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Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 1
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Visitation: Dos and Don'tsPage 2 of 2    (1, 2)
I checked the archives and didn't see anything that deals with this situation.

I didn't want my children to attend church with their Dad today..... not because of religious issues, but because of the H1N1 situation and there are a lot of people infected in my community right now... including my brother who was just diagnosed 48 hours ago.

My Ex took them to church...and he told them very bluntly that me saying Not to Go to Church was Stupid.

well the kids understood it was about the flu ...and not because of any objections to attending church in general.

He went on to tell them that basically...His time with them was his time and he dictates how they spend it.

the kids are upset... an as for not attending was only for one week as the kids were vaccinated this week and it takes @8-10 days for the body to be immune. They would be fine by next Sunday to attend.

Was I being unreasonable to make this request?
I have not denied him access at any time...and if anything I have to make contact with him to see the kids. The only time they do not hang out with him is if they are sick and I feel it just holds everyone back when one kid is sick... so I take care of that child so they can carry on.

I'm very angry right I am totally confused why he suddenly got this attitude like I was denying him his children. Hell I would luv if he had them more often. I am the one making the effort for visitation.
Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 2
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/8/2009 4:55:33 PM
Not sure how many replies I can make on this post..but here goes.

I am basically keeping them cloistered as much as I can...yes...but not quarantined.
We are limiting our activities....and using caution..that is why we are we can not be cloistered if indeed the vaccine will protect the kids.

I have a child with a compromised immune system and one with cold induced asthma...which means where a healthy child might get a cold or flu and shake it off in a few days... my kids are out for weeks and their lungs are full with fluid and the infection tends to settle in for a long while.

they are getting healthier as they grow up....but again I try to be cautious when I feel it is necessary.

over 200 kids and staff were sick a few weeks ago at the school, that week all 3 of my kids were sick...they were home for @3-4 days depending on the kid...and went back..the school actually asked that I not send the healthy kid back...cos there were so many others coming back too soon and getting sick again.

I've been thru a lot of with sick kids over the last 14 years.... so I don't think I am over-reacting ..and I don't think my request of not going to church this one Sunday was unreasonable.
Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 3
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/8/2009 5:21:09 PM
Nope... they are going to school...that week the 200 were sick.. I didn't find out til the kids were back in school... my tenant's kid was sick for days too I didn't know.

nope.... I send them to school with sniffy noses and sore throats.....we try to boost their immune system and they are not living a sheltered life....this H1N1 is spreading a bit much in my lil community right now so I am taking precautions.... like no big groups of huggin n kissin or big playgroups. One of my daughters is plays on a basketball team...we are keeping an eye on that.... many school activities are being monitored and the schools get wiped down by a team of cleaners if it has more than 10% of the students are off sick.

as I brother has just been diagnosed with full blown H1N1 ...and he is in quarantine.

and NOPE...if there is someplace I want or have to be.... and the kids are sick.. I will not go. I would not take them out and compromise them. It just wouldn't cross my mind to even go.
I would never think of preventing others from carrying on their activities without us.... .we take a raincheck.

and as for if it matters what you say...yes, it does...because I can my question was is it an unreasonable request I made to my Ex?
I do want the feedback. I don't see any need for a personal attack of course...but...ya.. I do want feedback please.

Great, then why did you even start this thread...sigh.

to get your attention no doubt....
Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 4
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/8/2009 6:18:03 PM
The Ministry of Education in our province...of British one of your states...the Ministry is not advocating the hand sanitizer in school....they want the kids to use soap and warm water. The Health units agree as sanitizers are a temporary fix and not as effective as hand washing.

ya...there has been a lot of schools shut down and I know of two school districts now that have closed all their schools because of the sheer number of children and teachers sick in whole communities.

a crew of cleaners dressed in overalls and masks like a mini hazmat team goes in to clean the schools if more than 10% of the school population is sick.

this H1N1 virus apparently stays alive on hard surfaces, ie.. desk, doorknobs, counters etc.. for up to 48 hours.

