Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Politics  >      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 shlomi27
Joined: 8/31/2008
Msg: 82
How do we defeat Terrorism?Page 4 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
How about we consider this piece of terrorism against my Jewish brethren in Israel- The white paper instituted by the British to prevent Jewish immigration from nazi occupied Europe...this white paper of terrorism on behalf of the British led to over 1 million Jews perishing in death camps with the implications of this action widely known.....that is undoubtedly genocidal terror, not one of your *hard to find* singular cases of legitimate resistance against British oppression towards Jewry by the irgun gang
 StrangerInTheHouse
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 86
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/11/2008 10:55:41 PM
My point is that terrorism will never be defeated. When you push people far enough back into a corner that they don't fear death compared to the life that they're offered under your government, they're going to do it.
This is the case with the middle east, who don't want to be ruled by western oil interests.
I think the term "terrorists" is pure bull crap because most of you, if you were in the same position as the people who did this, would do anything you could to strike back at foreign invaders and be proud of it.
 EarlzP
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 88
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/11/2008 11:24:56 PM
I thought the topic of this thread was how do you defeat terrorism? First you have to understand it, this is not the Alamo and the terrorist are not Davy Crockett and Daniel Boone they are not going to stand their ground against a far superior force, if and when the sh-t hit’s the fan they are going to disappear and reappear some where else, The surge worked? More BS or just total ignorance about how they fight, We sent in more troops what were they supposed to do hang around and get their butts kicked , no one told them so they packed and moved back to Afghanistan and Pakistan and if we chase them their they will move again , they fight when they are ready and have the biggest advantage

If nothing else we should have learned that from Viet Nam, The NVR did not beat us because they had the better military or weaponry they beat us because our leaders did not know how to fight them and we are faced with the same problem now, do we ever learn or are we going to forever repeat the same mistakes. Come on vets of Nam wake up and tell it like it is you were there you know what we were up against, whether that war was right or wrong we should have learned some thing from it

Bush is an idiot his staff are idiots and so once more we find ourselves facing in underwhelming enemy that we have been battling for seven years and even it ends tomorrow Bin Laden accomplished his goal, our economy is in shambles we are borrowing money from the Chinese a country that we should not even be trading with to wage a war, Bush raises his hand and proclaims mission accomplished and Bin Laden laughs hysterically in agreement, he had no use for Saddam and Bush defeats the Iraqi army for him and commits American troops and money, Bin Laden started to believe in Santa Claus he just called him Bush

Back to the topic how do you defeat terrorism? You have to remove the teeth of the terrorist cut their heads off no not with a machete by finding out who it is that it is that feeds them, follow the money and cut the supply of it off, Bin Laden? let him eat sand the only power he has is the power that Bush gave him.

Where does the majority of the money come from that fuels the middle east what do they have of value, if we take that away from them how do they finance their armies, where do the terrorist get their money from. Take away the worlds dependence on fossil fuels and all they can sell us is play box sand. If you want to stop the terrorist take away their power and their source of income, if we are not dependant on oil the only thing they can throw at us is SAND

We are not safer today then what we were 7 years ago on 9/11 in fact we are more vulnerable on more fronts, if I am wrong tell me what is stopping them from launching another attack? I will tell you why they are not, they accomplished and are still accomplishing their mission at a rate of 10 billion dollars a month that’s the amount being drained from our economy each and every month and each and every month more people are being killed and maimed in a war that has no end . And why? the same type of leadership that ran the Viet Nam war is in charge of the War on Terrorism,

Their are no short cuts we must divert our resources to cutting off their supplies, crippling their economy and that means becoming energy independent. increase our defenses here at home, fire power and troops will not win this war, advances in energy technology will, bring the troops home use them to secure our borders and our ports, invest the money being used to fight the terrorist in R&D we are no longer in the stone age we can not win this war with might we must use our intelligence and technology to win.
 cncgandolf
Joined: 7/29/2007
Msg: 89
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/11/2008 11:35:56 PM
"Actually I believe the idea of using jet aircraft as missiles against New York City with suicide pilots was originally"

It was an easy, logical progression that was about as obvious a progression as they get. No shock that it happened, just a matter of when.

1. The first skyjacked plane many decades ago should have been a lesson to separate the****it from the cabin much the same as an 18wheeler does. Today they treat me like less than cargo, but they have not done the one thing to actually eliminate the hijack motive ... Care to think how many planes have been built since the first skyjack that could have been built with a separate****it?

2. WTC had already been bombed ... we knew they were going to try again.

3. hijacking mass transit in the form of buses and using them for suicide bombing was frequent enough in the Middle East to think of it as common practice.

