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whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 88 (view)

Questionning Israel = antisemitism? Posted: 11/20/2009 6:46:21 PM
This thread is titled: Questioning Isreal=antisemitism. It is NOT: Is Cotter An Antisemite? The rational that the zionist regime with its racist policies is not so bad because other regimes are equally immoral and murderous flies in the face of its founders who proclaimed that it would be a "Light Onto The Nations" . The irony that the proclamation was made whilst standing on the still warm bodies of the original owners seems to have been ignored, perhaps they were only photographed from the knees up. All and all, the state of isreal must be questioned because silence is complicity just as doing nothing is an act. In the spirit of Crazy Horse, Whiskeypapa

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 209 (view)

join the army and go to Afghanistan Posted: 11/5/2009 7:00:41 PM
Fopr the record Mullah Omar is a patriot defending his country from invaders. These invaders want to use his country for both a pipeline route to export oil to the Asian markets and a base to harass Russia and China. The US is not protecting the oil fields for western society. They are taking over the country for their own ends. The Taliban are no threat to the west. All they want is the invaders out. The TTP in Pakistan are mostly merecenaries from the Northern Alliance allies of the US. They are exporting mayhem because the US, India and Isreal want to Balkanize Pakistan, each for their own reasons.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 203 (view)

join the army and go to Afghanistan Posted: 11/5/2009 6:22:55 AM
Cor! Blimey!! not one of you poofters has asked why Old Blighty is in Afghanistan in the first. Just blindly go and ask no questions. NATO is in Afghanistan as an arm of US imperialism, nothing more. I suppose old imperialists see no harm in that but, the world has changed and the rules of law must apply. No longer must one nation wrest by force what it wants from another.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 47 (view)

Thousands flee Pakistan valley as truce crumbles Posted: 11/2/2009 5:40:19 AM
Ah, the Hitler card. There is no point fighting the second world war over again but I would point out that it was the Soviets who defeated Hitler not the US. The Taliban is not the cancer eating Pakistan. The Taliban is the symptom not the disease. The Taliban, like Al-quida, are more myth than reality. Anyone resisting US hegemony is automatically classified under one of those headings. The cancer eating Pakistan is the US. The people of Pakistan are well aware of US involvment. They see their government as corrupt taking US coin to make war on its own people. it is this corruption that made the people in the self-governing areas choose Sharia law over Pakistani law. They have seen the US terrorist drone attacks and the similarities of the car bombs to the mossad car bombs in Lebanon is not lost on them. The US , isreal and India want to balkanize Pakistan each for their own reasons. The big prize for the US is Baluchistan. Will they boldly seize it? Or, will they simply run out of money with the prize just beyond their fingertips?

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 45 (view)

Thousands flee Pakistan valley as truce crumbles Posted: 11/1/2009 6:55:40 AM
The price of oil has little to do with the problems in Pakistan. However, the interference of the US in reminisent of the interference in Iran during the reign of the Shah; with the US insisting Pakistan make war on its' own people just as the US trained SAVAK oppressed the Iranians. Will the balkanization of Pakistan work out to the USs' favour or will Pakistan, Baluchistan included, become ruled by Sharia law administered by Mullahs?

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 117 (view)

Afghan Deaths Increase - deadliest month in Afghan war Posted: 10/31/2009 8:47:10 AM
More boots on the ground means more double amputees , good for the wheelchair business. More boots on the ground also means more civilians killed and as passionateman pointed out, more resistance to american imperialism. There will never be a military solution to "winning" in Afghanistan. The US has to begin to deal honestly and honourably with the people of Afghanistan. Let Chevron make its' own business deals for the pipelines.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 99 (view)

Afghan Deaths Increase - deadliest month in Afghan war Posted: 10/29/2009 6:12:09 PM
All this talk about strategy and listening to the generals is just whistling in the dark. McCrystals expertise is assassination, Betrayus's expertise is payoffs. Putting Obama with these two clowns is a perfect recipe for a comedy show.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 69 (view)

Questionning Israel = antisemitism? Posted: 8/30/2009 4:36:59 PM
Just like Seinfelds Uncle Leo; anytime things didn't go his way he hollered--anti-semite!!!

