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 HappyRocker
Joined: 8/13/2011
Msg: 26
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Posted By: Internetdatinglol on 3/24/2012 852 AM
An upper house allows voters to choose whether or not they want to give the executive total power. For instance you could vote LNP in the lower house but Green in the upper house if you want a change of government but hope they don't destroy the environment if they win.


So you don't believe that we should take our vote seriously? You believe we should be able touse it like petulant school children? Use it like they do on TV reality shows maybe ...


It functions as a house of review, accountability and consideration - it's not a feudal or aristocratic hangover. To claim otherwise just indicates to me you don't know what you're talking about.


So you believe we should have more politicians and another tier of them to slow government down even further ...

Shouldn't you be crying in your beer over your lost seat or chanting "Go Can Do!" if you're winnig one from the other side?
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 27
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 1:19:35 AM
So my question still is ... expressed in other words;
If the MLAs (members of legislative assembly) that are elected by each electorate is a democratic selection, what is the upper house?

It looks a lot like the archaic House of Lords that the English Parliament is saddled with.

Are you an aristocrat Sunny Coaster?


What? Anyone who actually knows how politics works in Australia knows that it has become a house of review so as one party does not get complete executive power the way John Howard did federally, the way Joh did in Queensland. To stop bad governments from gaining to much power and introducing legislation that is bad for everyone.

It is this issue that saw the Coalition thrown out in 2007, because John Howard could pass bad legislation and run a bad government that he wanted to in 1996 after 2004. It is also to much power that led to the last Queensland Country party government to be thrown out under Joh. It is not a good thing when one party maintains complete executive power, there is enough precedent in what I said, I needn't to go any further.

Australia is not Britain, what you are saying is not how Australia's government has developed over time. If anything we have developed what has been termed as a Washminster government... Australia has decided the upper house should excercise its own independence as a house of review so as we don't end up with legislation such as Work Choices which pushes workplace relations to far in favor of one party over the other.
 internetdatinglol
Joined: 5/17/2007
Msg: 28
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Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 1:21:59 AM
HappyRocker

...what? Of course I believe we should take our vote seriously. This is exactly why I think we should be able to vote strategically, using our vote in the upper house as a restraint on political power if we choose to. Sorry this opinion appears to be too nuanced for your sensibilities/ability to comprehend though.

If you want unrestrained political power that runs without obstruction you can always move to China?
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 29
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 1:47:26 AM
This is a combination of Australian federal issues, and 13 years of Labor government... It's become significantly difficult for one party to maintain government for more than 3 terms in Australia. It's already over for Labor less than an hour into the call.
 HappyRocker
Joined: 8/13/2011
Msg: 30
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Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 1:57:12 AM
This is an issue of two politicians (with their "living on another planet" spin doctors and advisors) lying to their employers and thinking the employers would be too apathetic to care!

Unfortunately due to the financial power of the two major political blocks Queenslanders have had a choice of dumb or dumber.
 internetdatinglol
Joined: 5/17/2007
Msg: 31
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Posted: 3/24/2012 2:05:04 AM
Well Queensland, hope you enjoy being Australia's Alabama once again!

Wonder how long it will be until the Nationals bring back the Bjelkemander?
 internetdatinglol
Joined: 5/17/2007
Msg: 32
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Posted: 3/24/2012 2:23:02 AM
Don't worry too much, it's just state politics. There's only so much they have the power to screw up.:)
 HappyRocker
Joined: 8/13/2011
Msg: 33
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Posted: 3/24/2012 2:25:01 AM
Bob Katter is pretty coservative but he is a passionate advocate for his electorate of Kennedy. Many other electorates would be lucky to have a candidate like him.
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 34
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 2:31:03 AM
Holy shit... Peter Wellingtons gone now as well on the current count, not even good independent voices are escapting this mess :/ The curtain faders don't deserve Nicklin, that's Queensland's best independent voice on daylight savings and civil unions. If Nicklin falls thats a bellwether seat for the type of government we're going to expect.

