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Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead[CLOSED ]      Home login  
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 robin-hood
Joined: 12/2/2008
Msg: 96
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People DeadPage 6 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
Jeep Girl,

Thanks for that post. Whether by accident, negligence, or on purpose such tragedies bring grief to those it closely affects. To all the rest a platform to babble from.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 97
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 8:44:45 AM

So yeah, we got the 2nd amendment. And it's about damn time we had an adult, intelligent conversation about what that thing means here in the 21st century.


That adult, intelligent conversation has already taken place. The Supreme Court had it twice now, first in Heller, and then in McDonald. And as far as I know, the justices didn't ask either time what you or anyone here thought about the Second Amendment. If you've read those decisions and think the Court got something wrong in one or both, you haven't said what that is. And you can't--your real beef is that the Second Amendment exists at all.


It's high time we took a look at it and modified it for this age, not almost 3 centuries back. It has to evolve.


And just how should that happen, O Progressive One? Are you going to lead the charge to repeal the Second Amendment? I doubt that--it's so much easier just to ignore it. But it doesn't sound so good to admit that's what you really want to do, so you dress it up by saying the 2d Am. should be "modified," or that it should "evolve." So-called liberals, even ones who claim to respect the law, in fact do not. Like their Pharaoh in the White House, they think the Constitution should mean not what its authors intended, but whatever they happen to feel it should mean at the moment.

There's a good reason why it's called the "Constitution of the United States," and not the "Suggested Guidelines for the Government of the United States." The only legitimate way to change it is to amend it. Otherwise, live with it.
 OyVay...
Joined: 7/15/2011
Msg: 98
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 10:43:49 AM
"We are a nation virtually founded on the principle of "Help thy neighbor", yet we have become one of the most politically conservative, self absorbed, and materialistic societies in the history of humankind"

This kind of captures the spirit of that portion of society which I have come to abhor. All of the wonderful statements of the right in this thread, bears this out. The "I gotta a gun, if you don't like guns, when they come for you, don't look to me for help, you'll be shit out of luck"...show exactly the mindset this speaks of.

It marches lockstep, with statements about the OWS movement, that they smoked grass, were dirty and why didn't they get a job...when all they wanted was for someone to be held accountable for screwing up the financial system to make a buck.

The 'I've got mine, if you don't have yours(for whatever reason), the he11 with you', exemplifies the "self absorbed" nature of a segment of our society.

This incident is tragic in the extreme. A baby has died, the stories are beginning to pour in on the level of suffering of the victims. I'm sorry, we need to be more compassionate about our fellow human beings. That this segment is ONLY concerned with their guns, or their own lives..is proof, our society no longer functions on the principles on which our nation has been founded.
 want to travel
Joined: 7/29/2006
Msg: 99
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 10:59:22 AM
things like this go hand in hand with the RIGHT to have weapons
live with it
or change the constitution, and live in relative safety
americans cant have it both ways.....
 GreenThumbz18
Joined: 4/25/2012
Msg: 100
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 11:15:45 AM
^^^^^^
Hey, If you don't like it, stay home, where you're "safe".
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 101
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 11:22:59 AM
Years ago, another nut walked into a McDonald's and started shooting people. I remember reading the thoughts of one of the survivors, a policewoman. She had been having breakfast with her parents, both of whom were murdered. She felt terribly guilty about her decision to leave her gun in the car rather than bring it inside. As the attack went on, she could see the murderer from her hiding place. Several times, he was turned the other way, had paused to reload, and so on, and she knew she could easily have shot him and stopped the slaughter--if only she had been armed.
 want to travel
Joined: 7/29/2006
Msg: 102
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 11:34:18 AM
so same old argument, more weapons, means more safety lol
personally, I believe that Americans have a choice, to have, or control, the amount of weapons on the srteet, hell it is their country
but a really basic and simple fact is
gun controls,really does make for a much safer society
England,is a great example
it is now nearly impossible, to own a side arm,since they made very strong laws governing the ownership of these weapons, they hardly have any gun violence
and they are no less free, or democratic then the USA
 want to travel
Joined: 7/29/2006
Msg: 103
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 11:51:40 AM
news falsh, someone, or some people could have forced him down to the grown, anyway, without being armed to the teeth!!!
as far as the argument about a crazy person, shooting up anything finding a weapon, or weapons any way
thats just stupid
if it is very, very hard and expensive to get your hand on weapons,there are far fewer people that can get to them....
I live just a few minutes away from down town detroit
canada has all kinds of drugs, criminals, and homeless people now
but hardly any shotings here
across the river, it happens every single day, all the time!!!!
this is a really terrible thing, my heart goes out to the poor victims
but, local news shows that hardly one day goes by without a lot of people being shot
everyday is a tragedy,this one just more public
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 104
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 12:00:27 PM

