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 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 248
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.Page 7 of 13    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13)

The guys have convinced me that not only is asking guys out but paying is cool. I am in fact going to try it out this week. I will ask 5 guys out and see who accepts. I cant wait to see if these guy are looking for more than a cheap thrill and BOY do I mean cheap.


LOL; If you weren't 1000 miles away, I'd be jumping up and down waving my hands to be noticed...


I have gone out with guys I find unattractive Riptide. See the difference between men and women. You really think women are men with out penises? IF women held out only for the guys we find attractive we would never date.


Maybe that shows that women are generally pickier than men as to what they consider attractive? I don't really see it as an on / off switch, but more of a dimmer.

I have dated women that I was not initially attracted to, and in a few cases I discovered that they became more attractive as I got to know them.
 abelian
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 249
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 9:23:57 AM
After 11 pages of cluelessness (for the most part), I've come to the conclusion that there are an awful lot of people with IQs in the double digit range whose etiquette is either non-existent or what might be called anti-etiquette, in that whatever would be considered manners that the average 15 year old should possess, they do exactly the opposite. Look, this is not that difficult unless you're an idiot who thinks ``Deliverance'' was a documentary about upper crust snobs with overly refined social skills.

Here's what I think men and women would do if they were raised by people with even a little savoir faire in social graces.

First, regardless of gender or who asks whom, carry enough cash) with you to cover you, your date and any reasonable unforseen problems. (Don't count on using plastic unless you like looking stuipd when it can't be processed for some reason, even if you have an American Excess Black card.) That way you won't ever find yourself embarrassed because your date was fvck up and you won't end up stranded somewhere for some unforseen reason. A couple of hundred dollars ought to do it unless you're going to a high dollar restaurant or doing something really expensive. Now, you aren't dependent on your date for anything. (This ought to be second nature to those independent women out there. If it isn't, your claim of being independent is a sham. Independence means being able to take care of yourself in any situation if necessary, not being contrary and argumentative when a guy does something nice for you.)

(1) If you're a guy, just assume that you're paying for the date and your date will order expensive drinks, appetizers, the most expensive thing on the menu and dessert. Although that's unlikely, see the paragraph above about being prepared. Don't go anywhere you might have to bring up the subject of money. There are few things more tacky than telling your date you can't afford dessert or whatever. At some point, your date should offer to split the check with you (unless she was raised in cave.) I always declined and made sure my date never saw the tab or how much money I was giving the waiter (or whatever.)

You may wish to accept the offer, but if you do, don't be a cheapskate and sit there figuring things out to the penny. Do like most normal guys do when they go out. Give her a round estimate, accept what she kicks in and handle all of the other details, like the tip. (You're a guy, remember? Women like it when you look like you know what you're doing, take charge and get things done.) Treat the waitstaff well and don't be cheap with a tip. Even though women aren't known for tipping well, they do judge guys based on how the guy treats the waitstaff, valet, whatever. If, after paying the bill, you realize your date didn't give you enough to cover her half of the tip, don't mention it unless you like watching your date roll her eyes.)

Just assume that you, as a guy, will pick up the check. If paying for 1 date with an entitlement princess is going to break the bank, you need to do something less expensive or you can't afford to date. If you go on a second date with a woman like that, it's your problem. Stop thinking that you're going to get laid by paying for everything. If you want to spend money to get laid, find an escort. Then you won't become bitter or jaded and since you won't be thinking with your d!ck, you won't be tempted to keep paying for dates with the misguided idea that she'll be grateful enough to give you a pity fvck. It's a lot easier to see women for who they are if you know you could get laid 5 minutes after your date if necessary.

(2) If you're a woman, assume you're going to pay for the date (see first paragraph) and when it comes time to pay for something, offer to cover your share. If your date declines the offer, accept his hospitality graciously unless you want your date to wonder if you're Valerie Solanas' sister when you get pissed off at him due to some weird notion that he's a male pig for buying you dinner. Don't act like you haven't eaten in a month.

Even if your date declines your offer to split the tab, you might still offer to take care of the tip. (If you do, be generous so your date doesn't feel like he has to figure out a way to sneak the waiter a few bucks to make up for your ignorance, while not embarrassing you). If he declines, accept his hospitality and don't forget to say ``Thank you.'' Your date will judge you on your ability to act civilized, so if you can't at least handle yourself with grace when you're on a date, your date is going to think, ``Well, I wouldn't mind boinking her, but I certainly can't let her loose among people I know.'' If you don't make some token gesture to take care of your share of the date, don't be surprised if the doesn't want a second date because he read your behaviour as ``entitlement princess.'' Whether or not you pay is not the issue. The issue is whether or not you have the manners (and means) to make the offer.

