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 AUTHOR
 Discerning Virtuosa
Joined: 6/10/2008
Msg: 32
Dating someone in a 12 step programPage 2 of 2    (1, 2)
Hi I'm Rich,I've been a member of Al-Anon for alot of years.We work the steps from being powerless over other peoples drinking or druging.If some is truly working a program it shows in how they treat people! Spiritual people are not living in denial! They are focused on today and Knowledge of God's will for them! If you wouldn't describe your self as Spiritual,it may not work.Having a Spiritual connection in a relationship is awesome!You have to trust God and yourself before you can trust someone else! I would take the chance and see where it goes!


Hi Rich - I been to Al Anon a long time ago myself. It helped me realize that a co dependent relationship is too damaging for me and my life.

I have a question - and I mean no disprespect, but can someone get sober in AA or NA if they are an Athiest? I'm just curious about that. and do Muslims or Hindus have a problem with alchoholism as we do in the western world?
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 33
Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/4/2010 9:28:09 PM
Depends. I have an alcoholic son who is *not* in recovery. I've done a fair amount of time in Al-Anon. A few years ago I was very in love with a man who had hauled himself out of alcoholism via Buddhism. We lived together until he died. And on the other hand, I've known peeps with recovery time in AA of twenty or more years who are just as drunk as the day they started. They're just dry.

What you *have* to do is relate to the person in front of you, as they are. Nothing less will do. This can only be done with love.

 EvilLolli
Joined: 12/7/2008
Msg: 34
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/4/2010 9:52:05 PM
There are a lot more porgrams out there than AA or NA or Al-Anon. The program they are in is important only as far as how it works for them to get to where they need to be. Its not the program, it's how the program works for the person. Individuals are the big difference, not th eprogram, the addiction or the label.
 beehearnow
Joined: 9/28/2007
Msg: 35
Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/5/2010 4:18:10 AM

but can someone get sober in AA or NA if they are an Athiest?


Everyone has a source from whence they derive some sort of inspiration, and that source is not necessarily dogmatic. The trick for an Atheist, or even just someone who is put off by what is sometimes a pretty heavy dose of religion in a 12-step program, is to find that personal well.

12-step doesn't work for everyone, and some people are able to remain sober (and not dry-drunk all the time) with another type program or even, if they are disciplined and dedicated, without a formal program. I've seen positive results when someone works both a 12 step program and also somehow gets some behavior modification training. But the bottom line is always how much the person wants to effect change in their own life.

OT: yes, I'd date someone honestly working a 12 step program. Happily.
 Discerning Virtuosa
Joined: 6/10/2008
Msg: 39
Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/5/2010 8:23:27 PM
Amen to that, I am very discouraged at some of the peoples responses.


Sophabella - Don't be angered or surprised that some people are not willing to bring alcoholics or addicts into their lives or welcome them with open arms. Many of us - even myself have had devastating and life altering consequences from our experiences with alcoholics and need & want to make better choices for our lives now. A 12 step program is no guarantee they won't be a dry drunk or they won't fall off the wagon. Even when an alcoholic is not drinking they cannot handle any stress - the people around them feel as though they have to tip toe around trying to be careful not to get the alcoholic upset. My feelings and my life were always secondary and it was always about the acloholic and their life. By the time a man has reached my age, if he has destroyed most of his life with drinking there is not a whole lot to work with there. Brain cells have been destroyed for years and they stop maturing emotionally at the age they started to drink. One thing I did learn in Al Anon is that I need to take care of myself first and not the alcoholic. The years I spent dating Alcoholics were very draining on me. Never again. Their problem will NEVER be my problem again.
 christ on a crutch
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 40
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/5/2010 8:38:26 PM
And AA is pretty much a Christian cult

depends on what part of the country you're in. you're in the bible belt, so yeah, that follows.

aa wasn't my program, but the meetings i went to where i live (southern california) were more inclusive. very little jesus/magic nonsense. which leads to this ...

can someone get sober in AA or NA if they are an Athiest?

yeah, because not every spiritual model subscribes to the Big Guy In The Sky hypothesis of western monotheism. imo, 12-step is a great place to explore entry-level spirituality free of dogma.
 452
Joined: 11/1/2009
Msg: 41
Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/5/2010 10:23:12 PM
I like to go out too much and I don't need someone freaking out everytime I get something to drink. I had a friend date this guy in recovery and man it changed everything we did as a group. He wouldn't go into a resturant is the liquor bottles were visible. It was madness! Eventually, she was just at home all the time until she realized that she was not the person with the problem.

