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Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 326
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful BetrayalPage 14 of 19    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19)
It is classic to note that some people with the strongest views against abortion are those that contribute little or nothing to the support of unwanted/poor/impoverished children...yet sit aroung all day long trolling pof threads about how teenage women who find themselves pregnant have no right to their own body.

On another note....it does seem as though the perception of PP is that all they do is perform abortions...I'd be interested to know what percentage of their practice actually is involved in abortions and what percentage of all abortions in America this comprises....seems that somewhere I heard they do other stuff.
 Aristotle_Amadopolis
Joined: 12/8/2011
Msg: 327
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 5:41:49 AM

^^^I understand this is the reasoning given to make it okay, but on the same token, does the male in this situation have any say so?

Yes he has a say, but she has the final decision.

Unless you believe that a male should able to tell a woman what to do with their bodies.

If you can not handle the fact that a women you have sex with may or may not abort that unwanted pregnancy, then do not have sex.




To me both men and women should have the right to be pro choice. If the guy does not want a child, he should have the same right as the woman who does not want to have a child.

So it sounds like you are contradicting yourself, because you said:

"In what states are the GOP "controlling women?" Do you know how offensive that sounds? To think that a male can control a woman? Women have the right to control themselves...

Sounds like you just want to control women, unless you do not believe what you said about women having the right to control themselves.





you can not reason with pro abortion advocates...they see abortion as post pregnancy contraception...they use words like embryo and fetus to dehumanize the baby...

You can not reason with those anti-abortion advocates as they are not able to see the big picture and have these irrational feeling about zygotes.
 Earthpuppy
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 328
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 5:54:27 AM
I'd guess that most cases of abortion the partners participated in the decision. In an earlier post you claimed, you didn't want to know if your partner had an abortion.

There is the attitude that once just one little sperm hits an egg, the woman's body becomes property of the state or subject to the authority of men, employers or insurance companies, and their opinions should be able to over-ride her decisions.

This is predominately a women's health and pregnancy prevention thread since the vast majority of what PP does that. When employers want to dictate to women that their insurance cannot cover birth control, and, as in 3 states thus far, give the employer a right to fire an employee using birth control, it runs counter to the best interests of society at large, and is a hypocritical meddling in women's rights to autonomy. This is particularly hypocritical when there is no such debated or meddling for men getting boner pills and health screenings and treatment for sexual issues.
 Justcheckingfor1
Joined: 8/11/2011
Msg: 329
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 6:20:45 AM
"Yes he has a say, but she has the final decision.
Unless you believe that a male should able to tell a woman what to do with their bodies.
If you can not handle the fact that a women you have sex with may or may not abort that unwanted pregnancy, then do not have sex."

^^^I don't have to worry about this, because I know where my partners stand on this situation.

Of course she has the final say because it is her body, no I have never felt men should tell women what to do with their own bodies. My issue is, if she can abort whether or not the male agrees or disagrees, then he should be granted the same right to have his potential offspring (group of cells) aborted. To me that is equal and fair. Having a child can affect a males body in ways such as stress, high blood pressure, becoming an alcoholic, because 75 percent of his salary is now going to her so she does not have to work and can support "their" child. Of course an easier solution would be to not make the sperm donor responsible and force him to care for the group of cells that becomes a human that he never wanted in the first place. So that way women can have their way, and men can have their way.

"I'd guess that most cases of abortion the partners participated in the decision. In an earlier post you claimed, you didn't want to know if your partner had an abortion."

^^^No, actually I would not want to know if she did. It is her body and her decision. IF she tells me she is pregnant however, and aborts the child whether I agree with this or not is the issue I have. The same way if she wants to keep the child but I want her to abort it, because I may not be able to afford to provide it a decent quality of life. Plus considering what I went through as a child, I really don't want to have children because I would hate myself if a child of mine had to go through the horrible things that I did. To me this makes both partners responsible for their decision to procreate. To me no one should be forced into taking on something that they feel they can not handle or would be detrimental to their health. So I guess you could say, that I am for every bodies right to choose.
 Justcheckingfor1
Joined: 8/11/2011
Msg: 330
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 7:03:48 AM
"Haha...in what world do you think that actually happens?
Taking care of children is hard work. In a nuclear family situation the woman most often is working throughout the entire day. It is significantly more difficult and nerve racking than many jobs I have had.
You can't blame lots of women in bad economic situations for making this decision. As a single parent of 3 I am telling you first hand that it is the most stressful thing you can do."

