Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Single Parents  >      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 260
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?Page 15 of 22    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22)
Ohwhynot46: you do realize that I was kidding when I said that there was a prize for the most convoluted misuse of logic, don't you? There actually isn't a prize for it, so you can stop...


<div class="quote">
<div class="quote"> I advocate teaching them how the real world works. The entirety of human history backs me up.


Human history suggests that only those that are bigger & stronger succeed? Really?

Human history teaches that, just because you want something, holding your breath and throwing a tantrum isn't the way to get it. (unless, of course, what you want is to turn blue)


<div class="quote">
<div class="quote"> Self-control, diplomacy, tact. Need more?

(ohwhynot46) You really believe that all of these are taught by spanking?

It depends on how the discipline is administered. Dispensing spankings randomly, on a whim will not teach anything. Your "experts" could tell you this.


<div class="quote"> I simply can not come up with any rational logic...

You should have ended your sentence there. Truer words were never spoken.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 261
view profile
History
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/13/2013 6:11:28 PM

Ohwhynot46: you do realize that I was kidding when I said that there was a prize for the most convoluted misuse of logic, don't you? There actually isn't a prize for it, so you can stop...


Your attempts at deflection fail. You're being an azz.

Diplomacy: skill and tact in dealing with others.
Tact: ability to avoid being offensive.

Please how & under what circumstance spanking a child would enable a parent to teach either of these?


just because you want something, holding your breath and throwing a tantrum isn't the way to get it. (unless, of course, what you want is to turn blue)


So, spanking a child who holds their breath in order to get something teaches them that doing so isn't the way to get what they want? Explain how that is so. Doesn't not giving them what they want teach them that? I imagine that the spanking is, partcularly in the above instance, for the parent.

You have not presented any great logic in any of your posts, you have altogether avoided the application of logic. Not to mention that you have actually provided evidence of my claim, that spanking is for the parent, a release of frustration, a means of gaining control in a moment with no desire, much less ability to teach at that moment. Good job!
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 262
view profile
History
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/14/2013 6:46:01 PM
I absolutely agree about being sick of kids whose parents exercise no discipline at all, but there is an awful lot available between physical intervention & nothing at all. You are quite right in that those children who receive no direction & deal with no consequence are out of control, but simply because a parent doesn't spank doesn't mean that children have no guidance nor that there are no consequences for their behavior. I don't believe that time out is a means of teaching, either. It can give both a child & a parent time to calm down & address the sitaution in a manner conducive to learning, but it doesn't teach anything, in & of itself. It is the inablilty of a parent to work at parenting, to follow through, that results in unruly, spolied brats, not the lack of physical punishment. One doesn't have to experience the hurt of a bite in order to learn not to bite.

Throughout this thread, I have repeatedly seen that those who disagree with the notion that spanking is not teaching state that they have only spanked their children a few times. If it is true that those who spank are educating their children by doing so, it would logically follow that those children have only been taught that same number of times. I am pretty confident in stating that parents like yourself do indeed employ other methods of educating children as to proper behavior, and they work.
 S3v3ntek
Joined: 1/11/2013
Msg: 263
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/14/2013 8:25:57 PM

Does this change your mind about spanking your child?


Nah. I spank my child all the time. There are 2 ways that I prefer: I get the BIG old wooden spoon out and whack him on the butt till it's bright red. (That's always a classic)
Or I tell him to hold out his hands and I get the spatula and smack them with it. (It's fun, it's kind of like the game Whack-A-Mole)

:D
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 264
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/15/2013 9:35:29 AM

(ohwhynot46) I absolutely agree about being sick of kids whose parents exercise no discipline at all, but there is an awful lot available between physical intervention & nothing at all.


We are in total agreement here. What gets my Patrician nose out of joint, is certain people thinking and saying that, because I am in favour of spanking, that I am in favour of only spanking as a means of parent-child interaction.


If it is true that those who spank are educating their children by doing so, it would logically follow that those children have only been taught that same number of times.


