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Author
Thread: Baggage...
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
11 (
view
)
Baggage...
Posted:
11/18/2009 3:14:41 PM
Yeah I have to laugh, one person I met online in the same discussion, told me all about her ex-boyfriend and how frustrated she was with him and in the same conversation asked me if i thought i could accept someone elses kids as mine..............lol......needless to say i removed her from yahoo.
she didnt even realize how she sounded............come on who wants to listen to the woes from the last relationship, trying to suck someone new into their web of craziness.
I agree in principle, depressed people are contagious, so if our goal is a quest for happiness, we ought to surround ourselves with happy ones... but it goes both ways: she showed herself as a nair-do-well who has to dump on complete strangers ("normal" people have old friends for that); by the same token, you seem to have shown cynicism and lack of empathy, you've just publicly laughed at someone else's grief. I don't want to surround myself with people who enjoy my company at happy times and laugh behind my back when I stumble. Sounds like both of you might have dodged a bullet!
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
40 (
view
)
The New Jewish Lobby
Posted:
11/17/2009 10:33:55 PM
Why are the same myths recycled over and over.
The word "antisemitism" has not been coined by Jews (rather, by a renowned "Jew-hater" if you like this term better), but it has become the accepted term today, in this meaning.
Google 1066 Granada massacre, and Fez massacres of 1033, 1276 and 1465, Baghdad in 1828 and in 1839, Barfurush in 1867, Damascus blood libel of 1840, Marrakech and Fez in 1864.
Goes on an on..
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
70 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/17/2009 8:37:08 PM
Hahaha, NoBushLover, you are funny. Someone mentions X, and you pop in with a whole phillipics on Christians, involving not only X, but torture and what not.. turns out, your only basis for that hijack is that Christians are the majority.
Newsflash. It's RIGHT-HANDED people who molest children. More right-handed people than Christians are guilty of sex crimes. It's time to say it out loud! Right-handed people should be ashamed of themselves! They were the ones who brought America to where it is now. (should I put a smiley here? I guess I better.. Here:
)
Yeah, the racist post was horrible, not sure why nobody responded.
can we not make people take a test before having kids ? this is for all folks whether black, white, mexican, legal or illegal.
If this is for all, why such persistent labeling of everybody by their race? As if we did not get it the first time that oh horror, one of the perpetrators was black, it needed to be rubbed into our noses over and over.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
38 (
view
)
The New Jewish Lobby
Posted:
11/17/2009 7:33:13 PM
This is Jerusalem, people. You are talking about it as if it was just any town. It's like Washington, DC. Imagine the headlines reading: "Americans built another illegal statement in Washington, DC".
Here is another parallel for you. Stalin had deported some of the mountain people to Siberia.. when he died, they came back. By then, their homes and land were taken by Georgian and other squatters. The people who came back had no legal right to their homes. It never stopped them from having their homes back anyway. Don't ask how. I don't blame them. They were there first, end of the story.
I am against settlements, but on completely different grounds.
Jews living in Germany, and their opinions, are not particularly interesting.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
35 (
view
)
The New Jewish Lobby
Posted:
11/17/2009 2:05:41 PM
i dont use the term palestinian because theres no such thing, they are just arabs living in isreal, are criminals they go to jail at one point or another.... they vote for a known terrorist govmt,that not only wants to wipe out isreal, but also shows hostility to all free and democratic states this thread is anti semetic and should be shut down
Say WHAT? I am not even arguing with cotter, because her attitude makes me sick and you can't disprove any sick claim, but you, too. You, too.
Where do I start. 100 years ago, if you called most of today's Arabs "Arab", they'd just shrug. Today, an Arab is someone whose mother tongue is Arabic; Arabs are very, very diverse ethnically.
Palestinian Arabs, as Israeli and non-Israeli geneticists have shown time and again, are genetically closer to Jews than any other group. They are not "just Arabs", that's a scientific fact.
As for anyone who paints any broad segment of population (Jewish, Arab, Israeli, Palestinian, Muslim, Christian, black) as "all criminals", I'll leave it on your conscience.
With friends like you, who needs enemies.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
65 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/17/2009 11:23:05 AM
The only on-topic part of everything you've written here (if I understand you correctly) is your assertion that disproportionate percentage of Christians molest children. Christians, not priests, as I had originally interpreted your post. If you have any proof, I challenge you to produce it. If you don't, then it's just slander, and no amount of rhetoric will mask this fact; it's pretty transparent that you have an agenda. Unfortunately, your agenda is fairly close to my own, which makes me feel embarrassed.
The rest is off-topic, and I won't even respond. Why don't you open a new thread if you want to talk about Christian approval or disapproval of torture.
Oh, and trust me, I know what projection is. I think you do, as well.
Sorry everybody about feeding the troll; I could not resist.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
63 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/17/2009 10:47:28 AM
NoBushLover, projecting much? What does this thread have to do with anything you said? Why don't you walk your talk and speak of the "minority" of Christians? We are certainly talking about the minority here, right? So what a wonderful opportunity for you to lead by example.
If/when a Christian, or Muslim, or an atheist talks the way you do, that's equally offensive; here and now, frankly, it's just you. You are being a troll.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
60 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/16/2009 10:47:40 PM
^ I think religion might have everything to do with it. Imagine being brought up very religious and very homophobic, then realize you are gay; what do you do? If you can, you marry and hope marriage will "cure" you; if you are 100% gay, you can't marry a woman, but you can't stay unmarried either, because then you'll be in the spotlight. Being a priest sounds like what the doctor ordered.. besides, there is hope that being closer to God will help you fight the sin. Does not quite happen that way apparently... so now you are a sinner AND a priest.
Just my unscientific theory; I may be wrong.