^^^ Good post and I am very proud of you and honored to get a response to my post in that case. In cases of divorce it happens often in my area. Men are left with nothing but bills to pay, regardless of who is at fault at causing the divorce or even if it is mutual. I am not blaming women for anything at all. I just want men to have the same particular right that women have. If they can't have this same particular right, than I am against this right. So that if a woman can abort an unwanted pregnancy, then the male in the situation should not have to be responsible for an unwanted pregnancy, and Planned Parenthood should be supporting it this way, so that both parties involved have a right to their decisions. Both can have their way. Also a man should not be made to feel guilty and deciding what is best for him and his life and finances, just the same way a woman should not be made to feel guilty on her choice in this manner.
 Justcheckingfor1
Joined: 8/11/2011
Msg: 331
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 8:21:53 AM
"Hey remember I said men have an advantage cuz they can pee standing up and that's not fair Also it takes men significantly less time to get ready for a date, they don't have to shave their legs (unless they're into that) don't have to spend a fortune on lingerie and underthings, can burp and fart in front of their friends and think it's funny and the best; they can take things "in hand" and never have to leave the house!"

^^^Now that is an awesome post and alas, I concur. Happy Friday! :)
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 332
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 8:38:05 AM
There is the attitude that once just one little sperm hits an egg, the woman's body becomes property of the state or subject to the authority of men, employers or insurance companies, and their opinions should be able to over-ride her decisions.


When the decision to pay for it and what method and under what conditions becomes the job of the federal government :)
I'm sure there will be a bill passed that is 1000 pages describing the event in detail about how the money is distributed.

There is something I find interesting in a moral sense on how right/left view life/death.
Simple view... people act how they act but just according to the general views.

Left:
Acceptable to end life of the willing:
--Abortion (from women’s point of view), Euthanasia (sick, elderly)
Not acceptable to end life of the unwilling
--Criminals with the death penalty, wars

Right:
Not acceptable to end life of the willing:
--Abortion (from women's point of view), Euthanasia (sick, elderly)
Acceptable to end life of the unwilling
--Criminals with the death penalty, wars

So, from a Right perspective it is better to say no to those willing to die because this life is meaningful and yes to those that are not choosing death but they feel have violated the sanctity of this life. And the right believes in a life after death in general which includes a form of justice.

The Left are willing to allow those that are willing to end their life but are do not to accept the cost of ending the life of those that have chosen to do great harm in this life and the left tend to not believe in a sense of justice after death.

It is kind of strange mix. But it is where the views come from more so than being about womens rights which explains why some women also agree with it. They do not see it as a rights issue.
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 333
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 9:08:37 AM

To me the equal thing to do would be for both genders to have the same rights.

When BOTH genders have an equal commitment, THEN both genders will have an equal say... The 5 minutes (at least for conservatives, anyway) and bare minimum of resources/risk a male puts into the process has NO comparison to what the woman commits... Your commitment to procreation as a male is nothing compared to the nine months, all the physiological resources, the health risks imposed and the psychological/emotional involvement of the woman... When men have to invest at that level in a pregnancy THEN they have a say in it...
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 334
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 9:09:20 AM

Left:
Acceptable to end life of the willing:


Oh...let me fix this for you:

Right:

Willing to reduce medicare and medicaid to the point where it is a meaningless benefit to those that have worked all their lives...thus ending a long and productive life in poverty without the benefit of life extending healthcare.

Right:

Willing to end programs like school lunches and medicaid to children.

Once again...the right wishes to care for a zigot, but doesn't give a hoot about a "living" child or "live" person.
 Earthpuppy
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 335
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 9:16:15 AM
I saw a political cartoon recently with the woman of the house fretting over food prices, and ability to pay the rent and the husband pulling a Limbaugh on her, going spastic screaming "That's it! No more contraception or abortion!!"

