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 themadfiddler
Joined: 12/9/2009
Msg: 28
heaven- a punishment or a reward...Page 2 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)
I have to hold with Samuel Clemens on heaven...harp music for any great length of time...utter damnation. If there is no tobacco, liquor, good food, or vices of the flesh, I have no interest in going there. My heaven is the heaven of the Old Gods...and a lusty heaven it is.

Hail Baal and Astarte!



Flaco Jiminez was my introduction to this regional smorgasbord (well, bad word for this mebbe'), ...I know as "Tejano",


My landlord has the claim to fame of getting loaded with Flaco once at an Edmonton Folk Fest and having an accordion jam with him, and believe it or not, Bill Monroe, who in his own words "loved a well played accordion..." and if it wasn't for Earl Scruggs, we would have had accordion in bluegrass (contemplate that horror if you will...brrr)

Speaking of German songs involving beer, and swinging it around back to the topic, here's one that I was introduced to by my musical hero Pete Seeger that seems somehow appropriate to this thread...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_Gedanken_sind_frei

Die Gedanken sind frei, wer kann sie erraten,
sie fliegen vorbei wie nächtliche Schatten.
Kein Mensch kann sie wissen, kein Jäger erschießen
mit Pulver und Blei, Die Gedanken sind frei!

Ich denke was ich will und was mich beglücket,
doch alles in der Still', und wie es sich schicket.
Mein Wunsch und Begehren kann niemand mir wehren,
es bleibet dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Und sperrt man mich ein im finsteren Kerker,
das alles sind rein vergebliche Werke.
Denn meine Gedanken zerreißen die Schranken
und Mauern entzwei, die Gedanken sind frei!

Drum will ich auf immer den Sorgen absagen
und will mich auch nimmer mit Grillen mehr plagen.
Man kann ja im Herzen stets lachen und scherzen
und denken dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Ich liebe den Wein, mein Mädchen vor allen,
sie tut mir allein am besten gefallen.
Ich sitz nicht alleine bei einem Glas Weine,
mein Mädchen dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Thoughts are free, who can guess them?
They flee by like nocturnal shadows.
No man can know them, no hunter can shoot them,
with powder and lead: Thoughts are free!

I think what I want, and what delights me,
still always reticent, and as it is suitable.
My wish and desire, no one can deny me
and so it will always be: Thoughts are free!

And if I am thrown into the darkest dungeon,
all this would be futile work,
because my thoughts tear all gates
and walls apart. Thoughts are free!

So I will renounce my sorrows forever,
and never again will torture myself with some fancy ideas.
In one's heart, one can always laugh and joke
and think at the same time: Thoughts are free!

I love wine, and my girl even more,
Only I like her best of all.
I'm not alone with my glass of wine,
my girl is with me: Thoughts are free!
 xlr8ingmargo
Joined: 7/28/2009
Msg: 30
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/10/2010 2:49:19 PM
Im just a shameless hussy that will have to ask for forgiveness when I get there so Im gettin' all I can first...
 themadfiddler
Joined: 12/9/2009
Msg: 31
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/10/2010 3:02:38 PM
^^^^^ Wahooo!

Me likee hussies me likee hussies!

Sign me up for leaving a well used corpse!



Please Don't Bury Me by John Prine


Woke up this morning
Put on my slippers
Walked in the kitchen and died
And oh what a feeling!
When my soul
Went thru the ceiling
And on up into heaven I did ride
When I got there they did say
John, it happened this way
You slipped upon the floor
And hit your head
And all the angels say
Just before you passed away
These were the very last words
That you said:

Chorus:
Please don't bury me
Down in that cold cold ground
No, I'd druther have "em" cut me up
And pass me all around
Throw my brain in a hurricane
And the blind can have my eyes
And the deaf can take both of my ears
If they don't mind the size
Give my stomach to Milwaukee
If they run out of beer
Put my socks in a cedar box
Just get "em" out of here
Venus de Milo can have my arms
Look out! I've got your nose
Sell my heart to the junkman
And give my love to Rose

Repeat Chorus

Give my feet to the footloose
Careless, fancy free
Give my knees to the needy
Don't pull that stuff on me
Hand me down my walking cane
It's a sin to tell a lie
Send my mouth way down south
And kiss my ass goodbye

Repeat Chorus
 themadfiddler
Joined: 12/9/2009
Msg: 32
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/10/2010 10:37:34 PM


I can see from the posts, that mocking God is so hip and urbane. I see God in every leaf, everything around me. I've seen His work and His mercy in my life. Why do people have to turn a loving God into some kind of a joke? Does it make you feel superior?

