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 SunshineAngel99
Joined: 10/13/2010
Msg: 76
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Who is right?Page 4 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)
"Oh please. He sees the ring as not important because he feels that marrying her is more important then having a materialistic object to show off that she is getting married to brag her her friends. I say good for him."

If the ring is not important, than a traditional materialistic wedding shouldn't be either. If the man is consistent in his beliefs I would have no problem with that. My instincts tell me that is not the case though, but we can't speculate either way without anymore information.

I want to take the guys side on this, but the way it has been described it appears he allowed doubt to creep in and distrust. Now, he probably has to claw himself out of the hole he dug himself in.
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 77
Who is right?
Posted: 1/4/2012 1:44:44 PM
I think the guy's a jack-hole for telling her how she's supposed to feel about something that obviously means something to HER.

This idiot has YET to learn the motto, "happy wife, happy life." Guess he's a slow learner.


Nice. And his opinion means squat then,,,,correct????? Cause, a "happy wife, is a happy life"?????? What an ignorant, AND arrogant GENERIC "poster" saying. Seriously.

As others have said,,,these two are in for a world of trouble. For a marriage/partnership to work, things like this situation should be easily solved and agreed upon. EASILY. These things are basic core values and beliefs that a "couple" should already be on the same page. An example. I don't do well with people that enjoy "shopping" and "buy" for the sake of buying. I wouldn't expect to marry such a person(if I actually marry anyone) ,ya know, the ones that have a couple hundred pairs of shoes in their closet. Wouldn't happen, and I wouldn't expect her to enjoy my company or even know where I am coming from with my thinking.

They are DIFFERENT,,,,really different. It ain't gonna work.
 infennario
Joined: 5/24/2011
Msg: 78
Who is right?
Posted: 1/4/2012 2:13:39 PM

They are both right, for themsevles, but not a good match. One will always be pissed off no matter which one wins, who wants to live like that?


Agreed. And this is the beauty of the entire period before marrying- you find out what your potential partner is like. And you end it if it isn't right.
 WalksOnWater2
Joined: 5/19/2009
Msg: 79
Who is right?
Posted: 1/4/2012 4:18:40 PM
He should buy her the ring after they get married.

If she doesn't like this arrangement, her priorities are somewhat skewed...

 VirtuallyLove
Joined: 9/8/2011
Msg: 80
Who is right?
Posted: 1/4/2012 4:39:38 PM
I'm with your friend. If it's important to her, he should get one (assuming it isn't a money issue).

Despite all the inevitable blather about "Oh, love's not about materialistic things! If she truly loved him, it wouldn't matter" - it is almost certainly significant that he doesn't to buy her a ring. My guess is that he's using that as a pretext for backing out...possibly hoping she'll make an issue of it and he'll be able to withdraw self-righteously with "anyone who's that superficial," etc.

Of course that's pure speculation about his motives. I could certainly be wrong. But what I'm not wrong about, I believe, is it buying her a ring IS important to her, and as her love he should buy the damn thing. If he doesn't want to, my advice to her is to move on. She will likely never forgive him for that.

Again, the above is speculative. It's what my intuition is telling me.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 9/26/2009
Msg: 81
Who is right?
Posted: 1/4/2012 5:06:56 PM
(carolann0308) I would love to know how he would feel if she announced she was never going to wear a wedding band.


Good point.

I wonder why he isn't pestering her to buy him an engagement ring? Alternately, he should agree to buy her a ring, but ask her to ask her parents how big of a dowry they're gonna provide?

(daynadaze) They are both right, for themsevles, but not a good match.


I disagree. I think the guy should wise up, learn to understand his fiancee's thoughts and feelings, and buy her a ring.

You can go through life pretending every problem is a nail, and hammer it down, or you can use the proper tool (figuratively speaking). Guess what I'm saying is, "Figure out the right tool, and use it; don't be a tool!"

Arlo...
 wildandfreee
Joined: 12/16/2010
Msg: 82
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 4:50:51 AM
compare to the ring how do the guy normally treat her , how do they value each other , why are they getting married , if its not a money issue ,
I think they are both complicated and should learn more on each other
 AddHomonym
Joined: 12/26/2011
Msg: 83
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 6:09:10 AM
Tell your friends that you love them but if they even talk about marriage again you will do them both a favour and kill them...lol

They have a clash of values. This particular issue the number one cause of divorce. No amount of love will change that. If they get married you will get sucked into every fight they wind up having, he wants to save, she wants to spend, he wants a used car, she wants a new car, blah, blah, blah...

They are lucky to have figured this out this early on.

