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 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 33
god .... its all in your head say scientists Page 4 of 11    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11)
Once again, the god you're speaking of (and discrediting) isn't the idea of god that I would imagine - if I believed god existed.

You keep bringing this back to religion... a man made concept. This is a discussion about god being in our minds, or at least is was meant to be. I don't believe that God and religion have to be linked.

So where are you getting YOUR 'idea" of "god"/Cosmic Architect from...?
You keep repeating that there is only one, which implies that this is somehow 'cultural', on the basis that if you'd been in India, or somewhere, you'd be speaking of gods in the plural.
Would you have imagined there was "a god", if you'd had no knowledge of one.?
Is there any actual evidence..?

The big, bearded man in the sky, answering prayers and judging how we've lived.... That is NOT my idea of what god would be like

If I was this being and just didn't give a monkeys about what I had created, beyond making sure it should work, then I wouldn't want people to be aware of me. I wouldn't care how they lived their lives or what they believed, but I would give them a base to start from and then leave it up to them.

But that contradicts what you said earlier, about eradicating all evidence, aging the earth etc. which implies that he did care what they thought. You also say that you wouldn't want people to be aware again..?
If you existed, you could MAKE them think whatever you wanted, without them even being aware you'd done that.
You could remove the part of their brain, which enabled them to even consider the idea.

Edit: religion doesn't bother me... Most people I know who are religious, just have faith in god - some people may take their religion to extremes but, once again, I blame people for that and not the concept.

Most people who believe, are blissfully unaware of what's in the bible, and exactly what they are supporting.
I have no objections to many of the philosophies, and the 'fluffy', 'cherry-picking' versions of religions, that most people have.
The reality is a huge multinational corporations, with billions in assets, who preach about helping the poor, whilst abusing children, and covering it up.
The reality is Israel/Palestine, where despite being three 'sects' worshiping the same "god", they still can't agree to share the 'holy sites'.

If someone wants to believe, cool beans... If it comforts you, then that's marvellous. Just don't preach what I should believe.

Exactly the same goes for atheists. I don't want them preaching at me either.

I don't give a flying fook what people believe.
I object to religions because:
1/. It's all not true, and I believe the truth is always best.
2/. Because of what they DO: Anti homosexuality, anti-abortion, anti-stem-cell-research, Israel, Afghanistan, 9/11, 7/7, etc etc.
Look at the views of the "Tea Party" in the USA. They're little better than Al Quaeda. Patriarchal, misogynist nonsense.

I object to religions because of religious wars, like the one in the former Jugoslavia, where "Orthodox" catholic priests, whipped the population into a frenzy, about "muslims defiling sacred ground".

If you're just not seeing these things, or have no objections, I find that odd.
I'm not making anything up.

I object to religions because it's not just a harmless 'comfort', or an esoteric, philosophical debate, about the existence of a "super-being'.
It's a whole bunch of inflexible, non-negotiable 'rules', including death for disobedience, dissent, or deviation.

Read up on the history of Israel, since about 1880, when the idea of "zionism" was first conceived.
And read how that came about, from the beginning of the last century, through 1948, to the present.
Their justification, a belief in "god", and the biblical stories.
They believe that "god" gave them the land, about 2,000 years before, so they bulldozed villages, and slaughtered people, and we, the "christians" helped them.
The "holy land" is the epicenter of belief in god, and all the harm that it does.

 badge73
Joined: 1/17/2009
Msg: 34
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History
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 4/30/2012 4:26:27 PM
The amount of irony from most of the posts is quite outstanding, as ever most missed the point of religion being in the brain ... but wonder how many have got off their heads on drink or drugs and believed on the experience?

lets stress again if your kin heard voices in their head would you say it's god?

the question of religion is quite odd as believe Mary was a very young girl ... yet if a bloke approached a girl of that age now, what would happen?
 try1more
Joined: 12/16/2007
Msg: 35
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History
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/1/2012 4:48:35 AM
"I have never claimed any intelligence,"

my first thought was, perhaps you should pop down the lost n found, you may get lucky :-)
but thats just my kind of humour :-)

you then went on "merely" thats a very casual way to suggest the religious lack intelligence innit! and how could that ever be construed as an insult?
after all you dont believe in insulting others do you ? :-)

" I merely pointed out that most scientists are atheists.
And that belief in "sky-daddies" correlates with lower intelligence, and atheism, with higher.
Which IS true."

