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Show ALL Forums  > Dating Experiences  > How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 76
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?Page 4 of 14    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14)
I think it must happen just in fishes, but I've noticed there are an awful
lot of guys that think just because they are "fit", they are attractive.


I'm not sure what data you use to support such a conclusion, unless of course you assume that because a man says a certain body type is not attractive on a woman that he is also commenting on his perception of his own attractiveness. Neither fitness or attractiveness are a subset of the other, but there is a fair amount of overlap between them.

I think it is pretty much understood that when people talk about what is sexy or attractive, they are only able to relate what their opinion is. There are no universal standards. That is not to say that there are no prevailing opinions. It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that in most western cultures, obesity is not considered attractive to the majority of the opposite sex.

Larger women can be sexy. Gabrielle Reece is certainly considered sexy by a lot of men, but she is 6'3" tall and only weighs about 170 lbs (according to her bio). She might be able to carry 200 lbs and still be considered attractive, but her height is greater than 99th percentile. The average woman is about 5'4", 200 lbs would put her on the verge of being morbidly obese. Hope Solo is another, but she only weighs about 155 lbs at 5'8".
 BLoNde__ANgeL
Joined: 9/20/2011
Msg: 77
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 9:59:41 AM
When God died, some folks in POF took his job
 kari135
Joined: 9/1/2009
Msg: 78
view profile
History
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 10:10:49 AM

I'm not sure what data you use to support such a conclusion, unless of course you assume that because a man says a certain body type is not attractive on a woman that he is also commenting on his perception of his own attractiveness. Neither fitness or attractiveness are a subset of the other, but there is a fair amount of overlap between them.

I dunno about her, but I also get the same idea, from looking at men's profiles. There are a lot who claime to be athletic in build, say they do this and that and want someone fit enough to keep up with them. Maybe they did all that 'this and that' 10 or more years ago, but no one who is 'athletic' is going to have at least 4" of belly hanging over his belt. Then there are the ones who detail their weekly work outs, but if their photos are current (as most of them claim), the biggest work outs they get are clicking a remote and lifting a beverage. And they want a much younger woman who will reflect who or what they think they are now.

It really has to be that Magic Mirror Syndrome at work.
 hotlady43
Joined: 12/8/2011
Msg: 79
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 10:31:06 AM
I have gained over 20 pounds in each boob since 2005, which some men notice for sure -and like! or even love!
 au-naturel-lover
Joined: 12/8/2011
Msg: 80
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 10:34:49 AM
^^


I have gained over 20 pounds in each boob since 2005, which some men notice for sure -and like! or even love!


MMmmmmm, I would take 20 lbs. of that - for lunch! :)
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 81
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 11:45:28 AM

I'm not sure what data you use to support such a conclusion, unless of course you assume that because a man says a certain body type is not attractive on a woman that he is also commenting on his perception of his own attractiveness.



I dunno about her, but I also get the same idea, from looking at men's profiles.


I agree with browneyesboo and Kari on this! There is a certain assumption on the part of men who say, “I am fit: fitness is sexy”—isn’t the conclusion, “Ergo, I am sexy” the next logical step? A man who says this is commenting on his own attractiveness. Notice, no one has talked about facial beauty, personality, or other attributes (and yes, I know that this is a thread on 20 pounds); the only stated criteria by men who find fit women attractive IS their fitness. What if a fit woman has a face like Quasimodo? Is she still sexier than a woman who is 20 pounds overweight but has a pretty face?

I have seen profiles of fit men who did resemble Quasimodo, yet quite a few of them write, “Only looking for a slim/fit ATTRACTIVE woman.” Of course, the fat guys who list themselves as “average/athletic” say this, too.


Neither fitness or attractiveness are a subset of the other, but there is a fair amount of overlap between them.


This contradicts your first statement about the mistaken assumption that a fit man thinks his attractiveness quotient is high.


I don't recall any of us men on this thread saying that fit is a guarantee of being found sexy by the opposite sex.