In engaging in this ill-conceived (pun intended) plan to wage war on contraception and abortion to try to score points with the faithful, the far right is shooting itself, and the nation, in the butt. For every dollar spent on family planning we save $4, a fiscally responsible approach that they just don't get.
http://www.guttmacher.org/media/nr/2009/02/23/index.html

My brother works as a welfare fraud investigator in WI., MN., and northern IL. His company subs out to the states and lost the Iowa account a few years ago because partisans declared they could no longer afford their services. For every dollar spent for my brother's work and that of his agency, the state had saved $17. There were political forces in play beyond actually accounting. This is what the GOP is doing in declaring war on women's reproductive rights. How is ending family planning going to save money?

The bright spot in all this insanity, is that like the war on hispanics who are now solidly back in Obamas' camp despite previous ambivalence, the GOP is driving women away from the culture warriors against women.
http://www.people-press.org/2012/03/14/section-2-the-general-election-2/

This has been a wakeup call for women, one the Tea people and far right should pay attention to.
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 336
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 10:00:07 AM
Irish

All your additions are after the fact rationalizations for what you want to believe and have nothing to do with the motivations.

Do you not see how your positions are entirely faith based just as much as any religious persons? Your blind allegiance to a utopian government that does not and can never exist is just as illogical, irrational, and deluded as your view of the religious.

You’re making things up and associating it to an entire class of people that you ideologically do not agree with to the point of ridiculousness. You would believe anything that someone told you about how evil 'the right' is just because you want to and absolutely discount that the fact is that the majority of the country at this point is in some way not only Christian but their entire family is as well. Do you really expect that it is reasonable for people to turn away from their families just because you want them to feel guilty for existing?

It isn't easy to change beliefs. They are beliefs because people believe them to be true. We don't go around flipping around what we believe in every time something new comes up. It just doesn't work like that.

If I may.... I have just started this book myself but I think you would get more out of it... The End of Faith by Sam Harris. It does focus on Christian faith but it is about all faith and if you include politics in that as well it provides an alternative perspective.

Maybe you don’t realize how strong your faith really is...
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 337
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 10:21:35 AM
Do you not see how your positions are entirely faith based just as much as any religious persons?

Oh, nonsense... You are, and have consistently, confabulated 'faith' (in the religious context) and 'belief' (in general)... People can 'believe' without 'faith'... People 'believe' based on facts and reality, people 'believe' based on logic, people 'believe' based on fantasy but 'faith' (in the religious context) is all, and only, about fantasy... The fact that people 'believe' based on facts, reality and logic as strongly as another does on the basis of 'faith' does NOT make THEIR beliefs the same as religious 'faith' (which is ALL about fantasy and not fact or reality or logic)...
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 338
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 10:28:05 AM
Message 384:
... does the male in this situation have any say so? What if she wanted to keep the child, and he wanted to abort the child.
I have no issue with a woman's right to choose. My issue is why does the male who's sperm was used to fertilize the egg not taken into consideration, so that he has the same right. To me both men and women should have the right to be pro choice. If the guy does not want a child, he should have the same right as the woman who does not want to have a child.

I notice this is not the first time you've brought up this situation ... Message 367:
then the father should also have the right to have the child he helped create with the woman to be aborted.
Have you figured it out yet ... how to avoid having to be in that position of having nothing to say about the abortion? No?

Let me help ... any man has just as much right to choose as a woman. Men who don't want a baby ... don't want to raise a child ... don't want to spend money on a child ... can avoid that situation easily if he just exercised his right to use birth control.

Cover the end of it and/or get a vasectomy ... or as the Conservatives are now promoting ... ABSTAIN unless of course you want to procreate. NO SEX FOR PLEASURE!!! ... right?

Again, for those against birth control and abortion, how many unwanted children are you raising?

OT ...
In the meantime I see no reason to defund Planned Parenthood. Planned Parenthood benefits men as well as women. Our young men really need it when they get STD's and have no insurance to go to the Dr. and do not go to the ER for their symptoms.
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 339
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 10:44:37 AM
You’re making things up and associating it to an entire class of people that you ideologically do not agree with to the point of ridiculousness


Are you calling the kettle-black??? Because when you make posts like...

Liberals: <-----would this be an entire class of people???

Liberals do/think/feel yada yada yada...

Then you aught to be able to take the heat you so justly asked for.


Actually, my thoughts about the GOP paring medicare and medicaid are well known facts...and it is also a well known fact that many seniors currently on SSI and medicare live on the edge of poverty...thus, any further paring of medicare will push them over the edge straight into poverty....

