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 sporty16
Joined: 9/17/2012
Msg: 31
Is Jesus the son of God Page 2 of 19    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19)
Yes , Jesus is the Son of God.... Please read Matthew 1:18-25 and Luke 1:26-38 Mary agreed to the annunciation and the child was declared by the angel Gabriel to be the Son of God....
 sporty16
Joined: 9/17/2012
Msg: 32
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 3:26:54 PM
The genealogy of Jesus. The Jewish people throughout the early years of their history kept up their genealogy because every male child of King David was a potential Messiah. Down through Jewish history , the people looked forward to the coming of their Messiah. The genealogies would show them who might be a legitimate descendant of David to reign on the throne . Only when Jesus was born in Bethlehem did the long awaited King arrive. " Joseph , son of David" ( Matthew 1:20) is a quote from the genealogy of Jesus. " Where is he who is born King of the Jews ?" (2:2) Jesus was no son of the illegitimate King Herod who ruled Judah (2:12-23) Herod was an Idumaean , and he did not have a drop of David's blood in him. The angel said to Mary, " And behold, you will conceive in your womb, and bear a son , and you shall name him Jesus. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord God will give him the throne of his father David ; and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever ; and His kingdom will have no end " ( Luke 1:31-33) Why do we have 2 genealogies of Jesus in the gospels ? The 2 lines represent the lines of Joseph and Mary respectively.. They both are identified as decendents of King David. Matthew gives us the " royal " line of those who actually sat on the throne as descendents of the great king. The other line was the " legal " line of those who descended from the eldest son to te next, even though they never actually reigned as kings on the throne of David. How do we know this is true ? The 2 genealogiesreinforce the testimony of the angel to both Joseph and Mary. The 2 lines run parallel from Abraham to David. The interesting thing is the historian Matthew gives the lineage of Jesus by way of Solomon the son of David, while Luke traces us to Jesus by way of Nathan , another son of David. Therefore , these 2 genealogies are the lines of 2 brothers and their families. Luke gives us the genealogy of Mary, the mother of Jesus, and Matthew gives us the line of Joseph, the step father or adopted father of Jesus. Matthew and Luke both trace the evidence to the Messiah. One gives it through Solomon's line which was the royal line and the other through Nathan's which was the legal line... Hope you're paying attention....it's very important now. You will recall, nathan and Solomon were both the sons of David. Nathan was the older brother of Solomon, but when David died, the younger brother took the throne. Nathan's line ran on through the ages and ultimately produced the Virgin Mary. Solomon's line ran down through the centuries and ultimately produced Joseph. Matthew is careful to inform us that Joseph was not the father of Jesus, but that he was the husband of Mary, to whom was born Jesus ( Matt:1:16) And Luke uses a word for a son that includes what we should call a son - in -law. Moreover, the Bible makes it very clear that Jesus could not have been the Messiah if Joseph was his human father. In the use of the name " Jechonias " in his genealogy, Matthew declares that Jesus is the son of Mary and not the son of Joseph. Jechonias received a curse of God that took the throne away away from any of his descendents. ( Jeremiah 22:30) reads, " Thus says the Lord, write you this childless: a man that shall not prosper in his days; for no man of his seed shall prosper, sitting upon the throne of David, and ruling anymore in Judah. None of the 7 sons of Jechoniascould have been king because of the curse of God. If Jesus had been the son of Joseph, He would have been cursed and therefore could never have been the Messiah . What about the legal lineof Nathan ? The royal line of the son of Eli ( also spelled Heli ) would have quickly contested any claim of the line of Nathan. Nathan's line that had no curse upon it produced Heli ( Luke 3:23) and his daughter the virgin Mary and her Son Jesus Christ. Jesus is therefore eligible by the line of Nathan and exhausts that line . Solomon's line had a curse on it produced Joseph and exhausts the line of Solomon, for Joseph's other children now have an elder brother who, legally , by adoption is the royal heir. How can the title be free in any case ? We have 2 genealogies: one with a curse on it, and th lack of reigning royalty on the other line. God , the Holy Spirit begat the Lord Jesus christ in the womb of Mary without any use of a human father... Therefore , the child born of Mary was the seed of David according to the flesh. Joseph, on the other hand, obeyed the command of the Lord and married Mary and took the unborn child under his protective care , giving Jesus the title that had come down to Him through his ancestor Solomon. Moreover , the uncursed, legal, royal Messiah can be none other than the Lord Jesus !!!! Both lines of King David are exhausted in Jesus of Nazareth. Anyone else who claims to be the Messiah is an imposter !!! Yes , Jesus is the true Messiah . There can be none other. He is the Son of God and believing on Him brings Eternal Life... Thanks be to God..
 Demigod1979
Joined: 12/4/2011
Msg: 33
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History
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 4:02:41 PM

