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Show ALL Forums  > Politics  > Obama's "Secret Agenda" to bring about Socialism      Home login  
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 feeltobefree
Joined: 10/6/2006
Msg: 20
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about SocialismPage 2 of 3    (1, 2, 3)
So what's so wrong about socialism?
 dmotz
Joined: 11/19/2008
Msg: 21
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 9:58:46 PM

So what's so wrong about socialism?


Lets say I have three cows...my neighbor only has one cow...A socialist government will take a cow from me that I paid for,fed and raised and give it to my neighbor. This way we both have two cows...equality...

This is the way I see the obama...taking from those who have worked and earned and giving to those who will not......

SOCIALISM ...bad.......umkay!
 feeltobefree
Joined: 10/6/2006
Msg: 22
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 10:19:27 PM
Yeah right..that's exactly how socialism works... wow. You should go to school and learn some more or perhaps start learning.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 23
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 10:26:05 PM


Yeah right..that's exactly how socialism works... wow. You should go to school and learn some more or perhaps start learning.


So what percentage of socialist countries don't engage in wealth redistribution? Which socilaist political parties are against wealth redistribution?
 dmotz
Joined: 11/19/2008
Msg: 24
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 10:28:37 PM
Huge explanation on Wiki for ya...the obama is a Marxist in his theories...notice the words...
from each according to his ability, to each according to his need"


My above post says it all...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism
Socialism in Marxist Theory
Karl Marx

The Marxist conception of socialism is that of a specific historical phase that will displace capitalism and be a precursor to communism. The major characteristics of socialism (particularly as conceived by Marx and Engels after the Paris Commune of 1871), are that the proletariat will control the means of production through a workers' state erected by the workers in their interests. Economic activity is still organised through the use of incentive systems and social classes would still exist but to a lesser and diminishing extent than under capitalism.[23] For orthodox Marxists, socialism is the lower stage of communism based on the principle of "from each according to his ability, to each according to his contribution" while upper stage communism is based on the principle of "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need"; the upper stage becoming possible only after the socialist stage further develops economic efficiency and the automation of production has led to a superabundance of goods and services.
 flyguy51
Joined: 8/11/2005
Msg: 25
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 10:37:59 PM
Although some would rather not admit it, the formation of labor unions was something Marx did not account for and their formation has actually helped to keep capitalism intact.

Pure capitalism is like the game Monopoly: winner takes all.
 kabiosile
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 26
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Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 11:01:06 PM


SOCIALISM ...bad.......umkay!


Oh yes must get rid of those Evil socialist Fire departments all over the country. Those evil socialist public libraries, and those god forsaken public works. No one who cannot afford Haliburton to come to their house and put out the fire at 200xs the cost should have their house fires put out and if they cant afford to pay Haliburton to rescue them from the fire they should roast like the no good pigs they are! Damn people learning in those evil socialist libraries too! only the rich should learn anything and they should pay through the nose for a private library or be damned! Yeah water and sewage should only be for rich mouth and feces if you can't afford it you should die of thirst or some infection from lack of sanitation !

Lets not forget those military people leeching off the VA and sucking the governments teat eating all that evil socialist food, and being put up in evil socialist barracks and flown all over the place in all that wicked socialist equipment. Damn if those commie **stards want anything to defend the country they should buy it their damn selves and stay out of our pocketbook. Those evil socialist generals should have to buy mercenaries from other countries in fact at the highest cost possible with their own money and if they dont have enough those dirty **stards need to have a bake sale!

Down with the socialists! Love it or leave it and all that drivel! YEEEEEEEEEEHAAAAWWW!

*shakes his head in disbelief at how short sighted some people can be.*
 kabiosile
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 27
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Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 11:09:28 PM



So what's so wrong about socialism?


Lets say I have three cows...my neighbor only has one cow...A socialist government will take a cow from me that I paid for,fed and raised and give it to my neighbor. This way we both have two cows...equality...



PS that is not socialism that is some half baked pipe dream of yours.

Socialism would be you and your neighbor would pool your money together and get more cows for the dollar and both of you would come up. United we stand divided we look like a bunch of idiots whom cant do basic math.
 kabiosile
Joined: 11/3/2005
Msg: 28
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Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/21/2009 11:24:11 PM


So what percentage of socialist countries don't engage in wealth redistribution


What percentage of them did not have to repair the damages of a capitalist system before they can become a socialist country?



Which socilaist political parties are against wealth redistribution?


