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 Author Thread: When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 43 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:34:52 PM
Why then did Clinton win in kosovo, while Bush still has us stuck in the quagmire of Iraq?
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 69 (view)
 
What does maybe mean?
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:19:17 PM
Matt:yna's got the picture here. She's stringing ya... for what I don't know... maybe because she wants you around to manipulate you or something... or make a fool out of you.

I'd drop here like cold runny dog feces.

There's other girls.

Sounds like she's a cold fish at least.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 40 (view)
 
In Baseball, Which team had the best World Series Victory ever
Posted: 10/14/2005 4:56:08 PM
1960 Pirates with Bill Mazeroski's homer.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 17 (view)
 
Poll: Americans Favor Bush's Impeachment If He Lied about Iraq
Posted: 10/14/2005 4:41:50 PM
not according to the polls..
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 4 (view)
 
Pathetic and unAmerican
Posted: 10/14/2005 4:33:56 PM
yet another display about how much the neoconservative movement resembles nazis in prewar germany with their persecution of political opponents, racism, fascism, crusade against human rights at guantanamo, stopping people from counting the vote and appointing their own party as presidents, raping the national retirement fund to give to the rich in the form of "tax cuts" which really don't cut taxes at all; and want to replace our democracy with a one-party system.

This is the biggest problem the US has right now.

That's not "pathetic" and Unamerican, that's PATHOLOGICAL and Unamerican.... very frightening. I hope our nation survives.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 12 (view)
 
Are you against the War?
Posted: 10/14/2005 4:28:39 PM
I don't believe Iraq was a threat to Israel for several reasons:

1) The US had bombed his air force to smithereens and for the most part was enforcing the "no fly zone".

2) The Israelis home made tanks are not Abrams tanks, but still totally superior to anything Iraq has or had.

3) Scott Ritter had a list of bioweapons shipped to Iraq during the 80's from the US, Japan and Germany and KNEW that almost every last one had been destroyed. He said the US was the only one trying to act as if they weren't convinced; possibly because they were already planning the invasion of Iraq and wanted to keep this as a reason to invade. Bush's treasury secretary O'Neill confirmed Bush's administration was planning the invasion as soon as he took office.

4) Even Saudi Arabia said they no longer felt threatened by Iraq and asked us to move our military OUT back in 1998... and this is probably the reason we invaded Iraq: for the purpose of keeping our military near our oil supplies in the middle east to keep any jihadists from taking over AND TO deter any oil boycotts, which are a huge threat to the US national security.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 9 (view)
 
Are you against the War?
Posted: 10/14/2005 3:58:10 PM
I think the invasion of Iraq was very stupid and ill-advised...and lied about for the reason that it's immoral to invade another nation to control it's resources. It's really a ridiculous position for the US to have put itself in; but the question now is: How can we lessen our dependance on foreign oil so we can get out?
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 15 (view)
 
Poll: Americans Favor Bush's Impeachment If He Lied about Iraq
Posted: 10/14/2005 12:38:56 PM
I strongly favor Bush being impeached... but the whole government lied about Iraq. They knew what was going on and let Bush lie. The knew the truth.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 13 (view)
 
Where have all the cowboys gone?
Posted: 10/14/2005 12:22:45 PM


You are inferring that you like beer?

No... I'm inferring that a socialist and democrat are two completely different creatures and you probably know the difference...

It's not like your stupid and can't tell.

Your attacking something that's not there again....
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 40 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 12:16:45 PM

Iraq is <5 % of the worlds Oil reserves....get off the Oil argument!! Your like a bunch of damn parrots!!!


ac: your argument that Iraq itself is only 5% of the world's oil reserves is true and without piecing the whole picture together (picture the whole middle east), then you're right. It would make absolutely NO sense.

However, the US presence in the middle east gives us a deterrence factor against middle east boycotts AND Jihadist takeovers of friendly governments, such as Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, UAE and many other smaller Arab oil supplier nations in the area as well as Iraq.

Sixty percent of the world's known oil reserves are in the middle east, and as JimTex once said: it only costs $14 a barrel to get it out of the ground in Saudi Arabia and all the costs on top of that are taxes and profit between the pump and the retailer.

Imagine what the cost of oil would be if we had to start at $60 a barrel just to get it out of oil wells in and around bakersfield and other US fields if we couldn't get it from outside...not to say the volume of oil being cut by less than 30% to the US was enough to start the gas lines of the 70s, which even paralyzed the US military for a time.

In fact, the US actually planned to invade Saudi Arabia and TAKE the oil before that was cut short by the assassination of King Faisal in 1975.

You're a reasonable person and I have a hunch this consideration might influence your opinion as to the big picture on middle east oil and the threat of not having it.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 1 (view)
 
"Ring of Fire: The Emile Griffith Story"
Posted: 10/14/2005 12:07:55 PM
This is a great drama/documentary about two of the great fighters in boxing history, one of the greatest series of boxing matches ever, a moment of rage that killed a man, respect for fellow human beings and healing after a great tragedy.

This is not only one of the two great boxing films of all time ("Ali" is my favorite, one role Will Smith was absolutely BORN to play) but one of the BEST movies I have ever seen in my 55 years of life.

I highly HIGHLY recommend it, even if you're not a boxing fan....
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 33 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 9:44:21 AM

I sorry to vent


Not to be sorry... You've got a right, soldier... maybe even a responsibility to us and those who died and those who are currently suffering.. including yourself: to let us know.
I think you're very courageous to do this.

Big words, I have... but only words. You're doing the work.

I think it helps all of us to know how important it is to settle the issues which led to this; no matter what those issues may be. This is something that needs to be dealt with as soon as possible.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 10 (view)
 
Where have all the cowboys gone?
Posted: 10/14/2005 9:39:11 AM


I can detect very few differences between a Democrat and a socialist. It probably takes two beers to make one into the other.


I disagree dal, I think all it takes is a rudimentary political education.

If you think I'm inferring something, you may be right.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 30 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 8:48:03 AM
inoutoverandunder: Please understand that my son is in the army and he's going over there soon after coming back from Afghanistan.

You can see some of us are against the war or think it's unnecessary, but I can tell you for a fact that the reason many of us are is because your lives are extremely precious to us. You guys are the ones that put your lives on the line to protect us and our disagreement for the war doesn't take away even one BIT of our love for you guys and the hurt we feel whenever one of you gets hurt or killed.

Many of us pray for all of you every day and wish this thing could be over sooner.