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 66 (view)

Questionning Israel = antisemitism? Posted: 8/30/2009 9:20:55 AM
Criticizing israeli policies isn't anti-semetic. Anti semitism refers to hostility or predjuduce against jews. When the inhumanity of the zionist policies and actions are brought to the their attention, rather than correcting their behaviour and making amends, they use the smear of antisemite, thus justifing their actions and avoiding retribution. Perhaps the question should be: is supporting Palestinian Human Rights anti-semitism?

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 84 (view)

I watched the Israeli / US Media video Posted: 8/24/2009 8:29:14 PM
Yes, a single state is the best solution. Get rid of the apartheid wall, get a constiution--one that gaurantees equal rights for all. Perhaps, after a truth and rconciliation period as in South Africa the Muslims and Jews can work together as they did in Spain before they were expelled and maybe, just maybe, isreal could become a "Light Unto The Nations.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 40 (view)

Bush pressured Ridge to raise terror warnings for election Posted: 8/23/2009 3:35:15 PM
I agree with the "no brain" requisite for the twice bush vote.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 17 (view)

Is it possible complete al-Qaida defeat.... Mehsud dead Posted: 8/9/2009 6:07:17 PM
Mehsud was only a cog in a big machine. His death will not alter the situation ,there are other warlords to take his place. the TTP consist mostly of Tajiks and Uzbeks from the Northern alliance of Afghanistan. what are they doing in Pakistan away from their territory? Al-quida is more myth thean reality. formerly they were the computer list of the Mujahadeen employed by the CIA to topple the Taraki government and later to drive off the Soviets. Most were killed by the US and Iran during the invasion. It is not a monolithic organization with top-down central command. It is more like a mass movement composed mostly of true believers formed into splinter groups. A mass movement cannot be defeated, it has to evolve into a rational-legal government. The continued terrorist attacks by the US and the demonizing of its' leaders prolongs the state of anarchy which apparently is part of the grand chessgame.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 15 (view)

Is it possible complete al-Qaida defeat.... Mehsud dead Posted: 8/9/2009 3:43:48 PM
The TTP. for the most part, are mercenaries from the Northern Alliance. So you are correct in stating thatr he was a ruthless warlord accepting money for murder. Who paid him? Who recruited him? Why was he stirring up trouble in a formerly quiet part of Pakistan? Regarding the Bhutto killing, according to Yahoo News it was a charge he consisitantly denied. Take the police approach to murder investigations and ask, Who had the most to gain? The CIA, RAW and mossad are heavily involved in the turmoil in Northern Pakistan, each to its' own ends. The plan is to balkanize Pakistan. The US will get the big prize, Balockistan: rich in gas, oil, copper and uranium and a port on the Arabian Sea. Isrral will be the only nuclear power in the Middle-East and India will have gotten rid of its' major enemy. On the brighter side, that axis of evil suffered a setback when homegrown militias drove the TTP out of Swat and and surrounding area. Hence the continued terroirst attacks from the drones.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 13 (view)

Is it possible complete al-Qaida defeat.... Mehsud dead Posted: 8/9/2009 10:48:10 AM
Targetted killings without a thought for the safety of innocent bystanders smells more like mossad than a country with a constitution that places a high regard for individual rights. It looks like bushlite is continuing the gangsterism of the previous administration--invading countries for loot. "shooting rats at the dump" Killing people resisting US imperialism exemplifies the degradation bush and the neocons have taken a once pround and morally upright country to.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 192 (view)

US Sucked Into Israeli - Iran Conflict Posted: 7/18/2009 12:20:26 PM
why should there be a jewish state? There is no Roman Catholic state, no Protestant state, no Hindu state, no Muslim state. Why should there be a Jewish state?