So, the plan was to skyjack mass transit vehicals and plow them into buildings and blow it up. Only difference was a flying vehical, which they had already hijacked before, just hadn't blown up yet.

Logical progression. Totally illogical solutions to it. My CA ancestors wrote the constitution of my State. I really object to the way I get treated in airports. It doesn't make me one iota safer and it does make me concerned that such incompetence is just making me less safe.

A. Separate the****it --- eliminates building bashing
B. Rig the cabin with an automatic sleeping agent. Sure, a couple might die, but the whole plane won't. -- minimizes mid-air explosions

Security gates are an insult to my intelligence. McGiver could get tools through them or buy tools in the shops the other side.
 EarlzP
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 98
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 7:32:15 AM
And what have we done to prevent any of this, what in your opinion is preventing them from repeating any of the terroristic events you describe below? There is more then one way to skin a cat and so far the only thing we have accomplished is weakening our own economy and our ability to defend our country and our people.

Because educated people under stand terrorism and how to deal with it does not make them diplomacy nuts and pacifists it just means that they have done a reality check and know that our actions fuel their cause,


the towers fell down, the pentagon was hit, flight 93, the cole, the bomb in the basement of the towers, our soldiers in lebanon, death threats to the pope and our presidents, the nightclub in germany, the suicide bombers both men, women and children, etc.
 Montreal_Guy
Joined: 3/8/2004
Msg: 99
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 7:37:31 AM
cncgandolf,

You left out one very critical fact, in your well thought out list of the background that led the world to 9/11.


I don’t think that anybody could have predicted that these people would take an airplane and slam it into the World Trade Center, take another one and slam it into the Pentagon, that they would try to use an airplane as a missile ... even in retrospect there was nothing to suggest that.

- Condi Rice
National Security Advisor
(at the time she made that statement)


Actually, they was a predictive means of concluding EXACTLY that if you were in the intelligence services, and anyone who read a paper or watched TV was aware of why.


What if somebody blows up a 747 over the (Atlanta) Olympic stadium, or even flies one into the stadium?

The Secret Service and Customs had teamed up in Atlanta to provide some rudimentary air defense against an aircraft flying into the Olympic Stadium. They did so again during the subsequent National Security Special Events and they agreed to create a permanent air defense unit to protect Washington.

- Richard Clarke
White House Counterterrorism Czar


In 1994 two events occurred that removed any doubts.

A small private plane flown by a mentally ill man was crashed onto the White House grounds, and Algerian terrorists hijacked an Air France and were planning on crashing it into the Eiffel Tower - and they were thwarted only by the fact that they could not fly the planes and had to rely on the air crew to do it - and that "flaw" in their tactical plan is the only thing that stopped the Eiffel Tower from being destroyed that day .

Security forces stormed the plane on the ground, and killed them.

Tom Clancy's " Debt Of Honour (1994) " ended with a lone pilot crashing his 747 into U.S. Capitol building.

When elements of the US law enforcement agencies brought forward the initial confirmed information about suspected individuals taking flight courses under very suspicious circumstances, it should have registered as a major indication warranting two things :

1) A security lock down on all flights totally restricting access to the crew area, from just before take off to just after landing.

2) A full court press into investigating why these men were taking those courses in the first place. This could have been done in a covert way, while they were being tracked.

One of the ways one fights terrorism is to look at events as they occur, and predict future potential threats from them.

There's something going on right now in Asia, which I won't go into here for obvious reasons, that should hopefully be triggering that type of concern right now in security and intelligence circles worldwide.

It has zero to do with terrorism, directly.

That's all I'll say, and I'm hopeful that those protecting us are looking at it's implications.
 eeeo4U
Joined: 6/25/2007
Msg: 101
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 8:09:52 AM
Nero, while I don't often agree with you I find your posts well-reasoned and thoughtful...and this is a good example. Reagan may have been given a lot of the credit but the collapse of the Soviet Union was economic and a lot of it was due to an overcommitment to an unwinnable war in Afghanistan...
 StrangerInTheHouse
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 102
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 8:13:23 AM

EarlzP you brought up such a good point, not really on topic...But borrowing money from China. When I first heard that I was like WTF? Isn't China one of the countries we don't actually agree on things with??? We treat them like enemies and question their government but will take a hand out from them???


That's only the half of it...
We borrow money from China to pay China with.
The trade imbalance between our two nations is staggering...
The United States' current monetary policies do everything possible to make China the richest nation on earth in the future...
That's the republican way and that's where we're headed.
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 103
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 8:22:52 AM
Tomic, we and our administrations over the last few decades are Dr. Frankenstein and Terrorism is a monster of our own creation. Believing otherwise is dancing on the strings of those who intend to continue the experiments.