Libertarian socialists might be a good place for a self proclaimed "anarchist" to start to investigate. You did claim to be an anarchist in another thread yes? I would not say they were "against" it but, they are not "for" it either. More like voluntary co-ops and unions as opposed to government forced ones. hmmmm.

 imalwayssmiling
Joined: 7/17/2009
Msg: 29
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History
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/22/2009 7:56:00 AM
I don't think he has any hidden agenda,he's been extremely upfront about all his moves.

As for socialism ,I quite enjoy it now,where we have a blend of the two,many of our countries organizations are socialist and others are not,I like having our police,fire,and such and public schools all being socialism and would like our health,well complete health plan made socialistic,sure Medicare and Medicaid and the VA are already socialistic,but I'd like it all.In fact I'd like it how Canadians have their health,their seeing that over the years there is a need for a for pay system blended in to there socialistic system.
 Wookie50
Joined: 4/9/2006
Msg: 30
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Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/23/2009 11:01:32 AM

They believe Obama is ruthlessly advancing a ‘secret agenda’ to bankrupt the United States and dramatically expand government control to an extent nothing short of socialism.


I think the previous guy beat him to it. Which shows that government control isn't synonymous with socialism.


They also believe they possess a level of knowledge and understanding when it comes to politics and current events, one gained from a rejection of the mainstream media and an embrace of conservative media and pundits such as Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh, which sets them apart even more.


In other words they hear what they want to.
 BikerBiker53
Joined: 6/11/2005
Msg: 31
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History
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/23/2009 12:09:03 PM
Actually,

I didn't think anyone was trying to keep it a "Secret"

Its been Public knowledge since before he was Elected, at least in my little corner of the world.

I look at it like this,.....as long as Im allowed to keep what I've worked for, and paid for, all my life,
and others are allowed to keep what they have worked for, and paid for,......Im cool.

What I dont want to see,..is someone get better Medical Treatment,...better Representation,...better Trash Service,..etc,....just because of the area of town we live in, or based on our Race, Creed, or Religion.

Thats where Socialism is supposed to level the playing field,..where we really need it.

If I worked for, and paid for 2 Vehicles,....I dont see where Im obligated to share one with a Lazy Neighbor, that neither worked for, nor paid for it.

So far,....I see things I dont like, but as long as this "Redistribute The Wealth" doesnt turn into an agenda of taking from people thats worked for their position and status in life,...Im cool,...

If redistributing the "Wealth" means spending some of that TAX Money in improvished neighborhoods, to help inprove the quailty of life for others less fortunate,.....instead of only spending it in upscale neighborhoods,....Im a'll for it.

But if its just a continuation of Over Taxing the Poor, and making them bare the brunt of the responcibility, but get none of the benefits,..you know,..the same old "Song and Dance" routine,...just dressed in fancier words,..then forget it.

All we have seen, and heard so far,.is the same old story,....just more of the "Same Old Same Old",...Lip Service,..we've heard since as far back as I can remember.

Im looking for "Hope",.....and,....."Change"

Instead of,...

"Hey Brother,..I Hope you can spare some Change?"

You know,

Socialism works great,..Till you run out of other peoples Money.

And our Government has just been on the bring of colapse for far too long for us to expect too much out of Obama, after all he is only one man,...and the people that actually run this Country total 535 Congresspersons,...

IF,...the people in Congress wanted a Balanced Budget, and a better Economy, they could of done so long ago.

I cant blame Obama for Socialism,..., I cant blame him for a lot of our Societies ills,...but I can blame him for not being smart enough to know that in order to cut Run Away Inflation, create a better Economy, and to help Balance a Budget,..you have to Cut Government Spending,....NOT Increase it.

No Country ever spent its way out of Debt.
 imalwayssmiling
Joined: 7/17/2009
Msg: 32
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History
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/23/2009 2:57:43 PM
Is national health insurance ‘socialized medicine’?

No. Socialized medicine is a system in which doctors and hospitals work for and draw salaries from the government. Doctors in the Veterans Administration and the Armed Services are paid this way. The health systems in Great Britain and Spain are other examples. But in most European countries, Canada, Australia and Japan they have socialized health insurance, not socialized medicine. The government pays for care that is delivered in the private (mostly not-for-profit) sector. This is similar to how Medicare works in this country. Doctors are in private practice and are paid on a fee-for-service basis from government funds. The government does not own or manage medical practices or hospitals.

The term socialized medicine is often used to conjure up images of government bureaucratic interference in medical care. That does not describe what happens in countries with national health insurance where doctors and patients often have more clinical freedom than in the U.S., where bureaucrats attempt to direct care.
 dmotz
Joined: 11/19/2008
Msg: 33
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/24/2009 8:10:13 AM
This about sums it up...from one of the great minds so loved by those in the white house...