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 191 (view)

US Sucked Into Israeli - Iran Conflict Posted: 7/18/2009 9:53:28 AM
Thousands of years of hatred between people's in the Middle East is a falsehood, a hasbara talking point. According to Uri Avnery when the Jews and Muslims were expelled from Spain the Jews went to countries in the Middle East where they were welcomed and treated as brothers, People of The Book, for fifty generations. It wasn't until the advent of zionism that troubles began. Even to this day, despite all the troubles, Muslims do not hate Jew.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 165 (view)

US Sucked Into Israeli - Iran Conflict Posted: 7/9/2009 8:29:49 PM
couldn't find any quotes from Mahmoud on Aljazeera, did find a few stories on the zionists slaughter of the Palestinians in Gaza, also an interesting headline: US politician urges sabotage in Iran.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 157 (view)

US Sucked Into Israeli - Iran Conflict Posted: 7/9/2009 5:43:47 PM
cite your sources to prove that Mahmoud is: a flagrant holocaust denier, Hitler apologist and rabid jew-hater that wants the dstruction of israel. You will find that all your sources lead back to MEMRI mistranslations and misquotes.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 152 (view)

US Sucked Into Israeli - Iran Conflict Posted: 7/9/2009 3:41:51 PM
cite your sources , this sounds like stuff from a hate site.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 141 (view)

US Sucked Into Israeli - Iran Conflict Posted: 7/8/2009 8:12:47 PM
Whether the apartheid torture state has a right to exist may be a moot point in twenty years. According to a CIA report (Global Research 13 March 2009) the regime occupying Jerusalem will fade into the pages of time owing to: " An inexorable movement away from a two state to a one state solution, as teh most viable model based on democratic principles...."

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 1010 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 7/4/2009 1:18:18 PM
Inserting Vietnam into the discussion is just another redherring. The "they" I mentioned are the US oligarchies from the previous paragraph. For an independent analysis regarding pipelines in Euroasia look up Pepe Escobar writing for the Asia Times 26 March 2009. Eric Margolis and the crowd at antiwardotcom are another source for analysis of the Afghanistan and Pakistan conflicts.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 1008 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 7/4/2009 10:21:00 AM
Bin Laden is basically a redherring to distract from the cause of all the trouble in Eurasia. The US created and funded the Mujhideen to destroy the Taraki government simply because they felt a stable government would be to difficult to bend to the will of the US oligarchies. Brzerinski openly admitted that he did not think the fanatics they recruited would develop into much of a threat, a classic case of blowback. The Af-Pak war is ambitious . The US wants to pacify the South of Afghanistan so that the TAP pipeline can be built. They want to subdue Baluckistan to gain access to its riches (natural gas, oil, uranium and copper) and get a port on the Arabian Sea. The US is not in Eurasia to import the ideals of democracy, it is there for the loot, plain and simple.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 81 (view)