(3) Finally, don't discuss who's going to pay. That's tacky and going ``dutch'' is even tackier. Handle the tab as the opportunity arises on the date. Notice that I didn't say tabs. There's a special place in hell for people who ask for separate checks. (I know... groups of women like to do this, but then again, they always get waited on by the waiter who draws the short straw, who then puts them at the bottom of the priority list for service.) If you ask separate checks, you might as well tell the waiter you can't afford a decent tip. Only ask for separate checks if you want to impress your date with your skill in picking restaurants that have terrible service.

I really have a difficult time believing so many people lack the common sense required to do all of the above by instinct. If this is a major issue for a lot of people, then a lot of people have bad pickers, at the very least.

People with good manners make an attempt to get the check first and pay it. People with bad manners try to figure out how to get someone else to pick up the tab.
 bethesdafoodie
Joined: 1/2/2012
Msg: 250
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 9:39:46 AM

If you ask separate checks, you might as well tell the waiter you can't afford a decent tip. Only ask for separate checks if you want to impress your date with your skill in picking restaurants that have terrible service.


Umm, in a large group I agree that splitting checks can be a nightmare, but I've worked in the restaurant business and I can tell you that there is no correlation between splitting checks and bad tips, hell I've split checks when I go out to eat and make sure the waiter is taken care of.

I'm more inclined to tip the host stand which often is the least well paid part of a restaurant operation, especially if they take care of any requests I make( nice corner booth, flowers on the table, etc) than worry about whether the check is split or not.

Call me modern, call me crass, call me tacky; but be sure to call the women that date for the free meals a few choice words while you're at it.

I'm actually almost more inclined after this thread to go dutch on the first date just to see how she handles it, it could be a great method to weed out the ones that want a free meal.

I always go into a meal with enough cash to cover the bill, and I don't mind paying as long as it's a genuine date and they're not just there for the free food.

Just sayin...
 Darkbutcomely
Joined: 4/20/2011
Msg: 251
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 10:02:50 AM
Sorry Abelian I need to know a head of time if we are going dutch. MY last date took me to a place I couldnt have afforded the tip for the parking let alone the meal. AND no I didnt pick the place nor did I purchase the most expensive item on the menu. He wanted a bottle of wine and I dont drink wine. IF we are going dutch. COOL then we arent going to a place like that we are going to a place I can afford as I am on a budget. YES ask for separate checks why not too embrassed to let the waiter KNOW you arent paying for your date. BE bold so what if the waiter thinks you are cheapskate all that matters is what your date thinks.
 SC67
Joined: 6/21/2009
Msg: 253
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 10:12:46 AM
I think.separate checks are fine. I asked for separate last week 'cause I think mine was more expensive than his...maybe not...he did have 3 drinks. I certainly didn't want him paying for more than his share.

loll...where did you come up.with the idea women don't tip well? 20% if normal service & more if exceptional. Should I be leaving more?

I agree with a lot of the women on here. There aren't loads of guys I'd ask out. I'm gonna take the challenge though.
 abelian
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 254
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 10:34:24 AM
Sorry Abelian I need to know a head of time if we are going dutch. MY last date took me to a place I couldnt have afforded the tip for the parking let alone the meal. AND no I didnt pick the place nor did I purchase the most expensive item on the menu.

Then you should have discussed going someplace you could afford. I had the same issue come up on a number of dates. If a woman though the place was too pricey, I made sure it was clear that I was paying the tab and I at least knew she was concerned about how much I was spending. (I don't care if a woman picks the most expensive thing on the menu, by the way. I want her to order what she wants. I just don't want to act like she hasn't eaten in a week.)

IF we are going dutch. COOL then we arent going to a place like that we are going to a place I can afford as I am on a budget.

Whether or not you're going dutch, you ought to be conscious of whether or not it's a place you could afford if you were picking up the tab, unless you have been told explicitly beforehand to not worry about it.

YES ask for separate checks

NO. Asking for separate checks is tacky. If you're going to split the check, pay one check and divide among yourselves.

BE bold

My idea of being bold is to take charge the date so that my date doesn't have to concern herself with anything but being good company.

if the waiter thinks you are cheapskate all that matters is what your date thinks.

I've never gone on a date and had separate checks, so from my standpoint, that's a moot question. I was suggesting that people not ask for separate checks because (1) your date will think something about it; and (2) if you're a pain in the ass, you'll get subpar service, which will not impress your date. She may not be annoyed with her date, but if she's annoyed, the date is not going to be as good as it could have been regardless of why or at whom she is annoyed.

It would help a great deal if you learned to punctuate sentences properly and capitalize according to the rules of standard English.

where did you come up.with the idea women don't tip well? 20% if normal service

I've waited tables in about a half dozen restaurants as well as dated women who waitressed. Everyone I know who has ever waited tables has agreed, without hesitation, that a group of women almost always: (1) want separate checks; and (2) tip poorly. It's really funny to stand there with the other waiters and waitresses all saying, ``Shit! I hope they don't sit in my section.''

