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Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?      Home login  
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 mr.evil
Joined: 11/14/2009
Msg: 251
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time? Page 11 of 54    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41)
Geee, I'm lost, what happened to D, E and F? Oh and what has any of this to do with 80% of the breakups?
 GotAHubCapDiamondStarHalo
Joined: 10/25/2009
Msg: 252
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 9:07:51 AM
D went off to slit her wrists at the unlikely prospect of trying to find a man who doesn't harbor ingrained resentment toward women. E is up in a belltower with a high powered rifle waiting for the voices to tell him who he needs to pick off to protect himself from the government's brain wave intrusions and F is considering a sex change operation since it is hard to identify with the anger harbored by the majority of their gender.

And yeah, the premise of the whole thread is flawed (as I explained in a previous post), because it is based on divorce filing stats, NOT breakup surveys.
 happybunny8
Joined: 4/16/2010
Msg: 253
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 9:13:40 AM
Z, I win.

Messages this short may not be posted.
 happybunny8
Joined: 4/16/2010
Msg: 254
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 9:22:18 AM

i'm sorry for your pain. good luck in the future, have hope.


Thanks for your kind words eden. I have many people in my life and am lucky in that the friends I make, I make for life and I continue to have hope in general, but the postings from some people on here really give me pause and in some ways continue to put nails in the seemingly increasing relationship coffin.

Like evil said, maybe there is nothing to debate? I agree. There never really was.
 zangie
Joined: 5/30/2007
Msg: 255
view profile
History
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 10:17:24 AM
Thank you Sexier User (love your posts..especially the sly, funny ones..lol) and mtnwldflower...while I knew the bottom line answer to X's A, B, C thing..I would never have been able to explain it in detail, logically...I must intuit better or something..lol..

I also mentioned several pages back that those stats are based on who files...and as I said, working in this field..who files is not always the one who wants the divorce..there are many reasons, both legal, practical and emotional to file first or not...

I wonder do all, some, most, men care who initates as much as they just are looking for someone to blame ?

I think quite a few women explained why they initiated their break ups...but, those answers appeared to not be acceptable to many of the men...like I said..do they want to know the reasons..or do they want validation for their viewpoint? Or, praise for being the "better" gender?

I have no problem actually discussing it , honestly, and with some implied understanding on both sides..but...I see few men willing to do the same...and honesty gets punished, no matter how much it's preached it's vital...
 x_file_
Joined: 9/30/2009
Msg: 256
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 6:35:49 PM

I'm assuming you are directing this slight at me based on my gender. It says loads about you and your mind set. Sad ... Really.


An assumption is something you have to prove before you can make further conclusions that rest on the assumption, otherwise your conclusions are unsupported, and are just further assumptions in a pyramid of assumptions - like a house of cards, but of assumptions.

I'm now sure you don't know anything about logic, and you didn't solve the problem yourself.

If my "mind set" is a certain way, it's because I've seen enough cases of women who don't know what they are talking about.



I love redundancy.


In other words, no expropriation.



I would also like to add that C is indeterminate based upon A and B.


Ah ah! I see. Well done. Except it's the reserve, and partially false.

A & B are indeterminate based on C and the nature of implication. C has a known value... C is true.


I would like to see some sources, that women initiate 80% of break-ups...if a man/woman cheats and breaks faith with the parameters of the agreed upon terms of the relationship, does that mean they are initiating a break-up?


OP should have offered sources for his claim. But if you are really that interested in the answer, find the sources yourself.



You DO have a knack for stating the obvious, which amuses me greatly. Carry on.


And you still can't get it.



I remain unconvinced, and unimpressed, with your inflated opinion of men (and by extension, YOURSELF) because I KNOW with absolute certainty that if it became somehow necessary for MORE women to become mechanics, engineers, pilots, etc, then that is exactly what women would do.


Like I said, and you STILL can't get it. The fact is men ARE in those professions/jobs, and have been for quite some time, therefore they have been and ARE the foundation of society, even at this very moment. Therefore women have needed, and STILL need men if they want to maintain their current lifestyle. In fact other men need those mechanics, electricians, pilots etc.. just as much.



I stopped being polite when you made the remark about the coffee. If you'd like to be spoken to with respect, try showing some.


Earn it!



The word is crises (plural) and I gave an example already.


You told me what you do. You didn't give an example.



...and just in the last month, have provided first aid to two people, one with a broken bone and one with a seizure


There...was it really that hard?