however you also pointed out

"I'm a fckin atheist, I'm not autistic!"

which kind of negates what you said before, so maybe you can skip the lost n found :-)

if you feel insulted because i said both sides are nutters...tough!
anyone that claims their version is the truth, when it is in relation to something that can neither be proved nor disproved.
and is willing to fight their corner, to me has at least one screw rather loose.
and when each side is slinging would be facts and ad hominum mud at each other that can hardly be described as rational.
although in this case it's not at all a surprise!

anyone that claims to be either religious or an atheist, that simply cannot contemplate their being wrong, cannot discuss a what if you "are" wrong.
as far as i'm concerned has an equal measure of blind faith.
which is one of the reasons why i see atheism as just another religion.
it's nothing more or less than an inversion.
somewhat ironic that atheism couldn't exist without religion innit!

it's pretty tiring hearing how religion is responsible for wars and inhumanity, it's simply an excuse for the nature of some men/women.
it's on a par with blaming the way a girl is dressed (or not as the case may be :-) ) for why she got raped.

nothing more or less than trying to shift blame.

hello swanny, nice to know my humour is not completely lost on here :-)

as poor old lusipher keeps trying to point out god and religion are not the same thing.
religion was the precursor to laws, the laws of countries are based on the religion dominant in that country.
way back in the past, a religion would have been a positive thing to follow, as it supplied rules which would have created order in place of disorder, it would have woven in rules that were appropriate to that locality.
that is "one" of the problems we face now, those rules are not appropriate everywhere.

as for god, perhaps we could rename it nature.
nature maintains a balance of sorts, it does have it's work cut out though, as we have a habit of screwing up that balance.
many dont seem to understand evolution, on a forum a religious nut asked for proof of evolution, so i offered the flu virus, and asked for their proof of creation, i never got a reply :-)
at the human level it's no surprise there seems to be no evolving, medical intervention has put paid to that!
whether we like it or not, natural selection is a prerequisite of evolution!
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 36
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/1/2012 7:13:25 AM
Jo Van, I remember getting worked up about this as an adolescent...

You surprise me, it was a very long time ago.

surely you don't believe quoting stats is going to make a believer disbelieve...

Lots of people stop believing, for lots of different reasons. Fewer people believe now, than in the past.
We have more information.

You act as though religion makes people do bad things...

Like wearing the burka..?
Where do you think the idea of burying people, and 'stoning' them to death comes from..?

What's interesting is the intellectual superiority you feel entitled to (pro) claim as an atheist...

BS. I make no such "claims", show me where, or learn to read.

As silly as you think religious people are, there are many who find you equally foolish...

Show me where I said that..? And -Do I look bovvered..?

We tend to leave all that behind as we get into our twenties...

It's a pity you didn't also leave behind, the superstitious beliefs of bronze-age sheep-herders.

Are you a born-again atheist? Lol...

I've always been a thinker, I figured out it was all bollux, by the time I was 15.
How do you know you've chosen the right "god"..?

Msg 132 Dwight
Have you banged your head..?
Msg 136 Dwight
Evolution Theory is a made up story and cannot be proven beyond reasonable doubt and is so 1980s ,scientist have move on and are making up different stories ..

Evolution was a 'theory' in 1859. It has since been proved a fact.
Why not read more, and write less.
You seem completely ignorant of mankind's progress, I'm frankly surprised you've even GOT a computer!
Use it, to do some research. Scientists don't "make things up", they look for the truth, and evidence.
That's how Darwin came up with his theory, based on observation, measurements and evidence.
DNA evidence has provided the proof that he was correct.
msg 139 Lusipher

Both sides will say whatever it takes (and ignore what they don't like) in an effort to discredit the other view and it's beyond stupid - you're like football fans who spend more time hating their rivals, than they do appreciating their own team.

Whereas you appreciate neither team, and appear to "hate" them both.
What would that be, "beyond, beyond stupid..>?"
My "team" is science and facts, and I have a huge appreciation for both.
I haven't "discredited the other view", Galileo, Copernicus, Darwin and others, began to do that, ages ago.
Even the church has been forced to now concede, that the "creation" story is nothing but a myth.

msg 142 Audax
.......This is a meaningless statement.

For once, you're correct. It's true of every post you write!

