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 RazzleRoadRunner
Joined: 4/13/2007
Msg: 107
What's the reward for Chivalry? Page 4 of 21    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21)
ceffodicane....

Secondly, as was oft re-itereated there, chivalry is not, in any than the most coloquial sense, a synonym for good manners.


I have to agree with you ceffodicane, being chivalrous and having good manners are two entirely different things.

Chivalry........is considered an act of heroism, to save another's life for example.
Good manners/etiquette has nothing to do with being a hero.
 2Irish1
Joined: 9/1/2008
Msg: 110
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 1:49:46 PM
I'm just going to respond to the OPost...being too lazy today to read 7 pages of post..and really...this should be a retorical question...
Chivalrous Behavior:considerate and courteous behavior, especially shown by a man toward women...my window dictionary

IMO, ya do chivalrous things not expecting nor demanding a return...jhmo
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 111
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 2:14:27 PM

Chivalry is only a name for that general spirit or state of mind which disposes men and/or women to heroic actions, and keeps them conversant with all that is beautiful and sublime in the intellectual and moral world.

And that keeps always in front of them..."do unto others as you would have done unto you."
Chivalry, ethical behavior, kindness,virtue, good manners, doing the right thing, all are their OWN reward.
And I for one have held doors for men as well, helped a guy struggling with his coat, (usually these are very senior or very junior men) gotten stuff down off high shelves in stores for shorter men, etc.
It's simply a mindset that you try to make life a little pleasanter and easier, to the best of your own personal ability,to make the day go a little smoother for the people you cross paths with.
And I don't care if it devolves to me being the one woman out of 10 who smiles and says "thank you" to a man who opens/holds a door for me, I will still do that.
Cindy O
 browneyesboo
Joined: 5/19/2005
Msg: 112
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 2:33:23 PM
I didn't realize having manners or being polite was chivalry.
I hold doors open, pull chairs out, help people who struggle
walking etc.
I thought chivalry was tossing your coat over mud puddles
or carrying someone over a threshold or perhaps slaying a
dragon that's gone amuck?
I also didn't realize we expected to be rewarded for being
polite. Being polite is what I do...I don't necessarily expect
everyone follows the same path.
I guess my only reward is I feel good about myself and I
sleep nights knowing that there aren't many people out there
that consider me an ahole.

 Angel__Wings
Joined: 7/25/2009
Msg: 113
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 2:39:22 PM

I think in general society is me me me and then maybe YOU will pop up on the list at some point, but don't forget that I thought of you. Does that make sense? After all, YOU should be so blessed I was able to go out of MY way to do something for YOU. So sad, yet so true. Now that I say tsk tsk tsk to.


This makes perfect sense to me. We really have become the me me me society. Almost scary to watch, but that's where it is now. It's what do I get out of this. How about just treating people with a little respect every now and then.

Mr Evil, Trust me is that guy ever walks into my life, OMG I would duct tape him to me LOL In all seriousness though I have had a couple men do these little gestures and have to admit, it made me feel like a woman. I don't believe it is weak to admit you can be delicate as a woman. Yet it seems many woman won't say it or if they feel it they think it is wrong so won't admit it. Yes I can do those things but to have someone care enough to do it, gives me the warm fuzzies all over.
 browneyesboo
Joined: 5/19/2005
Msg: 114
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 2:44:27 PM

Women destroyed gentlemanly behavior, methodically and deliberately. They did it because they wanted to do so, and they felt very smug and superior while they were doing it. If they now decide that it wasn't such a great idea, tough titty. They should have thought of it then. Too bad for the younger people.


another person confusing chivalry with manners and courtesy.
And blaming women for the reason he no longer has manners and
social skills.
Really?


There should be a drop down on the profiles for men and women to identify
themselves as misogynists and misandrists as there are enough of them in this
place to start a new country.


sheesh
 2Irish1
Joined: 9/1/2008
Msg: 115
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 2:51:13 PM

Chivalrous Behavior:considerate and courteous behavior, especially shown by a man toward women...my window dictionary

another person confusing chivalry with manners and courtesy.


