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 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 360
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?Page 10 of 53    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41)
OK R.O. interesting Hypothesis. We came from big reptilians??? That is the suggested "alien" that is the nasty little creature that wants to enslave the human race.

Today there was a statement from Associated Reuters (major news outlet), that the poles are melting even faster than was first thought. Seems we are going to have to grow gills first, before we have to worry about it getting to cooled...

As for Aliens having much more interesting things to do, if we can shell out many trillions of dollars to the NASA program to see what is out in space, and if there is life out there; why wouldn't other higher intelligent beings have that same interest?

Maybe there isn't anything, because our solar system is a rather ODD solar system most solar systems have binary stars, except for ours.. Which would make these solar systems rather hot, unless their planets are further from the heat source IE two suns.

As far as the human race, we have many different races, and not all races are created equal DNA wise any ways... Some have developed better means to handle certain disease, and some have genetic disorders that really stink.

Take Asians, (no offense to ANY Asian) but Chinese and Japanese have small eye lids and slanted eyes... However not Filipinos, People from India, Vietnamese, at least not as prominent. What evolutionary purpose does that serve?

Oh and dogs, can all be traced back to the wolf and fox....

Another thought, if we came from reptiles, why did it all the sudden become beneficial to give live birth, verses sitting on eggs? My point that is a heck of a lot of evolution

Once again a lot of interesting thought, all considering that there were several ice ages, and after the die off of the dinosaurs, then the ice ages should have killed off things that didn't live under water. These ice ages were supposed to completely cover the earth surface with very thick layers of ice, even the hair need food...
 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 361
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 2/27/2009 5:33:38 PM
>>>interesting Hypothesis. We came from big reptilians???

Honestly, that was one of the things I was gunna say he got wrong....but nope, ends up its true- Mammals evolved from a kind of dinosaur that lived in the late Carboniferous Period, named Synapsid ....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synapsid
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 362
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 2/27/2009 5:58:59 PM
not every palaeontologist would agree with Professor Prothero’s evolutionary assessment of the synapsid cranial morphology. The most recent review has been written by Christian Sidor (Assistant Professor of Biology and Curator of Vertebrate Paleontology, University of Washington) in the journal Paleobiology which and entitled “Evolutionary trends and the origin of the mammalian lower jaw”. The full publication can be found here.

(http://www.truthinscience.org.uk/site/content/view/270/65/)

Jip, you are the first to say to look to science, and we who chose NOT to believe find it easy to just guess...WIKI??? Come on, there was a major need of citation, and not all palaeontologists agree... Once again a dviding of the science world..

I know less about the origin of man then I did before the start of this thread...
 hurricane hanna
Joined: 9/4/2008
Msg: 364
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 2/28/2009 4:01:29 AM
"Plausible theory?"

No.

People in specific cultures begin to believe things, and believe them fervently, as a part of being exposed to 'disinformation'.
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 367
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 2/28/2009 1:05:33 PM
Twister, you make a good point, and I think Religion, organized in particular is at odds with many things...

However I think there are MANY possibilities that exist. Humans seem to think in terms of their just being ONE race of superior beings... This leaves out the possibility of OTHER races of superior beings, thus the different space ships.

Our thought process can be so limited to one thing or another, that is seems hard for people to not grasp things in the really big picture as there being MANY possibilities...

It has been proven that SOME mammals were reptilian in the beginning... However not all, and that means there are different answers to the same question.

Religion is a source of power over people once again. It always has been, if you don't do this that or the other, then YOU WON'T get to heaven. How great of a power can anyone have then convincing people that their life is meant for service to a church, THEN they will be rewarded after they are dead.

There is something about church that does stir a majority of peoples brain waves. Even those who are NOT into organized religion, can have one thing or another that stirs this inner "spirituality". Pop religion musicians have this affect on me, I enjoy from time to time listening to Michael W Smith, and others, yet I can't stand organized religion.

Heck even those that are devil worshipers they are still believing in some sort of power beyond the human existence... WHY

As of yet have I seen OTHER creatures get stirred to some sort of spirituality... I have seen animals them grieve death first hand, so this to me says a lot about humans, and animals and the odd connection we have between each other...

Maybe we humans are to willing to look for just one answer then the multiple answers that are out there. Funny how humans want things all neatly put in one box, and want it to agree with others at the same time...
 Bluesman2008
Joined: 4/2/2008
Msg: 370
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 2/28/2009 11:20:17 PM

What does that have to do with 200 years ago....1000 years ago..how about back as far as caveman days and their drawings ? ....they still were kept at a distance even way back then.
It has nothing to do with oil....that is a no brainer
It has nothing to do with money...that is a no brainer
It has nothing to do with any military industrial complex.......thats a no brainer
because none of those things were even in mankinds thoughts back then


I was responding to the question of why the ET phenomena is kept secret NOW and not 200 or 1000 years ago. But as Dance said, information is power and power is control. It's simple really.
 desertrhino
Joined: 11/30/2007
Msg: 371
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 6:43:16 AM
Conspiracy theorists are funny. It's virtually impossible for *TWO* people to keep a secret, much less 2,000 or 2,000,000. Ask them for proof and watch them spin about how perfectly their pet conspiracy is kept from the people... but THEY have seen proof... they can't show YOU or they'll be killed, of course.

