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 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 52
Paying child support for kids that are not yoursPage 2 of 30    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30)

You know... That's another thing...
In Canada, not being the Bio father is not a reason to not be nailed with support...
But I think if a guy opts for vasectomy... he should have a few more rights when it comes to support... afterall, getting snipped is a definate "I don't want kids" statement... sort of anything produced after the requisite testing and possible previous pregnancy phase ie 1 year post vasectomy results being certified as a successful vasectomy... and before any considered reversal of such.... should be exempt from support requirements..


I had my vasectomy years ago.... I'm just a recreational vehicle now.

I think the purpose of a vasectomy is to prevent further births. If I was to decide to get involved with a mom and we lived together for a while, I think there may be a case for support - depending on circumstances.

If someone knowingly accepts the role as an adoptive father I think he's responsible for some sort of child support. What I don't like about Ontario laws is that the adopting father has no rights/say over the children.... that's kinda exposing exactly what men are used for.
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 56
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History
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/6/2009 12:09:47 PM
^^^^Wow, just wow. Since you say neither party should be ruined financially, I guess the answer is to give the kids to the state so that the custodial parent, whether male or female, is not ruined by trying to support a family alone. This IS how it was for hundreds of years until recently. Women were stuck with the kids and if dad was not honorable, how they fared in life was usually not good because of the earning potential of women in general.


well considering that we can't rely on individuals to always do the right thing

Child support exists because of the thousands of people that deserted their children, male and female.

Friend of mine married someone who said she didn't know who the fathers of her children were. She now sees it as a revenue stream (they are all over 18) and is currently in the process of suing the fathers for child support. She lied to all three of them and to me, that is just as bad as holding someone you know is not the father responsible because they have lost all these years if their bio dad was the type to be involved beyond financial support.
 SweetnessInFlorida
Joined: 6/26/2008
Msg: 58
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/6/2009 11:24:29 PM
Ya know, last time i was at the drugstore picking up some meds after being sick a a dog and doing an evening in the ER, i actually saw DNA testing kits being sold right over the county in the pharmacy.
Grab one, swab the inside of your cheek, the inside of your kids cheek, and send it off to the lab is how it works.
It cost about 50 bucks i think. I would pay the 50 if i had doubts.
I was tempted to buy one myself. The kids were picking on me and i was sure for a moment there that they couldnt be mine.

P.S im going to advocate being a little sneaky here to the dads that have limited visits or access, be real low-pro about it, do it on one of your visitation days, or show up at your ex's house, and say "hey look at that bird" and when she goes to look swab that kids cheek real quick. Then "oh my look at the time gotta go!"
Give the kid a lollipop so if she catches you and says what u just put in my kids mouth, you can say "a damn lollipop woman, gees, every kids loves a lollipop." I just came over to give my kid a lolliepop. Paranoid much?
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 60
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History
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/7/2009 12:57:53 PM
You also say financially ruining either parent, I know many custodial parents over the last 30 years that have basically struggled until they were old to raise the kids and then play catch up for having to do so without a dime from the X. There was a lady down my block, supported four kids alone, never stopped her X from seeing them although he rarely if ever contributed to their support. How is she not financially ruined by that? Like she would not have more to show for her life if the other parent had helped her to raise their children?

I my case, with the man for 14 years, asked repeatedly to go to counseling when w discovered that he was bioplar which meant constant emotional and verbal abuse. So, in your opinion, since he earns three times what I do, I should go live with my mother so that my children and I can be emotionally abused by her while my X is able to live in quite good style on 90K a year? And yannow, the only reason he is able to earn that and be a dad is because I have always been the one taking care of the kids and doing everything for them whether he lived in the home with them or not.

My X isn't held to the same standard I am, he takes care of one person, himself. I care for myself and my three children. I have no one to take my kids to school, to doctor and dentist appointments, to the sports practices and voice lessons. I have no one to sit in for me and pretend to be interested in my childrens' lives because I am doing it myself, he doesn't. He shows up to play dad when he chooses. Given that I think actually being expected to support his children is really only fair relative to the portion of my income that supports them versus what supports him and the amount of time I spend raising his children while he does whatever he wants.