US Sucked Into Israeli - Iran Conflict Posted: 7/4/2009 9:37:43 AM
The Palestinians rejected partition because they wanted a single country with equal rights for all. (Encyclopedia Of The Palestinian Problem) Partition is tantamount to saying: we are giving your house to people we have wronged in Europe and you now have to live out in your yard. What is preventing peace from breaking out is the zionists relentless pressure to drive off the Palestinians using methods that have gotten people hung after the second world war in Germany and Japan. These crimes against humanity include: collective punishment, mass murder, looting, deprivation of food, deprivation of water and denial medical atention. The claim of a devine right of "Lebenstraum" is false when most of the zionists hail from the US and Eatern Europe where they maintain residences in their absence.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 1000 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/29/2009 9:14:21 PM
Yes, I was taken aback but the Moyers article but it is indeed slanted to transfer blame for the development of the Mujahideen from the US to Bin Laden. The use of the chronological falsehood, buzzwords, are simply demagoguery. I suggest reading an article in Counterpunch, Zbigniew Brzezinski: How Jimmy Carter And I started The Mujahideen. Also, read his The Grand Chessboard. Then reread the article by Moyers; you will see why I thought the article came from the "lie factory". If you read The Grand Chessboard you will see what the people in Eurasia are up against and why they are so undeveloped in comparison to the Western World.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 997 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/28/2009 10:58:15 AM
This Moyers article has some errors, most notable: it begins the arrival of the mujhadeen after the soviet arrival, when in fact the CIA had already begun the attack on the Taraki government using mujhadeen fighters earlier. When the soviets arrived, at the behest of the Taraki government, the CIA was able to morph it into a holy war and recruitment of ready fighters was enabled. One of those recruited was Bin Laden. It seems glaringly false to claim Al-quida as Bin Ladens then in the next breath, say :" With Saudi Arabia and the United states pouring billions of dollars worth of secret assistance to rebels in Afghanistan, the jihad against the Soviets was constantly gaining momentum." Also, a Fatwa is a legal interpetation of the Koran usually issued by a learned scholar. Fatwas are not declarations of war and are as binding as the Abrahamic, Thou Shalt Not Kill. Neither the Mujhadeen nor Bin Laden refer to themselves as Al-Quida. Al-Quida is a term used by Bushco to extort funds from a frightened congress. Like. "the boogyman is going to get you if you don't come home early." used on children. Most of the Mujhadeen in "the base" were killed during the invasion of Afghanistan with the assistance of Iran. People who monitored radio transmissions reported that Bin Laden ceased transmitting around the middle of December of 2001. It is likely he perished about that time. This article by Moyers is self-serving and seems to have been dictated by the neocons out of the "lie factory". Blaming all attacks on US occupation forces in other countries on the monolithic Al-quida may put a face on the resistance but it is a false face used to distract from the immoral and illegal attacks by the US on those countries. You only see the attacks but the American public never asks why they are in those countries in the first place. This last post on how evil and backward the Arabs are brings to mind the words of a great american thinker, Eric Hoffer, who wrote: "The most effective way to silence our guilty conscience is to convince ourselves and others that those we have sinned against are indeed depraved creatures, deserving every punishment, even extermination. We cannot pity those we have wronged, nor can we be indifferent toward them. We must hate and persecute them or else leave the door open to self-contempt."

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 992 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/27/2009 9:50:57 AM
Regarding US founding of Al-Quida. Al-Quida, (The Base) according to Robin Cook is nothing more than the computer files of the Mujihadeen operatives fighting in Afghanistan. The Mujihadeen were foreign fighters recruited from throughout the middle-east to destroy the Taraki government and drive off the soviets. They were paid indirectly by the CIA through the ISI. Al-Quida is not a monolithic organization bent on a world-wide Caliphate but, rather, more like a mass movement; people who resist the corrupting influence of the West whos' only goal is to steal their natural resources. The Bush administration labeled all who resisted US hegemony as Al-Quida. Every false-flag, every bonafide attack is attributed to the late Bin Laden and his so-called world-wide organization. Al-Quida is the boogyman used to extort funds for the fight against "terrorism" . A technique now used sparingly by Bushlite. It should be noted that Iran had a democracy and constitution emulating the US as early as 1909 and again in 1959. While both were destroyed by outside forces but this amply demonstrates the ability to govern themselves without the chauvanism of the mighty US. Enthusiasm for torture and admiration of the apartheid, torture state of "them" seems to be hand in glove, no surprise there.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 983 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/23/2009 7:09:37 PM
The US founded al Queda and used it to destroy the Taraki government and drive off the Soviets using terrorist tactics clearly demonstates a national policy of supporting terroist organizations. The School Of The Americas where torture was taught to right wing extremist governments further demonstrates that fact. Israel, apparently needed no instruction in torture but its tactics were supported by the US. While presenting the list of attacks on the US may gain some justification for the invasions of sovereign countries it must be noted that the attacks were in retaliation for US supported oppression in the Islamic world, Palestine most notable. Being paid in your own coin can cause bitterness . The consensus on this and other threads is that torture did not save lives. Further, the consensus is that indulging in all that is base and perverse during the Bush administration took the US to depths that the US will take a long time to recover from.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 11 (view)