This is one sad thread.


You don't think the Creator - if there is one - would have a sense of humor and perhaps irreverence if it is any way like us?

And if He/She/It is not in any way like us, what makes you think They would give a crap what we would think?

This is the OP:



curious-
is the christian version of heaven
enough to excite you
and is the bible's version of heaven
to be taken literally-

if not,
would a heaven of your own choosing-
be more up your ally?


A humorous or irreverent response to the imagined version or stereotypical version of Christian heaven is what is being critiqued...perhaps you might suggest what you are taught or believe to be your view of what heaven might be like (as the OP suggests?) instead of just taking a swipe at everyone else below the ankles?

Some of us also have a pretty transcendent view of the Divine...it may not be your view however. That doesn't make either of us right or wrong, just different.
 Earthpuppy
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 33
view profile
History
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/11/2010 6:28:33 AM
"I can see from the posts, that mocking God is so hip and urbane. I see God in every leaf, everything around me. I've seen His work and His mercy in my life. Why do people have to turn a loving God into some kind of a joke? Does it make you feel superior?"

The God presented in the Bible is hardly a loving God. The death toll from that God is over 33 million in those pages alone, hardly a loving authority figure. That God comes across as petty, jealous, unreasonably demanding, inconsistent, and vicious when he does not have his control freak rules working upon all. Everybody must get stoned....Jawbone of an azz slaying a thousand philistines..selling daughters into the sex slave scenario...condoning rape and mass murder of men, women and children...etc..etc.. See evilbible.com for more.

I was raised first in the dark Lutheran tradition, then in a Methodist sect where there was a picture of a laughing Jesus on the wall. Just because the God thing is presented in a certain horrific, angry and judgmental way by come sects, does not mean there is not a God with a sense of humor, irony, and trickster side that just likes to mess with the minds of the flock. It is also quite reasonable to expect that people find their God(s) to be more accurately made in their own image. Most hard core bible thumpers, particularly the olde testament variety, tend to feel superior, in a very public way, to those they deem unworthy, heathens, or from inferior religions or sects. The irony of that question about superiority was amusing.
 EvilLolli
Joined: 12/7/2008
Msg: 34
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History
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/11/2010 10:33:04 AM
It kind of amazes me the lack of reading comprehension some days.


I can see from the posts, that mocking God is so hip and urbane. I see God in every leaf, everything around me. I've seen His work and His mercy in my life. Why do people have to turn a loving God into some kind of a joke? Does it make you feel superior?


The question in the OT was NOT about God, but about HEAVEN. There is a difference you know.

I see more mocking of the concept that heaven is a place for those perfect souls to float around in white robes playing harps then mocking a creative force(God). I also see some comments on the "sales pitch" of the white robe, pearly gate version of heaven versus the personal versions of heaven.

What I got from the OT was which "version" of heaven would sell you more on the idea of it. A personal version created to suit you, or the version of white robes and halos. Not much about God himself.
 xlr8ingmargo
Joined: 7/28/2009
Msg: 35
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/11/2010 12:12:53 PM
You know I dont run around professing my Christianity and trying to force my opinions on others because people have a human nature to judge me according to what I believe. I know I am saved, where I will spend eternity, and I do try my best. The difference is I know who and what I am so why try to hide it? Am I going to hide my sins from God? NO. He will grant me forgiveness according to his judgement, not the judgement of man. Romans chapter two dude, read it. That and does not the bible state clearly "Whosoever believeth on me shall not perish but have life everlasting"? Whosoever. That includes fornicating hussies like me. I judge no man/woman, and accept and love them instead. I might get angry at them, or not like the things they do, or not agree with their views, but I still accpet the person without judgement.
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 36
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History
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/11/2010 1:57:54 PM
I'm not religious either, but I can sympathize with the OPs lack of appreciation for the version of heaven she's been handed. Other religions have varied their versions of post-life to make it a LITTLE more appealing.
It reminds me of some of the visions of the wonderful future that some science fiction writers have put forward, wherein people evolve into "mind only" entities, who simply enjoy being very smart. I'm not intrigued, because I STILL happen to like things like kissing, sex, and all that other sensual stuff.
If you want to ponder possible heavens, though, take into accou t that those drawing up the plans DID have some thinking involved that they didn't want to put up front:
1. Heaven needs to be desirable enough to keep people trying to get there after they die, and thus behave themselves here.
2. Heaven still has to be UNDESIRABLE enough, not to make believers yearn for death. If they did, they wouldn't get anything done here.
As I am a non believing historian, I see the definition of Heaven as a long story of the powerful elements in society trying to concoct a belief system that makes their followers productive, easily controlled subjects that they can benefit from, in exchange for psychological comforts.
If I could pick a heaven, I guess it would be more of the same as here, except I'd know more what I was doing, and all diseases would be curable, all handicaps would erase themselves, sex would be just as wonderful, exercise would actually be FUN, we could change our appearance like bumper stickers, just for fun, and lying would cause a person's head to flash on and off and sirens to sound. Stuff like that.
 jed456
Joined: 4/26/2005
Msg: 37
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History
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/11/2010 6:00:09 PM
Being an agnostic I have no idea if there is in fact a heaven or hell.If there is my version of heaven, A two hour concert once a week jimi Hendrix,Jim Morrison,Ronnie van zandt,buddy holly,Otis redding,Duane allman,John Lennon,George Harrison and bob Marley jammin.Every animal you ever loved is there.Conversations with Jesus,Gandhi,jefferson,Einstein,Buddha,conversations with Washington,Lincoln.