Not that all people in recovery are this extreme but man, that did it for me.



So you have a friend,not even you,who had a bad experience with one person who was too extreme so you automatically judge all people in that situation as the same!?


I know quite a few people who are recovered/recovering alcoholics and they have no problem with anyone drinking in front of them or going into restaurants where liquor is served and visible. You might want to grow up a little and judge people based on how they behave around you.
 452
Joined: 11/1/2009
Msg: 42
Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/6/2010 12:27:43 AM
Yeah I read the last sentence you wrote and you still come off immature and judgmental. You are judging all recovered/recovering alcoholics based on your friends experience with one. Hopefully some day you will grow up and realize that you can't judge a whole group of people based on the actions of one who you never even dated.


Wow looked at your profile and I must say that I am shocked to see you are 31. I expected you to be 18 or 19!
 beehearnow
Joined: 9/28/2007
Msg: 46
Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/7/2010 12:34:56 PM
off topic - Filmmakermike, I am very, very sorry for your tragic loss.

This man was stupid and arrogant. But probably not in a 12-step program yet, since he apparently didn't think he qualified for one. And maybe he wasn't a alcoholic, maybe drinking and driving wasn't something he did all the time. But it's still a waste, and I hope he is now suffering and others are learning from the tragic results of his decision to get behind the wheel after drinking.

A lot of people who drink and drive are totally disillusional about the very real dangers they and other impaired drivers pose to everyone else on the road, even to the point of stating that legal limit laws and license restrictions are unfair because they punish people before they've committed an actual crime (injuring/killing someone while drinking and driving).

This is, of course, complete and total bullsh!t. I think the impaired driving laws should be much stricter than they already are. But it's a different thread.
 452
Joined: 11/1/2009
Msg: 49
Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/7/2010 9:04:22 PM
I am re: to your responces on : Would you ever date a truck driver and Dating people with difficult child.


The first on you said you would not date a truckdriver because your sister got an std from one and died. Then you went onto say say that they are all bad.

On the second you stated that you would not date someone if they had difficult children.

So, where are we any different in stating and making choices that work for us personally? Chew that over.



Lol nice attempt but you have failed miserably. There is a world of difference between dating someone who has gotten help for their past problems and dating someone whose problems are front and center in their lives, for example problem children who will and do make your life a living hell. That is a problem that is not in the past and not taken care of.


I said it before and I will say it again. Grow up and judge people based on how they behave with you now, not on their past problems.
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 50
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/7/2010 9:13:32 PM

No way!!! Once an alcoholic ALWAYS an alcoholic.

And your point is? There are thousands of people walking around that are alcoholics and it is not like all of them or even most of them get up every day and NOT drinking is the focus of their lives. It is just what they are it doesn't have to be who they are.

My father was an alcoholic. Thought he could handle drinking after being sober for nearly a decade so he celebrated when my middle brother was born. Found that nope, he got so pissed they put him to bed. He didn't take a drink after that for the 38 years he continued to live. He never did the 12-step thing and his addiction was never an issue. I wouldn't have known about it if my parents hadn't told me.

With the cult thing? Well, as mentioned some 12-step programs are more churchy than others and people also have levels of addiction. There is the person in the 12-step program because they are court-ordered to be there, repeat DUI offenders, etc., with the wreckage of their lives visible in their wake. There are also the people who would be more likely labeled functional alcoholics or problem drinkers that are not at a place wherein the alcohol addiction was a source of destruction.

Someone in a "12-step-program" may or may not actively attend meetings. If someone recovers to the point that the urge to drink isn't particularly strong I don't believe that they have to keep going nor is there any prescribed number of meetings someone must attend if they have been sober for years and it is more a maintenance sort of thing.

Some people really need to work the program with a capital W, others not. My sister-in-law's father was an alcoholic and when retirement came, if he wanted to move where they had vacationed (which was the plan) he was either going to AA and wouldn't drink or she was divorcing him after like 30 years. He chose the AA, only problem was that he supposedly couldn't manage to keep it together if he went more than a week to maybe 14 days without going to a meeting. But he couldn't just go to a meeting, he had to go to "his" meeting. Made it very difficult living like 800 miles away from two of their kids.


I had a friend date this guy in recovery and man it changed everything we did as a group. He wouldn't go into a resturant is the liquor bottles were visible. It was madness! Eventually, she was just at home all the time until she realized that she was not the person with the problem.