According to the NT, Jesus came to earth not for just the jews, but for all of mankind.................

He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel." - Matthew 15:24
Of course he did eventually help the non-Israelite woman, but only after calling her a dog. :p

Jesus being the Jewish Messiah is a core part of Christianity. As Wiki article on Jesus says: "Christians hold Jesus to be the awaited Messiah of the Old Testament and refer to him as Jesus Christ or simply as Christ".
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 34
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 4:31:05 PM
the thing is that the Messiah the Jews await is not a son of God.
He is not part of a trinity.
He is a flesh and blood person who fullfills the Jewish requirements of Messiah which Jeffrey wrote down above.
he will bring peace to the world.
Did Jesus bring world peace?
where in the Torah (OT) does it leave room for a second coming to accomplish these things that Messiah is to accomplish?

Perhaps the spirit of Jesus brings a personal peace to those who believe upon him.
but that does not mean he is God in the flesh.
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 36
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 5:07:06 PM
Paul,
first of all not all Jews reject Jesus.
secondly...the King James Bible is a bad translation.
It totally mistranslates the verses it claims to sight from the Old Testament.
It mistranslates them in the KJ version of the OT.
I read Hebrew and in order to get a proper meaning you cant just switch words to suit your own ideas. (not meaning Your ideas Paul...but the translators ideas)
 Keeper_of_Secrets
Joined: 5/16/2012
Msg: 38
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 6:13:26 PM
http://www.allabouttruth.org/oldest-bible-version-faq.htm

then there is also this bit of info to consider.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_text#History_of_religious_texts
History of religious texts

The oldest known religious texts are Pyramid texts of Ancient Egypt that date to 2400-2300 BCE. The earliest form of the Phoenician alphabet found to date is the inscription on the sarcophagus of King Ahiram of Byblos. ( The Sumerian Temple Hymns [1]). The Epic of Gilgamesh from Sumeria is also one of the earliest literary works dating to 2150-2000 BCE, that includes various mythological figures. The Rigveda of Hinduism is proposed to have been composed between 1700–1100 BCE[2] making it possibly the world's oldest religious text still in use. The oldest portions of the Zoroastrian Avesta are believed to have been transmitted orally for centuries before they found written form, and although widely differing dates for Gathic Avestan (the language of the oldest texts) have been proposed, scholarly consensus floats at around 1000 BCE.[citation needed]

The majority of scholars agree that the Torah's composition took place over centuries.[3] From the late 19th century there was a general consensus around the documentary hypothesis, which suggests that the five books were created c.450 BCE by combining four originally independent sources, known as the Jahwist, or J (about 900 BCE), the Elohist, or E (about 800 BCE), the Deuteronomist, or D, (about 600 BCE), and the Priestly source, or P (about 500 BC).[4]

The first scripture printed for wide distribution to the masses was The Diamond Sutra, a Buddhist scripture, and is the earliest recorded example of a dated printed text, bearing the Chinese calendar date for 11 May 868 CE.[5]
 Demigod1979
Joined: 12/4/2011
Msg: 39
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History
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 6:35:02 PM

Jesus DID come to earth not for just the jews, but for all mankind. What is ironic is that the very people that whom he is a descendant from, rejected him. Or at least they rejected him at first, since a few changed their minds later.

Correct me if I am wrong, but the Jews are still waiting for their Messiah to come, as they rejected Jesus.

The idea that Jesus came for everyone was due to the influence of the apostle Paul, who wanted to spread the worship of Jesus among the gentiles. Among Jewish Christians, Jesus came for the Jews, and only for the Jews (e.g., Matthew is known to be a very pro-Jewish gospel - thus, the Jesus in that gospel is very Jewish). There was a battle of ideas among early Christians as to whether or not gentiles were required to become Jews in order to be saved (this is contained in the NT, in Acts as well as in Paul's letters), and eventually Pauline Christianity won out.