" The new social system has only just been established and requires time for its consolidation. It must not be assumed that the new system can be completely consolidated the moment it is established, for that is impossible. It has to be consolidated systematically. To achieve its ultimate consolidation, it is necessary not only to bring about the socialist industrialization of the country and persevere in the socialist revolution on the economic front, but also to carry on constant and arduous socialist revolutionary struggles and socialist education on the political and ideological fronts. Moreover, various contributory international factors are required.
The socialist system will eventually replace the capitalist system; this is an objective law independent of man's will. However much the reactionaries try to hold back the wheel of history, eventually revolution will take place and will inevitably triumph.
Sound familiar?
Mao Tse Tung "
 imalwayssmiling
Joined: 7/17/2009
Msg: 34
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Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/24/2009 9:19:27 AM
Frankster you TKO'd him,way to go,I mean some of these haters talk of the impending sky "IS" going to fall,that Obama is the one way greased slide to Communism,its that rock in roll definitely leads to drugs and immoral behavior thing !

Its funny that many of these haters do not understand a vast amount of our system is already socialistic and we have not gone to hell yet.Well Bush tried,he bought us tickets,Obama stopped the plane !
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 35
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/24/2009 1:06:34 PM


Its funny that many of these haters do not understand a vast amount of our system is already socialistic and we have not gone to hell yet.Well Bush tried,he bought us tickets,Obama stopped the plane !


We understand that a vast amount of our system is socialistic, but disagree about not having gone to hell yet. The sky isn't going to fall, it's already falling.
 imalwayssmiling
Joined: 7/17/2009
Msg: 36
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Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/24/2009 1:22:01 PM

We understand that a vast amount of our system is socialistic, but disagree about not having gone to hell yet. The sky isn't going to fall, it's already falling.
I'm sorry your feeling so pessimistic,I do understand the Bush administration ,hell,lets just say it,the last 20 years of Republican majority has left us in such a horrible state that the economy collapsed and we had lost world trust and weakened most all our allies trust and confidence,who could blame them,we turned into a nation that had gone to torture ,starting wars over misinformation and wrong reasons and saying,"what constitutution"!

I'm happy though,because that was the past and we have Obama now and he has been turning around everything the the past administration buried.Whether in environmental,science,citizens rights,medicine,Iraq,infrastructure,Wall street,Banks,Auto,he have made improvements on every one of them,of course not fast enough for the mass of the "I have to have it know" mentality,but for the ones that realize unearthing a country out of a nuclear blast takes some work,we are realistically pleased at the reasonable pace ,understanding the entire scope of whats on his plate.

Now you being a fan of anarchy,I would assume its not hellish enough for your jollies !
 laxref41
Joined: 7/20/2008
Msg: 37
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/25/2009 6:27:39 PM
"I have to disagree with you. Would far left liberals agree with the thoughts below? I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. "

Actually... yes i can. It's the gargling and regurgitation of the holy water gospel of talk radio / Fox heroes who keep you from realizing it... who need to convince you that democrats are all about taking money that you earned in order to freely give it to those who don't deserve it. Nothing could be further from the truth!
 laxref41
Joined: 7/20/2008
Msg: 38
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/25/2009 6:36:54 PM
"I can blame him for not being smart enough to know that in order to cut Run Away Inflation, create a better Economy, and to help Balance a Budget,..you have to Cut Government Spending,....NOT Increase it. No Country ever spent its way out of Debt."

Precisely correct... but that doesn't mean you don't add the programs you need to add and cut other programs and make efficiencies elsewhere to pay for them.
 laxref41
Joined: 7/20/2008
Msg: 39
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/25/2009 6:41:52 PM
"The sky isn't going to fall, it's already falling"

Completely agree... although if we were to return to GOP Christian conservative Fascism... and it truly is fascism... the sky would fall a lot faster.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 40
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/25/2009 7:26:06 PM


I'm sorry your feeling so pessimistic,I do understand the Bush administration ,hell,lets just say it,the last 20 years of Republican majority has left us in such a horrible state that the economy collapsed and we had lost world trust and weakened most all our allies trust and confidence,who could blame them,we turned into a nation that had gone to torture ,starting wars over misinformation and wrong reasons and saying,"what constitutution"!


I'm sorry you feel that the Demoncrats share no part of the blame. It's voters like you who keep this dog and pony show alive. Left and Right are two wings of the same bird and it's dumping on all of our heads.



I'm happy though,because that was the past and we have Obama now and he has been turning around everything the the past administration buried.


Seems to me that he's doing his part to make matters worse.



Now you being a fan of anarchy,I would assume its not hellish enough for your jollies !


