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Show ALL Forums  > British Columbia  > HST!      Home login  
Joined: 6/14/2007
Msg: 125
HST!Page 6 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)

2. Debate and pass the tax shifts again. No pain for them. Get what they want and blame it all on Gordo three years from now, when he retires rich and well-connected and they come up with a new leader. Especially if the opposition sticks with Carole James.

I'm going to bet on that outcome, personally, and not just because the way you worded it makes it obvious. :P

Although actually... I'm not sure Gordo will retire, nor am I sure he couldn't be elected again. Despite the massive efforts the NDP doubtless will make, I bet by the time of the next election this will mostly be forgotten. The economy will likely have recovered completely by then and the Liberals will take all the credit, as does any ruling party in such circumstances. Then we'll have the same old choice of Crooks vs. Idiots and the Crooks will win again because there's no grossly obvious reason to vote them out, and there's the huge swing vote that reasons you can fight Crooks in court if necessary but the only cure for Idiots is not to elect them.

I would love to see the NDP splinter and fall apart, because then the Liberal/SoCred "coalition" would surely fall apart shortly after and maybe we could get some real new blood in politics around here.
Joined: 10/31/2005
Msg: 126
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Posted: 6/16/2010 3:34:14 PM
Hey Thefishformerlyknowas...
I think you should run for office in the next election because you've done a much better job of explaining the HST here than our Liberal Government has. Is it arrogance on the Liberal's part for not explaining it to BC citizens. With Ontario going with HST, BC really had no choice but to follow suit. I agree that in 3 years time the HST will be working and the economy booming and the people will have forgotten what all the fuss was about.

I personally think that the HST will be good for the province in the long run because I understand how a Value Added Tax works. I think the savings to business will eventually be passed on to the consumer due to market competition and these savings will offset the few additional items that will now be taxed with HST that were previously exempt from PST.

The HST protest is huge but it is purely based on fear and misinformation. I really wonder what Vander Zalm's true movtives are for leading this protest? Is he planning to launch a new political party in BC?
In fact the anti HST petition is a joke because it will be presented to Elections BC, which is in the wrong jurisdiction. The HST is Federal law not BC Provincial law. BC did not enact HST legislation what they did was repeal the existing PST legislation.
All the people who signed the petiton are going to be peeved when the BC Government looks at it and says "sorry, do it again and take it to Ottawa, it's their law, not ours."
Vander Zalm certainlyknows this so why is he doing this charade?

Never a dull moment in BC politics. Let us know when you've filed your candidate's papers Thefishformerlyknowas... you'll have my vote. Ha Ha
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 127
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Posted: 6/17/2010 4:13:58 AM
Beaker49, there is no reason why B.C. "had to follow suit" after Ontario. Quebec and the Atlantic Provinces had HST for over a decade, and it didn't hurt B.C. or Ontario. It DID hurt Quebec (now the poorest province per capita) and the Atlantic Provinces.

I know what a VAT is, and like all regressive taxes it explicitly takes money out of the pockets of middle-class and poor citizens and stuffs it in the pockets of corporations and the rich. Sure it helps business - at everyone else's expense. There has been NO passing on of savings to consumers in Quebec or Atlantic Canada, and the short-term gain of a cash "transition payment" to provinces that agree allows them to survive electorally - but the chickens eventually come home to roost in higher taxes on SOMEONE, and it's never those corporations or rich individuals. Where has this NOT happened?

And HST and GST aren't really VATs anyway, because they apply to the FULL retail price, not at every stage along the chain. With our GST/HST, every stage along the chain gets a refund until the final consumer.

BOTH the federal and provincial governments must pass legislation to replace PST with HST. The feds only do it once they get the provinces to go for it; they'd sure as hell not send that cash payment if BC didn't keep their HST legislation.

This is not at all a problem of communication. People oppose it because they understand it. That's why there was no attempt to "explain" it before the last provincial election.
Joined: 6/14/2007
Msg: 128
Posted: 6/17/2010 8:49:17 AM
BOTH the federal and provincial governments must pass legislation to replace PST with HST. The feds only do it once they get the provinces to go for it; they'd sure as hell not send that cash payment if BC didn't keep their HST legislation.

Nevertheless, he has a good and interesting point. Wouldn't it be a hoot if they forced the BC government to keep the PST and the federal government said "so? this has nothing to do with the law we passed" then charged the extra 7% anyway?

Of course, we can fantasize about this horrible outcome with glee because it seems obvious the petition won't actually achieve anything.