Do you mean as a guarantee for themselves or for fit women being sexy?


I certainly don't expect any woman 20 yrs younger than me to find me sexy


I don’t discount men 20 years younger than I am NOT finding me sexy. There are lots of young men who have older women fantasies. However, I do not expect any man to find me attractive and/or sexy.


When God died, some folks in POF took his job


Do you mean “her” job? (Grin.)

Some of the most common iconographic images from the Paleolithic and Neolithic are the so-called “Venus” figures: statues of extremely large women with huge breasts, thighs, and stomachs. They are very likely fertility figures and depict pregnancy, but that doesn’t account for the huge thighs. Our ancestors did not create these works of art (perhaps utilitarian art) because they found these women “unsexy.” Like artists throughout the ages, they were more likely shaping figurines of the Paleolithic standards of beauty—just like the Egyptians, Greeks, and every other culture has done. In art from the Middle Ages and the Renaissance, women are very often shown with large stomachs, again, indicating fertility but not necessarily pregnancy. Botticelli’s Venus has plump thighs and an ample stomach. Titian’s nudes are, likewise, quite ample; later, Renoir’s nudes echo this body style.

These works of art bespeak a different time. But from my experience, I can attest that the male appreciation of plump women is not dead.
 U make it entertaining
Joined: 7/17/2009
Msg: 82
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 11:59:09 AM

Somehow Hotlady I don't believe that is a real picture of you - living on the streets - seems like you and mr au natural might make a good match.


Of course that's not her Paddy.

the photo can be found at ...

http://photobucket.com/images/fat%20ugly%20girl/?page=2
 bottleguy
Joined: 3/22/2011
Msg: 83
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 12:00:14 PM
20 pounds for me is almost no difference whatsoever cause I am 6'4 with a wide frame. 20 pounds for a very small person is a WHOLE LOT. Some people can carry that weight some people can't. I'm so big, I lost 11 pounds in one football practice in high school.
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 84
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 12:13:28 PM
This contradicts your first statement about the mistaken assumption that a fit man thinks his attractiveness quotient is high.


No it doesn't.

The fact that a man says they prefer women who are fit does not imply that he thinks he is sexy simply becuase he is fit. I don't understand how you make that jump in logic.

What I essentially said is that there are three permutations: people who are attractive but not fit, people who are fit but not attractive, and people who are both. It is my opinion that the third group is larger than the first two. How does this contradict anything else I've said?


I have seen profiles of fit men who did resemble Quasimodo, yet quite a few of them write, “Only looking for a slim/fit ATTRACTIVE woman.” Of course, the fat guys who list themselves as “average/athletic” say this, too.


There are plenty of unremarkable looking women who say in their profiles that they are looking for tall, handsome men. I don't think delusional expectations are limited to either gender.
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 85
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 1:59:03 PM

No it doesn't.

The fact that a man says they prefer women who are fit does not imply that he thinks he is sexy simply becuase he is fit. I don't understand how you make that jump in logic.


If you said ugly women were not attractive and you were ugly, wouldn't that mean you would think that you are unattractive?

Let me ask you directly: Are you attractive? Why or why not?


What I essentially said is that there are three permutations: people who are attractive but not fit, people who are fit but not attractive, and people who are both. It is my opinion that the third group is larger than the first two. How does this contradict anything else I've said?


Let’s examine what you said:


I'm not sure what data you use to support such a conclusion, unless of course you assume that because a man says a certain body type is not attractive on a woman that he is also commenting on his perception of his own attractiveness. Neither fitness or attractiveness are a subset of the other, but there is a fair amount of overlap between them.


I do believe that this is the statement on which I commented. I don’t see three permutations but then, I am an English teacher and perhaps I miscounted the number of equations in the list. I understand this as saying that fitness and attractiveness are not mutually inclusive, but that the odds are that they “overlap” quite a bit. Or perhaps I should ask, just for clarification, what constitutes a “fair amount of overlap” since that is a very vague “calculation.”