Personally I find the whole system so corrupt and unredeemable that I'm content to watch as it comes crashing down.
 CountIbli
Joined: 6/1/2005
Msg: 41
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/25/2009 7:27:54 PM


Completely agree... although if we were to return to GOP Christian conservative Fascism... and it truly is fascism... the sky would fall a lot faster.


Well in that case let me start campaigning for Palin/Huckabee 2012!
 imalwayssmiling
Joined: 7/17/2009
Msg: 42
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Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/25/2009 9:45:43 PM

Personally I find the whole system so corrupt and unredeemable that I'm content to watch as it comes crashing down.
Exactly what I'd expect you to say,you'd be the caped anarchist on the sidelines holding up a score.

I'm like Obama on his thoughts on a broken system,and that is that its all fixable,it takes lots of patience and lots of small steps,there is nothing fast here,its time consumning,its complex but I do not believe anything is too broke or too corrupt to be changed and improved,we differ in that I feel no joy here,I see suffering amongst things slowing improving and change for the better happening.We differ on our thoughts whereas I feel Obama is very genuine,Government will always has those amongst us that are corrupt,as with police or even presidents of your neighborhood HOA.

Its no mystery to me where we lost half of the Obama fan club,they know so little of how each system works that they just can't grasp why things are not turned around already.We have,and so do all countries,some very average people,and some very below average people,a good portion of our population in fact.We see them every time we're at the grocery store.There are too many people out there that cannot tell you how many continents we have ,and have ones that you would stump if you asked them what a continent is.Ever watched the show ,are you smarter than a fifth grader ? My point is alot of a country are not in tune to how things work,whether thats finance ,infrastructure,or even as mundane as a tire jack or how one programs something as basic and simple as a VCR,yet these same people vote and they voice their opinions and they choose which president they stand behind,whether they understand it or not.As I said long ago on a thread,my mother actually voted for Bush because she felt he was a better christian than Gore,that was her sole reason to pick a president of the United States.As for Obama she states he is very smart and he has very well behaved children,and felt he answered his questions well and McCain seemed to throw out insults rather than answer the questions.Hmmm,I feel she thought this out a little better than with Bush !

We are a country thats a melting pot of different cultures ,religions and intellects.I expect a certain amount in this country to cry out foul to some things that happen politically ,yet have no grasp of what exactly is going on.Others get fired up because there friends are,some because there preacher said so,all these types are putty in the hands of Limbaugh and others like him,Barnum would do well here ! The better it sounds,the more dramatic, the more many, become moths to a flame.

Anytime I here a poll figure I wonder how many of each type person participated in the poll.I put little trust in a poll if its a poll available to everyone.I do though tend to trust more, if its say,the Wall Street Journal that asked a question and had asked us to put in our vote,Wall Street Journal would be of no interest to most people.Same if Scientific Digest asked a question and wanted our opinion,I would certainly put more trust into the results given there.

The vast majority of this country has no grasp as to whether Socialism is good or if its bad.If you asked random people at the mall what is socialism,you would hear interesting responses and a lot of "I don't know's"

Its not hard to understand how these lobbyists ,shock jocks and right wing haters are being so successful,no mystery at all.I have to chuckle when people tell me how dumb Obama is,"anyone could go to Harvard,thats no big deal,don't mean your some genius".I don't know about you,but I think thats funny,all you can do,is grin.Yes lets all just go to Harvard next year,lets choose to do that.In my schooling I only knew one student,our Valedictorian that was awarded a full scholarship to Harvard,the news came via a handwritten letter from President Nixon.I tend to not listen closely to someone that makes a statement like that .Its a test of patience sometimes on these threads,After I tell someone the same thing for the fourth or fifth time,I end up blaming myself for having even gone as far as considering a third time let alone as far as I went.

Its no mystery why we have so much protest ! Sorry I went off on a tangent ,its just when I hear someone say "I'm content to watch as it comes crashing down",its makes me stand back ,look at the whole picture and think of the sources of so much anger, hatred,misinformation,and then also those that like to "mix it up a bit".
 cpfstock
Joined: 11/7/2005
Msg: 43
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/29/2009 11:07:01 PM
it's not a secret
 imalwayssmiling
Joined: 7/17/2009
Msg: 44
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History
Obama's Secret Agenda to bring about Socialism
Posted: 10/30/2009 3:56:41 PM

it's not a secret
excellent ,you finally say something I can agree with,its not a secret,because it true,there is no secret agenda,wow,first time I felt you stated something accurate.Usually its just hateful towards Obama or those that agree with correct logic or its your interesting slant on facts !
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