*laughter*
 ForeverLong
Joined: 11/22/2007
Msg: 372
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 7:50:31 AM
If ETs are visiting here we would have some proof by now. Do you think all the governments of the world could keep that a secret. They can't keep a lid on anything. It was a government conspiracy to lead us to think there may be something to it so they can get more money for space programs....think about it. Of course Hollywood wants to keep the conspiracy going...more money for them. Hey I love scifi and fantacy too. I'm sure there is other life out in the universe but the distances are unsurmountable and who can say that they are capable of space travel. Why is it that with everyone having digital cameras and cellphone cameras that there are no good photos even? We have seen the faked, blinking lights, and fuzzy pics.
 ForeverLong
Joined: 11/22/2007
Msg: 375
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 4:18:06 PM
That thing about gravity weakening and dinosaurs was the craziest nonsense I have heard in a while.
 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 376
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 4:53:10 PM
>>>why must there be such great need to scoff and discredit, attempting to belittle opinions when you can nether prove or disprove your own ?

I believe the context is essiential in this topic- we are in a philosphy and science section of the forums- which means there would have to be some form of scientific explaination and inquiry. Now, if this were in the "Off Topic" section, I might be compelled to crack jokes about whether or not ET shits in the woods- but thats not what this section is for- its for debate, questioning, and inquiry.

And to say that I must be quiet and respect your opinion, that I should ignore the flaws in both the science and the logic, and that any attempts to disprove it is somehow disrespectful, is completely ridiculous- I have just as much the freedom to express an opinion as you do- and my opinion is you are wrong- and I will work harder to express myself than you will, because I intend to prove my opinion

>>>But I do enjoying talking with other's about such things and share the possibilities.

But these possiblities you are expressing are not based on any actual observed facts! Essientially, you are making things up, and claiming you think they are possible because you feel they are- not because you've proven they are.

For example- the idea that there is life on other planets- our observations shows that we cannot find a single planet that is capible of supporting life, save our own. Does that mean that there are no planets out there that can support life? No- but that DOES mean the possiblities that there is life on other planets, based on our observations, is nil. You wish to take our observations and completely invalidate them solely because you don't like what we've observed.

>>> but to close your mind to other venues I find limiting.

How is closing your mind to uncredible sources limiting? What value can you get from a source who would freely and openly lie to you? Isn't the crediblity of your source of knowledge absolutely essiential?

-----------

>>>Life on Earth's surface started with huge organisms because dinosaurs were the only beings large enough to survive the strong gravity.

Uhhhh, no- life started with microscopic creatures-In fact, dinosaurs appeared billions of years after life took root- it was more the Permian-Triassic extinction event that lead to 95% of all life going extinct- giving the dinosaurs the edge to take root and spread.

>>>The Earth was too hot and the gravity was too strong for humans to survive.

Uhhh.....while the heat may be true, the gravity had little to do with it- we've evolved over millions of years to adapt to this gravity- if a modern man were to go back in time, yes, the gravity would be too great- but if a creature were to evolve into man in the time of dinosaurs, they would be able to adapt to the gravity.

>>>I don't think that dinosaurs were predators until the gravity started to weaken and overpopulation made food scarce.

Got an example of when that gravity shift started to happen?

And isn't the worlds oldest dinosaur discovered, the Eoraptor, a carnivore?

>>>The best that technology can do is transport us to another Earth type planet around the early BC era so we can enjoy thousands of years of fun before we have to leave again.

Why would there be no recorded history of such an action? And no evidence? And why do we see apes clearly evolving into us through the fossil record?
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 377
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Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 5:51:34 PM

But these possiblities you are expressing are not based on any actual observed facts! Essientially, you are making things up, and claiming you think they are possible because you feel they are- not because you've proven they are.


Jip, this is incorrect, according to YOU there is no provable facts, you dismiss all things that don't fit YOUR criteria of scientific. As well, we haven't seen an INTH of the universes beyond our own solar system.

We don't know what kind of anything that is out there, and just because it hasn't been found doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Just because YOU focus on what you want to believe does NOT mean others should limit their own observations to what you consider proveable facts.

We are going to a paperless society, why is it shocking to think there isn't recorded anything??? Perhaps there was more, but due to an inhospitable environment things couldn't survive, they deteriated from heat, cold, water, microbs...

We don't know, there is no proof one way or another, and until about 30 yrs ago, dinosaur bones had been put together WRONG, funny when they put them together, they were the top scientist of their time...