And it is equally a fact that many in the GOP favor eliminating that wasteful child school lunch program and paring medicaid even further....and let's not forget who's in favor of defunding PP....

So, the GOP wants to tell a woman she cannot have an abortion....limit sex only to procreate....make contraceptives harder to get...and are against passing the Violence Against Women Act....and democrats are forcing morality on the unwanting masses???....what a load of bullshyte.
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 340
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 11:04:07 AM

...The fact that people 'believe' based on facts, reality and logic as strongly as another does on the basis of 'faith' does NOT make THEIR beliefs the same as religious 'faith' (which is ALL about fantasy and not fact or reality or logic)...


I did not say anything differently. Just apply the same logic to politics and government... if you can...

I don't understand how you don't understand the relationship. It is one thing to believe things based on facts and reality. It is another thing to assign characteristics to that belief that are beyond facts and reality and hold them as true which is faith.

I am not trying to muddy your water. I am trying to show the consistency of both sides and why it is opposing sides of the same coin. It is just fundamentalism on both sides and both sides are equally wrong and based on faith and not on the real world of governance of 300 million people in a global economy.
 unYOUsual
Joined: 8/11/2011
Msg: 341
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 11:14:24 AM
they stated they would pass the VAWA..if it was a reauthorization...but as usual Dems have to try to allow illegal immigrants citizen rights and what not...
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 342
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 11:22:25 AM
I don't understand how you don't understand the relationship. It is one thing to believe things based on facts and reality. It is another thing to assign characteristics to that belief that are beyond facts and reality and hold them as true which is faith.


2 posts later you disavow your post calling it in effect fact...well, it ain't and you've classified liberals (a class of people) as this and that...which side of your mouth will we hear from next?




they stated they would pass the VAWA..if it was a reauthorization...but as usual Dems have to try to allow illegal immigrants citizen rights and what not...


Once again we hear the GOP talking points parroted in the threads where the reality is:


The legislation would continue existing grant programs to local law enforcement and battered women shelters, but would expand efforts to reach Indian tribes and rural areas. It would increase the availability of free legal assistance to victims of domestic violence, extend the definition of violence against women to include stalking, and provide training for civil and criminal court personnel to deal with families with a history of violence. It would also allow more battered illegal immigrants to claim temporary visas, and would include same-sex couples in programs for domestic violence
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/15/us/politics/violence-against-women-act-divides-senate.html?pagewanted=all

The assault on women's rights and issues continues past the assault on PP and women's access to reproductive healthcare....we can only hope these efforts keep going on till November...because the GOP keeps shooting themselves---->in the foot.
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 343
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 11:30:40 AM
2 posts later you disavow your post calling it in effect fact...well, it ain't and you've classified liberals (a class of people) as this and that...which side of your mouth will we hear from next?


It doesn't matter because both of your ears are closed. Read the book. If anything you should get a kick out of the views on religion.

You do not and it seems never will understand what they are opposing or the viewpoint. I'm sure no cost will ever have bearing. The cost to society, the cost to the economy, and the cost for the next 200 years is irrelevant. No reality other than your own... no laws matter... no structure matters... just the all mighty collective government. The granter of rights...

You understand the separation of church and state... but do you understand the whole ‘all men are created equal, life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness thing’? It is to keep the government from being the granter of those rights... that’s it. Religion is separated to keep religion from being government. Having the concept of people having the being born with specific rights not granted by government makes government equal to people. Putting government at the equal level as religion makes religion the government. Removing the authority from outside government to grant those rights just elevates government to the status equal with religion. All you are doing is replacing religion with government that doesn't believe in God. It should be no more desired than a theocracy.

As far as abortion goes it isn't about women’s rights on the right. It is about morality. Sticking to that morality has consequences such as children that are not wanted as well as the very real problem that it will force them to dangerous situations and terrible outcomes. You just can't legislate morality like that. Alcohol prohibition failed for a reason.

I am not talking out of both sides of my mouth. You just can't seem to grasp that you are wrong about why. There is no evidence that there is a war against women. It is just a political war over a morality view of life. The president has no authority to change this law and if these states do things that violate the law they should be brought to answer in a court of law and not because of anything you fantasize.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 344
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 11:36:26 AM
So, the GOP wants to tell a woman she cannot have an abortion....limit sex only to procreate....make contraceptives harder to get


Either Medicare is reformed or it will disappear anyway, when there is no longer enough money to pay for it. And the day's not too far off.

