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 Kimberish925
Joined: 6/22/2008
Msg: 57
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?Page 2 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
I think there are big differences between those that are grammatically challenged or just plain lazy or English is simply not their first language. I think you can tell the difference between the styles. I am forgiving to a point on this issue.

Personally, if the first impression is going to be judged on what you have written whether in a profile or e-mail I think you should take the time to make sure that at the very least you have used proper punctuation, capitalization and for God's sake learn to write in paragraphs.

I see it like this...I take the time to read over what I have written and make sure it makes some sort of sense and is well written. I would expect the same or we may not be on the same level. I don't or rarely use text speak even when texting and when it's used in e-mail it makes me crazy.
 AsharpTechie
Joined: 1/27/2009
Msg: 62
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/10/2010 9:20:33 PM
"grey=gray" - Actually Webster's dictionary lists both of these as an acceptable spelling. Though I still see Gray as being the correct way.

But yes, the amount of people online that have a complete and total inability to spell correctly is astounding. I don't know whether it's a general indifference, or just laziness, or even total and complete ineptitude.

But, that's the internet for you.
 Bookbelle
Joined: 10/24/2008
Msg: 66
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/11/2010 6:18:01 AM

I'm sure you've got friends who text and email with abbreviated misuse of the english language? When was the last time you received a hand-written letter from a friend??


The vast majority of my friends refrain from misuse of the English language even in texts and emails, and I'm 19 - my friends and I grew up texting/emailing each other since our early teens. Although I rarely receive hand-written letters, any letters/emails I do receive are more often than not written with the correct usage of the English language, and not "text speak".

The whole point of "text speak" originally was to save money on mobile phone bills due to the character limit. In emails and letters, this simply isn't necessary; I don't even like it (or use it) in text messages to be honest, except when very low on credit. If I don't like "text speak" in actual text messages, then I'm not going to put up with it in emails and other forms of communication, where there is absolutely no call for it.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 68
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/11/2010 6:38:30 AM

I do hate to be petty but if you are to be so ungracious towards guys who have given up there valuable time to write to you, as to criticise there English could I point out that your opening sentence "the incidence of illiterate men who write me," should be write to me(-:
but I wish you well!

No, actually it is "write me". The "to" is implied...and BTW, if a guy's time is that valuable but his interest in making an impression isn't, I suggest he save time and not bother altogether. He's not doing anyone a favor by sending messages.

Help people learn .

People are here to date and make connections, not tutor. There are people out there who do tutor primarily though as part of their job (or they volunteer). They probably won't want to date you. The two aren't connected.

Some have little knowledge in computers,

So? Keyboards and typewriters aren't that different. If you can type you can use either one. Spelling and grammar has nothing to do with computer savvy.

others do not know what to say

That's a social skill issue and one again, doesn't have squat to do with spelling and grammar. People who don't know what to say here don't know what to say anywhere - so they need to figure out what to say, not how to spell it.

and others are so lazy to write anything.....

Obviously a lot of people are. That's the point of the thread.

I maintain that asking for at least a sixth grade grasp on spelling and grammar is NOT too much to ask from a bunch of adults. If they can't grasp it, they need to have an awareness of it and be making a current effort to try to learn it and want to edit themselves. If that desire to at least want to know how to write or look good is missing, then I'm not interested.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 69
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/11/2010 8:00:22 AM

I maintain that asking for at least a sixth grade grasp on spelling and grammar is NOT too much to ask from a bunch of adults. If they can't grasp it, they need to have an awareness of it and be making a current effort to try to learn it and want to edit themselves. If that desire to at least want to know how to write or look good is missing, then I'm not interested.


Ditto. If they don't care enough to do the required work to make a good impression on me, then they shouldn't complain when I'm not impressed with them.
 melissa0607
Joined: 2/12/2009
Msg: 71
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/11/2010 8:46:22 AM
breath,

LMAO. I was trying really hard not to go there. Is this the funniest thing ever? (well I'm exaggerating a little, but it is pretty damn funy) To come into a thread on a subject such as we have here and to write that nearly had me falling off of my chair. The thing is I think she is completely serious. You have to wonder about people huh?
 melissa0607
Joined: 2/12/2009
Msg: 74
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/11/2010 8:58:44 AM
akamyrna,

ok, I think you are right about this one. Funny because normally if I question anything someone says I would go look at the profile first. I guess where this one didn't come across as a joke in any way I didn't bother. That'll teach me.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 76
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/11/2010 12:53:40 PM

English is my fourth language, I can speak a dozen languages well along with excellent dialect, ask me to write in English and proper grammar,I have a very hard time with it.