Those qualities are NOT the exclusive domain of men, contrary to your statement that women cannot handle crises.


I haven't seen a woman who can handle a crisis. I didn't say women can't handle crisis.



LOL.... why so many errors? Worked up about something?


Why can't you make out a misspelled word from the context?

And how many errors did you point out? One, correct? Where does the "so many errors" come from?



Who are you trying to impress with high school hypothetical questions when you cannot identify ONE element of illogical process in my ACTUAL statement?


I can point out other statements of yours where you fail logically other than your actual statement, can I not?

Also, some of you got the "high school hypothetical" question wrong.



For you to say, "No you can't because you are not logical" is not true, not proven, and a lame attempt at sidestepping my question.


Not at all. Electrical circuits are generally based on logic. To understand electrical components that make up the any electrical grid requires at the very least basic logic.



You have never seen a female mechanic, but you HAVE seen a grown woman cry over a broken nail "more times than you can remember".


Yes. Actually, not just grown women, but teenagers as well. I know two women who burst into tears at the sight of a fly... they just cry until the fly goes away.... they don't even move but just cry on one spot. The broken nail is just one example I have seen quite a lot. I've seen women cry in order to get their way.



Where the hell do you live? Have you taken up permanent residence in the "He-man women haters " club house? Say hi to Spanky for me....LOL


You seem to know Spanky, I don't. You can say hi to Spanky yourself.

And I don't hate women, but I don't like all of them either.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 257
view profile
History
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 7:24:30 PM
Men are the foundation of society anywhere on the planet.


Quite ridiculous, this argument really. But the truth is, none of us would be here at all if not for men and women getting together. The truth is, people got along without cars, without electricity, without running water, etc. But never have they continued to exist without each other.


OP should have offered sources for his claim. But if you are really that interested in the answer, find the sources yourself.


As far as that goes, it depends upon one's definition of initiate. Filing for the divorce is, for many seen as a final step, rather than the initiation. The majority of divorces are initiated by women, as are the majority of appts. with marriage counselors. It seems to me that the backlash here came about because of the statement that men are more important, more productive, more necessary, which seems to be proven false by the initial post. If that were the case, why then would women initiate leaving them? Importance is subjective. I would imagine that Gertrude Elion's contribution to society is far more important to a recipient of a heart transplant than any mechanic's.

How absurd this argument has become, all because of one rather immature, inflammatory post.
 GotAHubCapDiamondStarHalo
Joined: 10/25/2009
Msg: 258
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 7:25:56 PM

An assumption is something you have to prove before you can make further conclusions that rest on the assumption, otherwise your conclusions are unsupported, and are just further assumptions in a pyramid of assumptions - like a house of cards, but of assumptions.
You are confusing the notion of truth, which relates to the premises and conclusions of arguments, and the notion of validity, which relates to arguments themselves.
I'm now sure you don't know anything about logic, and you didn't solve the problem yourself.
Underestimation of my abilities has worked in my favor on more than one occasion.
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 259
view profile
History
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 7:45:22 PM
Good for you, sexiest!

Please note that for many, initiating divorce has indeed resulted in solving the problem themselves.
 Super_Eve
Joined: 10/23/2008
Msg: 260
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 8:10:13 PM
In other words, no expropriation.


Why do I need to expropriate? I am not the one making this claim:


men are mostly to be credited for the wonders of technology and civilization.


And before I go any further, let me just state that your whole argument is a non-sequitur with regards to the original post...but hey, I did bite...

Oh...and your argument was a total strawman by the way...go back and reread your post and the responses given.



So yes, men, as whole A , in comparison to women as a whole B are more valuable and certainly more important to the day to day operation in a society C .

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That is the correct answer. A => B is false only when A is true and B is false, and true in all other instances, hence even if B is true, no deductions can be made about A. Therefore, in the particular example, ([A & B] => C) & C, nothing can be deduced about [A & B].

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would also like to add that C is indeterminate based upon A and B.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ah ah! I see. Well done. Except it's the reserve, and partially false.

A & B are indeterminate based on C and the nature of implication. C has a known value... C is true.


The whole thing with logic, is that it has to add up. So far what you have posted does not add up. It makes no sense. What you have provided is a one way statement in which the conclusion C, is confirmed by the assumed validity of A and B. You are arguing a conclusion that has been assumed by the premise.