England,is a great example

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1223193/Culture-violence-Gun-crime-goes-89-decade.html


The number of people injured or killed by guns, excluding air weapons, has increased from 864 in 1998/99 to a provisional figure of 1,760 in 2008/09, an increase of 104 per cent .

The figures follow a warning by Mr Grayling that U.S.-style gang culture has reached some parts of the UK.


http://harvardpress.typepad.com/hup_publicity/2011/08/guns-and-violence-in-britain-malcolm.html

Tony Martin, an English farmer, was sentenced to life in prison for killing one burglar and wounding another with a shotgun during the seventh break-in at his rural home in 1999. While his sentence was later reduced to five years, he was refused parole in 2003 because he was judged a danger to burglars.

In 2008, a robber armed with a knife attacked shopkeeper Tony Singh in West Lancashire. During the struggle the intruder was fatally stabbed with his own knife. Although the robber had a long record of violent assault, prosecutors were preparing to charge Mr. Singh with murder until public outrage stopped them.

In 1991, American tourist Dina Letarte of Tempe, Ariz., used a penknife to protect herself from a violent attack by three men in a London subway. She was convicted of carrying an offensive weapon, fined, and given a two-year suspended sentence.


This incident isn't about a political agenda or platform. It is a tragedy. Now the people have to cope with the aftermath of a person that chose to become a mass murderer.
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 105
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 12:24:43 PM
...in 1999.
....
In 2008
....
In 1991
....

You come up with 3 examples injustices over a 17 year span... 17 years... and post it like it is supposed to mean something shatteringly important...?

I wonder how long the list would be if it were the injustice done to victims of significant gun violence in the US over that same 17 year period, even if it were restricted to a maximum of but one example from each year...?

And yet you don't see that injustice as something deserving of a solution if the solution limits YOU in any way...? Freakin' unbelievable...
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 106
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 12:28:08 PM

I'm curious about that too. Some people are just crazy and have mental disorders. We'll have to wait and see when they question him. So far, all he said is that he's the joker.


I'm there also. I have this picture that he took on some persona of the joker and that he walked out and stood by his car and offered no resistance other than to tell them "and now for my next trick" with the apartment bomb. The one thing that sticks with me is that there is something more... beyond the apartment. Is he trying to become the first literal super villain?
 MsMicki
Joined: 10/2/2006
Msg: 107
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 12:50:49 PM
Seriously?? You guys want to argue for pages and pages about gun control?

This guy wanted to kill......period.
If he hadn't been able to buy the guns legally, he could have just went to the corner and bought one.
Or he could have googled how to make one!!
Or he could have used other methods to kill, as in his booby-trapped apartment, and just bombed the theatre.

All this argueing about gun control is nothing more than political grand standing ...ya'll look like your running for some office!!

Fact is, this guy cracked.
No obvious "signs" have been proven......he was a quiet, weird guy.
How many of you arguing in this thread could be described that way???

sure guns can kill......but so can a pencil if used as a weapon!
 want to travel
Joined: 7/29/2006
Msg: 108
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 12:52:05 PM
why is it that no matter what americans, think left, and right
I live minutes away from, downtown detroit
all my mothers side family lives in cali
anyone that thinks only republicans are joined at the hip, with guns is just stupid,all americans are!!!
why because the majority of americans are just terrified
americans are afraid of blacks, whites ,the left, the right, arabs,socialists
they will never rebel against authority, the whole world knows americans are sheep, to their government,police and even banks
so why all the guns, not to throw out any government, cowards do not ever make a revolution
 Earthpuppy
Joined: 2/9/2008
Msg: 109
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 12:56:55 PM
I would bet that it would be impossible to walk into any crowed place and kill 12 people with a pencil.