I think it's very impressive that you are multilingual, but I think the OP was directing this thread at those whose first language IS English.
 nnb9251
Joined: 12/10/2009
Msg: 83
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/12/2010 10:00:25 AM
OP-You are absolutely not alone and it's not just your age bracket. I absolutely can not stnad it when some one sends me a message and soes not use proper English! It bugs me to no end. I sometime scringe when I'm reading some of the messages that are sent to me. Lol. So just a hint for everyone reading; please use proper grammar!!
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 84
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/12/2010 12:30:14 PM

English is my fourth language, I can speak a dozen languages well along with excellent dialect, ask me to write in English and proper grammar,I have a very hard time with it.

And yet you can still type/write and probably speak circles around some people on this site and in forums who are supposed to know English as a first language, at least at a 12 year old level. This basically proves my point.
 Nodak62
Joined: 7/22/2008
Msg: 86
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/12/2010 6:13:02 PM
it isn't a region thing I think, i cme from a VERY rural state, my dad was a farmer with an 8th grade education. i learned to speak well, communicate with others, I think number reason is laziness, the I don't give a sh*t atitude.
Now I may miss spell a word or two, so I am not perfect like others (my phone doesn't have spell chk)
 EvilLolli
Joined: 12/7/2008
Msg: 94
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 1/17/2010 7:37:35 AM

Are you trying to say that people who do not know good grammar and good spelling have no right to love, sex, a family and happiness ??


Good lord I hope they aren't relying solely on just the internet for that! Also there is usually a distinct difference in some one that has learned English as a second language, and someone who just does not care to know the proper way to communicate in written English.

The ones in this discussion are the ones that do not seem to care, or want to be bothered to know a better way to communicate in written English in this format. The occassional spelling, grammer, or tense faux pas(gee look I used French!) is not the issue. It's when you aren't sure if it is English they are using to communicate, or some new language we missed out on in school.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 102
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 2/1/2010 8:50:01 AM


Not only do computers have spell check but also grammer check...Why don't some people use them?



I don't know, how come you didn't use yours?



You've got that right. It's spelled "grammar", not "grammer". How funny.
 PatrickJack
Joined: 5/31/2009
Msg: 104
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 2/1/2010 8:54:43 PM
Welcome to America.
 Ender330
Joined: 4/23/2006
Msg: 105
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 2/1/2010 10:52:33 PM
Rlealy who caers? Msot poelpe can belray tpey wtih mroe tehn two fignres. As lnog as the fisrt and lsat letetrs are in the rghit palce you souhld be albe to raed jsut fnie.

Ashsoles
 CA_ExPat
Joined: 1/1/2010
Msg: 112
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 2/6/2010 3:54:57 PM
I think you should read your own profile with care. It seems you are slanted toward blue collar workers with your wording. Generally you will attract men who feel they have a chance with the woman whose profile they are reading. Yours shows an acceptance of plumbers, electricians, and roofers, none of whom usually have a degree in English nor is grammar and spelling a priority in their lives.

Write your profile to attract what you want, but, just as importantly, write it to cause self elimination of those you don't want.

As for the remainder of your questions, there are many intelligent blue collar workers who through life experience or other learning make wonderful lovers and life companions.

... and, there are many highly educated men who write well and know how to appear warm and caring and are scoundrels.

If you really dig a rodeo rider and he's hot, sensitive, and in to you, don't expect him to help you write your doctoral thesis.
 Miss W
Joined: 12/4/2006
Msg: 114
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 2/7/2010 12:03:41 AM
I have not read all of the pages on this thread, but I have found that many are lazy and clueless in general. It is part of the current culture of immediate gratification and not understanding why things don't happen when they make very little to a half assed effort.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 131
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/14/2010 7:51:05 AM
^^^I doubt your mom met your dad online by typing/writing messages to her. If he had things may have been different, who knows. There are places where people who can't spell or use grammar effectively will make a better impression if their verbal skills are impressive - this site just isn't one of those places.

Sorry, but I agree with those who have posted that writing is the means of communication here. Therefore it stands to reason that if you are in a text intensive environment, you should probably know how to properly read and write and spell. It's assimilation, really.