Msg 144 Mr Goodman
If you believe in science then you must believe that there are answers out there to be discovered.
At present science has hit a brick wall looking for the Higgs/god particle. If they find it it would prove all modern theories correct and science would get a great boost forward......anti gravity travel, superconductors that function at room temperature leading to potentially easy planetary travel.

As I understand it, even if they don't succeed in detecting it, it doesn't 'destroy' the theory, and calculations which show that such a particle has to exist.
(Just as other calculations have revealed the existence of "Dark Matter"
They will still know how matter was formed.

And, as usual, their efforts are not directed at disproving religion, and it's myths, or "proving" the non-existence of "god".

Scientists view ancient texts, as just that.
They know full well, the "mindset" of the people who wrote them, and the context, and knowledge levels.

At the time Jesus is alleged to have been born an "astrologer" told King Herod that a new "king of the jews" was prophesized (sp?) and so Herod ordered all baby boys to be killed.
Bear in mind that the King would be one of the better educated individuals, as would the "astrologer".
If that's how stupid the top people were, imagine the levels of superstition, and general ignorance amongst the majority.
That's not being "disrespectful", that's being objective.
Msg 146: Try1more

my first thought was,

Congratulations! Not before time! (sorry, just my "humour". )

which kind of negates what you said before,

How..?

if you feel insulted because i said both sides are nutters...tough!
anyone that claims their version is the truth, when it is in relation to something that can neither be proved nor disproved. and is willing to fight their corner, to me has at least one screw rather loose.
and when each side is slinging would be facts and ad hominum mud at each other that can hardly be described as rational.

And yet here you are, doing exactly the same thing I am, fighting your own ( =and obviously the "only correct stance") 'corner', and slinging ad hominems. Have YOU got a screw loose..?

If you don't like it, don't read it. There's no need for insults. Do it again, and I will report. K?
If you can't argue your case, without insults, you should stay out of the debate.

which is one of the reasons why i see atheism as just another religion.
it's nothing more or less than an inversion.
somewhat ironic that atheism couldn't exist without religion innit!

The only irony is that you don't understand the meaning of the word atheist.
Of course it can exist without religion!
There are lots of things I don't do, I would still be a "non-doer" of those things, regardless of whether anyone else was doing them, or not. Eg. Stamp collecting, horse riding, slinging insults, etc
An atheist is someone who doesn't believe in something.

it's pretty tiring hearing how religion is responsible for wars and inhumanity,

I'm sure you find a lot of things pretty tiring, but as I said, hearing (or reading, to be more accurate) about it, isn't compulsory.
Just thought I'd bring that to your attention, as both you and swannie seem to be unaware of that.
"Doctor, it hurts when I bang my head"....?
"Tough" indeed"
I'll carry on, whether you like it, or not.

it's simply an excuse for the nature of some men/women.
it's on a par with blaming the way a girl is dressed (or not as the case may be :-) ) for why she got raped.
nothing more or less than trying to shift blame.

Sh1t analogy, it's nothing like that.
I blame the people, not the religion, but they blame the religion, they say it's what "god wants".
So I try to show them that all the religious books are bollux.
If it makes you" tired", don't read it,
have a nap.


The global assets of religions, could wipe out poverty, world wide, or solve the current debt crisis, easily.
The "Greek Orthodox catholic" church has more in assets than the Greek Debt.
The catholic church (Roman) has assets of over £300 Billion, most of it 'hidden' behind holding companies, and 'nominees'.
Instead, they provide priests with free accommodation, and invest for their pensions.
It's total hypocrisy, and a scam.

They should be made to comply with the same laws as everyone else.
1/. Delete all of the "hate speech" and incitements to commit crimes of violence, on women, 'non-believers', gays, etc from their books.
2/. Substantiate their lurid claims, or withdraw them.

I fully understand why people believe, life is difficult, and scary.

But I don't like the way religions 'target' the weak, the damaged, and the vulnerable.
They do that, when people are at their lowest ebb, and exploit that, in much the same way other charlatans, like "psychics" do. "Leave the church your money, and you'll go to heaven"

They are selling a product, as factual, which in reality can't be shown to exist.
That's a breach of Trading Standards.

Edit:
Msg 148 Indigo

I agree that some of us Greeks do have a few assets though :-))

We've only got your word for that...
A picture speaks a thousand words...
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 37
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/1/2012 9:26:25 AM

Wow! Jo Van, that message must have taken you all morning

About an hour!