Like I said, I love redundancy...(as in this has already been pointed out to you before...)

Anyway...when we are being served red herring, who pays?

Oh! And I like pickles...does it come with pickles?
 cap_n_mORGAN
Joined: 7/3/2009
Msg: 261
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 8:11:10 PM
Getting back on topic.....The question is why do women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
The answer that I have seen way to often is that women is looking for the BBD.....Bigger Better Deal.
Where the men seem to want to work on the relationship.
Let me stress that this is from first hand experience. Not only of my relationships but those of my friends as well!!!!
One more point guys if your wife of many years says she wants breast implants go ahead and get the best attorney you can find!!!!......To back this statement up myself and 3 of my friends got divorced just weeks after buying boobies!!!! These divorces took place within a year of each other.
 late™
Joined: 2/1/2010
Msg: 262
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 8:16:21 PM
Geee, I'm lost, what happened to D, E and F?

Mr. Evil is wisely pointing out that, X files dude has tossed out a non sequitur, (...nothing to do with the OP), throwing down a logic gauntlet which is nothing more than one logical fallacy piled on the next.

Oh and what has any of this to do with 80% of the breakups?

Hmmm...

If this is a representation of the reasoning of 80% of the men who may or may not be self-aggrandizing/conflating their own importance with the state of civilization (um, ...by the same logic they're taking responsibility for all the crap in civilization), it's no surprise that women (the other default gender) eventually catch on to the easily validated logic that n = n ...the conclusion being "it's over".

..."n" being nonsense/non sequitur, take yer pick

Getting back on topic.....The question is why do women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?

'Cause they married idiots, but at this point, I'd love to thank all the idiots for making it seemingly easy to look good to the other gender by merely being reasonable.
 mr.evil
Joined: 11/14/2009
Msg: 263
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/20/2010 8:37:06 PM
Yes though I tend to agree, man has invented many things, electricity, structural engineering, mining and drilling methods for both gold, coal and oil. Hoooray!!

Oh... what about those other things though war, famine, organically engineered pestilence, false economies, dictatorships, etc, etc, oh well, guess I shouldn't have mentioned those, ooops, my bad!!

Now before the ladies go see, see, see! Both genders do most times come up short in the leadership roles. Seems most leaders need 75 PSI for their egos and their heads, and could give a sh1t less about the little people. You know the ones, they don't own the oil rigs, coal mines, electric companies, boutiques, hair salons for the stars, they just work there for bupkis, and somebody else gets the dough.

Well enough of my rant, this STILL doesn't tell me or anybody else, how to reduce that number from 80%. Yeah I know, your right, I'm just a pain in the azz, fly in the ointment, anal retentive and all the other wonderful adjectives you all have for me.

But I can always hope that someday, we will enlist the aid of men and women, who really want to fix themselves and their relationships, and not just yell "next!", whenever things don't go their way. Guess it's that diehard optimist in me.

So feel free to carry on, tell me all about the great acomplishments of women and men, while we continue to NOT be able to communicate with somebody with supposedly love. Not to worry, I have time, I should not die for several years, by then somebody should have said something intelligent without attacking anybody.
 MidshipMom
Joined: 7/19/2009
Msg: 264
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/21/2010 8:05:49 AM
Thing is, women really DO need men. Women cannot be husbands and fathers. Women realize this, and most go to great lengths to keep a family together.

A man needs to learn that it is NOT "helping out" that a wife desires, but by actively putting time and effort into the rearing of his children, he is becoming an integral part of the TEAM. A woman is less likely to divorce if the man makes himself so valuable for team survival, leaving him would be like cutting off her right arm. Men have not made themselves indispensible, but men aren't entirely to blame because they are never taught HOW to be indispensible.

You are right, Mr. Evil. This doesn’t tell us how to reduce the number of divorces. Most husbands WANT happy wives (and, I will add, knock themselves out to make them happy). To be honest, I wish I could say the answer is we should do A, B and C and 'poof' -- no more divorces, but the problem is so complex I don’t even know where to start. Insight please.
 happybunny8
Joined: 4/16/2010
Msg: 265
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/21/2010 10:04:55 AM
Oh, come on. I'm saying this as someone who is regularly scolded for "pandering" to men (because I happen to agree with men's postings more than women's), but even I have to call shenanigans on this.


Dawn - I usually find your posts quite fair actually and haven't noticed this pandering.