Hell-Jerry Falwell,Lawrence welk and the Brady bunch.
 GrandmaBooBoo
Joined: 12/30/2006
Msg: 38
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History
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/13/2010 7:14:30 PM

curious-
is the christian version of heaven
enough to excite you
and is the bible's version of heaven
to be taken literally-
LOL!!! Well, I really hate to break this to you...but a good many of those who profess to be Christian...do NOT believe in the Bible. You post really reminds me of a conversation I had with my 2 young grandchildren a year or so ago. They asked if we would have birthdays in Heaven? LOL! I said, ya know...I'm not really sure...but I DO know..that we WILL have, cake, ice cream, balloons, etc.

I really do understand what you're saying, and you make a very good point. Biblicaly speaking, the streets will be paved in transparent gold...and like you, while yeah, that may be cool....I'm really good with a sandy beach.

Too many of those who hope to reside in heaven, thinks it's like McDonald's....they get to have it THEIR way....and so must everyone else! (have it "their way") I once "argued" with this other Christian woman....who told me that I'd better get used to the painfully loud music and screaming....because "that is what Heaven was going to be like"...LOL! I said, "no, that's just the part where YOU will reside....I'm going to be sitting in the quieter orchestral section". She just didn't get it!
 KrimsonGray
Joined: 3/29/2010
Msg: 39
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heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/14/2010 11:15:50 PM
I like the phrase, "Angels have wings so they can get OUT of Heaven". Mind you, I think God was Humanity's creation to begin with. And if there is a God, there is more evidence in the Bible itself to suggest that God is not very pleasant. The term "God is Love" appears twice (in 1 John 4), and that's it. I can't even count how many times God's Wrath comes up. But God being a being of love is hard to swallow, the first chapter of Joshua (where God orders him to Genocide all sorts of people) is pretty repugnant. I'd rather have Oblivion, but in the case there is a Supreme Being, then I think that "Damned if you do, and damned if you don't" pretty much sums things up.

Unless of course, God has nothing to do with all those religions created in her name, and actually wants us to forge our own destiny and become a race of peers, rather than a petting zoo full of sheep.
 Stray__Cat
Joined: 7/12/2006
Msg: 40
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/15/2010 7:53:06 PM
Buddhist think Heaven is a distraction.
They believe it is cool and all....
but not permenent.
We don't stay there forever.
come back here abit depressed for the downgrade.

As to why....well imagine you're in heaven.
All that happy bliss going on.
But you feel like you're missing something.
Can't put your finger on it.
So you drift back to earthly realms and
see people having sex.
Wow! That was it!
No sex in heaven.
Geez, you miss that so.

So watching a young couple go at it...
you get all entranced and excited....
and pop!
Get sucked in.
Now dufus you're fixin to be born.
Hope your parents are good....
for your next go around.
:-P
 mr.evil
Joined: 11/14/2009
Msg: 41
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/15/2010 11:13:47 PM
How does the song go, "I don't think theres a heaven, but I pray there ain't no hell"

Who knows, guess I gotta say looking around at the righteous teabaggers,bible thumpers, all those religious members of congress living in that house in DC where they pay next to no rent and cover up sex scandals owned by a church. The Falwells, Limbaughs,Palins, Goerge Bush's, the guys who kill abortion doctors in the name of God, the Jihadists who took down the towers in the name of allah, the millions killed because they believed in christ, the millions killed over the years because they didn't. All those priests who did unspeakable things with little boys, the thousands killed in the inquistion, the folks who sin like he11 all week, then go to church for an hour on sunday, the ones who ask poor people to send money to their church so they can ride around in a benz and live in a nice house, the oh heck you get the idea...

