You honestly believe that everyone who eats meat has never considered where that meat comes from? That seems to be a very niave way to look at the world- that either someone agrees with you, or they simply haven't thought about it. Is it impossible that people could simply disagree? >>> It's a deep, mental pain that goes beyond body. Ha! Try telling that to someone whose suffering third degree burns that your pity for animals is greater than their pain. >>>I already said anger helps no cause, even if it is noble. I'm not talking about anger- I'm talking about violence- and violence in the name of any ideal is never noble. >>>No one in the Animal Rights movement have taken a life (in the last 30 years, on record) How do you know this? And why is murder bad, but death threats are good? Telling someone that you will kill their children on their way to school because their family eats pheasent- thats okay- but if you actually do it, thats not? Why the distinction? Isn't violence violence? Isn't terrorizing people for disagreeing with you still terrorism? Why should people who simply have different ideals have to live in fear of vegans? What kind of morality justifies such immoral actions?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 328 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 10/28/2009 12:14:25 PM
>>> But really, is it a choice? Yes, it is. You said so in your first post, remember? "Many people who have yet to go vegan just don't realize that it's an option." >>>If your 'choice' didn't mean the suffering of innocent animals without thanks or remorse, or the devastation modern agriculture poses on our planet, then I would tell you to eat your little heart out. In that case, is electricity really a "choice"? After all, there is no form of developing electricity that doesn't require us to destroy the enviroment, and kill untold number of animals.Gas, Coal- these kinds pollute the air and water, and may attribute to massive unnatural global changes. Nuclear creates dangerous cancer causing agents. Hydroelectric floods land that may once have been home to thousands if not millions of animals. And Wind kills birds- and all these forms of electricity require you mine metals from the Earth, further destorying habitats and creating death. Admit it- you cannot act like you are somehow above the suffering of animals if you are sitting there on your PC. The power it drains and the resources it is made of could only have been made through the death and destruction of animals and nature- and while you find it completely unacceptable to raise animals to eat, you find nothing wrong with killing animals so you can entertain yourself on a dating website. >>>A vegan child will question their veganism a lot more thoroughly than the typical 'meat eater' child and their diet, and that is the difference. Oh really? That seems like a rather broad generalization. Isn't the opposite equally possible? And what is a "typical 'meat eater'"? >>>It's called compassion and the ability to think outside one's self. It's very real. You feel sorry for animals- that doesn't mean you feel phsyical pain. You're acting like you are taking on the lashes for our sins- and you're not- you're not even willing to turn off your lights. >>>You're assuming the whole organization is built of radicals and those seeking revenge. Not at all- but you are acting like individuals who commit acts of violence are merely peeved off- they're not- they're insane. Nothing- NOTHING gives them the right to act as they do, regardless of how much compassion they feel. If a Jewish man feels compassion for all the people eating Shellfish in the world, does that mean its okay for him to get angry and begin burning down grocery stores? If a Christian is mad that Evolution is becoming a more popular theory than Creationism, does that mean its okay for them to start burning down schools? >>>And cut it out with the dramatic 'terrorist' spiel. Yikes. Why? Its apt- These people are committing acts of violence because other people won't agree to do as they say. Thats the very defination of terrorism. >>>Tell this to the Native Americans, or the Japanese, I don't recall any Japanese being killed in the camps, although I could be wrong. And do our countries stand for these ideals now? Is Canada the same Canada it was in the 1700's and 1800's? >>>Suffering is wrong. Can you deny this? Can you deny your lifestyle is devoid of suffering? Shit, G2G- I'll discuss the rest when I can :P

