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 ForeverLong
Joined: 11/22/2007
Msg: 351
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The Science of Global WarmingPage 15 of 19    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19)
It's more about politics than anything else. Ice ages have occurred several times, and much warmer periods when there were hardly any people on the earth. It's pretty arrogant to think we can control the climate. All it takes is a big volcanic eruption, activity of the sun, or an asteroid impact to change the climate immediately. Whatever we can do is too little, it's like throwing stones into the ocean and expect it to have a measurable effect on the waves.
 FairyHealer
Joined: 9/3/2007
Msg: 352
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 11/19/2009 6:22:13 PM
It doesn’t take a scientist or a genius to realize that “pollution” has negative effects not only for the planet, but also for everything that exists on the planet. Therefore reducing such “pollution” would have a positive effect on the planet and it’s inhabitants.

But, can pollution change the temperature of the Earth and is it responsible for all these changes?

There are all kinds of talk about this being “truth” on TV. What I don’t see mentioned on TV or in the news anywhere is that “Our Whole Solar System Is Changing.” Surely we aren’t responsible for this ….but what is? Could it be the Sun?

The following info is from a paper by Richard C. Hoagland & David Wilcock published in 2004.

http://www.enterprisemission.com/_articles/05-14-2004/Interplanetary_1.htm

The entire solar system - not just our one small planet -- is currently undergoing profound, never-before-seen physical changes.

Here are some highlights:

Sun: More activity since 1940 than in previous 1150 years, combined
Mercury: Unexpected polar ice discovered, along with a surprisingly strong intrinsic magnetic field … for a supposedly “dead” planet
Venus: 2500% increase in auroral brightness, and substantive global atmospheric changes in less than 30 years
Earth: Substantial and obvious world-wide weather and geophysical changes
Mars: “Global Warming,” huge storms, disappearance of polar icecaps
Jupiter: Over 200% increase in brightness of surrounding plasma clouds
Saturn: Major decrease in equatorial jet stream velocities in only ~20 years, accompanied by surprising surge of X-rays from equator
Uranus: “Really big, big changes” in brightness, increased global cloud activity
Neptune: 40% increase in atmospheric brightness
Pluto: 300% increase in atmospheric pressure, even as Pluto recedes farther from the Sun
None of these statistics are from “fringe” scientists; they are all very, very real, and what you have just read is only the proverbial “tip of the iceberg.”

The article was fascinating and offers something you won’t find on the 11 o’clock news.

Peace, the FairyHealer
 quietcowboy
Joined: 12/25/2007
Msg: 353
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 11/22/2009 6:01:14 AM
Another article about "the science of global warming":

http://www.dailytech.com/Climategate+Stunning+Deception+and+Misconduct+at+UK+Warming+Research+Center+Revealed/article16889.htm
 JustDukky
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 354
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 11/29/2009 10:10:26 PM
@ Thorb

I see the carbon footprint as a way of trying to pass the blame onto the individual and take it off the corporate machines.

BINGO!!
 AncientMuse
Joined: 8/12/2007
Msg: 355
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 11/29/2009 11:42:19 PM
Here's the 'big elephant in the room' for me with AGW and why I'm a skeptic :

The huge assumption of positive water vapour feedback and the lack of understanding of cloud formation and its role as a negative feedback in the overall mechanism of climate.

How are clouds formed exactly ?
Are they a negative feedback ?
And if so, how dominant is it ?
Does one feedback cancel out the other ?
Are we observing more cloud formation now ? Or less ?
And so on, and so on.

The IPCC admits in AR4 their lack of understanding in feedback mechanisms, especially clouds.

Without the positive feedback assumption, AGW (specifically CO2 as the lead author) cannot possibly work.

As far as I'm concerned, full true understanding of feedback/albedo mechanism(s) is an enormous missing chunk of the puzzle.