Sorry about repeated posting btw; fat fingers.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
85 (
view
)
Questionning Israel = antisemitism?
Posted:
11/15/2009 10:38:55 PM
Anyone is free to define it any way they want ... and they are certainly entitled to their opinion.
No, not everyone. Any group is free to define ITSELF any way it wants. For instance, I am not religious (and neither is the majority of Jews), but if the Jewish people says I am a part of them by birth, and I agree, that means I am.
They teach the difference between fact and opinion in 4th grade.. did you miss that?
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
11 (
view
)
should we focus on arab resentment of the west as a mid-east peace plan?
Posted:
11/15/2009 9:44:33 PM
Great example. Let's look into it.
Did we focus on ... communist resentment of the west... as a peace plan ???
Umm, no, you did not. Gorbachev did. He focused on the West's resentment of communism as a peace plan. Remember Gorbomania?
Yes, he destroyed communism in the process, unintentionally.. but he saved Russia (from itself, not from you), and, quite possibly, the world (from both of us). Which is more important?
You sound almost like YOU won the cold war.. I've heard it before. Hate to rain on your parade, but we could have still be communist if we wanted to, just like North Korea, and there would be nothing you could do about it. WE topped the communists, not you. Yes, your BBC radio and Voice of America certainly helped, thank you.. but they helped precisely because they gave an outlet to our dissidents, our intelligentsia who actually loved our country and knew what they were talking about; not to people like yourself. So yes, a little cultural sensitivity can go a long way... thanks for making my point for me.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
53 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/15/2009 3:37:13 PM
In the U.S. it's considerably more complicated. Frankly , the open-ended definition of a sex-offender has practically invalidated the usefulness of the registry.
So who is a sex offender ?
Here are some examples of sex offenders :
http://www.solresearch.org/~SOLR/rprt/LookNow.asp
Are you really afraid to live beside a 13 year old girl who sent a naked picture of herself to her boyfriend ? Or the guy who stopped on a highway to relieve himself ?
That's the problem with these registries : The label is defacto permanent and it often bears no semblance to the implications. People naturally assume that a sex offender is simply somebody who goes out and rapes at will. This , unfortunately , is not necessarily accurate. In fact , more often than not , it's not even close to accurate. All sex-related crimes (from public indecency to consensual sex with a minor by somebody who themself is just past the threshold of age of majority) are not equal. People recognize that there is a big difference between a guy peeing on the side of a highway and a child rapist but the registries don't usually provide details such as this (or , at least , few people care to distinguish once a name makes the list)
Wow, an amazing link, I recommend everybody to go and look at it. Scary!
Some very scary stories on this thread, as well.. my heart goes out to the victims!
Looks like we are overlooking the complexity of the phenomenon and lumping some very different things together.
Here is my account of two encounters with what Americans would call "pedophiles"; both happened abroad.
I went to school with a very bright kid who married his teacher first thing after graduation; she was already very pregnant. Later, he became on of the nation's best-known politicians. Here in the US, she'd rot in jail and be 1st degree offender unable to live near a school; over there, she has a happy, well-adjusted family and kids, and can work as a teacher if she wants to. The kid was simply very mature for his age, and she was indeed a lovely woman, hard not to fall for. Everybody was happy for them.
Another story from my childhood. A friend's friend had a relationship with his male coach. They have not been jailed fortunately (homosexuality was illegal at the time, and the treatment of gays in prison was awful), but they both have been beaten savagely by anyone willing; the kid went through multiple suicide attempts. Now they are married and live in Europe, last time I heard of them.
It's a complex world we live in. So to those on this thread who feel the urge to tear someone to pieces... do your homework, make sure there is indeed a victim, don't assume. Lots of very different phenomena, ranging from pure Romeo/Juliette love stories to peeing on the roadside to savage murder seem to be lumped together here simply because it's a taboo subject and we as a society don't want to bring it to the level of a national debate.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
52 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/15/2009 3:36:21 PM
In the U.S. it's considerably more complicated. Frankly , the open-ended definition of a sex-offender has practically invalidated the usefulness of the registry.
So who is a sex offender ?
Here are some examples of sex offenders :
http://www.solresearch.org/~SOLR/rprt/LookNow.asp
Are you really afraid to live beside a 13 year old girl who sent a naked picture of herself to her boyfriend ? Or the guy who stopped on a highway to relieve himself ?
That's the problem with these registries : The label is defacto permanent and it often bears no semblance to the implications. People naturally assume that a sex offender is simply somebody who goes out and rapes at will. This , unfortunately , is not necessarily accurate. In fact , more often than not , it's not even close to accurate. All sex-related crimes (from public indecency to consensual sex with a minor by somebody who themself is just past the threshold of age of majority) are not equal. People recognize that there is a big difference between a guy peeing on the side of a highway and a child rapist but the registries don't usually provide details such as this (or , at least , few people care to distinguish once a name makes the list)
Wow, an amazing link, I recommend everybody to go and look at it. Scary!
Some very scary stories on this thread, as well.. my heart goes out to the victims!
Looks like we are overlooking the complexity of the phenomenon and lumping some very different things together.
Here is my account of two encounters with what Americans would call "pedophiles"; both happened abroad.
I went to school with a very bright kid who married his teacher first thing after graduation; she was already very pregnant. Later, he became on of the nation's best-known politicians. Here in the US, she'd rot in jail and be 1st degree offender unable to live near a school; over there, she has a happy, well-adjusted family and kids, and can work as a teacher if she wants to. The kid was simply very mature for his age, and she was indeed a lovely woman, hard not to fall for. Everybody was happy for them.
Another story from my childhood. A friend's friend had a relationship with his male coach. They have not been jailed fortunately (homosexuality was illegal at the time, and the treatment of gays in prison was awful), but they both have been beaten savagely by anyone willing; the kid went through multiple suicide attempts. Now they are married and live in Europe, last time I heard of them.