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 325 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 10/27/2009 11:36:34 PM
>>>Many people who have yet to go vegan just don't realize that it's an option. Oh, I realise it. And I choose to eat meat. If its an option, who are you to judge? Aren't you showing a grave ammount of hubris to dicate morality on personal opinions and choices? >>>We go into this world trusting that the decisions being made for us are the right ones, and if our parents never questioned the status quo or tradition, chances are we'll be brought up exactly as they were. And so it goes. And what if you were raised a Vegan? Wouldn't the same argument conclude that you must eat meat? >>>You start questioning ethics and morality, and you're going to get a whole slew of outraged people who don't want to think about what's on their plate. You don't think its because these people do not like their personal beliefs dictated to them? That they should be free to determine their own beliefs, and for you to talk down to them as immoral because they disagree- are they wrong to be offended? >>>and even the phantom pains we feel are unbearable. Oh get off your crucifix. >>>Unfortunately anger is harmful, no matter what you're angry about, and people will denounce your cause based on it. Which, judging by the replies to this thread, has happened to a few of you. "ANGER"? Thats all you have to say on this? "anger" Anger is what I'm feeling right now- what those activists do is not mere anger. It is violence. It is terrorism. They hand out death threats, intentually try to disturb children, commit vandalism, breaking and entering, theft, and arson. Their actions are unforgivable, because it is very clearly terrorism- we must either agree with their beliefs, or they will hurt you. And that goes against everything our country stands for. No rational person- no ethical person- would dare justify these peoples actions as you seem to be. >>>You can tell yourself that the consumption of meat is not a moral or ethical choice, but you are only denying yourself the empowerment of doing what is right, for all living things. Anyone notice they announced they are right, and yet at no point explains WHY they are right? >>>I can only encourage you, those who choose death over life, to consider your younger self when you make those choices. Because children make the best choices in life. Thats why we give them the freedom to smoke or not until they've reached 5- then they're courrpted forever.....

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 3 (view)

Why do we still shake hands ? Posted: 10/24/2009 1:50:39 PM
I've heard our hands are dirtier than our ***holes- but the physical contact is a sign of respect, me thinks. I'm not about to reject a handshake and instead bow at my next job interveiw

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 104 (view)

A Human Clone. Will It Have A Soul? Posted: 10/24/2009 1:48:08 PM
There is no phsyical evidence the soul exists- so its me saying that, if I had invisible fairy wings that no one could detect, perceive, or concieve, would my clone have invisible fairy wings? Or do you mean if you raised a clone, and raised the original, would both have the same personality? No, I doubt it, although some characteristics may be the same- but thats possible with anyone picked off the street....

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 217 (view)

Crop Circles, what is behind this mystery ? Posted: 10/24/2009 1:57:38 AM
Theres that pesky Misanthropy again.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 212 (view)

Crop Circles, what is behind this mystery ? Posted: 10/23/2009 9:55:18 AM
>>>In order to get into centre of field without leaving tracks you ned to fly Maybe they're light footed? Maybe they're lucky with tracks? ------ >>>I have checked a lot of crop circles on the Internet over the years and there is no way humans can create these magnificent sophisticated crop circles over night. Why is it impossible for humans to do this? >>>Take a look at the “ufo conference 2006” with Jaime Maussen from Mexico. Because when you want to have an open mind about something, its best to look at a source that religiously believes something is true. Don't look towards moderation- extremism is the only correct route to take. >>>On Aug 17 a crop circle was laid down that was the answer to a message sent out into space 20 years earlier. Again, why couldn't it be humans? Are we incapible of "answering" our own questions, and pretending its from space beings? >>>The answer says that their mathamatics is based on 10 digits Lucky that. Suspiciously lucky, in fact. >>>Do you think an intricately detailed crop circle with information for us, can be made in one night by humans? … I don’t think so … Of course not! The only possible answer is all our understanding of the universe is wrong, and space aliens are**n' around with us by writing things in feilds, rather than making direct contact! Thats far, far more likely than some people who have too much time with their hands making complex crop circles, or even more likely than someone with too much time on their hands creating a career by reading too much into people making complex crop circles- either is so impossible, we can outright reject their possiblity. /sarcasm >>>Then we have in August 2004 a detailed crop circle of the Mayan Calendar … Do you think this was done overnight by humans? … I don’t think so … Why not? The Mayan Calander certainly was made by humans. In fact, that fact that we made the Calander, and the Calander is based on celestral observations made on earth** would imply that, yes, it made by Earthlings. >>>All our institutions must change big time or be no more, when the truth is finally out. Don't you people get it? We have to accept our sins and ask for forgiveness- only then will God- err...I mean, Aliens- will forgive us and we will enter a peaceful, nirvinia like being. All it takes is faith! And you see why I call such notions "religious"?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 5 (view)

