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 Susieb
Joined: 7/11/2006
Msg: 351
Climate disruption, re. The Science of Global WarmingPage 15 of 19    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19)
Floods caused by global warming. Who says so? On what basis?

Whilst I don't doubt that global warming is a factor in flooding, it's merely a side issue. The biggest culprit in global warming/flooding/third world poverty/injustice - is man. His very behaviour is ignorant, thoughtless and selfish and he seems incapable of learning quickly enough.

It's interesting, perhaps, that here in the UK a new restriction has been added to building regs to prevent householders concreting over their front gardens. It is perceived that 'this' reduces land drainage - never mind the destruction of land drainage in terms of road building/new airport runways although in fairness these are professionally(?) constructed and should consider such - I wonder of they do to the extent that is needed.
 maemae7
Joined: 3/4/2009
Msg: 352
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 3/31/2009 10:06:42 PM
My view on this is prove it to yourself if it's right or wrong; do your own research online and read articles on what's being affected and judge for yourself.I have done many college papers on global warming.You would be surprised what has happened over time and most recently.Type in global warming look up whales, sea lions, and other polar ice animals and read some on how their life is changing and what they feed on.Follow the food chain and see the effects of what global warming is doing.Don't take my word for it.The world evolves, the world has changed and wheither it's for the good or bad,you decide.
 WanderingRain
Joined: 3/9/2008
Msg: 353
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History
Climate disruption, re. The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 3/31/2009 11:25:58 PM
To me, here's my way of looking at it:

Cause and effect:

there's two results for the people who believe Global warming exists :

1) If they are correct, people take steps to prevent it (mostly control man's consumption and excess). Planet is saved.
2) if they turn out to be wrong, you will still have cleaner air, better water and a more robust environment because efforts have been made to curb excesses.

Let's look at people who don't believe, do nothing and refuse to acknowledge man's responsibility to nature:

1) if they are correct that global warming does not exist, we will still have dirty air, less water, and a poorer environment since we're doing nothing but keep the status quo.
2) if they turn out to be wrong, humanity is screwed big time. (there is no do-over) There will be wars for water resources, more sickness, more death. If the world tips into a terrible imbalance, you will lose massive numbers of people to starvation.
 fishingmachine
Joined: 1/23/2009
Msg: 354
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History
Climate disruption, re. The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 4/1/2009 3:10:15 AM
Either way humanity is screwed! The planet earth will not be able to sustain the growth of humanity. We are destroying it slowly. Weather patterns are changing by whatever means are causing it. Back in the late 20's and 30's the Oklahoma and Kansas area was a dust bowl. Now there are crops growing. The floods are our fault in a sense that we build levees to hold back water in an area that we shouldn't build. Common sense dictates that we use our heads a little better. We are easy to blame, but it is hard to accept.
Back in the 70's there were only 500 polar bears, now they are thinking of taking them off the endangered species list. Believe what you want. Our earth will revolt. Maybe its best that way. That way we as humanity will get it thru our thick skulls to be more aware of what we walk on every day. For a species that has the most advanced brain that we know of, we sure are stupid.
 sabbycat149
Joined: 2/26/2009
Msg: 355
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History
Climate disruption, re. The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 4/1/2009 10:21:34 AM
2 words,,,,,,,,pole shift,,Nova did an excellent documentary on this .Volcanic lava flows with known time intervals were core drilled and it was found the the metallic content pointed in opposite direction in diferrent layers, The time intervals were mapped and placed on top of the co2 chart(like the one in inconvenient truth) and it matched perfectly,every time there was a co2 spike there was a pole shift. Granted we are producing more co2 increasing the normal spike we are currently in but maybe this will hold off the cooling effect after the poles have shifted and the earth magnetic field gets back to full strength
 unholymackerel
Joined: 2/23/2009
Msg: 356
Climate disruption, re. The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 4/1/2009 11:46:17 AM
Pole shifts don't occur. However, magnetic pole reversals do. On average a pole reversal happens about every 800,000 years. Many people get pole shifts confused with pole reversals and for some reason mistakenly think that the poles are going to suddenly shift thereby creating catastrophic upheaval. Scientists will tell you not to worry, because it's not going to happen.
 sabbycat149
Joined: 2/26/2009
Msg: 357
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History
Climate disruption, re. The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 4/1/2009 11:59:44 AM
Ya , a reversal ,didn't realize there was a difference :)
 jinglehimmer_smith
Joined: 12/4/2008
Msg: 358
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 4/1/2009 12:10:55 PM
My biggest question about global warming is even if it exist, who cares? What gives us the right to say this enviorment is better than the one were headed for? What if i like 150 degree weather? If you believe evolution is true, then we'll all adapt anyway. If your smart and have reasoned the necessity of God's existence, then you have nothing to worry about either. Its kinda like Socrates' old theory that death cant be bad!
 unholymackerel
Joined: 2/23/2009
Msg: 359
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 4/1/2009 12:55:48 PM
Our society has been created and suited to our present environment. Any major climate change will occur at a great cost to society.
 neopol
Joined: 9/26/2006
Msg: 360
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 6/6/2009 9:47:17 AM
U.N. report: Nature best controls climate gases June 6 2009
------------------------------------------------------------------------
AMSTERDAM (AP) — Nature's way is best for controlling the gases responsible for climate change, the U.N. Environment Program said in a report Friday.
The report said better management of forests, more careful agricultural practices and the restoration of peatlands could soak up significant amounts of carbon dioxide, the most common of the gases blamed for global warming.