Let your guys know we feel that way, PLEASE.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 29 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 8:43:37 AM


is crucial and critical to the very survival of western civlization as we know it.
_____________________________________________________________

This I just flatout disagree with period.


Well Darjeeling.... know that I respect your opinion very highly and I'm sure you have good reasons to think the way you do. We think very alike on most things except this.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 2 (view)
 
Iraqis Catch 2 Americans Trying To Ignite Car Bomb
Posted: 10/14/2005 8:30:41 AM
This appears to be exactly what I was afraid of. With the Bush administration, it was only a matter of time, right?

http://www.freemarketnews.com/WorldNews.asp?nid=1326

UNITED STATES CAUGHT IN IRAQ CAR-BOMBING

Friday, October 14, 2005 - FreeMarketNews.com

It's happened again - allied troops being caught with bombs. This time it is the Americans captured in the act of setting off a car bomb in Baghdad. Last time, as FMNN reported only weeks ago, two British soldiers, apparently working for British intelligence, were caught near Baghdad similarly equipped.

According to the Mirror-World, "A number of Iraqis apprehended two Americans disguised in Arab dress as they tried to blow up a booby-trapped car in the middle of a residential area in western Baghdad on Tuesday. … Residents of western Baghdad's al-Ghazaliyah district [said] the people had apprehended the Americans as they left their Caprice car near a residential neighborhood in al-Ghazaliyah on Tuesday afternoon. Local people found they looked suspicious so they detained the men before they could get away. That was when they discovered that they were Americans and called the … police." Just as in the British incident, the Iraq police arrived at approximately the same time as allied military forces - and the two men were removed from Iraq custody and wisked away before any questioning could take place.

The incidents are said to be fueling both puzzlement and animosity among Iraqis. Yet the motivation behind such activities remains formally unknown since in both cases the soldiers involved have been removed with an efficiency that has quashed any attempts at an interrogation.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 23 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 7:32:13 AM
inoutunderandover: Correcto!!!

Now, I don't mind the second part. It's the first part that worries me.

Any reasonable person has to think about this, regardless of their stance on the Bush administration.

It's a neverending war unless WE can develop the political wherewithal to get off oil.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 8 (view)
 
Bush Teleconference with Soldiers Staged.
Posted: 10/14/2005 7:29:34 AM
Hey Omar

Welcome aboard, dude!

I agree with you about the Bush teleconference. This is dogma. This is politics. However, it's nothing that wasn't done to some extent by everyone that came before.

I almost posted this myself, but I didn't think it was a big deal.

Can't blame people for being against the war though...
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 20 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 7:25:14 AM


I disagree Dan. I don't think we are there to 'protect' the supply of Oil, but I would say one reason we are there was, and is, to be able to control and utilise Oil supplies, as a strategic method of exerting longterm geopolitical influence, and use it (oil) as an economic weapon.


Not sure our disagreement is that far apart, darjeeling.

I see the NEED for the US to control oil as a strategic weapon of influence in order to exert geopolitical influence as a NEED which is crucial and critical to the very survival of western civlization as we know it.

If we didn't control the oil, what would happen?
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 6 (view)
 
Where are all the Radicals?
Posted: 10/14/2005 7:10:37 AM

While I dont consider Rebublicans or Democrats radical by any sense of the word. I very much meant. Where are all the Socialists, Anarchists, ect.

Radical by definition, getting to the root of the problem (ie: Socialists argue that Capitalism is the root of the problems in the world)

This is more what I meant.


mrklove: I think we're beyond the thinks that some political ideology will save the world.

Elements of capitalism and socialism are applied to our problems as needed; sometimes rightly, sometimes wrongly; sometimes a mixture of both. The main thing is that the system functions and after that, it hopefully gets fine-tuned to become more efficient; ALTHOUGH political evolution has something in common with natural evolution in that most of it doesn't work... but if we didn't go through those stages, we couldn't be able to find something that DOES work.

In fact, being tied to something like "socialism" or "capitalism" today is recognized as kind of a silly thing to be...
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 2 (view)
 
Are you against the War?
Posted: 10/14/2005 7:07:17 AM
I hate to say this... because I believe the war is morally wrong and that's why we're lying about it; BUT, I think the survival of western civilization depends on it because the middle east could ruin us by boycotting oil. The US imports 60% of it's oil and europe imports a lot bigger percentage than that, so the only deterrence to a boycott is US military occupation.

We at home should do our part and get off the oil dependancy somehow. Otherwise we're engaged in a war that cannot end until there's no more oil to fight over.

This could be the end of western civilization... at least as we know it.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 58 (view)
 
Al Sharpton Likes Speed
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:59:55 AM
Again, I have to agree with Dal... 110 IS lethal speed....

I don't want anyone driving that fast on the roads I'm driving on. If it's that important, call ahead and have the state troopers close the road so nobody gets hurt. High ranking US diplomats can do that.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 7 (view)
 
Money = Credit Monopoly
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:36:40 AM
This sounds way familiar... but I'm not gonna say where I think it's coming from....

I believe in freedom of speech...

But I don't think gold investment is the way to go... sorry.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 54 (view)
 
Al Sharpton Likes Speed
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:31:28 AM
okay Dal...

Nine mile chase and screaming racism when he gets caught.

I'll buy that.

the speeding alone: no. We all do that... some of us more than others...

Your argument is therefore acceptable by me.

Bet that just warms your heart.

But I had to ask. The question is there. It was begging.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 52 (view)
 
Al Sharpton Likes Speed
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:27:57 AM
Mary: do you drive over the speed limit?
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 85 (view)
 
Miers New SCOTUS nominee
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:23:17 AM


I heard it on Rush today


Rush must hate people digging into HIS life... hurts the bejeebers out of his ratings, doesn't it?

How could the senate review a nominee's qualification if they didn't go into their past?

Rush seems to think it was all made up to keep conservatives out of office

Hasn't every other nominee to the court had to go through this?

Isn't becoming a part of the highest court in the land (the world, actually!) the job with the most responsibility of any legal position in the land?

Why WOULDN'T their personal lives and political attitudes be closely examined before their appointment? Shouldn't any judge expect their qualifications to be challenged? not even just once in awhile but even in any case they sit on?

WHO were they thinking of nominating that would have "all said no"?

David Dukes?
Rush himself?
O'Reilly?
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 50 (view)
 
Al Sharpton Likes Speed
Posted: 10/14/2005 6:10:12 AM


Wonder if Dal ever exceeds the speed limit himself or if he's just picking on Al because he's black and liberal?

