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 lalby
Joined: 12/5/2005
Msg: 4
Hillsborough - 15th April 1989Page 2 of 5    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5)
I've had to watch unpublished footage and read about all the events that led upto the Hillsborough disaster for some training i had,and all i can say it was a very very sad thing that didnt need to happen if only alot of people had done thier job properly it would never have happened.
I will spare a thought for sure.
 pantsonfire
Joined: 7/19/2006
Msg: 5
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 3/16/2009 9:45:59 AM

Don't buy the Sun. It's printed by Scum.



And that is relevant how exactly???

I remember watching this on the news in utter disbelief....

The police treat every football supporter like scum... My son went to a local derby and when they closed off the train station, he went to ask a policeman how he could get to his train he was threatened with a baton and told to get the fukk out of the way or risk a smacking... My son was eleven!!!

You stop being human when you are at a match and are just cattle, to be herded into and out of the ground as quickly and quietly as possible... No one give a toss if it's done fairly or properly or safely as long as the after match reports look good for the authorities...

No one will ever be brought to justice because it's the system that failed and you can't blame the faceless...
 butter wudnt melt
Joined: 4/12/2008
Msg: 8
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History
Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 3/16/2009 10:22:10 AM
I remember like it was yesterday, two of my uncles were at that match and one was forced to go into pen 3 and nearly lost his life!! He was thought to be dead and was placed in the makeshift morgue where he woke up surrounded my dead bodies!! My family has never been the same since.
My uncle is one of the members of the Justice For Hillsborough Campaign and has spent the last 20 years searching for answers and someone to stand up and take the blame for the events of that day.
I am hoping to be back in the city on the 15th of April so i can pay my respects at Anfield along with the rest of my family.
Did anyone see the interviews in The Observer yesterday?? It brought it all back to me, especially seeing as the front cover of the magazine supplement was a picture of my uncle!!!!!!!!!!
 lalby
Joined: 12/5/2005
Msg: 9
Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 3/16/2009 10:29:10 AM
The police actually asked for the match to be delayed after a road traffic accident which caused a delay in fans arriving ect
They would not delay the match because it was being telivised.
Emergency exits were locked and there wasnt any event stewards "Herding" them into thier designated seats,people were rushing in to the nearest seats also there was alot of counterfit tickets which were not checked properly so all in all far too many people in the wrong place and thats what caused it.

VVYeah sadly that is also true,like i said before lots of people not doing thier jobs properly,or using thier heads there was so many ways it could have been prevented
 pantsonfire
Joined: 7/19/2006
Msg: 12
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 3/16/2009 11:23:08 AM

Your going to have to explain your questioning of this one?

EDIT:
here is why its relevant. It may have been poor taste to just post the line above, but that rag has allot to answer for.

http://www.contrast.org/hillsborough/history/media.shtm


And I was supposed to deduce all that from

Don't buy the Sun. It's printed by Scum.
???

Perhaps a little elucidatory text accompaniment might have been useful... I had forgotten about the inflammatory headlines...

Thank you for your clarification... I still struggle to see how a Tabloid's usual idiotic and sensationalist reportage had any effect on any court cases???

 butter wudnt melt
Joined: 4/12/2008
Msg: 15
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 3/16/2009 2:29:19 PM
Memories only fade quickly for people that were not directly affected by the tragedy.
 BiologicalWarfare
Joined: 4/20/2007
Msg: 38
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/15/2009 7:13:30 AM
RIP

My heart goes out to all those still affected by this tragedy.
 badge73
Joined: 1/17/2009
Msg: 62
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 10/18/2011 6:23:48 AM
i dont understand on why the accusation of a cover up is thrown around?

was the government responsible? no .....

i lot needs looking at the liverpool fans behavior, why would they try and gain entry into a ground with out tickets? why were they forcing themselves in?

the questions should be asked about the fans who turned up without tickets conduct, but guess what its far easier to blame others .......

its just sad how those that died most likely had tickets and suffered with their lives.

edit vvvv your missing the point, did the fans turn up with out tickets and gain entry? its either a yes or no answer .......
 stonecastle
Joined: 2/14/2007
Msg: 65
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 10/18/2011 10:19:59 AM
I remember it well. As I was 22 at the time. The main cause of the tragedy was that there were no side gate in the pens, so that when the crowd of Liverpool fans went into most of them went into the central pen and could not move to the sides to make room for others coming in as there were side fences with no gates in. It could all have been completely avoided if the fencing had been designed better.
 Pete2205
Joined: 3/18/2011
Msg: 68
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 10/18/2011 3:14:01 PM
I took my daughter to Boundary Park that day to watch her first Oldham ''Home'' game against Sunderland. A round trip of 500 miles. I recall the news filtering through on radio sets around the ground. I remember the second half, how quiet the crowd was, you could hear the players voices their was such a forlorn atmosphere as news of deaths went around the ground.

