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Show ALL Forums  > Health Wellness  > High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?      Home login  
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 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 101
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High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?Page 5 of 11    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11)
.....just another aside.....I remember people talking enthusiastically about hs-CRP as a measure of cardiovascular risk more than 10yrs ago.

We still don't see it in widespread use (at least not in Australia and NZ).

What gives?
 satx78218
Joined: 10/30/2007
Msg: 102
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High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/13/2013 10:29:22 AM
statins have LOTS of side effects, some severe in many people, esp the open-ended, for-the-rest-of-your life statin consumption.

any reduction in systemic inflammation from statins could very well be achieved with diet and exercise.

statins are a 60-year BigPharma wealth-sucking scam. And this week's statin news is BigPharma saying every more people should be letting the wealth be sucked, while saying "don't sweat your cholesterol numbers" LOL
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 103
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Posted: 11/13/2013 10:56:53 AM

statins have LOTS of side effects, some severe in many people, esp the open-ended, for-the-rest-of-your life statin consumption


Most people tolerate them just fine. About the most common side effect is myalgia, no big deal. Part of the reasoning behind taking them at night.


any reduction in systemic inflammation from statins could very well be achieved with diet and exercise.


I was posting it as an interesting observation. You are treating cardiovascular disease, not the cholesterol or hs-CRP.
ie: what statins do to cholesterol or inflammation is irrelevant- you measure the direct relationship between the drug and cardiovascular disease.
 satx78218
Joined: 10/30/2007
Msg: 104
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Posted: 11/13/2013 12:42:03 PM
low or any grade systemic inflammation, esp in arterial walls where the inflammation causes cholesterol/calcium deposits, very probably is direct cause of CVD, so any reduction is a reduction in the cause of CVD.
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 105
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Posted: 11/13/2013 2:06:22 PM

low or any grade systemic inflammation, esp in arterial walls where the inflammation causes cholesterol/calcium deposits, very probably is direct cause of CVD, so any reduction is a reduction in the cause of CVD.


Then you need to understand how it's measured.
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 106
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Posted: 11/13/2013 3:53:57 PM


Then we agree.


It seems we certainly do.



Modify it to what? Some prescriptive diet used to sell books?

I'm not selling a book.



there is also good evidence for low saturated and trans-fat intake in terms of cardiovascular risk.

Who said eat a high saturated fat diet esp if eating other typical American foods like grains and sugars/starches.

I said trans fats are bad and we need saturated fat in moderation for good health along with a low glycemic, low inflammatory lifestyle.



there is reasonable evidence for caloric restriction in animal studies, and on biochemical and physiological markers of aging in people.


This thread is not about aging.
You can eat more food/calories/fuel if they are the right calories/food than going on a processed/starchy/grain laden low calorie diet and be healthier, esp heart health.

If I ate 1500 -1800 calories a day ( way to low for me) of , say a burger /hot dog on a wheat bun/fries/ diet soda and wheat toast or cereal/corn bread ect ect I would get a gut and thunder thighs, have clogged arteries, pain in my joints and be sick with headaches, asthma and other allergies and I can't even imagine going back on all those prescriptions for each ailment.

I take not one Rx for any medical issue. I was on 6 at 41



The most consistent and best evidence for reducing cardiovascular and cancer risk is a diet high in fruit and vegetables.

Who said vegetables and fruits are bad for your heart?

For some I would limit fruit depending on their condition however.

You are forgetting good fats and getting in protein.
Your heart is a muscle and need protein and fat.


I think you are referring to statins

^^^^^^^^
As far as the study I was referring to in that statement yes, but also cholesterol does not cause heart disease or heart attacks and there are studies that show that also.

Inflammation, viral,bacterial infections, stress, smoking ect but not cholesterol




We all are here to learn and we all need to keep an open mind no matter how intelligent some are, many are still just plain ignorant of facts regardless of intelligence.

No one knows everything, no one plan works for everyone for every condition.

But cholesterol does not cause heart attacks.