(did that sound bitter?)
 VirtuallyLove
Joined: 9/8/2011
Msg: 84
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 7:00:26 AM
Wanting an engagement ring implies absolutely nothing about being a spendthrift or materialistic. Rather, it's a very, very basic symbol of intent/commitment which most women want. Now if the woman demanded a $10K ring then yes, that kind of critique might have merit. But women generally want a ring for what it symbolizes.

The women I've had in my life to the point of discussing rings were both financially conservative and both very much wanted that ring for what it represented.

The man in this case is likely feeling ambivalent about the whole thing and is using the ring as a pretext for expressing that.
 onceagain57
Joined: 11/25/2011
Msg: 85
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 7:15:01 AM
Oh yeah...tit for tat...wait till they get married it will only get worse.....and if he really cares and theres good carma he might better cave in....shes gonna want a big wedding too....specially if its their first marriage.....guys arent in tune to this...woman are..it their dream...well most.....tell them I wish them well....
 VirtuallyLove
Joined: 9/8/2011
Msg: 86
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 11:09:39 AM
Arlo:

"I disagree. I think the guy should wise up, learn to understand his fiancee's thoughts and feelings, and buy her a ring."

Well, I agree, with the proviso that he actually does love her and wants to be with her. His pseudo-excuses cast some severe doubt on that in my view.
 LovingKittyCat123
Joined: 12/14/2011
Msg: 87
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 12:37:01 PM
That makes me wonder what kinda marriage they are going to have. I personally wouldn't marry a guy that is not willing to make me happy by buying me an engagement ring. Is that to much to ask for. His values are all mixed up. I would head for the hills if I was her.
 needyone
Joined: 8/13/2010
Msg: 88
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 12:44:33 PM
sooo funny in todays equal world
all she should do (assuming she is working) is take him to the jewelry store and pick him one that she likes and show him one of equal value and ask him to get it for her
otherwise maybe and I dont know she is asking for a ring and a big wedding
we dont know all we have is a question without all the facts
Well there has to be a lot more to it
 Forumite
Joined: 10/31/2011
Msg: 89
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 12:52:36 PM

That makes me wonder what kinda marriage they are going to have. I personally wouldn't marry a guy that is not willing to make me happy by buying me an engagement ring. Is that to much to ask for. His values are all mixed up. I would head for the hills if I was her.


fascinating,,,so,,what else is he going to have to BUY to make you happy?

and his values are all messed up? because he is not superficial and entittled?


wow,,,,,,,you know,,,you can also buy a woman to make you happy if you are a guy,,it's called a prostitute,,and at this moment,,,,i am having a hard time distinguishing between,,,,

being with and having sex with a man FOR money and
being and having sex with a man BECAUSE he has money


either way,,you are paying for something,,,,,

no money ,,no sex
no money,,no making her HAPPY
hummmmmmm...alrighty then:)
 SC67
Joined: 6/21/2009
Msg: 90
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 2:56:58 PM
Oh come on Forumite! A woman wanting an engagement ring isn't like a hooker standing there with her hand out before she gets on her knees. If he doesn't want to get her a ring then he should just say...I don't want to buy you an engagement ring & I don't care what you, your friends, or the rest of the world thinks about it. She can then plan accordingly.

Two thoughts...I agree with Virtually...smokescreen for really not interested in marrying her? Also, who is paying for the wedding? If her parents are paying & he's not doing an engagement ring...
 Forumite
Joined: 10/31/2011
Msg: 91
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 3:19:58 PM
{quote]Oh come on Forumite! A woman wanting an engagement ring isn't like a hooker standing there with her hand out before she gets on her knees.

no,,but apparently ..it IS like someone who has there hand out expecting some kind of payment/tribute before they will consider having sex with you in a marriage.....

which is basically,,,,sex for payment????? hummmm oh well,,,,,what can i say.....it keeps coming up the same.....feel free to point out the major difference

and the statement "oh come on' is not exactly evidence or a comprehensive rebuttal....just sayin:)
 raid_on_me
Joined: 6/19/2011
Msg: 92
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 3:30:21 PM
Who needs a ring? I guess I say that because I don't think marriage is always the next step just because I've been with someone for a while. Love trumps everything but that's just me.
 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 93
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 3:36:15 PM
Maybe the guy asked her parents for a dowry and they told him to forget it, so no dowry, no ring. lol.

It's another case of women screaming for equality and equal rights and being treated the same as a man, but suddenly become "traditional" when it suits them to get trinkets. I never see a guy pouting and throwing a tantrum to get an engagement gift of equal value. Maybe they should get a set of His and Hers rings, and split the cost 50/50.