People leaving the ground, 2-2 it finished but it didn't matter, Sunderland fans mixed with Oldham fans in the street outside the game didn't matter. My daughter was old enough to understand yet couldn't grasp the enormity of what we were hearing. It was going to be a long drive back to the Isle of Wight - Instead of heading down the M6 we carried on along the M62 and made our way to Anfield.

It was late when we arrived and there were many at the ground just milling around, tears, a sense of despair - I spotted not just Liverpool shirts but Everton, Tranmere, Preston and a few others. Already flowers were being laid and my daughter made the first move and placed her ''Oldham Ted'' at the base of a gate where many scarves were already tied. I took my Oldham one and added it to the tributes.

I dont know why I felt I needed to drive to Anfield - Oldham hadn't played Liverpool in years bar the odd cup match, perhaps it was looking at my daughter and realising it could have been my child that died that day - There had been several occasions when we had been to games where we were packed into stands with a fences holding us in like animals. Selfish as it may seem I looked around the people milling about wondering how many felt the same as me, that those bloody fences were responsible for the tragedy.

If people had been able to access the pitch easily so many deaths could have been avoided - So much loss of life and why? Because society viewed every football fan as a hooligan, a thug and therefore had to be caged.

After about an hour or so we made our way back to the car, my daughter slept most of the way but we stopped at a service station and met several fans from various clubs already making the journey North to pay their respects.

To be honest I dont think anyone blamed anyone that very day for what happened apart from the bloody fences. At least in conversation it never came up. No one blamed the police, the consumption of alcohol or the breaking down of gates. We were just all devastated and trust me Liverpool fans the tears were shed by people up and down this country by fans of every club. never in all my years as a football fan have I met so many fans of so many clubs united in grief.

We were just all at one with Liverpool fans, we were parents, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, grandparents all united in our grief for the loss of so many people. Fellow football fans who loved the game who had just gone out that day as usual to watch our team play be they big teams or small teams we loved our clubs and the banter with our friends, the ritual of getting ready, putting on our replica shirts and scarves, stopping for a pie or a pint.

Even when we caught the ferry at around midnight back to the Isle of Wight there were fans of various teams who had been playing up North. We were not the only ones who had made the detour to Anfield we sat with Brighton fans, Derby fans, Ipswich and Man City fans all who had made long treks with mates, kids, girlfriends to follow their teams. Normally we would have chatted about the way the various games went but of course we didnt... It was very much a case of ''That could so easily have been us''

Zeegary this is really the wrong thread for you to be debating who or what was responsible for the death of 96 football fans who left their families to go and watch the team they loved and never went home. This thread is not in my eyes a debate about what went wrong that day. It is a thread where football fans should just pause and reflect about that day and perhaps stand once again with the fans of Liverpool FC and remember with respect that what happened will affect those families forever.

RIP the 96 and while the pain will never go away for those that they left behind I am sure all true followers of the wonderful game hope that, whatever the result of the enquiries and the report that follows you find peace in whatever way you can


 badge73
Joined: 1/17/2009
Msg: 73
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 10/19/2011 11:29:23 AM

did the fans turn up with out tickets and gain entry? its either a yes or no answer .......


for some reason a few are dodging the question, carnt think why? .....

you would of thought all concerned would of learned from the heysel stadium trouble as highlighted by previous poster and for more reading

