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 Casper66
Joined: 3/2/2007
Msg: 76
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Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.Page 4 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
Yes I think men and women view relationships differently, but I think what destroys alot of relationships is taking others for granted, thinking that they will always be there without putting any effort into the relationship. Look at the honeymoon part of a relationship, you spend time together, do things, learn/communicate about each other, have sex, want to make the other person happy and so on. Both partners put in an effort, but then the relationship goes on and people get lazy or pre-occupied with day to day chores/work/family, they don't communicate or spend time together, when one or both feel like they are not appreciated anymore or wanted, thats when they start looking elsewhere or the relationship ends.
 OyVay...
Joined: 7/15/2011
Msg: 77
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/20/2011 9:06:31 PM
Interesting thread! Hardly enlightening, very similar to the mongoose and the cobra.

One is a day dweller, the other a night dweller.

Women "say" they only want a relationship, that's garbage. They want the looks, the personality, the bad boy package they find attractive!

Mostly the older women on here have done the..."I'll keep him till the kids college is paid for", then they dump him, continue to live on his alimony, and have the life they wanted for the last 10 or 20 years, but hated to pay for, so why bother? When you can get it for free, paid for by the chump who paid for the wedding, the house and life style they wanted for the kids!

Women get unhappy in marriage, relationships when it no longer suits their needs.

Let's face it, the most important thing is their "day"! Let's get married, have a life together, then have kids!

That's girl code for, I want my day, with gown and party, then I want to get the trappings(house, big screen TV, ethan allen bedroom set, china set, etc), after that comes the children.. Post that fuk you, you have served your purpose, given the sperm, paid the bills, now it's time for me to spread my wings, and you can eat sh*t and die. I don't need you anymore.

You may think that harsh, but unless you have experienced the dismissal of being a man, who met the woman's needs, now no longer neccessary to her life. You don't get it.
 TDH49
Joined: 8/13/2010
Msg: 78
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/20/2011 11:08:03 PM

Women "say" they only want a relationship, that's garbage. They want the looks, the personality, the bad boy package they find attractive!

Mostly the older women on here have done the..."I'll keep him till the kids college is paid for", then they dump him, continue to live on his alimony, and have the life they wanted for the last 10 or 20 years, but hated to pay for, so why bother? When you can get it for free, paid for by the chump who paid for the wedding, the house and life style they wanted for the kids!

Women get unhappy in marriage, relationships when it no longer suits their needs.

Let's face it, the most important thing is their "day"! Let's get married, have a life together, then have kids!

That's girl code for, I want my day, with gown and party, then I want to get the trappings(house, big screen TV, ethan allen bedroom set, china set, etc), after that comes the children.. Post that fuk you, you have served your purpose, given the sperm, paid the bills, now it's time for me to spread my wings, and you can eat sh*t and die. I don't need you anymore.

You may think that harsh, but unless you have experienced the dismissal of being a man, who met the woman's needs, now no longer neccessary to her life. You don't get it.
Kudos to you for holding it together my very optimistic friend. Nobody will ever be able to stick a bitter and jaded sticker on your forehead
 happybunny8
Joined: 4/16/2010
Msg: 79
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 4:15:25 AM
Mostly the older women on here have done the..."I'll keep him till the kids college is paid for", then they dump him, continue to live on his alimony, and have the life they wanted for the last 10 or 20 years, but hated to pay for, so why bother? When you can get it for free, paid for by the chump who paid for the wedding, the house and life style they wanted for the kids!


How utterly selfish. If the relationships isn't going well, don't they realize the environment is NOT good for the children?

I have a friend who has 4 kids with this guy. The children are far too stuck to her and don't go near him. When he is around, the oldest teen acts completely different. When he is not around, the teen is laughing.

Finally now my friend is thinking about leaving. What for? The damage is done and at least half of those kids will be the same as their father. Sad.

While I was brought up that you avoid divorce and try everything before going down that road, sometimes it is warranted.

Women like that obviously came from a background where they either had too much or far too little and became embittered and now think the world owes them something. Please.