"We need to move toward a comprehensive policy framework for addressing ecosystems," said co-author Barney****on, releasing the report at the U.N. climate negotiations in Bonn, Germany. The event was webcast worldwide.

Millions of dollars are being invested in research on capturing and burying carbon emissions from power stations, but investing in ecosystems could achieve cheaper results, the report said.

It also would have the added effects of preserving biodiversity, improving water supplies and boosting livelihoods.

Halving deforestation by mid-century and maintaining that lower rate for another 50 years would save the equivalent of five years of carbon emissions at the current level, said****on, the agency's head of climate change and biodiversity.

The loss of peatlands, mainly drained for palm oil and pulp wood plantations in Southeast Asia, contributes 8% of global carbon emissions. China could capture about 5% of its carbon emissions from burning fossil fuels by returning straw to croplands, it said.

Agriculture has the largest potential for storing carbon if farmers use better techniques, such as avoiding turning over the soil and using natural compost and manure rather than chemical fertilizers, it said.


http://www.usatoday.com/weather/climate/globalwarming/2009-06-05-greenhouse-gases-united-nations_N.htm?csp=27&RM_Exclude=Juno
 DarkTallMan
Joined: 3/21/2009
Msg: 361
view profile
History
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 7/26/2009 2:30:19 PM
Somehow Science has turned into a competition of credentials. Instead of examining the evidence we are supposed to examine the credentials of people making claims.

floosy upon losing an argument with me over the regular msg facility chose to block me instead of hearing my side of the argument. Is an unwillingness to hear the evidence, or to present your own evidence science or dogma? Is flashing credentials science or authoritarianism?
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 362
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History
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 7/26/2009 2:52:59 PM
I didn't go through all the 15 pages, but I have came across a documentary that states the sun is in a heating cycle, or getting hotter.
http://www.lubbockonline.com/news/092897/study.htm
http://partners.nytimes.com/library/national/science/093097sci-sun.html
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/november2006/161106suvjupiter.htm

To me it would seem that between "greenhouse effect", which is logical when you see large amounts of pollutants with no place to go, Forrest removals, et al. The other things people shouldn't ignore is the fact that matter and energy is never lost, it just changes form, thus we have created a greenhouse of the earth, which when added to the hot cycle of the sun, people are going to have to acclimate which isn't realistic to expect to happen as fast as the heating cycle of this world is occurring.

I often wonder why people want to fight the fact that we humans may need to change our lives style so as to NOT expedite the global warming trend.

I also have to wonder why people have to look at these things as one or the other, and NOT both.

I think it is unrealistic to say our poles aren't melting, that we are having hotter seasons, and that these changes are occurring with resulting changes of weather patterns.

If we are to believe the bones of the dinosaurs, there was something that happened that caused them to all die out after a very long existence on this planet. In fact according to the time table of dinosaurs, it was a LOT LONGER than homo sapiens as we know them to have existed.

Why are humans so arrogant to think that we could handle an extreme weather change?

What is it with people that want to deny that polluting waters and the air, along with naturally occurring geological issues, as well as weather pattern changes, adding yet another factor is going to speed the process.

I don't have to be a scientist to understand that IF dinosaurs had a long run on this planet, and none of these large creatures survived, WITH OUT man made problems, why would we a much more fragile system creature.