And I have known many alcoholics that stayed sober for decades and chose to hang in bars. Seemed a bit daft to me but not everyone that is dealing with an alcohol issue has problems being around other people that are drinking.
 packagedealx3
Joined: 2/4/2006
Msg: 51
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 2/7/2010 9:18:07 PM
As for your question OP, sober AT LEAST a year, and see how they are working the program. If someone has been sober long enough outside letting you know about it, you would have no clue they had an issue at all. Others, run as fast as you can. You just have to use some common sense about the behaviors you do or don't see.
 trelyn1
Joined: 7/17/2010
Msg: 55
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/21/2019 1:53:53 PM
Any suggestions on meeting only others involved the the 12 step community? Any one who tries to live by the 12 principles regardless of which on is what’s important to me, to really connect.
 __TEXASCHICK__
Joined: 11/9/2011
Msg: 56
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/21/2019 4:04:25 PM
My late hubby died due to drinking to excess. This was in 2005. I will not date anyone who does more than occasional drink.
 fullmoonguy2
Joined: 6/14/2017
Msg: 57
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/22/2019 1:49:22 PM

Any suggestions on meeting only others involved the the 12 step community? Any one who tries to live by the 12 principles regardless of which on is what’s important to me, to really connect.


So are you saying that you only want to meet people in 12 step programs, because they are the only people you can connect with?

If so, it's another SMH moment.
 Clytemnestra
Joined: 6/6/2018
Msg: 58
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/22/2019 2:01:55 PM
msg#55:
Any suggestions on meeting only others involved the the 12 step community? Any one who tries to live by the 12 principles regardless of which on is what’s important to me, to really connect.


Keep going to 12 step meetings? Meet someone there?
Seems too obvious. Is there some 'rule' you cannot date others who attend the meetings?
A 'rule' you cannot use a meeting to pick up a likely prospect?
Maybe try an 'out of town' meeting and see who shows up?
That's all I got~
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 59
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/22/2019 2:51:56 PM

Any suggestions on meeting only others involved the the 12 step community? Any one who tries to live by the 12 principles regardless of which on is what’s important to me, to really connect.

Go to various AA meetings in your area, socialize, and among guys you like, aim to cozy up with them. If/when you do obtain a comfort-zone with a guy, cozying up -- ask him to go out to a cafe or Applebees or something after the meeting.

Keep going to 12 step meetings? Meet someone there?

I actually did meet a gal at one of those (no lie). It was during my "Se7en" phase checking out different groups (see movie). She was really cute. But boy was she crazy.

Seems too obvious. Is there some 'rule' you cannot date others who attend the meetings?

There is no rule that I was aware of. I think that probably applies to the SexAholics Anonymous meetings. But the one I went to (yes, they exist) -- total sausage fest.

A 'rule' you cannot use a meeting to pick up a likely prospect?

No, people become friends, socialize, etc. It's not really anonymous from my experience -- it allows you to be. I mean it starts off with "Hi, my name is [Sally], and I'm an alcoholic." And they're not all the same. Some are for newbies trying it out (or forced/pushed to) -- others are for veteran 12-steppers.
 dynamicones
Joined: 2/7/2018
Msg: 60
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/23/2019 8:16:18 AM
I've had several alcoholic girlfriends, found I can't handle them for long term, had ONE recovering girlfriend and she was the opposite end of the extreme, couldn't handle her either. Perhaps after a while they get their head together but I don't know
 Like2dance
Joined: 4/13/2013
Msg: 61
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/27/2019 8:32:34 PM
Going to AA meetings and hitting on attendees of the opposite sex is known as taking the 13th step. It is all too prevalent.

If one does not have substance abuse or other addiction issues why would one want to date an addict? That is asking for trouble as they are always just a breath away from drinking, drugging, eating or whatever their addiction constitutes.
 feirene
Joined: 1/3/2017
Msg: 62
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/27/2019 8:50:52 PM

Any suggestions on meeting only others involved the the 12 step community? Any one who tries to live by the 12 principles regardless of which on is what’s important to me, to really connect.


Just google search for '12 step dating',i found a few sites that way.
If you wanna use this site justmention in your profile you're doing really well on the 12 step programme and are seeking someone similar.

I was still in the SAA 12 step when i met my fella, he is 'normal' but was very supportive of me and the meetings etc, that helped a lot. So i didn't dismiss anyone just because they weren't an ex addict or anything.
 MeramecRiverRat
Joined: 10/12/2017
Msg: 63
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/28/2019 7:19:58 AM


Any suggestions on meeting only others involved the the 12 step community?