Many in our community are sick. What little we can do to stay put and not spread it more helps.
Joined: 8/4/2007
Msg: 5
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/9/2009 10:50:57 AM
I agree with what WindRoper said...I'm staying out of the flu battle!

If you want to pass a message to your ex, hand him a note if you don't talk, or are afraid of an argument, if you can't call on the phone. Verbal messages back and forth through the kids are a no no! Leave them out of it as much as you can.

His time IS his time - what he does with the kids, where he goes, who they are with - all up to his judgement. Remember - that is a two way street. How would you feel if he questioned your calls about the kids?

As to him saying what he did - been there done that can't control what he says. You can only control your response to it. Don't stoop to that level.
Joined: 5/3/2006
Msg: 6
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/9/2009 3:44:23 PM

Here in the U.S., joint legal custody gives the non-custodial parent (I am a non-custodial father with joint legal custody) the right to have say and influence in matters of schooling, religious training, medical care and the like.

My time with my son is mine to govern, so long as I do not truly endanger him or threaten his well-being. Sounds like that is true in B.C., too.

Therefore, ultimately, he is correct.

Yes and no.

I have full custody and care & control over all (medical) decisions. While I agree that what the non-custodial parent does with their time is their own choice, I have to say that considering the current situation I would have had a face-to-face conversation with him and asked him please not to take them and explained my reasons for it. It's no unreasonable to do such... and it wouldn't have been unreasonable for him to agree.

I just spent the weekend toting #1 from clinic to emergency dentist to ER because I didn't like the answer I got from our local doc and there were too many *what ifs* that needed clarification. I chose not to call the ex and tell him what was going on until I had an answer and explanation to satisfy any questions he might have. I did call him last night once I got home and we talked about everything. It is not unreasonable for a parent to voice their concerns where their children's health and welfare goes.

It's not about who gets their way, it's about what's best for the kids.

My ex is guilty of letting our then 7 yo watch the full Aliens series of movies... and left me to deal with 6 mo of nightmares. Now I ask that he be aware of and follow the censor's recommendations on movies and games. He's also chosen not to medicate them, and issue that has caused some significant problems between us. Because he hasn't really spent a lot of time with them over the last 5 yrs, he is not aware of everything that could potentially mess them up. Because he doesn't think that those things are bad (violence, sex, foul language, etc) he doesn't think anyone else will either.

WesternRose felt it was best they not attend for this week. I'm not clear, but I don't think she actually voiced this to her ex. Considering there are extenuating circumstances behind her decision, I do not think it was unreasonable. It's one freakin' week.
Joined: 8/3/2007
Msg: 7
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/9/2009 3:47:50 PM
I know you are concerned about your children. You can convey those concerns to your x but not in front of the kids. It is x's time so what he does with the information is up to him.
Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 8
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/9/2009 8:37:29 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Ya.. I hear you.

thanks for all the feedback...all valid.

FYI... spent a week in the hospital with one kid aged 4 months old ...respiratory virus that damaged her lungs for life.
Same kid...age 2 ... e-coli from tainted tap water...told she would die within two weeks if her white blood cell count didn't go up. There were complications all along the way. Kid was pumped with antibiotics... as I stayed by her side.... blood tests @ 6 - 8 times a day on her. I have a child with a compromised immune system....building it up slowly over the years... flu of any sort can kill her if it sets in.

it's the pneumonia that will kill you damaged set of lungs don't help.

apparently I am over-reacting.
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 9
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/10/2009 9:04:23 AM
Karmic, I don't know if your community was spared but a month or so ago here, a totally normal 12-year-old girl, no asthma, no underlying heart condition, was picked up from school on Friday. The doctor did not believe her symptoms warranted Tamiflu so she was sent home with other appropriate meds. She was admitted to the hospital, having developed pneumonia on Saturday and was dead on Sunday.