Absolutely wrong. There is a lot of difference between saying, "Spanking is a teaching tool.", and saying, "ONLY spanking, is a teaching tool." You do realize that a statement isn't automatically logical just because you include the word "logic" in it, right?
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 265
view profile
History
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/15/2013 5:17:03 PM

There is a lot of difference between saying, "Spanking is a teaching tool.", and saying, "ONLY spanking, is a teaching tool." You do realize that a statement isn't automatically logical just because you include the word "logic" in it, right?


I am fully aware of the existence of implied logic, thanks anyway. Please enlighten me: how exactly is spanking a teaching tool?
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 266
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/16/2013 5:10:50 PM
(ohwhynot46) I am fully aware of the existence of implied logic, thanks anyway.


If you are aware of its existence, why have you never actually USED it?

BURN!!!



Please enlighten me: how exactly is spanking a teaching tool?


Re-read the thread. Pay special attention to my nuggets of wisdom, and actually try to keep an open mind, instead of barrelling in with your preconceived notions that spanking is only half-a-step removed from human trafficking.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 267
view profile
History
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/16/2013 7:37:11 PM

Pay special attention to my nuggets of wisdom, and actually try to keep an open mind, instead of barrelling in with your preconceived notions that spanking is only half-a-step removed from human trafficking.


Sorry, I guess you'll have to point them out, as I have not been able to locate any discernable "nuggets of wisdom" in even one of your posts. An open mind allows me to acknowledge that any human being can be pushed to a point of merely exercising conrtrol over a child and to admit that spanking is not necessarily abuse, but it does not, and neither does logic, direct me toward your statements that spanking teaches anything at all. It is your preconceived misconception & lack of comprehension, I imagine, that leads you to your stated conclusion, as I have said nothing of the sort. It becomes clearer & clearer, as you continue to post, that you do in fact feel that bullying will bring you victory. I feel sorry for your offspring.
 bamagrl68
Joined: 11/14/2010
Msg: 268
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/17/2013 3:34:23 PM
Orionthehunter9- Clearly there is serious division of opinion on this subject. We agree on this one.
A spanking is not a beating.
Time outs can be effective, I have used that also.
Having said that, using reasoning with a child doesn't work.
They are children, they are totally self focused and all that talking is silly, all they hear is "blah, blah, blah".
It always makes me chuckle to see a grown up trying to reason with a out of control child, you might as well try to reason with a brick.
These are the people who ruin our dinners out because their kids are running around screaming and acting the fool while they ignore them or waste their time telling the child for the 100th time to sit down.
Don't even get me started, I've had to move tables and change seats at the movie theater :(
My son is a chef, my daughter is a freshman in collage who just got all A's and B's and my youngest son is in the gifted program at his school and also an honors student. They all were occasionally spanked, and you know what else? I NEVER had to sit red faced because they acted the fool in public.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 269
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/21/2013 7:26:04 AM

(Arlo) Pay special attention to my nuggets of wisdom, and actually try to keep an open mind, instead of barrelling in with your preconceived notions that spanking is only half-a-step removed from human trafficking.


(ohwhynot46) Sorry, I guess you'll have to point them out, as I have not been able to locate any discernable "nuggets of wisdom" in even one of your posts.


*shrug* You're obviously one of those people to whom it is more important to be "right", than to have the integrity to admit that someone else MAY have a point, and is able to string a logical, coherent argument together. If you'd rather nit-pick and be all fussy... well, have at it.


(ohwhynot46) An open mind... logic...


Neither of which you've demonstrated. If you have either/both, you've kept them well-hidden.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 270
view profile
History
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/21/2013 5:21:11 PM
You have demonstrated nothing more than that you like to argue & enjoy the role of schoolyard bully. It's not about being right, it's about not sitting idly by while you attempt to take my posts taken out of context.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 271
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/22/2013 7:12:24 AM

(ohwhynot46) You have demonstrated nothing more than that you like to argue & enjoy the role of schoolyard bully.


*shrug* You say "schoolyard bully", and everyone hears "guy who won't put up with your logic-chopping and disingenuousness", but whatever...