The science cannot possibly be 'settled' without that knowledge.
 A1_GOLD
Joined: 5/6/2009
Msg: 356
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/23/2010 7:09:17 PM
The IPCC is in trouble again on multiple fronts.

Their declaration that the glaciers in the Himalayas are going to melt away by 2035 was based on a non scientific news story.

Other reports indicate that Arctic summer sea ice has increased 409,000 sq miles, 26% since 2007.

Professor Mojib Latif is predicting mild global cooling over the next few decades.

Al Gore and the IPCC might have got the science wrong on Global Warming.
 Island home
Joined: 7/5/2009
Msg: 357
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/23/2010 7:37:07 PM
I think it is all a big conspiracy
To set us up for when a real emergency emerges
We will confidently sit back and allow it to over take us
 eye4light
Joined: 7/12/2006
Msg: 358
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/24/2010 10:16:51 AM
Here’s how I see it -

A man begins driving from Los Angeles to Toronto. Two hours later, the oil pressure light comes on. He continues driving.

Three hours later, the light is still on but he remembers that the oil level was checked sometime in the past couple of months so he probably doesn’t need to check it again. That would waste of time that could be spent driving.

An hour later, he hears a radio report about a mechanic who was caught fraudulently charging people for unneeded repair service. This convinces him that all mechanics are not to be believed.

Four hours later he hears a talk show host ranting about an automobile recall order for a faulty design. This convinces him that the oil light is probably only on because it’s faulty.

Two hours later, a radio preacher passionately quotes Exodus 14:25, “He made the wheels of their chariots come off so that they had difficulty driving”. This convinces the driver that if the oil pressure warning light is right, something could go wrong with the engine that might make driving difficult - but not stop him from reaching Toronto.

He hears many more things on his radio: the Mayan calendar ends soon and so does the Universe; generation upon generation of evangelists have seen the positive signs that they would see the end of the Earth as we know it and so it must be about to happen...eventually; sometimes cars run perfectly and sometimes they break down - it’s just a natural cycle, no big deal; there are spots on the sun that can disturb television and cell phone reception.

He is convinced that the oil light is not really important and besides, the world will come to an end someday so, ”why worry?”

A few hours later, there’s a loud knocking sound coming from the engine. White smoke starts billowing from the exhaust and the engine is losing power.

He drives on. No worries.

 coolnomad
Joined: 5/4/2007
Msg: 359
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/24/2010 4:12:03 PM
Island home - I would urge you to consider how absurd your comment sounds. Consider for a moment, the level of competence that we see demonstrated by our governments.
 Island home
Joined: 7/5/2009
Msg: 360
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/24/2010 4:17:54 PM
coolnomad
Its not the government
its the anti government
Thems the brainy ones
 coolnomad
Joined: 5/4/2007
Msg: 361
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/24/2010 4:31:55 PM
Who is the anti government?
 A1_GOLD
Joined: 5/6/2009
Msg: 362
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Posted: 1/24/2010 6:00:04 PM

what reports and by who .... site a quote or two for this preposterous claim.
[did you bother to even check google's latest reports from major news papers?


I'm sorry, they have been lying, please read this article:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1242011/DAVID-ROSE-The-mini-ice-age-starts-here.html

The IPCC reports you have heard aren't based on real observations.
 Island home
Joined: 7/5/2009
Msg: 363
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/25/2010 12:37:05 AM

Who is the anti government?[.quote]
With my tongue still firmly in my check
The conspiracy theorists!
 A1_GOLD
Joined: 5/6/2009
Msg: 364
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/25/2010 8:10:50 PM
You understand that the IPCC report states that the Himalayas glaciers will melt by 2035 was based on hearsay and had misrepresented the news article as scientific research when it was just word of mouth?

The scientists suggest that the changes in global cooling and warming is based on changes in ocean currents and these fluctuations cycle over decades?

Weather scientists have trouble predicting weather a week ahead of time much less decades at a time.