You may think that harsh, but unless you have experienced the dismissal of being a man, who met the woman's needs, now no longer neccessary to her life. You don't get it.


I don't think it harsh at all. My usual experience has been dismissal because it got "too tough" for them.

Sadly I have a very strong opinion that men are weak. I know not all, because I've seen some men close to me be pillars when it counted, but I've also experienced both my grandmother AND my mother being the ones with the strength when it was needed (death of a child, depression). But the men always had to be strong after the woman already had been and had seen the storm through and stayed with her spouse.

Men want all sorts of things too. Let's not pretend that one sex is better than the other. You have to take into account all the factors.

Frankly we got different hormones running around inside that act differently (high/low) in each person. Yes, I'd say women are a tad more emotional, but I guess nobody ever linked those hormones when a woman is pregnant with the possibility that they are the same hormones as when one is not?! Sheesh.

It's like men getting all "I want to fight" when they see a fight break out or some silliness. We think it's nuts, but maybe it's hormones?!

I've been on these forums awhile. Men don't know what they want either, or they seek something that doesn't exist. A woman who is traditional, ambitious and independant - but one trait can't overrule another.

And just as women expect men to be mind readers, men expect it too.
 Yew4ics
Joined: 9/30/2010
Msg: 80
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 5:15:52 AM

About the cards, annivery remembering, the holidays...

I don't think that is a gender then, it is a family thing. We are unfocussed on these in my family, and sometimes it can be a struggle to remember my own birthday. I don't do holidays much, though I have tried at times and I have my small traditions. My stepmother is holiday, birthday, cards and letters needy and simple efforts have gone a long way to put our relationship on a good footing. I sent her cheap stickers for her to put on cards that she sends out. Wow, what a huge effect! So she was happy, so my daddy was happy....

But neither my daddy nor mom, nor the woman I call "Mom" , nor their family before or after, of both genders, are focussed on any kind of anniversary.

My husband, though, dammit. When people ask how long we have been married, he'll tell you to the day, and with a little hesitation, to the hour. Cards, holidays.....and he views my attention to this as evidence of my investment in our relationship,



I think it is much more romantic to bring home flowers, cards, etc. when it isn't a birthday or holiday. To do it just because. THAT is my idea of being romantic. That way, if a birthday, anniversary, or Valentines day slips his mind, then there is no need to feel neglected. If someone nurtures a relationship all the time (and this goes for both genders) then the romance is covered, and petty things like certain dates do not have to be stressed over. As another poster said, it becomes hell on earth for the poor guy if he forgets to pick up a birthday card for her. Well that's probably because he has been so neglectful of meeting her emotional needs, that the one day out of the year, she thinks he is going to get it right, and he doesn't even remember to acknowledge it with a card...yea, you can probably expect to be in the doghouse for a week after that one.And whatever his needs are that need to be met, it is up to her to see to those as well. Relationships are like gardens. If they are not watered and nurtured, they will dry up and die. It can be either or both that become neglectful, and the marriage withers up and tanks.
 cap_n_mORGAN
Joined: 7/3/2009
Msg: 81
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 7:32:26 AM

Lets be careful we dont think giving money for kids up keep is like giving money for the mother to go out night clubbing with.
I think in the 70s, the only money when my parents broke up for kids mantinance was 7.00 per week, and my real father did not wish to pay it out of bitterness, this left her having to decide if she could either buy toothpaste or something else.
She had two young children to support, and it was difficult, eventually she had to go out to work and my nan would babysit us both, of course we would cry for our mother and one day my Sibling called my nan mother, by mistake.
I also remember a babysitter ,being nasty to us and pinching us, in a rough way, but my mother had no choice but to work as she could not afford to without financial help stay at home.
Getting bitter about an ex, also can get at the kids too, she did marry again and he offered payments for us when they split, which I thought was a lovely gesture, but by then my mother had qualifications and could make her own money, and did not view it as fair, as this man was already paying for his own kids from his first marrige.