The anti-homosexual, curtain fader vote is strong if the LNP is polling strongly in Nicklin.
 crustyold
Joined: 4/25/2011
Msg: 35
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 3:02:40 AM
after chatting with people here in my area........

selling what is not yours, is a big ,no, no

forgetting rural areas............we will remember
& the labour party still dont get it
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 36
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 3:06:29 AM
/\/\/\/\

The Deep North has gotten what it wants make the most of it while it lasts.
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 37
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 3:09:13 AM
It's time South East Queensland secedes from this rabble.
 internetdatinglol
Joined: 5/17/2007
Msg: 38
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Posted: 3/24/2012 3:27:50 AM
Brilliant and strong concession speech by Anna Bligh. Not one for tears it seems!
 qldblue
Joined: 2/4/2009
Msg: 39
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 4:20:29 AM
I think a lot of people have confused state issues with federal issues, even the interview with Clive Palmer was more about his issues with the federal government rather than the state issues.

Being old enough to be involved in too many elections and using my own opinions I think that because of the mud slinging from some sections of the Labor movement, the real issues were forgotten.

Anna Bligh did some amazing things after Cyclone Yasi and the Flooding of SE Queensland but this was not aired in North Queensland.

I also believe that Bligh was unfortunate in the fact that a lot of the ministers of her government were at best very medioca at their best.

Only some North Queensland seats voted for Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party when it was around.

It is interesting to note that Robbie Katter won his seat based around Mt Isa, an area with a very large multicultured region as there are people from just about every country in the world there.

Bigh's government did sell off some state assets that a lot of Queenslanders were against.

Will the LNP be a better government?

I think we will see the people of Queensland judgement in 3 years time
 internetdatinglol
Joined: 5/17/2007
Msg: 40
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Posted: 3/24/2012 4:39:32 AM
The LNP will win the next two state elections I reckon.

Anything beyond that, who knows. I certainly think all this talk of Labor being out of power "for a generation" is completely overblown.

Lots of Labor people voted LNP today simply because they thought it was time to give the other mob a chance at government. In my opinion a stupid thing to do but that's how a lot of people vote!
 qldblue
Joined: 2/4/2009
Msg: 41
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/24/2012 2:46:19 PM
As one of the panelists said on the channel seven's election show and I must agree with this and I quote" A lot of voters are now becoming supermarket voters" unquote.

This was from the LNP state member, he also went on to say that in his opinion voters were looking at the image of the person and not at the policies but in this election the policies did take a back seat while the attacks were made on the two possible Premiers.

Neither side can claim a policy fought win or loss.

A growing trend in the seats outside of the South East corridor was the number of votes that Katter's Australian Party received and these were in usually strong National Party held electorates and maybe the major parties should look at some of the policies that struck a chord with those voters and not dismiss everything Katter's Australia Party expressed.
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 42
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/25/2012 1:08:12 AM
The LNP was always more beneficial to the Liberal party than it was to the National party. It lets National party members masquerade as something they're not. It seems we've forgotten about that though.

I can see in time that KAP will pick up a lot of the vote that would have gone to the Queensland Nationals though. Last nights election shows just how many people still want to vote for the Nationals and I believe if the Nationals were running that New Zealand soft-drink company L&P wouldn't have done so well last night.

This is what happens when we tinker with the Queensland electoral system however, it turns out we've got a new Gerrymander on two counts. With preferential voting KAP and Labor would have probably picked up at least 2 or 3 more seats each, with the Nationals running Labor might have picked up another couple of seats. Instead we've got the misleading brand that is L&P where Nationals can pretend to be Liberals like in the last election where Katters ten gallon hat would have had more chance of winning the election than the faux Liberal Lawrence Springborg.
 HappyRocker
Joined: 8/13/2011
Msg: 43
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Posted: 3/25/2012 6:24:08 AM

Posted By: Sunny_Coaster on 3/24/2012 11:09:13 AM
It's time South East Queensland secedes from this rabble.