And even for those who can't there should be SOME attempt to want to make a good impression to compete with those who can because you're trying to meet people here. There are too many spellcheck programs out there not to be able to review and edit what you're writing, especially in a profile. Those who don't even make an attempt to learn/correct their own stuff aren't going to be a match for some people. End of story.

A sixth grade grasp on the English language at least isn't a lot to ask if you plan to communicate with others on a site where everyone's writing.
 sweetest
Joined: 10/8/2007
Msg: 139
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/14/2010 8:48:52 PM

...whatever deal breaker you feel is appropriate and ultimately makes you happy probably needs to be exercised, practiced and extolled in your profile---tell ‘em all right up front you’re grading on their writing skills, that if it doesn’t meet your hopes, dreams and expectations you’ll simply not be dating them.

^^^BH, why should I?

Write your profile to attract what you want, but, just as importantly, write it to cause self elimination of those you don't want.

ExPat...completely agree. I wrote mine to be reflective of who I am and what I was looking for without drilling down and harping about what I didn't want. Many men who write me cite that they found my profile to be a refreshing change to what they generally tend to see.

A sixth grade grasp on the English language at least isn't a lot to ask if you plan to communicate with others on a site where everyone's writing.

WIP, it's stunning to think that some could think otherwise.

It might be “like attracting like” but I’ll still wait patiently to hear of the true love found stories from real life that have developed solely through “good writing skills”. This would be the one time I’d be thrilled to know I’m wrong!

I hope you're up to enjoying another 'thrilling moment', because you're wrong.

No one ever said that being able to write well was the only thing you had to do to be successful in dating online. You still have to meet the people with whom you correspond and make a connection. However, if you write badly and and don't bother to check your spelling, you won't get very many opportunities to do that.

Exactly. Why give someone the opportunity to not consider you based on something that can be so easily fixed?

Now...if I found him at all appealing, his lack of style and content in his initial message might be overlooked. But at some point in time, one has to invest some effort into the process.

The profile reviews section is full of people who often end up there thinking that they don't need to invest any effort into the process either. They wonder at their dismal early results or continued inability to attract interest. The 15 to 25 or so people that regularly do the critiques in that forum, seem to me to be trapped in an endless loop giving repetitious guidance. They cite over and over again the importance of having well-written profile content and good clear photos as the two best improvements that tend to drive better results.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 141
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/14/2010 9:19:03 PM
^^^Au contraire. Using spell check to correct your writing and spelling will actually rub off on you unless you're brain dead to the extent you can't type at all. The process of wanting to improve your text and make a good impression is a part of absorbing information and improving yourself. Wanting to look smarter on paper usually goes hand in hand with wanting to know how you CAN look smarter on paper (or in text).

How do I know? Because when I run my writing through a check I automatically learn what I did and didn't do the right way - sure I happen to be overly critical of my own stuff, but even if you're not it's hard to get the same word wrong 12 times unless you actually try to do it on purpose. It's human nature to retain that through practice and redundancy.

Posting a pic of you 40 lbs lighter or changing your height or age to attract people isn't educational.

I'd date a person who uses a spell/grammar check to make a good impression a lot faster than someone who could do it, but just doesn't care or want to.
 EvilLolli
Joined: 12/7/2008
Msg: 147
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/15/2010 6:54:12 AM

i'm not a stuck-up woman who thinks that a person/man needs to spell/write to be a person...


LOL This cracks me up. It doesn't appear that anyone is using the expectation of proper written communication to be stuck up or imply that someone with poor wrting skills is not a person. From what I gather from the majority of posters supporting good writing skills are saying that it is reflective of the person writing in the internet arena of dating. On the internet, the written word is one of the first things used for creating an impression, contact, and clue about another person. It is also a sign of respect. If they can't be bothered to try to communicate well in writing, what other areas will they not be bothered?

If their writing is sloppy, poorly done, badly spelled or grammatically nightmarish, it's hard to understand/read, and puts a question in the mind of the reader about other facets of the writer. If they are this sloppy in an email, are they this sloppy about other things? If they aren't taking the time/consideration in online communication, would they lack that time/consideration in other areas of a relationship? If they take no care to improve an aspect about themself that is easily fixable or improvable, how many other flaws, imperfectios or what ot to they not acknowledge/improve as well?

As for writing not being important in a relationsship, I wonder about historically. Once upon a time before the internet and computers, hand written letters were the primary communication over long distances(and some led to romances/etc.). How many of those that communicated via handwritten letters would have had relationships with friends, family, or lovers if they had poor spelling, grammar, etc.?

