Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > Occupy Wall Street      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 timetogo3223
Joined: 9/29/2011
Msg: 1001
Occupy Wall StreetPage 41 of 53    (13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53)
still..




While myself and other of my union bros. and sis. were "raising holy hell" we were unemployed


Create your own employment. Stay home and work. Be productive, not destructive. Public union people are overpaid and under worked, and supporting your "brothers" and "sisters" in sloth is hardly something to be proud of.
 Doremi_Fasolatido
Joined: 2/14/2009
Msg: 1002
view profile
History
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 11:08:56 AM
Ice, I am referring to the Tea Party Govs. that were elected in the last gubernatorial elections. Elected in large measure with help from people like the Koch Bros. As I stated on previous posts the first thing these Govs. did was to try to remove collective bargaining rights for state union people.

Certain rich conglomerates bought our Govs. Who in turn tried to steal the right of states union workers to collectively bargain.

No, I am not against corporations making big money. The eradication of my and other jobsite protections, in the form of Union representation I am against. Both can co-exist and prosper. Corporations making big money should be a good thing not just for the ceo's and stockholders but for those that actually produce their goods. Or build their roads, buildings and factories, as I do. And it's not just wages but jobsite safety, environmental and advancement of working conditions.
 Doremi_Fasolatido
Joined: 2/14/2009
Msg: 1003
view profile
History
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 11:22:10 AM
Ice, I am referring to the Tea Party Govs. that were elected in the last gubernatorial elections. Elected in large measure with help from people like the Koch Bros. As I stated on previous posts the first thing these Govs. did was to try to remove collective bargaining rights for state union people.

Certain rich conglomerates bought our Govs. Who in turn tried to steal the right of states union workers to collectively bargain.

No, I am not against corporations making big money. The eradication of my and other jobsite protections, in the form of Union representation I am against. Both can co-exist and prosper. Corporations making big money should be a good thing not just for the ceo's and stockholders but for those that actually produce their goods. Or build their roads, buildings and factories, as I do. And it's not just wages but jobsite safety, environmental and advancement of working conditions.

And time, post 1185...I have since returned to work thank you. Since I am Union I guess you think myself and others are "slothful". Did you attend public school? If so, did you point that out to your teacher back then. If you ever need a cop or fireman I hope you tell them that before they do their duties. Of course, that would involve a face to face encounter and I can see from your profile it's not your style.
 SweetLilGTP
Joined: 10/22/2010
Msg: 1004
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 11:25:52 AM
Some blue collar guy with a high school education believed his broker when the broker said, "Yes, you can afford this house", and HE'S the bad guy because he got played?


What...they don't teach basic math skills in high school anymore? How can you say he got played? He should know how much he can afford to pay on a mortgage


Trinity: Do you not believe in business ethic then? (No moral standard is due in business....whatsoever?)

How about on a social front?

Do you also believe a lady, when raped, should have known better, akin to blue collar worker above; and for that reason should not have any recourse taken by herself or a Government party against her attacker?

Is everything, and any action, then ok; because the wronged "should have known better"?

Please excuse me if I missed a pre-face or further qualification of your statements. From the post I read; you lay blame for being ripped off solely on the victim.
 OyVay...
Joined: 7/15/2011
Msg: 1005
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 11:36:43 AM
(Yawn) gee I wish someone would attribute the right things to me. If we keep talking about the same things, the same villain, will be responsible. Now that you want to talk about something new, we will have new villains! See how that works?

"see how public unions have brought California to the brink of BK"

Well at least we now know you can quote Fox news, since they are the ones purporting this.

Yes I'm sure they contributed, but I'm afraid the list of those is long and distinguished!

Let's start with Prop 13, from back in the 70's that held down proerty taxes. So you people wound up with low property taxes, and fairly high personal income taxes and capital gains taxes. At the same time shifting the responsibilty of the schools from local to state government.

The problem here is, while it holds your property taxes down, you are subject to the vagaries of cycles in the economy. So in a recession like now, you lose revenue, and have a larger shortfall, than if it were based on the property tax. This is part of the problem, not unlike other states who've done the same.

You had a 60% population increase in the last 30 years, putting more strain on services, especially in the poor(You'll love this I know, since most illegals are poor, more problems). These problems were disproportionate to the population, since little if any of the money made by illegals made it's way to state coffers.

