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 grove_22
Joined: 1/30/2012
Msg: 10
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for mePage 3 of 4    (1, 2, 3, 4)
Pick better, OP!


It's not always possible to determine that someone will be a flake ahead of time. As for the possible reasons why someone would literally cancel a date at the last minute. Better plans ( from their perspective ) came up. They got cold feet. There was an actual emergency ( although I think that is rare ) etc.
 grove_22
Joined: 1/30/2012
Msg: 15
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 2:39:12 PM

Weird how for some, this seems to be a chronic problem!

Others ... Not so much!


Are people suppose to have a crystal ball and predict ahead of time who flake out at the last moment? LOL.
 grove_22
Joined: 1/30/2012
Msg: 18
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 2:52:02 PM

No. Men are supposed to have the sense to pursue women with whom they have a realistic chance of getting a first meet. Set up firm plans and have something interesting enough about their character, personality, conversation/ communication skills to make a woman LOOK FORWARD to meeting them.


According to your logic, if a woman cancels a date, it must have been something that the man did or said that turned her off. That's not always true. People often cancel dates for reasons that have nothing to do with the other person. They get cold feet, they are married or in a relationship, they are not completely over an ex, they were dishonest about something etc. This is not a gender specific or women bashing issue. There are men who flake out on women as well.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 20
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 2:53:56 PM
I agree with Import and Deacon here. I believe that people tend to prioritize what they know they want. Until they meet you they have no bonding/investment to respond to. Some are afraid to take the next step, some won't unless/until it's effortless; some people have no one in their lives and therefore their schedules are meant to stay busy enough not to have time to realize they are single. This is sort of counter productive when they do meet someone, so they have to then readjust. There are a number of reasons to just say "meh" and move on, and only a couple reasons to actually carry out plans.

The only thing you can do is try to make it as convenient for both sides as possible, and never bank on the other person in order to go anywhere. Go somewhere you'd go anyway without company and tell them they are welcome to join, that way them not showing or canceling won't affect your schedule.
 neck romancer
Joined: 9/7/2006
Msg: 21
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The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 2:59:41 PM
From my perspective I feel your a bit harsh to drop them so quickly.. not to say its not possible they were jerking you around.. but there is a chance those things did happen to them. Even if they were jerking you around whats the harm in allowing them to pursue you?
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 22
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 3:44:44 PM

Among the women that I talk to and actually set a time to meet; I might actually meet 30%

That is pretty high % of bails AFTER they agreed to meet at a specific time/place. I would say the highest "norm" % would be about 25% DON'T meet, and about 75% of that not being legit excuses. In the end, I think it depends on how things flowed between you and the girl, and during the agreeing-to-meet process. For instance, if I were to write a gal who's not that talkative back but responsive, so I throw out the proposition to meet, she agrees, and I set a date/time/place and she agrees, all with minimal communication relayed, I would assume there's a decent shot she's not going to be oh-so keen on meeting up when that day/time is closing in.

So I could see those types of situations being around 1-out-of-3 making it. I think in those cases as I described above, the idea sounds fine at the time, but they're whimsical and not taking everything seriously... then they bail. If you end up having fruitful conversation with a woman back and forth several times, and she seems genuinely interested to meet, agrees and all, then I would have to say you should be getting less than 30% bails, instead of 30% shows.
 _TALL_IQ2_
Joined: 2/10/2010
Msg: 24
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 3:56:58 PM
Others ... Not so much!
Yeah, the day I wake up owning a vagina and can dictate these things I'll keep that in mind.


you can typically tell which ones have a high flake chance, but sometimes you get surprised

What makes you *certain* that the person you were chatting with actually had one?


IF you haven't set eyes on them, just electronic chat, know that there ARE many fakes online..
Teens, HS kids, children with too much free time, some men pretending for juvenile lols, and some actual women who are NOTHING like they claim in the profiles, so they would *never* actually show up at a RL meet with anyone...
 Ortin
Joined: 9/15/2011
Msg: 27
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The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 4:18:10 PM
I'm with neck romancer McAwesomeName.