If you want to reduce it then I suggest starting with natural ways first. Food, fibers, spices/herbs and mineral supplementation as needed as the earth is depleted them from our food sources and water.Esp sulfur
 or_current_resident
Joined: 6/3/2013
Msg: 107
High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/13/2013 4:35:43 PM

But cholesterol does not cause heart attacks.

If you want to reduce it then I suggest starting with natural ways first. Food, fibers, spices/herbs and mineral supplementation as needed as the earth is depleted them from our food sources and water.Esp sulfur


OK........Just wondering, are you writing a book, or just here indirectly advertising the healthy food stores ?

Its like a used car salesperson.....as they are more concerned in selling their self, then selling the product...weird....

ps, take skyr proven advice......he backs what he says........with proven Scientific Knowledge & Medicine....cheers
 statemachine500
Joined: 8/25/2011
Msg: 108
High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/13/2013 5:58:46 PM

low or any grade systemic inflammation, esp in arterial walls where the inflammation causes cholesterol/calcium deposits, very probably is direct cause of CVD, so any reduction is a reduction in the cause of CVD.


This is my understanding.It builds up at those sites,and sometimes restricts or totally blocks off an artery.Or breaks off in a lump and lodges who knows where.

@current_resident.P is not selling a book.Since the early 50's,mass producers of packaged food had one thing in mind,and it wasn't your health.Convenience for you and cash for them.Do you really want to spend your later years on pills?
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 109
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Posted: 11/13/2013 8:42:15 PM

Who said eat a high saturated fat diet esp if eating other typical American foods like grains and sugars/starches.


Who said vegetables and fruits are bad for your heart?


I'm not sure why you keep asking who said what. I never implied that you said anything, nor did does it have any relevance to my generic statement.

The evidence for cardiovascular risk is in a diet high in fruit/vegetables, low in trans and saturated fat. As for aging, it is probably the primary driver of cardiovascular disease, so of course it rates a mention. Blame it on the Hayflick effect.


You are forgetting good fats and getting in protein.


I wasn't implying that you exclude all fat and protein from your diet.


But cholesterol does not cause heart attacks.


It is highly correlated with it...in terms of risk. Now if a cholesterol plaque ruptures or thromboses in a coronary artery, are you saying that is irrelevant to the pathophysiology of a heart attack?
 mitchozie
Joined: 3/11/2009
Msg: 110
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Posted: 11/13/2013 9:01:57 PM
S**t doesn't work, so let's sell more s**t!

http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/12/health/cholesterol-guidelines/
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 111
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Posted: 11/13/2013 9:56:18 PM

S**t doesn't work, so let's sell more s**t!

http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/12/health/cholesterol-guidelines/


That's interesting, and makes sense.

Even though cholesterol has been shown to be highly correlated with developing cardiovascular disease; and statins lower cholesterol, they are two separate variables, as I've mentioned before.

Statins have been shown to reduce heart attacks and strokes in high risk patients. That's a direct treatment effect of statins on cardiovascular risk, regardless of what the cholesterol is.
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 112
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Posted: 11/14/2013 2:16:04 AM
The thread is about high cholesterol

It asks for suggestions and remedies.

Some of us say look first to food, then some remedies.
We have for the most part contributed to what asked and elaborated on what one can try other than drugs.




It is highly correlated with it...in terms of risk
( high cholesterol)

If it has OTHER factors with it, yes.
You saying a low inflammatory diet sans processed foods/sugars dont reduce risk.

Wait, I think you said low inflammatory diets are made up by charlatans.




No doubt made up by charlatans trying to sell the latest diet fad.

^^^^^^^^Whoops ,there it is and you are wrong, not a fad nor made up by charlatans
You dismiss things we can change in most part that are proven.

A simple food intolerance, high sugar/processed diet, allergies, infections can increase inflammation. An allergy or intolerance does not mean you go into a a severe reaction and you have to get to a hospital or need an *epi pen*


.


Now if a cholesterol plaque ruptures or thromboses in a coronary artery, are you saying that is irrelevant to the pathophysiology of a heart attack?