It's a complex world we live in. So to those on this thread who feel the urge to tear someone to pieces... do your homework, make sure there is indeed a victim, don't assume. Lots of very different phenomena, ranging from pure Romeo/Juliette love stories to peeing on the roadside to savage murder are lumped together here simply because it's a taboo subject and we as a society don't want to bring it to the level of a national debate.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
51 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/15/2009 3:35:46 PM
In the U.S. it's considerably more complicated. Frankly , the open-ended definition of a sex-offender has practically invalidated the usefulness of the registry.
So who is a sex offender ?
Here are some examples of sex offenders :
http://www.solresearch.org/~SOLR/rprt/LookNow.asp
Are you really afraid to live beside a 13 year old girl who sent a naked picture of herself to her boyfriend ? Or the guy who stopped on a highway to relieve himself ?
That's the problem with these registries : The label is defacto permanent and it often bears no semblance to the implications. People naturally assume that a sex offender is simply somebody who goes out and rapes at will. This , unfortunately , is not necessarily accurate. In fact , more often than not , it's not even close to accurate. All sex-related crimes (from public indecency to consensual sex with a minor by somebody who themself is just past the threshold of age of majority) are not equal. People recognize that there is a big difference between a guy peeing on the side of a highway and a child rapist but the registries don't usually provide details such as this (or , at least , few people care to distinguish once a name makes the list)
Wow, an amazing link, I recommend everybody to go and look at it. Scary!
Some very scary stories on this thread, as well.. my heart goes out to the victims!
Looks like we are overlooking the complexity of the phenomenon and lumping some very different things together.
Here is my account of two encounters with what Americans would call "pedophiles"; both happened abroad.
I went to school with a very bright kid who married his teacher first thing after graduation; she was already very pregnant. Later, he became on of the nation's best-known politicians. Here in the US, she'd rot in jail and be 1st degree offender unable to live near a school; over there, she has a happy, well-adjusted family and kids, and can work as a teacher if she wants to. The kid was simply very mature for his age, and she was indeed a lovely woman, hard not to fall for. Everybody was happy for them.
Another story from my childhood. A friend's friend had a relationship with his male coach. They have not been jailed fortunately (homosexuality was illegal at the time, and the treatment of gays in prison was awful), but they both have been beaten savagely by anyone willing; the kid went through multiple suicide attempts. Now they are married and live in Europe, last time I heard of them.
It's a complex world we live in. Just sayin'. So to those on this thread who feel the urge to tear someone to pieces... do your homework, make sure there is indeed a victim, don't assume. Lots of very different phenomena, ranging from pure Romeo/Juliette love stories to peeing on the roadside to savage murder are lumped together here simply because it's a taboo subject and we as a society don't want to bring it to the level of a national debate.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
50 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/15/2009 3:34:21 PM
In the U.S. it's considerably more complicated. Frankly , the open-ended definition of a sex-offender has practically invalidated the usefulness of the registry.
So who is a sex offender ?
Here are some examples of sex offenders :
http://www.solresearch.org/~SOLR/rprt/LookNow.asp
Are you really afraid to live beside a 13 year old girl who sent a naked picture of herself to her boyfriend ? Or the guy who stopped on a highway to relieve himself ?
That's the problem with these registries : The label is defacto permanent and it often bears no semblance to the implications. People naturally assume that a sex offender is simply somebody who goes out and rapes at will. This , unfortunately , is not necessarily accurate. In fact , more often than not , it's not even close to accurate. All sex-related crimes (from public indecency to consensual sex with a minor by somebody who themself is just past the threshold of age of majority) are not equal. People recognize that there is a big difference between a guy peeing on the side of a highway and a child rapist but the registries don't usually provide details such as this (or , at least , few people care to distinguish once a name makes the list)
Wow, an amazing link, I recommend everybody to go and look at it. Scary!
Some very scary stories on this thread, as well.. my heart goes out to the victims!
Looks like we are overlooking the complexity of the phenomenon and lumping some very different things together.
Here is my account of two encounters with what Americans would call "pedophiles"; both happened abroad.
I went to school with a very bright kid who married his teacher first thing after graduation; she was already very pregnant. Later, he became on of the nation's best-known politicians. Here in the US, she'd rot in jail and be 1st degree offender unable to live near a school; over there, she has a happy, well-adjusted family and kids, and can work as a teacher if she wants to. The kid was simply very mature for his age, and she was indeed a lovely woman, hard not to fall for. Everybody was happy for them.
Another story from my childhood. A friend's friend had a relationship with his male coach. They have not been jailed fortunately (homosexuality was illegal at the time, and the treatment of gays in prison was awful), but they both have been beaten savagely by anyone willing; the kid went through multiple suicide attempts. Now they are married and live in Europe, last time I heard of them.
It's a complex world we live in. Just sayin'. So to those who feel the urge to tear someone to pieces... do your homework, make sure there is indeed a victim, don't assume. Lots of very different phenomena, ranging from pure Romeo/Juliette love stories to peeing on the roadside to savage murder are lumped together here simply because it's a taboo subject and we as a society don't want to bring it to the level of a national debate. By the way, is inciting to murder a crime or a first amendment right?
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
49 (
view
)
Who Molests Children?
Posted:
11/15/2009 3:29:32 PM
In the U.S. it's considerably more complicated. Frankly , the open-ended definition of a sex-offender has practically invalidated the usefulness of the registry.
So who is a sex offender ?
Here are some examples of sex offenders :
http://www.solresearch.org/~SOLR/rprt/LookNow.asp
Are you really afraid to live beside a 13 year old girl who sent a naked picture of herself to her boyfriend ? Or the guy who stopped on a highway to relieve himself ?