Just wondering???
 browneyesboo
Joined: 5/19/2005
Msg: 116
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:04:18 PM

Just wondering???

Really? Let me help you.
chiv⋅al⋅ry
  /ˈʃɪvəlri/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [shiv-uhl-ree] Show IPA
Use chivalry in a Sentence
See web results for chivalry
See images of chivalry
–noun, plural -ries for 6.
1. the sum of the ideal qualifications of a knight, including courtesy, generosity, valor, and dexterity in arms.
2. the rules and customs of medieval knighthood.
3. the medieval system or institution of knighthood.
4. a group of knights.
5. gallant warriors or gentlemen: fair ladies and noble chivalry.
6. Archaic. a chivalrous act; gallant deed.
Origin:
1250–1300; ME chivalrie < AF, OF chevalerie, equiv. to chevalier chevalier + -ie -y 3

Just because somewhere along the line someone decided chivalry was just plain
manners and courtesy, doesn't mean it didn't have an original meaning...and its
fairly obvious to me (although not so much to you) that this is the meaning that comes
to mind when people think of "Chivalry".
"chivalry" has not been practiced by anyone in this forum for sure...unless they
are REALLY lying about their age.
 Angel__Wings
Joined: 7/25/2009
Msg: 117
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:15:04 PM

"chivalry" has not been practiced by anyone in this forum for sure...unless they
are REALLY lying about their age.




You know though when I think of "Chivalry" I do go to more of the hold the door, take my coat, walk on the street side of the sidewalk, kinds of things. I guess even though that is the definition of chivalry that is not what comes to mind.

So I stand corrected as well. I will take a guy with manners. Wow that almost sounds so bad to say. I think most guys have good manners but doing these types of things for the woman they are with, well that is still more then just simple manners.
 Angel__Wings
Joined: 7/25/2009
Msg: 118
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:23:30 PM

Agreed. People get chivalry confused with civility. There's no mention of how men are supposed to treat women in the above definition, yet some folks have turned chivalry into that, and seldom (if ever) mention how women are suppose to treat men.


See and here it is again. You should not expect something for being nice, but trust me if you did those little things for a lot of woman they would give back. I have been kind of seeing a guy for about 4 weeks. We have just met but seeing where things go. He does a lot of these things and I have to say, when I am with him and he is doing it, I feel all famine and warm. So what does he get back. He gets those little smiles from me, a whispered thank you, he sees my shy happy side. He gets me at my most vulnerable level that not many see. I show him the respect and care he deserves. He also gets more of me because he does these things.

I have been with guys that do not do any of them and you know what, there is a difference in how I am with them.
 2Irish1
Joined: 9/1/2008
Msg: 119
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:30:50 PM

Just because somewhere along the line someone decided chivalry was just plain
manners and courtesy, doesn't mean it didn't have an original meaning...and its
fairly obvious to me (although not so much to you) that this is the meaning that comes
to mind when people think of "Chivalry".
"chivalry" has not been practiced by anyone in this forum for sure...unless they
are REALLY lying about their age.

Thank you for the help...I think my point was that one of the definitions is considerate and courteous behavior...and yes the other definitions show that chivalry was a term coined in the days of nighthood....gee, thank you for for pointing out what I see each day in the threads...some people have no social grace...I saw this in a widow/ers thread...as someone came in and started rudely joking around while we were in the process of "helping" people with recent loss...but, my guess that she was being less than chivalrous.

perhaps, I'll coin the phrase dis-chivalry and it won't be a gender specific term.
 Angel__Wings
Joined: 7/25/2009
Msg: 120
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:31:07 PM

and seldom (if ever) mention how women are suppose to treat men.


Reading this whole thread it has somehow gone down to male vs female road again lol. Sorry if I took it that way just thought it was asking yet again what do men get out of it. So sorry about that.
 chameleonf
Joined: 12/22/2008
Msg: 121
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:33:32 PM
Well, I'm thinking there's probably a cross-over of sorts with respect to words and terminology and it's why people tend to equate one word with the other, depending on mindset of any given individual.