Stephen Colbert and the troops Posted: 6/17/2009 4:38:02 PM
Actually Bin Laden never was the head of Al-Quida, the CIA was. Al-Quida simply was the list of Mujahadeen operatives employed by the CIA, Bin Laden was only one of around five to six hundred. Most were killed by the US and Iran when the US invaded Afghanistan. (the CIA does not have a good retirement package for defunct operatives) What makes the Taliban terrorists? They were the dejure rulers of Afghanistan having seized power and forming a government during a period of anarchy, something legal under The Law of Nations. They never attacked any foreign countries and, in fact, the US dealt with them on a government to government basis. It was only when they held out for better terms for the trans-Afghanistan pipeline that the US decided to attack them. The Egyptian newspaper, Al-Whafid, reported that Bin Laden died of pulmonary complications bought on by kidney failure in December of 2001 and is buried in an unmarked grave in ToraBora.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 6 (view)

Stephen Colbert and the troops Posted: 6/14/2009 7:36:40 PM
Bin Laden was one of the mujahadeen brought in to destroy the Taraki governemt and drive off the Soviets. While bushco accused him of the attack in newyork he has never been charged with that offense because of lack of evidence. The accusation is seen by many as only a pretext to attack Afghanistan since the plans were made five weekd beforre the events of 911. Mullah Omar is the leader of the Taliban in Afghanistan

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 4 (view)

Stephen Colbert and the troops Posted: 6/14/2009 5:05:01 PM
It is very good to support the troops and to keep their moral up. After all, they do not make policy or have a choice of where they are sent once they sign on the dotted line. However, we must ask the question: why are they there, now that we now know the Taliban had nothing to do with the events of 911?

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 973 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/14/2009 4:49:06 PM
It seems those who resist US/zionist occupation are terrorists just as the French and Polish underground were terrorists to the nazis. Demonized as "terrorists" they can be subjected to any inhumanity such as the recent slaughter in Gaza. "One shot, two kills" is the slogan of the IDF as they target pregnant Palestinian women. The Palestinians are not calling for the "mass extermination" of jews. All they want is their land back and for the usurpers to leave--return to Eastern europe or to the US, whatever, just leave. US support of the apartheid regime is not a blight against Islam, it is a blight against all humanity. All the world sees it , it is only those who have gotten the "mushroom treatment" in the US who do not. All this being said, it is not likely the zionists with US protection are not going anywhere. So why two states? Why not a single state with equal rights for all?

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 120 (view)

Pakistan Will Fall to the Taliban Posted: 6/13/2009 9:08:08 AM
Well, it would appear that the CIAs, RAWs and MOSSADs machinations in the Tribal areas has suffered a setback. The TTP. mostly mercenaries from the Northern alliance, have apparently withdrawn in the face of tribal resistance. But keep your eyes on the big prize--Baluckistan. It is to rich to give up.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 948 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/13/2009 8:46:04 AM
It seems unclear who the uncrupulous and vicious enemy who doesn't give a damn about Geneva Conventions is being discussed here.... After all it was the US who invaded and laid waste to two soveriegn countries and is in the process of attacking a third. It seems risible that after slaughtering over a million people and terrorizing millions more with death squads and drone attacks in the night that one would claim high moral standing and certitude.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 939 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/11/2009 8:45:02 PM
The US doesn't have to withdraw from the world. It must deal honestly and honourably with the people of the world. Pay more attention to the Carnegie Council and less to the Council on Foreign Relations and you'll find that there will be fewer people out to get you back.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 937 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 6/11/2009 7:51:38 PM
"The fundemental question critics continually gloss over is if they had responsibility to protect the American people from another 9-11 what would they do?" I would begin to deal honestly and honourably with the people of the world. I would not invade sovereign countries to loot their resources. I would not lie to the UN as Colin Powell did. I would not build an army of Mujahadin to fight proxy wars then stab them in the back when I was done with them. I would not keep the people of the US in fear of the bogeyman--Al-quida, so that I would look like their saviour and protector. I would not allow another nation to direct my foreign policy so that it only benefits that other nation. I would not fund that other nation so that those funds could come back and corrupt my politicians so that they would have no choice but to turn a blind eye when they slaughtered innocents.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 116 (view)