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heysel_Stadium_disaster

as someone who attended many games in the 80s and seen the troubles will admit hillsborough was a disaster waiting to happen, as spent many a saturday afternoon swaying in the back of the holte end, you do not have a choice on what you can do as if you go under ..... then basically trampled on, plus worse after half time as used to see floods of piss going around your feet.
 Tayfire
Joined: 2/29/2008
Msg: 82
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 10/20/2011 10:40:35 AM
Yes we all have simpathy's for all football fas who have died in disasters even the 1 not mentioned here ibrox 71. I read somewhere at Hillsboorough that when the first fire crew arrived in the confusion the Station Officer (Watch Manager) was told by a policeman "Are you needed"? The fire service do have cutting gear which would help cut away barriers.
 xxmistyxx
Joined: 6/18/2009
Msg: 88
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/26/2016 3:59:23 AM
R.I.P 96 liverpool fans..For their families a day (26 April 20016) they thought would never come but it has and they have had confirmed what they have always known, the truth and so does the whole world. The fans were innocent on that day.
 duracell_bunny_one
Joined: 1/21/2015
Msg: 89
Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/26/2016 10:49:38 AM
As no-one else seems inclined to come in - I was 43 at the time, so remember it well.
It was totally obvious that the fans were never to blame for what had gone wrong.
Them wots upstairs are very good at ar*e covering...nice to see it come unstuck
(for once)
I don't know where we go from here -
The Great & the Good are already doing the 'lessons have been learned,
lines have been drawn' bollox......

It'll be even better when they can pull your mobile phone records
and (probably) delete them - think it won't happen????

 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 90
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/26/2016 12:07:29 PM
Aye hopefully now we can see some prosecutions. South yorkshire polis seem to be corrupt as hell.
The miners strike, hillsborough and rotherham. Thuggery and corruption seem to follow them around.

I watched the polis wummin on the nights news who said she was bullied into changing her statement. Its been a damn disgrace. Any polis who took part in the cover up should be jailed or at the very least lose all the pension rights.

Again though as the bunnster said the ranks at the top will sacrifice a couple of dafties and accept no blame.

It was disgraceful the way the fans were blamed and treated by politicians and press alike.

But i hope the families feel a wee bit better tonight.
 duracell_bunny_one
Joined: 1/21/2015
Msg: 91
Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/26/2016 1:15:53 PM
.....and once again, the majik word Rotherham rears its head........

 vlad dracul
Joined: 4/30/2009
Msg: 92
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/26/2016 10:47:00 PM
".....and once again, the majik word Rotherham rears its head........"

And why shouldn't rotherham get mentioned? This is the same polis who battered miners stupid, who then blamed liverpool fans for hillsborough and subsequently hid evidence and changed statements and then done the same in rotherham.

It's relevant. The same force who can lie about covering up child abuse are well capable of covering up their blame for the 96 deaths.

So I'm no exactly sure of your point. No everyone who reads this are aware that south yorkshire polis were involved in orgreave, hillsborough and rotherham.

And funnily enough how many polis have appeared in court for ANY of those?
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 93
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/27/2016 2:47:34 AM
I don't think it is that simple Vlad. The miners strike was not supported by the vast majority of the population, people were fed up of strikes and being held to ransom by the unions. Similarly with Hillsborough. The British had an awful reputation for football hooliganism in the UK and Europe so when Hillsborough occurred the population was all to ready to believe the fans were at fault.

I note the the Sun and the Times didn't have Hillsborough on their front pages. So sad.

Where to now though. Is prosecuting anyone at this stage going to achieve anything especially with the chances of a conviction by a jury being extremely low.
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 95
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/28/2016 4:11:52 AM
You weren't there then? I remember being stuck about 30 miles from home having to stay in a pub near where I was working because I didn't have enough petrol to get home and back again - the tanker drivers were on strike. The roads were empty due to lack of petrol and the fact they were covered in snow - Liverpool council workers were on strike and no snow clearing. When I did finally get home for the weekend I remember my uncle trying to get back home to the USA calling the airline asking for help to get to the airport. He finally lost it when he was told the train drivers were going on strike (remember there was no petrol). "How can I get to the airport then, ****ing Pony Express". That was about 1978-9 I think.


Thatcher was elected because of all these strikes. To break union power. We were fed up of Scargill whilst maybe having some sympathy for the miners, Remember, half of the miners were not on strike, part of a different union and a lot of those on strike were forced to by other miners.


Yes, the police did behave badly. And yes they were probably under orders to do so. But there wasn't a lot of sympathy from the general public.


All accidents have a series of events which when they all line up, in hindsight, if just one of them could have been stopped, the accident would not have happened.