Regardless of how he acts, I would never limit his time with the kids if anything, we fight because he uses his job as an excuse NOT to spend time with him because my experience is, if he cares about something and wants to do it, he can figure out a way to juggle his schedule, not so much for his kids.

My stepson left home 11 years ago. His dad and I split over 4 years ago. He never sees or talks to his dad but he and his children see me and my kids. Parenting is not tied to biology nor does it stop when a relationship ends.
 Tealwood
Joined: 12/16/2008
Msg: 66
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:05:28 PM

and he pays child support, but since I'm self-sufficient without it, it goes into a college fund.


So he pays...and you do what? Since i would imagine it is required that both keep a home suitable for your children and both have to have items that are suitable for the children to use..and both would then be paying for the mortgage and heating and food?

But Lonestar...you perhaps are unique. We have had mothers on here complaining about losing the cs when the child reaches 18 and perhaps has not yet moved out as they have not found themselves...and other mothers who without an education are unable to find work or middle 30's mothers who play at getting degree's while showing little to no interest in actually being self sufficient.


If I could suggest Lonestar, some of those woman make you and other self sufficient woman look bad. They easily maintain the single mother stereotype?
 barbee1970
Joined: 12/29/2008
Msg: 69
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/8/2009 3:51:08 PM
I would say get a DNA test. I didn't think men had to pay child support for someone else's kids. The courts should do the test and go after the REAL father.
 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 72
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/9/2009 1:11:00 PM

The courts are not concerned with the actual father. They just want a man with a fat wallet. It is not possible to stop paying child support just because DNA says a man is not the biological father. The courts have an unlimited number of excuses for not eliminating child support.

As soon as the upcoming depression hits full force, millions of men will be jailed because they lost their jobs and cannot pay the court ordered child support. The courts never reduce child support even when men become disabled or unemployed. However, this will not really be benefiting the custodial mothers because, if men don't have the money, they cannot pay


^^^ I must agree with most of what you said. ALthough, being in jail is counter productive in helping a man gain an income, isn't it?

As another poster stated, women are not made to be accountable for lying about paternity. On the other hand, the courts seem to make anyone who becomes involved with a mother more accountable than the mother, in a financial sense. Women's groups has pushed the courts to consider the mother first - using children's rights as political pawns - and this has created an awful affect.

If a mother lies about paternity yet feels the "psuedo" father should be held more accountable than the biological father, many women should expect to get used, played and dumped more often than ever witnessed in the past.

It's a sad state of affairs when women can "choose" who they want to label as "Father".
 Tealwood
Joined: 12/16/2008
Msg: 73
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/10/2009 1:50:30 PM
http://cnews.canoe.ca:80/CNEWS/Canada/2009/02/10/8332701-sun.html



I wonder when his gf will be asking for cs for her children and perhaps even spousal?



'Squatter' forces man out of home

No-contact order with girlfriend keeps man out of his own house

By TONY BLAIS, SUN MEDIA, The Edmonton Sun

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2009/02/10/8332701-sun.html



EDMONTON -- In a bizarre case before the courts, an Edmonton man has been forbidden from going to his own home while his girlfriend - whom he has told to get out - is still living there. Todd Shandro, 36, went before a judge yesterday to try to resolve the situation, but he was told there were jurisdictional issues and he has to take the matter to civil court.



"It's very sick what is happening here," said a frustrated Shandro. "I am the sole owner of the house. The mortgage and title are in my name and she is essentially a squatter. "It's ridiculous. The system doesn't seem to be working here and she is bending the law to her own advantage."



NO OVERLAP

The problem appears to be there is no overlap between civil matters such as land titles and home ownership and criminal matters where no-contact orders are issued. Court heard yesterday that Shandro is charged with two counts of assault, one against the ex-girlfriend and one against her mother.



After his arrest, a justice of the peace released Shandro on $500 bail and issued a no-contact order barring him from going within five blocks of his home near 102 Street and 113 Avenue. The JP also ordered that Shandro could revisit the residence issue by bringing his ownership documents to court.



