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Show ALL Forums  > California  > Cap and Trade and Global Warming      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 76
Cap and Trade and Global WarmingPage 4 of 19    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19)
The global warming thing is just statist/Democrats desire to take control of people's lives and throttle business not unlike all authoritarian states via health care, business regs, and gun control.
I'm watching ObaMao this moment huff and puff about Cash for Caulking. Does he realize how desparate looking this is? Does he realize he is president of a country with a $13Trillion economy? I mean it's like the captain of the titanic describing the dinner menu while the boat is sinking.

The worst of this is, as I've cautioned my libtard friends since this clown came on the scene, is it "freezes the marketplace", not unlike when a new breakthrough technology is announced but not released. people quit acting, and go into wait mode. So business's are not hiring or investing because they are not sure of healthcare, cap and tax, and tax policy. We have structural problems then this clown introduces uncertainty?, astonishing, someone needs to send him to night school for economics education.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 77
view profile
History
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 8:34:43 AM

This is complete insanity on a global scale.


President Obama's using this EPA regulation on CO2, and the threat of signing onto a treaty that limits carbon production, as leverage to help his cap=and-trade bill. But it's a hollow threat. Neither an EPA reg nor a treaty gets to first base unless Congress agrees. That's why this vote next year is going to be so important. If most Americans don't want all this stuff, let them say so. All they need to do is go to the polls and vote the right way.
 Gogetter56
Joined: 9/27/2008
Msg: 78
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 8:54:07 AM
Agenda based science is not trustworthy science period. I know, for instance, that ID (Intelligent Design) is agenda based science and that is why so many people have such a huge problem with it. The thing is, from The Theory of Evolution to Global Warming or the highly ambiguos new title Climate Change, the science is no better than the science behind ID. It's all agenda based.
 HeyJenny
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 79
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 8:24:33 PM
I agree withe the host that we have got to do something but this treaty is not the answer.

This video has an interesting take if Obama signs this treaty in Copenhagen: TREASON !!

There is too much pollution and maybe you would admit it under certain circumstances, say your kid who you are suppose to protect has asthma would you dare live next to one of these factories that spew garbage into the air ? How about living next to a rock quarry or the dump? even next to a freeway is unhealthy. No, you don't want to live near it even if you're healthy, do you? Out of sight, out of mind?

Want to take a cruise to see beautiful Alaska or the island of garbage that is about the size of Texas? Let's go fishing , you wouldn't want to be eating it after you saw the lab results.

There's a guy who invented an auto engine that runs on water. he's dead now, they murdered him or this is the logical conclusion since he had everything to live for.

I hate the hatred most of you project on here!! What gives you the right to call someone a libtard? I find your attitudes absolutely disgusting.

What I find sad is I can reuse, recycle and repurpose my entire life and it will not make a dent in the problem. I will still do it and try my best not to contribute to the problem in my own little ways. Here is a question for you as small scale as you may think it is. Do you buy water in those plastic bottles? When it first started I said "Who are going to be the fools to pay for bottled water?" Apparently there are plenty!! I installed a water filter on my refrigerator, it costs about 12 dollars and should get changed out every 6 mths. or longer ,then I fill my reuseable bottles with my clean water, what a concept,ay?

Okay I am ready for the insults!! Throw them at me, I dare you.

Remember December 18th is a huge day for Healthcare Reform and the Global Climate Treaty in Copenhagen. Instead of trying to one up each other on here make sure you protest in a real way. I called the Capitol today and got heard, yay!! Flood them with phonecalls!! Also with a few clicks you can protest from your computer.
 HeyJenny
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 80
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 8:26:07 PM
Whoops, I forgot to copy and paste the video !!! Sorry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7fL6nJ2NWY
 HeyJenny
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 81
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 8:49:07 PM
I found this website thanks to a POFer called asamom.com aka asamom.org
Men don't let the website's name scare you! The following what some of what I found, listen to lauraingraham, just an easy copy and paste and a few minutes of your time! Lets see if we hear about the March they had today on the news or will it just be that Tiger Woods is up his 14th now?