What's that leave Mr. evil to do..

Guess I'll opt for he11, I wouldn't know anybody up there anyway!
 xlr8ingmargo
Joined: 7/28/2009
Msg: 42
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/16/2010 1:50:38 PM
Well I like you both and if I had my way you two would be in heaven with me.
Im not a thumper though~ I just believe Im forgiven.
 late™
Joined: 2/1/2010
Msg: 44
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/16/2010 8:10:02 PM
How does the song go, "I don't think theres a heaven, but I pray there ain't no hell"


That one clicked a memory, BS&T with David Clayton Thomas "And When I Die".

But the irony is more complete, as it's:
"I can swear there ain't no Heaven
But I pray there ain't no hell"

Great tune, Laura Nyro wrote it I think, that was a great band...

Krebster, ...Stairway to Heaven? ....ewwww

Dust in the Wind? ....hmmm, written by a borna' agin' b-thumper, ...interesting.


For me, I'll continue to believe in the ol' German beer hall songs, the ol Cajun songs, Tejano music songs, that, in essence, remind us:

It' what you do here on earth that will make a difference. Continue to be as righteous as you can, but, hey, take time once in a while, to celebrate life, in whatever way you can.


Abso-f'in-tively bro', and to take this from the sublime to the ridiculous....

Jim Dandy to the rescue!

"If You Want to get to Heaven"

I never read it in a book
I never saw it on a show
but I heard it in the alley
on a weird radio
if you want a drink of water
you got to get it from a well
if you want to get to heaven
you got to raise a little hell

I never felt it in my feet
I never felt it in my soul
but I heard it the alley
now it's in my rock and roll
if you want to know a secret
you got to promise not to tell
if you want to get to heaven
you got to raise a little hell

I never thought it'd be so easy
I never though it'd be so fun
but I heard it in the alley
now I got it on the run
if you want to see an angel
you got to find it where it fell
if you want to get to heaven
you got to raise a little hell

Ha ha... I think there is no other form of human expression that describes the many facets of "heaven" as diversely as songs do.
 valenciacityx
Joined: 3/10/2009
Msg: 45
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 2:01:01 AM
heres my problem with heaven/hell...
So God is All Powerful, All Omnipotent, the whole schmear Alpha and Omega.... IF there is a Heaven and Hell.... would He not know our destiny to begin with... and allow us to skip this step ?.....

... Ah, but there is free will..... so are you saying that your all Powerful God is off tracked by a whim that came through my mind ?.....

See, its just circuitous logic like that that leads me to believe that man created Heaven as a reward, Hell as a punishment, because the existing legal code was not enforcing an appropriate moral behavior....
 Snotsure
Joined: 9/14/2009
Msg: 47
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 8:08:26 AM
This is worthy of a repeat. I may have found my long lost brother in arms.... A little touch of heaven in these words;


A couple of dudes knocked on my door one morning, apparently sent by the Lord...

The Lord was too busy for a personal visit, so he sent these two cherubic gnomes in sleeve shirts and skinny black ties to do his bidding...

What the fvck was he thinking?...

"Lord... If your intent was to frighten me into some new faith, then you should have sent some really scary fvckers to my door."...

Through the peep-hole I could see them poised, smiling with perfect teeth and bibles clutched to their breasts in anticipation...

I let them in... Hungover and bored is my only excuse... Usually, I'd have given them 50 cents for their literature, and told them I was late for an appointment...

But not today... A little recrimination and self-abuse was in order... My penance...

"Have a seat, guys... Don't mind the mess... Yeah, just kick those beer cans onto the floor... Oh, don't smell that towel, man... There's an interesting story behind that; but you'd of had to been here last night to appreciate it."...

They appeared uncomfortable, and began spewing incomprehensible shit about god and his plan for us... This was my apartment, and I couldn't even plan a hasty exit... I needed a drink...

In desperation, I excused myself under the pretense of having to pee... Leaving them alone with their secretive plans for my salvation...

Minutes later, I popped back into the room clad only in speedos and an ornate sombrero, shouting; "Let's dance, ya little weenies!"...

Wow... I thought they drove here in a car... But the exit stains from their bicycle tires are still embedded in the driveway...