However, Shandro has twice appeared before a judge to amend the bail conditions, with both a lawyer and the documents showing he owns the home, but to no avail. And the same thing happened again yesterday. "All we want is to amend the bail conditions so I can live in my own home," said Shandro.

Court heard Shandro and his ex had been dating for more than a year when he invited her to move in to the home on a "trial" basis approximately eight months ago.



In October, Shandro realized he wanted to end the relationship with his girlfriend and asked her to leave, said defence lawyer Chady Moustarah. "She said 'no, I'm not leaving', " said Moustarah, adding Shandro repeatedly tried to get her to leave.



On Dec. 5 he came home from work and found both his ex and her mother there and asked them both to leave. When they refused, he went to a pub and had a couple of drinks, said Moustarah.



ALLEGED ASSAULT

He returned and again asked them to go and the mother told him to go to the bedroom and lie down. He again left, but quickly returned and demanded they leave, which is when the assault allegedly happened, said Moustarah.



He told the judge the ex-girlfriend says she is fearful of Shandro, but questioned why she is then staying at his house. "It doesn't make sense," said Moustarah. "Essentially she is a squatter. She is trespassing."



The Crown told court the girlfriend has been paying bills and said she wants to remain in the home because she has two children and they go to a nearby elementary school.

Justice Stephen Hillier ruled the matter should go to civil court and adjourned the bail review to March 2.
 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 74
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/10/2009 3:05:03 PM
I agree that the courts shouldn't force a woman and her children to be homeless because her husband/boyfriend decided to act like an animal. Regardless of who actually owns the home. Had he not assaulted her, he could have charged her with trespassing. Instead, he chose to become violent. She didn't. That's on him in my opinion


^^^ You can't be serious. Women don't need to be assaulted in order to be just as much an ***hole as he is.... her and her mother is proving that.
If you're telling me you beleve a woman is allowed to take possession of a man's home /possessions if she is assaulted, I think you're nuts. Apparently, he lost control because they wouldn't leave..... who aggravated the situation?

Too often women drive men past the boiling point and then behave like a victim while stealing his home.


Yet another reason for men to remain single...... unless the woman owns her own house
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 75
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/10/2009 3:34:42 PM

I wonder when his gf will be asking for cs for her children and perhaps even spousal?


Not to mention that since she's paying the bills, she'll be able to claim half of the equity in the house if it's accrued any.... if he's lucky, that is.

 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 77
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/10/2009 4:36:36 PM

My I,

I am replying to a comment about a specific situation and specific circumstances, and no, I'm not kidding. Keep your damn hands off of other humans, don't act like an animal and you'll still have full access to your home and she will have to leave.

I'm sorry, I don't think you can compare her refusing to leave a home where she helped pay the bills, to anyone male or female assaulting another person.

I won't further this discussion with you. You obviously believe there are good reasons to assault women. Adults don't hit, that stopped being acceptable when you were three. How old are you?

I won't debate with clueless unreasonable people


Either I didn't word things correctly or you misread what I said (tried to say).

First off, I have a history of intervening domestic assaults/violence. But that's not what the point is.

My point is, a man's possessions are always susceptible in situations like this.... not so for most women. Assault has no bearing on the case regarding the behaviour of the mother and the girlfriend. From the behaviour they are displaying, they seemed to have an alterior motive. As I said, they provoked him because they refused to leave. Irrespective of his behaviour, that girl had no intentions of leaving. Hence, the mother moved in as well and she refused to leave. The mother has no right to be there except to visit. It makes me wonder how the mother ended up leaving her home to move in with the daughter?

They had no intentions of leaving - even if there was no assault... that's my point. The fact that it's an "allegation" means nothing. Mom and daughter are staying put.