That's the problem with these registries : The label is defacto permanent and it often bears no semblance to the implications. People naturally assume that a sex offender is simply somebody who goes out and rapes at will. This , unfortunately , is not necessarily accurate. In fact , more often than not , it's not even close to accurate. All sex-related crimes (from public indecency to consensual sex with a minor by somebody who themself is just past the threshold of age of majority) are not equal. People recognize that there is a big difference between a guy peeing on the side of a highway and a child rapist but the registries don't usually provide details such as this (or , at least , few people care to distinguish once a name makes the list)
Wow, an amazing link, I recommend everybody to go and look at it. Scary!
Some very scary stories on this thread, as well.. my heart goes out to the victims!
Looks like we are overlooking the complexity of the phenomenon and lumping some very different things together.
Here is my account of two encounters with what Americans would call "pedophiles"; both happened abroad.
I went to school with a very bright kid who married his teacher first thing after graduation; she was already very pregnant. Later, he became on of the nation's best-known politicians. Here in the US, she'd rot in jail and be 1st degree offender unable to live near a school; over there, she has a happy, well-adjusted family and kids, and can work as a teacher if she wants to. The kid was simply very mature for his age, and she was indeed a lovely woman, hard not to fall for. Everybody was happy for them.
Another story from my childhood. A friend's friend, a boy, had a relationship with his male couch. They have not been jailed fortunately (homosexuality was illegal at the time, and the treatment of gays in prison was awful), but they both have been beaten savagely by anyone willing; the kid went through multiple suicide attempts. Now they are married and live in Europe, last time I heard of them.
It's a complex world we live in. Just sayin'. So to those who feel the urge to tear someone to pieces... do your homework, make sure there is indeed a victim, don't assume. Lots of very different phenomena, ranging from pure Romeo/Juliette love stories to peeing on the roadside to savage murder are lumped together here simply because it's a taboo subject and we as a society don't want to bring it to the level of a national debate.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
8 (
view
)
should we focus on arab resentment of the west as a mid-east peace plan?
Posted:
11/15/2009 1:57:30 PM
The short answer is - yes, I think we should.
The long answer: it is not our place to change others (persons or nations, it's all the same), or tell them how to change, it's not our mission on Earth. If we can become more open-minded, more culturally-aware, more egalitarian, more compassionate, if we can cultivate our ability to see both sides, walk in other people's shoes, even our enemies' shoes, and attempt resolve our conflicts peacefully if at all possible, that's all great, that speaks of our maturity and emotional intelligence. People with emotional intelligence have enemies, too - but fewer.
I find it remarkable that Obama's rating in Jordan and even in Syria is comparable to Bin Laden's. It shows just how divided Jordanians are, and just how much simple WORDS (because words is all Obama has done so far) have tremendous power of swaying the public opinion in the region. That's something most people are unaware of, and it answers OP's question. Yes, if simple words can give us such huge support numbers - then we need more of them! No games of course, because people there have grown extremely disillusioned and cynical and won't be fooled - but sincere words followed by sincere actions, from both US and Israel, is just what the doctor ordered.
As for apocalyptic scenarios - come on, as if Judeo-Christian civilization does not have them as well.
Now, to those who try to portray Iran as a defenseless victim - here are some Ahmadinejad quotes. The proof is in the pudding.
“Anybody who recognizes Israel will burn in the fire of the Islamic nation's fury,”
“Iran is ready to transfer nuclear know-how to the Islamic countries due to their need.”
"Remove Israel before it is too late and save yourself from the fury of regional nations."
"Israel is a rotten, dried tree that will be annihilated in one storm."
"The skirmishes in the occupied land are part of a war of destiny. The outcome of hundreds of years of war will be defined in Palestinian land. As the Imam said, Israel must be wiped off the map."
The guy obviously does not talk defense here, and apparently does not need anyone else do it on his behalf; he is outspoken enough.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
229 (
view
)
Are Messianic Jewish people still Jewish ?
Posted:
11/12/2009 8:49:37 PM
There is ethnic and religious aspect of being Jewish.
From the religious standpoint, you can be both Jewish and atheist at the same time (in fact, most are), but you can't be both Jewish and and a convert to another religion; that's where the line is drawn.
Messianic Jews, or Jews for Jesus, don't see themselves as converts out of Judaism; why? Jesus was a Jewish guy, he was circumcised, preached in the Temple, observed Sabbath and Jewish holidays, and believed to be sent to Jews.
From the standpoint of everyone else in the Jewish community.. Judaism is incredibly flexible, it accepts and internalizes astrology, big parts of Buddhism, reincarnation, Big Bang theory and about every theory in the world, except one. Judaism is a strictly monotheist religion and can never accept that God is one, but there is three of him. Old Testament/Torah speaks very strongly against any manifestation of polytheism. So they don't view messianic Jews very kindly. Christians in general are still associated with crusades, conversions on the edge of a sword.. and messianic Jews want to convert people.. so there is a bit of friction.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
32 (
view
)
The New Jewish Lobby
Posted:
11/12/2009 8:12:20 PM
No one should have a blank check. Not Israel and not the USA... no one.
I am very much Pro-Israel. Their right to exist and their right to security. But we all do wrong and the goal should be to do right more often. They captured the land post-1967 but if they want a real peace and to do right, perhaps the settlements aren't the right thing to do. That's just my impression... I've never been there and all I know is what I'm told from the Pros and Cons. A great deal of what Israel and Palestine do is not my business, but our involvement should be of concern to us... how to show support with fairness to both parties and no blank checks.
I agree with you in principle, itechman.. but as always, things are not black and white.