I never said wome who come in alone or perhaps with a friend were bad tippers. (One of the best tips I ever got was from a woman who grabbed my ass and told me she'd give $10.00 tip on a drink if I got it for her in a hurry, so it's not women, per se. It's groups of women, followed closely by people who ask for searate checks. When a table wanted separate checks, there might be one person who leaves a decent tip, but one person doesn't offset the rest.) In any case, I thik asking for separate checks is just tacky. If you want to split the tab, pay one check and divide it among yourselves later. You can tell how cheap you are by whether or not you need the check to divide it up just in case your food was $12.00 and not $12.50.

I always go into a meal with enough cash to cover the bill, and I don't mind paying as long as it's a genuine date and they're not just there for the free food.

On a first date, you can't know that for sure. (However, if you talk to a woman enough before meeting her, you ought to have some idea of what she's all about.) It's like gambling. You put your money down before you roll the dice. What you get from a first date is an idea of whether or not your date is the type of woman you wany to see again. If you keep seeing her without bothering to make some sort of judgment about her manners and ettiquete, it's your fault. If a woman can't empathize with you when it comes to the money you're spending (or anything else), don't see her again.

I might be a little more sympathetic if I had ever had a date who just wanted a free dinner, but I either got lucky or I got to know a woman well enough to have good intuition about her before we went out, because the women I met did offer to cover their share of the date and they did take into consideration the cost of the date.

Not "cluelessness", just a misplaced trust that the other will do the correct, polite and appropriate thing.

That's a distinction without a difference. I don't trust people to do the correct, polite and appropriate thing. I take a chance and cut my losses when I feel like someone doesn't do the correct, polite and appropriate thing. I don't have to trust someone if I'm willing to take a little risk on the assumption that it may very well not pay off. Blind trust is quite another matter. Getting anything requires a willingness to take a chance and knowing when to cut your losses. I've found that being geneous up front has reaped a lot of rewards that I would otherwise not have gotten had I insisted everything take place on a quid pro quo basis.
 Archangel_07
Joined: 6/21/2010
Msg: 255
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 2:43:11 PM
BrookfieldGentleman,
You better have this date's back when she doesn't have enough money to spend on them dates, when the situation comes. The same way she covered for you, you should do the same for her.
 SC67
Joined: 6/21/2009
Msg: 256
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 3:44:14 PM
the 22 yo took me to her camp for the weekend, she drove and provided the food. she has paid for my meal at Geneva on the Lake (Lake Erie) and twice now has brought a delicious meal to my home for us to nosh on. last night it was chicken teriyaki stirfry.
i've actually spent very little money on her. i am the voice of experience.

I don't think I've looked at your profile to see how old you are, but why aren't you at least going Dutch with a young woman who is either working a pretty low-paying job or paying off some college loans/expense? (possibly both if she's out of college & just starting her career) You should be in a much better position financially than she is so it's odd to me that she's paying. (not sure about the "her camp" thing either. I don't think I have "a camp.")

Please share your secret with the rest of the men on here 'cause they can't seem to get a grown woman to go Dutch without extreme anxiety, much less get a 22 year old to foot the entire bill.

p.s. Doesn't count if it's your granddaughter. (sorry...couldn't resist)

*edit to add* Checked out your profile & I'm gonna throw a flag on the play.
 OyVay...
Joined: 7/15/2011
Msg: 257
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 3:49:17 PM
She was a CIT and still had the keys to the main building!
 largo2
Joined: 12/13/2011
Msg: 258
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 4:54:51 PM

but why aren't you at least going Dutch with a young woman who is either working a pretty low-paying job or paying off some college loans/expense? [/quote}

She's an heiress? (I mean, why not as long as we are fantasizing)
 DivineBovine
Joined: 5/13/2005
Msg: 259
view profile
History
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 6:50:53 PM

We can look at a profile pic and tell the outcome.


really??? so all you care about is how she looks???

what if the pics are about a decade old? i had that happen to me with someone last summer.

but even worse, the man talked AT me for 2 hours straight; he was way more interested in himself than anyone else.

i found THAT to be way more unattractive than the deceptive photos.

if you can tell the outcome from a picture, more power to you. i suggest you bottle it and sell it.
 DivineBovine
Joined: 5/13/2005
Msg: 260
view profile
History
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 7:22:04 PM
^^^i'm asking how you can tell from a photo that someone is attractive when we hear SO many stories about how the person in the photo looked nothing like the person that showed up???