As for the Jews rejecting Jesus, I don't think there was anything to accept. Putting aside the dubious gospel accounts, Jesus did not fulfill the messianic prophecies, thus he cannot be considered the messiah. This is a fact that even Christians know - after all, what is the Second Coming if not the time when Jesus will finally fulfill the messianic prophecies? Frankly, the Jews have very good reasons for rejecting Jesus as the messiah.

The Wiki article on Jewish messianism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_messianism) contains a good outline of what the Jews expect of their messiah.

There's also a documentary series called Christianity: A History, the first episode of which is called Jesus the Jew. It gives a very good presentation of why the Jews do not accept Jesus as the messiah.

Here's a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjAWyg7ZCJk
 Stray__Cat
Joined: 7/12/2006
Msg: 40
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 7:49:01 PM
I am no Biblical expert.
But I do not think Mary's genealogy goes to David.
At least in the Book of Mathew it goes to Levi.

The wording in The Gospel of Luke is imprecise.
and that genealogy(which does go to David) is sometimes considered Mary's.
But again the wording....is not the best.

Someone above mentioned the crudeness of some of the biblical writing.
That is very true. It is not written in the best style of the day.
The reason for that is twofold.

One, most early Christians outside of The Levant were illiterate.
They paid pagan scribes to read and copy texts.
These scribes...even if conscientious...still made numerous mistakes.
The religious symbolism was outside of their pagan understanding.
So they used what words they could to describe what they did not understand.

The second reason is
Recopying text over time added further errors.
Especially the Greek versions which were copied by monks who didn't read Greek.
They just copied em letter by letter blind to the meaning.
There was no way to proofread it.
And once an error was in....it stayed in for the next copy.
That is why no early gospels match.
A Luke from 600AD Rome is different from Luke of 500AD Alexandria.

ALL gospels in the New Testament are copies from earlier ones.
There are no originals.

Here is a link to all the ins and outs of the genealogical controversy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genealogy_of_Jesus
 sporty16
Joined: 9/17/2012
Msg: 41
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 7:50:52 PM
This is meant for Jeffrey65802. Thank you for bringing all those requirements of the Messiah to fulfill according to prophecy. The Torah is absolutely correct and God is the Author of the Torah... I would love to spent many good times searching and proving the scriptures together regarding the Messiah , but we are some distance apart . Nevertheless we can move forward in friendship and examine the evidence that demands a verdict. I would ask you to take your time and slowly read the New Covenant books of Hebrews and Romans.. and after send me a message about how you feel afterwards. There is one Lord and one God.... The Lord is God.....The God of Israel is ONE.. If you read the New Covenant you will see that Jesus fulfilled all the prophecies regarding the coming of the Messiah . Jesus said, " My Father and I are ONE" God is the Messiah, God is the Savior.. The name " Jesus " means Savior.
 sporty16
Joined: 9/17/2012
Msg: 42
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 8:12:12 PM
Marriage is between a man and woman. God does not marry...don't be so silly. The genealogy of Mary is in Luke 3: 23-31 from Heli to Nathan....okey dokey
 sporty16
Joined: 9/17/2012
Msg: 43
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 9:04:50 PM
About 740 B.C. The prophet Isaiah 9:6 -7 " For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given. And the government shall be upon His shoulder: and His name shall be Wonderful , Counselor , the Mighty God , the Everlasting Father , the Prince of Peace " Of the increase of His government and peace , there will be no end, upon the throne of David and over His kingdom......"This prophecy is fulfilled in Jesus , the Son of God.
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 44
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 9:48:02 PM

The Bible, and all other religous works are ALL subject to interpretation, and to say that YOU and you alone have the one and only true interpretation is folly. There are many who would and do say that THEY are the only ones with the real truth. To them, I only can say........... Good luck.


Paul...I think that you addressed the above to me.(?)
I never did nor will ever claim or say that I alone have the one and only interpretation.
I do not believe that anyone has the full truth or complete knowledge of God.
anyone who claims to is foolish.