I find it funny when people say God won't let this happen... Really??? Why not. If according to the bible a fluid killed off all undeserving people, and Sodom and Gomorrah were wiped out because of a displeased God... What would make this God, feel there is a need to save human kind now??? What have we done to be considered worth of NOT being wiped off this planet???

Can't be because we are good stewards of this planet, and or the creatures on it. can't be because we treat each other so well, when daily there are wars, and hate filled havoc of mass proportions.

If there is a God, and he got pissed off at humans for their piss poor behavior back then, why not now??? We are NOT kind and loving creatures to this planet...
 yna6
Joined: 1/21/2007
Msg: 363
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 7/26/2009 7:14:21 PM
Global warming? Rain 4-5 days of the week with longer winters and record snowfalls. Where's the "warming" part? I fail to see it affecting us here! Tempuratures below the norms most of the tme.
Perhaps because we are getting the brunt of the polar cap melting? Who knows?
But...there is ALWAYS an upside. Global warming will open up Antartica...a whole new continent that is just waiting for us! Overpopulated areas will have a place to expaand. New farmlands and mining opportunities. the land rush will be on, just like it was when the Americas opened up...but no native issues! Great!
 coolnomad
Joined: 5/4/2007
Msg: 364
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History
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/17/2009 2:38:33 AM
@ nextthyme: i guess just for the sake of arguing I would like to point out that dinosaurs were not much smarter than chickens.

we have highly developed brains (although the opposite may appear to be the case when you talk to certain... individuals) and over all as a species we can manipulate our environment. Should the global temperature rise the projected 2 degrees or so, I doubt it will be an apocalyptic end to our reign on earth. However, things will change. Likely there would be less of us.

And hell.. God WON'T let this happen. We're looked upon with favor :p

@ everyone who thinks the science is shaky: the science behind this stuff isn't that hard. You can go to many websites of gov't orgs and whatnot to learn about the circumstances. You don't even have to enroll in courses to learn the chemistry/physics behind global warming... the information is readily available on the internet if you want to learn. Otherwise you'll have to take the expert's word for it :\
 u_and_me_
Joined: 4/24/2009
Msg: 365
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/17/2009 9:41:17 AM
i had to say that im not a believer of global warming or what ur sayin.its like u said, ur not a climatologist. u even said urself that the amout of co2 released in2 the oceans is an overestimation.how do u know the others arent.im sorry but the weatherman cannot predict the weather accurately for tomorrow yet every1 believes thier predictions for 100 years from now.i have a question for peacethx.do u own a vehical?shop at walmart or other big corporations?if so ur contributing to global warming just like every1 else.what do u people expect to do?live like pre-industrial times?i cant see it happening.im just tired of hearing about this subject.it was a publicity stunt by al gore which worked extremely well.if he had never done it nobody would even be talkin about it.does every1 expect the planet to not change?its called evolution and sometimes its not beneficial to all species.maybe this time some of us is gettin the crappy end of the stick while the beatles and other species are laughin.lol.
 u_and_me_
Joined: 4/24/2009
Msg: 366
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/17/2009 9:49:51 AM
lol.thats a great view on things!i never thought of that.thats probably y every1 is fightin over ownership of the north pole.
 Mikezt
Joined: 7/6/2008
Msg: 367
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/17/2009 9:36:09 PM

Er global warming is causes by the sun..increased sun spot activity..All the planets in the solar system are experiencing it do they have factorys and cars on them too?



The sun is getting warmer, but at a very slow rate, about 1 degree per 500 million years, so we can consider it constant It is the only significant input of energy to the planet. The sun is also the main source of energy input to the Earth. So, add green house gases like CO2 to the atmosphere, and keep the incoming energy from the sun constant and it's pretty clear what the cause is.
 INDYSARGE
Joined: 11/2/2008
Msg: 368
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/19/2009 9:17:08 AM
Those who really care about hearing both sides of this issue should read the book titled "Red Hot Lies" by Christopher Horner. Among other things, he points out that ...

... there are actually 5 times as many polar bears as there were a generation ago.

... the polar ice caps have enlarged by several square miles, not shrank.

... many thermometers measuring global warming have been deliberately placed near hot air vents and on black tar roofs.

... when all of the thermometers in the oceans showed there had actually been global cooling, the global warmists claimed all of the thermometers had malfunctioned at once.

... there has actually been global cooling for the last few years.

... where there is warming in one area of the planet, there is always cooling in another area, which they never point out.

... the hottest year on record was 1934.