Anyway...Romney has taken to politicizing this massacre on his Faceplant page.
https://www.facebook.com/home.php#!/photo.php?fbid=470344299643193&set=a.221499604527665.68159.220814084596217&type=1

While possibly true on that particular day, Rmoney ignores the 14 police officers killed by CC gunowers, the 448 fellow citizens killed by CC owners, the 21 CC owner massacres that killed 94 people, and the growing "justifiable" homicide rates from stand your ground anywhere anytime laws.
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 110
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 1:01:07 PM
Again, you missed the point............... The point isn't how often it happened, the point is the mindset of the criminal system...

I didn't miss any point... I simply contrasted his point about "injustices done to innocent people defending themselves" with the mindset that seems to say "I'm willing to tolerate injustices done to others as victims of gun crime as long as the solution to that injustice limits me in any way"... Or did YOU miss THAT point...?

sure guns can kill......but so can a pencil if used as a weapon!

Except a gun kills more impersonally, the user doesn't have to be within arm reach making it easier to "disconnect" from the act of killing another... and the gun has no other designed purpose than to kill/maim/wound...
 want to travel
Joined: 7/29/2006
Msg: 111
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 1:10:50 PM
I hardly ever wach local detroit news anymore, this kind of thing happens every day, someone is shot
every single day
gun contol is not a left right issue, both dem, and republicans need there guns
America, is sick with fear,this has to be changed
the whole idea of having the citizens armed, is so thet governments would be kept under control, by the people
truth is americans would never use weapons against any kind of authority, they sheep
followers,more so then any citizen from any other developed western democracy
thinking gun ownership be limited to mentally competant people is not a very bad idea, it may even be a great start
at becoming just a tad bit more couragious
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 112
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 1:14:39 PM

Anyway...Romney has taken to politicizing this massacre on his Faceplant page.
https://www.facebook.com/home.php#!/photo.php?fbid=470344299643193&set=a.221499604527665.68159.220814084596217&type=1

I'm not so sure that is Romney's actual facebook page... Looks more like a supporter's page... Mitt's an ass but I would be seriously surprised if he was THAT big an ass...
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 113
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 1:47:48 PM

I highly doubt it. A person that is actually crazy or schizophrenic probably doesn't have a plan B or plan C ready for when they get caught. He didn't even have an escape plan from the theatre.


I think you make a few assumptions here that the police aren't makeing. Your fist is that he is crazy or schizophrenic. He may not be. Not to the clinical definition anyway. Next, that he doesn't have a plan B or C. The police also evacuated the college just to check that out. Next... that he didn't have an escape plan... That is the most unlikely of all. He acquired everything, planned the date, bought the tickets, knew where to park, how to re enter, and re enter with his stockpile. The only plan he didn't make was escaping. Not because he was to crazy to think of it. Because he obviously wanted the police to take him. If you follow the Joker angle then you have to apply what happened in the last movie. He gave up willingly in order to continue the game.

http://goo.gl/A9DSt

Holmes' apartment appears to have three types of explosives — jars filled with accelerants, chemicals that would explode when mixed together and more than 30 "improvised grenades," the official said.


Planning to get caught without putting up a fight is highly relevant. He could have incorrectly thought they would bust in through the front door and he would have gotten to see his trap sprung... Maybe...
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 114
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 1:51:28 PM

'm not so sure that is Romney's actual facebook page... Looks more like a supporter's page... Mitt's an ass but I would be seriously surprised if he was THAT big an ass...