This is the point you seem to gloss completely past. What we knew 100 yrs ago about humans has been upended almost completely 100 yrs later... So with you linear flow of logic, that evolution occurs, why wouldn't science continue to evolve as well??? Do you honestly think it stops where it is, or maybe there is a crap load MORE to learn, maybe what is a theory, or considered fact is still really crap science.

Do you honestly think that 100 yrs later we have it right, even though we haven't ventured to ANY OTHER planets out side of our own solar system, and the universe IS SO VASTE that we can't see it from end to end... That we know for sure there is NOTHING out there?

There is a LOT of unexplained history, and a lot of it is a hypothetical guess, that isn't good science either...

I find it very interesting that you want to shoot everybody down that doesn't agree to your belief system... Believe me, reach mid age, and you will find a LOT of things that were told to you at 24, that doesn't hold water at 44... That is only 20 yrs of gained knowledge.

Perhaps we did come from a space ship, and like many different objects that are dissolving from microbs in the ocean like the IE Titanic, and Lusatania perhaps these too have rotted away. Perhaps they only had a couple hundred or more PEOPLE, they had to start from scratch. Knowledge got lost, and before they knew it, there own history was being written on stones, because they didn't have the fancy equipment from before.

500 yrs from now, if this earth exists, our own existant will be gone from history. Do you honestly think that it isn't that hard to fade into a past where nobody knew you existed??? That is unless you were some leader, shaman, priest, to the ruler et al.

You, me we will not be part of some memorable archive. I might, when I was born I was written down on paper, and perhaps in some old warehouse my name will still exist. However I will be no more meaningful that the millions that exist today unless I do something that gets my name in stone...

I have no interest in having a grave marker, I am donating my corpse to science, because I have no interest in taking up land after death.

Now think about it, technology changes rapidly... In my days as an X ray tech films after the age of 18 unless they were mammograms got tossed after 7 yrs... Same with other paper documents... Now a good portion is all on computer, which will be archived for a while then erased...Not even a hard copy to dig through the trash for...

Do you honestly think that in 500 yrs they are going to bother keeping a record??? Do we really lead that interesting of lives to make anyone want to keep our memory around?

NO...
 Soul Union
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 378
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 6:56:14 PM
As well, we haven't seen an INTH of the universes beyond our own solar system. ~ nexthyme


Right on the money.

I see the Earth, the planet upon which we live, as a single grain of sugar in a big bag. We are surrounded by millions of other bodies, planets, stars and galaxies. Put that bag in a warehouse, where there are thousands of such bags already. Stack 'em up high. . . . Now look how infinitely small, and feeble, we are - with our 'knowledge' and our so-called understanding.

The light from some of those stars out there has taken many years to reach us. Travelling at 186,000 miles a second, that gives us an inkling of how much is out there, and how far and away those heavenly bodies really are.

As an astrologer, I am constantly amazed, for example, by the influence of the planet Pluto. It is a tiny planet, smaller than our Moon, at the farthest reaches of our solar system, and yet its influence is mind boggling, as any astrologer will tell you. The first thing I do when I cast a chart is to track Pluto. His influence is, as I said, beyond the pale.

Our idea of 'facts,' our notion of knowledge, and our human understanding of what goes on around us are highly suspect, always changing according to what new data is collected.

As for the Illuminati, their ultimate goal is complete global control over human beings. Anyone dismissing the profound influence of the global elite has only to read about how the British Metropolitan police force will soon be microchipped - all in the name of 'security.' Or take the United Nations and their coming 'Codex Alimentarius.' Heard of that? Know anything about it? If Codex Alimentarius has its way, then herbs, vitamins, minerals, homoeopathic remedies, amino acids and other natural remedies you have taken for granted most of your life will be gone. The name of the game for Codex Alimentarius is to shift all remedies into the prescription/drug category so they can be controlled exclusively by the medical monopoly and its bosses (Big Pharma), the major pharmaceutical firms. This is what we have to look forward to by the end of 2009, if the lovely UN has its way. Here in New Zealand, where I live, the outgoing Labour government tried to pass a Bill that would outlaw natural medicines here, including vitamins, etc, from our health food stores. Fortunately, they did not have the numbers to pass the Bill. They never mentioned this before they were elected.

The Codex Alimentarius proposals already exist as law in Norway and Germany, where the entire health food industry has literally been taken over by the drug companies. In these countries, vitamin C above 200mg is illegal, as is vitamin E above 45IU, vitamin B1 over 2.4mg and so on. Shering-Plough, the Norwegian pharmaceutical giant, now controls an Echinacea tincture, which is being sold there as an over-the-counter drug at grossly inflated prices. The same is true of ginkgo and many other herbs, and only one government-controlled pharmacy has the right to import supplements as medicines, which they can sell to health food stores, convenience stores or pharmacies.

Another use of the codex law will be to irradiate all food that enters the food chain. Every vegetable, fruit, nut or piece of meat that you and I eat will be 'dead.'

The World Trade Organization (WTO) is forcing Codex Alimentarius upon the nations of the world, including the US. This would be done under the threat of massive economic sanctions if WTO countries do not comply with Codex Alimentarius. Big bully at work again - with their sanctions.