You bring up a great point but what is the right amount?
I got custody of my children after the divorce was long over. I put the same amount of money that I had been paying in child support in a separate account for one year after I obtained custody. Out of this account I paid for one half the household bills and their clothes.

At the end of the year I had enough left to take a month long vacation in Europe.

Yet I was always told I wasn't paying enough c/s when I didn't have custody.

My belief on this is 50/50 on everything....the Children spend half the time with the mother and half with with the father.

They each are responsible for the kids while they are with them....No support is paid to either person.

This has actually been done and the results show the kids to be better balanced and healthier when this is done.

Medical is also 50/50 each parent is responsible for half of the childs up keep.

While I know there are deadbeats out there.....The truth is the current system is back door alimony.
There are much more reasonable ways of being sure the parents support their kids.

BTW for the record I think the deadbeats should be hunted down and jailed if they don't support their kids.....However it should be a reasonable amount that is expected.

A father should not have to live with family just to be able to pay support.
 FyrKrakn
Joined: 2/21/2010
Msg: 82
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 12:44:50 PM
I'm right behind you, yew.

Be neglectful all year and ya can't make an effort on the *required* days? She may not feel good about complaining about all those days but her hurt for all those days is expressed in the singular day that she thinks she has the right to complain. It's a set up, though, she freaks on command, like program. He knows she will, now he has something to complain about because she is "crazy".

I do know a couple of men who do all day long for their women, and the women still freak when the holiday isn't outrageously expensive and romantic, but these women are abusive all year and the men are doormats.

Yes, there are situations where unhappy people stick it out for nearly forever. There are crappy people on this planet. That's not this thread.

The explanation for women, who love their husbands, and are loved by their husbands, who are unsatisfied in their marriage, is a need for a different relationship than what they are getting.

Why do women in general need this relationship that is so different from what men in general need?

Why do men, knowing what the woman needs, take the stand that she needs to change what she need, then suffers a surprise when she leaves?

Why can't women just need differently, more closely to what satisfies men?

OK men, you want a partner who needs differently, more like you, then you have relationship options that don't involve women.

If women are dissatisfied but continuing to love, only a romantic fool believes that love alone should be enough, because the love was created and grown in the relationship, and if you take the relationship away, the love dies. I don't know how much more "go with the flow" you could be than to maintain love for the purpose of keeping it. To me, stopping the effort, is not going with the flow, it is damming it up by becoming an obstacle.

Being shocked at the end of a relationship for this reason is a bit like yelling at the sun for setting. It ain't no secret that a woman will be unhappy if the relationship is neglected. It's a no brainer.
 grizzelda
Joined: 6/25/2006
Msg: 83
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Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 1:10:43 PM
Being shocked at the end of a relationship for this reason is a bit like yelling at the sun for setting. It ain't no secret that a woman will be unhappy if the relationship is neglected. It's a no brainer.


IME the biggest issue most men have is that they dont like having to actually make the effort to tend the relationship. They know why, they just dont see any value to doing it until things come to a head, if it isnt important to them, then it cant be or shouldnt be important to any one else I guess.

I can only think its because so many men have such incredibly low standards when it comes to a relationship, this boggles their mind. They really dont get that putting in the smallest effort possible is insulting and selfish. Then women are crazy, on the rag, ****y, insert typical comment here.

What I always find incredibly amusing is that those very things that many women do like making sure that their is decent food in the house, that the sheets get laundered, cook their favorite meal when they are feeling bad are the very things that women who are "emotional" and "crazy" do for the people they care about. It is also the same "emotional" and "crazy" things their mother's did for them when they were children and were growing, the very things that made them feel loved, safe and cared for. The very things that helps shape them into healthy productive individuals.

But maybe that is the problem, these men are selfish and takers that cant be bothered to see that these things are done out of love and a desire to make the people they love happy and cared for.
 FyrKrakn
Joined: 2/21/2010
Msg: 84
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 1:29:02 PM
Grizzelda, I am not going to paint men as selfish for not making the effort.