Just because she paid for utilities for 8 months that doesn't make her part owner. I don't suppose she should be living for free, do you?
 dion6
Joined: 5/26/2008
Msg: 79
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History
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/10/2009 9:01:59 PM
Well if you are in though, go right ahead and get the DNA done, am a woman...but some women makes me sick, especially those on the Maury Show, that keep saying ( look at his nose, look at his eyes ) sick...... and most of the time the test turn out to be wrong. Before they go on stage and make a fool out of themselves, they should be 100% sure, cause i would if it was me, besides why can't they use birth control if they have to sleep with more than one man ?
 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 80
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 2/11/2009 7:49:17 AM
Get smart and check out the laws in your area before getting involved with a woman who has children. Then, you'll know what your legal and financial responsibilities are. Many men are very naive and don't find out ahead of time what they are getting into and then blame the woman for coming after them for child support. Find out ahead of time


Is it that men are naive or is it that some of these women are desperate and/or manipulative?

Given the Ontario laws and the attitudes Ontario lawmakers have regarding fathers; especially those who are not biological fathers, I think it's getting more difficult for mothers (with kids at home) to find men willing to take that chance.

Ironically, I think the trend is that men are being more honest about their intentions as opposed to some of the women... especially those women who are so angry, bitter and vocal about "making him pay!!!!"
 jennyrose41
Joined: 1/5/2008
Msg: 81
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/5/2009 12:20:30 PM
RE: msg 50 from Jaxi...

"Good grief, this would be similar to the judicial system trying to rip money away from me in order to pay for my neighbour's children........tsk tsk. "

They already do in the U.S. It's called welfare....
 MsYesterday
Joined: 10/30/2008
Msg: 84
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/8/2009 6:06:29 PM
I know a man who raised 2 children from birth and the kids were NOT told that they were not his.The couple divorced and one of the children got very sick.The father had finally tell the kids the truth about the situation.The kids were upset but mostly to the mother who tried to hide the secret .Both of the children insested in finding the real father.Once the real father was located he had passed away and the kids missed out on a fortune.Something to think about.
Personally I would not keep a man responsible for kids he not create-I would be the most honored if a man was big enough to step in and support them eventhough they were not his.If the relationship ended I would NOT ask a penny for childsupport I would get another job to provide for my children.I would not teach my children to use the law for my benefit.I quess I am saying this since I have supported 2 kids without childsupport and damn proud of it.
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 86
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/8/2009 6:25:52 PM

If he is a halfway decent person, he will want them to continue to be in his life, regardless of what his ex-wife had done in the past.


Yes, but this ^^^ is a very different thing than being legally forced to pay CS for kids that are not his.

 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 87
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/8/2009 7:15:38 PM
The children here are innocent, and they shouldn't be punished because momma can't keep her legs closed.


That's messed up thinking in my opinion. The children are innocent; the (non-biological) father is innocent... both are being punished. Yet, the mother is the only person who benefits from start to finish.

The OP stated:

Years later the man finds out the woman cheated and the kids aren't really his. So he divorces her but she takes him to court for child support. Court rules in her favor and he is stuck with the bill for a very long time.