Everyone of us has the right to our own personal religious or spiritual beliefs.
we each have our own path to take.
quoting bible scripture of either testament does not hold up in any disagreement unless the other person believes that testament to hold value. if someone does not believe the NT to be literally true then quoting scriptures from it...is of no use to them or to you.

Because some fundamental Christians are set on their way being the ONLY way to get to heaven....
I find that I cannot accept that religion. God, who created us, knew that not everyone would believe in Jesus as his son, there are so many other religions,.....and paths to God and rules to follow if one wishes to follow rules.

But for a religious leader of fundamental Christianity to tell others that they will go to hell if they dont believe in Jesus is...ummmm.....I dont have the word to say. why would God create all of us and our diversity of beliefs if there was only ONE way? Is that God one who places people in everlasting fire to burn in hell forever because they dont believe in one of the many religions? that leaves more than half the worlds population in hell.

Not everyone born is meant to believe in or to accept Jesus.
I believe Jesus was a great teacher. He had many truths to share. But I do not have to agree that he is God in the flesh. I believe he was on a higher spiritual plane than most people. however what about other prophets? the Buddah, Dalai Lama, Moses, ....I do not know them all.
can YOU accept that there are other paths to God,..
and that people of other religions are not all going to burn in hell for not accepting Jesus?

Ok....Paul..you have the right to your beliefs. I am just explaining to you why I do not appreciate Christians telling others that they will go to hell if they dont believe a certain way.
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 45
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/6/2013 10:19:58 PM
This is the way the verse in Isaiah is directly translated from the Hebrew words in the Torah:

For a child has been born to us, a son has been given to us; and the government is on his shoulder;
and his name is called A wonderful counselor is the Mighty God, the everlasting Father, the ruler of peace;
that the government may be increased, and of peace there be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom,
to establish it, and to uphold it through justice and through righteousness from henceforth even forever,
The zeal of the Lord of hosts does perform this.

Isaiah 9:5-6

The above are prophetic names for Hezekiah
the words of the name form a sentence to express the greatness of God, which benefits will become known when they are bestowed upon the future king (Hezekiah).
Hezekiah is called A wonderful counselor because the name is a sign which tells God's future plan for him.

all the names given to Hezekiah have a meaning. Names were used to say what the person would be or who he is.
Immanuel means "God is with us"
but that does not mean that Immanuel is God.
Elihu means "My God is He"
many names were given to describe attributes of God...given to regular people.

I could go through each name that the verse you quoted from Isaiah gives to this King.
but this is not the place for that.
I realize that you are quoting from a Christian Bible and not directly from the Hebrew words.
The original Hebrew is also using a past tense verb and the Bible you quoted from is using a future verb....changing verb tenses also changes the meaning of the scripture.

this is one of the many reasons for the misunderstanding of interpretation of scripture. The Bible was not properly translated,..especially by the time it got to be into English. I do not know when the translations came to be...but I know they are not exact. there were too many years in between the events and the writing down of them,...and then the mistranslations.
 lyingcheat
Joined: 9/13/2009
Msg: 46
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History
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/7/2013 8:01:31 AM

Is Jesus the son of God

They have to be related, it's in the myth script.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monomyth
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_monomyths
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Monomyths

Joseph Campbell's monomyth, or the hero's journey, is a basic pattern that its proponents argue is found in many narratives from around the world. This widely distributed pattern was described by Campbell in The Hero with a Thousand Faces (1949).

Campbell held that numerous myths from disparate times and regions share fundamental structures and stages, which he summarized in The Hero with a Thousand Faces:

- A hero ventures forth from the world of common day into a region of supernatural wonder: fabulous forces are there encountered and a decisive victory is won: the hero comes back from this mysterious adventure with the power to bestow boons on his fellow man. -

Campbell and other scholars, such as Erich Neumann, describe narratives of Gautama Buddha, Moses, and Christ in terms of the monomyth and Campbell argues that classic myths from many cultures follow this basic pattern.