Heaven or Hell?...
 mr.evil
Joined: 11/14/2009
Msg: 48
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 8:35:32 AM
"Mr. Evil has given up."

Not given up, just accepted the foibles of those who believe that we can affect the out come with green stamp religion. You know, you go to church every sunday for 70 years, then die ad present our 70 books to God and say "so what do I get for this?"

I don't qualify for much of what passes for acceptable. I do for my fellow man, have compassion for those who need it and try to affect those I can, in a positive way. At the same time, much of what I accept as normal or interesting is judged by those who thump the book. I thought judging was God's job, not man's?

I agree with others, songs more speak to heaven than anything else today. But then again, it was the bible 1,000's of years ago. They had no billboad top 100, CD players, MP 3's, or radio back then.

I guess the bottom line now, no different from back then is, man is confused, awed and frightened by what he cannot see, control or affect. So he must invent something to assuage his lack of means to control life and what is inevitable. I mean, as far as I know, no one gets out alive.

Now whether you accept God or not, believe in heaven or he11, your still gonna croak sometime. As far as I can see, the best thing to do, is the best you can with what you got, do no harm, try to help those who can't help themselves, and when you have time, party like a rock star. Whatever happens after that, AIN'T up to anybody on this thread, nor anybody in this world, not even that guy in Rome with the funny hat.
 countreekidd
Joined: 6/30/2009
Msg: 49
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History
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 9:19:52 AM
Understanding God, can it be done? Do grasshoppers understand us? Imagine this:

Big tall blades of grass, a gentle breeze, and all the little insects partying together...everything is great. They have no idea it's time for you to cut the grass. Further more, why the heck are you cutting the grass?...that's what they eat! They have no understanding that this is your backyard. You are too big for them to perceive accurately, and the lawnmower is just a loud vibrating death dealing storm...it's horrible!

One day a grasshopper comes along that can communicate with you. He tells you this horrible story, and you explain it to him: I own this house, and this is my backyard. When the grass gets too tall, my kids can't play in the yard because there could be ants, snakes, spiders, etc--and they won't be able to see them in time. Plus keeping a neat lawn adds value to my home. The grasshopper has no idea how killing them, and chopping off their food supply, adds value to anything--but he does understand you wanting to protect your children. So he makes the case that his kind won't harm your kids, so why do so many of them have to perish? You tell him to tell his fellow grasshoppers, that when the grass get to a certain height, they should leave the yard, and they will be spared. He tells his fellow grasshoppers, in fact he tells all the insects, some believe him even though there's no proof. Others believe the storm can't be predicted, it just happens.

So when the grass reaches a certain height, he and a few others leave the yard. They return much later to see the grass has tripled in height! Those that left, turn to the grasshopper and ask what gives? We left, barely had enough eat, and nothing happened! He warns them that the grass is too tall, and he turns to leave--this time, fewer follow him. They return again, much later, and notice the grass is even taller! Those that stayed are laughing, and tell them everything is great! There hasn't been a storm in ages! The grasshopper says the grass is too tall and leaves, with fewer still following.

Of course the next time they return, they see nothing but destruction as far as their insect eyes can see. The survivors tell the story of a different type of storm that moved faster and covered more ground--it was louder, and it was deadlier. Then came the sickness, insects just dropping dead! This story made the previous storm look like a gentle breeze!

When the grasshopper asks you what happened? You tell him the kids were away at camp. He has no idea what you're talking about. You tell him you got a new 60" riding mower you wanted to really put through it's paces....again he's clueless. You tell him that when you cut the tall grass you noticed your yard was infested with creepy crawlies, so you had to bring out the insecticide...the what?

He finally tells you that nothing you are saying makes sense, or justifies the horrors he's seen in the aftermath. You try to explain to him that his world and your world are completely different, and not much of anything you say will make sense to him, but there's only a couple of things he needs to know...and they are:

One) It's your backyard

Two) The grass is too tall.

Being a Christian, I sometimes feel like the grasshopper, but mostly I feel like the kids that play in the backyard.

When I start contemplating things like Heaven and Hell--and yes I believe in both--I try to move beyond the grasshopper's world.

Think about this: On Earth, we are biological beings. We like sex, food, drugs (alcohol), etc. We don't like pain, suffering, illness, etc. What happens when we are stripped of our biological wants and whatnot?

In Heaven, what if being a spirit is completely different? What if every step we take on those golden streets, feels like an orgasm to the spirit? What if every song we sing in praise, makes us drunk and happy? ..and it's forever. I think I can live with that!