Most men can't handle half the stuff I've gone through at the hospital and outside. You want examples: Most can't even handle the sight of menstrual blood or even want to hear talk about it, nor have any men been there for me while I was sick and when both my grandparents died, they couldn't even be there with me at the funeral because "HE" couldn't handle funerals, so please enough with the wussy women comments.

So what if men can do more physical things than women? So what if women are stronger emotionally? It is what it is and so is the amount of people initiating break-ups.

Understanding that most people cannot handle things as well as I can is part of understanding myself and others (although it does not help with the hurt it causes at the time). Allowing those who know me to be comfy enough to be open with me to tell me how they feel has always been a goal; and I have succeeded with some people on this.

Most folks need a serious lesson in "suck it up" - it's not all about you. When my friend had no one to drive her to put down her pet, I took time off work to do this for her. It's not about how much work I would miss or money. Most people cannot see beyond their own needs.

Besides, A LOT men like women who are feminine and do all that wussy stuff. Why is that bad?

I'm not sure that number will ever be reduced Evil. The posts here continue to show why these numbers exist. As I said before, it is very sad and society in general will continue to both sadden and give me hope. Which side will win?
 x_file_
Joined: 9/30/2009
Msg: 266
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/21/2010 8:31:14 PM

Can't we just 'file' this happybachelor-worthy crap in the "troll" 'file' and shut the box? Kind of like they do at the end of Cold Case?


Classic!

You are not only encouraging suppression of freedom of speech, you are showing that you can’t handle disagreements, criticism, can't properly argue, or for that matter properly communicate.



Quite ridiculous, this argument really.


That particular statement is a statement, not an argument. Also, it is one thing to claim that my statement is ridiculous and another to offer, at least, some supporting evidence as to why my statement is ridiculous.

Look around you. Look at your immediate surroundings. Nearly everything has been engineered and built by a man – from your computer, to your car, to your house, to the street outside your house, and even the building/place your work at. From hospitals, to airports, to skyscrapers and even the very city you live in was planned, built, and is maintained mostly by men.



But the truth is, none of us would be here at all if not for men and women getting together.


Also, part of the truth is most people won't be here without the technological innovations of men. You don’t have to take my word for it. There is a strong correlation between technological advances and population growth. That is another piece of evidence (a premise if will) for my claim that women need men more than men need women.



It seems to me that the backlash here came about because of the statement that men are more important, more productive, more necessary, which seems to be proven false by the initial post. If that were the case, why then would women initiate leaving them?


I’m not sure where you're getting that statement from. Your question is built on a starwman.

Also I'm not talking about each and every man, but men as whole.



You are confusing the notion of truth, which relates to the premises and conclusions of arguments, and the notion of validity, which relates to arguments themselves.


You are referring to the soundness of an argument vs. the validity of an argument. Here is the thing, you didn’t make an argument you stated an assumption. You said so yourself.

What I said was:

"You are logical but not emmmjay (if you figured out the answer on your own that is.)"

And your reply was:



I'm assuming you are directing this slight at me based on my gender. It says loads about you and your mind set. Sad ... Really.


I thought someone helped you with the argument. It's not a gender thing, it's a human thing. Your assumption, was just that, an assumption, but you assumed its truth anyway in order to insult me. And that does indeed say a lot about your minds set.


Underestimation of my abilities has worked in my favor on more than one occasion.


I’m not underestimating your abilities. I only doubt one of your abilities, namely, your ability to do logic. You are logical in one instance, and not in the next.



Men and women have historically needed one another. While science and technology (not the same thing as SOCIETY, btw) was being advanced mostly by men, women were expected to do a lot of other things. You think it was a cakewalk farming, making a home, and giving birth to numerous children back in the middle ages? I hardly think women got a free ride when it comes to building SOCIETY.


I don't think women (as whole) got a free ride. Your claim is in no way in conflict with mine. Men are the foundation of society, and women generally make society better. A man makes a house, and a woman improves it. A man designs a car, and a woman makes it beautiful, etc., etc., etc..





I can point out other statements of yours where you fail logically other than your actual statement, can I not?

I dunno. You haven't yet.


I can, and I have:





What argument? Okay...men rule the world...Xfile is a man...therefore Xfile rules the world? Every woman must want you!

Also, the conclusion of your argument is wrong. The conclusion should be "Therefore x_file is ONE of the men who rules the world".


More?



Why do I need to expropriate? I am not the one making this claim:


en are mostly to be credited for the wonders of technology and civilization.