Sure, we have to address what's already escaped from the lab. But do you see anything to indicate that this administration and those to come next have accepted that they are the cause of terrorism? It will continue to be a vicious cycle and as long as people continue to believe as you and many others today, you will never defeat an enemy that continues to have a cause. That cause is not hatred of our freedom. It is not hatred of our religion. As long as people are oppressed and frustrated by our policies, they will take up their cause.

Ironic to me is that the people of the mindset that is the cause of terrorism are the ones so convinced they have the solution with no change in their way of thinking.
 dragonpat
Joined: 9/29/2006
Msg: 104
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 10:16:00 AM
First off, i will agree the US's policies have helped form some of the hatred for this country. We have supplied the terrorists in the past, we have treated other countries like pawns. I agree we need to stop.
The war in Iraq, well we do need to get out. Bases in Saudi, get out. Matter of fact, we can get out of every country that doesnt want us there. I personally favor all of these. I think we should and not simply for the world opinion, but the financial reasons alone.

Then do you think the terrorists will love us?

I wonder if they will think that they have us on the run. And what will these groups do to the nations we abandon? Will we be crying again about the oppression in Afganistan? But remember we also need to keep our nose out of other peoples business.
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 106
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 10:40:32 AM
Any love would have to earned over time. No, it's silliness to believe that leaving places where we aren't wanted or ceasing unconditional support for oppressive regimes would generate a Barney and Friends kind of love for the US.

There will be hardened haters already in movements and cells that already have their reasons to seek vengeance. There always are, have been, and will be those where destruction is their reason to exist. They exist, have their agendas, and will have to be dealt with. Yes... for these men there does have to be sound strategies to deal with them.

But when those who do already exist go to young Saudis trying to recruit on the basis that infidel troops occupy their holy lands or that the West provides unconditional support for their oppressive regime, how many would sacrifice their own lives in suicide bombings or leave everything behind on a singular cause of destruction?
 StrangerInTheHouse
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 108
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 10:46:27 AM
The US creates it's own terrorism.
The truth is that WWII made the US rich and we fell in love with the prosperity it brought. I pulled us out of the depression and we became a full-time war economy.
Every once in awhile, some president has to juice that up with some declaration of a "war to spread democracy", a "war against communism" or a "war on terror"... but that's the main plan... no matter what.. the central theme of US foreign policy and the US economy, if you will.

We couldn't possibly sustain single digit unemployment and the growth we have without it. Military sales are the biggest industry in the world and just to make sure they sell well, we train our enemies just in case some don't spring up on their own. We had the Brits train Osama Bin Ladin. We trained Manuel Noriega at the school of the Americas. We gave biochems to Saddam. We actually started Iran's nuclear program back in 1969, after we had to remove our missiles from Iran as part of the cuban missile crisis agreement... After all, who could blame us if Iran had it's OWN nukes pointed at the Russians?
But now that we're attacking in the middle east, we're not so comfy with that.
Reagan sold satellite technology to the Chinese in 88... then they build ICBM's... do you think this was a surprise?
IN Iraq, we bought 200,000 weapons with taxpayer's money and GAVE THEM AWAY!

http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2007/08/gao-190000-us-w.html

As long as we sell weapons, war is good for business.
We even elected the first family of the arms industry, the Bush's... two of them, as presidents.
Look it up.
 eeeo4U
Joined: 6/25/2007
Msg: 110
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 1:26:34 PM
And prior to 1947 when Harry Truman recognized Israel, they were all just romantic "Desert Song" nomads who wouldn't harm a fly...yeah right.
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 112
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 5:46:06 PM
i see the light ITECHMAN.

it's all AMERICA'S fault.


And I didn't even have to try that hard. Common sense prevails!

Geesh. People wear their bloodthirst on their sleeves and wonder why others want to kill them.

Look at all the free infidels within a stones throw of the Middle East not being blown up by suicide bombers. I see... they just like the challenge of having to cross oceans to blow up infidels because going to Europe would just be too easy.


And prior to 1947 when Harry Truman recognized Israel, they were all just romantic "Desert Song" nomads who wouldn't harm a fly...yeah right.


Were they blowing themselves up in the name of martrydom?
 Saver1
Joined: 2/1/2008
Msg: 114
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 10:38:58 PM
Jumpswings

We have a large number of Muslim people here in NZ and they are as normal as anyone else, hard working, pay their taxes, respect the law, mind their own business etc.
So please don’t generalize.
I’m afraid my friend you are ignorant and ill-informed about Islam and Muslim culture in general.