Why Stem Cell research is good Posted: 10/21/2009 10:52:05 AM
While I in no means am opposed to fetal stem cells(they never survive longer than a week- and in my mind, a week old fetus is NOT a human), again, Paul makes a valid point. If we're able to take someones blood and achieve the same end, alot of peoples worries over the morality of such an action can be put to rest

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 38 (view)

Five Criteria of an Enslaved People Posted: 10/21/2009 1:16:38 AM
Pauls got a valid argument. True Slavery is really terrible, and horrible things are done to people who endure slavery. To associate that with not owning your own business- thats really pissing on everything those people endure.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 8 (view)

Ardi, and the impact on evolution... Posted: 10/21/2009 12:15:33 AM
>>>I'm pretty sure Moses wrote about God in his own personal... delusional... and possibly greed motivated image. Its my understanding that the bible isn't Mose's account of the story- he didn't write it.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 35 (view)

Five Criteria of an Enslaved People Posted: 10/20/2009 11:03:12 PM
Well nothing, you make the claim that you "didn't make any of this up"- implying that what you say is an absolute truth. By what standard of truth? What makes your statements more credible than the people who critise your or Harry Browne's beliefs?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 20 (view)

Five Criteria of an Enslaved People Posted: 10/19/2009 11:01:17 PM
>>>I didn't make up any of this So who did make it up? Like, did you write this article, or did someone else?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 317 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 10/18/2009 11:52:25 PM
>>>With the upcoming and inevitable food shortages, the near future may dictate limitations on our choice of food. I never got this statement. Firstly, what business it of anyone's, save the individual? After all, if beef becomes expensive because of food shortages, then why shouldn't it be up to the individual on whether or not they wish to buy it? Why should limitations be placed on society? Aren't people capable of limiting themselves based on their own budgets? Secondly- what does food shortages have to do with the OP- morality, and the vegan lifestyle? Thats reasoning based on practicality, not morality. Thirdly- why does foot shortages demand we stop having livestock altogether? Again, if food becomes more rare, and the prices go up, the cost of meat will also go up to accommodate for the cost in animal feed- so the person who buys the meat is already paying the difference you say exists. And Lastly, your statements are based on predictions and foreseeing doom. You conclude the end is nigh, and we should abandon some luxuries because such a time is upon us. You've said something to that regard numerous of times now. And frankly- I don't believe you. The only thing that supports such a belief is your own skepticism and pessimism.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 205 (view)

Crop Circles, what is behind this mystery ? Posted: 10/10/2009 1:32:07 PM
It depends what you mean by real.... I mean, if by real you mean they really phsyically exist, then yes, Crop Circles are real- no one is really challenging that. What they're challenging is who made them. But if by "real" you mean they were made by Aliens, then the verdict is already in- no. Theres no reason, theres many low tech ways to get the same solution, and the crop circles seem to be getting more and more complex depending on advancements of OUR technologies.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 11 (view)

The Angel of Death... Posted: 10/8/2009 10:23:25 PM
All facts aside, I wonder- can anyone have a scientific explaination from a video? I mean, doesn't scientific explainations require testable, reproducable results(which you can't do with a video)?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1 (view)

Burning Building Hypotheical Posted: 10/7/2009 11:35:00 AM
You're standing outside a burning building, and someone is trapped inside. You are the only one with enough strength to pull a person out of the building- do you enter? Do you have a moral obligation to do so? What if it may cost you your life? What if you were saving an infant? What about a cat or dog? What if you were one of the people who could not- would you judge the person poorly for not being willing to put their life in harms way? Would you assert this morality, expecting and even demanding others put their life at risk because they are capible of it? And what of Firefighters- is it moral to enter a burning building, causing firefighters to potientally have to find 2 people inside the burning building rather than one, putting their lives in further and potientally unnessary danger? This Hypothetical came from the "Animal Rights" thread- which honestly irked me, because one block away less than 3 monthes ago, an 18 year old lost his life trying to rescue his dog by going back in. Seemed like a waste of life- oddly enough, some people feel otherwise.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1 (view)