Here is a good (although one-sided) article that covers the Israeli position:
http://chinaconfidential.blogspot.com/2009/05/can-tiny-israel-afford-to-surrender_13.html
Basically, West Bank (a.k.a. Judea and Samaria) is our ancient land. Historically, we have more rights to it than to Tel-Aviv. It's also mountain land from which the rest of the country, the plain, can and has been easily reached by rockets and such. If you support Israel's right to exist, you've got to support Israel's right to keep hold of the heights strategically essential for the state's survival, as many past existential wars have shown, until a peace treaty is signed.
It's a mistake to think that international law forbids occupation. When you are attacked, and the attacker loses, you have every right to take the war to their land and keep their land at least until they sign a peace treaty, right? Well, in 1967, Israeli leadership was sitting by phones waiting for Arabs to start negotiating such treaty.. but it did not happen. Egypt and Jordan did not want Palestinians back. Now what?
So what did Israeli parliament decide? Nothing. They just hid their head in sand. Meanwhile, the right-wingers who just won an impossible war against all odds... they wanted to live where their ancestors had lived. Now, that, in retrospect, should have been forbidden; however, you have to understand that the Israeli border at the time was a border defined by a war boundary; there was nothing sacred in it. It was neither the historical border, nor the border of the Balfur declaration; just a ceaze-fire line on the map.. Jews have always lived on both sides of it, until the very recent events... I mean, it's Judea over there! The Temple, the Western Wall, the tombs of Abraham, Isaak, Jacob, Leah, Rachel, the place where the prophets were preaching and peasants were growing their vineyards and pasturing their sheep.. are on the other side. So it was very hard to explain to someone at the time why living West of it is good, and to the East, bad.
So that's how the mess was created.. Jewish and Palestinian population got into each other's hair... now undoing it is easier said than done.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
13 (
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Question re: Jewish belief about Hell.
Posted:
11/12/2009 7:22:00 PM
There are variations, as everyone believes slightly differently, but Bear more or less nailed it. To add a few minor points (and these are bits and pieces I've heard and read from religious Jews, YMMV):
* I think Pagans used to do human sacrifices in the Heenom valley at some point, so it was a scary place.
* There is no fire in Jewish hell, the torture is psychological. The hardest part of the torture is being shown two films: what your life could have been, and what it was. Much of the belief about afterlife is very similar to Buddhism, and the role of the relatives and their prayers is similar, too.
* Many believe in reincarnation; it does not contradict anything.
* Jews don't talk about afterlife much and are more or less agnostic about it. Judaism is more concerned with living right in this world.
* Non-Jews are said to have it much, much easier in the afterlife, which makes sense, because they've never promised anything to God in the first place. They are only required to follow the much more relaxed "Noah's law": not to murder, etc. Which is why whenever someone wants to convert to Judaism, tradition compels to try to talk them out of it.
* For most of us, our claim to the land is historic, not religious, although for religious Jews, that component is certainly there as well. For the rest of us, the ethos of 2,000 years of Passover promises/wishes to see each other "next year in rebuilt Jerusalem"... call it religious or not.. they did sink in and finally manifested, as you can see.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
82 (
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Questionning Israel = antisemitism?
Posted:
11/12/2009 3:05:57 PM
Someone smarter than me had said it before: criticizing Israel is not antisemitism; singling it out is. Unless you happen to have a rational explanation of WHY you are singling Israel out, i.e. how Israeli policies bother you more than about everyone else's in the region.
When an international board comes together with the purpose of condemning Israel's (admittedly problematic) record on human rights, and almost everyone sitting on that board has committed much, much more heinous violations, but they are somehow OK... it makes me wonder what's going on.
When a bunch of people on the 'net, to whom Israel, a country so puny you can't even see it on the map, that has never done anything to them, spend hours of their valuable time bashing Israel, and only Israel, resisting any attempt to focus their attention elsewhere, they make me wonder.
By the same logic (and many will disagree with me) when a Palestinian hates anything Israeli, that, to me, is not antisemitism.. it's just normal consequences of a normal conflict. Even when Mein Kampf becomes one of the best sellers in Palestine, that, to me, is more acceptable than elsewhere. I mean, at least we've given them some reasons to hate us, right? We've won, we are back to our ancestral land to which they have some very serious rights, too, but which they can't have... let them have whatever solace they find. They don't hate us as Jews, they hate us because they have a real estate dispute with us which they lost. They are hurt, they are going through their denial-anger-grief-acceptance like we've been doing for 2,000 years before them.. I sympathize, but we were there first, our ancestors have given a name to every tiniest rocks or cave there, and, unlike them, we have nowhere else to go, and they have as much land, compared to Israel, as a football field compared to a match box... hopefully, with time, they will build a good life on their football field, we'll build a good life on our matchbox, and the dust will settle. Europeans on the other hand.. I am somewhat more suspicious of European anti-Zionists, German in particular, they do make me wonder exactly what they are hiding behind this newer, more fashionable facade.
We are more than religion or a culture by the way.. we are an ethnic group... so comparison with Christianity has no merit.
VivaLAmore
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
272 (
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Biblical inaccuracies/contradictions
Posted:
11/12/2009 2:07:32 PM
If Newton's Theory of Gravitation turned out to be entirely unverifiable, unsupported by any facts, and the few facts it showed were entirely inconsistent... then it would be relevant.
His theories are entirely inconsistent with Einstein's theories. Newton's theories work on a macro scale, and Einstein's on a micro scale, but not visa versa.
Say what? Newton's mechanics is a "subset" or a specific case (there is a word for it, but its English translation escapes me now) of more generic Einstein's physics . It's a very accurate model for low velocities and low gravitation fields; but both models work there. Einstein's model is, in turn, incomplete, just like you said, but a good model.
