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Show ALL Forums  > UK forums  > If you could choose what type of society to live in.....      Home login  
Joined: 4/23/2011
Msg: 1
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....Page 2 of 2    (1, 2)
scientific with all mod cons ...

religious and moral ...

dictatorial and you are the dictator... ?

simple ...?

bland but fair...?

one where 90% are very well off and 10% are poor but you were in the top 90%... ?

or ... your choice ? ...?

imagine... ?

so basically you have one wish... .. what would it be ?
Joined: 4/23/2011
Msg: 2
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/9/2012 5:00:10 PM
For me, just give me, a woman, a dog ( got to have a dog !! ), a thousand miles away from every bugger else, they can sort their own problems out hahahaha :O)
Joined: 4/23/2011
Msg: 3
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/9/2012 5:14:42 PM
On second thoughts, not having any luck in the woman deptartment !

make it two dogs instead , be company for each other hahahaha :O)

VVVV seclusion does indeed have its attractions kags :O)
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 4
If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/10/2012 10:39:34 AM
I'd like to see only the known, verified scientific truth taught, (as we know it so far) and an end to all the superstitious drivel, we've accumulated, and perpetuated, as if in some sort of twisted 'homage' to the past.

So I suppose my ideal society would involve starting 'from scratch'.
No "races", no "nationalities", no 'labels', no monarchs, no preconceptions, and definitely no religions.

A society which looks forwards, instead of clinging to the past.
History is interesting, but we shouldn't be so afraid to leave it behind us, and start doing things differently.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 5
If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/10/2012 2:00:00 PM

Am I being cynical??? prove me wrong JV, thats not me being funny either, I know there is thought behind what you say..

Interesting idea about history, although to leave it behind means possibly making the same or similar mistakes of the past?? Although looking with fresh unadulterated eyes at life and how you deal with things could be a point of view to try to take into account too..

A knowledge of History is essential IMO.
You can only begin to make sense of things now, if you have some understanding of how we came to be at this point.
Our languages, how we express ourselves, even how we think about things, has all been 'marinated', in history.
You have to look at the 'bigger picture' to hope to understand our societies, their traditions, customs and cultures, and begin to look at them objectively.

We carry far too much historical 'baggage' IMO, and they continue to be successfully 'sold' to a gullible, malleable public, by pushing their primitive tribal 'hotbuttons', like "loyalty", "patriotism", and "honour".
"Race", "Tribe", Nationality, religion etc., are all divisive constructs which serve no constructive purpose other than division.
It's not enough to simply be a part of the human race, you have to be further sub-divided into categories, and each steeped with their own propaganda about their own superiority.
We are persuaded to "belong" to groups, according to our places of birth, or our skin-tone.

You're fully entitled to believe yourself to be whatever you wish. This is the problem with the "race" argument. For centuries, certain "races" were declared to be "inferior". Now that we've got that old chestnut straightened out, people are ("justifiably") proud to declare themselves to belong to a particular "race".
Most "race" is self ascribed.

There are all sorts of 'romantic entitlements', and connotations, which come with such a self-declaration.
Like 0.5% of all of the males on the planet, I can claim to be a direct descendent of Genghis Khan. etc..
That's a very attractive prospect, for some people.

Personally, I find that sort of 'vicarious glory' to be just as laughable as feeling some vicarious shame for the slavery, barbarity, rape and murder, which all of our ancestors were surely involved in, at some point..?

We've all become used to the idea of "race", and all of it's history, to the point where it's difficult for (some) people to imagine living and thinking, without it.

We've only just (Historically speaking), stopped thinking in terms of 'clan'.
Movement between villages has become much easier, (For most) in the last 100 years or so.
Similarly, we've probably 'evolved' a mindset which protects 'our own', and extended families, "Kith and kin" etc
Words like loyalty, and patriotism are powerful, and emotive 'social drivers'.