Not at all. But the cholesterol alone does not cause the plaque.
It would attach it self to a scab or other things in the artery wall.



Dr. Dwight Lundell...... A heart surgeon

Thu, 01 Mar 2012

We physicians with all our training, knowledge and authority often acquire a rather large ego that tends to make it difficult to admit we are wrong. So, here it is. I freely admit to being wrong. As a heart surgeon with 25 years experience, having performed over 5,000 open-heart surgeries, today is my day to right the wrong with medical and scientific fact.

I trained for many years with other prominent physicians labelled "opinion makers." Bombarded with scientific literature, continually attending education seminars, we opinion makers insisted heart disease resulted from the simple fact of elevated blood cholesterol.

The only accepted therapy was prescribing medications to lower cholesterol and a diet that severely restricted fat intake. The latter of course we insisted would lower cholesterol and heart disease. Deviations from these recommendations were considered heresy and could quite possibly result in malpractice.

It Is Not Working!

These recommendations are no longer scientifically or morally defensible. The discovery a few years ago that inflammation in the artery wall is the real cause of heart disease is slowly leading to a paradigm shift in how heart disease and other chronic ailments will be treated.

The long-established dietary recommendations have created epidemics of obesity and diabetes, the consequences of which dwarf any historical plague in terms of mortality, human suffering and dire economic consequences.

Despite the fact that 25% of the population takes expensive statin medications and despite the fact we have reduced the fat content of our diets, more Americans will die this year of heart disease than ever before.

Statistics from the American Heart Association show that 75 million Americans currently suffer from heart disease, 20 million have diabetes and 57 million have pre-diabetes. These disorders are affecting younger and younger people in greater numbers every year.

>>>>Simply stated, without inflammation being present in the body, there is no way that cholesterol would accumulate in the wall of the blood vessel and cause heart disease and strokes. Without inflammation, cholesterol would move freely throughout the body as nature intended. It is inflammation that causes cholesterol to become trapped.<<<<<

Inflammation is not complicated -- it is quite simply your body's natural defense to a foreign invader such as a bacteria, toxin or virus. The cycle of inflammation is perfect in how it protects your body from these bacterial and viral invaders. However, if we chronically expose the body to injury by toxins or foods the human body was never designed to process,a condition occurs called chronic inflammation.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That's my point

As far as risks, being chronically sad is a risk for a heart attack.
Having someone slam on brakes in frt of you is a risk for a heart attack.
Having a gun thrown in your face causes a risk of a heart attack.
OODLES of risks.
.
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 113
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Posted: 11/14/2013 2:46:03 AM

Some of us say look first to food, then some remedies.


As an isolated risk factor, that's the general medical recommendation. In someone with at high cardiovascular risk, it doesn't matter what the cholesterol is, they benefit from a statin.


Not at all. But the cholesterol alone does not cause the plaque.


I never said it did. But it's still a cholesterol plaque, and hyperlipidaemia is still correlated to ischaemic heart disease, so you can't say that cholesterol doesn't cause heart attacks. It's built into the pathogenesis of atherosclerosis, even if there are other factors like endothelial inflammation. Or do atheromatous plaques result in inflammation?


A simple food intolerance or allergy, infection can increase inflammation


Yes, but where is the site of inflammation? And is it specific to cardiovascular risk. eg, are coeliac disease sufferers at increased risk of cardiac disease? Remember you're looking at two variables here...you're trying to extrapolate one via the other. If you have any sort of infection, even a simple cold, your inflammatory makers are going to be many orders of magnitude higher than what you'd measure as hs-CRP....you're actually just measuing CRP! So are you at increased cardiovascular risk every time you have a cold?

The inflammatory response is non-specific.
 motown_cowgirl
Joined: 12/22/2011
Msg: 114
High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/14/2013 3:55:08 AM

The inflammatory response is non-specific.

of course it is, because it isn't a bee sting it's blood chemistry.


or just here indirectly advertising the healthy food stores ?