But anyway, if the ultimate pursuit of scientific knowledge is to know all that is knowable then if the human species got to a point where it DID knew all that is knowable, wouldn't that give us the ability to 'create' our a universe? And, by every definition become a GOD?

By the reasoning of the people who invented the current crop, we already are, as I pointed out earlier in the thread.
Stands to reason, only gods can fly....

But I agree, although we may never know everything. Every time we think we've got it 'sussed', we discover something new, like dark matter, dark energy, dark flow, etc.

I believe it's our natural curiosity, which sets us apart.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 38
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/1/2012 4:05:57 PM
That's all I have to say about this subject.

Thank fvck for that!

Now I know why you didn;t answer me, when I asked you ages ago, (very politely) if that's where you're advocacy of TIH relationships had their origins.
And yet you're against the burka..?

Charity, read what people believed 50 years ago, when we still had apartheid colonies, read what was believed 100, 150, 200 years ago.
And then ask yourself how much they knew, about anything, 2,000 years ago.
It's primitive superstition.
All in your head.


 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 39
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/2/2012 8:40:17 AM

Hitler was the greatest thing ever. The secular potential savior

Point of order here (Although slightly off-topic)

Brian, Hitler wasn't "secular".

He was a cvnt. [Med. Term]

(Excuse my language please ladies)

I'm no fan of the "jews", nor the "muslims", nor the "christians", I believe all religions to be mistaken.
But I don't think all believer are "idiots", or even intellectually 'inferior' in some way.

The notion of "god" has been in our collective psyche, for so long, that some people have problems imagining a world without it. That's really all they lack, -imagination.

I think there may turn out to be some sort of "one-ness" about us all.. Indeed, about everything.
It may all be connected.
But it will be explained by quantum physics, cosmology, and astrophysics.
(Please note: I make no claims to understand all of it, but I am aware , and interested in their findings.)
They know HOW and When Matter was formed,
and it wasn't "god".

(I may never understand all of it, but I do understand how we make the electrons 'dance', in the controlled way, which facilitates this post.)

If god existed, it WOULD be self-evident, despite Lusipher's alleged (but interesting) notion of celestial 'hide and seek'.

If any god existed, he wouldn't have restricted his communications, to just a few drug-crazed, bearded soothsayers in the middle east, India, or Greece, some 2,000 years ago.
And there wouldn't be different gods, in India, China, Papua New Guinea, or Norwich.

I wouldn't need books, or priests to inform me of "god's" existence.

Until he/she/it simultaneously informs us all, , in clear and unambiguous terms,
it will remain nothing more than a varying bunch of cultural myths,
perpetuated by those with a vested interest in doing so.
The only people who benefit from this belief, are the priests.
God is still an abstract concept.

The morality of all religions, seems to be "Do unto others, before they do it unto you".
Wherever "christians" have spread "the word of god", they did so, to a captive audience, literally.
Wherever they spread the "message of love" which Charity views through such rose-tinted glasses, they did so by force. As did the Romans, when they brought it here, and elsewhere.

Our morality is under our own control, and 'judged' only by others, in this life.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 40
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/2/2012 9:45:47 AM
I'll give it a go mate!

From what I know, and what I've read about it, my guess is that it was a massive "Black hole", which sucked in all matter, until it became so incredibly dense and massive (in the 'mass' sense of the word) that it reached some "critical mass", in much the same way, that nuclear explosions do.
And then it "popped", spewing everything (literally) back out again.
My guess is that this cycle repeats.
The universe expands, until gravity begins to slow that down, and eventually reverse it, all collapsing back into a "singularity" again.

I think I've seen similar opinions from much cleverer people.
It's definitely happened once, so far, anyway!



Edit: VVV
I understand what you're saying Marco, but we could just be too early on, in the cycle.
It might take another 20 billion years...
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 41
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/2/2012 2:13:26 PM
Before you post any more long diatribes, maybe you should do some reseach instead of simply posting dogma and adolescent ramblings.

At least my "adolescent ramblings are my own.

Yours are just plagiarism, mostly copied from wiki, but unattributed as such.
That's actually a forum offence.