People oppose it because they understand it.


Whatever ultimate philosophical reasons you may have for being against it, it's very obvious that a lot of the anti-HST crowd don't understand it. We can see that from comments people have made here, on other websites, in anti-HST propaganda, in the news and right in their "fight HST" signup booths on the street. With anti-HST leaders lying to them, that's not surprising. It's particularly obnoxious for VanderScam to start shouting about censorship and undue influence while at the same time pulling every legal trick he can to stop the government from answering anti-HST lies like that "$2100/year" figure that's still being passed around even now.

Let us know when you've filed your candidate's papers

LOL I fear my chances of getting elected in BC would be much lower than those of the hollow tree in Stanley Park, were it capable of running for office. :P Being honest is such a handicap in politics, and I have this compulsion to try to explain my view to people instead of just cynically manipulating them.

I agree with the nay-sayers it was rather obnoxious to say "no HST" in an election campaign then turn around and drop it on everybody afterward, and I surely would like to discourage this kind of behaviour, so I'm not much bothered by the petition even though I disagree with its ultimate goal. If it forces the legislature to debate it publicly, that would be a good thing even though the outcome is certain.

On the other hand, BC voters have a habit of rejecting every attempt at reform that isn't a promise of bread and circuses, so it's hard to be too strongly against the way the Liberals hid any HST plans during the election. If voters are going to behave like children what realistic choice is there for politicans but to handle them like children?
 Space Cowboy 53
Joined: 1/14/2010
Msg: 129
Posted: 6/17/2010 11:48:38 AM
I want to know how in god's name any price reductions that businesses pass on to us because of the HST are going to make up for the extra tax I'm going to have to pay? Right now I am trying to sell my house, and I want to buy something for considerably less than what I can get for my house, and use some of the left over money to buy a motorhome. If I don't sell my house before July 1st, not only will I have to pay HST on my realtors fees, but I will have to pay HST on the privately owned motorhome I have my eye on. The realtor's fee will cost me an extra $1204 and the motorhome will cost me an extra $4900, for a total of $6,104 in extra tax that today is not payable. And what about the HST on things that currently only GST is charged on, like new houses, haircuts, restaurant meals etc. I predict these arrogant pricks will be tossed out of office next election....I have talked to so many people that normally wouldn't dream of voting NDP that will be next time around if the HST is not rescinded.
Joined: 6/14/2007
Msg: 130
Posted: 6/17/2010 12:37:36 PM
not only will I have to pay HST on my realtors fees, but I will have to pay HST on the privately owned motorhome I have my eye on. The realtor's fee will cost me an extra $1204 and the motorhome will cost me an extra $4900

A used motorhome selling for $70,000? It must be a pretty nice one! Class A? Fifth-wheeler? (Just curious...)
 Space Cowboy 53
Joined: 1/14/2010
Msg: 131
Posted: 6/18/2010 7:22:31 AM
Oh yeah, forgot, HST will also be payable on legal fees to sell this house and buy another add even more to the cost of buying & selling...maybe it's time to at least make my offical residence Alberta....the more I think about this, the more #&%)!%#ed off I get.....
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 132
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Posted: 6/19/2010 5:54:54 PM
Ex-SEB: everyone I talk to, all the canvassers I asked, and all the anti-HST columnists and stories I see cite the transfer of tax burden from corporate and high-income taxpayers to individuals of low to moderate income. That's the core of it. Who do you know who seems to have missed that?

The big disagreement is whether giving yet more money to businesses will help us all. The history of that shows reliably that money trickles up, not down, and that cutting taxes on individuals makes businesses richer. Period.

This goes all the way back to a century ago, when Henry Ford demonstrated that increasing the wages of his workers raised his profits because they could buy cars.

The BC Liberals have been cutting income and business taxes since they took office, and inflation-adjusted, after-tax incomes of the vast majority of BC taxpayers have been going DOWN consistently. Meanwhile, the government turned surpluses into debt with its tax cuts - despite spending cuts that are crippling health care, education and infrastructure. BC has become Canada's child poverty champion, and close to that for poverty in general.

The answer to that is for provinces to honor their agreements not to compete with each other in incentives to business, and for international agreements to demand fair treatment before dropping tarriffs.

But they keep repeating the mantra that making the rich richer will help everyone. That will never make it true until it is true.