A world 'seed bank' has been built inside a remote mountain in Svalbard in Norway, and if you stop and question the need for this bank, backed by Bill Gates and the Rockefeller Foundation, you just might conclude that our flora is in 'danger.' These people know the truth of this because they are in danger.

The vault has top security, blast-proof doors and two airlocks. The number of seeds stored depends on the number of countries participating in the project. The point of this project is to prevent the diversity of agricultural crops currently stored (typically in the form of seed) in seed banks from becoming 'extinct' as a result of accident, mismanagement, equipment failure, war or natural disaster, or due to a global catastrophe.

This indicates that some kind of global 'disaster' is on the cards, whether 2012, later or sooner, governments around the world are preparing for this event. Australia has their Pine Gap, an underground 'city' with resident armies and highly trained personnel in the heart of the desert. A little research on Pine Gap will produce surprising results.

"If the people were to ever find out what we have done, we would be chased down the streets and lynched."
George HW Bush to White House reporter Sarah McClendon, 1992

~ Peter
 Bluesman2008
Joined: 4/2/2008
Msg: 379
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 7:40:34 PM
All very true. People had better start making some noise about this and other things NOW before it's too damned late. We can't allow ourselves the luxury of complacency.
 stargazer1000
Joined: 1/16/2008
Msg: 380
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 8:43:51 PM
For example- the idea that there is life on other planets- our observations shows that we cannot find a single planet that is capible of supporting life, save our own. Does that mean that there are no planets out there that can support life? No- but that DOES mean the possiblities that there is life on other planets, based on our observations, is nil. You wish to take our observations and completely invalidate them solely because you don't like what we've observed.


To be blunt, Jip, I think you're wrong here. At present, observations don't really say anything about the present existence of life on other planets. However, the it does indicate a high level of probability.

Currently, over 300 "exo-planets" have been discovered. Most are hot Jupiters and only a few analogues to our solar system has been found. Absolutely no Earth-mass planets have been discovered.

What has been seen is that planet formation is almost ubiquitous to a variety of systems. Our understanding of the process is far from complete so it is difficult to make definitive statements about that process. However, with each discovery we get closer. And it's safe to say, life needs a planet.

The chemistry for life is certainly everywhere. Given the right conditions, certainly the probability of life existing elsewhere is high, approaching 100 per cent. The fact that it happened here, and there are other likely places in our own solar system, is promising for the universe as a whole. Most likely, it's something akin to bacterial. After all, that was what dominated Earth's biosphere for the majority of its existence.

And this is the where we get to the crux of the problem. The only thing we can speak about any of this is in probabilities. What is the probability that some interstellar faring species happens to find our lonely little ball of mud at just the right time in our evolutionary history, cross trillions of miles of empty space, fiddle with our DNA and make us without leaving even a hint of their existence, or their manipulation in our DNA? Not zero, but damn well approaching it.

The bottom line is, the greatest likelihood is that we humans evolved on our little speck of mud in space completely independently of any extraterrestrial influence, unless you consider the causes of the five mass extinctions (by natural, i.e. asteroid, nearby supernova, etc., not supernatural forces).

As for the NWO, and grand conspiracies, the fact that you can sit there and say the evidence is all over for everyone to see but remains secret is non sequitor. If you can see it, the rest of us can see it. God, if only governments were that competent. Sadly, I doubt we will ever see a NWO with even half that level of competency.
 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 381
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 9:07:53 PM
>>>Jip, this is incorrect, according to YOU there is no provable facts

Don't assume that since you base your beliefs on things that cannot be proven that I equally believe nothing can be proven- there are provable facts, and there are absolutes. I certainly have no problem with that- but what evidence have you presented that aliens exist? Other than the conviction that life must exist out there because it must(as well as some handy abduction stories), you've presented nothing that can be proven.

>>>As well, we haven't seen an INTH of the universes beyond our own solar system.

Aside from the grammar error(there is only one universe- hence the uni- you clearly meant either galaxies or solar systems), you're missing a distinct point to my beliefs- that I require evidence, not conviction. You have convinced yourself that there is life on other planets- you haven't observed the evidence that supports the idea of life on other planets, because there are none- your evidence is the lack of evidence- that unless we know everything, claiming to know anything is wrong- which does nothing but stifle real scientific progress, since science is the method of reaching a better understanding of the universe through observation, not through faith and conviction

>>>We don't know what kind of anything that is out there

We certainly have an idea, and can reach conclusions based on our simple understanding and observations- everywhere we look, the universe is barren and hositle to life- you take our observations of the universe and claim we must be wrong, not because of anything observed, but because you have convinced yourself that life must exist. The universe must be full of life not because we see it be true, but because you have faith that it is true.

When will you people realize you're creating a new religion?

>>>and just because it hasn't been found doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Then prove it! Find it!

What is so hard about this? I will not alter my opinion based on the fact that you have convinced yourself you must be right- I will, however, alter my opinion to evidence.