 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 15 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/14/2005 5:59:31 AM

do you have an opinion about this or are you waiting for somone else to read the whole thing and summarize it for you?

My 2 cents.... that's one sucky job that i am glad i do not have to do because there are brave souls out there doing it for me and you. God bless them!!!


First, I had the opinion that you do: "It's a sucky job" and I'm also thankful to those who are doing it for us.

At the time I posted this, I hadn't developed alot of other thoughts on it because I try to eliminate my own biases when I'm not controlled too much by my emotions. This is critical to developing an objective opinion that can be used to evaluate the situation. The more subjective the opinion is, the closer it comes to "I WANT...(this, that or the other)". It needs to be balanced against reasons to make it worth thinking about.

However, I think the worst thing to do is ignore it because we don't like the problem of having to deal with it. We live in a democratic society and I think at least we should be concerned about what's happening lest the soldiers should be forgotten over there and nothing is done by the rest of us to help their situation. I think we should be constantly evaluating and reevaluating this to make sure we back home are doing what needs to be done to support the troops and hopefully shorten the unnecessary parts of suffering, whatever those may be.

I do hate the war. However, I believe it IS vital to American and other free world security interests as you say.

Why?

The soldiers are not there for the reasons the administration said it was. We are over there to protect the oil which the US and the free world is dependant upon for our day to day existence.

Why don't the Bush and the Blair administrations just come out and say that?

Because it's a moral problem for one country to attack another country for the use of guaranteeing access to the areas resources. It's never been recognized as a moral reason for the carnage of war, despite the fact that deprivation of oil can cause the whole western world to collapse.

Another opinion of mine is that our hold on the world's oil supply is becoming more tenuous and eventually we WILL lose it regardless of HOW many soldiers we send because:

1) we're becoming more dependant on oil by the second
2) That dependancy is requiring input from more different foreign sources because the existing ones don't have enough resources to support our growing needs
3) We stand a chance of going broke doing this if we have to continue for a long time
4) In order to win, we may have to have a large military draft because people aren't joining up like they used to.
5) Oil is a nonrenewable resource and will eventually run out.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 20 (view)
 
Ted Nugent - Unabashed Spokesman
Posted: 10/13/2005 3:25:56 PM


I would say that being a guitar player in a rock band makes him uniquely unqualified to be a political leader, much like a governor who was a pro 'wrestler' or a big budget action movie star.


Now Eric... yaknow I almost ALWAYS agree with you... we're only afew miles (feet maybe?) apart.... but I can't go along with that...

I don't like Ventura, or Ahnold or Reagan either... but I can't say their previous careers make them unqualified to lead... only INCOMPETENCE, INEXPERIENCE or the inability to manage one's personal life or their health does that!

Sorry...

I don't like Nugent, either.

I don't like his politics and I don't like his style.... but that's just my opinion. If he got elected, then we'd get to see what his leadership would be about...

I'm not encouraging that, because I think he's a nut case... but in all fairness, even I could be wrong.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 486 (view)
 
Rally to Impeach Dubbya
Posted: 10/13/2005 2:21:28 PM


Btw, the US won the War of 1812.

not against Canada they didn't.... the US invaded and got driven out.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 1 (view)
 
What's that stuff in your pocket, Punk?
Posted: 10/13/2005 1:04:34 PM
Iowa Deputies Suspended for Eating Candy

Tuesday, October 11, 2005


(10-11) 16:27 PDT Cedar Rapids, Iowa (AP) --


Four Linn County deputies are appealing suspensions that were handed down after they ate candy that belonged to an inmate.


Jim Sorensen, one of the deputies who was disciplined, said deputies have long eaten candy left behind by inmates who are released or transferred.


Sorensen, a deputy since 1988, said he and the other deputies are accused of stealing $24 in candy from an inmate who bought the candy from the jail's commissary. The man, who was released or transferred from the jail, called back to inquire about the candy, he said.


"We ate the candy, but it has been past practice," he said. "It's a bad habit."


Sorensen, who previously ran unsuccessfully for sheriff, said about a dozen deputies were involved. After an investigation, some of the deputies were given written warnings and others were suspended.


Sheriff Don Zeller said its an internal matter and declined to comment.


The deputies are appealing the suspensions before the Linn County Civil Service Commission. A hearing was scheduled for Wednesday evening.


___
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 1 (view)
 
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences...
Posted: 10/13/2005 1:01:25 PM
BALANCING ACT
When U.S. soldiers conduct a raid, they go in hard, and that has consequences: The aggressive tactics used in the hunt for insurgents often alienate innocent Iraqis
Anna Badkhen, Chronicle Staff Writer

Thursday, October 13, 2005
Ouja, Iraq -- It had been a frustrating morning for U.S. Army Lt. Jeff Halladay. He had already gone through three houses, searching in vain for a mustachioed man suspected of planting roadside bombs. Intelligence suggested the man lived in this neighborhood of neat stucco compounds.

So now, Halladay was resorting to a more urgent measure, one that U.S. military officers acknowledge can do more harm than good: trying to gather the needed information by intimidating the suspect's neighbors.

Halladay thrust a photograph of the suspect at Muhammar Abdul Karim, a slender teenage boy in a brown dishdasha shirt, who was cowering in the corner of one of the compounds. "Where the f -- is this guy?" bellowed Halladay, 28, from Buffalo, N.Y. He towered over Karim, his feet slightly apart and planted firmly on the ground. Halladay was clutching the photograph of a man in his mid-30s in one hand, an M16 rifle in the other.

The boy started saying something to Halladay's Iraqi interpreter, shaking his head "no," his brows arched plaintively. Halladay cut him off.

"Don't f -- ng interrupt or I'll break your f -- ng finger!" the American roared. "Where the f -- is he? He's your f -- ng neighbor! Do you wanna see your brother and your father go to jail? Where the hell is he?"

The tactic brought the Army unit no closer to finding its target in Ouja, former President Saddam Hussein's home village just outside Tikrit. Karim, like his two older brothers and father Halladay would question later, insisted he did not know the man.

It's a scene that is repeated often. American soldiers looking for suspected insurgents not only find themselves thwarted in their mission but have left a civilian population more alienated by their presence than they already had been.

As commander of the 2nd Battalion of the 7th Infantry Regiment, 1st Brigade, 3rd Infantry Division, Lt. Col. Todd Wood is well aware of the negative consequences of such a seemingly heavy-handed approach.

