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 faith2565
Joined: 3/25/2006
Msg: 109
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The Hillraisers just won't foldPage 4 of 26    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26)
McCain has become a whiner. Since Obama has been abroad. Instead of McCain talking about 'why we should vote for him'. All I hear him doing now is whining. That is really getting on my nerves.

He maybe could have passed Obama in the polls if he we just talk about the facts. I had to stop watching, because McCain has had a chance to shine and he has been a complainer.

We will see when Obama returns.
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 110
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 8:14:51 AM
Fly writes..

So in other words, you think that people who haven't come to the same conclusion as you are "ignorant", brainless and asleep?

I probably would have used adjectives like...... disgruntled.... yes, but it seems rather ignorant, if you asked me, to side with Mccain, if your political views are more left leaning.
I think many................. or at least a few......... are soooo pissed right now that Hillary didnt' take the nomination, that they'll sabotage whatever small part they have, just to have some glimmer of revenge. THAT seems ignorant.
And I would say those who would follow McCains stance do exude some level of......... Bush-lite fever. You can't help but do so. It's abundantly clear AND .......it's to McCains demise that he cannot separate himself from it.
 flyonthewall!
Joined: 3/31/2008
Msg: 111
The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 9:39:13 AM
I'm voting for McCain because I think Obama would be a sucky President. McCain would not have been my first choice. Hillary was my first choice. But McCain was my second choice. So I'm voting for him.

See how that goes?

In the polls McCain is closing in on Obama, as can be seen here:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html

I think once the conventions are over and the election goes into full swing, McCain will pick up the pace.

See how I did that without indicating at all that your choice was stupid? You should try it.
 Green Sangha
Joined: 3/12/2008
Msg: 112
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 9:57:49 AM
I make no apology and stand by my comment. McCain is not the next best candidate to Clinton. That is an absurd position to take. I won't list all of McCain's deficits, but given the damage Bush has done to the U.S., and given McCain aligning himself with Bush on all major issue, it is idiotic to support him. I could argue the finer points, but I don't have a lot of respect for those who don't have the capacity for reasoned thought. So, McCain's your guy....bully for you. He is dangerous for America, but I don't suppose that plays into it. I find it near impossible to believe any true Hillary supporter would cast a vote for McCain who is the opposite of everything Hillary stood for. It is the height of absurdity, bordering on sociopathic. Those voting for McCain were died in the wool Repugnicans all along.
 StrangerInTheHouse
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 115
The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 1:21:16 PM
I think it just has to do with who a person identifies with and against most strongly. Our political identity has much to do with who we identify as our predators in society.
How one does that has to do with a number of factors, including the economic level one is on, the one their family was on when they were growing up, their education level, ethnicity, location, religion and many other things.
It's apparent by the posts we're seeing that many people identify Obama with a (small)class of black people who are parasites and criminals in our society and fear that if elected, he'll advocate the interests of that class of people.
Conversely, many other people identify McCain with a (again small) class of white people who are parasites and criminals and fear that he'll advocate the interests of that class if elected.

I think the ones who fear McCain have a stronger case...
 Green Sangha
Joined: 3/12/2008
Msg: 116
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 3:20:20 PM
I doubt whites have anything to fear from Obama. He is about as black as Condoleeza Rice when it comes to being willing to stick one's neck out for one's "people". In other words, Obama isn't going to stick his neck out for his "brotha's" if it could taint his political career, IMO. As Jesse Jackson noted, he sometimes speaks down to lower class blacks and has certainly aligned himself with the white, elitist ruling class - which has admitted "some" blacks if they do and say the right thing. While I certainly would hope Obama would promote changes that help those in poverty, there is no reason to think he is going to do much specifically FOR people of color. I hope I'm wrong as I'd love to see a President advocate serious change and social justice. I don't know if Obama dares do so once he is has become the first African American President. That is an awfully big legacy with a lot of expectations attached and I believe he is well aware of this fact.
 oddandy
Joined: 3/5/2008
Msg: 117
The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 3:22:43 PM

Our political identity has much to do with who we identify as our predators in society.


I've never thought of it that way but I think it a wise and enlightening observation.
 eeeo4U
Joined: 6/25/2007
Msg: 118
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 3:39:23 PM
Let's see...