Audax wrote:

Einstein believed in Spinoza's God, who reveals himself in the harmony of existence, not one who concerns himself with the fate and actions of humans.


wiki wrote

On 24 April 1929, Einstein cabled Rabbi Herbert S. Goldstein in German: "I believe in Spinoza's God, who reveals himself in the harmony of all that exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fate and the doings of mankind."[11]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Albert_Einstein

All I have to do is copy your sentences into google search, and it tells me exactly where you stole them from.
But nice try....


Edit:
^^^

Below, before you wet yourself my quote simplifies simpflies Rabbi Goldsteins 1929 quote, rather then plagiarises.

It's actually Einstein's quote, Einstein. But I'm sure you really knew that, otherwise you'd really look silly!

But if you wish I can refer you to other hermeneutic texts where there are other quotes.

I do "wish", yes please, do that.

I also "wish" you'd finally figure out how to use the quotes function.
Is that beyond you..?


VVV
Thankyou for the advice, I wondered where I was going wrong. I will never again compare the bible to a work of fiction, wtf was I thinking?

The bible IS a work of fiction!
HTH
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 42
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/2/2012 3:43:09 PM
I know i don't know...

We don't know, no-one does.

But we don't even know what Dark matter is yet, but we "know" it accounts for about 80% (?) of the mass of the universe. It seems there's no such thing as "empty space".
When they find out more about that, we may get closer.
I don't think we fully understand "time" properly, and I think that there are things "faster than light", we just don't know about them yet.

Lusipher: before the Big Bang, there was no time either (As I understand it), so technically, there was no "before".
It's hard to get your head around, (to me), but no harder than trying to imagine "light years" of distance, or 13.7 billion years ago in time. That's why people think of it as "infinite", it might as well be.
 Wafta
Joined: 9/9/2008
Msg: 43
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History
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/3/2012 2:13:04 AM
My son is planning on doing an Astrophysics degree when he's finished his A Levels, so I may have to ask his opinions on this when he's home. I have a headache!!

However, I do think neither option has all the facts, but one has "more" facts than the other and one is still being researched where the other is just accepted regardless. My brain tells me that one, therefore, is more likely to be truer than the other, hence me being Agnostic. I, like many others, am open minded and, should I ever be presented with facts to confirm the existence of a deity, my stance could possibly change.

I think people who believe "anything" without some factual evidence are weak minded or just idle minded, so I do put believers in that category.

What I object to is the usual "all non believers will go to Hell" speech that I often get thrown at me. Luckily, as a non believer, I don't believe in Hell so I guess it doesn't really matter!
 Wafta
Joined: 9/9/2008
Msg: 44
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History
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/3/2012 3:50:24 AM

You were not there,therefore anything you claim to have happen are just figment of your imaginations and just your belief .

I assume, in being fair and equal in this debate, that you include believers and non believers in that statement.
 ibakecakes
Joined: 11/27/2008
Msg: 45
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History
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/3/2012 4:07:24 AM
I havent finished reading all of this thread yet but my opinion for what it's worth is that, if people gain comfort from believing in God or other Deity, then crack on. I was brought up in a fairly reigious church going family but my faith was swayed when my sister died of cancer aged 32......I just didn't get how, if there was an all seeing all powerful God, he would let a young vibrant woman, who had just given birth, die so young and yet let some of the most horrendous criminals walk amongst us..........that has never sat right with me.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 46
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/3/2012 5:57:55 AM
I think a belief in god, is simply a fear of our own mortality, which, if I'm ungenerous, can be viewed as a 'conceit'.
A belief that our 'self' is 'too important' to simply disappear from existence. A form of egotism. (IMO)

Over the four years it took my father to die, after his diagnosis, we had many conversations about it.
And in trying to help him come to terms with it, I actually helped myself more.
His mind remained pin-sharp, 'til the last day.
When my time comes, I know I'll face it with the same courage and dignity:
I'll go Kicking and screaming, and having to be held down too!
It's how it's "supposed" to be.

We fear our death, because that fear keeps us alive !!
Our fear releases adrenaline, which gives us the additional strength and speed needed to extricate our selves from harm. The "fight or flight" response is instinctive, and automatic.
We have "evolved" it, because it's a beneficial trait, those who survived, bred, those who didn't, perished.
"Natural selection", Darwin was a fookin genius!!