I am not paranoid, nor do I give my children flu shots although it was something I struggled with this year. My kids have weather-induced asthma and while I can normally keep them out of the emergency room, I was worried that the shot could kill them or not giving them the shot could kill them. My daughter's immune system was compromised when she was around 12 when she picked up some sort of stomach virus so she and I did both get the flu shot and were both sick for a week, so I opted out for the boys.

I normally abhor the way the media handles these things but we have had bouts of swine flu since the spring, the natural flu season never ended here. And more alarming is that there have now been cases of swine flu in dogs, yes, the virus is jumping species which is exactly the strain of something that can be epidemic.

OP, I don't think you were unreasonable as I also don't think he was necessarily unreasonable but with your childrens' specific conditions, I believe that he should have agreed with your request.

But, you can't control what he does with the children when they are with him so you have the right to make the request but after that, you have no choice really other than letting it go.
Joined: 11/7/2008
Msg: 10
Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/17/2009 10:00:41 AM
Wow...I'm SOOOO glad that I get along great with my son's dad...we DISCUSS things like this without raising our voices or directing blame at each other.

I'm also thrilled that my son's step-mom is a nurse and has access to information that made it easier to make decisions regarding health.

When your kids dad has his "custody" days, you pretty much have no say in what they do or where they's his right as a father to take them to church if he chooses to do so. I would suggest getting some kind of "co-parent" therapy.
Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 11
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/17/2009 11:32:02 AM
Difficult to explain this....but since I posted this thread....well I have officially given up.

Where we had a good relationship....agreement to communicate and ensure we did what was best for the children at all was all just do I say this....

"ya...ya...ya....ya, ya, ya"

something my Ex taught me about way before we were's how he just nods in the affirmative....but is actually ignoring the was a joke to was how he 'communicated' with his mother and others.

I HEAR you....but I am NOT listening to you.....nor am I agreeing with anything you are saying. I am going to do things my way.

This past Sunday there was no communication once he had the children.... I tried to contact him several times on the Friday to let him know I was working on Saturday and where they were.... I couldn't reach voicemail.
I rushed home from work Sat, picked up the kids from my parents place and dropped them off at his place. He could of had them much earlier if we could reach him.

Sunday we had a major storm front hit the coast, trees down.....power outtage....the children arrived at the front door soaked to the bone, their thick winter coats full of water, their overnight bags completely umbrellas, they walked home in the rain.
I don't have a dryer.... so we just managed.

He dropped them off at 1:00pm again..... no lunch in their tummies.

ya...what he does with them on his time....none of my business... I am just in charge of the clean up and the childcare when they are sick and hungry.

Not going to expel any more energy to bend, compromise....just going to go with the flow even if I think it may be not a good situation ... a safe situation.... and I am going to ignore any complaints from the children about what things happened when they are with their dad.

No more trying to help build bridges and see the bright side of visits.... no coercing the kids to go have a great time with Dad....nope...not my job.

Not going to discipline the kids and tell them to stop referring to him as a womanizer and the other things that spew from their mouths...based on their personal observation. They have met several of his new girlfriends over the last few years.
I find most of the time they don't know what they are saying....and I find it disrespectful.... I tell them explain to them it is wrong. I put a stop to it.

I don't speak ill of their dad. I don't want to know about his life.
I don't grill the kids, I just don't need to know a lot of things.

I am done trying to do damage control and build bridges so he can have a healthy and respectful relationship with the children....... Nahhh....not my job. I have read what all of you have written, and thank you...sincerely thank you.... but after 28 years of this twisted form of communicating I have clued in finally. I am worn out.