Each man and woman alienated by Americans during a raid becomes a potential recruit for the Sunni-based insurgency, he fears. "In the States, if police burst into your house, kicking down doors and swearing at you, you would call your lawyer and file a lawsuit," said Wood, 42, from Iowa, who did not accompany Halladay's Charlie Company, from his battalion, on Thursday's raid. "Here, there are no lawyers. Their resources are limited, so they plant IEDs (improvised explosive devices) instead."

U.S. soldiers reimburse civilians -- usually immediately -- for everything they break during a raid. A broken gate, for example, is worth $60 -- about half an average monthly salary in the area. But they cannot compensate for the emotional scars of civilians they scare in the process, Wood said.

"I have to balance the effects of arresting a bad guy who possibly makes and plants IEDs versus the effects of conducting that raid and all the negative effects it may have," Wood said. "It's a very delicate balancing act. It's a risky business."

As part of an effort to tighten security in the area ahead of Saturday's referendum on the new Iraqi constitution, soldiers from the 2nd Battalion have raided dozens of suspected insurgent hideouts over the last two weeks, arresting almost 40 suspects, about 10 of whom they have already released.

There have been no major attacks on coalition troops or Iraqi security forces in the area since the raids began, and Wood credits the raids for the lull in violence.

On a typical raid, soldiers leave their humvees a block away from the suspected hideout, then sprint, silently, toward the targeted house, crouching beside stucco walls of Iraqi compounds, their guns drawn. If the compound's metal gate is shut, they kick it down and run into the house loudly.

Some soldiers separate men from women and children, while others run through the rooms with their guns at the ready, peering cautiously into shadowy corners, shining their flashlights at unfinished meals, pet squirrels, pewter trays, Kalashnikov rifle magazine clips, children sleeping on the floor. Sometimes, they bring bomb-sniffing dogs. Other times, they go through closets and cupboards, looking under mattresses and in ovens. Large, glossy brown****oaches skitter out of drainpipes as the soldiers lift up heavy lids, looking for hidden weapons.

"You gotta go on one of those raids with the assumption that the guy's barricaded in there and that he's ready to kill anyone going through the door," Wood said. "You can't come in with a relaxed posture and then step it up, 'cause you'll get hurt."

But as they yank residents out of their houses at all hours of the day -- at this time of year interrupting Ramadan meals -- the soldiers often leave civilians terrified and angry, seeming not to understand the purpose of the Americans' mission.

"Why? Why?" repeated Karim's mother, an older woman wrapped in a black abaya covering, as Halladay took her three sons and husband aside, one by one, yelling at them, swearing, demanding they tell him the whereabouts of the man in the picture.

At another compound, where an awning of flowering vines cast odd shadows on the tiled floor, an old man in a white dishdasha and thick glasses tried to persuade Halladay to take extra dishdashas for the man's two sons, whom Halladay was about to take away. "They don't need another dishdasha, guy," Halladay said.

"They need to have a dishdasha," the man begged. "Let me give them a dishdasha."

In the darkened kitchen, a woman with two infants in her arms cried, soundlessly.

"They won't let them have an extra dishdasha in detention," Halladay said, and turned around to leave. The man walked out after him and stood at the gate as the soldiers carefully loaded his blindfolded, handcuffed sons into an armored humvee.

In the third house Charlie Company raided that morning, an elderly woman, seated on a long mattress in the living room, seemed to have an anxiety attack when the soldiers came. She pressed her hands against her chest and moaned. Outside, her son, Yousef Ali Hussein, who appeared to be in his late 20s, sat on the curb, his hands bound behind his back, a strip of white gauze over his eyes. Flies swarmed on his feet clad in plastic flip-flops.

"Her blood pressure was way up, 260 over 140 -- that's stroke level," said Spc. James Morris, 38, a medic from Las Vegas. "She wasn't taking her blood pressure pills because of Ramadan. I told her that God wasn't going to look after her if she stopped taking her pills."

Charlie Company soldiers helped Hussein into one of their armored humvees, then got in themselves and took off, leaving behind distraught families.

"These raids can do more harm than good if we don't select the targets and if the soldiers don't treat the people in the area with respect," said Wood. "This is a very tough environment for soldiers who may not have the maturity or experience to understand the complexity of the consequences of these raids."
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 1 (view)
 
There Once Were Two World Superpowers having a cold war. Now both are being attacked by Jihadists...
Posted: 10/13/2005 12:57:52 PM
Rebels Launch Attacks in Southern Russia
By FATIMA TLISOVA, Associated Press Writer

Thursday, October 13, 2005

(10-13) 07:50 PDT NALCHIK, Russia (AP) --


Scores of Islamic militants launched simultaneous attacks on police and government buildings in this city in Russia's turbulent Caucasus region Thursday, sparking battles that killed at least 49 people.


Chechen rebels claimed responsibility for the attacks, which forced the evacuation of schools and left corpses littering the streets of Nalchik, the capital of the republic of Kabardino-Balkariya.


The Chechen rebels' decade-long struggle against Russia, originally a separatist movement, has melded increasingly with Islamic extremism in the past decade and spread far beyond Chechnya's borders to encompass the whole turbulent Russian Caucasus region.


President Vladimir Putin ordered a total blockade of Nalchik, a city of 235,000, to prevent militants from slipping out, and he said armed resisters would be shot, according to Russian Deputy Interior Minister Alexander Chekalin.


Estimates of the number of militants involved ranged from 60 to 300. The attacks began with heavy arms fire and explosions, and sporadic shooting continued for four hours afterward.


Officials gave conflicting casualty figures, ranging from 49 to as many as 63.


Fyodor Shcherbakov, a spokesman for presidential envoy Dmitry Kozak, said 49 were killed — 25 rebels were killed, 12 police officers and 12 civilians. He said the number was constantly rising as bodies were being discovered.


Hours earlier, officials said 63 people had been killed. Chekalin said that figure included 50 militants and at least 10 police officers. Local Health Ministry spokesman Stepan Kuskov said at least three civilians were among the dead, and 84 people were wounded. The ITAR-Tass news agency quoted Dr. Asker Zhigunov as saying 15 civilians' bodies had been brought in to a city hospital.


Dmitry Kozak, Putin's envoy to the southern region, said Thursday's attackers were holding hostages at a police station, but he did not specify whether they were civilians or officers. A spokeswoman for the republic's Interior Ministry, Marina Kyasova, said police on the upper floors of the building were battling attackers on the ground floor, and denied that hostages had been taken.