Do you normally assume that if the girl doesn't make the first date she's jerking you around? I mean, the fish example is ludicrous, but she did ask to reschedule and you had an obvious conversation piece to use on her. If nothing else you could probe her excuse for validity.

It looks to me like you're upset because they're responding to the situation the way they wanted to, rather than the way you wanted them to, and you're assuming a great deal about their intentions because of it.

If that's how you wish to operate, I can't really change that, but I see it as bad taste to complain about an assumption you've made about people you don't know.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 29
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 4:48:45 PM

I can't look at it this way. I'm going to put an effort in.. maybe it's a guy thing - the courting part of it for a guy. So nothing against you WIP. :)

No offense taken, and if you're the one who does show up, then it's a given you are the one putting effort in. Where you might be off is with expectations. Making plans dependent on others is a recipe for disappointment though.

I've never been stood up.. left waiting for somebody that never shows up. I usually text or call to let them know that I'm on my way. If I don't get a response, I don't go.

I wouldn't go anywhere that I'd cancel if the other person canceled. That's what I'm saying - if it's absolutely dependent on them being present, and I don't know them very well I'd rather not make plans in the first place. I have three times, but to be fair - twice was by the same guy and someone I ended up more friends with than anything, and the other was someone I met once and was more interested in the place we made plans to grab food than I was in him, so I might have been kind of OK with him not showing - I enjoyed the meal.

This is supposed to be a two way street, right from the beginning at least for me. If she doesn't put in a reciprocated effort, then I'm gone.

No one's telling you to bother with someone who cancels or doesn't show - I'm just saying, don't have what they do ruin your plans.

Sorry, but canceling just before a meet up without having a real emergency at hand is a deal breaker for me. And who cares really? Neither of us have invested much of anything as we've never actually met. I have other options and she obviously has other options. I'm interested in meeting women that are willing to and want to put an effort into a relationship. Bottom line.

I agree with you except for the relationship part - on a first meet it's too soon to be thinking about all that. Willing to put an effort into getting to know someone, maybe. I always say it's easier when someone cancels than does a no show...but in the end if you don't plan around them, it won't cause you any stress if they don't follow through.

And I'm not going to "cope" with this sort of behavior and attitude from a woman. Not gonna happen on my street. Good luck! Carpe Diem in your own way.. I'm gone. ha HA! :p

Of course you should write someone off who does this, unless there is a legitimate excuse and decent notice.
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 32
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 5:28:35 PM

Yeah, the day I wake up owning a vagina and can dictate these things I'll keep that in mind.


Ya know, I felt some sympathy with you until you posted this, but it quickly evaporated.

This supercilious statement allows a peek into your misogynistic streak. IF I were to judge all men by the ones who treated me badly, I would have become celibate a long time ago. Men are every bit as flaky as are women; I have met men for coffee who asked several times when we could meet again and when I couldn't give them a time, Poof! Never heard from them again.

If the flakiness has become unbearable, then stop dating. Problem solved. No one is forcing you.


Maybe I should already know this but why would men pretend to be women?


On POF, I have had only one email from a man pretending to be a woman (that I know of) but when I used to go into Yayhoo chat rooms, it happened all the time. Some men think that all women are secretly or overtly bi and that they will cybersex with another woman when they will not do so with a man. I have seen men dress up in women's clothes, complete with wig.
 Ortin
Joined: 9/15/2011
Msg: 34
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The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 6:26:27 PM
Experience has taught me that no response is a response.


They did respond. But because they did so after the arbitrary deadline you've decided all of humanity must adhere to you have declared them to be playing with your heart.


I get mad because she wasted my time.


This is not an unreasonable reaction and I'm not begrudging the hurt feelings you have.


Why do people schedule things that they have no real intention of attending?


But this is some garbage you made up to make yourself feel righteously indignant. You didn't bother to gather more information about her intentions. As soon as your schedule was inconvenienced by events out of her control you've declared her dead to you.