How does this contradict anything else I've said?


It depends on the “fair amount of overlap.” If fitness and attractiveness overlap a lot, then how many men, and women, can assume that they are attractive?


There are plenty of unremarkable looking women who say in their profiles that they are looking for tall, handsome men. I don't think delusional expectations are limited to either gender.


I am quite sure of this; I just don’t see as many profiles of women as I do of men.


Yes there are plenty of men running around with the little head telling them what to do and I would imagine most of them are looking for a sexual experience and little else. Who knows they may have adopted the attitude of Benjamin Franklin ( who was known to have a taste for older women ) and feel that "Every Cat in the dark is Grey"


I see—so not only are fat women appreciated ONLY for their breasts and derrieres, but older women are only appreciated because they are desperate for sex—that was, after all, Franklin’s take on the issue:
"8th and lastly. They are so grateful!!!"


But if “every cat in the dark is gray,” we would have sex with even unattractive partners.


I would imagine based on your posts that you expect quite a few men ( even some significantly younger slimmer and more fit than you ) to find you attractive or you would not be making statements that show your confidence in your belief that you are attractive to the opposite sex


If you noticed, I said that I do not expect “any” man to find me attractive. It is never an expected “thing,” but I have had enough respond to make me confident that I have a modicum of attractiveness—just as you are confident in how you look based on your experience with the opposite sex.

Or at least I assume that is your experience.
 christyis4real
Joined: 7/6/2011
Msg: 86
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 1:59:28 PM
The average woman is about 5'4", 200 lbs would put her on the verge of being morbidly obese.


I am 5'4 and just shy of the infamous 200 pound mark and I look 30 pounds smaller than what I really am (according to everyone that can't believe that I weigh up there in that range). I am so far away from morbidly obese it isn't even funny.

You need to get your eyeballs fixed and your facts straight. Just sayin.
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 87
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 3:23:54 PM
You need to get your eyeballs fixed and your facts straight. Just sayin.


5' 4" and 200 lbs results in a BMI of 34.3. I mistakenly thought that 35 was considered the threshold of morbid obesity, but most sources I just checked put the number at 40. Regardless, that weight would be considered 25 pounds beyond the healthy range for a person six inches taller.

What does 200 pounds look like and what measure would a person use to say you look 30 pounds lighter?

If you said ugly women were not attractive and you were ugly, wouldn't that mean you would think that you are unattractive?

Let me ask you directly: Are you attractive? Why or why not?


When I say something about what I consider attractive in a woman, it does not imply anything about men. Being a heterosexual man, I don't consider myself qualified to judge the attractiveness of men. Thus, I defer to women to pass such judgments about my looks.

Let’s examine what you said:

I'm not sure what data you use to support such a conclusion, unless of course you assume that because a man says a certain body type is not attractive on a woman that he is also commenting on his perception of his own attractiveness. Neither fitness or attractiveness are a subset of the other, but there is a fair amount of overlap between them.

I do believe that this is the statement on which I commented. I don’t see three permutations but then, I am an English teacher and perhaps I miscounted the number of equations in the list. I understand this as saying that fitness and attractiveness are not mutually inclusive, but that the odds are that they “overlap” quite a bit. Or perhaps I should ask, just for clarification, what constitutes a “fair amount of overlap” since that is a very vague “calculation.”


Mathematically, if I declare that there are two sets and assume the sets overlap but neither is a subset of the other, it is the equivalent of saying there are only three permutations within the two sets. When I say they overlap quite a bit, I'm saying (in my opinion) more people are in both sets than are only in one or the other.

I'm an engineer. I've studied and applied math for more than 35 years.
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 88
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 4:26:54 PM

Thus, I defer to women to pass such judgments about my looks.



Tippy, tappy: the sound of dancing feet.


A functioning human without an ego--very rare. However, I find it difficult to believe that you cannot "judge" a man's attractiveness. Let's put Brad Pitt and Rondo Hatton side by side: who is better looking?