They have a code word, "Bill W". Earlier this year an AA member matched with me on Bumble even though I put "never" for drinking. One of the first things she wrote was "Do you know Bill W?" I didn't know what it meant, but apparently your fellow AA people know and use it to identify each other. The problem solved itself within 24 hours as she unmatched me on Bumble and didn't call or text me anymore. She showed up on Bumble twice shortly thereafter, apparently creating new accounts. Of course I swiped no each time.

One thing I cannot recommend doing is contacting people who say they never drink, hoping they'll be recovering alcoholics who aren't drinking anymore. They might be actual non drinkers who never had a problem. I suggest anyone who has ever been in AA _not_ claim "never" for drinking. Because of "former" drunks claiming they don't, people who would like a non-drinker are suspicious of actual non drinkers.

Me, I would not want to get involved with someone who 1) has a history of "addiction", 2) believes in an imaginary "higher power", or 3) rationalizes doing bad things by claiming they had no control of the situation, twisting their mantra "Lord, give me the power to accept the things I cannot change". You killed a pedestrian hit-and-run while driving drunk? No problem, you couldn't control yourself.

The main reason I avoid people with alcohol or any "addiction" is their violent tendencies, their temper, their mood swings. They lash out, often with threats. I stopped doing anything with a former buddy because he can be a mean drunk. On our final fishing trip, after he had drunk many beers, he didn't like something I said and made physical threats. I don't believe he's an AA member, but he would probably behave even worse as a member because other members would enable him. And AA doesn't want anyone to get cured; they want everyone to have the problem forever.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 64
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 4/28/2019 1:52:34 PM

Going to AA meetings and hitting on attendees of the opposite sex is known as taking the 13th step. It is all too prevalent.

Nothing wrong with it, though. Although there is something socially wrong with playing "Se7en" and utilizing support groups to try and pick up a girl, when said support groups don't apply to you. But said support groups give a sense of community. They have dances. Stuff like that.

If one does not have substance abuse or other addiction issues why would one want to date an addict?

It's one of the logical problems with places like AA. Some of the folks who've been there a long time aren't addicts anymore at all. But you call yourself an addict as a preemptive method to prevent yourself from liking it again. So it's not always true that they Are In Fact an addict. Not everyone's 2 steps away from hitting the bottle. Some even go who don't Really have a drinking problem, but their spouse/ex-spouse/family-member does -- and they are warding off booze themselves 100% to set an example.

That said, if you go to one of them where long-time members go -- to meet a girl -- you better be pretty much a non-drinker if you're thinking anything beyond casual dating.

I suggest anyone who has ever been in AA _not_ claim "never" for drinking. Because of "former" drunks claiming they don't, people who would like a non-drinker are suspicious of actual non drinkers.

Problem is, you can't put a no-answer in there. If at the time they really Don't Drink -- they should put Never. It's in the present tense. I guess if they're Trying to stop drinking, sure, don't put Never. Or if they're on DAY #x, yeah, don't put Never. But if they're closing in on a year since they last drank -- put Never.

One thing I cannot recommend doing is contacting people who say they never drink, hoping they'll be recovering alcoholics who aren't drinking anymore. They might be actual non drinkers who never had a problem.

One side note that gets AA people riled up: Most people who've had drinking problems and don't drink anymore, have done so on their own, without any AA help. Easier if you don't drink hard liquor, but instead have drank beer cans far too often over a long period of time. But AA does not hesitate to call drinking beer on weekends 100% an alcohol problem.

And AA doesn't want anyone to get cured; they want everyone to have the problem forever.

In a way, true. They want to tell you that you can't get out of it. That you Have it forever. That you can't just not-drink, like not eating red meat. You'll need constant support for the rest of your life, and you're always an addict, etc. For SOME people, I can understand that. Problem is, they tell everyone goes there, who's had an issue with drinking too much, that it applies to them And Everyone. IMO, that prevents a number of people from making the best of themselves and kicking an issue.
 LetitiaLeGrande
Joined: 3/22/2015
Msg: 65
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 5/9/2019 6:53:50 PM
myrgth

I agree. Leave the addicts to other addicts. The victim/saviour thing that some get into very often goes awry....
 LetitiaLeGrande
Joined: 3/22/2015
Msg: 66
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Dating someone in a 12 step program
Posted: 5/9/2019 6:57:37 PM
There may be degrees of alcoholism. Many are functioning and can conduct normal lives and some end up in the gutter.
It is a physical illness and should be treated with compassion. I have known those who have a drink or two after work but never get out of control. However would be a problem if the supply was ever cut off. SO it is psychological as well as physical.
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