Lies are not being told as much as data interpretation is still in progress.
don't jump to any stupid conclusions too quickly .... the Innuit are rarely wrong about the Arctic.


I would love to see a scientific journals report by Innuit scientists. Are there any Innuit climatologists that you can cite? Or are you too working on Innuit hearsay?

Just because you believe that something as simple as burning fossil fuels may be changing the global environment doesn't make it so. It sounds easy but when the weatherman can't predict the local weather this coming weekend or the coming season, I find it hard to accept that it can be predicted for the next year or for the coming decade. Who can you trust with your plans for the next week and be as absolutly certain of their predictions as you seem to0 be of their prediction of the weather 20 years from now.

I am still of the generation that had the fear of global cooling drilled into us. Too much rainfall spoiling the harvests. Summers to cold for plants and frosts destroying citrus in the southern states. Winter snow storms, blizzards, that buried cites for weeks at a time, snow drifts higher than homes. Rising fresh water lakes due to rainfall and snow. Hurricanes that hit the east coast up to Manhattan in the fall. We were frightened that glaciation might start again and there was nothing we could do about it. No one ever mentioned global WARMING.

Oh yeah, please moderate your use of certain adjectives, they are insulting, please be civil.
 coolnomad
Joined: 5/4/2007
Msg: 365
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 1/25/2010 11:22:50 PM

Weather scientists have trouble predicting weather a week ahead of time much less decades at a time.


This is actually a misconception about climate science. Predicting short term events is very difficult, but predicting trends extrapolated over long stretches of time is very doable. For instance, consider roulette... betting on red or black coming up on the next spin is very difficult if not impossible to predict. However, over many repetitions the trend is predicable (say 10,000) roughly 48% will be black, 48% will be red and 4% will be green.
 quietjohn2
Joined: 12/6/2004
Msg: 366
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 2/4/2010 8:40:54 PM
Here is a nice long-term prediction - over about 450,000 years, placing current global temperatures exactly where they should be base upon a 120,000 temperature cycle- http://www.globalwarmingart.com/wiki/File:Ice_Age_Temperature_Rev_png.

Based on ice core measures, the planet has been hotter than the present time on 4 occasions and then it has cooled off again.

Go back 4-5 million years and the planet was substantially warmer - http://www.globalwarmingart.com/wiki/File:Five_Myr_Climate_Change_Rev_png

You may argue that CO2 levels may add to the effect, and I'd agree that it would be wise to moderate CO2 production, but graphs like these surely raise a question about how anthropogenic current climate patterns really are.

This chart http://www.globalwarmingart.com/wiki/File:Phanerozoic_Carbon_Dioxide_png shows CO2 levels hitting at least 3 times higher than current levels in the same 450,000 year period - and the planet cooled down again. The solid lines are computer models.
 themadfiddler
Joined: 12/9/2009
Msg: 367
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 7/9/2010 1:05:26 AM
This headline should liven things up a tad...


http://www.democracynow.org/2010/7/8/headlines#9


British Probe Clears "Climategate" Scientists

A British university probe has cleared a team of scientists linked to the so-called "Climategate" controversy last year. The University of East Anglia launched the investigation after over 1,000 emails were stolen from its Climatic Research Unit and publicly released. Deniers of global warming had claimed the stolen emails provided evidence of an effort to silence academics who have questioned or downplayed human-driven climate change. But in the latest of several probes to clear the scientists involved, panelists found no proof of the charges. University of East Anglia vice chancellor Edward Acton said he hopes the so-called controversy can be put to rest.

Edward Acton: "Today for the third and hopefully the final time, an exhaustive independent review has exposed as unfounded the whole thrust of allegations against our science. We hope the commentators will accurately reflect what this highly detailed independent report says and finally lay to rest the conspiracy theories, untruths and misunderstandings that have circulated."

The British probe comes one week after a Penn State panel exonerated one if its top scientists whose emails were among those released.