"Race", Clan, Tribe, nationality, they're all invented 'artificial' constructs, created to accommodate ever-expanding empires.
Even if the notion of "race" hadn't been discredited by science, it would have eventually died a death, because it's a shit system.

I believe we "respect" our ancestors far more by dumping their stupid, ill-informed beliefs, than we do by perpetuating them, out of some misguided notion that we somehow "honour their memories" by doing so.

I think most people would wish for better lives for their offspring, than their forbears had to endure. I know I do.
We can only achieve that, if we change things.

People are frightened of stepping into the unknown, so the past becomes a 'security blanket' for them.
History is great, if it's a book.
It's not so good, if it's a huge ball and chain, which you're 'shackled' to, and have to drag with you, into the future.

We still live in a feudal monarchy, here, in the UK., with 70% of the land, in the hands of 1% of the population.
50% of the land hasn't changed hands for over 500 years, much of it has been in the hands of the same families, since 1066.

But somehow, great swathes of the population have been persuaded that all that history is a good thing, and should be "cherished". So they line the streets, waving their little flags, never once questioning the apparent lack of "austerity" of a guilded carriage, exiting a 700 roomed council-house. There is nothing logical about that.

All I'm doing, is 'joining the dots'. There is an inevitability about truth, it just takes some people, longer to see it.
Joined: 12/26/2009
Msg: 6
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/10/2012 3:08:59 PM
I'd live in a cave where the man went out to hunt and I clean the cave. A cave without spiders though or anything creepy. And wine must be involved. And man must cut off all pieces of fat off the meat.

A beach nearby would be a bonus.
Joined: 3/26/2011
Msg: 7
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/11/2012 11:15:57 AM
The 11+ is still going in my area too I'm pleased to say.
Joined: 4/23/2011
Msg: 8
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/12/2012 9:47:03 AM
I have noticed since joining the forums 2 or 3 months back, how often a light hearted thread ( such as this one) gets turned around, and becomes overly serious and heavy, jeez, if thats the sort of thread people want, then post one !, but let others have a laugh on a thread thats MEANT for people to have a laugh, some people need to lighten up a little i think :O)
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 9
If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 7/12/2012 10:46:23 AM
@ Pandora:
You're welcome.
Of course we should be selective about what we keep, and what we discard.
Religion is often referred to as the "source of our morality", but I feel sure that rules like not killing people, not raping, etc., had been agreed by consensus, in most societies, long before 8,000 years ago.
It's an obvious rule, if you want anything approaching a peaceful, and harmonious co-existence amongst relatively large groups of individuals.

And of course our "genetic love" for family members is a "natural instinct", something we've evolved, because it's beneficial.
In fact most of our morality has been evolved by consensus, in the same way, for the same reason.
The trick is to separate or suppress our "natural instincts" for violence and selfishness, from our agreed morality.
Our natural instincts fill history, with their conquests.

Our history was based on a "might is right" principle, and societies were patriarchal, for that reason.
The strongest individual in the household, was the head of the household, and he took what he wanted, by force.
the strongest individual in the village (or 'clan') became the chief.
The villages conquered, and absorbed other villages, the clans spread into nations.
The "natural love" for 'kith and kin' got exploited, and 'extrapolated' to cover the new territories.
Words like 'loyalty' suddenly had new meaning, people were expected to feel it, for however many people the new conquests absorb, within the newly expanded boundaries of the countries.
Words like "patriotism" were invented, and linked to notions of "honour".

This country, and most others, are built on conquests and violence, and exploitation, and empire building.

I think we should move on.
We've already accepted (most of us.. ) that just because men are bigger and stronger, they shouldn't dominate women by force, either within the home, or more generally.
Just because we can beat you in a fight, doesn't give our arguments any extra validity.

So now they've made spousal rape, a crime (1991) in this country, and many others, all quite recently.
I think this shows just how slowly societies change, but we still have a long way to go, before we completely shed all of our "natural instincts".
Government still routinely use institutionalised violence, to get their way.