Take Action Tuesday -Take on Congress: Capitol switchboard: 1-877-762-8762

The Senate Healthcare bill HR 3590 is being voted on by Dec. 18th (this week!). On this very day, thousands are marching on Washington to stop this government bulldozing of our healthcare choices.. http://lauraingraham.com/pg/jsp/charts/streamingAudioMaster.jsp?dispid=302&headerDest=L3BnL2pzcC9tZWRpYS9mbGFzaHdlbGNvbWUuanNwP3BpZD03ODcx

If you can’t make it to Washington, call/fax/email your Senator and Senators in key areas whose contact info has been provided in following link: (Thank you to Captain Happy Pants for posting the contact info of key Senators) http://asamom.ning.com/forum/topics/stop-the-health-care-bill-hr

This list of fence sitters from Theconservativemama http://asamom.ning.com/profiles/blogs/universal-health-care-fence

P.S. Although this is off topic,Lieberman is a swing vote and is expected to vote yes Dec.18th for Healthcare Reform, contact his office and say if he votes yes then we vote no for him.
 HeyJenny
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 82
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 9:07:48 PM
Sorry Paul that you are "not too worried" The higher ups love that!! When we are submissive we sometimes get what we deserve (I do say that in the nicest way) Well I for one am worried and will shout it from the rooftops. I tell my friends, my family and post it on the social sites I'm on.

I see people too wrapped up in their busy own little worlds not to care about anything but when their materialism is starting to get affected or when it hits their pocketbook, is it then they start worrying? Start worrying now and get some faith along with it, that may help.

You know when you're not too worried and you haven't set aside some supplies will you be the one knocking on my door asking me to share with you? When our rights get taken away and they tell you you can't buy or sell without a chip will you be worried then? We are a submissive society where things slowly get snuck in and we take it.

Major changes are happening,we can only try to do our part.

"Our greatest failure is our failure to try"
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 83
view profile
History
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 10:27:42 PM

I see people too wrapped up in their busy own little worlds not to care about anything but when their materialism is starting to get affected or when it hits their pocketbook, is it then they start worrying? Start worrying now and get some faith along with it, that may help.


I hope you don't imagine you're the only one around here who's concerned about all this, or who's spoken out about it. You sound as if you think everyone else is complacent about what this administration's doing, or too busy to worry about it. I wonder how you know what people who are total strangers to you have or haven't been doing, or which ones of them need a pep talk.
 HeyJenny
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 84
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/15/2009 11:37:40 PM
Hi Rococco and thank-you for agreeing with me!!

I do know some of my neighbors and out of my neighbors and my friends I can only recall one person who has some supplies stored. Since we live in California we can always say it's in case of an earthquake or some other natural disaster that may occur.

I say people seem to be walking around in comas around here.I tend to get that mid-afternoon coma effect myself although my brain stays pretty intact :) You know it could be all the toxic stuff in their systems that adds to that coma effect lol, seriously .The toxicity started early for most of us from the vaccines to the mercury in our fillings to what we're ingesting.

Have you heard of chemtrails before? Very interesting.

While it's true that we do get some legimate news from Anderson Cooper, etc. Most mainstream news is not geared toward real news but instead it is entertainment news. When I moved from Michigan to California one of the first things that struck me was how celebrity driven the news was here. Tiger Woods affairs are much more interesting than what I heard today that 4 Billion dollars is earmarked for alot of non-important stuff in this struggling economy. Didn't Obama say something about earmarks?

On a another friend based site I'm on I post real current events plus some speculative near future events and my friends say "it's scary" Well, what is happening and what could possibly happen soon is scary. This is where my faith comes in. Those who are aware and have no faith would be more scared I think. Hopefully they will learn and find that faith they need.