Do you or do you not think the wonders of technology and civilization were achieved by men, and achieved at a cost? Your statement here:



This is one of my favourite arguments hosted by the self-aggrandising man. They assume all of the credit for the wonders of technology and civilization but are unwilling to expropriate the responsibility of how this may have occurred.


...clearly shows that you think men are unwilling to expropriate the responsibility of their actions which implies that "men did it". In other words, not only you agree that man are to be credited for the wonders of technology and civilization, but also your statement implies you think there is an expropriation, a price, a cost at which men achieved the aforementioned things. So what is the expropriation? You made the expropriation claim not me, so where is YOUR expropriation?



The whole thing with logic, is that it has to add up. So far what you have posted does not add up. It makes no sense.


To an illogical person, logic makes no sense. Consider:



Mtnwldflower:

So yes, men, as whole A , in comparison to women as a whole B are more valuable and certainly more important to the day to day operation in a society C .


Mtnwldflower:

I would also like to add that C is indeterminate based upon A and B.



C is clearly NOT indeterminate in this argument: [A & B] implies C, C, Therefore_____.

The only other place where C might be indeterminate is in your “ABC analysis” of my claim – which is quoted above.

But even there, C is NOT indeterminate. C is equal to A & B. Men and women comprise what we call society.

Even if there a million other things that comprise society, so that C = A & B & D & E, ... & Z , men & women (A & B) are known and belong to C (society), so C cannot be indeterminate. At the very worse, C is partially known, but definitely NOT indeterminate.

You don’t really need logic see that… to say that C is indeterminate is to say that “society is indeterminate” – and that makes as much sense as you do.

C is not indeterminate in my argument and not indeterminate in your ABC analysis of my claim. Therefore C is not indeterminate, period.

You are wrong. It’s you who makes no sense.



Like I said, I love redundancy...(as in this has already been pointed out to you before...)


In other words, once again, no expropriation.



'Cause they married idiots, but at this point, I'd love to thank all the idiots for making it seemingly easy to look good to the other gender by merely being reasonable.


It takes an idiot to marry an idiot.
 late™
Joined: 2/1/2010
Msg: 267
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/21/2010 8:46:57 PM
For someone claiming the high road in logic, you sure do a good job of avoiding it...


C is clearly NOT indeterminate in this argument: [A & B] implies C, C, Therefore_____.

-> Circular argument, one that is also a non sequitur in the context of the topic of debate.

Logic ...twice removed
 Super_Eve
Joined: 10/23/2008
Msg: 268
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/21/2010 9:57:54 PM
I'm assuming you are directing this slight at me based on my gender. It says loads about you and your mind set. Sad ... Really.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I thought someone helped you with the argument. It's not a gender thing, it's a human thing. Your assumption, was just that, an assumption, but you assumed its truth anyway in order to insult me. And that does indeed say a lot about your minds set.


Oh, the irony!


To Sexiest: You are logical but not emmmjay (if you figured out the answer on your own that is.)


and...


I thought someone helped you with the argument. It's not a gender thing, it's a human thing. Your assumption, was just that, an assumption, but you assumed its truth anyway in order to insult me. And that does indeed say a lot about your minds set.


It is interesting that the meeting of divergent ideas is predicated on your subjective interpretation.



Do you or do you not think the wonders of technology and civilization were achieved by men, and achieved at a cost? Your statement here:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is one of my favourite arguments hosted by the self-aggrandising man. They assume all of the credit for the wonders of technology and civilization but are unwilling to expropriate the responsibility of how this may have occurred.


I thought you would have picked up on that one.

I was expressing a possibility to go with the nonsense post you provided. I never actually agreed with you.



The only other place where C might be indeterminate is in your “ABC analysis” of my claim – which is quoted above.

But even there, C is NOT indeterminate. C is equal to A & B. Men and women comprise what we call society.

Even if there a million other things that comprise society, so that C = A & B & D & E, ... & Z , men & women (A & B) are known and belong to C (society), so C cannot be indeterminate. At the very worse, C is partially known, but definitely NOT indeterminate.


This is a vacuous truth. Look it up.


You don’t really need logic see that… to say that C is indeterminate is to say that “society is indeterminate” – and that makes as much sense as you do.


Try following your own logic within the strictures of logic and don't be surprised if they come up short. Again...logic adds up.