you cannot tell that the actual person is attractive, only the image that is presented to you..
 barbiebabeRN
Joined: 7/31/2011
Msg: 261
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 7:36:21 PM
Last date I went on I picked up the check! Gee, not all women are out to stick it to the guys out there. I prefer to buy my own meals. Once met a guy who wanted to meet for an appetizer and ice tea. My mind is programmed for real food after an appetizer, I sat there the whole time, his cell going off and him talking about past relationships and all I could think about was ordering a to go meal and making my escape.
 largo2
Joined: 12/13/2011
Msg: 262
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 8:08:15 PM
Oh Riptide!! Now you want the lobster, I see how this is!!
 Archangel_07
Joined: 6/21/2010
Msg: 263
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 9:44:21 PM
I just got back from my date and we went dutch the whole entire time. No names called like cheapskate, or stingy ass punk, or any of the sort. We both were upfront about going dutch and did exactly that, went dutch. Whatever she ordered she paid for and whatever I ordered I paid for. Had a good time with the date on the date. End of story.
 SpittyKitty
Joined: 5/2/2011
Msg: 264
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 10:24:53 PM
I will always say, "Please allow me to contibute towards the bill".
They will usually refuse. At which point I will say, "Thank you, may I at least pay the tip?'. If they refuse again I say, "Well thank you again! How nice!".

If they accept, I pay. No problem.
Graciousness and class is my motto.
 Darkbutcomely
Joined: 4/20/2011
Msg: 265
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/2/2012 11:35:08 PM
I am with the guys really I am. I will take guys out. Does it matter if the meal is really cheap? I mean guys will you be insulted if all I can afford is 25 for the both of us including drinks? Tell me how to be just like men. But how will I know the guy is really in to me? How will I know this guy likes me?

Because let's be real a guy will eat the free meal then turn around and have sex with a woman he has no intentions of ever calling again.
 Fifi47
Joined: 8/19/2004
Msg: 266
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/3/2012 3:47:15 AM
Many of us do offer to pay but we are told that we are not sincere? We cannot win for losing. I have met men who told me that he would pay if he had found me to be hot looking, my response to him was I would pay if he had been honest when I said going dutch sounded good to me and he said he asked so he would pay. One of two times I have walked out without blinking an eye.
 runningout
Joined: 8/19/2008
Msg: 267
view profile
History
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/3/2012 5:15:19 AM
Athough if there is another date Arch and she says "My treat", you do realize if you accept, she will be expecting you to put out?
 runningout
Joined: 8/19/2008
Msg: 268
view profile
History
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/3/2012 7:03:20 AM
Not entirely true Dark...it does still take two active participants to have sex. If you are worried about a guy being really into you and not after you for sex, then dont put yourself in a position to have sex.

I have never been "used for sex" but I also end a first date at the car or on the doorstep.
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 269
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/3/2012 7:04:03 AM
Because let's be real a guy will eat the free meal then turn around and have sex with a woman he has no intentions of ever calling again.


Some will, some won't. Please don't lump us all together.

It is a woman's responsibility to figure out what the man's motives are, just as it is a man's responsibility to figure out what the woman's motives are. There are no easy shortcuts, you have to look for clues in their behavior.

Assuming that everyone is alike often means assuming the worst, which is a very negative outlook to have.
 anyelina24
Joined: 10/29/2011
Msg: 270
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/3/2012 7:12:40 AM
Funny post cant stop laughing ! . I for one dont like my dates to pay for me , but thats just me . I think you shouldnt encourage those women you choose to take on dates to order the most expensive apps or drinks . Just tell them upfront is a dutch thing .
 Archangel_07
Joined: 6/21/2010
Msg: 271
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/3/2012 12:29:05 PM
lol runningout :-p
gotta review what she says before I accept Lol.

This whole spending money on dates thing and then getting resentful about it is just so overrated. It's really sad. Just communicate and upfront with what you want to do and tell the person exactly that. If you're not happy about spending money on a date, then don't go and save your money or do something free together.

Face it we spend money on things everyday and yet we don't get as pissed off about doing it. It's part of making a living. You buy a house, you pay the mortgage along with the expenses of the house. You buy a cell phone, get a phone plan, use the phone plan, pay the monthly bill. Everything adds up. If you can't afford it, don't buy it.
 koolfuture
Joined: 8/30/2008
Msg: 272
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/4/2012 6:54:08 AM
just read it..so funny .
 Darkbutcomely
Joined: 4/20/2011
Msg: 273
Mens Dating Expenses/Dating Experiences.
Posted: 3/4/2012 7:26:32 AM

Assuming that everyone is alike often means assuming the worst, which is a very negative outlook to have.


Have you read of the posting men have put in the forum??? They are upset because they are spending money and not getting the physically return for the their investment. So if I spend the money will I get the relationship return for my investment?
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