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 AUTHOR
 Balsamica
Joined: 2/24/2012
Msg: 18
Conspiracy theory?Page 2 of 2    (1, 2)
6string, that was a typo.......regardless, what I asked you was where in the document do you find the language that is so objectionable and why and I never got an answer.

If it is so disturbing, just tell me why... show me! I'm from Missouri, the show me state! :-)
 6stringsandotherthings
Joined: 1/14/2012
Msg: 19
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 3/27/2012 12:29:31 PM
Balsamic, I'll show you a few examples of why this x-order makes me nervous. You have to remember that words mean everything and their "meanings" mean everything when interpreted. Then the argument begins on what context the words were used in. If some one has an agenda he/she will always make it very clear in what context they were using the word after the fact; which will happen if this x-order is enacted.

I'll begin with this section: " Sec. 201. Priorities and Allocations Authorities. (a) The authority of the President conferred by section 101 of the Act, 50 U.S.C. App. 2071, to require acceptance and priority performance of contracts or orders (other than contracts of employment) to promote the national defense over performance of any other contracts or orders, and to allocate materials, services, and facilities as deemed necessary or appropriate to promote the national defense, is delegated to the following agency heads:" The words "to require acceptance" is used very loosely here......who, what, when where and why came immediately to mind when I read it. The words "or appropriate" is the big flag here.......depending on the context, it could mean; 3. to take to or for oneself, take possession 4. to take without permission; expropriate. This is according to the college addition of the Webster's dictionary.

"(c) Each resource department shall act, as necessary and appropriate, upon requests for special priorities assistance, as defined by section 801(l) of this order, in a time frame consistent with the urgency of the need at hand. In situations where there are competing program requirements for limited resources, the resource department shall consult with the Secretary who made the required determination under section 202 of this order. Such Secretary shall coordinate with and identify for the resource department which program requirements to prioritize on the basis of operational urgency. In situations involving more than one Secretary making such a required determination under section 202 of this order, the Secretaries shall coordinate with and identify for the resource department which program requirements should receive priority on the basis of operational urgency."..... again the words "and appropriate" are used. Then it refers us to "section 801(l). " Special priorities assistance" means action by resource departments to assist with expediting deliveries, placing rated orders, locating suppliers, resolving production or delivery conflicts between various rated orders, addressing problems that arise in the fulfillment of a rated order or other action authorized by a delegated agency, and determining the validity of rated orders."...................my question here is what actions will the department heads take if the words "and appropriate means "to take".......

This one should raise a flag for you? "Sec. 502. Consultants. The head of each agency otherwise delegated functions under this order is delegated the authority of the President under sections 710(b) and (c) of the Act, 50 U.S.C. App. 2160(b), (c), to employ persons of outstanding experience and ability without compensation and to employ experts, consultants, or organizations. The authority delegated by this section may not be redelegated."............ the words "to employ" doesn't always mean you get a paycheck and it clearly states in this section, "to employ persons of outstanding experience and ability without compensation". This alone should raise huge question like "are you enslaving me for nat'l security''................. Balasamic, this is just part of what erks me about the x-order, it really does go far deeper than a play on words. One question I have is; "why would this order need to be in place during non-emergency conditions"???? In my view, it may have to do with control because this x-order encompasses every aspect of the American way of life.
 Balsamica
Joined: 2/24/2012
Msg: 20
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 3/27/2012 1:17:54 PM
6strings:

"necessary and appropriate" uses the term appropriate in the sense of proper, not to take, i.e an adjective, not a verb.

"to employ experts without compensation", etc. doesn't imply to me that anyone is going to conscript or draft someone against their will. Even in a draft, soldiers get paid.

Why it would be in place during non-emergency conditions is answered simply to have it in place in emergency conditions in the future, if need, with legal authority.
 IgorFrankensteen
Joined: 6/29/2009
Msg: 21
view profile
History
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 3/27/2012 1:34:19 PM
This seems to me to be nearly identical to the fuss that pops up every now and then, when some innocent (as in ignorant of the past) stumbles across the fact that our armed forces planners maintain a set of invasion plans for almost every country on the planet that might require military action against, or in support of them.

We don't make and keep plans to invade everyplace, because we actually plan to launch a world-domination campaign, we keep the plans up to date in order to be as prepared as we can, to be able to respond quickly should the need arise.

If you think that our invasion plans for Iraq were put together on the spur on the moment, right after Bush decided to send the assault teams in, you are more than naive.

This looks to be the same sort of document, again with nervous and "innocent" people worrying that it points directly to an actual imminent intent to have the Federal Government take over the entire US financial and Industrial structure.