Irresponsible fiscal policies. WOW!! There are a lot of these. From the city manager who made 700K, for a job in a small town, not an LA, to the Enron debacle in 2000-2001, when the highest user of electric(state of california) was raped repeatedly by Enron, perhaps you remember this?

I could go on, but why bother, you will not believe what I say, even though you live there and know what I said is true.
 SweetLilGTP
Joined: 10/22/2010
Msg: 1006
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 12:10:18 PM
"see how public unions have brought California to the brink of BK"


Samew with British Columbia. The only people/group that did better, as opposed to "way" worse off under their Liberal Government was the public sector union. (The..only....one)

And ya, you heard it correct, a "Liberal" Government; NOT the NDP which is made fun of up here as a commie party, due to its' socialist routes

Here in Ontario; we're going deeper down that drain to see if we can strike oil in that hole

Guillotines!!

Get yer red hot guillotines!! Get em while they're hot!

Order one this week; and we will throw in a free had basket and wash set!!

Buy Three and we will ALSO throw in a real lame gim, I mean, executioners outfit for FREE!!



What; business is slow since left Expedia....whatdya want?

For the record: that job ended because the higly paid Government screwed up and cost me licences "again". The same Government who is reportedly all about getting people back to work. <--They still got me to work, but the paying taxes part dropped heavily due to their mistake, and my ensuing inability to meet the demands of the role. (travel demands)

You had a 60% population increase in the last 30 years, putting more strain on services, especially in the poor(You'll love this I know, since most illegals are poor, more problems). These problems were disproportionate to the population, since little if any of the money made by illegals made it's way to state coffers.


So now you're competing with China wages AND cheap illegal labour. You're competing for jobs with people who dont pay taxes and acept less.

Lemme know how that works out. Actually, no need, my calculator got that answer 'real' fast
 OyVay...
Joined: 7/15/2011
Msg: 1007
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 1:20:09 PM
I doubt anybody is against corporations making a profit. Nor does anybody on here propose stripping them of assets.

I DO have a problem with an inside group of executives, at a public corporation, making 3 to 400 times what their average employee makes, when in most countries it's more like 35 or 55 to 1 ratio. I do have a problem with corporations swaying elections, paying lobbyists to change or influence the writing of laws in their favor. I do have a problem with corporations designing company buybacks, that don't span the year, and try to achieve a price for the betterment of shareholders. Instead coincide with the issuance of executive stock options, and for a brief period while they unload their shares, artifically inflate a stocks price.

But a profit, he11 no, I don't have a problem with that, in fact I applaud it.

I believe stilllookin, is referring to the Koch Brothers company Koch Industries, owner of among other things Georgia Pacific. A driving force($$$) in the tea party, they have supported certain candidates, with a specific goal in mind. Don't believe it? Check out the conversation taped with Gov. Brown of Wisconsin when he thought he was talking with them, and it was actually a TV station!

Frankly I love corporate profits! More for them, better stock prices for me.
 lotustemple
Joined: 10/23/2011
Msg: 1008
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 1:41:28 PM
The USA would be smart to follow the examples set by successful established countries like France, Canada and Sweden(minus the open immigration policy).

France in particular doesn't put up with corporations and white collar writing their own pay rates. They protest successfully.

The USA is larger and more corrupt and needs a superior model to follow. This is a tough one, however OWS lets us know how much of the population if fed up, contrary to the information and polls furnished by the ever questionable and corrupt media. Basically America is fed up and has global support. Gosh i hope something good comes from all of this!
 SweetLilGTP
Joined: 10/22/2010
Msg: 1009
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 2:02:47 PM

The USA would be smart to follow the examples set by successful established countries like France, Canada and Sweden(minus the open immigration policy).


The US has way more illegal immigration, and at deeper levels, than Canada does.

 lotustemple
Joined: 10/23/2011
Msg: 1010
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 2:37:34 PM
^^^^i was referring to Sweden. Holland is another great country whose weakness is their immigration policy, but overall have a fabulous social system without excessive laws and restrictions IMO.
 trinity818
Joined: 9/1/2006
Msg: 1011
view profile
History
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 2:45:03 PM

Do you also believe a lady, when raped, should have known better, akin to blue collar worker above



Please excuse me


WTF. There is no excuse for this comparison. If you can't see the difference between a rape and a bad decision, you're not worth responding to.
 cap_n_mORGAN
Joined: 7/3/2009
Msg: 1012
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 4:40:38 PM


Really? What is the unemployment rate in France?