There's probably been some research which shows the optimum size for a functioning "community".
I like the idea of "community". A recognition that we've become a very "specialist" society, but each contribution is equally important to the smooth working of the whole.
That's not to say we're all "equal". I'm not deluded! But we all have equal importance.

The word "meritocracy" has been soiled and devalued by people like Blair and Mandelson. IMO.
Ideas have merit, or not.
People will applaud good ideas, and the people who have them, but meritocracy has nothing to do with individual financial gain, or even 'social standing'. If the idea is beneficial, or viable, everyone benefits.

I think the current system leaves us all so suspicious, that people are reluctant to give of their best, or to try their hardest, because they're so used to people getting 'exploited', and think it's a 'mug's game'.

The problem with our current system ("capitalism") is that it encourages dishonesty, and deceit.
It's thought to be "clever" to do as little as possible, for as much as you can get.
The ultimate aspiration being, to do absolutely nothing at all, but to still be incredibly wealthy.
I think we all suffer, for that mistaken mentality.

My society would be still be competitive. That is a natural instinct we should keep.
 Soul Union
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 10
If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/11/2013 5:26:19 PM
One where the death penalty is bought [sic] back for crimes against children :D --- Maneatingtigress

Why only children? Don't adults have the right to justice, too?

In Singapore, where you can walk along mainstreet with your boobs hanging out and your skirt up your ass, as if you're trying to get raped, you will be left alone - guaranteed. But here in New Zealand, for example, it's odds-on that you will be raped, boobs, skirt ass or not. New Zealand, where I live, has twice the rape statistics of Uganda and 21 times the rape statistics of Canada. But the raping still goes on unchecked year after year.

If my daughter (33) was raped, I'd want the criminal to be hanged by the neck until he was dead. But that's not politically correct, is it? So it won't happen, not here in bureaucratic, let's-not-offend-the-criminals, can't-make-up-our-mind New Zealand ('Godzone,' as they call it, for some reason unbeknownst to me).

Oh yes, I believe in the death penalty for everyone, not just for crimes against children. I mean, aren't adults human beings, too?

That is not equality, not by a long chalk.

Best wishes
 Soul Union
Joined: 6/9/2007
Msg: 11
If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/11/2013 5:45:41 PM
People holding key positions in British society have tried to eradicate Englishness away from our generation and this is why we now have a generation of youth who feel totally disenfranchised out of mainstream society. The majority are now told that their existence, values and way of life is offensive to the minority and that the majority are far less important than the protected minority. --- day-trader

Ah, a purist, a man who speaks from his heart, fearlessly, without cowing to the evils of Marxist political correctness, who cuts to the chase and sees through the deception and what is really happening to British society and why it is in such disarray.

I salute you, sir. I applaud and congratulate you in no small measure. It is with a glad heart that I acknowledge your wise sentiments.

England has come a long way over the years, as these perceptive words by English playwright and poet William Shakespeare highlight with such genius and clarity:

This royal throne of kings, this sceptred isle,
This earth of majesty, this seat of Mars,
This other Eden, demi-paradise,
This fortress built by Nature for herself
Against infection and the hand of war,
This happy breed of men, this little world,
This precious stone set in the silver sea,
Which serves it in the office of a wall
Or as a moat defensive to a house,
Against the envy of less happier lands,--
This blessed plot, this earth, this realm, this England.

William Shakespeare
-- King Richard II [Act 2 scene 1]
Greatest English dramatist and poet
who ever walked the face of the earth.

And the 'envy of less happier lands' gathers pace.

Best wishes
Joined: 11/2/2011
Msg: 12
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/12/2013 2:26:04 AM

French food.

French women.

Joined: 4/23/2011
Msg: 13
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/13/2013 11:45:51 PM
^^^ "My wish would simply be a society where everyone treats each other how they themselves wish to be treated"

eerrmmm...whilst this thread was put up with some sense of humour...pleeease try to keep within the realms of realism hahahaha :O)
Joined: 11/2/2011
Msg: 14
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/14/2013 10:41:05 AM

I'd be happy in a World without X-factor and all it's sob stories.