My father was third generation Irish Catholic, my mother second generation Italian Catholic. Neither finished college although both attended. My father was a police officer before and after WWII service in the USMC. I grew up in a neighborhood of small brick houses with garages far out in middle-American white bread suburbia. Early on it was understood that if I was smart enough to go to college there would be a way, scholarships or the GI Bill (student loans were anathema...we didn't have car loans and keeping a mortgage more than 10 years was profligacy). We had enough for food and clothes and utilities and a used Rambler every couple of years. So who do I identify as a predator in society??? Of course I also served 20 years in the Army and was involved in four interventions, was wounded once but not seriously. Who does my demographics say I should vote for?
 StrangerInTheHouse
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 119
The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/25/2008 4:12:51 PM

Who does my demographics say I should vote for?

If you're like most people, you identify not as strongly with whom to vote FOR as much as whom to vote AGAINST.
Rarely do we have alot in common with people who run for president. At least, I don't. How many of us went to school with Dubyah or Clinton, etc, etc???
... and if we did, would we trust them now that they're prime time politicians?
Thus, as many people have observed, we usually vote for "the lesser of two evils" rather than someone we actually trust.
 gentalltheway
Joined: 9/9/2006
Msg: 121
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/26/2008 7:28:46 AM
Don’t you find it amusing to see an idiot on the news saying that he’s a “passionate democrat for 18 years” and “ I never voted for anything but democrat” then turns around and says “I will personally vote for John McCain” followed by “it’s good for the greater picture and good for the long term of the democratic party.” This from the leader himself???

So the message of PUMA is basically vote for McCain because it will be better for Democrats in the long run???

Will Bower (leader of PUMA), actually quit his job in July to oversee PUMA. Either this guy has serious mental problems or he his remunerated through undisclosed funds.

It’s quite obvious that PUMA is a backed GOP group who’s out there to feed the un-informed and the morons all the bullshit they can to create mayhem so some can switch to the republican party. There’s even a woman still questioning Obama’s religion and where he was born! I thought that most would’ve had that right since allllllll the information that was passed on since last winter. WOW!!!

The stupidity of people is astonishing. Mind you, considering that half the country voted a second time for Bush, nothing and I mean NOTHING surprises me anymore.
 designingwoman
Joined: 9/4/2005
Msg: 122
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/26/2008 10:27:52 AM
Vote AGAINST McCain:

Immature: Making light of bombing a country with his stupid "Bomb Bomb Bomb Iran" ditty.

Bad temper. Many examples of this can be found on line. He is too emotionally unstable to be president and handle the stresses of the job effectively.

More of Bush's BS ideas: Wants to make Bush's tax cuts for the rich permanent, which would force us to continue borrowing from China and the Saudis. The stupid borrow and spend thinking MUST GO. Tax appropriately and spend was what Bush Sr and Bill Clinton did, and we need to return to that. Fiscal irresponsibility has been our ruin of late, weakening both the US dollar and the economy.

McCain also would do very poorly as far as representing our nation.

To the veteran who asked who to vote for: McCain wants to take away veterans' benefits and is basically a conservative jerk who doesn't care about veterans, teachers, children, the poor, the elderly, students and anyone else in need.

Obama: A fine representative to the rest of the world, stable, mature, has concern for everyone in this nation and will return to proper fiscal policy which will strengthen our economy.

Vote FOR Obama 2008!!
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 123
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/26/2008 4:47:48 PM

The stupidity of people is astonishing. Mind you, considering that half the country voted a second time for Bush, nothing and I mean NOTHING surprises me anymore.

Ain't that the damn truth. What's more amazing, still, is hearing how many would vote McLame into office, simply because he's A) a white boy, B) he's a Republican, C) cuz he aint' that black guy D) cuz Hillary lost the nomination. I mean, really. How much more insane can people get? This economy is near collapse, largely due to our present administrations failings on so many different tangents, and yet, some here are still planning on voting for him. I wonder, of those voting McLame, how many are in foreclosure on their homes, lost jobs or been handed pink slips because their employer has run out of work, or are having a difficult time putting food on their tables. That's the insidious nature of the rightwing coalition, that people will fight incessantly for their captains long after the boat has already gone underwater. How devoted.