France lowest rate since 09 was a astoundingly low 9.0% since then it has been as high as 10% but is running around 9.5%.

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/france/unemployment-rate

There is the source.

Yes seems France is a socialist wonderland.

Thanks but no thanks I would rather have my America back to the way it was before the anointed one came into power.
 lotustemple
Joined: 10/23/2011
Msg: 1013
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 5:05:50 PM
OK guys, but the bottom line is France isn't letting corporations destroy their country, economy and the middle class. That's one lesson we could learn from them. How they keep corporations, government and white collar in check. Which is alot better than we have been doing as of late.


VVV Edit to below:
What good does polarization do? There are good things to be gleened from even a socialist country. France has caps on corporate and white collar profit. Personally i'd like to see that implemented in the USA while not stepping on the toes of capitalism.
 cap_n_mORGAN
Joined: 7/3/2009
Msg: 1014
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 5:17:30 PM

OK guys, but the bottom line is France isn't letting corporations destroy their country, economy and the middle class. That's one lesson we could learn from them. How they keep corporations, government and white collar in check. Which is alot better than we have been doing as of late.


No the corporations are not destroying France the socialist government is. Look at Greece.

Defaulting on national debt because they can't pay the outrageous retirements the socialist government promised.

Sorry but capitalism will always trump socialism......At least for the ones that believe they can spend their own money better than the government.
 SweetLilGTP
Joined: 10/22/2010
Msg: 1015
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 6:24:13 PM

WTF. There is no excuse for this comparison. If you can't see the difference between a rape and a bad decision, you're not worth responding to.


The lady who was raped trusted someone, and then had that trust abused.

The person who went to a mortgage advisor and was givemn bad advice that caused them to lose their house also trusted someone, and had that trust abused. The difference here, is that example two PAID for that.

It's pretty obvious really.


France has an unemployment rate of 9.0%


It would be interesting to see what their "poverty" rate is. After all; 'that' is a measure of a society, not how many worker bees are buzzin the hive right?
 Cdn_Iceman
Joined: 12/1/2010
Msg: 1016
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 6:31:12 PM

The lady who was raped trusted someone, and then had that trust abused.

The person who went to a mortgage advisor and was givemn bad advice that caused them to lose their house also trusted someone, and had that trust abused. The difference here, is that example two PAID for that.

It's pretty obvious really.
Actually its not obvious, When a woman is raped she is being forced, but lets not go there its a touchy subject, Ive known rape victims and its really not a valid comparison and its a sore spot for some of us , and comparing it to the person going to a crooked banker/broker?First thing there was no gun put to their head, or their lives threaten, they signed the mortgage documents by their own free will , out of greed most cases, there was no forcing them, most of them gambled and lost its that simple comparing to rape is asinine.

Yes there were some that were desperate and was taken advantage of and most of those brokers are either a guest of the government now or they were put out of business.
 Bladesmith81801
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 1017
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 6:48:22 PM
I doubt anybody is against corporations making a profit. Nor does anybody on here propose stripping them of assets.

I DO have a problem with an inside group of executives, at a public corporation, making 3 to 400 times what their average employee makes, when in most countries it's more like 35 or 55 to 1 ratio. I do have a problem with corporations swaying elections, paying lobbyists to change or influence the writing of laws in their favor. I do have a problem with corporations designing company buybacks, that don't span the year, and try to achieve a price for the betterment of shareholders. Instead coincide with the issuance of executive stock options, and for a brief period while they unload their shares, artifically inflate a stocks price.

But a profit, he11 no, I don't have a problem with that, in fact I applaud it.

I believe stilllookin, is referring to the Koch Brothers company Koch Industries, owner of among other things Georgia Pacific. A driving force($$$) in the tea party, they have supported certain candidates, with a specific goal in mind. Don't believe it? Check out the conversation taped with Gov. Brown of Wisconsin when he thought he was talking with them, and it was actually a TV station!

Frankly I love corporate profits! More for them, better stock prices for me.


Put more succinctly, We (I and the OWS movement among others) have a problem with the 1% and the corporations buying off our supposed representatives and using the same and lobbyists to rig the system against anyone NOT them, and usurp the American Dream.

Pretty soon these short sighted and extremely greedy individuals will discover that, without a middle class able to buy their products, their money will dry up and disappear. Worse, let things get too bad, and all their money and hired thugs won't be enough to protect them from the angry serfs they've beaten down for decades. Bread and circuses only mollify for so long.

