Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Politics  >      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 dragonpat
Joined: 9/29/2006
Msg: 168
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?Page 9 of 9    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9)
In the third case above may I ask why the person in question didnt take advantage of the amnesty offered in the 80's? WHy that person didnt apply for citizenship? why that person had to stay illegal for all those years?
just curious.
 dragonpat
Joined: 9/29/2006
Msg: 170
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/18/2008 11:40:46 PM
I dont know of any international law that would prohibit the deportation of non-citizens back to their own country. Last i checked it was still an aspect of soverignty that a nation can remove non-citizens. I could be wrong. But i dont think i am. As for deteration of our relationship with mexico, how would sending back their citizens be a justified cause for them to be upset with the US? As for the rest of the world, well they are right now having their own immigration problems.
As for amnesty, well a partial amnesty would be a viable answer providing there was some real effort made to stop the flood. I still think the best way to stop the flood is go after the employers big time. No job, no reason to stay.
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 172
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/19/2008 4:29:14 PM
I think to take what Sorot said in the above post futher, while adding even more of a revelation to your question DP, is this:

The reason Mexico would be upset with America for sending back illegals is easy. They can't afford them either, and it's easier to make America look like an uncaring society than it is to tell the truth. If we put their own burden back on them, we are the bad guy.


As for amnesty, well a partial amnesty would be a viable answer providing there was some real effort made to stop the flood. I still think the best way to stop the flood is go after the employers big time. No job, no reason to stay.


I don't think given the direction our country is heading, any amnesty is good thing at this time. In my area, thousands were given pink slips, many auto industry workers are losing their jobs on Dec. 23rd. As I've said before, if everything were A-OK in this country economically, then fine. But it isn't and it's going to get worse. See the thread about the country heading for a depression. If that happens, how can we justify giving amnesty to illegals when we can't provide jobs for our own? And while I've debated with many others on this very topic, I don't think going after the employers will get rid of them all. Just the honest ones who really did come here with no other intention except to provide for their families. Those into criminal activity will continue to stay and be a source of problems. And they are the one's who need deportation the quickest.
 angelsands
Joined: 9/17/2005
Msg: 173
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/19/2008 4:44:40 PM
WOOOOOWWWW...!! Uhh.. I will have to admit that I never thought I would agree with You Mr. Ready... Even though partially. The problem is that the ones getting deported... are the ones that HELP and try to contribute... meanwhile the "criminals" are roaming free and some of them even have PRIVATE JETS...!!! Have You ever heard of WALL-STREET...??? What about CONGRESS..?? OHH.. I almost forgot... THE WHITE HOUSE...!!!
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 175
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/19/2008 9:54:38 PM

meanwhile the "criminals" are roaming free and some of them even have PRIVATE JETS...!!! Have You ever heard of WALL-STREET...??? What about CONGRESS..?? OHH.. I almost forgot... THE WHITE HOUSE...!!!


Hey, now......

The only place we can deport the Wall Street, Congress and White House guys to is San Quentin. But first you gotta find something that they are guilty of and will stick, and until then they ARE at the very least legal citizens.

Now these other cats we're discussin'.........they are criminals first, anything else second. Big difference there. We got something that will stick on those guys, now we just gotta convince those "criminals" (your definition not mine) in Congress and the White House to do something about 'em.
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 176
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/23/2008 2:23:17 AM
Now Ahh-nuld says Cali-fornia is gonna be brohke eff they don't come hup with 42 billion in da next two months.

Is this haven of illegals the next big Government bailout?

I think this is where the showdown could begin and make a big impact if someone has the 'nads to stand up and fight for it. Give the bailout if they take a percentage and start the mass (M)exodus runnin' toward the border! Set up one way tickets for those who need them and those who have vehicles "pack our sh!t & start yer engines"! It would send the right message since those bozos in congress seem to think they deserve some kind of raise for the piss-poor job they do and actually earn a bit of it by overseeing something meaningful for the first time in a long time. Show this country that it can actually do something to save a bit of the tax money they seem to want to give to everyone but those who earn it.

But, nah, that would be too easy. They'll probably just hand it to them without any stipulation and we can watch the Mexican GNP increase again as we watch our unemployment numbers do the same. Why am I so quickly becoming very disillusioned with my country?
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 177
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/23/2008 8:24:03 AM

I don't think given the direction our country is heading, any amnesty is good thing at this time. In my area, thousands were given pink slips, many auto industry workers are losing their jobs on Dec. 23rd. As I've said before, if everything were A-OK in this country economically, then fine. But it isn't and it's going to get worse.
No, it's obviously not A-OK here in the good ole US of A. We still haven't found a bottom in this downward economic spiral. Quite frankly, if I were here illegally, I'd be making plans to exit stage south....cuz things are going to get worse. We may see at least another 150 days (5 mos) of continued layoffs and business closings, home foreclosures, etc. Bank institutions have taken billions in bailout moneys and yet refuse to disclose where or how the money is being spent. Wall Street is in bed with the higher escelon of government and they're getting whatever they can while the gettin's good.