Fairness Versus Rights Posted: 10/7/2009 11:10:22 AM
Are the two words synonymous? Is there a significant difference between the two? Can a situation exist where something is protected as a right, and yet, is still is unfair? Is the existance of rights the pursuit of achieving such a "fair state"? Is the constant alteration of our laws to make things "fair" the right thing to do? Can Rights be perverted through fairness so that, in the end, it has the opposite effect of reducing peoples rights in order to create "fairness"? And do people have the freedom to create a situation where things are not fair- that if you work for a greater standard, you've earned it? Or is society the pursuit of a world of equality that itself could be considered unfair?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 2 (view)

Natural vs Man Made Posted: 10/6/2009 11:17:02 PM
Its my understanding that Manmade is something that has to be consciously created(cars, books, and yes, landscaping), while Natural implies that it will appear or be created without our intervention(trees, life, mountains)

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 295 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 10/2/2009 10:54:43 AM
Oh come on Dukky- you call me out on my straw man arguments, but you let Willow go full force with his own?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 173 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/26/2009 8:36:03 AM
Decency? Are you shittin' me? First off, again, you're using fluid terms that are subjective- and secondly- they don't seem to have much trouble with nudity. Or having sex infront of their children. Again, giving the subjective matter of the word you choose, theres room for interpretation, but what about animals makes you think they have decency?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 142 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/23/2009 11:21:32 AM
>>>If we do feel for the suffering of others, don't we feel a moral obligation to try to alleviate it? But that's the thing- you're attempting to take individuals ability to decide such things for themselves. When it comes to the situation described, a house fire, it is an extremely personal decision to make- to sacrifice ones self or not. You wish to deprive the person from making such a decision, claiming enforcing morality supersedes their rights- that throwing their life away is the only thing they can do and still be moral. I find such a worldview to be absolutely abhorrent, with little regard for life or rights, and whose actions act immorally to enforce a dictated morality- and yet ridiculously claims to be FOR rights, FOR life, and FOR morality. Its a mess of contradictions . If you do not go into a burning down building, you are not immoral- and if you really feel such a person would be, ask a fireman how many people throw their lives away in such misguided acts of heroism, and why you feel its A-OK for you to egg them on to do so. >>>not my opinion, law is law, and law for humans ought to be universal. I Come on- we're all adults here- rights are an idea, nothing more. They do not actually physically exist, nor would a person intrinsically know of rights if they were not taught the idea of them. To say animals start to have rights makes as just as much sense as saying that animals must also start doing their own math for taxes. They are incapable of conceiving such an idea- they simply fight for resources, and your pleas of rights and freedoms will always go unnoticed and ignored, because they simply do not understand.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 95 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/19/2009 10:55:20 AM
But thats the thing- as we clearly see, we aren't entirely sure how humans think- so theres no way someone like willow can make the blanket statement "Animals think on an entirely different level than us"- because we do not know how animals think- Or humans, for that matter. Anyone claiming they do is making shit up.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 91 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/18/2009 10:41:39 PM
>>>Animals don't think in words You know how animals think?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 82 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/18/2009 6:25:45 AM
They're arguing against the concept that animals have equal rights to humans, which you claimed was the case, if memory serves me(dunno.....thats Raz's debate)

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 80 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/18/2009 12:25:06 AM
>>>Without the wolf the rabbit would overpopulate, and get diseased. The wolf keeps the sick and weak rabbits from reproducing and thereby keeps the species strong and viable. How, and Why, is man removed from from this role? And what keeps the wolf from suffering from overpopulation, and disease? And, this begs to question- why aren't you offering yourself up for the same sacrifice? If someone is ill, or genetically inferior, should they be expected to sacrifice themselves to wolves? Should you, since, after all, you must harm the environment to survive?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 67 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/17/2009 11:21:13 AM
>>>The wolf does not oppress the rabbit. Actually the wolf and rabbit rely on each other for survival. How does the Rabbit need the Wolf? >>>I do not choose a world like this, however this is the world I have been born into. I have a right to survival. Much like the wolf. At the cost of the destruction of the planet? And, again, why should we listen to you? You condemn others for destroying the planet, but, if it costs you ENTERTAINMENT, you accept that destroying the planet is a requirement for survival.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1061 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/16/2009 11:40:28 AM
Who're you talkin' to Dragon? In either event; >>> I don't debate with those trapped at this level. You are not ready for the truth. When you are, it will open up to you. Am I the only one who finds this to be lazy? to argue "I won't debate with you unless you already agree with me" only means you don't wish to debate- it means you're only looking for people to tell you that all you have to do is feel that you are right, and thus, you are. The Pippi Longstocking way to look at the world- all you need to believe it is true, and it is!