In very good extra long term relationships, the children witness the bad more than the good. The bad tends to be public, what the men do to successfully keep the relationship tends to be private.

Men do not have the examples to teach them. Everyone sees Mom do all the nurturing, the holiday prepping, the honey-do list making.....They hear Dad complain about the list more than see that he is *doing* it and trying hard to please her. They see Mom cry when she is ignored, they don't see or hear the simple sweet nothings and physical affection that Dad does to fix everything.

What do women want from men? They want communication. Men think women talk too much and tune them out. You want to guarantee she will constantly talk about nothing? Ignore her. She is constantly testing everything to find what sparks your interest in her.

Touch her, talk WITH her, HEAR her.

If you don't like touching her, if you cannot stand a conversation with her, if you are not interested in communicating and understanding her, WHY ARE YOU WITH HER????

I got news for you, she KNOWS you feel this way, your actions scream at her. She loves you and you say you love her while doing this???? And you complain when she frees you to find someone who you WANT to touch and communicate with.

Yeah, I forgot, she was too needy, if she just needed less, like, I don't know, an absence of physical affection, no displays of regard, and to be shut out of communication, then everything would be OK. She just needs to needs less, then divorce rates would not be so high and everyone would be happy.

OMG, that's some crazy sheet, women just want TOOOOOO much.
 Fleuron
Joined: 8/18/2010
Msg: 85
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 2:27:11 PM

At the end of the year I had enough left to take a month long vacation in Europe.



This has actually been done and the results show the kids to be better balanced and healthier when this is done.


How much does a month long vacation in “Europe” cost? Any particular country/city in Europe, or just anywhere?

And what “results” and what "this" are you talking about? Do you have a name of some sort of scientific study? Who conducted it? Who paid for it? Your arbitrary arguments don’t sound credible to me at all.


Yet I was always told I wasn't paying enough c/s when I didn't have custody.


Boo hoo, poor baby…that must have been horrific for you.
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 86
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 4:20:08 PM

Men do not have the examples to teach them. Everyone sees Mom do all the nurturing, the holiday prepping, the honey-do list making.....They hear Dad complain about the list more than see that he is *doing* it and trying hard to please her. They see Mom cry when she is ignored, they don't see or hear the simple sweet nothings and physical affection that Dad does to fix everything.

What do women want from men? They want communication. Men think women talk too much and tune them out. You want to guarantee she will constantly talk about nothing? Ignore her. She is constantly testing everything to find what sparks your interest in her.

Touch her, talk WITH her, HEAR her.


And, again with the "no matter what's wrong in a relationship, it's always the man's fault" song.

.... love it.

Again, I say that women are NOT the wonderful communicators that they think they are. Women DO NOT invest themselves in relationships as much as you seem to believe they do, especially if kids are involved. Women want men to listen to what they say and do what they tell them to do. Women communicate AT their men more than the try to communicate WITH their men.

And, again, why does the relationship always have to relvolve around HER and only her? How about women make some accomodations for a guy's needs? How about give HIM some consideration?

Honestly, most men know that it really doesn't matter how hard they try to make their woman happy. From experience they know that she's always going to find shit to biatch about or be unhappy about. She's always going to have some new need she needs fulfilled. After a while, it just isn't worth it. There is very little return for any investment the guy makes or any effort he puts in.

Relationships really should be equitable, but they rarely are and it is NOT only because of the men.

Yeah, some men are surprised when women up and leave, but it's NOT that they could have done anything about it anyway. Before my ex left with her new guy, I knew she wasn't happy about things as they were, but she wouldn't talk to me about it. I tried to accommodate her any way she wanted, but it did fvck all good. In fact, I think trying to be a good partner made things worse. She didn't communicate to me what was really bothering her, just as I'm sure many women who up a leave have not done much to communicate to their men.

You can pat yourself on the back all you want for being the rocks and the wonderful relationship nurturers, but every time a relationship fvcks up, there's a woman who's at least half of the problem.

 happybunny8
Joined: 4/16/2010
Msg: 87
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 4:26:25 PM
^^^well, I tried the open communication thing and was totally upfront about something and the dude ended up dumping me.