I suggest you should take a trip to a Mulslim country and I can guarantee you that you will find all sorts of faiths, colour, race in there, and guess what, those the so called “Muslim people” are very peaceful toward them and see them no different from themselves. Why? Well, because those people didn’t hurt them, or insult their religion.

Please understand that Islam is only a religion who has one billion of followers from all over the world - just as any other spirituality. Your quotes are centuries old and therefore they are irrelevant. Peoples’ thinking and attitude toward lives have changed over time, religious extremists are unwelcome by all societies in the Middle East, they hate them their.


I cannot believe that there are some people in this forum think it’s okay to eradicate Muslim people. You people need to go to a psychiatric hospital to get a treatment because you have a disease which I call misanthrope, it’s a dangerous one, if you failed to treat it as soon as possible you will go psycho in no time. I thought we have past Hitler’s era. Lighten up people.

Do you think people in Iraq will say we love the USA after the US government killed a half million of their won people and caused irreversible rift between their sects (the Sunni and Shia, Christian). I mean seriously think about it, if you were an Iraqi how would you feel if you have lost your mum, brother, sister or your whole family just because USA army drops a missile on them by accident. Wouldn’t you try everything in you power to do something for them huh, think about it.

To eradicate terrorism:
1: you have to solve the Israel and Palestine conflict - it’s a must.
2: Spread education and raise awareness about the benefit of democracy - this must be done through a peaceful initiative and in accordance with each country’s culture.
3: If there are hardcore extremists whom existence causes nothing but trouble, then the US should tactfully persuade their irrespective countries and take them out by a high tech weapon without invading that country. And I am talking here about Muslim, Jewish, Christian extremists.

You have to understand that 99 % of the world and this include Middle Eastern countries wish they could have a good system similar to the one that the Americans have in their own country, where if you work hard you’ll achieve your goals and dreams.
Imagine if American government adhere to the same system when dealing with other countries, wouldn’t the world be a more peaceful place, I bet it would.
Final note:
There should be a system not only in the State but in all democratic countries, in which every politician can only serve for 7 years or less and give a way to new people. This because if politicians remain active for so many years - then nothing will ever change, same ideas and same mentality. Fresh people with fresh ideas are the only way forward to a better country and better world.

Peace/love
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 115
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/12/2008 11:41:10 PM
It wasn't that long ago I was of the "Nuke 'em all" mentality. It's so easy to be there. We're just us going about our lives and these guys fly planes into heavily populated buildings just for a free ride to paradise. Then someone asked me about history. Asked me to think about how I would feel if this, this, and this was what my life was like.

The history showed me how people reacted under circumstances forced upon them versus circumstances closer to what they would choose. In history, in spite of the quotes listed here from the Quran, when Muslims lived the kinds of lives closer to what they would choose they didn't kill non-Muslims for being non-Muslim and least of all they never killed themselves. They lived peacefully amongst non-Muslims.

I consider that I am much like the colonists of the US before the Revolutionary War. How did they react to being oppressed by Britain? They were terrorists! How would I feel about being oppressed and desperate? I'd be one of the first to grab a musket and hike to Bunker Hill.

Our nation itself was formed not because our religion told us to kill the British, but because our forefathers felt the same way the disregarded Islamic peoples feel now and we are their British. This is "1 + 1" and "the shortest distance between two points" stuff people!

Our stake in the Israel-Palestinian conflict is crucial because of the image projected by our unconditional support for Israel. 9/11 occurred immediately after the US walked out of the UN Human Rights conference that turned into a condemnation of Israel. I don't think we should turn our backs on Israel at all and I know there is no easy answer to that conflict. Still we are seen as the enablers of Palestinian oppression based on our support. Our unconditional backing of Israel is seen as what gives them the power to oppress.

When I was shown these facts I was angry that I was so easily led to believe that terrorism emanated from simple religious hatred or hatred for "our freedom" and way of life. Everyone that buys the current administration/GOP line... they know better but simply want you to believe the propaganda. It's not important if they believe the lies, it's important for you to buy into them.
 Bluesman2008
Joined: 4/2/2008
Msg: 117
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/13/2008 1:53:48 AM

It wasn't that long ago I was of the "Nuke 'em all" mentality. It's so easy to be there.


There seems to be a correlation between the onset of Viagra/Cialis et al, injective into the cultural mainstream and the rise (pardon the inescapable pun) in violence? Coincidence?


When I was shown these facts I was angry that I was so easily led to believe that terrorism emanated from simple religious hatred or hatred for "our freedom" and way of life.