The best times this nation has ever had was when the middle and lower class was well off and didn't have to sweat each and every penny to make ends meet. There is nothing more dangerous than someone who doesn't have anything left to lose.
 Bladesmith81801
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 1018
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 7:03:21 PM
Cdn Iceman said: "First thing there was no gun put to their head, or their lives threaten, they signed the mortgage documents by their own free will , out of greed most cases, there was no forcing them, most of them gambled and lost its that simple,"

I'd like to see you post the numbers to back that statement up, because it's a fairly common talking point, offered without evidence. All the people I see on the news fighting for their homes don't HAVE a second or third home to flee to, they've got their life's saving invested in the home they're trying to save, which explains their desperation.

SOME of the people who signed those crappy mortgages were speculators, but not the majority of them. What we HAVE seen is a lot of cases of applications being falsified BY the brokers, not the applicants, after the fact, which is why so many AGs are now involved. Furthermore, the brokers and dealers have a code of professional conduct to adhere to? Y'know stuff like not inflating a homes value, lying to the buyers, adding tens of thousands to the buyers income without the buyer knowing.....

Or doesn't it strike you as odd that it's the sellers that are being pursued by the law for fraud, and not the buyers?

Oh look! Case in point!

Eileen Foster, a former executive vice president in charge of fraud investigations at mortgage lender Countrywide Financial, told CBS 60 Minutes reporter Steve Kroft that mortgage fraud was a common occurrence at the firm. Foster goes on to say that she faced illegal retaliation for filing reports investigating the fraud, alleging Countrywide fired her when she refused to lie to federal regulators on Countrywide's behalf.

"From what I saw, the types of things I saw, it was, it appeared systemic," Foster said on 60 Minutes Sunday. "It wasn't just one individual or two or three individuals, it was branches of individuals, it was regions of individuals."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/05/countrywide-whistleblower-mortgage-fraud-systemic_n_1129637.html
 cap_n_mORGAN
Joined: 7/3/2009
Msg: 1019
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 7:26:46 PM

It would be interesting to see what their "poverty" rate is. After all; 'that' is a measure of a society, not how many worker bees are buzzin the hive right?


Here is some clear info that shows the poverty level rising in France again showing socialism sounds great on paper but has yet to really work.

http://www.eurofound.europa.eu/ewco/studies/tn0910026s/fr0910029q.htm

Again give me back a truly capitalistic America if you want a socialist country move to France where unemployment is above 9% all the time while the poverty line is keeping even the working poor.
 Cdn_Iceman
Joined: 12/1/2010
Msg: 1020
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 7:55:38 PM

I'd like to see you post the numbers to back that statement up, because it's a fairly common talking point, offered without evidence. All the people I see on the news fighting for their homes don't HAVE a second or third home to flee to, they've got their life's saving invested in the home they're trying to save, which explains their desperation.
Bladesmith,Hold up there, people don't lose homes just like that, you would have to be in arrears for months before legal action commences, Ive seen the documentaries regards some of those people that lost homes they have had for 20 , 30 sometimes 40 years, my question was what are you doing refinancing your home and taking out the equity for?

A lot of people speculated and lost, I'm not talking about the poor out of work couple or individual that lost their home because they lost jobs, and the market went south.

Second I already acknowledge there were crooks, especially at Country wide, Washington Mutual and banks like that were writing up mortgages with their eyes close and did some fraud and most of them have been caught

Telling me that some mortgage bankers were crooks is like telling me that in the state of Texas there are guys name Bubba...

I watched that Micheal Moore documentary about capitalism and I remember the part where the guy was about to be evicted he had the house 30 years, but what Mr Moore didn't tell you was, the guy refinanced his house/farm and bought all sorts of toys, guns etc, he didn't invest for the future it was to pay off a lavish lifestyle, he was retired and couldn't budget . the only reason why I know that because that fool was interviewed later on by some investigation reporter and found out things Moore wouldn't say on film.

I may not know the exact percentage but you don't know either, what I do know from being in the financial sector, people don't lose houses just like that or missing one payment.
 timetogo3223
Joined: 9/29/2011
Msg: 1021
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 8:06:14 PM
Paul K...