The right-wing tax-cut agenda has failed EVERYWHERE it has been tried, leaving behind huge deficits and poverty. Even in Alberta, where oil revenues wiped out deficits due to high prices, most people are poorer. The effects on England, California, Ontario and Quebec are obvious.

The only argument supporting lower taxes as a benefit is competition with other jurisdictions, and this leads only to the "race to the bottom." The vast majority of business in BC is here because it has to do business here, in service and resource industries. Our provincial government has the ability to keep its own spending here, but it sends its dollars out of province rather than do so.
Joined: 10/12/2006
Msg: 133
Posted: 6/19/2010 8:18:47 PM
Her's a dumb thought, why do we have business pay tax to have busness's payeach other then collect it, multiple times from manufacturer to distributor to dealer....paperwork by the ton and employing govt workers is all.
why not simplify it all, the end person pays a tax, since the govt says the HST will all be neutral why bother.
just a singlwe reasonable tax on the bottom end and me

No business having to work out balancing buying and taxes, no resources like mining and forestry having to deal with this tax or that, just the end consumer paying a single reasonable tax. think of the stimulus that would make for the business end of the economy, more jobs, less cost and hassle for companies so they could lower prices, hire more people etc......almost makes sense.......naw they'll never go for it.
Joined: 2/12/2009
Msg: 134
Posted: 7/14/2010 12:52:35 PM
This week I paid my business's final remittance of PST collected in June.

I now collect only HST from my customers. I have to admit that calculating taxes will be easier now as well.

However the price of a cup of coffee went up.
Joined: 8/19/2007
Msg: 135
Posted: 7/27/2010 12:00:01 AM
I don't believe Alberta is converting to HST...they will still have the GST to contend with only. The only provinces right now converting to HST are BC and Ontario. Alberta would be a good place to go to avoid the any tax over and above what we have to pay in it would only be the 5% GST. (But technically there is probably something in the legislation stating that we have to self assess for the difference in the HST which would be the 7% PST that just got the axe!
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 136
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Posted: 7/27/2010 1:01:00 AM
Michey63: "HST" is a combination of provincial and federal sales tax, and the federal rate is always 7%. The provincial part varies by province. There is no point in Alberta using HST because they have no PST. Therefore there would be no PST collection mechanism for the feds to share, and no cost saving for the feds to bribe the province to get.

Politically, Alberta would never touch a sales tax because their citizens don't get one from their province. Until GST, Albertans boasted that they alone in Canada paid the same price as on the label.
Joined: 2/7/2011
Msg: 137
Posted: 6/19/2011 4:46:25 PM
Does anyone know what's going on with the HST ballots? I think i heard a while back that the deadline to return them would be extended pending a postal strike. and well, you know the current situation.
Anyone heard any updates?
Joined: 5/29/2005
Msg: 138
Posted: 6/19/2011 7:46:05 PM

HST" is a combination of provincial and federal sales tax, and the federal rate is always 7%.

No. The federal rate is 5%.

I still haven't received my ballot, so I'm going to contact them next week.
Joined: 3/5/2011
Msg: 139
Posted: 6/29/2011 3:14:19 PM
but...but >>> they say it will be dropped to 10 point 2 percent
anyway, to heck with the hst or any tax....and pay attention to my friends clevage in post message 30.....heheeee
Joined: 2/7/2011
Msg: 140
Posted: 6/29/2011 6:44:16 PM
i got my ballot today. yay
Joined: 4/5/2011
Msg: 141
Posted: 6/30/2011 9:25:35 AM

Whatever ultimate philosophical reasons you may have for being against it
there is nothing 'philosophical' about my lighter wallet

the old system (PST exempt) that are now subject to HST such as:

Lease of Alternative Fuel Vehicle and Fuel Efficient Vehicle
Purchase of an Alternative Fuel Vehicle and Fuel Efficient Vehicle
Motor Vehicle Parking
Admission to Professional Sporting Events (e.g., Hockey, Football and Soccer Games)
Movie Tickets
Golf Memberships
Driving Range Fees
Gym and Athletic Memberships
Ballet, Karate, Trampoline, Hockey, Soccer Lessons etc.
Tickets for Live Theatre
Admission to Museums and Art Galleries
Music Concerts
Ski Lift Passes
Camping Sites
Domestic Air, Rail and Bus Travel Originating in British Columbia
Snack Foods (e.g., Chips and Pop)
Restaurant Meals
Massage Therapy Services
Over-the-Counter Medications
Certain School Supplies
EnergyStar Windows
Thermal Insulation, Weather Stripping and Caulking
First Aid Kits
Smoke Detectors Valued Less Than $250 for Residential Use
Food Producing Plants and Trees (e.g., Tomato Plants, Plum Tree)
Household Moving Services
Safety Helmets for Sports (e.g., Hockey Helmets, Snowboard Helmets, Bike Helmets)
Adult Sized Ski Gloves for Children
Adult Sized Ski Boots for Children
Children’s Sized Ski Boots
Adult Sized Clothing for Children
Shoe Repair
Tailoring Services
Used Adult Clothing Purchased for Less Than $100
Domestic Air, Rail, and Bus Travel Originating in B.C.
Camping Sites
Basic Cable Television
Local Residential Phone
Repair to Certain Household Appliances (e.g., Stoves, Ovens, Refrigerators, Washers, and Dryers)
Repair, Maintenance or Renovation Services for Real Property (e.g., Plumbing Electrical Wiring)
Landscaping, Lawn-Care, Private Snow Removal and House Cleaning
Computer Software Repair Services (e.g., virus removal or software installation)
Funeral Services
Fitness Trainer
Hair Stylist/Barber
Esthetician Services (e.g., Manicures, Pedicures, Facials)
Accounting Services
Interior Design Services
Wedding Planning Services
Veterinarian Services
Dry Cleaning
Catering and Event Planning Services (e.g., planning, consulting, coordinating and organizing
Joined: 1/16/2011
Msg: 142
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Posted: 7/1/2011 2:10:14 PM
The HST is a Regressive VAT tax. A VAT tax is a Value Added Tax. Orwellian name I know but still our politicial classes are lead by some creative people with black sense of humour.
The experience of the EU is that their VAT taxes which were promised never to rise have risen. The temproary increases were never recinded. VAT Taxes go up, ALWAYS.
You can argue all you want but this is a tax burden shift from the bigger business to the tax-payer. This is what our (not that I voted for it) government has offered for our benefit. That some people dond't see the shell game for what it is, means one of two things; they are a shil for the Libtards or they are graduate of the public school system and haven't learned a thing since Grade Six.
When the HST is rebuked, Expect the PST to be ammended to cover off the HST's tax grab. In other words, we're hooped either way.

And while we're agrueing with shils about the HST,
don't pay attention to BC Rail, BC Hydro, BC Ferries and all the other scandals the Libtards bring our way!

Joined: 10/3/2010
Msg: 143
Posted: 7/13/2011 11:32:14 AM
I don't think the HST is a good idea. I understand that it's putting together both taxes but I thought the PST use to be paid by businesses? All businesses already include the PST they pay in the sale price of their product or service. So by putting both taxes together, it is forcing consumers to pay for it. Businesses are obliviously not going to reduce the difference in price of all products and services they use to compensate paying the PST with. I as a consumer now have to pay the HST which includes 7% PST but also the 7% PST business no longer have to pay as well.

Now why do I want to pay 7% more on something that is no additional benefit to me?

Thats what I got from all this bickering about the HST.
Joined: 2/19/2011
Msg: 144
Posted: 7/14/2011 9:09:55 AM
However the price of a cup of coffee went up.

and it adds up
HST is everywhere

A friend once remarked "It's only $20"
$20 feels like $40 ... and in a pinch, it can't be afforded
The working and non-working poor just got poorer
I notice this shift drastically and it happens during a time when a lot of resources are being cut or heavily reduced
but it seems... no one cares. IMO

As for myself, I brew my own coffee
it's cheaper.... kinda
Joined: 2/7/2011
Msg: 145
Posted: 7/14/2011 11:41:33 AM
I wonder where all the saving that business supposedly pass on to us are. my shaw phone just went up $7, and the intenet and tv another 5 or 6. plus the hst on top. Shaw sure didn't see fit to pass on the savings.
just reads a crtc report this morning that the cable co. profits are up a good amount from last year too.
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 146
view profile
Posted: 7/22/2011 9:09:34 AM
You have until August 5th to get your ballot in now. So mail it TODAY!

We've had a year to see the results, and there are no savings or price cuts. Businesses are much more profitable.

Remember, vote YES if you want to kill the GST.
Vote NO if you want to keep it.

The recent cosmetic changes to he GST will SLIGHTLY, TEMPORARILY give rebates to A FEW PEOPLE, and may reduce the rate to 10% in two years, but it will more likely go up again. BUT the cuts to businesses mean we will have to pay much more and experience more user fees and service cuts.

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