WHAT is 'indirectly advertising healthy food stores'?? is that like indirectly selling statin drugs?

http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/health/blogs/daily-dose/2013/11/12/new-cholesterol-treatment-guidelines-could-double-number-americans-taking-statins/wd2PPKWS21BHyzrt1eLIKO/blog.html

"a lot more people should take statins, but at lower doses". cool.


Its like a used car salesperson.....as they are more concerned in selling their self, then selling the product...weird....

what a weird statement. what are you selling?
 satx78218
Joined: 10/30/2007
Msg: 115
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Posted: 11/14/2013 6:37:01 AM
Skyr, our resident BigPharma shill,

A healthy body produces about 2000 mg of cholesterol/day, so it's absolutely essential, eg, hormones are derived from cholesterol (so statins pushing cholesterol very low may reduce both estrogen and testosterone, which may explain the loss of penile stiffness and libido while on statins (and LOTS of the other BigPharma crap).

What is the body trying to do by laying down plaque on arterial walls? Is there something wrong with the walls that the body is trying to correct or isoate with plaque and calcium deposits?
 satx78218
Joined: 10/30/2007
Msg: 116
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Posted: 11/14/2013 6:42:49 AM
Don’t Give More Patients Statins

This announcement is not a result of a sudden epidemic of heart disease, nor is it based on new data showing the benefits of lower cholesterol. Instead, it is a consequence of simply expanding the definition of who should take the drugs — a decision that will benefit the pharmaceutical industry more than anyone else.

if statins actually offered meaningful protection from our No. 1 killer, heart disease; if they helped people live longer or better; and if they had minimal adverse side effects. However, none of these are the case.

Statins are effective for people with known heart disease. But for people who have less than a 20 percent risk of getting heart disease in the next 10 years, statins not only fail to reduce the risk of death, but also fail even to reduce the risk of serious illness — as shown in a recent BMJ article

http://www.bmj.com/content/347/bmj.f6123

140 people in this risk group would need to be treated with statins in order to prevent a single heart attack or stroke, without any overall reduction in death or serious illness.

18 percent or more of this group would experience side effects, including muscle pain or weakness, decreased cognitive function, increased risk of diabetes (especially for women), cataracts or sexual dysfunction. (aka "well tolerated" LOL )

Perhaps more dangerous, statins provide false reassurances that may discourage patients from taking the steps that actually reduce cardiovascular disease. According to the World Health Organization, 80 percent of cardiovascular disease is caused by smoking, lack of exercise, an unhealthy diet, and other lifestyle factors. Statins give the illusion of protection to many people, who would be much better served, for example, by simply walking an extra 10 minutes per day.

When the last guidelines were issued by the National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute in 2001, they nearly tripled the number of Americans for whom cholesterol-lowering drug therapy was recommended — from 13 million to 36 million. These guidelines were reportedly based strictly on results from clinical trials. But this was contradicted by the data described in the document itself.

even though the guidelines recommended that women between the ages of 45 and 75 at increased risk of heart disease and with relatively high LDL levels take statins, the fine print in the 284-page document admitted, “Clinical trials of LDL lowering generally are lacking for this risk category.” The general lack of evidence for LDL level targets is why they have been dropped from the current guidelines.

The group that wrote the recommendations was not sufficiently free of conflicts of interest; several of the experts on the panel have recent or current financial ties to drug makers. In addition, both the American Heart Association and the American College of Cardiology, while nonprofit entities, are heavily supported by drug companies.

====

John D. Abramson, a lecturer at Harvard Medical School and the author of “Overdosed America: The Broken Promise of American Medicine,” serves as an expert in litigation involving the pharmaceutical industry.

Rita F. Redberg is a cardiologist at the University of California, San Francisco Medical Center and the editor of JAMA Internal Medicine.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/11/14/opinion/dont-give-more-patients-statins.html?from=opinion
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 117
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Posted: 11/14/2013 7:01:07 AM

A healthy body produces about 2000 mg of cholesterol/day, so it's absolutely essential, eg, hormones are derived from cholesterol (so statins pushing cholesterol very low may reduce both estrogen and testosterone, which may explain the loss of penile stiffness and libido while on statins (and LOTS of the other BigPharma crap).


