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Joined: 12/2/2011
Msg: 164
Breaking the law: A morality issue?Page 9 of 9    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9)
Whether 'breaking the law is a morality issue' IS a slippery slope...b/c 'morality' itself is a slippery slope!

BUT, the legality of pot is governed by politics. And politics are not as concerned with morally ethical implications of law than it is making money.

'Morals' are based socially as opposed to politically.
AND the FACT is, only 35% of Americans 18+ years of age HAVE NOT tried pot in some form once in their life.
With the majority rule of 65%, the social standard would be that pot is acceptable. If we lived in a true democracy where EVERY INDIVIDUAL voted on EVERY SOCIAL ISSUE, odds are pot would be legal!

Smoking pot does not make you 'immoral', it does not mean you arent 'virtuous', and it does not make you a 'bad person'.

clitoral removal are "democratic" customs

Clitoral removals are patriarchal customs, not democratic!
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 165
Breaking the law: A morality issue?
Posted: 1/2/2012 9:37:30 PM

morality' itself is a slippery slope!

Not as slippery as you might imagine. Any social group that is to function without excessive harm or damage to its members must operate with a consensus morality to determine what is and isn't acceptable behaviour within that social context. Behaviours falling outside that range are usually outlawed.

Obviously a system of law that is more complex is less likely to be fully understood and therefore less likely to be observed, so simplification ought to be the order of the day. What could be a simpler moral rule than "Don't intentionally hurt anybody"? What's slippery about that? Obviously anyone not willing to live in a social group adhering to that one rule has the freedom to leave it, and in the case of my own, would be encouraged to; I don't want someone like that near me.

Clitoral removals are patriarchal customs, not democratic!

That may be, but if most of the men in those societies were against the custom, it would die. If you want to argue that a patriarchal society is undemocratic because women can't vote, be reminded that women can vote (and quite effectively) with more than ballots:

(from Wikipedia): In 2003, Leymah Gbowee and the Women of Liberia Mass Action for Peace organized nonviolence protests that included a sex strike. As a result, the women were able to achieve peace in Liberia after a 14-year civil war and helped bring to power the country's first female head of state, Ellen Johnson Sirleaf.
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 166
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Breaking the law: A morality issue?
Posted: 1/2/2012 11:14:17 PM

That may be, but if most of the men in those societies were against the custom, it would die.

Ok you lost me here... it is a patriarchal custom resolved by democracy.. it is not caused by democratic means...

An old system corrected by another. Now don't get me wrong saying that democracy is the best solution. It is a good one in moderation.
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 167
Breaking the law: A morality issue?
Posted: 1/3/2012 12:51:47 AM

don't get me wrong saying that democracy is the best solution. It is a good one in moderation.

Sorry for the confusion; I was mixing more than one point in the comment. I agree with you that democracy has its place, for instance (as I've said before) deciding what colour to paint the Town Hall. Democracy has NO PLACE in deciding matters of law. Some laws, often as not amount to cruel customs (such as witch burning or genital mutilation). The problem through time has been making "laws" around what amount to unjust traditional customs because they were "popular" (and often profitable); for instance slavery was quite "legal" under what was called the common law and many so-called "laws" were passed to regulate the slave trade. Involuntary slavery, while an ancient custom, was always wrong from a moral standpoint, so any law that supported it was unjust and therefore really no law at all.

There have always been and will probably always be cruel/unjust customs that will be considered lawful by the majority of a society. As time goes on, hopefully there will always be fewer of them, but that won't happen unless some brave minority fights for justice by swimming against the current of "democracy."
Joined: 7/8/2004
Msg: 169
Breaking the law: A morality issue?
Posted: 1/3/2012 9:26:36 AM

Was the use of the word "hurt" over "harm" intentional?

No; it was unintentional really. There are many things that don't "hurt" at all by the common definition, but are no less harmful; fraud is one. I really meant to say "harm."

Richard Nixon described Leary as "the most dangerous man in America" because of his attitude to drugs and authority.

What Nixon probably meant was that HE was the authority that Leary didn't respect and that made Leary dangerous TO NIXON.

putting forward beliefs that contradict how society works makes you dangerous.

It not only makes you dangerous (to the status quo), but puts you in danger. (witness the persecutions throughout history of men & women who disagreed with the established order)

convincing people that killing is the right thing to do (cult leaders and religious fanatics) should be against the law, yes?

It is.

trying to make people see that while drugs can cause harm, they are not the cause for such occasions should IMO never be considered "dangerous"

Drugs are like cars, computers, or most anything else; they can help or harm, depending on how they are used. While you might be able to make the case for not having a 10 megaton warhead in your basement owing to its lack of positive utility and potential for causing harm if you pop your top (or miscalculate) one day, it is difficult to make a similar case for drugs, as research and experience has shown that the most harmful things generally attributed to drugs are largely a function of their illegality to begin with.
Joined: 2/22/2008
Msg: 171
Breaking the law: A morality issue?
Posted: 1/5/2012 8:20:13 PM
is it racist to protect your country from people you do not want there? If the answer is no then why did people support anti colonial efforts of driving white men from the African continent.
Joined: 11/10/2008
Msg: 173
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Breaking the law: A morality issue?
Posted: 1/5/2012 9:52:53 PM
^^^{quote} Well.... my knowlege is lacking to give a truly informed reply..... but that wont stop me lol

Never has before. Son, you mean to tell us that you are from the UK and can't spell "British"? you aught to be ashamed of yourself. All the other misspellings I overlook....but I couldn't let that one slide......Us Amaricuns R reel fussie bout spellin
Joined: 11/10/2008
Msg: 175
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Breaking the law: A morality issue?
Posted: 1/5/2012 10:30:40 PM
Now Mr. Happy, I wouldn't make that need an opposing point of view for an argument. But while I'm here correcting the future writer...look down on your keyboard and notice that big long key in the middle bottom....that's a spacebar. You know where it is, because I see you use it sometimes.

Young man, you have no respect for your elders. LOL

Some misspelling should be illegal and is down right immoral. LOL
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