It's not about being right, it's about not sitting idly by while you attempt to take my posts taken out of context.


In order for me to take your posts "out of context", they'd first have to BE in some sort of context. Aside from your verbose statements which essentially boil down to, "Spanking is bad because I say so!", your posts make very little sense, and have gotten the replies they deserve...

(Man, some people can be such SORE-HEADS!)
 bamagrl68
Joined: 11/14/2010
Msg: 272
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/22/2013 10:20:12 PM
Queenlizbeth-Thank you :) I'm very proud of them.
I don't mean to hijack this thread, but I think it bears adding that not only did I also get spanked, but so did many generations of people before us and I don't recall mass shootings back then, so much for the "it creates violence" non sense.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 273
view profile
History
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/23/2013 4:36:22 PM

In order for me to take your posts "out of context", they'd first have to BE in some sort of context. Aside from your verbose statements which essentially boil down to, "Spanking is bad because I say so!", your posts make very little sense, and have gotten the replies they deserve...


I actually said nothing like that at all. I thought I had been quite clear in that I am stating that I don't believe, and have seen no evidence at all presented, that spanking teaches children how to behave appropriately, nor is it a logical consequence following the behaviors described in the scenarios presented. You have a seeming need to provoke an argument otherwise directed. Simply because I am not buying in to it, doesn't make me a "sore head", whatever that may be.....Very little sense to you is fairly meaningless, as you seem to have no other agenda to promote than that you know what everyone else really thinks or comprehends. I have no more time to waste; keep telling yourself that which you so enjoy hearing.
 KeriLynn09
Joined: 6/17/2009
Msg: 274
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/26/2013 9:18:04 PM
I was spanked as a kid as I have a 140 IQ. That "study" is completely false. It's not only about spanking a kid. You need to also explain to them why they got punished.
 logicalman1111
Joined: 1/15/2013
Msg: 275
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/27/2013 11:08:04 AM
I think most studies done are total bs. A persons IQ is hereditary provided he wasn't accidently dropped on his head or fell prey to a disease that effects his body and brain at childbirth. The next thing that dramatically effects IQ is a persons environment, dangerous neighborhoods, living on the defensive everyday doesn't allow you much time to think about other things. A child in a bad neighborhood might spend most of this time working out and less time thinking, but even the choice to work out is a thinking choice. Lack of income, poverty, inexperience with traveling to other countries or seeing sights in our own country. People whom have money tend to be well rounded and exposed to all sights unseen. If I had a million dollars and wanted to know how something works I would ask permission to roam the factory where it's made. If I wanted to build a house, I would video tape every single step taken, especially the wiring part. I may not figure it all out but 99 percent of it just by watching it done. Kids usually get spanked for being roudy. I don't voluntarily spend money on rock concerts and I am not going to let a two year old bring one to me. Now sit down and shut up and stop that crying before I give you something to cry about, lol. Abuse itself because you have a bad day at work and you beat the kid, thats different, put those people in prison.
 GangnamStyle1969
Joined: 12/26/2012
Msg: 276
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/28/2013 1:29:46 AM
I didn't get spanked I got punched or kicked. It taught me nothing but if I wanted attention from my parents I needed to do something bad. Children want attention and when they get more attention from spanking they will keep on doing it. Physical violence didn't teach me a damn thing other than violence is a solution to your problems.
 KayT01
Joined: 1/16/2013
Msg: 277
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 1/28/2013 5:35:33 AM
That is not accurate. There is no positive correlation between spanking and IQ. There are too many factors that attribute to IQ (ie social status, genetics, etc).
 FlyyinSolo87
Joined: 6/15/2011
Msg: 278
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 2/1/2013 4:23:47 PM
Daves_not_here-- I've know many men who have never been spanked and still find sexual pleasure in it. I've also know some of those same men who enjoyed choking, yet have never been choked. As one poster said, correlation does not equate to causation. Similar to how 100% of people who drink water die. This kink you speak of, is it merely spanking a woman, or getting spanked, or is it more along the lines of BDSM? If it's BDSM, I've watched a many of documentaries about the subject and not everyone who enjoys it was spanked or abused as a child. Also how were you spanked as a child? When I was spanked, I never went without welts. If your experience was similar to that, then that was abuse, not a spanking and hence damages the mental health of the child. There is a lot that contributes to how a person develops. More than one aspect that is to be taken into account. To further share with you, I have a true sex addiction, but that is not the result of being spanked the way I had. I was also sexually abused as well. If such a kink that you have torments you, then I implore you to seek therapy because in my personal opinion there might be more going on that is the result of more than just spanking.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 279
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 2/2/2013 8:05:37 AM