Unions have their place, but even the "Jesus" of the left, FDR, was AGAINST unions in public service. He was right......... look and see how public unions have brought California to the brink of BK. You will never change their minds, so when you are called names and responded to in a derisive manner, just understand that when that happens, it is normal


Yep, Illinois is broke too, and the public union pensions are unfunded to about 30 billion dollars or more. One of two things will eventually happen: Illinois will go broke and void the pensions, or the citizens will be taxed to their eyeballs and leave. Either way, Illinois goes broke. Nearby states are swooping in and wooing businesses large and small, because of the state corporate tax increases and the threat of more fees and taxes to come. The deal here is the" Illinois Combine" (think International Harvester), where the democrats and republicans unite to rob the citizens of the state. Won't change until it implodes.

Yep, FDR did oppose unions for those in "public service", but he probably thought it would mean loss of control. The Dems in intervening years have bought the union heads and the money gets washed right back into Dem campaign coffers. Sweet.

I like it when they call me names. Makes my day. Don't you ever stop, my liberal-progressive friends. Sticks and stones, as they say, which are the things used by union thugs who go in to bust up crowds (and which were used on Jimmy Hoffa, no doubt) will break bones, but the names only make me laugh.
 OyVay...
Joined: 7/15/2011
Msg: 1022
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 9:56:41 PM
Oh my, (yawn) and now we have the yawner with us!

Gee, who gives a sh1t about France? Ahhh, does anybody on here live in France? Ahh, Is anybody from France going to pay your bills? Yeah OK, they have a better handle on white collar crime and abuse, when we fix this sh1t, we should take a page out of their book! Aside from that, please all of you who give a sh1t what the unemployment rate in France is, raise your hands?

Hahahahaha!!! Gawd I do luv you guys, you never cease to entertain me.

So what's the deal now? Wah wah, put his beef up about cally, I answered, he never said a word, boo hoo, my feelins is hurt! Hahahaha!

So now we want to talk Illinois? What are we gonna take this one state at a time? Look we got california, arizona, florida, illinois, michigan, nevada, new joisey, Oregon(that one surprised me) and little rhode island. Those are the states in the most trouble financially.

Almost all due to major budget shortfalls, due to loss of income to the individual states.

Of course some are easier to understand, like cally, nevada, illinos, arizona and michigan. All those (except MI) took major hits to their real estate markets and the recession just topped it off. Michigan, well they got wacked with the auto's, never had that much construction or real estate market to speak of.

Notice a glaring exception to the list? New York!!! In fact they are not on the list, in fact have a fully funded pension as well, something the others can't claim. Plus they got ALL those taxes to burn from the banks who bilked ya!!

Now it doesn't matter which state you choose off the list, or which party runs it. They both suck at not spending or trying to make deals they can't keep with the electorate! I mean really are we gonna split hairs? Arizona, Nevada and California were run into the ground by republicans the last 5 or more years!

But I don't wish to pee on your parade, so go on b1tchin about who dug the ditch, who fuked who over, wake me when you figure out how to fix it!


Hahahahahaha! Gawd this is some funny sh1t!
 Bladesmith81801
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 1023
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/5/2011 11:23:33 PM
What bothers me, Ice, is that you seem to be giving equal blame to both the Mortgage and the banksters as you are to the buyers, and that is a patently false equivalency, the same as blaming the middle class union workers for our economic meltdown. If I'm incorrect, apologies, but thats what it looks like you're doing.

From the article I posted:

"In 2007, Foster sent a team to the Boston area to search several branch offices of Countrywide's subprime division - the division that lent to borrowers with poor credit. The investigators rummaged through the office's recycling bins and found evidence that Countrywide loan officers were forging and manipulating borrowers' income and asset statements to help them get loans they weren't qualified for and couldn't afford."

We are not going to see real change and actually prosecutions until we stop trying to blame the people who got ripped off by these so called "Financial professionals". Working class people got scammed and lied to by these people, and it's NOT their fault. I'm college educated, admit I suck at math, and I have a damned hard time reading and understanding all that legal gobbldeygook on the forms. Thats WHY those people get paid what they do, because you're supposed to be able to trust them.

You don't need a law degree to use a lawyer or a medical degree to use your doctor, do you?
 Cdn_Iceman
Joined: 12/1/2010
Msg: 1024
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/6/2011 6:36:32 AM

What bothers me, Ice, is that you seem to be giving equal blame to both the Mortgage and the banksters as you are to the buyers, and that is a patently false equivalency, the same as blaming the middle class union workers for our economic meltdown. If I'm incorrect, apologies, but thats what it looks like you're doing.
Not sure why or where you're going with this Bladesmith? but to answer your question I blame ALL parties, Ive said this before many times.