I was wrong. It's none of my business what happens when they are with their dad.
Joined: 8/26/2009
Msg: 12
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/17/2009 5:37:26 PM
Sorry I don't mean to controdict but allergies aren't something you catch like a cold. My sister and I were country kids, we played outside and eat a variaty of foods and had terrible allergies. My sister, worse than myself. We were allergic to dust and milk and food color , bee stings etc. I outgrew mine and I think my sister did too. exposing your kids to sickness and allergens isn't going to stop them from getting sick or having allergies. You have been lucky.
Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 13
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/18/2009 11:35:37 AM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^ had to reply to this. The quote...that I would not longer bother discipling them was because I am worn out....fed up of doing damage control.

As for The Womanizer comment:

I asked her about it when she repeated the word a few times. I didn't want to overeact initially....not to give it any creedance.
She seemed to enjoy her new found word too much. Apparently another girl at school's dad is a womanizer too and it was discussed.

Where did you hear that word?
She said that 'Charlie' on Two and a Half Men is a womanizer.
I then told her that I had told her previously that she is not allowed to watch that show and that I don't care what Charlie was.... it was very rude to refer to her father as that.

she then said to me...well he has a new girlfriend every week...and then her sisters agreed with her.

my daughter is almost 15.... in highschool.... I try my best not to stifle their opinions and thoughts.... that said I do draw the line when it comes to respect....and I don't care what her observations are.... I set her straight that she is not to be disrespectful and make assumptions and call anyone names like that...especially her father... I made that very clear to her sisters too!

so assume what you may about me... I will tell you this now..the word 'womanizer' does not exist in my vocabulary....and I do not speak disparingly about their father...if anything I have gone beyond duty to help build a respectful and healthy relationship with their father.
I have requested in the past that he be aware that they are children and they form opinions and make just keep that in mind.... I did not give him any specifics.
I don't want to know what he is doing in his personal life.... I don't care... I am not his keeper.
I am just constantly doing damage control on my end and trying to be factual with the kids and not get be judgmental about others.

back to someone who asked why not immunize my kids...well at the time I posted the initial thread..the kids had been immunized...and I just requested they miss church for that one the vaccine takes 8-10 days to protect your immune system....they would of been all clear by the following Sunday.

*** the EX called me last night..left a message...He can not see the children as he has a bad bout of the flu and is very sick.****
Joined: 8/26/2009
Msg: 14
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 11/18/2009 11:41:43 AM
womanizer: If the shoe fits

You can't fool kids that age, they aren't stupid
Joined: 9/15/2008
Msg: 15
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Visitation: Dos and Don'ts
Posted: 12/14/2009 8:14:00 AM
As previously stated by my Ex to the children....'My time with you is My Time!"

so....same Ex....this past Sat night... I dropped them off when he asked me to... .he has no car at the's below freezing here @ problem .

I dropped them off @ 3:00pm.....he fed them, left them home alone from @ 5:30pm til sometime after 11:00pm..... he went to a Christmas much for spending time with his 9, 11 and 14 year old.

I would of let it go, except that it was the first thing the kids blurted out to me when they got home yesterday. My youngest said she was scared to be home alone and told her sisters to call mom and let's go home.
They were more scared of their dad so they didn't call me.

I mentioned to him that I understood he has a social life, and that is good, but he could of made alternative plans with me to switch sleepover nights for the kids so he could go out.
He called me twice yesterday to arrange for getting them for Xmas eve and all Xmas day and dinner.....he plans on making a big feast for him and the kids....

and then called back 1 hour later to say he changed his mind.... he has other plans for Xmas dinner now he is going to a friends, not going to need the kids that day.

he made a big hoopla to the kids about making a big Xmas celebration....the whole time with him...then calls me to tell the kids plans are off.
He hadn't even come to an agreement with me before he told the kids about his original plans.

Somehow I am the bad guy here?.... I am allowing full access to the children... trying to get them to see him more often... he lives within walking distance from us, I encourage the kids to see their dad....HE is YOUR DAD....make an effort...but really now... hard to sell this to the this my job to mend bridges that are broken constantly?
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