Of course it is, it's in our cell membranes. Potassium is essential too...so let's not bother treating hyperkalaemia. Never mind it could lead to a cardiac arrest.

The level of sophistication of your logic.


This announcement is not a result of a sudden epidemic of heart disease, nor is it based on new data showing the benefits of lower cholesterol. Instead, it is a consequence of simply expanding the definition of who should take the drugs — a decision that will benefit the pharmaceutical industry more than anyone else.


I've already explained this several times. Two different variables. Statin work on high cardiovascular risk patients irrespective of the cholesterol. You're making the same mistake extrapolating via cholesterol. You're not treating a number, you're treating a patient.
 or_current_resident
Joined: 6/3/2013
Msg: 118
High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/14/2013 9:22:22 AM

You're making the same mistake extrapolating via cholesterol. You're not treating a number, you're treating a patient.


Yes, the new guidelines issued by the American Heart Association and the College of Cardiology offer doctors a new formula for estimating a patient's risk, that includes many factors besides a high cholesterol level….
The formula includes age,gender,race,and other factors such as whether someone smokes.
The emphasis is to try to treat case with his or hers more appropriately level of malady.

As the concern on high cholesterol compounds the cases in, obesity ,high blood pressure,diabetes, stroke,and heart disease, the leading killer….

As with statins,despite a small increase risk of muscle problems and accelerating diabetes[ in patients who are already pre diabetic to begin with], statins are remarkable safe drugs, & the benefits outweigh the risk according to doctors…


According to the World Health Organization, 80 percent of cardiovascular disease is caused by smoking, lack of exercise, an unhealthy diet, and other lifestyle factors. Statins give the illusion of protection to many people, who would be much better served, for example, by simply walking an extra 10 minutes per day.


Point taken, but unfortunately, for many it is more then just that…… being it genetic, injury,physical,emotional…the list is long.

I believe in modern Medicine & Science, and healthy lifestyles, and glad for its wonderful success in helping people move beyond the alternative approach [home spun remedies, etc,etc etc] and to live such a fuller life into the 21 century…..
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 119
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Posted: 11/14/2013 10:09:25 AM

Statins are effective for people with known heart disease. But for people who have less than a 20 percent risk of getting heart disease in the next 10 years, statins not only fail to reduce the risk of death, but also fail even to reduce the risk of serious illness — as shown in a recent BMJ article

http://www.bmj.com/content/347/bmj.f6123


That article addresses the Cochrane Review I mentioned earlier. For low risk patients, according to Cochrane review, the NNTs for statins are 67 for those at <5%, and 167 for 5-10% 5yr cardiovascular risk, for ALL-CAUSE-MORTALITY.

There is always going to be some variation on risk scoring systems, so one can quite easily come to a different conclusion based on methodology. The NNTs for low risk patients are pretty high regardless, so even if the conclusion is of a net benefit in a low risk group, it's up to the patient whether they want to take a pill where you have to treat 167 people in order to prevent one death.

Don't confuse that with high risk patients- the benefit of statins are undisputed.


Perhaps more dangerous, statins provide false reassurances that may discourage patients from taking the steps that actually reduce cardiovascular disease. According to the World Health Organization, 80 percent of cardiovascular disease is caused by smoking, lack of exercise, an unhealthy diet, and other lifestyle factors. Statins give the illusion of protection to many people, who would be much better served, for example, by simply walking an extra 10 minutes per day.


A rather patronising view, and makes the assumption people are either misinformed or stupid. People on statins should always be advised to reduce other cardiovascular risk factors.

Turn it around- how many people who exercise daily, eat well and don't smoke are given false reassurance they won't get a heart attack. They can and they do.
 or_current_resident
Joined: 6/3/2013
Msg: 120
High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/14/2013 4:26:39 PM

A rather patronising view, and makes the assumption people are either misinformed or stupid. People on statins should always be advised to reduce other cardiovascular risk factors.