And then there's Hell...What if our spirits can never become accustomed to the pain and agony? ...and it's forever. I think I'll go with the other option!
 Earthpuppy
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 50
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History
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 10:46:56 AM
In reading the old Testament of the Bible, that God is more like the guy on the lawnmower spraying pesticides in his wake. God smote around 33,000,000 because they were pestilence. Nice guy.
http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2007/01/how-many-has-god-killed-complete-list.html
When you start adding up the numbers from people who claim God spoke to them, like Bush and Hitler the witch burners, Inquisition folks, the death toll is unimaginable. Living in perpetuity with such a jealous, angry, judgmental, schizo entity would seem to be more like hell.

Of course Satan was not without guilt for killing the 10 sons and daughters of Job, but he did it with complicity and a wink from God.
 late™
Joined: 2/1/2010
Msg: 51
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 12:40:13 PM
Not a Saved Person and snortin' up that cocaine like it was Vick Vapo Rub, why, soon as I get caught, why, I reckon it's a good time to declare that "I just been Re-Born."


flectere si nequeo superos, Achaeronta movebo

Heh heh !cough! heh...

Yeah, ...I remember thinking about this a few years ago while listening to a b-thumpers, the idea that a person as demonstratively altruistic as Carl Sagan is suffering the eternal damnation of hell, while even the most loathsome, repulsive, or utterly despicable humans get a free pass into the *True Christian™ version of heaven if they just utter the secret passwords.

Take for example, Jefferey Dahmer, who, ...according to Rev. Jim Osborne of the Landover Baptist church, even though:
"Brother Jeff lived a very sinful and abominable life. He was a serial killer, but even worse, a homosexual."

He was Saved®, or in Jimbo's words:

"Brother Jeff's story has a wonderful lesson that we should teach to our children. No matter how depraved a life a life he led (raping, cannibalism, necrophilia, serial killing...even something as bad as homosexuality!) he repented for his sins and accepted Christ. He is a testimony that anyone can accept Jesus Christ!"

"All of Dahmer's victims were unsaved trash. While what he did in itself was wrong, we can console ourselves by knowing he was removing homosexuals from society. Don't forget also that most of his victims were godless negroes or budda-worshipping chinks. Heck, some of his victims weren't even American. So when it really comes down to it, his crimes are not as bad as the media has made them out to be."

And so...

"Lest anyone think that Brother Jeffrey is not in Heaven, all one has to do is look to the Bible and see that he was Saved® and is in Heaven with Jesus."

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/showthread.php?t=28839

I'd rather be hangin' with Carl....









* - The **Landover Baptist church trademarked it, heh heh heh...

** - see "Poe's Law"

http://rationalwiki.com/wiki/images/d/d5/Poeversion.gif
 countreekidd
Joined: 6/30/2009
Msg: 52
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heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 3:57:41 PM

In reading the old Testament of the Bible, that God is more like the guy on the lawnmower spraying pesticides in his wake. God smote around 33,000,000 because they were pestilence. Nice guy.


Without checking your sources, because it doesn't matter to me if they are right or wrong, do you know what I find funny? When some people read something like that, they think "Yeah! There's your LOVING God!!! Give me a break!", but when I read something like that, two thoughts occur to me: 1.) I'm thankful there's a New Covenant and 2.) I'm glad I'm on HIS side!!! LOL

but from a grasshopper's perspective....
 late™
Joined: 2/1/2010
Msg: 53
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 4:10:25 PM

when I read something like that, two thoughts occur to me: 1.) I'm thankful there's a New Covenant and 2.) I'm glad I'm on HIS side!!! LOL

Cool, ...when you get there, tell Jeffery Dahmer I said "hey".
 countreekidd
Joined: 6/30/2009
Msg: 54
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heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 4:24:13 PM
sorry, I have no idea what's in someone's heart, so I'm not qualified to make that call. If he's there, I'm sure it would be because he really accepted Christ into his heart, and I doubt anyone there will be asking to leave because he's there.

but from a grasshopper's perspective....
 111Enigma
Joined: 2/6/2010
Msg: 55
heaven- a punishment or a reward...
Posted: 4/17/2010 4:48:17 PM
OP: I'm not a religious person but I do believe is 'something upthere..."

And I certainly don't believe in a God who would have us burn in hell....that is such a silly notion.

I'm thorn in between the idea that heaven or hell might be experienced right here ....on earth!

I don't know but I'm trying to make my life on earth as fulfilling as possible right now.

Cheers.
P.A.
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