(daves_not_here) The point of my post is straightforward: spanking has a sexual connection for many and I think we should keep that in mind when we consider exposing our children to it.


*shrug* Mr. Roger's Neighbourhood has a ghetto connection for many who have seen Eddie Murphy's hilarious spoof of it, "Mr. Robinson's Neighbourhood", on Saturday Night Live (to say nothing of his "I'M GUMBY DAMMIT!!!"). What's yer point?


I was spanked neither abusively nor overtly sexually, yet I can clearly trace my current preferences to my childhood experiences, as can the many people I've met over the years who are similarly inclined.


What was done to you as a child, and what you do about it now that you're an adult, are two separate issues. I think you just like seeing your name on the left...
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 1/7/2013
Msg: 280
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 2/3/2013 11:25:04 AM

(daves_not_here) What a strange and hostile response. I've posted exactly twice with what I intended to be meaningful contributions to the topic. You, on the other hand, have posted at least 10 comments which attack and demean other posters. Yet you impute that I "just like" seeing my name on the left.

You don't know me or my motivations. Your practice of preceding posts with a dismissive *shrug* betrays a loser attempting to project superiority. Please continue to *shrug* to communicate to the forum that you fully accept you are as pathetic as you appear to be.


*shrug* You come across as someone who's seen 2 or 3 episodes of Dr. Phil, and now feels qualified to analyze everything. I'm always amused by pop-psychology.
 offroader831
Joined: 2/15/2013
Msg: 281
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 3/5/2013 10:38:51 AM
I agree with a parent having more in their toolbox than just the two...

I also agree that one shouldnt raise their kids with their hands tied behind their backs because some yahoo decides i'm going to go out on a limb and publish a finding.
 ksayer1
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 282
view profile
History
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 3/5/2013 4:41:23 PM
All i can say is the first time i put my kid in time out and she told me no! i told her i was going to spank her. She told me no again and got a good swat on the butt and had to take her time out too. I think she tried me 2 more times.

I thought she was going deff. If i stood behind her and told her to do something she wouldn't wouldn't even flinch. I almost had her ears checked. First i decided to quietly tell her i had ice cream and wouldn't ya know it she heard that loud and clear!! Lol ya she got a swat on the butt when she ignored me after that.

I was smacked around as a kid, and there is a huge difference!! I was also spanked til my butt was sore, i don't have any kinks though.
 Albvs
Joined: 2/14/2013
Msg: 283
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 3/5/2013 5:50:12 PM
I was routinely spanked and my I.Q. is in the top 2%. I wouldn't put too much faith in that study.
 Paul9473
Joined: 2/12/2013
Msg: 284
Does this change your mind about spanking your child?
Posted: 3/6/2013 3:06:07 AM
Hmmm apart from self-aggrandisement did that article actual talk about parenting at all. Maybe some where there, but it was lost on me after all the "Forget all other studies" hype.
What was the sample size? I understand that its a newspaper article not a scientific paper, but I expect at least that to be mentioned. You sure are going to need a big one >10000 in order to get a decent correlation (It's a big multivariate systems and you'll need to eliminate other potential causes - socioeconomic factors differentiating your average spanking vs non-spanking families would just about account for that difference alone).
Who really did this study? Professors don't carry out research - that's what students are for.
IQ? What a lot of bloody nonsense. How is that normalised testing?
Definitely changes my mind about where higher education government funding is going.
Show ALL Forums  > Single Parents  >