For instance, we have the highlighted

the sum of the ideal qualifications of a knight, including courtesy, generosity, valor, and dexterity in arms.

Although the highlighted words aren't the only thing which makes a man chivalrous, it's part of it.

Then you have the word gallant, which is also used to describe chivalry:


n., pl., -ries.
Nobility of spirit or action; courage.
Chivalrous attention toward women; courtliness: "the air of faintly mocking gallantry with which he habitually treated mother" (Louis Auchincloss).
The act or an instance of gallant speech or behavior.
Archaic. A bold or stylish appearance.


So I can see where people are doing the either/or thing when it comes to the term - they tend to overlap somewhat.

What it boils down to in simple terms in today's society is...be nice. If pulling out chairs, etc. etc. is your style and if having them pulled out for you is what makes you feel more feminine or being paid polite attention to, no problem when you have two like-minded individuals together if we're talking about dating, and being that this is a dating site, I'm thinking that's where this pretty much started with the thread.

As far as the reward for chivalry (being respectful, nice, polite...any other term)...the reward is that you generally get what you give, especially when it's done without need for a return. Good karma gets back to you eventually.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 9/26/2009
Msg: 123
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:42:19 PM

(2equallyyoked) It's not true chivalry if you're looking for a reward.


Wrong. It's not true chivalry if you're not a Knight of the Realm.

Binroe...
 bo_weeks
Joined: 1/5/2009
Msg: 124
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:54:53 PM
Being polite is it's own reward. lf one acts a certain way in order to gain something from someone else, IMO it isn't anything more than playing a game. l do the things l do because it's the way l am, and what l believe is the right way for me to conduct my life.
 RazzleRoadRunner
Joined: 4/13/2007
Msg: 125
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 3:55:59 PM

you can barely get people to call 911, much less save someone's life.


The people upholding the laws of North America sometimes skew an act of chivalry and the person who is chivalrous is sometimes seen as a criminal when in fact they were not.............that is where things become very one-dimensional and unbalanced for the good samaritan who was just trying to help. People's lives have been ruined and sometimes the good samaritan is imprisoned, due to a jury's conjecture. Tis a very sad part of human behavior and their need for a scape goat.

An example of this may be a stranger who comes upon another stranger who has been shot, knifed or beaten and the police walk in just after the stranger has performed CPR, is covered in blood and/or holding the weapon.

Anyway, back to Chivalry and Having Good Manners!!!
 chameleonf
Joined: 12/22/2008
Msg: 127
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 4:18:43 PM

Yes Chivalry is expected of gentlemen. What is expected of the ladies?
=============
We all know the answer to this one. Does it really take 8 pages?
Sex. Just like in return for anything else.


You know what's funny about comments like this? It's either designed to be funny by those trying to be humorous, or it's designed as a bash against women. Unwittingly, though, I believe it's a bash against men - from men, cuz if you really think about it, it pretty much says that's all that a man is capable of when it comes to a relationship. It may be that way for those who are closer to cro magnon man's mentality, but I believe most men have far more depth to them than "just" being capable of a sexual relationship and only being "nice" in order to obtain it.
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 128
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 4:21:25 PM

You make it sound a bit like a snow job, to gain favor through deception of false character. Archaic practices of courtship just don't fly in these modern times, as the end result is usually the man getting screwed over.

And this my dears, is why so many of these threads become men vs women. Marriages and relationships, for any number of reasons,good bad or indifferent, fail. 2 people wind up hurt and angry, and suffering from financial, practical and social problems. Rather than get the hell OVER themselves( and I'm directing this to BOTH genders, BTW) it becomes a "screw 'em over first, before they screw YOU over" mentality pervading the dating and romance scene. Men consider that the courts position of children's best interests, which may mean his ex and kids get to live in the marital home, and that compels him to pay part of his income to child support, as being "screwed over". The woman, left to struggle with less financial resources, and virtually no "alternate sponsor" to help with child rearing, figures that this man got his jollies, left her with kids to raise pretty much alone(to all intents and purposes) LESS opportunities/ options for finding another worthwhile partner, because all the damaged men have THEIR eye on the main chance...which ISN'T a woman with kids at home. So everybody is out to get all they can get and screw over the opposite gender. So you end up with men )(uming that women are just after wallet, and women
)( uming men are only after p*ssy.