I'm thinking of starting a local meetup group, political with current events and a small amount of bible prophecy thrown in. I will not allow extreme political views to disrupt the point of meeting up. I really don't know yet if I'll do this, I need tech help to start it up,etc, we'll see.
 Gogetter56
Joined: 9/27/2008
Msg: 85
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/16/2009 11:29:10 AM
Actually I say let the left ruin the country while they have the majority. That way they will never be able to live it down and the bickering over what is right will cease.
 HeyJenny
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 86
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/16/2009 1:21:18 PM
Rococco, the divide and conquer theory seems to be working quite well wouldn't you say? Instead of dealing with the issues together there is infighting so we don't use our voices as a nation in a constructive way.

I did like what happened yesterday with a protest. Lauraingraham.com

Here's a video of yesterday's protest http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-L7vuqH6W4

I do feel we are losing our liberties and feedoms very much so, this is why December 18th is such a big day with Obama in Copenhagen and the Senate voting on Healthcare Reform.

Not only am I seen as a political enemy to some but my choice of religion is also a problem to others.. As my experience on POF ca. forums is eye opening if I want to be persecuted for my faith all I have to do is make a simple comment on Youtube and watch them come. Now that is some entertainment!!
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 87
view profile
History
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/16/2009 1:42:34 PM
I already got a good sampling of who you are


You're giving all of us a very good idea of who you are. I don't recall anyone calling you a "libtard," or anything else. When you accuse people here of "spewing venom and hate," you lose your credibility. The only one I see being at all venomous is you. You're directly accusing me and jd of something--exclamation marks and all--and yet you don't say, specifically, what you think that is. If you don't like the fact I disagree with certain political views, so be it. I have no idea what you mean about everyone uniting and pulling together, but I'm sure you do.

You appeared on this forum and before long started chiding another poster for making a comment that you apparently thought wasn't vigilant or alarmed enough. We're not all stocking up groceries just yet. You seem to have a very big chip on your shoulder. I don't have anything more to say to you, because I don't want to drag this thread off topic. I don't expect you to be civil, but that's between you and the moderators.
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 88
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 12/16/2009 7:01:09 PM
All of the pro Green efforts can be done buy private enterprise and a better effort toward the planet and take the money out of it. Ask any Climate Change drone what they need the money for and they will look at you like a dear in the head lights.

Oh damn the temperature outside just dropped 2 degrees, I have climate change in my yard.
 sd_matt
Joined: 7/9/2006
Msg: 89
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 1/6/2010 3:49:14 PM
The solutions themselves tell me it is a scam.

All one has to do is offer prize money for the green energy that is cheaper than the competition without any subsidies.

For example; six prizes of two billion each. The first six companies that make green oil at $2/gallon at the pump in California will each be given cash to start up a factory, pay off investors, ect....

Progress not happening fast enough? Up the prizes to $4 billion each.

Compare this to Cap and Trade.



Here's a link that talks about the bad science behind GW.

http://www.talk-polywell.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=1593&highlight=climate+change

It involves some reading and some stuff that is way over my head but stuff like one piece of data involving only four sensors to measure an entire continent is within my mental grasp. There's more. This link answered it for me. Whether or not Global Warming is really a threat, I don't know, but the science behind it is a total sham.
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 90
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 2/8/2010 11:26:33 AM
Creators of carbon credit scheme cashing in on it

By Judi McLeod

Tuesday, March 13, 2007

There's an elephant in global warming's living room that few in the mainstream media want to talk about: the creators of the carbon credit scheme are the ones cashing in on it.

The two cherub like choirboys singing loudest in the Holier Than Thou Global Warming Cathedral are Maurice Strong and Al Gore.

This duo has done more than anyone else to advance the alarmism of man-made global warming.

With little media monitoring, both Strong and Gore are cashing in on the lucrative cottage industry known as man-made global warming.

http://adognamedkyoto.blogspot.com/Strong is on the board of directors of the Chicago Climate Exchange, Wikipedia-described as "the world's first and North America's only legally binding greenhouse gas emission registry reduction system for emission sources and offset projects in North America and Brazil."