Turn it around- how many people who exercise daily, eat well and don't smoke are given false reassurance they won't get a heart attack. They can and they do.



Bravo Skyr, as your statements are indisputable, yet the alternative health wizards out there think otherwise, and can give no professional proven reason why it isn't nonetheless…….with level 3 proof evidence …. ^^^^^^

As it seems its only matter to their own personal agenda, in bring in more patients indirectly to their business, where they work via this site……or so it seems to me….hummmm

Yet for many of the non believers in Modern Medicine & Science,, for example there is Steve Jobs, remember him, he with all his knowledge, genius,money, decide to go the alternative route to heal his problem………..not……
As he wish on his dying bed, he could go first to the doctors who knew how to treat his illness & not before deciding to go to the wizards in voodoo land first….

Guess what………it don't work now & it won't work latter, unless Modern Medicine & Science after years of research is done first. And not in what some alternative wizards says he or she think they know better then Real Medicine….
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 121
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Posted: 11/15/2013 3:40:19 AM


As it seems its only matter to their own personal agenda, in bring in more patients indirectly to their business, where they work via this site……or so it seems to me….hummmm

^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I've told you before to report those people if thats true.
Can you not find your way to the reports thread?


Yet for many of the non believers in Modern Medicine & Science,, for example there is Steve Jobs, remember him, he with all his knowledge, genius,money, decide to go the alternative route to heal his problem………..not……
As he wish on his dying bed, he could go first to the doctors who knew how to treat his illness & not before deciding to go to the wizards in voodoo land first…


^^^^^Again you have brought this zzzzzzzzzz up. So you think Steve died from high cholesterol or whats you point?

No one here said not to do everything you can to save your life (including western medicine) that has been proven.
The last 2 people ( one a close friend) I know that had pancreatic cancer were told after being opened up they could do nothing but keep them out of pain and had 6 months to live.
My friend still smoked 2 packs a day, ate bar b que with sweet sugary sauce on it, made her funeral arrangements and died in 6 months trying nothing else which was stupid IF she wanted to live .She was given no hope which is a terrible thing to do.

The second did alter lifestyle and lived longer (about a year)

You dont know what physicians told him, but we do know he told his employees he had it surgically removed..Did you forget he dropped LSD quite a lot?

Get the facts straight,*but wait* Steve Jobs was a known illegal drug user and a liar.

Steve Jobs' Pancreatic Cancer: A Timeline
Oct. 6, 2011
By DAN CHILDS and KEVIN DOLAK



Since he revealed in an email from a hospital bed in 2004 that he had a rare form of pancreatic cancer, Apple CEO Steve Jobs' health became a topic of intense interest. The picture that emerged from subsequent news reports was a patchwork of details that introduced many to the idea that one could live for years with a pancreatic tumor.

"With what was reported to be his type of pancreatic cancer, which was a neuroendocrine tumor, seven years [of survival] is not uncommon," said Dr. Baburao Koneru, chief of the Division of Hepatobiliary Surgery at UMDNJ-The University Hospital in Newark, N.J. "It's quite different from the common form of pancreatic cancer."

"These tend to be slow-growing tumors," said Dr. Steven Libutti, director of the Montefiore Einstein Center for Cancer Care in New York.

While>>> much of Jobs' journey through cancer was swathed in secrecy >often speculative<<<. Below is a timeline of media reports on Jobs' health:

August 2004: Jobs, 49, told Apple employees in an email that he had been diagnosed with a cancerous tumor in his pancreas and had undergone a successful operation to remove it.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"I have some personal news that I need to share with you, and I wanted you to hear it directly from me," the email read. "I had a very rare form of pancreatic cancer called an islet cell neuroendocrine tumor, which represents about 1 percent of the total cases of pancreatic cancer diagnosed each year, and can be cured by surgical removal if diagnosed in time (mine was). I will not require any chemotherapy or radiation treatments.''