That's a very good illustration to this theological debate: it is not a binary world where the knowledge of our ancestors is either true or false.. it's most likely true, somewhere, some place; certainly incomplete. The question is, can you do better, or can you only spend your lifetime dissing the wisdom accumulated before you?
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
30 (
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Question regarding pedophiles and the law
Posted:
11/7/2009 5:13:38 PM
I don't like it when people want to "exterminate" any segment of the population.. it usually ends bad.
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
18 (
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He lied about his age...only by two years....should i be concerned?
Posted:
11/7/2009 4:49:25 PM
It starts small...
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
65 (
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help! F*** friends/buddies and/or on/off relationships... what does he really want from me?
Posted:
11/7/2009 4:42:22 PM
Whoever said making oneself unavailable is playing games is missing the point. Don't "play" hard to get.. be hard to get. Have a life! Just to think, girl, you are 22.... not 32... not 42... how wonderful is that. To waste even one day of you life waiting for and agonizing over someone who is not 200% sure he wants you... someone who apparently does not have your best interest in mind.. that's a crime! I mean, what are you doing to your life. Even in the unlikely event that you'll "get" him, get married and have kids.. will that be a happy marriage where you will feel secure? Think... 50% of marriages end in divorce.. getting married is only half the deal..
He is a very, very long shot. And you don't make this shot by sitting there waiting for him to turn around. Love yourself, not yourself in him. If he is meant to be with you, and proves worthy, you'll know that.
Stop the friends with bennies thing now. It's hurting you already. It's never going to hurt less. It's a good arrangement when you are on a rebound... not when you are in love.
Move out if you can, even if it's just for a couple months. The place is toxic for you right now.
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
268 (
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Biblical inaccuracies/contradictions
Posted:
8/31/2009 12:38:11 AM
Control? I disagree that people have any control over good and evil or over the world.
Does Caribbean crisis say anything to you?
In any case, this is just one of many examples of the dizzying verbal gymnastics required to reconcile the words of the Bible with the real world.
No gymnastics, just knowing the language of the original.
For this purpose, let's just equate "perfect" with "inerrant." Talk to a Baptist minister or Pentacostal pastor.
Give me one reason why I should do that, any more than I should ask their opinion on Pushkin. Even if some of them manage to overcome the language barrier, frankly, I find literalists (both theists and atheists) to be somewhat boring. I mean, it's a complex world! It remains to be proven that the infinite Universe can be adequately described using a finite human brain and even more finite language. In any case.. if it does not ring true to you, that means it's not yours. Why don't you seek what works for you, and let others do the same.
I would also take issue with your claim that people have succeeded in keeping the Scriptures unchanged for 100 generations or so.
Scorpio I believe just wrote that Kumran scriptures are pretty much identical to today's Torah. I have no knowledge of that, but that's something you can easily verify or refute. How much more proof do you need?
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
266 (
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Biblical inaccuracies/contradictions
Posted:
8/30/2009 1:02:33 AM
1. Adam and Eve supposedly had no knowledge of good or evil. How could they be held responsible for being disobedient to God? How were they supposed to know that disobeying God is "evil"? Of course, it's easy for us to judge; we have knowledge of good and evil.
One interpretation of the tale is - people gained
control
* of good and evil before they were ready to handle the responsibility, and that threw them into a lower, tougher plane, where there is childbirth, hunger and such, and where we are struggling with the same issues even today: now we are messing with the nucleus of an atom and the nucleus of a cell, things we are still not ready to control, things that can turn deadly. Same old.
*The Hebrew word "knowledge" (yeda) also has a meaning of "control" or "mastery", more than just academic knowledge; for example, for Adam to "know" Eve is to have sex with her, or one can "know" to play a musical instrument; and "good and evil" means "everything". Therefore, to "know good and evil" is to "control the world", which is precisely what the science is trying to achieve today: to play with the world like it's a toy. Someone had slapped our ancestors on the wrist several times apparently.
2. So, because of their disobedience, sin has been unleashed upon mankind. Man is now depraved, wicked, imperfect, etc. Yet writing and compiling the words/thoughts of God Himself is the ONE PERFECT ACT sinful man has accomplished? I'm not buying it.
Who said it's perfect? Just because some people succeeded to keep some written books unchanged for the life of 100 generations or so, does not make the book perfect. If it was perfect, then we'd know everything; we obviously don't. The Book is an oversimplification; one of the many oversimplifications the mankind has come up with, if I may add. Blind men and an elephant!
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
15 (
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Single Dads - please chime in ladies and gents
Posted:
8/26/2009 8:51:01 PM
Why not go to a playground or a beach and meet some single moms with kids. If it works, you've got yourself a date; if it does not, then maybe a free babysitter (but you'll have to return the favor).
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
262 (
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Biblical inaccuracies/contradictions
Posted:
8/25/2009 2:35:04 AM
There are Aramaic/Hebrew originals though
No, actually, there are not. There are copies of copies of copies of copies of the lost originals. Big difference, as you point out nicely in the sentence that preceded this quoted one
They have been saved in the sense that no translation has ever occurred and (scorpionmover will correct me if I am wrong) I believe all Jewish communities have the same Torah, without variations. Unlike the Christian Bible.
Why would he have them written in a language he KNEW would be a dead language?
Shmuot legabei mavet shelanu mamash mugzamot - the rumors of our death have been greatly exaggerated.
Earth was created in one day. (the bible could have said ANY amount of time... The Christian god chose to say one *DAY*, so no "but god really meant. . ." argument please.