You are not so sure???? It clearly says "Community Page about Mitt Romney"
You had a tingle of doubt but your feelings were that is could have been because he is an ass? You need to question yourself more...
 want to travel
Joined: 7/29/2006
Msg: 115
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 1:53:08 PM
anyone who thinks this guy was not suffering from a mental dsorder should just go and check themselves in at the nearest phyc ward PLEASE!!!

my heart goes out to all the victims, cant even begin to understand the pain they must be feeling today
 KittenCatt
Joined: 6/11/2011
Msg: 116
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 2:02:34 PM
Is anyone else literally ROFLMAOOO at picturing someone trying to kill a bunch of people with a pencil...........thanks EP
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 117
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 2:09:14 PM
You are not so sure???? It clearly says "Community Page about Mitt Romney"...

I was being polite because EP has more than earned it...

And no, the linked page does NOT clearly say "Community Page about Mitt Romney"... anywhere... you would have to look elsewhere to find that... I didn't bother because it wasn't necessary but, in your zeal, I guess you didn't think that far ahead...
 Aries_328
Joined: 10/16/2011
Msg: 118
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 2:35:45 PM

anyone who thinks this guy was not suffering from a mental dsorder should just go and check themselves in at the nearest phyc ward PLEASE!!!


It is possible but not until its confirmed. Remember... if he is confirmed to have been insane then all he needs is treatment and can be released. Innocent by reason of insanity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insanity_defense

It is not obvious that he is insane. Or did you automatically assume that he must be crazy without realizing that excuses his actions.
 matchlight
Joined: 1/31/2009
Msg: 119
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Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 2:36:29 PM

"I'm willing to tolerate injustices done to others as victims of gun crime as long as the solution to that injustice limits me in any way"


I haven't seen anyone here take that position. What imaginary person are you attributing it to? And gun crimes are just that--crimes. Calling them injustices to the victims implies--falsely--that just because some **stard decides to attack someone with a gun, it means government is acting unfairly. But I guess the government was never to blame in places like D.C. and Chicago, if a single black mother or her family became shooting victims because it was illegal for her to have a gun to defend the household.

Otis McDonald, the old black man whose case went to the Supreme Court, lived alone in a bad part of Chicago and had had armed thugs break in more than once and threaten to kill him. I guess he was just supposed to call Chicago's finest, and if he got shot to death before they got there, tough luck. When it comes to people like those, all oh-so-caring "liberals" really care about is getting their votes.

The U.S. and each state can infringe the right to keep and bear arms, but not so far as to violate the Second Amendment's guarantee of those rights. After only one recent Supreme Court decision that applies to the federal government, and an even more recent one that applies to the states, it's too soon to know just how far and in just what ways the Constitution allows firearms to be regulated.

Certain things are already clear, though. Federal law can prevent persons from having automatic weapons--you don't get to have your own machine gun. People can only be prevented from possessing ordinary firearms for certain traditionally recognized reasons, e.g. being an ex-felon, or a mental patient, or being under a court order not to have any guns. At least in some counties, a state can ban sales of firearms or ammunition, as long as it doesn't effectively ban them throughout its whole territory. States can allow people who have been properly trained to carry concealed firearms, with reasonable exceptions--courthouses, for example.
 mungojoe
Joined: 11/15/2006
Msg: 120
Mass Shooting at Colo. Movie Theater, 12 People Dead
Posted: 7/21/2012 3:40:52 PM

And gun crimes are just that--crimes. Calling them injustices to the victims implies--falsely--that just because some **stard decides to attack someone with a gun, it means government is acting unfairly.


I guess he was just supposed to call Chicago's finest, and if he got shot to death before they got there, tough luck.


Only in a fevered mind...I don't know if that is a lonely place or one filled with other voices but it clearly tries to reinvent reality to fit it's own mold and imagines reality when it cannot be reinvented...

People can only be prevented from possessing ordinary firearms for certain traditionally recognized reasons, e.g. being an ex-felon, or a mental patient, or being under a court order not to have any guns.

I'm trying very hard to see what your point is here but, it appears to me as if you are simply trying to regale us with aphorisms... Unfornately, an aphorism usually requires that the thought be in some way original, this one is merely mundane...banal even...
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