Deputy Russian Prosecutor General Vladimir Kolesnikov told the Interfax news agency that 12 militants had been detained. His estimate for the number of militants involved was 80 to 100, the news agency reported.


Police and security forces have fought pitched battles with Chechen rebels across the region, often engaging in urban warfare, and the militants have employed terrorist methods including suicide bombings and the seizure of more than 1,000 hostages last year in a school in the town of Beslan, about 60 miles southeast of Nalchik.


The extremism is spreading despite the government's harsh anti-terrorist methods, from targeted killings of rebel leaders such as Aslan Maskhadov to paying rewards for information to the demolition of houses where suspected rebels have found refuge.


Alexander Ignatenko, a top Russian expert on Muslim extremists, said international terrorist groups viewed Kabardino-Balkariya and other provinces in the Caucasus as a new front line that could encourage the transfer of Islamic militants from other countries.


Military and police reinforcements were being sent to the city; a truckload of soldiers heading for Nalchik overturned, injuring 18 servicemen, a duty officer for regional road police said.


The Kavkaz-Center Web site, seen as a voice for rebels loyal to Chechen warlord Shamil Basayev, said it had received a message on behalf of the Caucasus Front. It said the group is part of the Chechen rebel armed forces and includes Yarmuk, an alleged militant Islamic group based in Kabardino-Balkariya.


Chekalin said Thursday's fighting began after police launched an operation to capture about 10 militants in a Nalchik suburb, and that the attacks were aimed at diverting police. All 10 suspected militants were killed, he said.


Gunmen launched simultaneous attacks against three police stations, the city's airport and the regional headquarters of the Interior Ministry and Federal Security Service, police said.


The attack at the airport was repelled, the facility was placed under military control and all flights were canceled, news reports said.


The militants also attacked the regional headquarters of the Russian prison system, the Emergency Situation Ministry's press office said. Interfax said a border guards' office also came under attack.


A teacher from School No. 5, who gave only his first name, Spartak, said children had been evacuated from the building, which is near a police station and an anti-terrorism office at the center of the attacks. Black smoke billowed from the building as panic-stricken parents searched for their children in the school yard.


Windows and doors at the local Federal Security Service office were smashed. Snipers crouched on the building's roof, and masked soldiers were in the streets, where two armored personnel carriers were parked. A crowd of bystanders stood about 100 yards from the building, with no cordon keeping spectators away.


In December, gunmen raided the Drug Control Agency branch in Nalchik, killing four employees, looting an a***nal and setting the office ablaze.


Earlier this year, Putin ordered security forces to deal more severely with suspected Islamic militants in the south. Law-enforcement agencies have launched a series of sweeps targeting suspected extremists outside Chechnya.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 25 (view)
 
What comes first with men - relationships or sex?
Posted: 10/13/2005 12:52:00 PM
Males main concern is Reproductive Success... so you could say sex has alot to DO with a successful relationship. It's going to be the first factor he considers, no matter what else you think, unless he wants your money or security or something...

Females usually consider security in a relationship very strongly... probably most of them are more concerned with that than sex, or at least have no problem in breaking off the sexual relationship if they find a different one that's more secure.

It's a give and take thing....
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 164 (view)
 
Marry an ugly woman
Posted: 10/13/2005 12:41:29 PM
Nah... been with unattractive women after getting messed up by pretty ones also... and I was thinking the same as you, but found out that's not a good think.

... and my two cents worth is that attractive women MAKE themselves attractive...and liking men has something to do with that many times...

Generally, attractive women like guys more, if only for the reason that attractive people get treated better; although I'm sure you can find MANY exceptions to this...

I think the main thing is that you have to have a sense about what the person's about on the inside.

Evidently, your fiancee gauged her own self-esteem by the way guys were attracted to her and she really didn't care much about anything else.. maybe because she was shallow, or maybe just immature... incapable of treating guys better than a mirror that talks or something...Vanity will do that.

That may have been her story, but there are LOTS of attractive women who aren't like that and don't even care for alot of public attention from men; believe it or not.

Conversely, some physically unattractive people have a mean streak from being treated badly for the way they look... and if you go with them just to have someone to feel superior to...and they sense this even if you don't act it; it's going to make them feel even worse. In fact, they might jerk you around just for the sake of saying they could do it.

If you're not attracted to the person, you should just leave them alone. It's not good for either of you.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 7 (view)
 
Ted Nugent - Unabashed Spokesman
Posted: 10/13/2005 12:28:53 PM
But would you invite him over for dinner, Dal?
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 118 (view)
 
who is the number 1 sporting legend?
Posted: 10/13/2005 8:21:45 AM
Boxing Legend: Jack Dempsey- plaster in the gloves when he fought Willard, hobo to heavyweight champ, married to Estelle Taylor (siren of the silent screen), painting of getting knocked out of the ring by the Wild Bull of the Pampas-Luis Firpo. 13 knockdowns in 2 rounds... Dempsey got back in the ring and won... Battle of the long count with the first heavyweight champ to retire undefeated as champ (Gene Tunney); knocked out future champ Jack Sharkey, worked as a wrestling referee and knocked out a wrestler in the ring... down on his luck again, became broke, worked as a waiter in San Francisco and other places, customer tried to walk out on check and Dempsey got his money back ... saved up enough to open a restaurant in Manhatten and got wealthy again...

Quite a guy...

Baseball: Babe Ruth.... (need I say more?)

also Satchel Paige... who made his players get off the field (actually, that's against the rules and technically a game can't be started until there are EIGHT players between the foul lines [excluding the catcher of course]) before pitching to the all time leading home run hitter of the negro leagues, Josh Gibson in the last game of the championship series. That's the story (legend) anyway...and was also said to have thrown a baseball in Kansas City...on a bet... all the way from home plate through a HOLE in the center field fence...400 feet away...

also Steve Dalkowski.. who was rumored to have thrown a baseball through a cyclone fence:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Dalkowski

"...Steven Louis Dalkowski (born June 3, 1939 in New Britain, Connecticut) is a retired left-handed pitcher in minor league baseball. He is sometimes called the fastest pitcher in baseball history and had a fastball that may have exceeded 100 mph (161 km/h). Some experts believe it went as fast as 110 mph (177 km/h), others that his pitches travelled at 105 mph (169 km/h) or less (the Guinness Book of Records records the fastest pitch ever as 100.9 mph (162.4 km/h) by Nolan Ryan). As no radar gun or other device was available to measure the speed of his pitches precisely, the actual top speed of his pitches remains unknown. Regardless of its actual speed, his fastball earned him the nickname "White Lightning".