The previous match commander was relieved it seems because one of his junior officers had committed some sort of prank which the Chief Constable was not amused about. It seems he was a stickler for discipline running the Constabulary more on Army lines. The new commander didn't take any advice from the previous chap nor from the experienced officers on duty that day. The match could have been held up but wasn't. It probably would have been if the previous commander had been in charge.

There are others! If you read this thread in it's entirety you will find that some grounds refused to install the barriers which added to the crush problems. You'll also discover if you read info coming out of the inquest that the police had previously said the ground was unsafe but no one did anything.

And remember, at that time Liverpool were halfway through a 6 year ban from European football after their fans rioted at Heysell stadium, resulting in the deaths of 39 Juventus supporters. 14 Liverpool fans were found guilty of manslaughter and each sentenced to three years' imprisonment. The tragedy resulted in all English football clubs being placed under an indefinite ban by UEFA from all European competitions (lifted in 1990–91). That may have had some effect on the police officer's and public's mindsets.
 skiptalker
Joined: 11/25/2007
Msg: 98
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 4/30/2016 5:23:08 AM

So you were stuck on a motorway....pity you didn't lose your life on said motorway, you are such a sad specimen of humanity....this is what is wrong with this country...have a NICE life


such a horrible reply were you pissed when you wrote this you need a ban from here
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 100
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 5/21/2016 3:01:12 AM
No I didn't get an apology not did I report it. I must admit to having been taken aback especially as it was wrong as well as particularly nasty. I feel sorry for someone who is so damaged they feel the need to post such stuff.
 Justanotherchap
Joined: 12/4/2013
Msg: 101
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Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 6/28/2017 4:30:19 AM
So here we are a year on and now we see that some people are going to be prosecuted.

David Duckenfield will be prosecuted for manslaughter whilst the ex Chief Constable , Bettison, will be prosecuted for misconduct in a public office (I have no idea how serious an offence that is).

Three others will be prosecuted for intent to pervert the course of justic, Donald Denton the South Yorkshire police chief superintendent who operated in a senior role in that process, his deputy, chief inspector Alan Foster, and the then South Yorkshire police solicitor, Peter Metcalf.

I know the families will want justice but 28 years on, will justice be further served considering the resuts of the inquests and public enquiry?
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 102
Hillsborough - 15th April 1989
Posted: 6/28/2017 5:48:53 AM
As some of you may know, I'm not a football supporter myself, which is probably why I've never posted in this thread.
I think that the way some "football supporters"/hooligans behave is deplorable, and infantile.

But I think what angered people, and poured yet more misery, on those already grieving, was the attempt at "victim-blaming", based on the above premise, and the use of that by the authorities, to cover their own contributory incompetence.
The "closing of ranks" mentality by the police, all the way up to the highest levels, was a disgrace.

This sort of "gang loyalty", where members of an organisation feel obliged to lie on behalf of colleagues is, IMO., what needs to be challenged and changed.
(That may be happening now, with the advent of "whistleblowers?)
IMO., the "loyalty" of such "public servants" should always be only to the public.
I think all public servants, including politicians, should be made to "swear" some sort of "oath" to that effect, and to become immediately liable to criminal prosecutions, if it becomes apparent that they've acted in a way which is contrary to that.

I'll always remember 15-04-89,
because I was at a party that night, and the news was trickling through, which dampened the mood somewhat.

I didn't drink much, even back then, and so was already saying my goodbyes, at about 12 midnight, for the long drive home, from Amen Corner, near Bracknell, back to Oxford, (as I'd already had my two drinks).
When I got a phone call from my wife, (who I'd left at home, because she was heavily pregnant, and was 'due' in a couple of weeks) telling me she was having contractions every six minutes!
I asked her what happened to every half an hour, or every 15 minutes?!
She said she didn't think they were "real".

I got back (about 30 miles) in exactly 27 minutes!,
hitting speeds of 140mph at some points! And 70mph through the centre of Reading!
(Actually hoping to be stopped by the police, just so I could say "my wife's in labour", and get the obligatory "police escort". )
My second son was born at about 1am on 16-4-89.
So for me, it's a happy day, but "tainted" by other people's losses.

Anyhow, I hope there are some "deterrent sentences" handed out, to remind public servants, just to whom their loyalty really belongs.
And what happens when you tell lies.
Jmo
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