Philosophically, I have 'come to terms' with my own mortality.
I know my Dad existed, and in a way, continues to exist, because I carry his genes, and my late mother's. If you like, their "spirits" are in me, in some senses of that word, I have some of their characteristics.
In turn, my sons have some of my "spirit". (Argumentative, and annoying! )

I prefer evolution, and natural selection, to "god, and creation", because it's a far more beautiful explanation, than anything written in the bible.
Things aren't static, as they supposed, back then. Things change.
The environment changes, and those living organisms which are 'best-suited' to survive, endure, and continue to evolve further. They've been doing that for a couple of Billion years on this planet.

The end result is Us.
Each of us is a survivor, from a long, long line of survivors.
Each of YOUR own human ancestors, survived lengthy migrations, floods, famines, earthquakes, meteor-strikes, the 'ice age', the attacks of carnivors, wars, disease, and disasters.

YOU are the end result, of a long line of champions!
Stretching back some 6 million years, to the time we separated from our Simian cousins, and the descendants of all successful iterations of life forms, which preceded that.
That's the truth, as we know it, so far.
That's much more of an achievement than the bible's version, that "god created you, in his image", just 8,000 years ago.
Be proud.
And congratulations, you're all winners!


 Pete2205
Joined: 3/18/2011
Msg: 47
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History
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/3/2012 10:25:12 AM
The downside being of course their life expectancy of 30 - 40 years ...I think I will be happy to be in my 80s-90s dribbling and living out my days in a warm home, being waited on hand an foot than I would being a Viking - Id have been dead maybe 20 years. Also I really dont care if I am thrown in a bin bag and buried with the rest of the rubbish - Its not as if I will know about it :)
 badge73
Joined: 1/17/2009
Msg: 48
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History
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/6/2012 10:18:32 AM
to bring it back into reality ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQS9g5BTZIc

would be quite interesting if some actually watch this and then say about god not being in the head .... or does he work in mysterious ways or gods will?
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 49
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/6/2012 10:42:47 AM
Owwww! father, why do you have to do that, it hurts...>?

<div class="quote">God is love and that is all any one of us needs to know...
Now bend over, and bite the pillow...
A line taken straight from the many catholic priests, who used it when buggering young children

Edit:
VVV

.I've said that Love is equal to Godliness...that is that love is an all encompassing universally felt emotion akin to what informs our humanity as human beings but a little more that than that....love is inspirational, love is what we feel in the very depth of our souls, love informs our spirit...love is God...love and God are our whole being.

I can assure you I'm perfectly capable of feeling love, without believing in "god", and millions of people around the world, all believing in different god or gods, or no gods at all, also do so.
It's all in your head.
Are you now the 'unholy trinity'...?


 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 50
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/6/2012 11:56:15 AM
I hate to burst your bubble, but there's an awful lot of stuff out there, which claims he's a dishonest liar.

Hardly surprising really, considering he's a ruthless self promoter.
There are thousands of social workers, who do similar work, helping people, entirely anonymously.
As usual, this man is a 'damaged' individual, a former gang member and a self-confessed drug dealer.
That will tell you more about his inherent personality, than any propaganda he now writes about himself.


Community leaders want his orphanage in Nimule—near the border with Uganda—to be shut down immediately, and for local ministries to take over.
In a September 2 letter to Childers, 14 local leaders—including the man who says he gave 40 acres of land to Childers to build the orphanage—wrote that Chiders has "dishonored our agreement" to take care of orphans, and that they demand "immediate closure of the compound." Childers told CT he never received that letter[..]snip[...]

But an officer in the SPLA denies any association with Childers, and has asked Childers to stop "staining our names." According to a letter obtained by CT dated April 8, 2011, Lieutenant General Obuto Mamur Mete told Childers that he had become "a problem," and urged him to stop "using the names of our authorities, me in particular, to manipulate your wrongdoings." Mete also told London's Daily Mail that Childers's "claims to have fought alongside us are a lie. He has never even seen the LRA." Childers disputes Mete's claims, saying that he has fought with the SPLA and against the LRA..

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2011/septemberweb-only/machinegunpreacher.html
 Wafta
Joined: 9/9/2008
Msg: 51
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god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/6/2012 12:02:15 PM

Believe in God or not.....believe in the Kony thing or not...say it's all in his head or not....This man lives his life to save kids

Assuming for a moment that he is as good as you say (I've never heard of him, so have no opinion), if he wasn't religious there are still believers who say that he will go to Hell!