Gore buys his carbon off-sets from himself--the Generation Investment Management LLP, "an independent, private, owner-managed partnership established in 2004 with offices in London and Washington, D.C." of which he is both chairman and founding partner.

To hear the saving-the-earth singsong of this dynamic duo, even the feather light petals of cherry blossoms in Washington leave a bigger carbon footprint.

It's a strange global warming partnership that Strong and Gore have, but it's one that's working.

Strong is the silent partner, a man whose name often draws a blank in the Washington****ail circuit. Even though a former Secretary General of the 1992 United Nations Conference on Environment and Development (the much hyped Rio Earth Summit) and Under-Secretary General of the United Nations in the days of a beleaguered Kofi Annan, the Canadian born Strong is little known in the Unites States. That's because he spends most of his time in China where he works to make the communist country the world's next superpower. The nondescript Strong, nonetheless is big cheese in the world of climate change, and is one of the main architects of the coming-your-way-soon Kyoto Protocol.

Gore is the glitzy, media approved front man in the partnership, the flashing neon lights on the global stage warning the masses of the end of Earth, as we know it, and Hollywood's poster boy for greening the silver screen.

The skeptics of man-made global warming believe that Gore and Strong have made climate change "the new religion". Climate change is not the first religion both parties have tried to make stick. Along with former Soviet Union leader Mikhail Gorbachev, Strong, currently president of the Earth Council, has been boasting of replacing the Ten Commandments with the Earth Charter, a golden rule guide for how the masses should treat the environment.

Gore, who has given sermons at the United Nations sponsored Cathedral of St. John the Divine Church in New York City, is a promoter of the religion known as Gaia.

The two environmental gurus also share a belief in radical Malthusian population reduction. According to them, too many people, particularly in the U.S. are polluting the planet, emitting excessive Freon through their refrigerators and jacking up the air conditioning.

But the conduct of Al Gore and Maurice Strong in the capitalist world is one for the books. It's a side of them that may have remained unknown had it not been for the investigative talent of the Executive Intelligence Review (EIR).

The tawdry tale of the top two global warming gurus in the business world goes all the way back to Earth Day, April 17, 1995 when the future author of An Inconvenient Truth traveled to Fall River, Massachusetts, to deliver a green sermon at the headquarters of Molten Metal Technology Inc. (MMTI). MMTI was a firm that proclaimed to have invented a process for recycling metals from waste.Gore praised the Molten Metal firm as a pioneer in the kind of innovative technology that can save the environment, and make money for investors at the same time.

"Gore left a few facts out of his speech that day. First, the firm was run by Strong and a group of Gore intimates, including Peter Knight, the firm's registered lobbyist, and Gore's former top Senate aide," wrote EIR.

"Second, the company had received more than $25 million in U.S. Department of energy (DOE) research and development grants, but had failed to prove that the technology worked on a commercial scale. The company would go on to receive another $8 million in federal taxpayers' cash, at that point, its only source of revenue.

"With Al Gore's Earth Day as a Wall Street calling card, Molten Metal's stock value soared to $35 a share, a range it maintained through October 1996. But along the way, DOE scientists had balked at further funding. When, in March 1996, corporate officers concluded that the federal cash cow was about to run dry, they took action: Between that date and October 1996, seven corporate officers--including Maurice Strong--sold off $15.3 million in personal shares in the company, at top market value. On Oct. 20, 1996--a Sunday--the company issued a press release, announcing for the first time, that DOE funding would be vastly scaled back, and reported the bad news on a conference call with stockbrokers.

"On Monday, the stock plunged by 49%, soon landing at $5 a share.By early 1997, furious stockholders had filed a class action suit against the company and its directors. Ironically, one of the class action lawyers had tangled with Maurice Strong in another insider trading case, involving a Swiss company called AZL Resources, chaired by Strong, who was also a lead shareholder. The AZL case closely mirrored Molten Metal, and in the end, Strong and the other AZL partners agreed to pay $5 million to dodge a jury verdict, when eyewitness evidence surfaced of Strong's role in scamming the value of the company stock up into the stratosphere, before selling it off.