There is nothing in the long line of humanity that can be disproved if all you need is someone convinced it exists- werewolves, vampires, mermaids, giants, dragons, the undead, spaghetti monsters, a talking volkswagon- I'm sure some of these things you doubt exist- you certainly don't apply the logic of "it must be proven not to exist to not exist" to everything- but in this sitation, you're willing to make an exception- why? why is this situation permit it, but others do not?

And how does one go about proving aliens do not exist? Are you seriously saying you can never be wrong until every square inch of the universe is completely observed? That I and everyone else must take your conviction as fact solely based on the premise that everything must be known in order for you to be proven wrong?

>>>Just because YOU focus on what you want to believe does NOT mean others should limit their own observations to what you consider proveable facts.

And just because someone says something is true doesn't make it so. We must have a greater system to verify facts, otherwise anyone who wants to make a name for themselves will make something up, or anyone who has a mental disorder will invent creatures left and right, and we would be powerless to deny what they say is false because everything everyone says must be true.

>>>We are going to a paperless society, why is it shocking to think there isn't recorded anything??? Perhaps there was more, but due to an inhospitable environment things couldn't survive, they deteriated from heat, cold, water, microbs...

Now I'm a little confused- is this in reference to the "we travelled from other worlds" idea? Because, again, when you land on the planet, you'd think you'd know how to build a city, or co-operate. But none of that was seen- you'd think if you came from an advanced society, SOMEONE might want to remember how to start a fire.....

>>>This is the point you seem to gloss completely past.

I disagree- I completely agree that science can be wrong- but that doesn't disprove any of our observations. The fact that we can be wrong doesn't mean everything we do is wrong- each situation must be observed carefully- we will not gain any understanding of the universe by making broad assumptions- thats not how we progress, and little advancement has ever been made by going by your gut rather than by your head.

>>> why wouldn't science continue to evolve as well???

Are you actually saying the proper way to achieve understanding of the universe is to refuse to try and understand it? That science, in order to evolve and better prepare for its future failures to understand, should declare things we do understand as false solely because we have been wrong so many times in the past?

You find nothing wrong with that kind of judgement?

>>>Do you honestly think it stops where it is, or maybe there is a crap load MORE to learn, maybe what is a theory, or considered fact is still really crap science.

I do not believe this is where it stops- but equally, I find it incredibly presumptous to assume things before the evidence supports it.

>>>That we know for sure there is NOTHING out there?

Not at all- but we do know what we know, and it is foolish to reach any conclusions that contradict what we have see to be true because we aren't achieving the answers we demand to be there.

>>> Knowledge got lost, and before they knew it, there own history was being written on stones, because they didn't have the fancy equipment from before.

And within a few generations, we lost the ability of language, fire, and the wheel. Sounds logical to me.

And I suppose all those forms we previously evolved from- I suppose they were put on Earth to trick us into believing we were born here?

>>> Knowledge got lost, and before they knew it, there own history was being written on stones, because they didn't have the fancy equipment from before.

Not without a trace- 500 years is nothing- we've found camps that are tens if not hundreds of thousands of years old.

>>>Do you honestly think that in 500 yrs they are going to bother keeping a record??? Do we really lead that interesting of lives to make anyone want to keep our memory around?

On you and my day to day lives? God no- but exchanges between countries will certainly be remembered, yes- and knowledge, as always, will be preserved.
 Soul Union
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 383
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/1/2009 10:43:32 PM
FYI ... Last I heard ... Pluto is no longer considered a Planet. Do you astrologers have something about how great the influence of the asteroids are in the asteroid belt ... that is much closer than Pluto. hmmm? There is lots of proof of Astrology ... right? and it fits right into Aliens creating humans ... right? ~ thorb


Hi Thorb. I think astronomers have demoted Pluto in some way, but there was a collective decision by astrologers to keep Pluto as the furthest planet in our zodiacal pantheon. When you have studied thousands of charts, when you hear of the profound life changes in people's lives because of Pluto, it is not a planet you would even consider leaving out. It tells us a great deal about the life of the individual.

Now you mentioned asteroids. There are several 'centaurs,' as they are called, but the one in primary use now among the astrological fraternity is Chiron. Chiron's 'picture' is that of the Wounded Healer. Where Chiron falls in your chart is where you will find your greatest lesson. For instance, my Chiron falls in my second house. This means that my greatest lesson in life (through the Chirotic energy) is to think more of myself, to value myself, and to see myself as an equal, not some inferior being.

More planetoids and asteroids are being added to the zodiacal pantheon as time goes by, but most astrologers use the traditional ten planets (Sun, Moon out to Pluto). For instance, one of the finest astrologers in the world, the American Noel Tyl, uses only the main ten planets. (We call the Sun and Moon 'planets' for the sake of convenience.)