If you are not willing to comment on your attractive quotient, let’s go to your experience with women—have a lot of women approached you in public places to comment on your looks? Your mother and grandmother do not count.


I'm an engineer. I've studied and applied math for more than 35 years.



I am an English teacher. I have been teaching college composition for eleven years and have read thousands of essays. I have studied what people write and how they write it for even longer than that. I am a mistress at reading between the lines to understand what people REALLY mean.
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 89
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 5:23:19 PM
If you are not willing to comment on your attractive quotient, let’s go to your experience with women—have a lot of women approached you in public places to comment on your looks? Your mother and grandmother do not count.


Yes, women have approached me and complimented my looks. I've also been asked out by women that I considered attractive. I have no way of knowing if it would be considered a lot. I can say it doesn't happen as often as it did when I was younger.

I have no idea who Rondo Hatton is.


I am an English teacher. I have been teaching college composition for eleven years and have read thousands of essays. I have studied what people write and how they write it for even longer than that. I am a mistress at reading between the lines to understand what people REALLY mean.


I would think you'd have learned by now how often you can be wrong when you presume to know what people REALLY mean.

I choose my words carefully and have learned to mistrust those that try to paint me into a corner.
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 90
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 5:34:28 PM

I am 5'4 and just shy of the infamous 200 pound mark and I look 30 pounds smaller than what I really am (according to everyone that can't believe that I weigh up there in that range). I am so far away from morbidly obese it isn't even funny.

I'm not going to debate about YOUR weight and how much others say you appear to weigh, What is clearly missed by most when discussing weight? The fact that there is such a thing as "normal weight obesity" and it's just as dangerous to one's health as carrying too much weight. Unless you are your height with a BMI of 19% or less, you'd be considered obese. Much like someone who weighs 100 pounds and has a BMI over 25%. Body builders or those who are exceptionally fit are likely the only people who can be 50+ heavier than the "norm" and not be "obese" medically. JMO

~OT~ 20 pounds? It's a big deal on MOST people. And 20 pounds turns into 25 pounds which turns into more than that all too easily. Losing weight is tough. Maintaining weight? Not so tough if one cares to do so (barring health issues.) JMO
 Whisky_River
Joined: 9/12/2010
Msg: 91
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 5:35:41 PM
@ Capitano_Blaugh
Nice...an interesting thread interrupted by some..Thin...married...dwarf...pirate...spewling about his fantasy...
 BLoNde__ANgeL
Joined: 9/20/2011
Msg: 92
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 5:57:15 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
and what about a man's bod?? why has this thread evolved into men critiqueing women's figures & some women defending women's bods???

I guess some men are so hawt even in middle age that they have to beat off us mere mortal portals of estrogen & progesterone

PS- I've had a generous derriere since post puberty, the poster who said men prefer a Hefner bod-wrong...
 Whisky_River
Joined: 9/12/2010
Msg: 93
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 6:30:22 PM
Actually...She was right....At one time a Voluptuous Body was desirable!

18th Century the "idealized" Colonial women were tough, big, muscular, strong and very fertile. This was a period of time in the history of our country in which size and strength were important assets for a woman to possess, for her own survival as well as her desirability as a wife, mother and worker of the land. Her fertility was important because the more children she could produce, the more free labor or helpers the family would have to work the land.


By the 19th Century the idealized female body image had changed drastically. It was now necessary for the ideal woman to be sickly, frail, pale, wan and prone to fainting a lot. The underlying reason for this new ideal was political. Women had to be made frail in order to support or justify slavery in the 1800's. Actually, what this ideal succeeded in doing was to make slaves of the women too. Womens' bondage was not in physical labor, but in the restrictive clothing they were encouraged to wear and the restrictive lifestyle they were allowed to live

Ugh...Fat or fit ...What makes a person "attractive" is their attitude towards others....
Just saying...
 BLoNde__ANgeL
Joined: 9/20/2011
Msg: 94
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 6:33:10 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^CAPT-that's why u have no pix-yes i started this thread in response to another thread & it is not my intent to have it turn into misogynists belittling women's bodies...
it is almost 2012, us women can pick & choose WHO we WANT WHEN we WANT HOW we WANT
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 95
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 6:53:41 PM
and what about a man's bod?? why has this thread evolved into men critiqueing women's figures & some women defending women's bods???