The engagement ring tradition started a zillion years ago, at a time when women did not work at jobs and every woman became a wife and mother and was housebound to a life of having to care for the family for no money, and it was solely the man's job to provide for the family. So it was only men who could afford to buy a ring. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some sort of religious connection to the ring thing, because there is no real basis for it. But obviously times have changed, so this ancient ritual should be changed to keep up with the times.
 Frau Chilliknickers
Joined: 12/5/2008
Msg: 94
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 4:01:12 PM
This is so dumb and doomed. *insert-nuclear-explosion-image*

Stats suggest that the marriage is unlikely to last, and the ring becomes superfluous...except when haggling for 'the best price'
 SC67
Joined: 6/21/2009
Msg: 95
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 4:32:00 PM

and the statement "oh come on' is not exactly evidence or a comprehensive rebuttal....just sayin:)

I was only trying to have you take another look at what you were saying. They're both invested in this relationship. This is not a business transaction. The cash exchanged between a hooker & john isn't wrapped in emotions & shared history. An engagement ring means much more than a few bills tossed to someone who will be doing the same thing with a different man in 2 hours (or less).

If we want to continue with your hooker/fiancee and cash/ring analogy...if you don't pay the hooker you don't get any sex. If you don't give the ring you don't get a wife. Maybe he doesn't want one?

Who knows...maybe the fiancee is asking for a ring that's too extravagant. Maybe his finances aren't what everyone thinks. Maybe he doesn't really want to get married. Maybe they should both stop talking to the OP about the problems they're having in their relationship & start talking to each other.
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 96
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 5:12:39 PM

I personally wouldn't marry a guy that is not willing to make me happy by buying me an engagement ring. Is that to much to ask for. His values are all mixed up. I would head for the hills if I was her.


No,,,,his "values" are not mixed up,,,they are "different" than hers. Get THAT straight people. I know the "majority" feel or think an "engagement" ring should be a "given" and "part of the deal",,to make the woman feel "happy". But,remember,again, not everyone will believe what YOU do. Is that so hard for some of you to understand????? Or do you have to contstantly follow what everyone else "believes" and reads in a bridal magazine??????? Just like actually getting "married" because,again, "some" believe it's a sign of commitment,,,though we have more than enough divorces that it's only a "commitment" till things aren't working out so well.

You do know why "bullying" occurs?????? It's cause some believe they can pick on people that are "different". Yeppers,,,,,but, we are suppose to grow outta that when we get older and understand that not all are the same. Suppose to.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 9/26/2009
Msg: 97
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 5:12:55 PM
I wonder why everyone suddenly thinks that they're either psychotherapists or clairvoyants, and are predicting a future of doom-n-gloom for the Opee's "friends"? It's a DISAGREEMENT, people! If relationships were doomed when a disagreement comes up, then there'd be no such thing as a couple being happily married for more than a few weeks.

Sure, you can dig in your heels about a disagreement and refuse to budge on your position, or you can see it as a learning point. Your choice.

Arlo...
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 98
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 7:05:27 PM

if he doesn't understand tradition...


And I'll ask you,,,"who's" tradition???? He isn't marrying you.

Who's bored out there tonight???? Why doesn't someone do a search about when and how the "engagement ring" became tradition. It would be kinda cool to know when,who,how and why. Really. It would. Maybe enlightening. Or,maybe not.
 Debisusanne
Joined: 5/3/2011
Msg: 99
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 7:16:58 PM
I like rings.. but i can buy my own!
 gcdeb
Joined: 4/25/2011
Msg: 100
Who is right?
Posted: 1/5/2012 7:19:50 PM
No,,,,his "values" are not mixed up,,,they are "different" than hers. Get THAT straight people. I know the "majority" feel or think an "engagement" ring should be a "given" and "part of the deal",,to make the woman feel "happy". But,remember,again, not everyone will believe what YOU do. Is that so hard for some of you to understand?????


That's the way I see it also. He has one set of values, she has a different set. The only mistake I see he has made, is that he should have informed her much earlier on in the relationship about this issue. He should have realised her expectations would have been traditional in that she would assume she would get a ring if they became engaged. I think it would have been fair for him to bring this up much earlier.

When I started dating my children's father, I told him very early on (say week 3 after we became exclusive) that if I ever had children I would want them to have my surname, or a combined surname at the very least. I explained my reasons and told him I would not waiver from that so it was something for him to think about. He decided he could accept that and we continued dating and eventually married and had two children, who bear both our surnames. His family were not happy about it but it was very important to me and I made sure he knew early on so he could decide if it was a dealbreaker.
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