... one global warming group first consulted meteoroligists as to what the hottest day of the year would be so as to have their meeting then for the greatest effect of what they wanted to show.

... that humans account for less than 1% of co2 emissions.

... One global warming research group has refused to share it's "proof" with the public.

... One group says they will only share it's "proof" with academics.

... One group says they have somehow lost their "proof", so just trust them they say.

... Obama has promised kickbacks and payoffs to various groups for their support of his energy tax plan.

... The countries who are the current producers of of most of the so-called greenhouse gasses have refused to sign the treaty which limits them.

The bottom line is this ... In what has now become a common theme in the Obama administration, he's going to take your global warming tax money and use it to pay others for their support of his plan. Obama said his energy tax to "fix" things it will cause utility rates to skyrocket. Yes, Obama actually said "utility rates will skyrocket". Conservative estimates are that utility rates will go up by at least several hundred dollars a year per family. Some predictions are much higher. Much like his other bailout plans, the net effect is a loss of lots of money to you, and huge payoffs to his supporters. This whole scheme is beginning to smell worse than yesterday's French onion soup.
 ClockworkToy
Joined: 6/4/2009
Msg: 369
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/19/2009 10:14:45 AM

... there are actually 5 times as many polar bears as there were a generation ago.
No I think they've actually increased 10,000 times in one generation.

... the polar ice caps have enlarged by several square miles, not shrank.
You bet, I just looked out the window and saw a glacier go by!

... many thermometers measuring global warming have been deliberately placed near hot air vents and on black tar roofs.
It's a little known fact that building all those black tar roofs and laying the intercontinental hot air pipes was actually the cause of so-called global warming.

... when all of the thermometers in the oceans showed there had actually been global cooling, the global warmists claimed all of the thermometers had malfunctioned at once.
Shivering mightily as they made the black-hearted lying announcement too I bet!

... there has actually been global cooling for the last few years.
brrrr...

... One global warming research group has refused to share it's "proof" with the public.
Lucky your guy Chris isn't so reticent, else we wouldn't know what was going on at all.

... One group says they will only share it's "proof" with academics.
... One group says they have somehow lost their "proof", so just trust them they say.
The ba$tard$!


... Obama has promised kickbacks and payoffs to various groups for their support of his energy tax plan.
Ha! Using compensation and incentives to trick them into contributing to a solution! As if anyone would fall for that.

... The countries who are the current producers of of most of the so-called greenhouse gasses have refused to sign the treaty which limits them.
Hey wait a minute! It kinda makes sense that they wouldn't... since they have the most to lose?
One of these points is not like the others...
 coolnomad
Joined: 5/4/2007
Msg: 370
view profile
History
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/19/2009 1:40:14 PM
Indysarge: for the sake of saying it, i'm going to tell you that the book you're pushing sounds like it's worse than worthless.
 kevinnem2
Joined: 7/2/2009
Msg: 371
Climate disruption, re. The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 8/29/2009 11:35:48 AM

To me, here's my way of looking at it:

Cause and effect:

there's two results for the people who believe Global warming exists :

1) If they are correct, people take steps to prevent it (mostly control man's consumption and excess). Planet is saved.
2) if they turn out to be wrong, you will still have cleaner air, better water and a more robust environment because efforts have been made to curb excesses.

Let's look at people who don't believe, do nothing and refuse to acknowledge man's responsibility to nature:

1) if they are correct that global warming does not exist, we will still have dirty air, less water, and a poorer environment since we're doing nothing but keep the status quo.
2) if they turn out to be wrong, humanity is screwed big time. (there is no do-over) There will be wars for water resources, more sickness, more death. If the world tips into a terrible imbalance, you will lose massive numbers of people to starvation.


the worest piece of logic I have ever ween in my life!

Useing this argument I would like to form an army to defend agenst the evil unicorn spaghetti monster invasion that is coming...... now you may think this is not a real issue however...

there's two results for the people who believe spaghetti monster invasion exists :

1) If they are correct, people take steps to prevent it Planet is saved.
2) if they turn out to be wrong, you will still have a great army to protect from other things, and people that are heatlyier,

......... see quote....
 jubbly
Joined: 3/9/2009
Msg: 372
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 10/20/2009 1:28:39 AM
In the meantime the OP should look at the COLD hard reality of the planets weather. I hear recently that at least 20% of the entire USofA was covered in snow, the greatest October snow the country has known for years. Unsurprisingly central Europe has had similar large snowfalls. This is the third year running where across large parts of our world we have had abnormally cold winters. This summers Artic ice melt stopped short by 1 million kilometeres of its 2007 low. In Antartica this years sea melt was the lowest since records began in 1979 leaving the ice 30% above its 30 year average.