I think women are afraid to really say it because either the man will:

Not listen
Belittle her
Think she's nuts anyways.

I think what is more important is both partners discussing their communication and "fighting" styles right in the beginning of a relationship. This way if one doesn't like it, they can bail then and there.

I saved myself a lot of trouble with the dude above by doing what I did. It was hard, but forced myself to do it as part of being more self-aware and opening up more.

I really don't know how one can think that it's all the man's fault when a relationship ends. Even if the man did more things wrong, I know in my case I wasn't totally innocent. And when I realized that, I began to make steps to fix it.

Meh, of course, I still might suck at it all. But I can brag and say that at least I acknowledged.
 FyrKrakn
Joined: 2/21/2010
Msg: 88
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 5:19:09 PM
Hilarious.

Capt Blah listened to his own tune and rewrote my words to fit.

I stand by the assertion that no one leaves a relationship with impunity. The topic question framed my now quoted words. If the topic question were different, it would have been a different frame, it is not, however a picture of me blaming all men and claiming all women are great communicators. That is your opinion of what all women think, thereby you fail in the singular most important aspect of communication.... to HEAR what the other is saying. With that failure and venom so obvious, and the one size fits all belief system of women being (insert laundry list of failings here), then it is no wonder that a woman left for exactly the reason that I say women leave:

She was not heard. No more than I was.

If anger comforts you, have at it, all by yourself.

If you don't like how women relate, you don't trust them, you don't believe in them, you don't respect them, you just plain don't like them.... Leave them alone and explore other options.

We won't miss you.
 Out_of_the_Ash
Joined: 3/1/2009
Msg: 89
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Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 5:40:02 PM
So what if my expectations of a man are to be like Gerard Butler's rendition of Erik?
...and props to who knows who Erik is.


It can and does, though, I agree.
That go with the flow thing men do sometimes gets a bit too ridiculous, though, especially when it borders on apathy. Apathy makes me crazy. I don't have time for it. I find it a sign of weakness... I love strong men, and by that I mean fearless when it comes to allowing themselves to be real, letting it rip like Matt Bellamy (lol look at all the namedropping)... and I need a strong man because I seem to wreck the weak ones.
I have a hard time respecting them after I get to know them and their issues.

Mind you I do like to dote. Hm. I am an amazing girlfriend, I have been told by several people. I just... if they do something stupid that destroys trust? Watch out. Things are gonna go nuclear.

I realize this probably sounds worse than it should. I really don't care. I think a lot of us have said some things on this, a dating site, which basically says "HI I AM FULL OF RED FLAGS!!! AVOID ME AT ALL COSTS!!"

Woof.
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 90
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 7:53:44 PM

Hilarious.

Capt Blah listened to his own tune and rewrote my words to fit.


Well, I'm glad you had a good laugh, darling, but you ought to go re-read my post.


That is your opinion of what all women think, thereby you fail in the singular most important aspect of communication.... to HEAR what the other is saying.


No, nice try, but not quite.

The first tenet of good communication is that it is incumbent on the commmunicator to make sure that the message is framed in a way that the communicatee understands the message. If the message is important enough, the one who is attempting to communicate the message needs to find a way that makes the message understood.

You have it backwards, as do most women. As I said, most women communicate AT, not WITH their men. There is a significant difference and I am in no way excusing men. Some will never learn to hear, but most CAN get it if the message is conveyed in a way that in actually conducive to communication WITH someone.

Men do not communicate like women. Why would women think that communicating to men as they do with their girlfriends is a good way to go about things? If communication is important, learn how to communicate your message to your audience.


She was not heard. No more than I was.


No, she did not communicate what was bothering her despite my attempts to give her many opportunities to do so.

Believe it or not, like many men, I actually CAN listen. I CAN hear what is being said, but communication is a two way street. Few women are really good at actually communicating, while they're VERY good at TALKING. There is quite a bit of difference.

