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 HalftimeDad
Joined: 5/29/2005
Msg: 41
So Much For The SurgePage 4 of 5    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5)

Are yall trying to say that al qaeda is the only terrorist group in the middle east? Come on now. Surly they don't keep yall in the dark up there.


No. But they are all religiously motivated.

Iraq was the only secular regime there - anethema to the terrorist groups. And there is far more violence and death in Bush's Iraq than there was in Saddam's.
 HalftimeDad
Joined: 5/29/2005
Msg: 42
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 2:53:08 PM
Hang on. You just said that there's less violence in Iraq now. I called you on it, and now you're spinning.

And name one terrorist group in that region that doesn't use religion as its ideological foundation.

Saddam was evil, no question. But he was in the single A league of evil compared to Hall of Famer George W Bush.
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 44
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 3:44:29 PM
Saddam was evil, no question. But he was in the single A league of evil compared to Hall of Famer George W Bush.

Whenever I see or hear such a statement as the above, I know that person has surrendered the debate.

SD
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 46
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 3:48:10 PM
Building democracy takes time. I am sure, more than a four or five years. We weren't all that well organized after the Revolutionary War or the Civil war, either. Not even five years after it....let alone DURING.

Hence, the reason we have not left Iraq, yet.
 exodusi1
Joined: 8/19/2006
Msg: 49
view profile
History
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 4:00:31 PM
Democracies aren't built from the outside, they come from having a strong middle class. No amount of occupation is going to create what they don't desire. They are comfortable with a theocracy. . .
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 66
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 10:17:58 PM
Are people still trying to sell the bullsh.. that we went to Iraq to steal their oil???? Good God man. I heard that in the early 90s, when we went there the first time. It didn't happen then, and it didn't happen this time.

I want what he is drinking.
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 68
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 10:26:51 PM
WMD's? Why would we find any there??? After we gave him 12 years to hide them??? Come on!

I see no problem with having Iraq repay us for the freedom we gave them. You can call it blood for oil. Frankly, I expect that of you. It is a predictable, if not simple viewpoint.

I happen to think we should have gone there long before we did. Too bad Clinton didn't have the stones. Or, he had them....they were just preoccupied.
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 71
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 10:32:57 PM
I'm on the right side of the war issue and the right side of history.
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 74
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 10:51:36 PM
Is this where we get the lecture about how we should negotiate with terrorists? How about when a rapist breaks into the house in the middle of the night, too? Should we "try to come to an understanding"?
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 76
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 11:01:38 PM
Erik, it is clear you can spout a long list of Americas errors on demand. I have noticed I have never seen you say one good thing about it. We get it. You hate this country. Grand.

Not surprising.

SD
 flyguy51
Joined: 8/11/2005
Msg: 81
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 11:25:35 PM

Is this where we get the lecture about how we should negotiate with terrorists?

Yes. That, or claim publically we won't ever negotiate with terrorists, while on the DL we sell arms (illegally) to terrorists in exchange for hostages and money and then use that to fund the pet freedom fighters of the day (illegally).

We get it. You hate this country. Grand.

What "we" get is that sometimes posters resort to petty sarcasm and empty accusations when they have no counterpoint to offer.
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 82
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 11:27:59 PM
What "we" get is that sometimes posters resort to petty sarcasm and empty accusations when they have no counterpoint to offer.

Fly.......you mean like when you ask "Do you even know how babies are made?" And, yet, you have none, while asking a man who has five of them? Like that ya mean?
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 84
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 11:44:28 PM
No, dear. I am not one who ever attributed responsibility of pregnancy to women, alone. Don't get it twisted. I am not a man who takes fatherhood lightly. You have no idea about what I did to make sure my own kids are safe and healthy and thriving.

You are making a very erroneous assumption of a man who is, in fact, raising his kids alone. And, although I don't see it as any great sacrifice, I will tell you that in California, it is no small task for any man. So, you will forgive me if I find his statement to be hallow, especially coming from a man who has no kids at all.

Let's get back to the thread, though.
 flyguy51
Joined: 8/11/2005
Msg: 85
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 11:51:29 PM

Let's get back to the thread, though.

Good idea. Who brought up the subject of how babies are made, anyway?
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 86
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/11/2008 11:54:23 PM
LOL. Can't help yourself, can you? You can email me if you want to carry on. I just don't want any of us in trouble for hijacking a thread. You can go back and read the posts.

Party on.
 Strongdad
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 89
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/12/2008 1:20:06 AM
Ah. It's Israel's fault. Gee. Why didn't you just say so??
 teeajay
Joined: 1/29/2008
Msg: 93
So Much For The Surge
Posted: 8/12/2008 7:22:17 PM

IMO, the Arabs / Persians / Radical-Muslims don't hate us because of our interference in the Middle East nor because of our support of Israel, ultimately they hate us because we have what they crave: POWER - Power to subjucate nations and the Power to influence the world. You don't think They want that? You don't think They hate us because we have it and They don't? The only time in our history when we weren't hated by Europe and the Middle East is when we weren't a superpower.


You couldn't be more wrong.

It's never been about power to subjugate or to influence the world. The beef the typical Arab man on the street has with the US is predominantly because of this country's unconditional support of Israel.

As for radical Muslims, they hate the US because this nation's greatest strength is also the basis of its greatest weakness...to wit FREEDOM. I am not talking about political freedom necessarily, but rather this nation's citizenry's freedom to be morally bankrupt if they wish. Adultery and yes, even homosexuality, and a few dozen other "evils" as perceived by the radical Muslim are not only accepted in American society, they fluorish. A person can blaspheme in this country with brutal satire and parody and claim it is his/her right to do so under the First Amendment. Scatological humor as depicted on dozens of tv programs (e.g., South Park) is a billion dollar industry. And let's not forget all the SEX....It's everywhere in this country.... from your average soap opera to Girls Gone Wild commercials late night.

The point is in the eyes of a radical Muslim, America typifies a decadent society, one that is truly evil.

And that is the primary reason they hate the US.

It's important to emphasize that not all Muslims are intolerant of American society. It's mainly the radical elements in Islam who are vehemently more conservative than any right-wing organization in this country.
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