What exactly is the meaning of the word "day" in light of the Special Relativity Theory? Regardless... faith is, in many aspects, like poetry: it's an attempt to use something as imperfect as a human brain (and human language) to comprehend the incomprehensible, at least a small part of it. It HAS to be metaphoric, simply because the world is more complex than we can express in a human language. So the word "day" was used. Like someone said, there was no Earth, Sun, or, likely, 3-dimensional space, and maybe there was no time as we know it, what words do you suggest to use to describe that? Many rabbis never thought of it as a calendar day to begin with.
Interesting post, Scorpiomover.
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
252 (
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Biblical inaccuracies/contradictions
Posted:
8/13/2009 1:58:40 PM
Some books cannot be translated or put on screen that easily, without losing much of the important message, and in order to not lose the whole point of the book, you need to do an adaptation.
That's exactly right, and a language is only a part of it. To illustrate the point, a literal translation from a well-known Russian song would say:
"A red rooster is bursting from under black shirts".
I challenge everybody to tell what that means.
And here is an adaptation:
The blazes of pogromes and civil war are bursting from under the black shirts of the neo-nazis.
Makes sense now? Now consider this: even my son won't be able to decipher this without some sort of a commentary, let alone his descendants 2,000 years down the road, let alone in translation to a COMPLETELY different language.
There are Aramaic/Hebrew originals though.. and a tradition of commentaries that goes with it. One might or might not agree with the commentaries, but they are a worthwhile reading.
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
19 (
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Name a good brand of a compass
Posted:
7/26/2009 11:08:31 PM
Not sure where in the world your from but round here the sun rises in the East and sets in the West if thats any help.
I am from a part of the world where there are hundreds, thousands miles of forest, and where kids learn land navigation before they learn to read. We also have a bit of self-deprecating humor over there which I am sensing might be lost on some.
Wonder what in the world compelled you to post, 7rainbows? Seeking to start a fight? There are land nav pros here on this forum who are not surprised one bit that someone might need a good compass, but what do they know, right?
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
14 (
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Name a good brand of a compass
Posted:
7/21/2009 7:36:16 PM
Wow, wealth of resources, thanks everyone! Note to self: I should have posted this question in the local forum, it attracts interesting people.
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
4 (
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Name a good brand of a compass
Posted:
7/20/2009 3:45:06 PM
I don't know, I only take GPS on dangerous hikes or mushroom hunts.. it ruins the fun. When the whole idea is to get lost, a GPS can be counterproductive, no? So yes, a compass.
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
32 (
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F Bomb
Posted:
7/20/2009 2:57:50 PM
You call THAT a bomb? So unimaginative, I wonder how come people don't ever get tired of it. In other languages I know, there are whole dictionaries of swear words and phrases.. I saw an 8-volume one.. you can maintain a whole conversation using nothing but swear words.. but then, they are for men only, we ladies are not supposed to even overhear that, most of the time.
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
13 (
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)
Too fat for surgeon general?? wow..prejudice ok??
Posted:
7/20/2009 2:51:22 PM
Don't know, a few obese people do have endocrine or other imbalance and can't help it; but barring that, in a country (oops, the world) where obesity is pandemic and the leading preventable cause of death, to choose a surgeon general who can't manage her own calorie intake and exercise regime, hardly sends the right message to the rest of us. You would not choose a surgeon general who chain-smokes, would you?
Apothegee
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
1 (
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Name a good brand of a compass
Posted:
7/20/2009 2:40:16 PM
I am a green freak and don't like to buy new things unless I have to; buying a used compass is not such a good idea though. Which brand stays operational long enough? I need one for hiking, and another for my car. Thanks!
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
8 (
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Name Richard Bach's book where a prophet burned his scriptures
Posted:
7/13/2009 8:19:21 PM
Yup! One.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/d.keenan/PageiteWars.htm
Thanks everybody, this forum rocks.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
1 (
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Name Richard Bach's book where a prophet burned his scriptures
Posted:
7/11/2009 4:29:32 PM
In the book, Richard and Leslie were traveling through a maze of parallel worlds, landing in different places. At one of their landings, they met a prophet who just saw his holy book magically appear out of thin air. The prophet then proceeded to burn the book. When asked why, he explained that this holy book will have the same fate as all holy books before it: it will cause wars, death and destruction.
What novel is it? I've only read it in Russian translation.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
25 (
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)
Kitten advice needed
Posted:
7/9/2009 6:13:10 PM
I did not have you in mind funcuz, you made a valid observation; not applicable to our case I am pretty sure. I mean, that's one happy cat. Too happy actually, if there is such a thing. Yes, the kids play it rough, do some cat acrobatics, but since he does not mind, why not? Cats are pretty good at voicing their disagreement.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
23 (
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Kitten advice needed
Posted:
7/9/2009 3:45:48 PM
Thanks, wonderful advice, especially on spray bottle. I think I'll reserve that for the extreme cases though.
As usual, there are a couple of troll responses, well, thanks anyway. I think most cat owners can tell when a cat is afraid or unhappy, it goes with dozens of other body language signals: eyes, ears, tail,... this one's tail is always up, but I am sure someone will say that's the sign of distress as well.
We've solved the scratching problem today, I just pick him up and carry him to the scratching place, he gets it now; and he is not overreacting to a "no" anymore. He is learning fast.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
1 (
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Kitten advice needed
Posted:
7/7/2009 8:48:16 PM
I've just brought home a wonderfully trusting 6 month old kitten. I've never seen a cat like this: he purrs and licks you (yes, he licks, like a dog) even when his tail is being pulled, even when he is held upside down. He always purrs when interacting with humans. Apparently, nothing bad has ever happened to him.
Now a problem: he is scratching the couch, and I waived my hand next to him in a way that scared him and pushed him off, and raised my voice a bit at the same time; nothing major (compared to the cats I've had before), but now he's visibly changed, he is afraid of me and showing some avoiding behavior.