It doesn't matter how good you live your life, if you don't believe in God when you die, you go to Hell. A murderer who repents goes to Heaven. Someone who's never done any harm to anyone in their entire life but doesn't believe, straight to Hell, do not pass Go, do not collect £200!!
 soverncomfort
Joined: 11/29/2011
Msg: 52
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/12/2012 3:32:02 AM
@Foxymoron ....well made point. I like to hink there is something out there to believe in. I was heavily involved with the church when I was younger but got disillusioned due to certain hypocrosy. However just because someone believes in god or likes to pray, etc it doesnot make them delusioned, stupid or mentally ill as some rather strange people have indicated in this thread. I also believe this whole science v religeon thing is crazy. Can the two not co-exist? Of course they can.

By the way, cant remember who said it but must make the point that believing in god or being in any way religeous does not mean that you go out with some hooded cloak and sacrifice women! Geeez.

I like a religeous debate but prefer that face to face. And there's too much to go through here in this thread.
 soverncomfort
Joined: 11/29/2011
Msg: 53
god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/12/2012 3:33:56 AM
Oh I think I ought to add that for those who don't know and really want to know the answer to the meaning of life, the universe & everything.

Well the answer is 42. This has been known for some time.
 Pete2205
Joined: 3/18/2011
Msg: 54
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god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/13/2012 11:02:16 AM
http://www.youramazingbrain.org/lovesex/sciencelove.htm

Thats one scientific view of love Lusipher :)

Message 243:

I agree all men die but not all live.

I have two fantastic daughters, three gorgeous grandkids. I have travelled the world and met and experienced many things. I have laughed, loved, cried and experienced most of the emotions known to man and hopefully when I DO end up in a nursing home incontinent and dripping saliva attended by care staff I will be able to look back over my life and be happy with how it has panned out. :)

IF there is a god then hopefully he will look after me when I shed this mortal coil and the fun will just get better!!!. If there isn't then its not as if I can complain about it anyway.

As once was said and, has been repeated many times......."The only sure thing in life is death and Taxes"
 gemini_lady_uk
Joined: 7/16/2008
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god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/13/2012 11:18:34 AM
Funny, I always did think god was in peoples heads/minds. He can't be seen, you can't touch him but people believe in him, believe in his existence and surely, if that is what helps them through life and death then there is nothing wrong with it. People's belief bring them together, they find support in each other. Some people become extremeists, as in any other way of life but for the majority it's simply a connection.

If I had to choose between god and science, I would go with science.

I don't put my faith in god, I am not a believer therefore I have nothing to fear nor rejoice in death. I won't spend my last days drooling in a nursing home, having nappies changed. I will choose when I have had enough.

I don't feel that I have lost out by not believing in god but would never knock those who do. It's all down to choice and opinion. At the end of the day, so long as you are happy with the choices you make, does it really matter who is right.
 Pete2205
Joined: 3/18/2011
Msg: 56
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god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/13/2012 11:34:59 AM
I am not saying that is how I would actually PREFER to end my days Gemini. Like most people I would like to pop off in my sleep when I have reached the end of a productive full ife and ideally before I lose touch with reality and dont recognise who is stood in front of me.

Having said that I dont think I am brave enough to choose someone like "Dignitas" or some other euthanasia clinic and decide that now is the time to die. Most of us will die at a time when we are either not aware we are about to or at a time when we would rather not.

BUt...I totally agree with you when you say " I don't feel that I have lost out by not believing in god but would never knock those who do. It's all down to choice and opinion. At the end of the day, so long as you are happy with the choices you make, does it really matter who is right. "
 gemini_lady_uk
Joined: 7/16/2008
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god .... its all in your head say scientists
Posted: 5/13/2012 12:06:56 PM
Pete, I didn't mean that to be specific to your comment, it's just one of the generalisations made regarding getting old. As much as I love my grandmother, I don't want to end up the way she is now.

I have my Living Will and have had since I was 35, as does my mother. We have contact details to ensure a dignified death, unfortunately it doesn't come cheap. You say you are not brave enough to make the decision, truth is, I'm not brave enough not to make sure I have that option. I would love to just drift off in my sleep, but if that isn't going to be the case, I want a dignified death in so far as is possible.

I don't plan on waiting until 'god' calls me or 'scientifically' my body just wears out bit by bit. I may have to make a decision earlier than I and my family would wish but that's the law at the moment.
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