Meeting someone out and about IRL is different than the internet. IRL there are facial expressions, vocal inflections, and gestures to assist communication. Written communication is not the important in face to face, non-internet meeting. But in the realm of the internet, our written words and ability to use them take the place of voice, speech, and physical expressions. Apples and oranges so to speak.

We all have our preferences, preferring good written commuicatio on a dating website is just one of them.
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 152
Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/15/2010 10:26:56 AM
A while back, I was seeing a disabled coal miner. Bright as a new penny, but his writing? ACK! Turned out he was *very* dyslectic ~~ and been schooled in a one room k-12 school in WV. His teacher was constantly telling him he should try harder, but since he knew he was trying as hard as he could. . . . he concluded that he was simply stupid. Which he was *not*!

Said that to say to say this: The internets are pretty much a word based media. A *written* word based media. Some of us are better at that than others, and it's likely to matter to us. And I think what we're wanting to see is someone making an effort. My last fella was literally a one finger typist, and most of his emails were not long. But between us before he died, we managed nearly three thousand of 'em. And mine prolly had more errors than his. He was an actor, and words mattered exquisitely to him.

As I see it: just another sorter, lol! In the same way that a profile which proclaims how much *fun* its author is is likely to be passed over by me (thinking as I can about maybe fifty virtues higher on my importance scale. . . . )

 sweetest
Joined: 10/8/2007
Msg: 154
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/15/2010 1:12:51 PM

Perception is reality, especially when the first impression, in most cases, is the only impression.

Writing well is something that I'm attuned to and something that tweaks my interest. It's important. It starts a process of engagement. I've contacted people from here simply because of how I felt reading their profile. Some have had no picture posted, some were not looking, but I've still contacted them because something they've written in a forum or that I've read on their profile I found intriguing and wanted to know more.

That action...me contacting them...them contacting me...'this' is Pof working--and working well. That's what people are here for..to make that connection to have someone to take notice of them amongst all the others.

Why would anyone not take the opportunity to use what's freely offered through membership and make it work for them in the best way that they can? I don't get that.

This dating site like others functions around writing. If you aren't able to make a convincing case for someone to contact you either by your photo, text content or both...it's literally game over.


..no wonder so many women don't get dates...i have a long list of guys/men who want to date me yesterday/now..


Since your profile states that you are only here for the forums, you obviously aren't trying to get dates from here. Therefore, your comments about dating online would appear to be irrelevant, regardless of how long the real world line is. As I noted above, if you're hot, you'll get lots of dates with guys wanting to get into your pants. If you want to attract guys for other reasons, you at least have to give them other reasons.

^^^Lots of dating sites don't provide you with a lot of opportunity to showcase more than a fraction of who you are. This place is great because you can display much more than a snippet of yourself through writing. I have always received a lot of mail and I still do if I don't hide my profile; even though I clearly indicate that I'm involved. I understand that a lot of men respond to visuals, and their efforts to get my attention based on running commentary and flattery about my looks alone, typically fails. I've always looked for more than just a pretty face. The guys who understand this and who succeed in getting and keeping my attention, know how to angle with the right bait.
 Padawan61
Joined: 3/1/2008
Msg: 156
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/15/2010 6:51:56 PM
For the most part, many people's brains have de-evolved to the equivalent of a Pygmy Marmoset. Language skills are all downhill from there.
 EvilLolli
Joined: 12/7/2008
Msg: 158
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Lack of basic language skills stunning! Is it my age group or area?
Posted: 4/16/2010 6:47:59 AM
I think there is a bit that the above post above seems to be missing.

Online the email or the profile are your FIRST impression or introduction(application). If the impression/introduction go well there will be a meet(interview). If the meet goes well there will be dates(probation period) until a relationship(hire) is established. Employers will also bypass a resume that is poorly written even with a degree. So will potential dates. So spell check/grammar check for any application to get a desired postition(job or date) should show that the applicant has at least tried to put the best foot forward. Both employers and potential dates will look at poorly written applications and wonder if there is a good fit when the effort to fix your own errors isn't taken. To put things in a job/online dating perspective.

As for the degree/non-degree debate. There is also something to be said for the effort in gaining experience in a field vs a degree in a field. There are many that have put in the time/effort to gain the experience in a given field, but don't have the degree to show it. Degrees don't equal intelligence or ability. Just like school attendance doesn't equal education. Just some of the gray areas of life.
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