That's what I have problems with. If you want to streamline your dating experience by cutting out the people who tend to be unreliable with first dates that's your prerogative. But don't assume the worst of them and bring those assumptions to a public forum, complaining that you are the sole good person in the world and everyone who doesn't meet your expectations is a flake.
 Ortin
Joined: 9/15/2011
Msg: 36
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The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 7:18:48 PM
Um...I'm just reading from your initial post, and the example there shows that you asked for confirmation before the date and she responded that she couldn't make it.

I mean, if you're getting flat out stood up then I have no argument. But I'm reading that they're contacting you to apologize (with arguable sincerity) and trying to make alternate arrangements.

Is that wrong?
 Ortin
Joined: 9/15/2011
Msg: 38
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The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/15/2012 7:49:52 PM
Okay, I didn't realize you were referring to an incident where she called after she missed the date. I'm sorry for jumping to angry conclusions.

Just out of curiosity though, were you going to attend Strawberry Fest together? If you weren't that's definitely more problematic, because there she is attending a big event when she should have been meeting you.

I would probably try to be more sympathetic towards her than you were, but it's not like you're reacting inappropriately, and I'm sorry for suggesting you were.
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 42
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/16/2012 8:10:17 AM

And my statement holds true. Women have a dynamically superior chance at a guaranteed date than do men.


And according to your statement, women only have this "superior" chance because they have vaginas. Their brains and personality have NOTHING to do with their chances. This not only demeans women, but it demeans men, as well--is a vagina all you seek in a woman?


So, they are flakey for moving on when you wouldn't give them another date? I'm confused by this.


When I say, "I'll have to let you know," or "We can have coffee again but the most we will be is friends and not lovers" and I NEVER hear from them again, yes, this is flaky. It lets me know that THOSE men are looking for a vagina, and not interested in getting to know who I am. They could reply with an "I understand, but I am seeking a relationship, not a friendship," but zip is flakiness.

Men have also contacted me then disappeared (there is a forum open on this topic). Weeks or months later, I have heard from some again. They were talking to two or three women at once and decided to date one of the others. Fine, but why not let me know? And then to come back? Flaky.

Or how about the man who hounded me for almost a year to meet him? When I finally acquiesced, he didn't show up! He never offered an explanation, but months later when I mentioned on my profile that I was moving, he contacted me and said he would be happy to help me move. Flaky, you think?

By the way, I have known women who have been contacted by very few men. Being female does not guarantee a date.
 femaleconnection
Joined: 8/12/2010
Msg: 45
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/16/2012 9:23:19 AM
I have also had men say they will be somewhere and not show up. Good thing I was going there anyways and it was no skin off my nose. I still did my thing and had my fun.

I personally changed my ways after the first few meets. Because the way I started off wasnt working for me.

Now, I use a webcam to 'see' the person Ive been exchanging emails with, and I set up meets doing stuff I was already going to do. It helps me in many ways. For example, I try to meet and date fellow dog lovers...as I am one myself. Setting up coffee dates in a dog park is safe, public, gets me fresh air, gets my dog fresh air, and if the man shows up I can see if he is an idiotic dog owner, or an owner I can respect. All in the time it takes to have a coffee. If he doesnt show up, Im there doing my thing anyways...no loss to me.

I have had men promise to be there and not show up. I just block/delete all contact and move on.

The last man I met this way, is still dating me. We shall see how things transpire...but if I were fishing again, Id do it that way again.

Ive had men chastise me for setting up meets to do things I was already going to do...but to my way of thinking, until you meet someone, you shouldnt buy into anything they tell you, including a promise to appear. So Id continue setting up meets this way. Once we meet, and I can sense he will show up to something else planned, Im more than willing to make plans to do something I wasnt planning on doing anyways...but until we meet in person, Im not going to go too far out of my way as we are all strangers until we meet in person.