Any state that can afford it is perfectly free to buy its public schoolkids prime rib for lunch, with a chocolate eclair for dessert. But if the *federal* government has authority to buy even one of them, anywhere, so much as a glass of milk, I'd like to know where that authority comes from.

I wasn't aware the Republican Party--or even any of the Republican candidates--had taken the positions you claim. I'm a conservative who will vote Republican, and I don't take any of them.

Contraceptives are about as hard to get in America today as a Big Mac. They've been cheap and very widely available for decades now--and every thinking person knows it.

I'm not unhappy with my state's abortion laws. And I support the right of people in every other state not to restrict abortion at all, to restrict is as far as the Constitution allows, or to do anything in between.

I certainly don't want to prevent people from having sex except for procreation, and I've never met anyone who did. I doubt anyone else here wants to do that either, or even if they did could suggest how to go about it.
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 345
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/16/2012 11:58:50 AM
Either Medicare is reformed or it will disappear anyway, when there is no longer enough money to pay for it. And the day's not too far off.


the General Fund of the Treasury. Because these redemptions will be less than interest earnings, trust fund balances will continue to grow. After 2022, trust fund assets will be redeemed in amounts that exceed interest earnings until trust fund reserves are exhausted in 2036

Who needs medicare or universal healthcare anyway....when the GOP ramps up it's assault on American morality and declares sex illegal except for procreation...we'll stop having sex...and athe frustrated masses will do themselves in.


But if the *federal* government has authority to buy even one of them, anywhere, so much as a glass of milk, I'd like to know where that authority comes from.


I dunno...and I'm not gonna educate you on it...but, here's a start:
http://www.fns.usda.gov/cnd/lunch/
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-111publ296/pdf/PLAW-111publ296.pdf

The national school lunch program has been in effect for some time now...don't like it??? get out your constitutional edit pencil and get to work.


Contraceptives are about as hard to get in America today as a Big Mac. They've been cheap and very widely available for decades now--and every thinking person knows it.


A 3 pac of condoms per year is cheap for you....yet, you ignore the effects of the assault on Planned Parenthood-the 5 million women who used PP last year might disagree with you.


I'm not unhappy with my state's abortion laws. And I support the right of people in every other state not to restrict abortion at all, to restrict is as far as the Constitution allows, or to do anything in between.


I imagine you're not at all upset at the sleazebag backdoor maneuvering some of the GOP states have been trying to pull in order to make abortion in their state all but impossible.


I certainly don't want to prevent people from having sex except for procreation, and I've never met anyone who did. I doubt anyone else here wants to do that either, or even if they did could suggest how to go about it.


Ask your newest Presidential frontrunner Santorum...I'm sure he has all the answers.


. I'm a conservative who will vote Republican, and I don't take any of them.


So, you're not a republican, yet, you're answering for them...


I wasn't aware


News flash....
 Justcheckingfor1
Joined: 8/11/2011
Msg: 346
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/19/2012 9:41:06 AM
"Let me help ... any man has just as much right to choose as a woman. Men who don't want a baby ... don't want to raise a child ... don't want to spend money on a child ... can avoid that situation easily if he just exercised his right to use birth control. "

^^^But if she gets pregnant and decides to keep it regardless, and it does happen in the real world, then he has to be responsible for the care(having some of his paycheck if not half of it taken away) for something He May Not Want! So in that case he should have just as much say as the woman he got pregnant when it comes to abortion. In other words. Neither men nor women should be able to have a right that bennefits one in the situation, while punishing the other. Neither should be able to trump each other. So in other words, if he wants her to abort her child then she should be required by law to do so, and she wants to abort the child she should have that right. That way BOTH genders have a Right to abortiontion. In order for this to be fair then both should have completely equal rights and planned parenthood should be their to support each gender's wishes. IF not, then it is an unequal organziation and should be shut down. If a woman has the right to choose, than a man should have the righ to choose. I can't support something that gives a right to one person, while taking a right away from another person. IF a woman has a right to an abortion without her partner's consent, then a man should have the same right without her consent. In that case, both have the same right, and the same say so in this matter. Planned Parenthood should be their to make sure both genders have a complete equal say.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 347
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History
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/19/2012 10:25:43 AM
There's an important point which seems to be ignored. Anyone who claims a woman has an absolute right to abortion--that the decision is hers and hers alone--is saying how they think things *should* be. How they *are* is something else again.