Pakistan Will Fall to the Taliban Posted: 5/24/2009 10:54:20 AM
This is a nice little feel good story. To bad it is largely exageration and gross misrepresentation of facts on the ground. According to writers in Dictatorwatch the plan to balkanize and denuclearize Pakistan is moving forward on schedule, more or less. The US continued terrorist drone attacks, ostensibly targetted killings of Taliban leaders actually killings of civilians in the night, has destabilized a once quiet area of Pakistan. The people are stuck between a rock and a hard place, fake taliban from the Northern Alliance committing atrocities and attacking Pakistani forces, terrorist drone attacks in the night and now the US has forced the Pakistani Armed Forces to attack, which they have , destroying infrastructure and creating refugees. The refugees will of course be indoctinated with Taliban ideology in the camps, then they will be pushed to the south where they will threaten to take over the nuclear facilities, the US will don their white hats and ride in to save the civilized world from nuclear armageddon. By then Pakistan will have been successfully divided into tribal enclaves of Pashtun, Punjab, Balocks..... The big prize....Balockistan. Balockistan is rich in copper and uranium natural gas and oil reserves thought to rival the Caspian.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 927 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/23/2009 2:44:06 PM
I thiught manfrommesa capped this thread nicely with his repost of message#13. The books: The Cell, Looming Tower and the 9/11 commission report are good propaganda because while they have a lot of true information in them they all carry the message of the US as victim of a foul attack and totally justified in the retaliation they carried out. The creation of Al-quida can be found in US interference in Afghanistan in the 70s and 80s ; islamic extremism is the direct reaction of the US support of israel and the US installed puppet dictators of Pakistan, Iran (prerevolution) Saudi Arabia and Egypt to name a few. None of this can be found in those books.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 113 (view)

Pakistan Will Fall to the Taliban Posted: 5/18/2009 8:45:52 PM
Radical Islam is a response to crisis, with leaders who are charismatic, looked to for guidance because of their wisdom but not venerated. The rise of the Mullahs in Iran was caused by the oppression of the Shah who gained power through a US and British engineered coup. The Taliban gained power through the US who thought they would be a malleable government after the overthrow of the Taraki government and the expulsion of the Soviets. The Taliban gained power and influence in Pakistan because the Pakistani government was corrupt and seen to be in the US pocket. The people in the self-governing regions chose Sharia law because the Pakistani judiciary was seen to be corrupt and expensive. Hamas, which was an israeli support group, gained power because Fatah was corrupt and Hamas most attended to the needs of the Palestinians . Hezbollah was a Lebanese homegrown resistance to israeli oppression that gained influence in Southern Lebanon, like Hamas, by attending to the needs of the Shias. As a response to crisis radical Islam would be short-lived if they were not continually attacked. Their revolutionary style would have to evolve into a more stable type but the prolonged "war on terror" keeps them in power, the terrorizing of the west feeds the terrorizing of the East.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 890 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/18/2009 8:11:59 PM
Your "strawman" complaint is a "redherring" Cotter has clearly shown that torture , rather than saving lives, actually cost the US many lives with the use of the Ibn al-Shak al-Libi confession gained by torture that was used as the excuse to invade Iraq. The confessions obtained by torture could have been gotten by other means by skilled interogators.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 872 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/17/2009 7:44:45 PM
If the question is valid and the premise of who allowed the deviant behaviour of torture is mistaken, don't you find it odd that all, even the torture enthusiasts, addressed the premise and ignored the question? wether or not the Democrats knew about the torture is immaterial--a red herring intended to disapate criticism and muddy the waters when trials begin.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 868 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/17/2009 9:30:05 AM
The question: did torture save lives? is a false question because it relies on the word of the torturers to arrive at a false conclusion. This is a technique of propaganda used to deflect from the main questions: Who allowed the torturers to deviate from the Conventions? Who ordered the torture? Who enabled the torture? We have seen how torture was used to justify the illegal invasion of Iraq with disasterous results for all involved. Why are you still clinging to the old lie?