Dalkowski was also famous for his unpredictable performance and inability to control his pitches. His alcoholism and violent behavior off the field caused him problems during his career and after his retirement. After he retired from baseball, he spent many years as an alcoholic, making a meager living as a migrant worker. He recovered in the 1990s, but his alcoholism has left him with dementia and he has difficulty remembering his life after the mid-1960s.

Screenwriter and film director Ron Shelton played in the minor leagues alongside Dalkowski. His 1988 film Bull Durham features a character named "Nuke" LaLoosh (played by Tim Robbins) who is based loosely on Dalkowski."
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 31 (view)
 
OHHHHHH YEAH.....ANGELS WON!!!!!!!
Posted: 10/13/2005 7:49:18 AM
Must be real disappointing to Steinbrenner and the Yankee fans to have the whole sport set up for them to win... no salary cap, they make 5% more at home and traveling than other teams... spend from at least 40% more than the closest to them and 6 or 7 times more than some others... only to LOSE in the playoffs...

It's been afew years, hasn't it?

Geez.... When they win I feel like a hor's ass for being a baseball fan. Why do we even go to see them when it's such a set up?

Glad a team other than the Yankees won... ANY other team.... California teams especially...
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 5 (view)
 
Anyone Really Trust the Media Now days???
Posted: 10/12/2005 9:03:38 PM
I think a person needs a variety of perspectives on something to have a valid opinion. The mainstream media tends to print only news that the majority of people want to read. A critical factor in understanding a story is to weed out opinions in any story from facts.

Some media, like the Chrisitan Science Monitor, don't print many opinions at all. They're known for that... but even in their case, the facts are sometimes related subjectively to the reader.

I know an individual who is a retired corporate lawyer. She teaches special classes at one of the top law schools in the world to judges, who must by law take her course before they can administer justice from the bench.

She says there is NO SUCH THING as a completely objective opinion.

We are US and we have bias toward ANYONE who is NOT "us".

That's not to say we're racists, or sexists, or anything like that. That's just to say we're "us"ists...

We're going to trust OUR way more than our kids, our mates, our parents... probably even our shadow, because there's ALWAYS something we trust less about them than we do ourselves.

When we're honest with ourselves about this, it helps us to be more objective than we would otherwise be....
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 3 (view)
 
Isn't it wonderful?
Posted: 10/12/2005 11:59:54 AM
She might be a good person...

However, just the fact that she was Bush's personal lawyer makes this a possibility I'd have a hard time accepting... unless he has one lawyer who works for him only when he's right.


... in which case she wouldn't have worked for him much.

...and I think the reason the repubs are against her is because she's not far enough to the right for them...

...But the Supremes have been pretty F'd up for a lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng time...

Their decisions are much like Fox News... The white house court. They even stopped the vote counting to appoint a president in 2000... and if THAT's not "unamerican" .... well... suit yourself... F democracy, I guess... that's the court's credo...

IF the Bush administration wanted to restore the court's integrity, they'd put in a political moderate with a long history of bench experience.

I'm sure they'll never do that.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 1 (view)
 
Yankees were WAY overrated...
Posted: 10/12/2005 11:49:00 AM
You can't make a baseball team play better by just throwing money at them. The yankee players weren't nearly as good as the yankees of afew years ago. They're very weak at some positions in fact... like all the errors they made... Giambi didn't hit a homer the whole series... ditto Sheffield, Rodgriguez...

When the playoffs come around, Talent walks the walk.
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 112 (view)
 
Why are Dems/Libs/Leftists against tax cuts?
Posted: 10/12/2005 11:22:54 AM
By their own definitions, I would say that cableguy and djartski are in danger of regarding themselves as parasites... because neither of them can afford to pay nearly their fare shares of the tax burden if you match what they pay OR EVEN THE PERCENTAGE of what they pay in comparison to the top 5%, without stripping the US of it's military, closing it's airports, it's shipping ports, roads, social services, schools and probably even sewage treatment plants.



Think about it...
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 18 (view)
 
The Male G-Spot
Posted: 10/12/2005 9:03:14 AM


I've heard the male g-spot is the prostate gland but I'm not wanting to go there.


You're right about the prostate. Alot of guys have psychological problems with anal penetration...just like a lot of women have trouble with the idea of anal penetration... although (if the guy's doing it right), the back of the pubic bone is the area of a woman's body that becomes sexually stimulated, rather than the prostate on a man....

BUT...

My g/f squeezes my balls when I start to cum and sucks harder and faster...I can't imagine a guy being more stimulated than the way she gets me... moaning and toes curling up like window shades...
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 1 (view)
 
THE FOUR GHOSTS OF THE WHITE HOUSE
Posted: 10/12/2005 8:55:23 AM
THE FOUR GHOSTS OF THE WHITE HOUSE:


One night, George W. Bush is tossing restlessly in his White House
bed. He awakens to see George Washington standing by him. Bush asks him,
"George, what's the best thing I can do to help the country?"

"Set an honest and honorable example, just as I did," Washington
advises, and then fades away.


The next night, Bush is astir again, and sees the ghost of Thomas
Jefferson moving through the darkened bedroom. Bush calls out, "Tom,
please! What is the best thing I can do to help the country?"

"Respect the Constitution, as I did,"Jefferson advises, and dims from sight.


The third night sleep is still not in the cards for Bush. He awakens
to see the ghost of FDR hovering over his bed. Bush whispers, "Franklin,
what is the best thing I can do to help the country?"

"Help the less fortunate, just as I did," FDR replies and fades into the mist.

Bush isn't sleeping well the fourth night when he sees another figure
moving in the shadows. It is the ghost of Abraham Lincoln. Bush pleads,
"Abe, what is the best thing I can do right now to help the country?"

Lincoln replies, "Go see a play."
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 111 (view)
 
Why are Dems/Libs/Leftists against tax cuts?
Posted: 10/12/2005 8:54:38 AM
djartski: What tax bracket are YOU in? (see above...)
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 108 (view)
 
tax breaks for the wealthy - no help for the poor
Posted: 10/12/2005 8:19:26 AM

Because I WANT to make that much.. They earn their money, they should keep it.


Well, LET'S TRY TO DO IT YOUR WAY Cable Guy...