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1058 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/16/2009 10:49:35 AM
So we can't prove WHY they drew it, or what they were trying to envision when they did. The same could be said for any painting anywhere. That is not evidence of anything, save our ability to express ourselves.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 60 (view)

Do Animals Have Rights? Posted: 9/16/2009 10:43:44 AM
>>>It is only when one species or individual takes power over another that the question of rights comes into play. And how is this not a natural part of nature? If a Wolf eats a rabbit, is that not the situation you are talking about? >>>Do we wish a world consisting of oppressor and oppressed? If we reject such a world, will such a thing not exist? Or will wolves continue to eat rabbits, regardless if we tell them its immoral? >>>As stated, I do not choose a world like this And as I've stated before, you are lying. You have chosen this world. I would be incapable of communicating to you through these means if you do not choose and accept this world, and all the benefits it can offer you. You complain about the destruction of the world, blaming all of mankind, while contributing to its destruction. You're a hypocrite, willing only to blame those whom disagree with your minor philosophical differences, rather than taking changes in your life in the effort to bring about the changes you are demanding others take. You cannot say "I did not choose this world", and still use electricity, and gas, and plastic- you are a part of this, whether you wish to acknowledge your fault or not. Get off your pedestal, because you are not who you claim to be.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1056 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/16/2009 10:30:21 AM
>>>BUT, there are too many unanswered questions to just let sleeping dogs lie. .... Well? Lets hear them. If you come to your conclusion based on being overwhelmed by questions, maybe we could help lighten your load and free you of your burden by actually answering your unanswered questions. I really don't think that someone, somewhere drawing something that, when looked at with the predisposition towards a preconceived conclusion, is evidence of aliens. I don't think that cavemen drawing saucers is any more evidence of aliens than if my neighbor would we write to the local paper "I saw aliens!"- the only real difference being that we aren't sure the intent on the caveman and their drawings, though neither of them can prove the experience was legitimate.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1054 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/15/2009 11:35:14 PM
>>>Well when there were NO flying machines Again, and this must be the third or fourth time, what about these images imply they are drawing machines? Couldn't it be clouds? An all seeing eye? and whose the say the image represents a sky? >>>and why not... You know the arguments for why not. In a nutshell, its physically impossible, and the only alternative is to disregard all our observations of the universe and how it works, simply on the premise that you don't feel its true. Its frankly a very subjective and, dare I say, egotistical way to view the universe, where something must be true because you *FEEL* it, and proving it is an unnecessary step to claiming it true.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 12 (view)