In a nutshell, there is no accountability in America. (Just look at Maddof)

But write a bad check and see how accountable you will have to be.

Why am I so quickly becoming very disillusioned with my country?

Ready, this may be where our opinions depart. As I see it, illegal immigration didn't start just yesterday, but in the past 8 yrs, things have drastically changed. 8 yrs ago, illegals were here but it's quite possible they've doubled in numbers in that time. After 9/11, it would have seemed ever so apparent that we needed to stem the flow coming across our southern border, not to mention other areas of the pacific northwest. Yet, these issues have all but been ignored. Up until a week or so of the financial meltdown, Bush (and McCain, I might add) continued telling the American people our economy was strong, while Obama had long since warned of catastrophic failure if things continued on the same path. So finally, after a couple million homes had been foreclosed on, and unemployment started rising exponentially, Bush finally admits (a year after anlayst had concluded we were already in a recession) that we were in a recession. For many, who take his word as the nectar of survival, they refused to see our economic woes until he made such statements publicly. It's as if they could not see with their own eyes, that they couldn't think outside the box (brainwashing) long enough to see they were covering things up, until it's much too late. And I think the problem with illegal immigration is parallel to this-that the situation grew much dire before it would ever be recognized publicly. Bush waited to admit the economic failure until it could not be held back any longer, and I feel they already know how pitiful the situation is concerning illegal immigration, but because other issues have now surfaced, it's too easy to ignore the basic facts, that the illegal conundrum is as much a part of our economic woes as the Wall Street money grab is. As you clearly point out, AHnold is beggin for a bailout.... but what if SF & LA were no longer a sanctuary for illegals.... these illegals are clearly a financial burden on that states economy. Yet no ones got the khahunas to admit it. So, in terms of accountability for bailout money, wouldn't you think AHnold should stem the tide by making sure their bailout money goes towards insuring bona-fide Americans will receive the benefits - by clearing out all those with illegal status? That goes for any state who's filing bankruptcy or has a hand out for bailout monies.
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 178
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/23/2008 10:41:43 AM

So, in terms of accountability for bailout money, wouldn't you think AHnold should stem the tide by making sure their bailout money goes towards insuring bona-fide Americans will receive the benefits - by clearing out all those with illegal status? That goes for any state who's filing bankruptcy or has a hand out for bailout monies.


Absolutely, 100% agree. I thought I made that point clear before the government gives them a peso, we should get some kind of insurance it goes to help Americans. Legal Americans. If I implied anything other than that, it was not my intent. And if you think I hold Bush/repubs any less accountable for this economic mess (including illegal immigration) than anyone else, that wasn't the intent either. My statement about becoming disillusioned was because I somehow know in my heart that California WILL get that bailout money without stipulation, and things will continue on status quo. And that, for lack of a more fitting term, sucks.
 cpfstock
Joined: 11/7/2005
Msg: 180
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/24/2008 1:09:43 AM
Actually erik
Like destroying the medicare system and helping big pharma.
Like passing Energy legislation written by Energy lobbyists.
Like eliminating taxes on multi-million dollar estates

all these are more important than the immigration issue. But here is one simple idea to help curb illegal immigration. Take for instance a city like San Fancisco, which has a stated policy of NOT enforcing immigration laws an d refusing to cooperate with federal law enforcment in these matters. Fine. Now just cut off all federal money to the city and any governmental body within the city like the school district. You want to do your own thing, pay for it.
 dmotz
Joined: 11/19/2008
Msg: 182
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 12/25/2008 2:14:51 PM
Why not pull our troops out of the middle east...with all the money we can save...build a electrified wall along the ENTIRE border...man it with our soldiers...spend a few million and find every illegal and ship them home...regardless of what country they come from.
Stop all foreign aid to Mexico...and every other country...they will soon see the US has been good to them...the crying will end when the other nations have to toughen up or sink.
We have enough oil..reserves...farms and other resources to cut ourselves off from the world...I say do it...then those who hate the US...you know...the ones we send BILLIONS to every year..will sink on their own. We can produce everything the American citizen could want or need right here...Piss on the rest of the world..take care of ourselves...
 sd_matt
Joined: 7/9/2006
Msg: 183
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 3/5/2009 7:22:27 PM
Jiperly and some others

Would you do for another country what it wouldnt do for you? Whether or not that country was rich or poor? If so then your definition of equality is arbitrary.

If you feel that we should solve Mexicos problems ( taking in her poor ) rather than helping her solve her own then you enjoy playing big brother. Is big brother part of your definition of equality?