In 1997, Strong went on to accept from Tongsun Park, the Korean man found guilty of illegally acting as an Iraqi agent, $1 million from Saddam Hussein, which was invested in Cordex Petroleum Inc., a company he owned with his son, Fred.

In that year, Gore, still U.S. vice president, was making news for "taking the initiative in creating the Internet."

The leaders of the man-made global warming movement, you might say, get around.

Meanwhile Jumbo's still in global warming's living room, but the duo with the tiniest carbon footprints on earth continue to just tiptoe past him.
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 91
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 2/10/2010 6:16:18 PM
Starry there is yet a third test re: climate change that is useful...it is not entirely clear it is a negative, that is the Earth warming. In fact most of the golden ages in history were accompanied by warmer than average temps (the period 900 AD to 1350 AD were very, very warm periods in Europe that resulted in population growth, breakthroughs in art, politics, wealth, science, etc.) whereas the dark Ages that followed were in an abnormally cold period (Maunder Minimum til 18th century)

I guess there is also a 4th test....if you did everything you knew how to do (assuming anthropogenic global warming) that you could move the dial
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 92
Cap and Trade and Global Warming
Posted: 2/13/2010 12:48:03 PM
Climate change and all the baggage it brings along is simply a secular religion/rationale for socialists. Someone recently called them watermelons, green on the outside, red on the inside. You can see lefties daily trying to deal themselves into play, being utterly useless and incompetent in a sane world.
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 93
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/14/2010 4:11:52 PM
So you lib's and true believers were/are happy to spend $trillions of dollars on investements and undoing the greatest economic system the world is ever know for that fat dumbell Al Gore and his bad of thieves. Fortunately you have some adults around tocall it a hoax.

Climategate U-turn as scientist at centre of row admits: There has been no global warming since 1995
By Jonathan Petre
Last updated at 5:12 PM on 14th February 2010
Comments (476) Add to My Stories
Data for vital 'hockey stick graph' has gone missing
There has been no global warming since 1995
Warming periods have happened before - but NOT due to man-made changes
Data: Professor Phil Jones admitted his record keeping is 'not as good as it should be'
The academic at the centre of the ‘Climategate’ affair, whose raw data is crucial to the theory of climate change, has admitted that he has trouble ‘keeping track’ of the information.
Colleagues say that the reason Professor Phil Jones has refused Freedom of Information requests is that he may have actually lost the relevant papers.
Professor Jones told the BBC yesterday there was truth in the observations of colleagues that he lacked organisational skills, that his office was swamped with piles of paper and that his record keeping is ‘not as good as it should be’.
The data is crucial to the famous ‘hockey stick graph’ used by climate change advocates to support the theory.

Professor Jones also conceded the possibility that the world was warmer in medieval times than now – suggesting global warming may not be a man-made phenomenon.
And he said that for the past 15 years there has been no ‘statistically significant’ warming.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1250872/Climategate-U-turn-Astonishment-scientist-centre-global-warming-email-row-admits-data-organised.html#ixzz0fYh0anZM
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 94
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/16/2010 5:17:00 AM
Blossoming I am not trusting journalists, you are (were). I've read every article on the topic (of climate) I've been able to get my hands on since 1970's when the threat was a new ice age. I've watched the IPCC publish temperature charts that showed extraordinary temperature spikes (the medeval warm period, the Maunder Minimum) only to "disappear" these inconvenient facts in the next publication. I've watched Al Gore avoid speaking with honest climate scientists, watched Nancy Pelosi call people who did not agree with the "settled science ' called flat Earthers and heap other scorn.