There is a well-researched theory, and I cannot remember who wrote about this, that there was once a planet between Mars and Jupiter and that an ancient alien civilization caused the destruction of this planet with their equivalent of nuclear warfare while they were battling some other civilization, and that the asteroid belt is the remnants of the break-up of that planet. I forget the author's name, but he is quite a scholar of ancient civilizations, including non-human ones.

Yes, Thorb, there is plenty of proof for astrology. Noel Tyl has a waiting list longer than the queue to see a public hanging. He charges a great deal of money for a single-session consultation. His style, his erudition, his very essence are truly professional. He sees things that most astrologers don't, and he has written many books - among them my favourite, Synthesis & Counselling in Astrology.

~ Peter
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 385
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History
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 8:41:45 AM
There is only one thing I will point out jip.

It has been left up to debate as to how the pyramids in Egypt, South America, the status of Easter Island, et al.

So if we currently are still at odds as to how they were constructed, why is it so odd that a space ship could come down and after generations lose the ability to do what they did before? Especially if they were having to improvise starting with nothing...

Who said they forgot how to make a wheel, or fire?

Way back when there are a LOT of extremely fabulous structures, yet when people moved to America, they once again had to start at an archaic point. With the slow assistance of getting supplies from Europe. However if a space ship came here, and had nothing but what they had, then they wouldn't have any supply lines would they?

We haven't been out of our own solar system, so we haven seen an inth of the UNIVERSE, this includes millions of galaxies we don't even know about.

The universe is thought to be 13 billion years old, earth 4.5, making some other places 7.5 billion year ahead of us; so during that time, doesn't it seem that perhaps the galaxies and solar systems within just might have had the same elements to create life? During that time which is nearly double the time we have been in existence, there does seem a plausibility for advanced life form to get out of their own solar system, beyond what we know?

You are asking for proof of this, well following your own linear thinking, if it is possible to create life out of star dust here, why not other places???

Jip, you are free to live in your bubble of "absolute truth"... I don't have a problem looking beyond what is known, and that IS how people make new discoveries, because they are able to see beyond conventional science and wisdom. These people are called visionaries, you want to call it fairy tale thinking, meh what ever floats your boat.
 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 387
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 2:26:09 PM
>>>When you have studied thousands of charts, when you hear of the profound life changes in people's lives because of Pluto, it is not a planet you would even consider leaving out.

I agree Pluto is significant, being the largest object found in the far reaches of our solar system discovered yet, but its significance on anyones lives should not change our status on whether or not we consider it a planet- Haleys Comet is considered significant, and has played a role in countless lives- should we name it a planet too?

>>>There is a well-researched theory, and I cannot remember who wrote about this, that there was once a planet between Mars and Jupiter and that an ancient alien civilization caused the destruction of this planet with their equivalent of nuclear warfare while they were battling some other civilization, and that the asteroid belt is the remnants of the break-up of that planet. I forget the author's name, but he is quite a scholar of ancient civilizations, including non-human ones.

....

You gotta be shittin' me....

THIS TOPIC IS ABOUT THAT.- The OP was about just that, and at least 10-15 pages of this topic is about that very claim you just made

Please, reveiw this topic, as it has been discussed at length.

>>>but most astrologers use the traditional ten planets (Sun, Moon out to Pluto).

Nine- if you include Pluto, there are Nine Planets- Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto.

>>> (We call the Sun and Moon 'planets' for the sake of convenience.)

Convinence?

First and foremost, convience shouldn't take precidence over fact- the Sun works in astoundingly different ways from all other planets, and cannot be considered a planet, as it does not match any of the characteristics of other planets.

Secondly, if we counted the Sun and the Moon, we would have 11 planets, not 10. And if we include all the moons, there would be 178 planets(179 if you count the sun)

-------

>>>So blast away with your scientific criticism, just be aware the final decision to read your post lies in "our" hands and is our option.

I am well aware of this, as users like Blue clearly have chosen to no longer read my posts. I understand this is a fourm with voluntary cooperation, and if a user chooses not to respond to my posts, I will accept it- but I won't ignore the flaws in their logic.

>>>It is possible we are the aliens.

How do you reach this possiblity? Under what criteria? Have you honestly looked at the possiblity for versus the possiblity against, or did you just FEEL its possible, and thats all the research you felt nessary?

>>>Why would that be impossible? We could be self programing machines, aware of self, regenerating machines.

We are in a very real sense biological machines, yes- but there is no evidence of a creator, be it a God or be it an alien.

>>>So why not some"thing" creates us?

Because that sentence is the beginning and end of you evidence- "Why Not?"- and society has evolved from such trivial means of understanding our surroundings.

-------

>>>So if we currently are still at odds as to how they were constructed, why is it so odd that a space ship could come down and after generations lose the ability to do what they did before? Especially if they were having to improvise starting with nothing...

If a machine came down, set up either life or the lifeform of mankind and kicked it out the door without a word to them, that may be a plausible theory(although, once again, there is no evidence outside of "Why Not?")- but the concept that aliens had enough knowledge to build a spaceship and keep it running for either decades, centuries, millenia or more, and yet no one had the smarts to think to preserve such basic skills as starting fire, reading and writing, and building shelter, is completely ridiculous

>>>Who said they forgot how to make a wheel, or fire?