You don’t really need logic see that… to say that C is indeterminate is to say that “society is indeterminate” – and that makes as much sense as you do.

C is not indeterminate in my argument and not indeterminate in your ABC analysis of my claim. Therefore C is not indeterminate, period.


I mean no offense, I am treating you like a peer, but I can't get past the six-tuple negatives in your post. I am confused about what you are saying and I need some clarification.


C is not indeterminate in my argument and not indeterminate in your ABC analysis of my claim. Therefore C is not indeterminate, period.


Again, I say, it doesn't add up.



[A and B] implies C
Having labia and red hair on it implies you are a natural redhead.
Carrot Top (the comic) has naturally red hair. Therefore he has labia with red hair on it!


(Thank you, Sexiest)

Do I have to spell it out for you?

It is not a weakness, to concede a point dontcha know...
 ohwhynot46
Joined: 6/28/2009
Msg: 269
view profile
History
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/21/2010 10:05:35 PM

That particular statement is a statement, not an argument. Also, it is one thing to claim that my statement is ridiculous and another to offer, at least, some supporting evidence as to why my statement is ridiculous.


I hate to break it to you, but you are not the most important person in the world. The statement you quote was not in response to your particular postings. It is ridiculous to argue that one gender is more important than another, as we would could not exist without each other, period. At the very least, it is a digression from the topic at hand.

PS Being a pompous azz is NEVER attractive. Just sayin'
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 270
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/22/2010 5:01:19 AM

Understanding that most people cannot handle things as well as I can is part of understanding myself and others (although it does not help with the hurt it causes at the time).

I agree with this. I'm the same way and I admit if I can handle something a man can't I find it odd to some degree as I was taught growing up that as a female it'd be harder for me to deal with things.

Allowing those who know me to be comfy enough to be open with me to tell me how they feel has always been a goal; and I have succeeded with some people on this.

I'm still working on that one, but I agree with this as well.

Most folks need a serious lesson in "suck it up" - it's not all about you. When my friend had no one to drive her to put down her pet, I took time off work to do this for her. It's not about how much work I would miss or money. Most people cannot see beyond their own needs.

I agree wholeheartedly with this too - especially for people who think that what's happening is only happening to them. While I will insist on being there for a friend who has to put a pet down, for instance because I know how tough it is to do alone - I'd never expect someone to have to go with me to do it - as it's not something I'd inflict on someone else.

Besides, A LOT men like women who are feminine and do all that wussy stuff. Why is that bad?

For men who like this there are lot of women who do this, so for me that's a wash. There are men out there who like all different types of women, so there's no shortage of women, or matching types.

Men are the foundation of society, and women generally make society better. A man makes a house, and a woman improves it. A man designs a car, and a woman makes it beautiful, etc., etc., etc..

I'm not trying to be difficult, but I really don't get this statement as it points to gender. People build society, and people make it better. Houses are built by some and decorated by others. I really need to ask you to explain how a woman makes a car beautiful - is it by laying across the hood? Adding air fresheners? I honestly have no idea what that means.
 rearguard*2
Joined: 2/8/2008
Msg: 271
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how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/22/2010 5:20:03 AM

Men are the foundation of society, and women generally make society better.


And here I thought that the Cro-magnons died out in millennia past!

In the end, my own conclusion is that there is no such thing as a man, nor a woman, beyond the practical reality of the need to label the components of the biological system that continues life. We are, essentially, one with each other, without any real independence. Eliminate all the women, and there will be no men shortly thereafter, and the same can be said for men.

We make society together, always have, always will. There is synergy between the sexes, and it is that synergy that makes the society in which we live, and continues it through time. To ascribe to one of thee sexes the source of society is hubris beyond comprehension. To ask for an explanation of the idea expressed by the quoted statement is to ask for an explanation of unreasoned ego. A pointless exercise that will yield only an expression of fantasy, one held by someone who has no ability to see reality as anything but their own desire.
 x_file_
Joined: 9/30/2009
Msg: 272
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/22/2010 6:23:37 AM

It is interesting that the meeting of divergent ideas is predicated on your subjective interpretation.


And her assuming that her claim was true was predicated on her objectivity?


This is one of my favourite arguments hosted by the self-aggrandising man. They assume all of the credit for the wonders of technology and civilization but are unwilling to expropriate the responsibility of how this may have occurred.


What type of person thinks men should expropriate responsibility for their actions, actions which men MAY have done?