What do I do? How do I teach him, let alone discipline him, without scaring him and changing his personality? He is not an average cat.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
113 (
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)
Astrology
Posted:
7/7/2009 12:03:51 PM
What's notably lacking in all the anti-astrological rhetoric is facts. Goes like this: "You believe in X, therefore you must be a moron, since only morons believe in X" - guess that's what passes for logic with these people.
Wait a second, here is an attempt at an argument!
Wait a second. When astrology was invented a couple of thousand years ago, people had absolutely know way to precisely plot any location on planet earth. Longitude and latitude hadn't been invented yet. Clocks hadn't been invented yet either. So people didn't think in terms of hours, minutes, and seconds.
Where do I start.
1. Astrology is much, much older than 2,000 years.
2. Hours, and fractions of hours, have been very well known by the Egyptians as far back as 4,000 years ago, and probably much earlier than that. Babylonians recorded time down to microseconds (as 1/60th of 1/60th of... ), even though they lacked the ability to measure it up with such precision. The very fact that hours and minutes of today are recorded in the base of 60 tells us of its Babylonian origin; which is where Astrology as we know came from btw.
From Wikipedia:
they specified that the mean synodic month was 29;31,50,8,20 days (four fractional sexagesimal positions), which was repeated by Hipparchus and Ptolemy sexagesimally, and is currently the mean synodic month of the Hebrew calendar, though restated as 29 days 12 hours 793 halakim (where 1 hour = 1080 halakim).
3. Not that you need to know minutes and seconds in order to do a chart.
4. Astrologers and their clients were local, they did not travel as much as they do now, and thus there was no need for latitude and longitude corrections.
Oh well, as if anybody's reading.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
56 (
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)
Astrology
Posted:
7/4/2009 12:49:49 PM
^^^ It's called Vedic astrology I believe
The basic difference between the two systems is that the Vedic zodiac is Sidereal and the Western is Tropical.
* In Sidereal astrology, the zodiac is aligned with 27 constellations, or fixed star groups. Aries, the first sign of the zodiac, aligns with the first constellation, called Aswini.
* In the tropical zodiac, the point in space when the Sun crosses the earth's equator is the beginning point of the zodiac, or Aries.
The earth's equator shifts backward through the signs of the zodiac at the rate of about 51" of longitude per year. This is called "precession of the equinoxes." Because of this phenomenon, the theoretical Aries of the western zodiac drifts further and further from the Aries used by Vedic astrologers -- at the rate of about 1 degree every 72 years.
The tropical (Western), and the Vedic Aries were on the same zodiacal plane around 285 AD. Because of the precession of the equinoxes, at present, there is approximately a 23 degree difference. Thus all of the planets in a Vedic horoscope, including the rising sign, will be about 23 zodiacal degrees earlier than they would be in a Western chart.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
1 (
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How to gauge whether a guy's interest is purely platonic
Posted:
6/10/2009 7:41:05 PM
His interest is very, very strong, we talk for hours, do things together, but nothing that can not be classified as pure friendship; nothing I would not be doing with a girlfriend. We are in the same circle of friends (not a "dating" situation per se), we are a tight group, and if I make myself too obvious and he is not interested, that would have awkward social implications. What are some subtle ways to resolve this puzzle?
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
1 (
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Liking them more when they are far away
Posted:
6/3/2009 9:44:39 AM
Has this happened to you: you've been really into someone, but whenever you meet, the magic is suddenly almost gone, you are little more than platonic friends. You go home, and here you go, you start thinking about them again, and everything said and done with them suddenly becomes very important. What is this? A sign that you are out of touch with the reality and in your dream world, perhaps projecting something onto them that is not there? A normal, healthy step in developing an attraction?
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
3 (
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Friendships
Posted:
5/28/2009 9:46:41 AM
You did not miss the mating season, it's right now. LOL. Sure, there are friendships - but none off the dating sites, except maybe for long distance friends; this has been my experience. Not for the lack of wanting on my part! Maybe I am just scared of the consequences. Has other people's experience been any different?
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
1 (
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)
Friendships
Posted:
5/28/2009 8:54:36 AM
How many men would be open to a platonic friendship with a woman off a dating site, without taking offense and without any hidden agenda? Honestly?
I understand wanting to cut off when sparks fly on one side, that's asking for trouble; been there, done that. But when the chemistry is so-so, I can tell, and the guy's ego is hurt nevertheless, what's up with that? So many talented, interesting people here, with unique interests and hobbies, with stories to share, skills to teach, do we HAVE to limit the whole thing just to dating? What are we, crabs who want to be left alone under a rock except in the mating season? Or am I doing something wrong?
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
5 (
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Am I wasting my time?
Posted:
5/27/2009 9:59:01 PM
Why don't you post in the Profile Review section.. and brace up. I think your profile is sort of wishy-washy; it needs some work. It's almost like you are trying to look worse than you are - and your pictures confirm that. Got to like yourself first.. know what I mean? Got to know who you are - and say it in a positive way.
In any case, your deployment in August is probably a show-stopper to many. It's one thing to wait for someone you know and care about; it's another to sign up for all that for someone you don't even know.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
3 (
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)
COMMUNICATON IN A DIGITAL AGE
Posted:
5/27/2009 5:07:04 PM
In a digital age, it's generally advisable not to shout... digitally.
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
19 (
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)
Lip gloss
Posted:
5/27/2009 3:19:58 PM
Most importantly, who is going to be in the control group?
abc.abc
Joined:
12/26/2006
Msg:
17 (
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)
Lip gloss
Posted:
5/27/2009 2:49:26 PM
Put extra lip gloss, give him a bj and ask him again what he things of lip gloss.
LMAO, with this method, he will come to like anything, you name it! I think you should patent it, OutMind. There is some prior art, but who cares, this would not be the first time.
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