Add in the fact that manhy women think most men are idiots when in comes to communication because men don't communicate like women, women tend to approach things in a pretty condescending and dismissive way...

.... which really tends to make true communication a bit difficult.

Anyway..... carry on.

 Out_of_the_Ash
Joined: 3/1/2009
Msg: 91
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Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/21/2011 10:37:57 PM
I CAN hear what is being said, but communication is a two way street. Few women are really good at actually communicating, while they're VERY good at TALKING. There is quite a bit of difference.


I think what many women need to learn, myself included, is how to communicate effectively with most people. Both men and women.

Most people don't have the attention span and get emotionally exhausted when an issue is hashed out by the person who feels the need to yabber on about what problem they're facing together for what seems like forever.

Best way to get to the point effectively is to make 3 statements that wrap up the entire problem and tell that to them. No more. Maybe 5 at most, to be fair.

It's what they do in the film industry to tell what the story is about before they are allowed to get that thing into production anyway. No time for petty details which can be worked out later.

A lot of women do like to talk and talk and talk, as do I, I will be the first to admit that. I know a lot of men who do, too. I am related to at least two men like that. However if you're actually wanting to fix a problem, it's best to keep it short and to the point so that they'll actually absorb it. They will also appreciate it. Especially if they're used to long, drawn out "discussions".

Seems a lot of people just like to hear themselves talk.
 RazaMixta
Joined: 1/19/2011
Msg: 92
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/22/2011 4:04:58 AM


(RazaMixta) Living with other women: mothers, sisters, cousins, grandmas, roommates, friends... they are all serious, intimate relationships to me! Sex has nothing to do with anything.


The bolded sentence should be filed under, "Just Doesn't Get It". The intimate relationship between a man and a woman is unlike any other; and, sex most certainly has a very significant role in the definition of that relationship...

Arlo...


Yes Arlo, I noticed ... I do have children ... And think I know exactly how it happened.
It is possible to have sex without intimacy but ...
Let's talk about "getting IT".
When a woman doesn't get relationship intimacy (communication, trust, appreciation, attention, courtship) I guarantee he won't 'get any'...
Get it?
This I get:

Men see relationship as physical first and emotional second
Women see relationship as emotional first, physical second

So for me is relationship intimacy first ... physical relationship second. Get it??


Relationships are like gardens. If they are not watered and nurtured, they will dry up and die. It can be either or both that become neglectful, and the marriage withers up and tanks.


So women bring to the marriage nurturing, care, tenderness, community, children. And since there is no sound of clapping from one hand without the other, they expect a responsive partner, one that goes with the flow and in the flow of time there is evolution: families grow, situations change, times change, kids grow up, individuals change and so do their needs ... everything changes ... change IS inevitable and adapting to it is necessary for growth.
Where are these men that GO WITH THE FLOW?? All I see and hear is that men want things to stay the same... wth??

At the core of this is the penchant for females to want change and men that want consistency.


Men enter the relationship expecting ... sex?

If a woman forgets a guy's birthday, the guy will say "It's OK. As long as I get beer and sex, all is good". Ditto for anniversaries.

So am I to understand that all the things that women can offer are not really wanted by the average man, because all they really want/need her to do is just "put out"? And if they don't they are suspected and/or accused of withholding and blackmailing? lol

'Cause if you are not 'getting any', is because you are not giving her any of the following:

after they have locked each other into a LTR/marriage...they stop doing all the nice, caring, nurturing things they did to each other that wooed them into the relationship in the first place. They start taking each other, and their love for each other...for granted....and neglect it.
This relationship laziness is the death knell for that relationship, as far as I've been able to see.

^^^ wait wait wait a minute didn't someone say something about men wanting consistency?

The only constant is change.
 happybunny8
Joined: 4/16/2010
Msg: 93
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/22/2011 4:33:21 AM
Men do not communicate like women.


Ah, so are you saying that men are the better communicators? That's kinda condescending ;p

Many men think that they give women "opportunities to do so". When in reality they don't. Maybe this is what women should be communicating to men.