Bet he did have chemo.He was a known liar an this man did not want to die.

It was later revealed that Jobs had been diagnosed in 2003 with the cancer, but he chose not to reveal this to investors at the time
^^^^^^^^^^^^Liar
The later he told people he had a hormone imbalance that caused his weight loss.
^^^^^^^Yeah

Steve was a liar and an illegal drug user.
Maybe he made bad decisions regarding his health in his LSD (and what else we may not know) illegal drug use..


ANYHOO on cholesterol
Niacin was used for years to lower cholesterol in doses monitored by physicians in dosage and liver enzymes checked often. It works.
Now drug companies use it with other elements to be able to patent it.
They could just use niacin and start a a much lower dose, but no $$ in that.

NIASPAN is an unscored, medium-orange, film-coated tablet for oral administration and is available in three tablet strengths containing 500, 750, and 1000 mg niacin. NIASPAN tablets also contain the inactive ingredients hypromellose, povidone, stearic acid, and polyethylene glycol, and the following coloring agents: FD&C yellow #6/sunset yellow FCF Aluminum Lake, synthetic red and yellow iron oxides, and titanium dioxide.

Ideally you start at around 200 mg of plain old regular niacin then slowly increase by 100 mg at a time if needed.
Many get the results they desire with just 200 mg.

So now that niacin is in a FDA regulated drug its not called quackery or alternative.
Go figure that one out.
 satx78218
Joined: 10/30/2007
Msg: 122
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Posted: 11/15/2013 10:30:47 AM
"Yet for many of the non believers in Modern Medicine & Science,, for example there is Steve Jobs, remember him, he with all his knowledge, genius,money, decide to go the alternative route to heal his problem………..not……
As he wish on his dying bed, he could go first to the doctors who knew how to treat his illness & not before deciding to go to the wizards in voodoo land first…"

If Jobs had been treated with conventional medicine and died

(pancreatic cancer has a 90%+ mortality rate at 5 years WITH CONVENTIONAL MEDICINE),

... nobody would have blamed conventional medicine.

When conventional medicine fails and people try alternatives and they fail, too, ONLY the alternatives get blamed for "failing"

And spare me the sparse anecdotes of people who were "cured" of cancer with conventional medicine.

" About 1,638,910 new cancer cases were expected to be diagnosed in 2012, and in 2012 about 577,190 Americans were projected to die of cancer, more than 1,500 people a day."

http://www.cancer.org/research/cancerfactsstatistics/cancerfactsfigures2012/index
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 123
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Posted: 11/15/2013 2:10:28 PM

If Jobs had been treated with conventional medicine and died (pancreatic cancer has a 90%+ mortality rate at 5 years WITH CONVENTIONAL MEDICINE), ... nobody would have blamed conventional medicine.


You're thinking of pancreatic adenocarcinomas. They have an awful prognosis. Steve Jobs had a neuroendocrine tumour.

The issue was his delayed treatment. Whether it would be fatal had he been treated earlier- no one can answer that now, but it would certainly have improved his prognosis.


And spare me the sparse anecdotes of people who were "cured" of cancer with conventional medicine.

" About 1,638,910 new cancer cases were expected to be diagnosed in 2012, and in 2012 about 577,190 Americans were projected to die of cancer, more than 1,500 people a day."


Another simplistic cut and paste.

Cancer is not one disease, nor is the goal of treatment always curative. Some are imminently curable, others are not. For those that aren't, the goal of treatment is to either extend life, or palliate symptoms.
 or_current_resident
Joined: 6/3/2013
Msg: 124
High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/15/2013 3:14:02 PM

I've told you before to report those people if thats true.
Can you not find your way to the reports thread?


I think you just did….. ^^^^^^^^^^ thank you………
 statemachine500
Joined: 8/25/2011
Msg: 125
High Cholesterol ? Suggestions? Remedies?
Posted: 11/16/2013 2:57:59 AM
P,Youre trying to sell a conspiracy theory,that's it!
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