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 856 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/16/2009 3:22:15 PM
Your antics of "if you don't tell on me I won't tell on you " are very childish and have been a source of amusement here. However, Obama, Blair and Pelosi were told about the torture after the fact. That knowledge does not mitigate the crimes of Bushco.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 854 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/16/2009 2:44:31 PM
Of course the torturers will say anything to justify themselves just as the tortured will say anything to make the pain stop. torture is illegal under The Geneva Conventions. If you don't agree with the Conventions, which are bareboned to say the least, the US has signed and ratified The International Covenant On Civil And Political Rights. The Covenant affords greater legal protection than the Conventions, so take your pick. Bushco broke international laws, the big one ,waging a war of agression, a crime against peace brought on other crimes , warcrimes such as the slaughter of civilians in Faluga and crimes against humanity such as torture. internal makeshift laws justifying torture enacted in the US do not supercede international treaties. The old excuse, "because we can!" is wearing thin. The question should be: Should Bushco be hung under the Conventions or the Covenant.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 102 (view)

Pakistan Will Fall to the Taliban Posted: 5/15/2009 8:21:51 PM
Oh jeez, now they have ancestral rights to our land!!!

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 823 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/14/2009 12:17:59 PM
How do you deal with global terrorism??? Stop terrorizing. had the US not overthrown the Taraki government of Afghanistan there would be no Al-quida and no Taliban. Afghanistan would have been by now a progressive prosperous country. Had the US not begun its' terrorist drone attacks in Pakistan the Swat Valley would still be a tourist attraction. had the US not invaded Iraq the US would not have pawned the future of their grandchildren to enrich a few already bloated US corporations and there would not be so many dead and maimed US soldiers. had the US not supported the oppression of the palestinians there could be a prosperous vibrant country there now. there is an old saying: When you find yourself in a hole, the first thing you do is stop digging.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 814 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/13/2009 7:46:51 PM
Thought I had better get on here before you found another flaw in my logic. Propaganda cannot teach you anything new nor can it change your mind once it is made up. Propaganda can only tell you what you already know. Propaganda only releases your inner voice. krauthammer writes propaganda justifying torture, you agree with torture so Krauthammer writes with intelligence and common sense. I don't agree with torture so all I see is an old pompom girl chanting Yea Bush! Yea torture! as I recall the US wasn't occupying Afghanistan after the soviets were driven out. I suppose we will have to check the Reagan years to find why Afghanistan was left to wither on the vine. What was going on at that time? I think it was the beginning of the dissolution of the soviet Union and the looting of Russia by the Jewish oligarchys. Only so many hands and so many pockets I suppose. I have to agree, the "decider" isn't an evil genius. The "high functioning moron" was a tool of the neocons . The neocons were not in the game for personal wealth, theirs was the goal of zionist domination of the middle-east. Their program revealed in their PNAC and their paper "A Clean Break" outlined the order of the countries to be attacked, Syria, Iraq and Iran. Afghanistan was a deviation from the plan but Bush was under considerable pressure from UNOCAL to rid Afghanistan of the Taliban so that a more malleable administration could be put in place. right now no one is benefitting from an Afghanistan pipeline because none are in place. But the US has placed a huge base in the "desert of death" straddling the proposed route of a trans-Afghanistan pipeline. Bin laden was only one of the Mujahadeen recruited to overthrow the Taraki government and drive off the Soviets. That he was to assume leadership of al-quida by virtue of his deep pockets came later. But as I stated it was the US and the Saudis who recruited and paid for the Mujahadeen. and it is the US who is responsible for the rise of he Taliban by funding their administration.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 811 (view)