You know you can blame these professionals all you want, the truth be told is if you don't understand something don't sign it, or at least hire a attorney ( which means you have to pay for his or her services) to explain it to you .

Ive bought and sold real estate for years and guess what ? My lawyer goes over everything with a fine tooth and comb, but I also understand financing, I'm not going to purchase a property I know I cannot afford, doesn't take a degree to figure that out , its common sense.

Look..... Its pretty simple If one earns $45,000.00 per year and lets do simple math just for this purpose only, how do you think you can afford a mortgage of $650K at lets say 6% interest, and this just simple interest for the purpose of illustration , the interest on that is loan is $39,000.00 so tell me if someone earns $45K, how can they afford it? I'm sorry but I don't buy the excuse of some professional tricking the unsuspecting borrower into buying .

Yes fraud DOES go on, because its all about the bottom line for these unscrupulous people, but the truth be told Most of these borrowers knew what they were getting into, they gambled and lost, I'm not referring to the " true victims" here and I challenge you to find any post Ive posted saying different.

You keep mentioning Countrywide, and I keep posting where is Country wide today? where is Washington Mutual today? where is Angelo Mozilo today? Sure he got a golden handshake but he will never run a public company ever again, but then again he should of been a guest of the government wearing orange pajamas but thanks the incompetence of the SEC and other agencies this loser will be spending the rest of his days doing shit, now I ask you where was the regulatory agencies, SEC among others, this is why I give blame to every one not just the crooked bankers.


You don't need a law degree to use a lawyer or a medical degree to use your doctor, do you?
I'm not getting the comparison? why would I need a law degree to use a lawyer, I think the purpose of getting a lawyer is to help with what ever law I'm not understanding so I don't contravene the law, If I'm sick, I don't need a medical degree to know If I'm sick that is why I go to doctors they have the degree, so I'm not understanding the point?

Its like me saying what is shoes to a man with no feet?
 OyVay...
Joined: 7/15/2011
Msg: 1025
Occupy Wall Street
Posted: 12/6/2011 7:15:33 AM
For one thing Ice, I think you have a different perspective on the whole issue.

You north of our border, have a different attitude, different practices and standards. I've been told many times, it's harder to buy RE in Canada, than the USA. That is a major reason, the blowback, did not hit Canada.

I would also caution you on the expectations you have for the level of sophistication exhibited by some people in this country. Again I think we both agree, people are not focusing on living their lives(which includes investing in their future), as much as being sheeple who would rather veg out.

In this country, the RE broker's fiduciary responsibility is to the seller, NEVER the buyer.(strike one) The mortgage broker(a neccessity for those without adaquate assets or income) is not licensed in any way. It's as simple(or was) to go down to Kinko's and print some business cards and bingo! your a mortgage broker, and again have no standards or rules.(strike two) Many, many people utilize lawyers recommended by RE agents, these are RE factories, who's primary legal work is closings, it's their bread and butter. If this group of agents, reccomends the same lawyer, he can as easily fall in line, despite his fiduciary responsibility to clients.

That alone, and not making time for the client and explanations, can expose the client to manipulation.(strike three)

Look I'm not saying people did not abuse the equity in their houses. That's one part of the problem. The RE debacle had many moving components. Flippers buying and selling houses. Those who were stupid enough to cash out part of their equity to pay off credit cards, only to run those cards up again, instead of destroying them and closing the accounts.

You know your lawyer, you trust him(her) right? You've used them for a while, and in different situations. I have the same thing(unfortunately, fuking lawyers!), although I respect them, they do tend to complicate life down here in the most litiguous society in the world. Now I don't know about Canada's lawyers, but here we've had our share of ones who would bend the rules.

A stupid person(for want of a better word) CAN be misled(RE agent), a mortgage broker can outright lie, nobody is watching him. Finally how can lawyers say they did their fiduciary responsibility for a client, by letting him sign a note, he will NEVER have the ability to repay?

A man goes to the doctor, says "cut off my arms", the doctor examines him and finds the arms perfectly healthy. Now most doctors would refuse the surgery, it would be against their oath. But somewhere, there is a doctor who would do it. Admittedly, there are far fewer doctors who would violate " do no harm", than lawyers!
Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > Occupy Wall Street