Quite simply: you are being silly. STUDY MORE HISTORY!!!! It will really help you to calm down, provided you don't limit yourself to reading only right or left wing idealist versions of everything.
 6stringsandotherthings
Joined: 1/14/2012
Msg: 22
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 3/27/2012 2:04:55 PM
Balsamic, it really is just about in what context you use the words. The difference between you and I on this matter is: you trust the government and I'm very leery of it.......the real argument can go right back to it's source. Are x-orders constitutional or not? This argument has been going on since 1789 and I'll assume we won't agree on this issue either. I feel they are an abuse of "executive powers" especially when they make law vs improve upon ones already in place from "the people, by the people". We're lucky we're in America, we both can disagree on each others views without being rounded up and have to stand before the "man" and explain ourselves........At least for now and is why I will continue to air on the side of caution when it comes to government. lol
 HalftimeDad
Joined: 5/29/2005
Msg: 23
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 3/27/2012 2:25:59 PM

I'll begin with this section: " Sec. 201. Priorities and Allocations Authorities. (a) The authority of the President conferred by section 101 of the Act, 50 U.S.C. App. 2071, to require acceptance and priority performance of contracts or orders (other than contracts of employment) to promote the national defense over performance of any other contracts or orders, and to allocate materials, services, and facilities as deemed necessary or appropriate to promote the national defense, is delegated to the following agency heads:" The words "to require acceptance" is used very loosely here......who, what, when where and why came immediately to mind when I read it. The words "or appropriate" is the big flag here.......depending on the context, it could mean; 3. to take to or for oneself, take possession 4. to take without permission; expropriate. This is according to the college addition of the Webster's dictionary.

"(c) Each resource department shall act, as necessary and appropriate, upon requests for special priorities assistance, as defined by section 801(l) of this order, in a time frame consistent with the urgency of the need at hand. In situations where there are competing program requirements for limited resources, the resource department shall consult with the Secretary who made the required determination under section 202 of this order. Such Secretary shall coordinate with and identify for the resource department which program requirements to prioritize on the basis of operational urgency. In situations involving more than one Secretary making such a required determination under section 202 of this order, the Secretaries shall coordinate with and identify for the resource department which program requirements should receive priority on the basis of operational urgency."..... again the words "and appropriate" are used. Then it refers us to "section 801(l). " Special priorities assistance" means action by resource departments to assist with expediting deliveries, placing rated orders, locating suppliers, resolving production or delivery conflicts between various rated orders, addressing problems that arise in the fulfillment of a rated order or other action authorized by a delegated agency, and determining the validity of rated orders."...................my question here is what actions will the department heads take if the words "and appropriate means "to take".......

This one should raise a flag for you? "Sec. 502. Consultants. The head of each agency otherwise delegated functions under this order is delegated the authority of the President under sections 710(b) and (c) of the Act, 50 U.S.C. App. 2160(b), (c), to employ persons of outstanding experience and ability without compensation and to employ experts, consultants, or organizations. The authority delegated by this section may not be redelegated."............ the words "to employ" doesn't always mean you get a paycheck and it clearly states in this section, "to employ persons of outstanding experience and ability without compensation". This alone should raise huge question like "are you enslaving me for nat'l security''................. Balasamic, this is just part of what erks me about the x-order, it really does go far deeper than a play on words. One question I have is; "why would this order need to be in place during non-emergency conditions"???? In my view, it may have to do with control because this x-order encompasses every aspect of the American way of life.

But this is exactly what was done in WW2. Everything you're concerned about has already happened. In a time of war, priority of resources and production go to the war effort.

That was my initial reaction to this: there's nothing here that is new.
 NotGorshkovAgain
Joined: 4/29/2009
Msg: 24
view profile
History
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 3/28/2012 12:28:53 AM
"Conspiracy Theory"? REALLY?

Maybe it's just me, but to my mind, conspiracies are usually secret and in the shadows, so nobody knows they exist - that's what MAKES them conspiracies.

Hard to have a conspiracy when you publish things in public before you have at it.
 DameWrite
Joined: 2/27/2010
Msg: 25
view profile
History
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 4/1/2012 5:46:00 PM
Having fun mocking again Proco?
BTW I'm quite aware that earthquakes happen all the time. What is different is that the media is using earthquake warnings as a scare tactic to get people to willing participate in the round up exercises.
Back to topic...
I find it amazing that anyone would think this no different.
This is supposedly peacetime, right? Not.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 26
Conspiracy theory?
Posted: 1/10/2018 7:59:29 AM
Just heard one..


Obama required us to get the new light bulbs because you can use LEDs to record and this was demonstrated at the recent tech show.

Anyone else heard any good ones lately?
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