These are COLD hard facts; not political, tree hugging, delusional, masochistic posturing by those that would transport us back into a era of mad mediaeval pasturism.

So now the West is about to swamp and shackle itself with costly unnecessary taxes and technologies that are at best half baked and at worst unworkable. Meanwhile the Chinese Politburo and the Indian Oligarchs sit back rubbing their hands in glee and watch as their respective economies leave the West further behind to stew in its insane self destrutive demise.
 Paul K
Joined: 3/10/2006
Msg: 373
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History
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 10/20/2009 4:50:07 PM
Hey Jubbly

Thanks for being a word of reason in a sea of BS......... What I don't understand is that the very same people who are all for the Kyoto Krap, and what is now going on in Europe vis a vie "global warming", which we are about to get roped into thanks to Howdy Doody at 1600 Pennsylvannia Ave, are the same ones that rail agianst a one world government, the amero, all of the secret societites. Don't they understand that the HIGHWAY to all of their fears being realized is the Kyoto Krap agreement, and all of the rest of the global warming hoaxs.

Every wonder why they are in such a hurry to pass all of these bogus agreements? They have to be, because sooner or later, people will realize the TRUTH, and laugh them out of office. Notice how many "crisis" we have had in the past 8 or so months? Kinda coincides with howdy doody taking office.........

Just one question: How many "crisis' have been solved............. Answer: NONE. How many have gotten worse? Answer: almost all.....................

And everybody is still happy.................. YET, now we have an executive branch that can reach out and tell PRIVATE INDUSTRY who to keep as their officers, how much to pay them............... What is the name of the political construct where the central govt. controls means of production??????


I've got it! Fascism.............

And everybody is still happy. Either that or they are afraid to say different for fear of being called a racist. At the end of four years, howdy doody's term will be comparable to that of the other great nobel peace prize winner........ jimmy carter!!!


Yeah!!!


Paul K
 stargazer1000
Joined: 1/16/2008
Msg: 374
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 10/20/2009 5:14:56 PM
Um, Paul....wha?! Was that diatribe for or against?

Oh jeez. So let's just keep on burning those fossil fuels. Woo hoo! Pump that carbon into our atmosphere with no fear of consequence. Oil is forever! In fact, it reproduces itself magically on its own, just like Titan, even though Titan has nothing to do with Earth.

We don't need to find new, better and longer lasting forms of energy. That's just stupid. If you believe that, well you're just a left-wing, toadie of the big business model that is pulling one over our eyes with the aim of taking more money from us. I don't have to take any responsibility for my energy useage. I'm going to turn on all the lights in my apartment right now! And not those energy-efficient fluorescents, no way. Incandescents for me, baby!

Yup. Certainly makes sense to me. Of course, only if I suspend my common sense.
 Paul K
Joined: 3/10/2006
Msg: 375
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History
The Science of Global Warming
Posted: 10/20/2009 5:38:30 PM
Hi star........

Golly gee, what I wrote was against a very stupid piece of international legislation that puts makes the US subservient to outside powers, and I guess that makes me a "left wing toadie"?

Know what the funny part is? All of the countries that produce the VAST MAJORITY of what you are so deathly afraid of, are EXEMPT.......... The only effect Kyoto will have is to force the US to the level of 3rd world developing nations. But then that shouldn't be surprising. I guess if your neighbor had a cow and you didn't, instead of working hard, and getting one too, you would petition the govt. to have his cow taken away, after all, it just isn't fair............ is it?

Common sense? There is NO common sense to those who push the global warming nonsense on us, as in the past 10 years, temperatures have gone.........DOWN. What about the dire predcitions of how many more Katrina like storms would happen as a result of the "warming trends" Just the OPPOSITE has happened. Yet there are still all of these "experts" that keep telling us that warming is just around the corner. As far as your energy efficient bulbs, if you break one, you are advised to call the haz-mat team, because they contain MERCURY................ Finally a real threat to our health, but it comes with the bulbs that are going to save us. And how are all of these effcient mercury laden bulbs going to be disposed of when they burn out? Don't worry, the TECHNOLOGY and the methods will be figured out by big business. Although, I doubt that you will thank them for that.

Paul K
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