Contents
1 Summary
2 The 17 Stages of the Monomyth

2.1 Departure
2.1.1 The Call to Adventure
2.1.2 Refusal of the Call
2.1.3 Supernatural Aid
2.1.4 The Crossing of the First Threshold
2.1.5 Belly of The Whale

2.2 Initiation
2.2.1 The Road of Trials
2.2.2 The Meeting With the Goddess
2.2.3 Woman as Temptress
2.2.4 Atonement with the Father
2.2.5 Apotheosis
2.2.6 The Ultimate Boon

2.3 Return
2.3.1 Refusal of the Return
2.3.2 The Magic Flight
2.3.3 Rescue from Without
2.3.4 The Crossing of the Return Threshold
2.3.5 Master of Two Worlds
2.3.6 Freedom to Live





http://department.monm.edu/classics/courses/clas230/mythdocuments/heropattern/default.htm

The Hero Pattern
This pattern is based upon The Hero: A study in Tradition, Myth and Dreams by Lord Raglan

Incidents which occur with regularity in hero-myths of all cultures:

1. Hero's mother is a royal virgin;
2. His father is a king, and
3. Often a near relative of his mother, but
4. The circumstances of his conception are unusual, and
5. He is also reputed to be the son of a god.
6. At birth an attempt is made, usually by his father or his maternal grand father to kill him, but
7. he is spirited away, and
8. Reared by foster-parents in a far country.
9. We are told nothing of his childhood, but
10. On reaching manhood he returns or goes to his future Kingdom.
11. After a victory over the king and/or a giant, dragon, or wild beast,
12. He marries a princess, often the daughter of his predecessor and
13. And becomes king.
14. For a time he reigns uneventfully and
15. Prescribes laws, but
16. Later he loses favor with the gods and/or his subjects, and
17. Is driven from the throne and city, after which
18. He meets with a mysterious death,
19. Often at the top of a hill,
20. His children, if any do not succeed him.
21. His body is not buried, but nevertheless
22. He has one or more holy sepulchres.


.
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 47
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/7/2013 10:53:40 AM
^^^^^^^
true about all the religions including Christianity that have the same story.
many of them have virgin births,
he is the son of God,
etc etc as the poster above has stated.
I have read about this a while ago and it was much to my surprise that this is within many religions.
which does make it appear as a myth.

but on the other hand....I can see the good that Christianity accomplishes for its adherants of today.
I love the worship songs and I can apply them to God as I see God,...
the many youth programs which give local children and teens many fun things to do instead of them getting bored and
roaming the streets or playing beer pong (lol)
I see no real harm in Christianity for church goers.
I am no Christian but we have a local church here that has a free movie night,...
various groups to attend which do not preach at all,
book clubs etc.

what I dislike is that the majority of Christians think they are the ONLY right ones.
but not all Christian churches believe that and are more open to other beliefs. God is the same God no matter
what religion if a person believes in ONE GOD.
and the going to hell thing....well my religion does not teach that one will burn forever in hell and I have yet to see that
in the Old Testament
if it is there please tell me what book and verse.
since, if you read the last book in the Tanach....(the complete OT which contains the writings of the prophet, psalm, proverbs..) it does say NOT to ADD anything to it.
the NT is an add on which is forbidden.
Jesus followed the Jewish law and he didnt write the New Testament...it was written after his death by different people who saw things a different way from one another. I dont see Jesus as changing any of the OT. I think it was the writers that said that Jesus said said different things. Other than that, his teachings have great moral value and he really did not say anything that was not already said in the OT. He may have used more modern words, but the meaning was the same.

Personally I have nothing against Christians as many are my friends, but they are not of those who believe the hellfire and damnation. if belief in Jesus has changed anyones life for the better...I am all for that. and I have seen lives changed.

one time someone told me that you can believe in a belief and that belief can change your life whether it stands upon reality or not.
 Double Cabin
Joined: 11/29/2004
Msg: 48
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History
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/7/2013 11:39:58 AM
As unsettling as it is as far as we KNOW DevilfromToronto is right. In my understanding the first writings of the 4 books came 70 years after Jesus passed and supposedly rose from the dead.