 Meeting_At_The_Crossroads
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 368
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 12/18/2013 10:45:24 AM
I live in Ontario. With all this freezing weather this fall, I do wonder what is going on with global warming. If the arctic is indeed warming up, then where is all this @%*#^*(& freezing cold weather coming from?? I do wish someone would turn up the heat.
 Coma_White
Joined: 9/15/2013
Msg: 369
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Posted: 12/18/2013 1:37:31 PM

I live in Ontario. With all this freezing weather this fall, I do wonder what is going on with global warming. If the arctic is indeed warming up, then where is all this @%*#^*(& freezing cold weather coming from?? I do wish someone would turn up the heat.


That's a common misconception. I also live in Ontario, but increasing the heat energy in atmosphere doesn't always equal "hot". Just like feeding more electricity into your computer won't make it faster. It'll just start making the system go haywire. A lot of people don't understand that you don't just look at the temperatures, you look at products of heat energy.
 bamagrl68
Joined: 11/14/2010
Msg: 370
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 12/20/2013 3:41:08 PM
Peacethx- Increased CO2 is just one cause of climate change.
The dynamics of the phenomenon are much more complex.
I found an article that is long, but explains it well:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/earth/cause-ice-age.html
Do not declare yourself knowledgeable of anything, especially science, without doing your research first.
There have been periods of the earth warming and cooling long before humans were even on the earth.
 DameWrite
Joined: 2/27/2010
Msg: 371
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Posted: 12/20/2013 8:53:20 PM
http://davidsuzuki.org/issues/climate-change/science/climate-change-basics/climate-change-deniers/
 forumiteinca
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 372
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 12/25/2013 10:43:12 AM
I'm having trouble with the concept of Global Warming right now. The temperature outside is hovering around -16 C; it went down to -23 C last night. My gas furnace has not shut off for the past two weeks. And people still talk about Global Warming and the Arctic warming up. Where is all this cold weather coming from?? The Antarctic?
 Coma_White
Joined: 9/15/2013
Msg: 373
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 12/25/2013 11:12:13 AM

I'm having trouble with the concept of Global Warming right now. The temperature outside is hovering around -16 C; it went down to -23 C last night. My gas furnace has not shut off for the past two weeks. And people still talk about Global Warming and the Arctic warming up. Where is all this cold weather coming from?? The Antarctic?


Isn't it supposed to be cold in the winter? I mean, today is Christmas.
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 374
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The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 12/25/2013 11:35:24 AM
One of the fundamentals of Global Warming, which those who actually understanding keep telling people, is that because of the complexity of climate, overall warming does NOT mean that local regions will see nothing but higher temperatures throughout.

Quite the opposite, in fact. It has been said that we will see more variation in our local climates because of the warming. That means that some winters will actually be COLDER for some than they were before, even as the polar ice has been melting back further than it has for hundreds or even thousands of years.
 GreenThumbz18
Joined: 4/25/2012
Msg: 375
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 12/26/2013 2:47:51 PM
I have been reading a book titled "The People's Almanac" by Wallechinsky & Wallace, 1975, and it contains an interesting entry "Can Man Change the Climate?" At the time of publishing, scientists believed that man might be able to change the climate of the earth. They discussed schemes to coat the Arctic region with carbon dust, so as to melt that ice, but the amount of carbon needed was way too much, so if was impossible to carry out, or by pumping warm water into those areas. The interesting thing is that those scientists argued about the effects of the melting ice. Better or worse? Wetter or drier?
Also they claimed that CO2 in the atmosphere was increased 10% between 1890 and 1975 from the burning of fossil fuels, and that this was believed to have cause a 1/2 degree F rise in temperature, and that the rise could be as much as 2.5 degrees F in the next few hundred years.
But, they add, no one knows for sure whether the earth's temperature will increase because of the carbon dioxide, or what effect it will have, and that more study is needed in this area.
I enjoyed this timepiece article because it is devoid of politics, and being in print, cannot be changed at a moment's notice like a website.
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