Ex-CIA agent: Waterboarding 'saved lives' Posted: 5/13/2009 10:37:49 AM
Krauthammer is one of the leading neocon propagandists whos' unabashed support of the illegal invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq is used as confirmation that what Bush has done, while illegal, is the right thing to do. The Bushites return the favour by using him as the "authority" for justification of their monstrous acts of wholesale slaughter and torture. Frankensteins two pus-filled legs. Krauthammers' recent persuesive article is based on Tenets self-justification for torture in the hope he will recieve a short sentence when he is prosecuted for crimes against humanity. If you need proof that the Bush administration sold you out to big oil and the opium trade you need only to look at the BTC pipeline. That oil goes to the Euorpean market, how does that benefit the US? as soon as the US invaded Afghanistan the opium trade was revitalized, how did that benefit the US? Tell us how in your "real world" the continued occupation of Afghanistan is benefitting the US. don't bother telling us about the bogeyman coming to attack the US in the night, by now most americans are sleeping with a ligh on. The "lins share" of the blame for islamic fanaticism can be laid at the feet of the US. It began with the funding and training of the Mujahadeen used to overthrow the Taraki government. the Mugahadeen were not native Afghanistans, they were gathered from throughout the middle east, most with a strong background in Wahabism which is more ancient tribal custom than Islam ,endemic to Saudi Arabia. It was the torture of prisoners in Au Graib that was the poster child for fanaticial al-Quida recruitment. In short there would be no "islamic extremists" if the US had not created them and furthered their reason for existence by occupying and looting their countries.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 89 (view)

Pakistan Will Fall to the Taliban Posted: 5/11/2009 8:07:06 PM
Source: NYTIMES. It is going back awhile but it was the NYTimes two pelicans Michael Gordon and Judith Miller who were the main propagandists dutifuly regurgitating "intelligence" that was fed to them about Saddams quest for nuclear weapons by spooky characters who turned out to be neocons operating out of Pentagons Office Of Special Plans, euphamistically known as "the Lie factory". The neocons dragged the US into a dark pit. Cotter has never expressed any hatred to the institutions that made the US great. Only a disgust at how those institutions were used and abused by those with dual loyalties to disregard the consitution and mock international laws.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 30 (view)

Thousands flee Pakistan valley as truce crumbles Posted: 5/9/2009 2:06:12 PM
Iran doesn't have a sphere of influence. It is, however, within two other spheres of influence, Russia and China. Even if Iran developed nuclear weapons how would it be a threat? At this time it has delivery system, it is under constant satellite survellence, the zionists have three nuclear armed submaines of Irans coast, the US has no less than three nulear armed fleets of its shores. with all that survailance a rocket would't get four feet above the ground before the US and the zionists rained death on Iran. But the news from the NIE might be changing, AIPAC was successful in subverting the Charlie Freeman appointment to the NIC, so it is likely that AIPAC will have its own man in that position, Bonkers Bolton comes to mind.

whiskeypapa

Joined: 5/19/2008

Msg: 27 (view)

Thousands flee Pakistan valley as truce crumbles Posted: 5/9/2009 12:56:44 PM
The talks with Iran regarding its nuclear weapons are "spectacularly unproductive" because the US is asking Iran to prove a negative, the same technique that worked asking Saddam to prove he had no weapons of mass destruction. The IAEA reports that Iran is not developing nuclear weapons, the NIE concurs as does ISIS. It's like asking you, "do you still beat your wife?" All the caterwauling about Irans nuclear program comes from one source, the criminals who run the zionist regime occupying Jerusalem, rather than compete with Iran they simply want to whack the competitiion.

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