Well, lets see- the Homo genus appeared on the scene around 200,000-500,000 years ago- civilization appeared around 10,000 years ago- so for eightteen to forty five times the length of all recorded history, they just kind wondered around in hunter-gatherer tribes for no apparent reason? You don't feel thats a fair critisim to make? That everything, from repairing the spaceship to fashioning weapons, to communicating to each other, was instantly lost? And you don't find that an oddly convenient to your argument- that mankind knew everything, but decided that civilization wasn't worth it, and decided to go feral and kill and rape and steal?

Not to mention your concept doesn't even begin to explain the examples you gave- how, if humans are aliens, and appeared tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of years before Easter Island and Stone Hedge and the Pyamids, did they manage to build these things?

>>>However if a space ship came here, and had nothing but what they had, then they wouldn't have any supply lines would they?

They wouldn't have a single thing from the spaceship? Not a steel girder, or a laser cannon, or a MP3 player, or even a hatchet? They wouldn't even have the knowledge of how they got there, and the knowledge of how to cooperate with each other as they had been doing for decades, centuries, or millenia (or even more)

I gotta say- if I were to land on Earth during the times of sabertooth tigers, I'd want to have at least a gun- you want us to believe they landed here naked, without so much as a thought in their head.

>>>The universe is thought to be 13 billion years old, earth 4.5, making some other places 7.5 billion year ahead of us

I believe I've already addressed this, but it may be in another topic- as another user pointed out directly above you, we are made of stardust- essientially, the elements that we are made from could not have been made from the Big Bang, but rather requires the fusion of a star, as well as a Supernova to spread these elements- so the timeframe you are giving aliens to have an advantage over us isn't as large as you wish us to believe.

And even then, though, the time frame doesn't really matter- even if life is evitable, intelligent life most certainly is not- evolution creates the most adaptive life, not the most intelligent- out of the history of Earth, over 99.999999999% of all life would be considered non-intelligent, at least not in a Homo genus sense- it seems that intelligent life really is a fluke, and could just as easily appear in the first million years of life or may never appear at all.

>>>You are asking for proof of this, well following your own linear thinking, if it is possible to create life out of star dust here, why not other places???

Its not a mere matter of elements- if that were so, I could combine Oxygen, Carbon, Hydrogen, Nitrogen, Calcium, Phosphorus, Potassium, Sulfur, Sodium, Magnesium, Copper, Zinc, Selenium, Molybdenum, Fluorine, Chlorine, Iodine, Manganese, Cobalt, Iron, and trace ammounts of Lithium, Strontium, Aluminum, Silicon, Lead, Vanadium, Arsenic, Bromine, mix it all up in a test tube and out would pop a human- and it doesn't work like that- in order for life to exist, inanimate matter must suddenly and quite irrationally spring to life and become animate. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, as clearly it does or we wouldn't be here- but until we better understand how life appears, independently, its unscientific to assume that the universe must be filled with life, because we have life here on Earth.

>>>I don't have a problem looking beyond what is known, and that IS how people make new discoveries, because they are able to see beyond conventional science and wisdom.

People make new discoverys by observation- there is no knowledge to be gained by making shit up and expecting the universe to fall into line. If you find empirical evidence of aliens out there, I would accept it with great glee- but I do not agree that we will better understand the universe by claiming our observations are wrong because your conviction doesn't allow them to be right.

---------

>>>Many others have seen the smoke as well
Nastradamus , mayans ,hopi indians....the list goes on

Thats the exact point where your analogy lost me.

Could it be argued we are seeing signs of our own destruction? Of course- wars, nuclear weapons, and enviromental damage are certainly can be interpreted as the warning signs you mentioned- but to claim that people hold some form of devine knowledge completely devoid of any observation is simply wrong in my opinion.
 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 388
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 3:05:29 PM
>>>so I guess you are saying that you dont believe in any secret societies ones that go back centuries like the Freemasons or later on the Illuminatti.

While I don't disagree with your statement(I do not believe in the NWO or Illuminatti or whatever), but I fail to see the relation- I do not believe that knowledge achieved from devine intervention has anything to do with these secret societies, and that knowledge achieved through observation is invaluable, while knowledge achieved through devine intervention are worthless.
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 389
view profile
History
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 3:59:09 PM

I feel the same as you Dance...we see something coming but dont know what
I do believe tho ...that my last gasp for breath in this world
will be my first gasp of breath in another world
Its with this thought ,that I walk forward
and fear no evil.


You, me and many many others... I got the sense you watched the history channel last night, Hopi Indians, and their belief of what can be, is dependent upon what a majority of people decide.

As we have spoken, before preparation can be futile, just like Y2K, however at the same time that very well could have been GOOD practice.