Everyone assumes they are "good" communicators.....


most people don't have the attention span and get emotionally exhausted when an issue is hashed out by the person who feels the need to yabber on about what problem they're facing together for what seems like forever.


It really depends. I have one friend with whom we go back and forth. In other words, we are there for the other when one needs to talk. One doesn't yammer on forever, the other does interject, because clarification is required. BUT the conversation is often long and we both have no problems keeping up and I never feel like she is yammering on. If I felt that way, I think that would be a sign of one of us lacking a communication skill, no?

Maybe women NEED to discuss it longer? I think however, that communication skills should be different for work. This is when communication NEEDS to be succinct and to the point.

Who made the rule that it has to be short? Also, I truly believe that some people just will not mesh together - even if there are good communicators. There is not only one good style of communication.

It seems to me that people are saying one way is better than the other. Maybe, when it comes to emotional issues, men and women are different. I mean, a psychologist has no problems "hearing".

I dunno, all guesswork. I don't think anyone is an expert. We all keep learning, but apparently some folks on POF have mastered everything....

 grizzelda
Joined: 6/25/2006
Msg: 94
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Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/22/2011 5:05:42 AM

Men do not communicate like women.


Bullshit! Wait, isnt this where the generality that women will talk anything to death comes in and men dont? Men will make a statement and that is it? That is the biggest load of baloney. I have sat and listened to many men ramble on incessantly about the boat motor, the new TV they just bought or how they had to fix something in the house. Men are no different than women when it comes to things that are important to them, so spare me the men and women are polar opposites in communications styles. I think that is a bullshit cop out for men who just dont care enough to listen to what their partner has to say. Easier to say that she is nagging or blah, blah, blah all the time than to "hear" what she is saying. Because my guess is that what she is talking about requires them to actually do something instead of just sit there and congratulate himself on how "simple" he is.

It is amazing that these men who claim to hate the way women communicate are the very same men when a woman is clear and direct are the first ones to call her ****y, agressive or the like.
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 95
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/22/2011 7:40:40 AM

Men do not communicate like women.


Ah, so are you saying that men are the better communicators? That's kinda condescending ;p


Where did I say men are better?


Many men think that they give women "opportunities to do so". When in reality they don't. Maybe this is what women should be communicating to men.


Well, that might be a good start, sure.


Everyone assumes they are "good" communicators.....


No, not everyone..... but just I'd say far more women believe this of themselves than do men.


Bullshit! Wait, isnt this where the generality that women will talk anything to death comes in and men dont? Men will make a statement and that is it? That is the biggest load of baloney. I have sat and listened to many men ramble on incessantly about the boat motor, the new TV they just bought or how they had to fix something in the house.


Again, TALKING is not the same as COMMUNICATING as in the context of a relationship and the expectations that each party brings to the table, which is, if I'm not mistaken, what this thread is about.


I think that is a bullshit cop out for men who just dont care enough to listen to what their partner has to say. Easier to say that she is nagging or blah, blah, blah all the time than to "hear" what she is saying.


Sure....and, well, perhaps sometimes she needs to realize that it's really unnecessary to give him the word-for-word replay of the 2 hour conversation she had with Trinity the hairdresser then follow that one up with the 3 hour replay of the conversation with her mother........

Cheers.

 Out_of_the_Ash
Joined: 3/1/2009
Msg: 96
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Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/22/2011 12:47:16 PM
Happybunny8,

lol that was fun to write out. Cute. Anyway, I'm no expert either. That technique was handed to me actually by my brother who works in film. When I gave that advice to my friend who calls a meeting maybe once a month to talk to her boyfriend about whatever issue they are facing, and I am not getting into that but it seemed the talks would last a long time and after I told her the 3 sentence thing she used it and he really appreciated that and actually got to work on fixing that issue faster and better, as it was well understood what needed to be done.

Clarity. For a lot of people like myself, I can't usually reiterate something verbatim unless it is written down in front of me. I'll get lost in my own head if someone goes on and on, I just tune out without realizing it, even. Eep.