The tax burden costs all tax payers a total of about 3 trillion... and 1/2 of all taxpayers only pay less than 5% of that... so even if you DOUBLED their tax rate.... or TRIPLED it, or even made it TEN TIMES what it is... it would then pay for 50% of the tax revenue...

So, if you taxed THEM that much, how much should you tax the others who make more?

According to you, everyone should pay the same amount, so in order to achieve that, I guess that would make their tax burden something like 2 to 5% depending on what they earn?

So take your pic.... either 50% of the public eats rice and lives in cardboard boxes near the dump while those who make $330,000 a year pay only $20,000 and people who make more ....like BILLIONS could be paying as little as .0001% of their income.

OR

we cut government services to what the bottom 50% can afford to pay in taxes....

Let's say the current rate... which would leave the government revenues at 10% of what they are now...

Lessee...no Army, no Navy, no airports, no freeways, no marines, no FBI...

Which way would you have it, Mr. Republican tax reformer?

Now, IF YOU said everyone should pay the same rate... This is what Reagan tried to do... and he had a majority in BOTH houses when he did it.... and still it was impossible. The rich in this country are TOO rich and the poor are TOO poor for us all to have one rate. It would wipe out the middle class.

 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 106 (view)
 
tax breaks for the wealthy - no help for the poor
Posted: 10/11/2005 1:37:39 PM

I would Prefer one party run the house and senate and the other the white house, seems money does not flow out as fast.


That's Bush and the neocons agenda: a one party system where nobody can tell them "no".

I'm totally against it.

 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 105 (view)
 
Why are Dems/Libs/Leftists against tax cuts?
Posted: 10/11/2005 1:19:01 PM

Where are you getting your numbers? I got mine from the congresional budget office.

Here's my tax table:

http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=6133&sequence=0

As of 2002, income earners in the top 5% paid 54.7% of the tax burden and made TWENTY-SIX percent of all income...That is, ALL the taxable income in the economy.

... and you don't think the system benefits them more than the rest of us?


Mr. Quixote, your are factually way off. One question. What do you think George Bush Jr. would do if radical islamic terrorist took 40 Americans hostage in Iran right now? Thats an eye opening question ain't it? You know damn well what he would do.


With 140,000 soldiers only afew hundred miles away, given the fact the US wants to KEEP soldiers in the middle east anyway, of course I know what he'd do.

In perspective, I also know what Carter and Reagan did. You probably don't..

Carter called upon the US military to organize a mission to rescue the hostages which failed because of a helicopter crash.

Then, Reagan negotiated behind Carter's back and told them to KEEP the hostages until after the election; guaranteeing Carter would lose; and then on the day he was elected president, he gave the Ayatollah ALL of the money the US was holding that Carter confiscated when they took American hostages.

How bad Reagan would have looked if the hostages had NOT been released...
 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 102 (view)
 
tax breaks for the wealthy - no help for the poor
Posted: 10/10/2005 9:24:32 PM
cableguy: I'm going to let you look over your own post there and see if YOU see "what's wrong with this picture"...

You look like you should be able to figure it out.

 DanQuixote
Joined: 7/17/2005
Msg: 440 (view)
 
Rally to Impeach Dubbya
Posted: 10/10/2005 12:47:08 PM

You are right about clinton not doing anything that is equal to Bush

You can say that again...


Bush has freed two countries

Which ones?
Are you counting Haiti, where he had M-16's sent to the other side of the island to start a coup against Aristide, a democratically elected president? and then had him kidnapped by the US military and taken off to Africa?
... OH, and the other one must be Iraq, you're saying.. right?



Bush has brought Al Queda to its knees
[/quote
uh.. yeah... sure.



Bush has stop every attack on the US since 911

How about the attacks all around the world?
How about the attacks on US soldiers every day in Iraq?


Bush has brought the economy back even after the recession, 9-11, and two major military endevours

Tell that to the people whose jobs got outsourced.


Bush has lowered everyones taxes


No. He's added an average of 240 billion to the national debt every year he's been in office since 2001 and causes the budget to get bigger every year. As soon as he stops borrowing and cutting taxes, we're going to have a bigger tax bill than we had before. His tax cuts are not tax cuts at all.


Bush has increased total federal revenues (not by raising taxes)

Why does he have to borrow more every year then?


Bush has given the most money for AIDS in Africa ever

.....I'd be impressed if this didn't help US drug companies more than anyone else, because that's who gets paid money on the end part of this.


Bush has given the oprotunity for Minority business and home ownership (higher than ever before in US history)

I'd like to see the figures on this. Nobody's given a website proving this yet.


Now lest look at what clinton has done; What about the first world center bombing, What about the Mena Investigations, What about Somalia where 50,000-60,000 somolians were killed directly due to Clintons decisions,

Show us...or tell us how this happened. I've never heard of this before.


What about the rose law firm that laundered billions of dollars for cocaine dealers,

What did he have to do with that?
Show us.


What about giving north korea 6 billion in nuclear technology which they used to create the nuclear weapons that north korea has today,

There were inspectors in North Korea until Bush screwed things up by cutting off aid to them. Now Bush is crawling back to the table as we write each other.


What about clinton standing by while 2.2 million Iraqis were slaughtered by Sadam in the 8 years clinton was in office

Why did I never hear of this before?
Documentation, please.
Why are you heaping all this on at once?
Do you really think nobody will ask you to look it up?
Not so fast, dude. Your credibility hasn't been A1 around here by a long shot.
Show us!



while the UN, French, Germans, and Russians stole hundreds of billions of dollars from the oil for food program,


That figure is a flat out lie.


What about the 22 top aids to clinton who are in PRISON right now (not one top aid from bush has been incarcerated).

Name them...and don't forget: Bush and Cheney were the first president and/or vice president to have both been arrested before they came to office. NO OTHER president or vice-president had been through that, not to mention Bush's desertion from the TANG.



What about clinton passing up the chance to kill Osama twice and arrest him once,

What about Bush passing up the chance to do the same. This is why O'Neill quit the FBI.


What about clinton actually being impeached, What about clinton not even know what "is" is, What about the dozens of people who have been murdered who worked with clinton,

Name them.


What about clinton giving china nuclear secretes from Los Alamos labs,

that happened under Reagan:


from: http://www.consortiumnews.com/2001/022301a.html
"...President Reagan's fans credit their tough-talking hero with “winning the Cold War” and restoring respect for the United States around the world. During his eight years in office, Reagan certainly made clear his disdain for the “Evil Empire” and vowed never to compromise with terrorists.