Op, being a female doesnt exclude us from the same issues men face, the only difference is in most cases you are the one setting up the plan...but make no mistake, men set up plans to meet all the time, and they flake as well. The reality is that online sites are chalk full of people who really shouldnt be here.
 Gwendolyn2010
Joined: 1/22/2006
Msg: 49
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/16/2012 4:22:02 PM

Yes, they were looking for a relationship involving sex. You've busted me because I too will "flake" when the woman doesn't want a relationship.


My definition of "flakiness" was stated as a man not bothering to say, "Sorry, not interested" but bails without a word.

If that is you, then why are complaining about women being flaky???


This should just be an understood undercurrent to every single instance of meeting someone on an online dating site.


And how do you know that those "flaky" women didn't believe that their actions were the result of "understood undercurrents"? THEY owe YOU an explanation but apparently, YOU do not owe OTHERS an explanation.

Uh-huh.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 55
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/17/2012 1:35:24 PM

Now, I use a webcam to 'see' the person Ive been exchanging emails with, and I set up meets doing stuff I was already going to do. It helps me in many ways. For example, I try to meet and date fellow dog lovers...as I am one myself. Setting up coffee dates in a dog park is safe, public, gets me fresh air, gets my dog fresh air, and if the man shows up I can see if he is an idiotic dog owner, or an owner I can respect. All in the time it takes to have a coffee. If he doesnt show up, Im there doing my thing anyways...no loss to me.

Ive had men chastise me for setting up meets to do things I was already going to do...but to my way of thinking, until you meet someone, you shouldnt buy into anything they tell you, including a promise to appear. So Id continue setting up meets this way. Once we meet, and I can sense he will show up to something else planned, Im more than willing to make plans to do something I wasnt planning on doing anyways...but until we meet in person, Im not going to go too far out of my way as we are all strangers until we meet in person.

Femaleconnection....sigh. You make me proud. : )
 DeadPoetScience
Joined: 2/8/2011
Msg: 57
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/17/2012 2:39:34 PM
OP, your main problem is you are using POF. This site sucks, period. I haven't gone more than a month without getting _laid_ from another certain free dating site (and almost twice as many dates than that) in exactly a year (it started on my birthday last year, and today's my birthday!), but I haven't gotten a single date from POF in 2 years come June. Women on here are mostly flakes, and from what I've heard so are the men. You're better off using your energy on a different site, or do something completely different like lunch speed-dating or a Meetup.com group, etc.
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 58
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/17/2012 2:47:42 PM

Agreed, but the flakes have to be counted into the equation because they have the option to say no, but do not.

But my point is they (much of the time) DO want to -- at that time. It's not like they were chicken to say No. Much of the bails is because they weren't taking you/the conversation between you two seriously, and thus, weren't taking the meeting seriously enough, so when it came down to it ACTUALLY happening, THEN they said No (last minute). Usually brought on by "Oh sh!t, I didn't think about (this) or (that) or (the other guy)". Again, being whimsical, flakey, WHEN they said Yes. The thought of meeting you in their minds at that time was a legit Yes.

The high flake chance is when you may send them multiple sentences and they respond with abbreviated sentences, ie minimal communication. At first, you wonder if they're trying to be nice... but multiple times, they respond accordingly. They're not taking you/the situation too seriously, despite in-the-moment, legitly agreeing to it as far as they feel (in the moment).
 DeadPoetScience
Joined: 2/8/2011
Msg: 63
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/18/2012 12:34:49 PM
It may also help to not consider any of these meetings as dates. I look at them as practice. In the immortal words of Vince Lombardi, "Practice doesn't make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect." Every date I go on, I treat the date and the woman as if she were my absolute ideal woman, so that when I finally do go on those rare dates where I actually have some level of hope in something more developing with this woman, I am already in the mode to have a fun date with her and not be nervous or**** or whatever. The other thing is, if she turns out to be a flake, it's no big deal, because she was only practice anyway. *DING* Next please!
 djappatight
Joined: 12/6/2010
Msg: 64
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/19/2012 6:47:08 AM
It is a thin line between love and flake...