Hypocrisy Posted: 9/15/2009 12:06:51 PM
Like Diva, I'd like to enter a discussion of hypocrisy, since I see alot of users on these forums acting in such a manner- but this topic isn't about that. This topic is about verifying your own misfortune, or the misfortune of someone near you, and your desire for either justice or revenge, or both. If someone makes a general topic about hypocrisy, I'd join it. This is about a very personal situation, and, having only one side of the story to work with, and a cryptic one at that, I do not feel that I am in any position to offer an opinion, since all I can do is parrot the opinion of the OP, or oppose the opinion of the OP, despite not having any of the facts, and the only source of facts already implies that guilt has been assured.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1046 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/15/2009 12:09:13 AM
>>>IT'S NEVEr OKAY to claim something impossible without knowing it is impossible. Could your mother be a very tall pixie, and your mother be a very small elf? Would it be wrong to claim they weren't? Would it be wrong to claim such a thing doesn't exist? How could you possibly know for sure? >>>The point you think should come prematurely (which seems to be right now, so that you can shut down the discussion of possibilities you find uncomfortable) should NOT come until - as you said -we've explored everywhere in the universe. Are....are you serious? You know that'll never happen, right? Even if we find a means to be in one solar system a second, find out everything in that solar system, and moved onto the next, and everyone in the world were to do this, for their entire lives, there would still be solar systems left unexplored. Not to mention, we'd eventually have to start over, because the universe is not stagnant. You ask an impossible standard. You can enjoy your life of ignorance, where you reject everything we see because you're certain the universe acts how you feel it should, rather than how we see it actually does. I will base my conclusions on actual evidence, though, thank you. >>>I am NOT claiming that we are for sure part alien, I'm saying it's a possibility. By what standard? What evidence is there to produce such a possibility? Couldn't we, under that standard, claim that its possible that there's a giant mash mellow on the complete opposite side of the sun to the Earth? >>>Nothing you can do can change the truth that we don't know. Granted, but nothing can deny what we've already found, either. How long do you have to walk amongst trees before its prudent to call it a forest? Until you've explored every square inch of the world? ------ >>>There were saucer shaped drawings, and an image of what modern day aliens are drawn as. That hardly proves anything- you can look back 25 years, and aliens were different. Look back another 25, and again, hugely different. Is a coincidence so impossible? >>> but it seems rather apparent something came to visit these people... And "messages to God" didn't seem well enough? Or an artistic creation? There must be a physical verification- not just a spiritual quest? And since when has something been proven true cause someone, somewhere wrote it down? >>>however these beings were tall, long armed and legged, with a triangle head. Of course! Just like all the alien abduction stories! Triangle Heads! >>>if a person has never seen something mechanical flying in the sky Omg! I remember you now! You mentioned you were in this topic earlier- and I ask, yet again- what about the image implies it is mechanical? --------- >>>Sitchin is a thoroughly debunked fraud, as is the existence of "Planet X". There are several other threads which deal specifically with both. Errm.....You're kind in one of 'em Frogo. Read the OP....

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1035 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/14/2009 12:13:29 PM
>>>When they ARE, and if it doesn't happen then the case MUST remain open to creative hypothesizing and wonder. What do you mean? I'm asking for specifics. At what point is it okay to make any claims on the subject matter and obvious questions this topic presents? When is it okay to claim that Aliens do not exist? When we've explored everywhere in the universe? When is it okay to claim that traveling the deep void of space is impossible? You know, other than the evidence that already exists explaining that there isn't enough resources to make such a thing possible? And why do you take the opposite stance of the scientific principal- that we must prove that aliens DIDN'T create man, as opposed to the critics having to prove their assertions true? When is it okay to claim that aliens didn't make man, or can't make the journey here, or even do not exist? And why do you take the stance that is contradicted by all of our observations, claiming that our observations are flawed because they aren't giving you the answers you'd expect, or prefer?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 283 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 9/13/2009 10:01:41 PM
Yea, I know of some women named Willow. http://www.behindthename.com/name/willow

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1033 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/13/2009 9:59:50 PM
>>>My point is that you don't know what is possible. So technically anything MIGHT be possible, until proven otherwise, that doesn't mean EVERYTHING is possible. And MY point is, at what point are the things we are discussing proven otherwise? Omniscience? Omnipotence ? At what point will we be free to reach a conclusion based on what we do know and what our current observations have achieved? At what point can we look at the data found, and not decide that, no, the data is wrong, and we simply haven't looked for the answer we prefer hard enough? And how is that perspective lead to good science? >>>1. what is useful, 2. what is likely and 3. what makes me happy. What about our observations of the universe implies it is useful? Does that mean our observations are flawed on the premise that, the universe must be useful. It just has to! And Happy? Why would the universe change if you gained comfort for it? Why would it care? And Likely? Who are you to judge likelihoods? Whatever likelihoods you can offer, I can contradict, and neither of us would be wrong, because we simply do not have enough knowledge to decide how the universe SHOULD act- we must only rely on how we see it acting. I honestly do not understand why you have such a sheer terror of making the wrong conclusions with the right data.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 280 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 9/13/2009 8:16:20 PM
Sorry Willow- I'm sure I've made the same mistake. Its the Willow name- its feminine, and is a womans name. I mean, if I came on here calling myself "Awesome April", I've got to expect some people to think I'm a chick. Especially with no picture.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 184 (view)