I'd happily support your secession.

a. You want daylight saving although the majority area of the State is in the Tropics where daylight saving just means we have to start work in the dark.
b. You are Brisbane centric although most of the wealth the State relies on is produced elsewhere.
c. Your "My Labor right or wrong" attitude grates on those who have to use regional roads, the Bruce Highway North of the Sunshine Coast and infrastructure left in neglect not seen since the Byke-Petersen - Hinze government.

Yep ... If you would like to secede and take Anna Bligh's government with you I can't see anyone North of Noosa making a fuss.
 crustyold
Joined: 4/25/2011
Msg: 44
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/25/2012 6:48:23 AM
LISTING TO SOME SHOWS TODAY

& THEY STILL DONT GET IT........

WAS NOT MY FAULT, & IT WAS THERES

THEY SOLD "OUR" STUFF, & SAID THEY WOULD NOT.

WAS NOT THEIRS TO SELL....

WE HAVE ROADS HERE, STATE & FED, THAT HAVE HAD VERY LITTLE TO NOTHING SPENT ON THEM FOR 8 YEARS........THE BRUCE H/WAY IS JOKE, THAT KILLS

THE NEW GUYS BETTER GET IT, AS WE ARE ALL OVER THEIR SHIT
 HappyRocker
Joined: 8/13/2011
Msg: 45
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Posted: 3/25/2012 6:56:28 AM

Posted By: qldblue on 3/24/2012 1019 PM
As one of the panelists said on the channel seven's election show and I must agree with this and I quote" A lot of voters are now becoming supermarket voters" unquote.

Journalists and politicians are telling each other that which comforts them in their ivory towers, "The great unwashed are just running around like lemmings. They aren't really voting against the last pre-election lie, the increase in government charges and raising of government corporation charges, the corruption, incompetence and negligence such as the Health Payrole debacle ... The little people haven't the brains to make decisions, they're just following each other!"


This was from the LNP state member, he also went on to say that in his opinion voters were looking at the image of the person and not at the policies but in this election the policies did take a back seat while the attacks were made on the two possible Premiers.

The best answer to this is a Twitter that I saw on Channel Nine coverage, "I had a choice to vote for the Dumb Party or the Dumber Party. So I voted for the Dumb Party that wasn't in power. Politicians, spin doctors and journalists looking for an opportunity to become a spin doctor should take note. When the electorate learns to toss out the incompetent incumbent even if they are putting in another incompetent it will take a lot longer to serve those two and a bit terms to get your lifetime taxpayer topped up pension.


Neither side can claim a policy fought win or loss.

You watch them! The pugnatious little twit from the army will rule with a iron fist and the Labor Party will eat its own for a few years.


A growing trend in the seats outside of the South East corridor was the number of votes that Katter's Australian Party received and these were in usually strong National Party held electorates and maybe the major parties should look at some of the policies that struck a chord with those voters and not dismiss everything Katter's Australia Party expressed.

WHAT! You mean there IS some Queensland North of Noosa??
Neither major party even tried to address Gladstone's issues. Liz Cunningham (Ind) has the safest seat in the State.
 internetdatinglol
Joined: 5/17/2007
Msg: 46
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Posted: 3/25/2012 8:41:23 PM
Very few people would say that the result has NOTHING to do with what's happened federally. In fact I doubt anyone has said that.

If people vote Labor just because they like Rudd then good riddance.

People ought to vote for a party because they identify with the policies they espouse, not because they like the way the leader looks. We can leave that ridiculously shallow mindset to the Americans (and Queenslanders now too I guess).

If people love Rudd so much they would vote for the party he's a member of and whose policies he supports. If Rudd was PM now his policies would be the same as Gillard's (except going by his track record he'd screw up their implementation and not be able to get them through parliament). Simple.
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 47
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/26/2012 1:05:51 AM
It's becoming more like a presedential election every time though and that's the thing. People voted for Campbell Newman, if they knew 3/4 of his members are actually nationals it would have been different.