But the Feb. 20 arrest of FBI counterintelligence agent Robert Hanssen on charges of spying for the old Soviet Union underscored a very different reality about the Reagan-Bush era: it was a time when American national security was broadly compromised both by communist adversaries and various regional powers.

The worst of those penetrations appear to have occurred around 1985, near the height of Reagan’s confrontational strategies against leftist governments and terrorist states. Despite the administration’s rough-and-ready rhetoric, the record now shows that the United States was the victim of enemy tricks from Moscow to Beijing, from Teheran to Medellin.

In 1985 alone, the evidence now shows that CIA officer Aldrich Ames began betraying some of the CIA’s most sensitive secrets to the Soviet Union while Hanssen allegedly began doing the same from his vantage point at the FBI.

Together these twin exposures of U.S. national security secrets may have represented the greatest breach in American history – and neither spy was identified or captured until after the Reagan-Bush era was over.

In bringing espionage charges against Hanssen, the FBI reported that Ames in 1985 identified three Russians who were working as “double agents” for the U.S. government and that Hanssen later that year confirmed Ames’s information to the KGB. The corroborated evidence sealed the fate of two of the Russians who were executed, while the third was sent to prison.

All told, Ames has been blamed for the deaths of nine U.S. double agents and the exposure of a wide variety of U.S. counterintelligence techniques. The charges against Hanssen are possibly even more serious. Besides betraying double agents, Hanssen disclosed "top secret" U.S. nuclear programs, the latest advances in U.S. spy technologies and the investigation of suspected spy Felix Bloch, the FBI alleged.

According to the FBI affidavit, Hanssen was most active from 1985 to 1991. His alleged spying operations grew more sporadic after 1991, at about the time of the Soviet Union’s collapse, though he renewed his efforts near the end of the decade.

Those later contacts, made in more emotional letters to his Russian control agents, indicated a far less disciplined double agent and reflected a new carelessness that may have contributed to the FBI's arrest of Hanssen on Feb. 20.

Yet, beyond the Soviet Union’s thorough penetration of both the CIA and the FBI in the mid-1980s, other sensitive U.S. military secrets may have reached Moscow indirectly.

Some intelligence officials in the United States and Israel suspect that the some of the secret documents obtained by Israeli spy Jonathan Pollard eventually reached the Soviet Union, giving Moscow another window into U.S. military strategies. Pollard was arrested for spying in 1985.

China & Nuclear Secrets

Evidence developed in the 1990s indicates, too, that the Reagan-Bush administration suffered damaging spy operations from communist China.

U.S. intelligence officials believe that China gleaned sensitive nuclear secrets from exchange programs with U.S. nuclear scientists in the 1980s, contacts accelerated during the Reagan-Bush years as part of a strategy to isolate the Soviet Union.

Many of the U.S.-Chinese scientific exchanges came after Reagan’s White House solicited a favor from China – the secret supplying of surface-to-air missiles to the Nicaraguan contra rebels in 1984. White House aide Oliver North, who let Chinese authorities in on the secret White House contra-supply operation, said China shipped the missiles, in part, to curry favor with the United States.

U.S. intelligence now believes that between 1986 and 1988, the Chinese used those scientific contacts to steal sensitive U.S. nuclear secrets, including how to make a miniaturized W-88 hydrogen bomb. China successfully tested its own small hydrogen bomb in 1992.

The Washington Post reported that Chinese documents turned over by a Chinese "walk-in agent" showed that during the 1980s, Beijing had gathered a large amount of classified information about U.S. ballistic missiles and reentry vehicles. [WP, Oct. 19, 2000]

Snookered by Iran

The freewheeling Reagan-Bush foreign policy led to other secret compromises with past and present U.S. adversaries. In the early 1980s, the Reagan-Bush administration secretly permitted the shipment of U.S. military equipment to the radical Islamic government of Iran through Israel.

"It was clear to me after my conversations with people on high that indeed we had agreed that the Israelis could transship to Iran some American-origin military equipment," said Nicholas Veliotes, the Reagan administration's assistant secretary of state for the Middle East. [See Robert Parry's book, Trick or Treason.]

Those early transactions set the stage for the expanded Iran-contra shipments of U.S. missiles to Iran in 1985-86, even as President Reagan vowed that he would never compromise with terrorists such as the Iranian-backed kidnappers of Americans in Beirut, Lebanon.

On June 18, 1985, for instance, Reagan said, “Let me further make it plain to the assassins in Beirut and their accomplices, wherever they may be, that America will never make concessions to terrorists – to do so would only invite more terrorism – nor will we ask nor pressure any other government to do so. Once we head down that path there would be no end to it, no end to the suffering of innocent people, no end to the bloody ransom all civilized nations must pay.”

Again, the tough talk contrasted with the underlying reality in which Reagan authorized the shipments of U.S. anti-tank and anti-aircraft missiles to Iran first through Israel and later through the CIA. In 1986, at the height of these shipments, Pentagon officials were alarmed the diversion of HAWK anti-aircraft missile parts into this secret Iran arms pipeline left U.S. forces in Europe vulnerable to air attack if war had broken out with the Soviet Union.

"I can only trust that somebody who is a patriot ... and interested in the survival of this nation ... made the decision that the national policy objectives were worth the risk of a temporary drawdown of readiness," said Lt. Gen. Peter G. Barbules in a deposition to Iran-contra investigators in 1987.

While secretly shipping those weapons to Iran, Reagan-Bush officials also were sharing military intelligence with Saddam Hussein’s Iraq. Substantial evidence now exists that the Reagan-Bush administration also helped arrange sophisticated military equipment for Iraq through third countries, such as Chile.

In a sworn affidavit in 1995, one of Reagan’s national security aides, Howard Teicher, described CIA contacts with Chile for arranging cluster bombs and other armaments for Iraq.

This covert assistance helped Saddam Hussein build his army into a powerful regional force and may have emboldened him in 1990 when he decided to invade Kuwait, an action that touched off the Persian Gulf War and continues to have geopolitical consequences to this day.."



I could list another 100 items like these or worse. These are all things that have actually happened, not just some red herring BS from people like ted turner and George Soros.

I bet you could list worse.. "Worse" in the sense that they're either lies or not true or unsubstantiated.

Hey... anyone can just make up a buncha crap out of their head. Why don't you bring me ONE point and substantiate it and we'll see what walks...
 
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