Doesn't help that I grew up in a family full of interrupters.
 julbev
Joined: 5/22/2011
Msg: 97
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/22/2011 8:00:13 PM
Women and men totally think differently!!!! That is why communication is SOOOOOO important. Women (most but not all) wether we want to admit it or not have a fairytale in mind....mine has changed over the years. A relationship takes alot of work!!!! The older I get the more I realize how little I know about relationships....Everybody has different ideas of a relationship and we will not know what the other is thinking unless we ask!!!

WAKE UP WOMEN!!!!!!! Men are not mind readers!!!!! TALK!!! If they don't know they can't participate!!!!
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 9/26/2009
Msg: 98
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/23/2011 8:26:10 AM

(RazaMixta) Yes Arlo, I noticed ... I do have children ... And think I know exactly how it happened.
It is possible to have sex without intimacy but ...
Let's talk about "getting IT".
When a woman doesn't get relationship intimacy (communication, trust, appreciation, attention, courtship) I guarantee he won't 'get any'...
Get it?


Yes, I get it. You obviously still don't. I was responding to your statement, "Sex has nothing to do with anything." It was definitely a situation where you should have thought twice before posting such screaming lunacy...



Men see relationship as physical first and emotional second
Women see relationship as emotional first, physical second


So for me is relationship intimacy first ... physical relationship second. Get it??


So who died and made you the boss of how quickly, and in which order, a relationship proceeds?



At the core of this is the penchant for females to want change and men that want consistency.


Men enter the relationship expecting ... sex?


You sound surprised that a man would expect (*EWWW*) sex in a relationship, and would place a different importance on it than you would. What are you, 12?



If a woman forgets a guy's birthday, the guy will say "It's OK. As long as I get beer and sex, all is good". Ditto for anniversaries.


So am I to understand that all the things that women can offer are not really wanted by the average man, because all they really want/need her to do is just "put out"?


Again, you sound surprised that men don't view things EXACTLY like women do, and have a different hierarchy of needs/wants. Is this really news to you?

Arlo...
 4ms4me
Joined: 4/24/2010
Msg: 99
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Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/26/2011 9:02:04 AM

"blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah important piece of information blah blah blah blah blah. Blah for 30 mins then suddenly its a key piece of important information. Then blah blah blah blah blah for an hour. Then important piece of information. Over and over.

There's a myth out there that women talk much more than than men; there was actually a book printed that claimed men spoke 7,000 words per day, compared to a woman's 20,000 words. Of course, people jumped all over that. Turns out, the author didn't do any research, she simply repeated a stereotype.

Actual research shows that men and women talk about equally; there's more variations among individuals than there is between genders. However, men and women do tend to talk about different things - women tend to talk about relationships and other people more than men; men talk about objects - like sports teams, or cars.

So ... yeah ... women do talk about important things; men just blah blah blah blah about unimportant stuff.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=women-talk-more-than-men
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=11762186
http://www.livescience.com/7420-men-talk-women.html
 cap_n_mORGAN
Joined: 7/3/2009
Msg: 100
Women are less happy in marriage/relationships than men because they expect much more?.
Posted: 7/26/2011 9:38:14 AM


So ... yeah ... women do talk about important things; men just blah blah blah blah about unimportant stuff.


From the research I have done the difference in the actual number of more words that are spoken by women is very small.

I don't think that the number of words are as important as communication.

Men talk about way more than just sports teams and cars. Men as a gender is programed to solve problems.

However many times women don't want a solution but just to know we understand.

There lies the rub.....Men listen and are formulating a solution as the lady speaks......when she is through he offers his solution.......She is offended because she now feels he thinks she can't fix her own problems.

Where if it was two women there would be no offense and if it was two men they would then discuss the best ways to fix the problem.

If the sexes could learn to actually communicate and speak each others languages then things might change.

Bill Cosby said....."Women don't want to hear what a man thinks.....She wants to hear what she thinks...........In a deeper voice.

Men if your lady is talking listen and before you offer a solution to the trouble ASK IF SHE WANTS ONE!
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