If I for one have to use money and gifts to gain a womans heart

Trust me dude, many women are extremely wary of men who seem to be overly reliant on money and gifts to make an impression. No, no no, DON'T start that other lame-ass weinie wail; " women only go for the bad boys that treat them like sh*t, nice guys don't stand a chance". I'm talking about getting a sense that a man is trying to BUY favor or impress with material possessions.

Chivalry was/is a code of conduct, a state of mind. Many EXAMPLES are no longer relevant, since we're fresh out of dragons, "The DaVinci Code" purports to have found the Holy Grail, there are no robber barons kidnapping fair maidens, and the Crusades are long over. That said, every time a man or woman enters the Armed Forces, every time a young person signs up to law enforcement, firefighting or paramedic/EMT training, I see chivalry still at work. Granted, these people do expect to be paid, to get educational benefits, etc, but there ARE other occupations that pay well and don't involve dangerous environments/being in harms' way on a daily basis.
Cindy O
 2Irish1
Joined: 9/1/2008
Msg: 129
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 4:39:49 PM
I think that behaviors from medi-evil times have little application to today's society....

I read chivalry to be curtious and conciderate...unfortunately the definition then goes on to say from men towards women...

And somehow, the OPost...is trying to tie a gratuity to being concidetate, kind, and curtious...oh, the in-humanity of that idea... (yes, I am making up words as I go)

First hand, I can tell you that good karma comes back in spades...the saying; "what goes around comes around"...rings true...I'd like to think that I "never" look for a thanks...yet, I know..that I'm somewhat saddened when I've done something nice and there's absolutely no acknowledgement of the deed...sigh...showing I'm more human than I'd like to be.

And so...I'm sitll trying to wrap my mind around OP speaking to this young man...who has the question asked of him...basically...what do I get for a good deed...and OP...gee...OP...do you really lack the character to answer that question right away...and have the gaul to come here and post a thread asing us????

Sure many in the threads lack social grace...and at times I abandon mine...I'll not make excuses for my indiscressions...I will say that once done..I feel remorse..and try to improve my tenor...to say what ever I may say in a palitable manor.
 Angel__Wings
Joined: 7/25/2009
Msg: 130
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 4:41:08 PM

We all know the answer to this one. Does it really take 8 pages?

Sex. Just like in return for anything else.


I do hope that was in jest. I know a lot of men who are looking for a woman for more then just sex. Yes there are men looking for just that but really???? I think more men want something real in their lives then "just sex"
 soatlanta
Joined: 9/11/2009
Msg: 132
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 5:09:22 PM
Chivalry is not dead....

"expectations" depends on the the individual..

I went on a lovely date with a great man; he paid for the babysitter!!!

Ladies, how cool is that?!?!

I told him that was not necessary.

His reply.."no worries, could you make dinner for me one night?"

Yay, for me. I believe that there are some good ones out there.
 DIVISION77
Joined: 8/10/2009
Msg: 136
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 5:30:23 PM
I already posted earlier in this thread, but I'll just finish up by saying that the "reward" for chivarly is some good "attention" later on down the road.

It's worth it............trust me.


 2Irish1
Joined: 9/1/2008
Msg: 138
What's the reward for Chivalry?
Posted: 12/9/2009 6:14:11 PM
Big Edit:
So the question is, in a relationship, what does the lady do in return for been shown a lot of "chivalry"? Is it just a thank you?
In these days of non-gender specific roles, I am finding it hard to point to anything.

Yes Chivalry is expected of gentlemen. What is expected of the ladies


I'd not like to discuss this attempt the OPoster has used to create a polarized thread....

Chivalry should not be gender specific...and the deed done...does not require reciprocation...of course some think that a return on investment is required...sigh
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