I already live in that world.

It's free too of mind numbing Eastenders, Corrie, Emmerdale, Holby City, reality TV, how clean is the junk in your attic, would you want to date this carrot yellow fake boob bird, let's take the piss out of someone who can't dance but is famous, Jeremy Kyle and Jimmy Carr.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 15
If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/15/2013 1:33:01 PM

You've completely changed your tune,

No, no I haven't.

I thought you was an advocate of multiculturalism?!

That's because it's clear that you struggle to understand what I'm saying.
You probably also think I "stick-up for muslims", but actually, I think all religions are equally ridiculous, primitive superstitions, which have become "institutionalised".

"Culture" is everything we do, and it's always changing. Any social interactions between any two allegedly different cultures, will change both of them, new technology changes culture, science and new information changes culture.

The word "multicultural" is a misnomer IMO. We (and every other society) have always been "multicultural"
We absorb elements of culture (if we like them) and they become part of our culture.
"Christianity" is a "foreign religion", also 'imported' from the middle east.
More recently, tea, coffee, christmas trees, writing, potatoes, plumbing, firearms, mathematics, and reggae.
As well as many, many more. (Speaking of Moors, the Morris Dancers are thought to have originated there too!)

Now you are saying that everybody should be the same?

No. I'm really NOT.
We can't ever all be the same, we are each unique.
Not only genetically, but also in our life experiences, and the things which have 'shaped' our 'personalities'.

The beliefs in "tribe" and "race" rely on a certain amount of stereotyping, or "grouping" people together in some way, according to similar tastes perhaps, or shared languages or 'cultures', etc.
I believe these views to be a mistake.

A person's (often erroneous) self ascribed "race" or "tribe" or your, or others' opinion of that, based on what they might look like, really tells you nothing about them.

In a few more years, these facts will sink into the collective consciousness of societies, and people will think it really weird that we ever ascribed "races" to people, based largely on the shade of their skin.

In the same way that evolution has replaced "creation", in our accepted beliefs. (-In all, but the most obdurate of theists! )

Human cognition is biased and thus so is our views and thoughts, even if you took away race and religion we would just find something else to judge people on.

How about merit...? Just a thought....
There is a recognised phenomenon, called "Status Quo Bias" (not the group), which you, and a large proportion of the population, seem to suffer from. (IMO)
Google it.
I prefer to think of it as an irrational fear of change.
Change is coming, whether people like it or not, the world, and it's inhabitants, are constantly changing.
I like change, and embrace it, but I've always been very confident in my own abilities, to cope, with whatever life throws at me.
Joined: 10/2/2010
Msg: 16
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/15/2013 2:54:51 PM

Oh yes, I believe in the death penalty for everyone, not just for crimes against children. I mean, aren't adults human beings, too?

The reason we don't have the death penalty is because the justice system isn't perfect and miscarriages can and do occur.
Seeing as you're so sure of your convictions here's a chance to prove them.

Would you be prepared to go before a New Zealand commissioner of oaths and publicly swear that should in the next 5 years any persons subsequently found innocent of a crime in the UK which would have carried the death penalty after a period of imprisonment which would have seen the death sentence enacted you will pay that person a sum of £20,000 sterling of your own money? After all; if you're sure enough to risk an innocent persons life then surely you will put mere money were your mouth is or face being ridiculed as a hypocrite. If you PM me your personal details I will contact Amnesty international NZ and arrange it for you. What say you?
Joined: 10/18/2012
Msg: 17
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If you could choose what type of society to live in.....
Posted: 4/15/2013 4:29:33 PM

if I could choose what type of society I could live in, then it would be one that is..."four legs good, two legs bad"

Not until I have finished my planting and gardening. I need those four legged critters manure first.
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