could humans be the highest form of intelligence in the universe? Posted: 9/13/2009 7:55:03 PM
>>>If you consider intellegence as the ability to live in harmony with the environment, whales are far more intelligent than humans. Granted, preserving your environment is an intelligent act- but it doesn't mean that the definition of "intelligence" is preservation of your environment- to claim such is making a straw man argument, and is just wasting everyone's time with your mindless preaching. Stop poking your agenda where it doesn't belong. Your misanthropy has no real place in this topic, and the sad fact is, the animal that you praise as being more intelligent than you cannot do even some of the most basic functions you are capable of. Whales cannot prevent illness, can do very little for extending their natural lives, they cannot prepare for upcoming disaster or even conceive of it- they cannot sent cartloads of food to the starving whales on the other side of the world- as far as I've heard, they can't even count. You wish to change the meaning of words, to suit your own raw hatred of yourself and your kind- and that's just not how things work. Intelligence does not mean "do not harm the environment" Not that any of this matters- Whales, regardless of your preaching, do cause destruction to the environment. The largest producers of Carbon is plankton- and the largest consumers of plankton? That's right- whales. Just like any animal, if they get too numerous, they can cause environmental destruction. Man is not alone in this- simply, man has mastered the other animals so only he causes widespread destruction. And, again, if you feel humanity's destruction of the Earth is an immeasurable sin- then why are you using electricity? Doesn't that make you a hypocrite, crying out that humanity is evil for giving you the necessities you need to be comfortable?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 251 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 9/12/2009 12:17:21 AM
>>>Very few in the western world are in the position you describe. And the ones that are?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 241 (view)

Are vegans and PETA more moral and ethical than society? Posted: 9/11/2009 6:52:18 AM
>>>Is it immoral to cause “unnecessary” suffering to animals. Define Necessity. >>>Eating meat is not necessary. Hate to challenge your generalizations, but for some people, yes, it is. Its either eat meat or die. Which, of course, begs to question- if the only way to reach that morality is to die yourself, what kind of morality are you offering? What kind of morality offers only death to those who follow?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1022 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/10/2009 10:59:49 PM
Trust me- the dope really helps in toleratin' this nonesense. But I'm certain they can be saved.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1020 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/10/2009 11:59:04 AM
>>>-Keeping us unaware of the truth of Oneness (cosmic intelligence) Right you are! People make these claims NOT because they're confused, mentally disturbed, or misinterpret reality- they make these claims because they know the truth of reality, and are trying to keep everyone else in the dark. The worlds largest and most complex conspiracy. Cause that makes perfect sense. >>>As the Bible says, "Go forth & multiply". We were dropped off here because it's a suitable planet for us to live on, once the herd gets to sufficient numbers ( maybe by December 21, 2012?) they'll be back to start harvesting. Again, following stargazers comments, we didn't just "appear" on Earth- we evolved over Billions of years, as did all life. The only possible way it could be argued that life came from another planet is if ALL life came from another planet- which isn't being argued here. As for 2012....I honestly don't get it. Why or how would the Mayans have this information? And on that note, why or how would the Sumers? I never liked the concept that older civilizations, when they talk about gods, are actually talking about aliens, but other older civilizations, like Greek or Egyptian or thousands of others, when they talk about Gods, they are talking about Gods. >>>. If you don't know the truth, you don't know it, period. I admit I'm not omniscient. But that doesn't mean we should cast our conclusions aside in the paranoid fear that, someday, somewhere down the line, we might be wrong. The universe clearly have limits- "anything's possible" is simply not true. I do not need to see and understand everything in creation to make this conclusion. So let me ask you- at what point is it okay to make a conclusion about anything in reality? Or must we understand everything about everything before we can admit to understanding anything about reality?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1011 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/9/2009 11:14:49 PM
>>>what if humans were actually aliens in the sense that we had travelled here from another planet? Well, it IS just a thought, I'll give you that. There is no evidence to support this. In fact, we can clearly see a humanoid like creature slowly appear on the scene through evolution- the concept that everything is evolution, but man is from space, I. . .I just don't understand why you have the need. . .I mean, why couldn't ducks have equally have come from space, and replaced a creature that looked and acted identical to ducks? -----==------==----- >>>I have no idea which is true, but claiming "You don't know the Universe works" implies that you DO, when you DON'T. Granted- I do not know everything about the universe- but I certainly know that the creed of "anythings possible" that people blindly cheer, is not true. I do not need to know everything to know the universe has its limits.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 1002 (view)

Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory? Posted: 9/9/2009 11:52:20 AM
>>>Anything that can be imagined has a probability. That isn't how the universe works, and claiming as such shows either an extreme naivety, or a refusal to acknowledge what we see, rather wishing to acknowledge what you wish was there . For instance, as much as I wish it were true, there is absolutely no probability that the lost city of Atlantis is located 1cm inside my anus. Its time to grow up and accept it- some things are simply impossible and improbable, regardless of the comforts you would gain if it were true. >>> It would just make human's collective inferiority complex even worse, which almost always results in bloodshed. We're a product of nature, and life in nature fights and competes for resources. It has nothing to do with a "collective inferiority complex", and everything to do with the nature of life itself. >>>Last I checked we were in the backwoods of the galaxy As stargazer pointed out, and I feel is worthy of addressing by you- by what standard do you make such a claim? Who are you to make such a judgment? And should we consider it a coincidence that your assumptions re-affirm your beliefs? >>>if one considers the egos displayed here are viewed as evidence, then we don't deserve such knowledge. Again, by what standard do you make such a claim? Who are you to judge who does and doesn't deserve knowledge? Who are you to judge whether or not someones worthy of it? Why do you believe you hold all the keys to the knowledge of the universe- and isn't that a distinct sign that you have what you condemn- an ego? >>>I've noticed that a person can not even correct an individuals mistakes in this forum with out wiping their nose through it in an arrogant manner. At some point we will open our minds and work together and collaborate our ideas, our opinions, and our perspective in order to figure out why we are here. But allowing people to make the same mistakes over and over again, never correcting them in fear of offending them- that'll help us understand things better

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 2 (view)

Virus powered battery Posted: 9/5/2009 9:40:59 AM
Sounds both innovative, and a million times more dangerous than having mercury in your car.

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 22 (view)

An interesting upcoming moment in time... Posted: 9/5/2009 2:12:09 AM
JYes! I'm gunna buy myself an award tomorrow. That truely was a significant moment in time. I intend to celebrate it next year.... The only question is, do I move up with the event(ie 9th month next year instead of 8th), or stick to the date?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 17 (view)

An interesting upcoming moment in time... Posted: 9/4/2009 11:36:39 PM
I'm going at 09:09:05:02:38 here. Did....Did I win?

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 36 (view)

Kola Superdeep Borehole aka (Well to Hell legend) Posted: 9/3/2009 11:27:07 AM
>>> couldnt find the american flag thats supposedly waving on the moon. Odd- we can clearly see them. http://gizmodo.com/5317057/first-images-of-the-apollo-landing-sites-in-40-years/gallery/

Jiperly

Joined: 8/30/2006

Msg: 155 (view)

vegan Posted: 9/1/2009 12:05:35 PM
Seriously, there are so many crazies in this thread, it looks bad for me to actually respond. I mean, did Dukky actually just argue that, since people are okay with eating livestock, that they should be okay with eating humans? Humans are incredibly different from a cow, chicken, or pig, and to act like that we are the same reduces this discussion to idiocy. Granted, life is important- we shouldn't torture animals, or mistreat them- but that doesn't mean we should ignore and whitewash our differences because you don't like the idea of animals not having freedoms they have no way on conceiving, no way of being responsible, and no way respecting. A cow is not a human, and no matter how many laws you pass claiming they are our equals, they never will be.

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