I don't think any woman who behaves in this manner deserves an ounce of respect from the kids or ex spouse. It also makes me wonder about the biological father and how he would fit into the scenario once he discovered he fathered children?
 MsYesterday
Joined: 10/30/2008
Msg: 88
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/8/2009 7:45:26 PM
Just makes me wonder how many men are out there who have fathered children and do not know anything about it because of the choice that the mother made.After reading all of these replies my thinking has changed-as soon as the baby is born a test should be taken about paternity.What is fair is fair.My heart does go out to these men who STILL pay childsupport for children that are fathered by other men.I quess that you men should do like all these ladies have done over the years............follow the women and their excamples..it is aamazing what a group of women can do if they complain long enough......do the same!Demand equal rights !If I was a man I sure would tell my G/F that if we do create life togeter I would like to get DNA.
I think that we should change as the times change ........where honesty and respect laid at one point is not there anymore.These are the times we live in , can't trust anyone-unfortunately.It is not an issue of one's insecurity anymore -the honest people should wake up!
 bye loosers
Joined: 3/4/2009
Msg: 89
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/9/2009 7:35:28 AM
my brother was ordered to pay 30,000 for a kid that isent even his or had a relationship with.. one day after 22 years of knowing this girl he gets a notice in the mail, his drivers licence has been pulled for back child support.. after find the woman who is now on her oun. they both payed for there d.n.a. test.. and it proved he was not the father.. but the state of nebraska. will not budge. so he paid the 30,000. now he wants to sue the mom for slander,walware fraud. ect. but she a dead beet. and has nothing to take. i feel for the kid not knowing who her dad really is.. its a shame some mom's try to hang it on the guy with the most to loose.. money ,property ect.. the laws need changed.
 MsYesterday
Joined: 10/30/2008
Msg: 90
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/10/2009 3:48:37 AM
Yes, the children should not be punished and I understand that it is not about it eather.A woman should be a woman enough to stand on her 2 feet after it has been discovered that the man who was there wasn't the real father.There is no excuse for this .let's not shift the blame on the innocent children and try to crerate a mess out of it.It is fraud if a woman tries to force a man who DID not father the children to pay for childsupport.Could it be ok for the women to pay if they stayed with a man with children...how about the "mommy figure".Are there any cases as such or is it all about men getting stuck with this kind of stupidity?Anyone?
 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 95
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/11/2009 7:03:41 PM

but i fell making someone pay for a child that is not his is wrong and the court should find the real father and make him pay


The courts have made these kind of women lazy and unaccountable. Remarkably, these women also tell everyone else how to live their life.


there is nothing wrong with asking for a dna test and if she kicks up a stink about it shes beening cheating


I think the best way to go about it is for the father to take the baby for a dna test on his own.... don't let her know what's going on. If she's a cheating ho? Move out without telling her why... just leave. Then, when in court and she's biotching in front of the judge pull the DNA results out.

If he's the father? Burn the results and don't say a thing.
 forester40
Joined: 2/5/2007
Msg: 104
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/14/2009 3:23:43 PM
I have paid a ton of child support over the years for a daughter that may or may not be mine biologicly.I love my daughter very much and she just turned 16. I have not discussed this with the mother, we were married for 18 years. Her mother would just deny deny deny. At the time my ex flaunted her relationship with the other man in front of my daughter and me and broke up our marriage. My daughter knows the other man very well. I feel that my daughter has the right to know who her father really is and I don't know how to approach my daughter and ex with this subject. PLEASE HELP.
 My I
Joined: 1/23/2007
Msg: 106
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/15/2009 7:42:28 AM

the fact is that discouraging this type of predatory, anti social behaviour is as important


^^^ That's a very important concern.

To date, it is more beneficial for a woman to remain silent and screw over the child and the non-biological father. These women have no conscience nor do they have any concern for the "Best interest of the child". Yet, the court implies these women do.

In my opinion, the courts have little, if any, recognition of a child's rights.... when it comes to issues of maternal responsibility and accountability. Apparently, the targeted male (not the father) must be more responsible and accountable than any of the biological parents.

That's something these women should be proud of. (sarcasm)
 barbee1970
Joined: 12/29/2008
Msg: 107
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/15/2009 3:15:35 PM
Get a DNA test, sure. I see alot of kids raising kids are products of affairs and they should not have to pay child support for someone else's kids. The real father should man up and support his kids. It may differ in a case where a man marries a woman who already has kids, who adopts them. Some men like in my sister's case are really nice to do this.
 onreesukr
Joined: 1/16/2008
Msg: 109
Paying child support for kids that are not yours
Posted: 3/15/2009 6:52:45 PM
i was divorced and a step father of a cheating wife and was ordered to pay support even when dna and blood test prooved i was not the father and i lost 3 appeals and would have had to take it to the oregon supreme court for another appeal but it wasnt worth the price of losing again as my lawyer told me we had a 10 percent chance of winning she forged my name on the birth certificate as we started dating when she was pregnant i prooved it was her signature and still lost so good luck now i raise my daughter from another woman for 10 years now on my own and cant seem to get a penny isnt our judicial system great again good luck
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