In this country, the Constitution is the highest law. It doesn't recognize abortion as a fundamental right. That means that within certain limits, the right to abortion can be restricted by state law.

In determining these limits, the mother's interest in aborting the fetus is weighed against against the state's interest in protecting its life. When the fetus becomes viable, the balance shifts in favor of the state.

Before viability, a state cannot prohibit abortion, or impose an undue burden on the right to abortion.

After viability, a state can prohibit abortion except where that would jeopardize the life or health of the mother.

According to the Supreme Court, those are the limits the Constitution allows. Of course a state may also choose to limit the right to abortion less than this, or not to limit it at all.

Anyone who doesn't like the law in their state can try to change it. Anyone who doesn't like the law in some other state can criticize it but has no power to interfere with it. If enough Americans think the Constitution should guarantee a right to abortion everywhere in the country, they can amend it to do that.

Two-thirds of the members of each House of Congress would need to vote for the amendment, and three-fourths of the state legislatures would then need to ratify it. The Constitution was purposely designed to be hard to amend, as any constitution should be.

Otherwise, it would be just a set of suggested guidelines that any temporary majority could change to suit itself. If an one-year apartment lease called for a monthly rent of $1,000, but also said either the landlord or the tenant could change that amount anytime, they would never really have agreed to any amount. Where people don't live by laws, but only by personal whims, disputes are finally decided by force.
 Kings_Knight
Joined: 1/20/2009
Msg: 348
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/19/2012 10:32:18 AM
@ Nr 1 ...


" ... Komen, the world’s largest breast cancer organization, decided to betray that mission. It threw itself into the middle of one of America’s nastiest political battles, on the side of hard-right forces working to demonize Planned Parenthood and undermine women’s health and freedom. ... "


" ... demonize Planned Parenthood ... ". Wow. That's pretty hysterical, even for the NYT. Has it ever occurred to the ones beating their breasts (figuratively) over Komen's decision (later reversed) to withdraw funding from PP that PP's policies and practices make it virtually impossible for parenthood to occur? That's their 'plan'. They encourage NON-parenthood via 'Planned Abortion'. For those who disagree with this statement, please explain how a woman having an abortion - thereby preventing her from ever becoming a parent to the child whose life she chose to end - results in parenthood to that child.

As for women and sexual activity - even 'unplanned pregnancy' - that's their business. It is NOT incumbent upon me as a private citizen through redistribution of my tax dollars, nor upon Komen, to pay for the private decision of a private citizen to terminate the life of their unborn child. If PP wants to stay in business and provide these services in keeping with the precepts of their 'leader', Ms Sanger, that's their choice. Let them raise the money needed to promote their activity from the market they 'serve' - they do NOT deserve public money to further the execution of unborn children. If the women who utilize these facilities want their pregnancy ended so badly, they'll find a way - unfortunately - to pay for it.
 BigBadNIrish
Joined: 1/31/2011
Msg: 349
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/19/2012 11:01:57 AM
Planned Parenthood provided as much adoption support as abortions services in their last reporting year of 2007....31% of their practice was STD testing...17% was cancer screening and prevention...11% was related to other women's health services...38% was related to contraceptive services...and 3% was related to abortion services...aand of course everyone knows the federal government does not provide funding for abortion services....lastly, most know that the Komen Foundation is not a government foundation.

http://www.plannedparenthood.org/files/AR08_vFinal.pdf

Interestingly enough:

Planned Parenthood has received federal funding since 1970, when President Richard Nixon signed into law the Family Planning Services and Population Research Act, amending the Public Health Service Act.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_Parenthood


VVV

I can imagine how much adoption support many of the most vocal critics of PP have provided...
 Kings_Knight
Joined: 1/20/2009
Msg: 350
Defunding Planned Parenthood-A Painful Betrayal
Posted: 3/19/2012 11:26:37 AM
@ Nr 415 ...

Does that mean they deserve PUBLIC money to further their PRIVATE agenda?

No.

Let them hold bake sales or fundraisers. NO tax dollars and no COERCED dollars.

Just because Nixon screwed up is no justification for continued public funding.
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