Don't you find it interesting how easily we seem to "know" when what we're really doing is feeling something without really knowing why? It's pretty hard to defend (look around here for all the wreckage LMAO).

itechman42 that's exactly right on the money. I really think we have to start a brand new party. The NMBS (anyone can guess what the "BS" is). Wouldn't that be refreshing. It'll be the NMBS vs. the MIBS. Popcorn sold and film at eleven. Don King will referee the bout.
 Saver1
Joined: 2/1/2008
Msg: 118
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/13/2008 2:11:22 PM
To Jumpswings

“I am not your friend”

This tells me what type of person you are, however, as a human being I till see you as a friend. I think you have a personal problem with Islam itself, in which has no place in this forum – this forum is for intellectual discussion. I’m not here to challenge, I am only here to discuss my opinion and read others’ opinions whom are more open-mined rational.
Oh… I forget that you come from South Africa, so no wonder why you hold all this personal begrudges.

You have to understand, every Muslim nations interpret the Quran in a way that fits well with their societies norm. In other words, their cultures influenced the Quran’s interpretation. For example, if you visit Dubai you will find it very different from Saudi Arabia in how they see and interpret the Quran.

Your claims are tenuous because they are not based on a first hand experience.

From my experience working in the Gulf I knew Saudi Arabia has a law in which if someone steals something, he/she will be given a warning the first time, second time is imprisonment with a warning that the third time he/she will lose a hand.
Eye for an eye, if someone deliberately kills someone then he/she will get the same treatment unless the parents’ victim chooses to forgive. And so……

You need to drop the personal hatred toward Islam and be programmatic and rational. Also when you discuss something, you have to understand that people are culturally different and therefore they don’t think or see think in the way that you see them. They are different so don’t expect them to act or behave just like you. Open up.


Here is a therapeutic technique that might help you loosen up. Take deep breaths and let them out slowly – it will help you to relax because hatred kills the hater alive.

Peace/love
 Saver1
Joined: 2/1/2008
Msg: 119
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/13/2008 2:28:41 PM
If I may also add this good example,

Women in Saudi Arabia aren’t allowed to drive but in all the other Muslim countries they drive, they rules, they govern etc. So why, well because it’s the culture, Saudi Arabia is full of tribes who still behind in term of education etc, and has nothing to do with Islam. Their Prophet Mahmud’s wife was a business woman, she supported him financially, he wasn’t a shame if that, unlike now where it is frown upon by some Middle Eastern culture.

In Iran, they practice Islam quite different from those in the Gulf and others Muslim.

I am not defend Islam, I am an atheist myself not big fan of religions, but hate it when people based their argument on misconceptions and lies.
 faith2565
Joined: 3/25/2006
Msg: 120
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/13/2008 3:19:21 PM
Defeat and create are two different words. Just think about it.
 Saver1
Joined: 2/1/2008
Msg: 121
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/13/2008 3:53:30 PM
I meant South African has been through so much, social unrest etc, which caused so much hatred and social rift. Sadly that hatred is still lingering and undercurrent in some of mind of South African people. Hopefully time will eventually heal all of that.

I meant no offence to South African people.

I didn’t make an assumption when I thought that you were from South African. Here is what you said in an earlier post Quote “I remember my sister telling me back in the the mid 1980's, whilst in school in South Africa ( she lived just outside Johannesburg)”.

As for friendship, I knew that will never meet you, however I always see all human kinds are my friends, and you are one of them.

So, peace my friend, and sorry if I offended you.

Yes back to the topic
 faith2565
Joined: 3/25/2006
Msg: 122
view profile
History
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/13/2008 5:43:41 PM
We defeat the person that actually attacks us and not create a war to get back at someone that hurt our family. Just a thought.
 jamminjeff
Joined: 2/20/2006
Msg: 125
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 9/13/2008 11:51:03 PM
One very important step is to Impeach George W Bush and Richard Cheney. They are 2 of the most dangerous terrorists in the world!
 jamminjeff
Joined: 2/20/2006
Msg: 127
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 10/23/2008 9:05:32 PM
And don't vote for John W. McSame and Lipstick Falin! Vote for Obama/Biden, and hope Diebold doesn't convert your vote to McSame/Falin.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 128
How do we defeat Terrorism?
Posted: 4/11/2016 10:06:14 AM
New bombings in Russia and Afghanistan, recruited suicide bombers

Why don't we get some artists to make some "anti-terrirism" videos that would be perceived as cool and try to dissuade them from blowing themselves up? Or are they already doing that?

Pop, hip hop and rock artists have all kinds of influence. Why not make some counter recruitment you tube videos.
Show ALL Forums  > Politics  >