If people knew that Kevin Rudd was from the Labor right I doubt he would have polled so well across the board either.

People will vote for Tony Abbott regardless of who the Liberal party preselects as candidates come the next election.

That is not a good thing either, I've actually highlighted the fact that the federal Labor government is getting the job done despite the position they've been put in. Federally we are in a position that is envied by many other nations and yet because the people have decided Tony Abbott will be our next president that's exactly what is going to happen.

If the media would actually report things as they are you would see exactly how much time and money is being wasted by the Abbott Coalition on filibustering policy for the sake of it. You would see that legislation is actually passing the floor and instead we get crap like 3 word jingos for the small minded majority.

Enjoy your delicious ironing of what Australia actually thinks should be done with "boat people"



15% of Australians prefer the option of sending the boats back out to sea without
assessment of asylum seeker claims (support for this option may vary if the option is put
less strongly / more euphemistically);

Assessment in Australia is preferred by a ratio of almost two to one – 53% chose ‘allowed
to land in Australia to be assessed’ compared to 28% for ‘sent to another country to
be assessed’.

Among those opting for assessment (rather than sending the boats back) an almost two-
thirds majority (64%) want asylum seekers held in detention while 32% want them to live in
the community. This equates to 52% support among all Australians for detention (64%
of the 81% choosing an ‘assessment’ option is 52%) and 26% support for living in the
community (32% of the 81% choosing an ‘assessment’ option is 26%) with 19%
unknown (they were not asked as a consequence of responses to earlier questions).

Among those choosing one of the two assessment options, 60% support allowing genuine
refugees to stay in Australia permanently. This equates to 49% support among all
Australians for permanent settlement (60% of the 81% choosing an ‘assessment’ option
is 49%). Support for temporary settlement of refugees was 29% of all Australians.
Note that 19% were not asked.

40% of those supporting detention opposed the detention of asylum seekers under 18
years of age (this equates to 21% of all Australians). Add to this the 32% (of those
choosing an assessment option) allowing asylum seekers to live in the community (equal to
26% of all Australians) and this suggests that 47% of all Australians oppose the
detention of asylum seekers under the age of 18, while 29% support such detention.
Note that the remainder, 24%, could not be inferred and were not asked.


This is from a Nielsen Poll conducted last August on 1400 people. The majority of people are that indoctrinated by Rupert's news however that they haven't got a clue about what is really going on.
 Sunny_Coaster
Joined: 9/3/2011
Msg: 48
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/26/2012 2:50:50 AM
I wasn't talking about the Queensland elections actually, and for the record Tony Abbott is dumber. If you don't believe he's not Rupert's puppet then you really are in bed with the Lib/Nats.

Go back to page 1, do as I said, inform yourself of whats going on, you'll soon realise its the filibusters vs. the government.


Get the facts!


There you go a 3 word jingo you should be able to understand. If that's too hard don't waste my time, just vote informal and don't muddy up the waters for those of us who actually do care.
 Hilly02
Joined: 10/7/2011
Msg: 49
Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/26/2012 3:47:40 AM

If that's too hard don't waste my time, just vote informal and don't muddy up the waters for those of us who actually do care.

So just because someone doesn't agree with your political views, they should shut up and not vote?
Thats about the most self indulgent, egocentric thing I have ever heard and I have heard some sh1t in my time.
I happen to think your political views are crap......does that mean you should shut up and vote informal because you don't agree with me?.
Grow up........geez it's no wonder I hate politics lol
 gingerosity
Joined: 12/10/2011
Msg: 50
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Political mud-slinging
Posted: 3/26/2012 4:07:09 AM
Voting informal doesn't mean you don't care. Not caring means you vote for whoever your friends and family tell you to vote for, or who you like the look of. Informal can mean you care so much you think the system itself needs such a major overhaul that the only way to make progress is to stop supporting the status quo.
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