I just have to laugh my A$S off at the stupidy of them, all the while pointing the finger at their leaders for disregarding their needs. Deomcrats had no part in that demise they are suffering, as I'm quite sure, there's a plenty in here.
 designingwoman
Joined: 9/4/2005
Msg: 124
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/27/2008 8:09:09 PM
Hillary is not going to be the next president, Suthn Boy. Nope. But she will no doubt play a role in the future, perhaps continuing as a senator or even becoming the governor of NY. Although NY currently has a good governor, and he will be reelected, so she might have a long wait. She might serve in Obama's cabinet, or perhaps even as a Supreme Court justice as mentioned by one poster. She would be more liberal than those slimebucket justices, Scalia and Thomas. Personally I would like to see both Scalia and Thomas thrown out of the Court on their ears for their ridiculous decisions, such as "selecting" Bush for the presidency.
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 125
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/27/2008 8:20:34 PM

Personally I would like to see both Scalia and Thomas thrown out of the Court on their ears for their ridiculous decisions, such as "selecting" Bush for the presidency.

I second that, Design.

PAybacks are he!l, aren't they. Looks like we have about 8 yrs of payback for the slime buckets.
 faith2565
Joined: 3/25/2006
Msg: 126
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/27/2008 9:55:17 PM
Hillary camp maybe you should vote for McCain. They both have one thing in common. They are too focused on Obama instead of discussing the issues. They are handing the election to him.
 Green Sangha
Joined: 3/12/2008
Msg: 127
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/27/2008 10:00:20 PM
Faith, I don't know why you would say that. The people I know want Obama to clarify his positions. Most of us who said we were too angry to support him are reevaluating as time goes by. Certainly everyone I know sees a clear distinction between Obama and McCain.
 faith2565
Joined: 3/25/2006
Msg: 128
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/29/2008 6:10:22 PM
Yes Dance,

While Obama was on his trip abroad, McCain had time to really campaign and discuss his issues. But, instead we heard complaining about Obama. I got so tired of that I stopped listening at a certain point. Hillary did the same thing.

When you were a kid they taught you, while in a race do not look at the other kid running. Just look ahead and run. They are too focused on Obama instead on just running the race.

Obama landed on American soil and his numbers went right back up.

Gallop Poll today July 29, 2008

Obama 47%/ McCain 41%

For McCain to be an experienced politician (like Hillary) why didn't he think about the long term. Maybe that is the problem. They have been around so long they feel negative campaigning is the way to go.
 flyonthewall!
Joined: 3/31/2008
Msg: 129
The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/29/2008 6:30:44 PM
Uh . . . no. Two days ago Obama was up 8 points in the Gallup Poll, and in RCP he was up 5 points.

In RCP (which averages Gallup, Rasmussen, USA Today Gallup, Democracy Corps, FOX News, and NBC/WSJ) he's down to a 2.5 percent lead.

So the trend, at least right now, is not upwards for Obama.

v v v v LOL, pretty much.
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 130
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/29/2008 10:58:37 PM
I"m with Faith, Too. I think the heel-snipping of MCPain and (once) Hillary are true representations of where they are.......... ............ behind.
 Ahoytheredave
Joined: 8/29/2006
Msg: 131
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 7/31/2008 8:39:59 PM
Hillary supporters were more about issues as Hillary never had charisma. Obama supporters are all about race and image. "Does he look like Kennedy?" Obama has no accomplishments of even the slightest importance and his positions are very hard to pin down. Hillary supporters are issue driven and Obama has proven he cannot be trusted. He abandoned his minister of two decades when he was a political embarrassment and later abandoned his church when it also became an embarrassment. These two entities had a lot to do with his political success and he turned on them. Hillary supporters know they are likely to be abandoned on the political whim of pole numbers.
 ManeRider
Joined: 5/22/2005
Msg: 133
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/1/2008 7:09:53 PM
^^^^^^^^

Ra Ra Nomadic

McCains got issues alright. Dementia, memory loss, basic mental instability....
technological dope..... But he's got a trigger finger..........a real wooo hoooo cowboy.
 faith2565
Joined: 3/25/2006
Msg: 134
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/1/2008 7:14:32 PM
The Hillary supporters are just acting like little kids that do not desire you to use their ball after they lose the game. It is not about issues, but tantrums.
 designingwoman
Joined: 9/4/2005
Msg: 135
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The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/1/2008 9:03:16 PM
McCain's trigger finger, emotional instability, possibility of age related memory loss, and immaturity despite advanced age scare me silly. I hope and pray for the safety of our nation and the world that McCain does not win the Presidency.
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