If you want to talk about mens' bodies, talk. Nobody's stopping you.


it is not my intent to have it turn into misogynists belittling women's bodies.


Sometimes people speak their minds on the internet, that doesn't make it misogyny. Nor should it be any great revelation that some female body types are regarded by most men to be more attractive than others.
 bhri
Joined: 9/22/2007
Msg: 96
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 6:56:26 PM

So does 20 lbs really make a diff?


That was the original post. Unfortunately, if an answer (such as mine - which was yes) displeases people, they take it as a personal attack. But as previous posters mentioned, people are not very good at judging weight. So that 20 lbs could have been 30 or 40.

But the basic answer is the greater percentage of your body weight that 20lbs is, the greater difference in your appearance it will make.

Also, consider if you are "hiding" 10 or 20 lbs to begin with, that extra 20 lbs will make a bigger difference (harder to "hide").

Generally speaking, a BMI of 35 is considered medically morbidly obese. But, it is an estimate/approximation. It is not a measure of your attractiveness.

So, to answer the original question posed, 20 lbs can easily make a difference. But it still has to be taken on an individual basis.

The crux of the matter was that the person misrepresented herself enough that the person felt that she was significantly (for him) heavier and less attractive to him than she presented. In other words he felt she lied to him.
 Savona
Joined: 11/22/2010
Msg: 97
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 7:03:35 PM


@ Capitano_Blaugh
Nice...an interesting thread interrupted by some..Thin...married...dwarf...pirate...spewling about his fantasy...


Oh my gawdddd have I ever been tricked. To think I nearly had a grand ol time with capitano and dreamy.

A skinny married dwarf. If that don't beat all.

OT

For myself 20:lbs would be a big difference. I am slim but slender muscle toned so at 125 I only wear size 2 American 4 Canadian. Different sizes between Canada and usa. Years ago the states dropped the dress sizes to make women feel better about themselves. And of course to get themshopping for their new smaller size.

I think at 5'4 being 200 lbs is way overweight. IMO that all.

Can't stop thinking of that nasty pirate and his trickery
 Savona
Joined: 11/22/2010
Msg: 98
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 7:28:12 PM
Yea trickery I say. You never gave us a heads up, so to speak, that we could have rested.our beer or wine on Your head. Good thing I know I don't verdicts of my butt to married dwarfs. Where the neck is dreamy to back me up.

OT weight is going to be the biggest health problem for the next number of years to come. If that is fact then how the 20 pounds of wondering how you look will be the least of your problems.
 christyis4real
Joined: 7/6/2011
Msg: 99
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 7:35:52 PM

I'm not going to debate about YOUR weight and how much others say you appear to weigh, What is clearly missed by most when discussing weight? The fact that there is such a thing as "normal weight obesity" and it's just as dangerous to one's health as carrying too much weight. Unless you are your height with a BMI of 19% or less, you'd be considered obese. Much like someone who weighs 100 pounds and has a BMI over 25%. Body builders or those who are exceptionally fit are likely the only people who can be 50+ heavier


Oh, I know I am a chubby girl (overweight). No doubt about that, and it's not something am proud of. Morbidly obese...uh..no. That is the gist of my "argument".
 mrmisterme
Joined: 6/7/2009
Msg: 100
view profile
History
How much of a difference does 20 pounds REALLY make?
Posted: 12/12/2011 7:42:26 PM

it is almost 2012, us women can pick & choose WHO we WANT WHEN we WANT HOW we WANT

And yet, there are a lot of single women here (regardless of their weight). I guess they don't want to pick and choose anybody tonight.
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