Once again, you make NO sense.


Again...logic adds up


Says a person who doesn't know much (or anything) about logic.



Again, I say, it doesn't add up.


Irrelevant. You have to show it.



[A and B] implies C
Having labia and red hair on it implies you are a natural redhead.
Carrot Top (the comic) has naturally red hair. Therefore he has labia with red hair on it!



(Thank you, Sexiest)

Do I have to spell it out for you?

It is not a weakness, to concede a point dontcha know...



It is indeed not a weakness to admit you are wrong. So perhaps you should consider it before you further embarrass yourself and Sexiest.

Your argument:

1) Having labia and red hair on it implies you are a natural redhead.
2) Carrot Top (the comic) has naturally red hair.
Therefore he has labia with red hair on it!

You are basically repeating the argument ([A & B] => C) & C, and you are trying to point out?

C in this argument is either equal to "A person is a natural redhead" or more particularly , 'Carrot Top is naturally a redhead". In other words, C has a KNOWN value. You are STILL wrong about C being indeterminate.

If you are trying to point out that the conclusion does not follow from the premises, because the argument has an invalid form, you'd be correct - but this was pointed out by Sexist_User in post 436. That's the reason I made the argument in the first place. Did you fall asleep or something?

Logic is not just knowing when something "adds up" but also knowing when it doesn't.

And if you think this claim:

"So yes, men, as whole A , in comparison to women as a whole B are more valuable and certainly more important to the day to day operation in a society C ."

is equal the this argument: ([A & B] => C) & C then you are wrong, again. You simply ABC'd my claim, and for some retarded reason assumed the relation between A, B and C is an implication when it can easily be equivalence - and it is. This is evidence that you not only don't know logic, but don't know when or how to properly apply it.


I hate to break it to you, but you are not the most important person in the world.


Love to break it to you, I never claimed so, nor do I think so.


It is ridiculous to argue that one gender is more important than another, as we would could not exist without each other, period. At the very least, it is a digression from the topic at hand.


Maybe, maybe not. But that's not my argument.



PS Being a pompous azz is NEVER attractive. Just sayin'


I don't care.



I really need to ask you to explain how a woman makes a car beautiful - is it by laying across the hood? Adding air fresheners? I honestly have no idea what that means.


Graphic designers, interior decorators, etc.,
 cap_n_mORGAN
Joined: 7/3/2009
Msg: 273
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/22/2010 7:17:02 AM
As far as the logic debate. I can not see how anyone can even think they could put men and women into a logic equitation and believe they could come up with a logical answer!!!

The factor everyone has left out is integrity.....Simply stated it is the integrity in a person that determines the person and that is the determining factor in society.

That is also the determining factor in whether most marriages stay together. When a person gets married they make a covenant with that person and God. To be there come what may till death do them part.
The person responsible for breaking the covenant is the one without integrity.
So the formula would look something like this. [A+B] x I = C
A man and a woman's integrity has the most influence on the out come NOT their gender.

You people look like a dog chasing it's tail!!!....What are you going to do when you catch it?.....Bite it then you just hurt yourself and look silly!!!

There are good reasons for divorce, abuse, addiction, cheating......ect.
However I doubt all 80% of women that start the proceedings have them as a reason.
So getting back on topic why do 80% of women file first........INTEGRITY!!!

Keeping your word sticking it out through the good and bad times. Not just when it serves you best......That is what marriage is suppose to mean.
 RazzleRoadRunner
Joined: 4/13/2007
Msg: 274
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/22/2010 7:24:42 AM
The #1 reason women initiate the breakup IMO, is because their husbands don't place any value on her contributions to the family and home as a wife and/or mother.

Most women are better off remaining unattached and in the paid workforce......at least she only has to work 8 hours in a day, has 2 days of rest out of 7, earns a retirement pension and can take a sick day without be expected to cater to the demands of others. Her achievements and contributions are rewarded with a promotion, raise and the occasional honorable mention in the organization she works for. If her workload is too demanding, her manager will typcially assign a person or group of people to assist. A wife/mother does not seem to be valued in any of these ways in our society......so why bother doing a thankless job.

How many men would stay in a thankless job that was not valued by his manager or co-workers?
 RobertKoi
Joined: 11/9/2008
Msg: 275
how come women initiate the breakup 80% of the time?
Posted: 4/22/2010 7:32:02 AM
Because women disrespect men these days. That's why.
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