I use journalists accounts from MSM because it's what got most of you true believers to this place.
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 95
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/16/2010 7:45:33 AM
MSM is mainstream media, I shall not comment on other.
 fzrhusker
Joined: 10/8/2005
Msg: 96
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/23/2010 11:21:21 AM
Well if you have not seen this Orwell would be amazed at what is coming. They control everything.


http://www.planetaryskin.org/resources/videos
 GolfCoast
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 97
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/23/2010 1:46:47 PM
Fzr that is an amazing video, and pure shakedown totalitarianism to the core. It sounds like one of my freshly minted MBA's has swallowed a thesaurus and wrote the script.

Being in the field of information management, and decision science I am somewhat familiar with the obstacles to doing the chore in a real world sense. For example a $50M factory generates about 200,000 pieces of data which from this mountain of minutia management attempts to map a course. The ability to do this is extremely limited due to several problems from collection through analysis, presentation, outliers, relationships, and outliers.

It is of course at the root why planned economies don't work, leaving aside for the moment the gaming of the system and unfavorable human motivators

I half expected Al Gore to step out in the final frame but he is probably keeping a low profile since Senator Imhofe may have his lying thieving self dragged before Congress to explain his role in this global warming hoax.
 AceOfSpace
Joined: 5/28/2007
Msg: 98
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/23/2010 5:13:34 PM
Invest!

We still have to fuel the cells, and there isn't enough capacity to generate biogas for the entire grid. However, every calorie saved through more efficient conversion from fuel to electricity buys us more time to engineer a soft landing from peak oil.

We've still got a lot of work to do to dial in our systems. Every dime we invest in improved efficiency now will be thoroughly repaid and then some through the costs we will save as oil gets progressively more expensive.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 99
view profile
History
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/23/2010 8:34:58 PM
I believe fuel cells are being developed that use hydrogen. If it ever becomes practical to use the sun to hydrolize water and to store the hydrogen, we'll have a fuel source that would never run out. Or, it might be possible to use the energy from nuclear fission to get the hydrogen from water.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 100
view profile
History
it seems to be rapidly unravelling...this secular religion
Posted: 2/24/2010 12:45:17 AM
If the environmentalists didn't try to regulate every thing we do, we could drill here


we are wasting money and a good nuclear site because of environmentalists.


It'll be interesting to see how much longer people tolerate the major federal environmental laws, as they have for about 40 years so far. These laws make this country less productive. The inefficiencies and delays they cause have cost an ungodly amount--in total, probably hundreds of billions or trillions so far--no one knows exactly. And what have we gotten for all that? Studies have shown that only the Clean Air Act has even come close to yielding benefits worth its cost--the others have been even worse money pits.

Still, American voters have seen fit--so far--to keep these legal monstrosities in place. I think the main reason is that like motherhood and apple pie, a clean environment's an easy sell. It sounds so wonderful--except to many blacks, who have traditionally viewed environmentalism as a clever way of excluding them from certain areas. I doubt most people have the vaguest idea of what getting a somewhat cleaner environment costs them. And I'm sure very few realize the economic disruption these laws cause. They'd realize it very keenly if they were ever involved with even one Environmental Impact Report.

You have to create an EIR (which for large developments may run into tens of thousands of pages, complete with diagrams, statistical analysis, maps, etc.) for every "project" you do in California--meaning a parking structure, a new barn for a dairy, an expansion to a motel, a gas station, and almost anything else bigger than a doghouse. For federal projects, an EIS has to be filed. The delay (often years) and uncertainty from all this red tape--and the lawsuits it encourages--make almost everything we buy more expensive, from housing to groceries to cars to furniture to clothing to medical care to education.

JD, you're right that it's making energy more expensive too. It takes so many years to get the required environmental approvals for a petroleum refinery or a conventional electric plant--let alone a nuclear-powered one--that lenders can't predict the result very well. That makes their investment riskier, which causes them to demand a higher interest rate on the money they're loaning.

A number of nuclear electric plants in the U.S. were given up in the 70's and '80's after years of planning--literally stalled to death by environmental groups. The same for new refineries, which became almost impossible to build. Conventional power plants have continued to be built, but it's not easy. That's why the utility companies pay their customers to use more efficient appliances and light bulbs--it's cheaper than to have to build new plants.
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