People dream about this which we aren't sure what to make of it. It could be easy to silently wait and see the flames. It could be easy to figure there is nothing to worry about, as I have said before, forge cautiously ahead, but I don't think a person should make themselves nuts over the unknown.

Jiperly, lets just say we can agree to disagree. No need to belittle anothers personal belief, NOR to claim they are making stuff up... The whole deal is, that YOU selectively choose to believe what you want, and dismiss the rest. Your choice, however some of us can look at the huge picture see the science, and also see things that still have question marks... That is what keeps us moving forward and looking Hypothesizing. You aren't required to like anyone person OR groups hypothesis.

I'm inclined to see that their can be a combination of things, not just one answer to all the questions.. You stated yourself we didn't just happen from star dust, no, that is not a logical idea is it.. Something kick started life, and we haven't been able to replicate that something.. Thus the continuation of looking at different ideas.

As for you, you have come to a conclusion, and decides that is what fits the big picture..

For some of us, No, and NO we have never said THIS IS HOW IT WENT, we just used the word plausible, possible... That is a far rest from saying this is how it is...
 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 390
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 5:07:42 PM
>>>however some of us can look at the huge picture see the science

What science have you presented? All I've seen is conjecture.

>>>and also see things that still have question marks...

I agree- but hypothesis's need evidence to back them up.

>>>As for you, you have come to a conclusion, and decides that is what fits the big picture..

Because the evidence supports the conclusion- if new evidence arrives, we certainly can re-evalutate the conclusion, but not before.

>>>we just used the word plausible, possible...

And the flaws I find should be making it should be making it less and less plausible- but for some reason, it doesn't- you're not as open-minded as you wish us to believe- if you were, you wouldn't allow any "Why Not?" notion to dictate your conclusions- evidence should dictate conclusions, not sexy ideas.

The speed in which you are willing to believe in a world government is a great contrast to this- you're attracted not to the most plausible, possible, logical or likely conclusion, but the sexiest- the one you find the most appealing.
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 393
view profile
History
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 6:01:19 PM
LOL ohhh twister, watch men in black, and how (sorry that actors name slips my mind) the guy opposit Will Smith, who said if you want to know what is going on cosmically you have to look at magazines like the Enquire.

There actually has been shows on vibrations, movies, LIKE "the last mimsi".

You got it, and only those who really want to hear and see, will know what is being talked about, the rest will say it is silly fantasy, and that is fine.

Tom Hanks is releasing another "codes" type of movie as well.

Ever watch this cheap budget movie from the early 80's called "they exist" or something like that?

These aliens were taking over the world, but nobody could see it because they set up a mind block. This guy got to noticing a church that was trying to get the message out, and the aliens could be seen with these sun glasses.

Cheesy movie, but it did get a person thinking.

No matter the case, information IS out there, but it depends if people really want to hear the message. For those who don't they pose no threat, and can easily be inslaved into what ever is demanded out of them...

After all it wouldn't be a major drastic move, subtle, like it has been the last 8 or 20 yrs...

That is until there is no way of turning back from the reality of the situation.

vvvvRhino it wasn't a quote of INFORMATION, but rather an observation that was a FUNNY statement...Glad you could find humor in it...VVVVV
 desertrhino
Joined: 11/30/2007
Msg: 394
view profile
History
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 6:18:12 PM
I love it when I'm in a discussion with people who get their inspiration from cheesy, low-budget Hollywood movies. Especially when they quote Men In Black as a source material on extra-terrestrials.


 Jiperly
Joined: 8/30/2006
Msg: 395
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 7:11:47 PM
>>>No matter the case, information IS out there, but it depends if people really want to hear the message.

Ah, one of those rare situations- people who need evidence for their beliefs can not have it, and must act on faith alone to understand it- people who need no evidence for their beliefs can have the evidence overwhelmingly, since the evidence is solely based on faith.

Basically, the only way to believe it is to have believed it prior to being exposed to any evidence supporting it- You must have faith, and without faith, it doesn't work- because faith is really all you've got.

Once again, you're treating extraterrestial life like a religion.
 nexthyme
Joined: 9/12/2007
Msg: 396
view profile
History
Humans created by Aliens: Plausible theory?
Posted: 3/2/2009 7:28:56 PM
Jib, once again you can decide what others think, but that doesn't mean it is true.

It took PROOF of something out there that didn't make sense to want to learn more. You discount other peoples proof, and that is YOUR choice. However that doesn't mean others aren't willing to think of the possible, and plausible.

WHICH I have repeatedly stated, and you have repeatedly went in to basic insult mode and saying I am stating things as a fact... I have said I don't know the answer, and am willing to believe there is MORE than one.

Belief and faith are two different things. If I personally treated et's as a religion, it would mean I would be worshiping them, which is NOT the case. If I am open to the idea they are other there, and believe it is plausible/possible that they have interacted with humans, which is based on my personal experience, and that which I have seen.

If that is a religion to you, then I need to start passing a plate around and asking for money to support my faith...

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