I'm a very understanding person so I give the benefit of the doubt when something goes "wrong" when trying to meet.

First time it's definitely possible that something last minute happened. Once for me the apartment complex installed a new toilet in my apartment and I tested it and it overflowed like 20 minutes before a meeting. I just turned off the toilet valve and still end up making the date.

Second time an agreed meeting time is set and something goes wrong then again it's possible something last minute happened. Nothing really on my end has ever happen to where I couldn't make the second meeting but it's possible. So I'm understanding and say well try again...

Third time if something goes "wrong" then it is definitely an ongoing trend and a BIG sign of a flake. At that point, then I stop trying and tell her well since things just aren't working in your favor for us meeting then I'm going to let you decide when we should try to meet. I leave her alone at that point and if she comes up with a definite time then cool I'll be there. That then shows that something might have really happened and she's really interested.

If she sets a time for us to meet and a raincheck is needed again... then it's quite obvious that she is a flake and I will straight up tell as polite as I can that obvious it's not meant for us to meet so no need to try a let's just lose each other's number. This has happened to me and the funny thing was her headline was... "Please, I have no time for games!" LOL, really?

I feel you OP but this doesn't happen very often, as it sounds in your case that it happens pretty often. Only thing I can say is look for the signs early and just weed 'em out as soon as possible.
 VacationGuy234
Joined: 8/1/2008
Msg: 65
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/19/2012 7:13:34 AM
I do not see anything in your post that tells me you will accommodate someone if plans have to change. Why would someone wish to go out with a person who is inflexible. Yes, there is a limit, but people should be given at least one chance. Most of the time, women are just testing you to see how you will react and, based on your text, "Me: *nothing ever again*" you would and I'm sure have failed this test.

So, which is it, you, "don't get upset" or you, "get mad she wasted your time"? Obviously, you haven't mastered the rejection.

Write this on the back of you hand: "She doesn't even know me yet".
 djappatight
Joined: 12/6/2010
Msg: 66
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/19/2012 7:13:49 AM

My definition of "flakiness" was stated as a man not bothering to say, "Sorry, not interested" but bails without a word.

If that is you, then why are complaining about women being flaky???


That sure as hell isn't my definition of flakiness. Flakiness is when both parties definitely confirm something and one of the other bails out. In your case, it didn't sound like you were flaked. They just wasn't interested and didn't have the balls to tell you.


I've had the same thing happen..had a pleasant date with a guy, then we set up a day the next weekend to get together. When I called him in the morning to finalize/set things up that day, I didn't hear back from him until I left a message for him at 6pm concerned about what had happened. He tells me he spent the day helping his dad clean out the garage and accidentally left his cel phone at home, so he couldn't call me.

I recall him telling me he lives 4 blocks from his dad..so, it would have taken like 5 minutes for him to run home and get his communication device.


That is more of an example of being flakey. Both parties confirmed and plus she tried numerous times to update. If I knew I made a date with someone and I left my phone 4 blocks away... I'm going to back to get the phone in case something happens. So in my opinion that was being flakey. No excuse there...
 VacationGuy234
Joined: 8/1/2008
Msg: 70
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 4/23/2012 4:59:25 AM
I was going to reply to the other post, but, honestly, this is the best on on the thread:


yes this sucks but happens, just a nasty fact of life


If you don't understand that the above is a fact of life, you are really just trying to live a fantasy.
 WomanInProgress
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 76
The flakey-ness has almost become unbearable for me
Posted: 3/18/2013 5:53:47 PM
^^^^Exactly. Some who stands you up is disrespectful - but someone who cancels isn't doing anything wrong - in fact, they are saving you some time, money, gas, and you can then make other plans. It's far better to be canceled on than stood up.

Someone who has a habit of consistently canceling or changing plans over time is flaky. I agree that in THAT case, there's no reason to continue entertaining it. Still, if you don't know them well - you're not really involved enough to lose a lot of sleep over it. *shrug*
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