For the rest of the bloggers, the solution.
1)Vote third party and send both dems and reps out of office. They have BOTH sold us out to the illegals. One for
business and the other to get voters. If the third party doesnt answer your demands then vote them out too. Communicate to them why you voted third party. You cannot reward failure with job security and expect different results. This is long term.
2) If Mexico goes to civil war then be ready to pick a side. Get it over with quickly. Be ready to invade Mexico if both sides are bad. Don't settle for the lesser of two evils. This is a Cold War mistake that we repeated many times.
 Beaugrand®™©
Joined: 3/24/2008
Msg: 184
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 3/5/2009 8:21:05 PM

spend a few million and find every illegal and ship them home
Do the math:
12 million illegals in the US.
The cost of identifying them, apprehending them, arresting them, prosecuting them, housing them until transport is available to ship them home, will easily exceed $5,000 each.
That's $60 BILLION, minimum.
Your share of that cost is how much?
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 185
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 3/5/2009 10:26:26 PM

Do the math:
12 million illegals in the US.
The cost of identifying them, apprehending them, arresting them, prosecuting them, housing them until transport is available to ship them home, will easily exceed $5,000 each.
That's $60 BILLION, minimum.
Your share of that cost is how much?


I bet that 60 billion would actually create some jobs as opposed to this 700 and "whatever it is today" billion dollar bailout we are stuck with to create around 2 million jobs. So figuring there are 300 million people in the country, and probably 150 million of those people actually pay any taxes--what, 400 bucks or so? To create possibly 10 million or more jobs?

Sounds like a bargain!!! I'll ante mine up tomorrow if it will get the ball rollin'.
 EarlzP
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 186
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 3/6/2009 4:21:37 AM
Without a doubt having 12 million illegal’s working in our country is a problem to really gauge the depth of the problem you have to know what they are doing and how much they are being paid to do it. If many of them are working at an hourly rate that is below minimum wage then hiring American workers to fill the void and paying them minimum wage will increase the bottom line on products and will that effect the most? Those that can afford the increase in life essential goods and services the least.

Their has to be an answer that will put Americans into these vacated jobs and make it so that their employers don't want to hire the illegal’s
 Beaugrand®™©
Joined: 3/24/2008
Msg: 187
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 3/6/2009 6:31:41 AM
The solution has to be pragmatic, because "just ship them all back" simply isn't practical or realistic or economically possible. It has emotional appeal (that I sympathize with, but hey-), and that's it- it won't work and it isn't going to happen.

I favor a program that would allow illegal residents who have never committed a violent crime to
1.) surrender to INS
2.) pay a fine
3.) serve a term of probation for entering illegally (12-60 months, paying a monthly probation fee)
4.) purchase a work permit
and
5.) pay taxes.

The catch is that those who enter this program
forever waive their rights to apply for citizenship.

It isn't "amnesty" because the crime of entering the country illegally isn't forgiven; if terms of probation are violated they are subject to prison and/or deportation and/or additional fines.

It saves the taxpayers $60+ Billion dollars, because the program would be self-funding. It increases revenues because the legalized residents will pay taxes. It discourages crime and encourages lawful behavior.
 gizmosellschickens
Joined: 5/20/2007
Msg: 194
view profile
History
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 3/9/2009 4:12:10 AM
The immigration problem started before Clinton was in office or even before Truman because the american economy had low skilled jobs no one wanted in argiculture, hopstiality and such. From WW2 to 1964 they had bracerco program that regulated the flow of workers between Mexico and Untied States at the time. The program sounded good in theory but the problem was workers were being cheated out of money by the goverment of Mexico and employers. The solution to illegal immigration is got to based on compassion, yet we need more troops on the border to catch dangerous drug lords, and smugglers. Immigration reform is needed to give people who paid social secuity taxes, local, federal taxes the oppounity to become American citizens. The supply of workers America needs never meets the demand because politicans cave in natvists rather than doing that what is best for the country as a whole.
 Metreau
Joined: 7/30/2004
Msg: 196
Solutions to illegal immigration?
Posted: 3/15/2009 7:01:17 PM
No decent, educated Mexican person comes to USA by illegally crossing the border and becomming a burden to the rest of population.


Sorot, though you make an absolutely good point in that entire post, I think that the sentence I quoted isn't true. From what I understand, the Mexican gov't is churning out brochures and other media eduacating Mexican citizens on how to cross the border (including which areas of the border are easiest to cross). I encourage ANYONE that thinks I'm incorrect on this to speak up.

I think we actually need to go ACROSS the border to address the problems AT the border. No, I'm not talking war, but we do need to do something (like impose trade embargos) that could persuade Mexico to get it together.

On a sidenote, the Mexican government should've taken care of their citizens in the first place. We would've never had this problem if it actually provided the proper essential services like it's supposed to. But seeing that that it's too happy to take the U.S. dollars sent across the borders (via Western Union, MoneyGram, etc.), I don't think anything is going to be done on their end.

Hopefully, Barrack will have something done on this issue instead of play the Bush/Regan card....
Show ALL Forums  > Politics  >