Bill Maher's "Religulous" points out there were pre-Christian religions set up in essentially the same way. In my mind if Jesus were the son of an Omnipotent being then Christians would celebrate his real birthday, not conveniently co-opt Pagan solstice celebrations.
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 50
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/7/2013 1:57:40 PM
there is another forum on here in which the proof of God can or cannot be proved.
it is my belief that no one can prove the existance of God and Neither can anyone prove that GOd does not exist.
to me,...its pretty clear there exists a Creator.
just look at the detailed exactness of things...
the magnificence.
Paul...I in no way want to discredit your religion.
But please explain why God would be a God who puts most people of the world into hell according to whether or not they believe that Jesus is the ONLY way and if the "accept" him and be born again?
Yes...it says that in the New Testament....but you cannot use the New Testament to prove anything if the person does not accept the NT as being true.
it would be like a person reading the Koran to you...who may not believe it...and telling you it is true because it says so in the Koran.
 Demigod1979
Joined: 12/4/2011
Msg: 51
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History
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/7/2013 2:21:26 PM

So now you are offering as proof that Jesus was an evil person, verses from writings that are not even in the NT?

I understand that you have a vested interest in Jesus NOT being the Son of God, but this is really reaching, isn't it?

Further, this is one question that cannot ever be proved one way or another, as all of these writings, the Torah, the Bible, the Koran, etc., MUST be taken on FAITH, because there really is no proof that will substantiate anything that is written in any of them.

I do find it amusing that you are using texts outside the bible to prove the non-deiety of Jesus.

Well, obviously the bible cannot be used to validate the bible. The church only included books into the NT that supported Jesus' divinity so you obviously cannot rely on them to validate Jesus' divinity.
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 53
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/7/2013 11:42:48 PM
I guess all of our different religious beliefs go on faith not proof.
and having faith in a Creator in my opinion is a good thing for us.
Having God to pray to is good.
living in a world and not believing is in my opinion sad, lonely,and does not make as much sense as believing in a Creator.
 for4rums_loner_here
Joined: 1/29/2013
Msg: 54
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/8/2013 5:08:00 AM
""""""""""""
I don't get it. Why did this religion take off? It's based on a false foundation.
""""""""""""

Because anything new, absolutely anything, that aims to touch the lives of people and affect the way to live, and it does not exclude new religions, can only succeed if it's based on a very well defined SCANDAL that people can talk about with each other.

If there is no scandal, there is nothing to talk about, there is no dissemination of knowledge, faith, or Word of God.

All major religions start off with a sexual scandal in a family. Moses was sent in a handbasket to float down the river by an unmarried young princess, who had got pregnant. Mary had a child though she was a "virgin", (that must have been hard to pull off, but since she succeeded at it, look what she produced: the only god people believe in who walked on Earth). Then there is Muhammad, ibid. Greco-Roman gods were very good examples for how to be scandalous in your lifestyle, as a god. The Egyptian and Chinese gods, the Hindu gods, even Buddha, were mostly repulsive and vicious and cruel. Okay, Buddha was not that vicious and cruel, I grant that, but he WAS grossly overweight. And he was not god, only god-like.

If Buddha wanted to become god, all he would have needed to do was to spread some juicy rumour about his mother. But he came from a better family, a family of values, and he knew that whether or not he was god or not, he would have got a good spanking and been sent to his room with no dinner if he spread the word that his own Mother was a tart, a regular two-bit hooker whose lovers were nameless, faceless fellers who came and went.
 for4rums_loner_here
Joined: 1/29/2013
Msg: 55
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/8/2013 6:01:39 AM
"""""""""
I see proof of that in when Jesus was on the cross, and the one thief spat on him, and the other said he believed, ...
"""""""""

Finally!! Finally I get the connections why the other prisoner was upset when the Roman guard spat at Brian in the movie. "Pilate's little pet, you must be!!"

So the thief spat at Jesus on the cross. Seeing they were a little community of crucifix-dwellers, this was not a very nice how-do-you-do from the next door neighbour. Bet you he also borrowed the hedgetrimmer and never returned it.

Pray tell me: why did the thief spit at Jesus? What was his reason, or motivation, or how did feel justified or called to action in this way? I am never satisfied with the "what", I need to know the "why".
 for4rums_loner_here
Joined: 1/29/2013
Msg: 56
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/8/2013 6:11:51 AM
"""""""""""""""
I am no Christian but we have a local church here that has a free movie night,...
various groups to attend which do not preach at all,
book clubs etc.
"""""""""""""""

Right. Christians do good things for the community, and I will be the first one to advocate that.

Because in the US almost everything is run by Christians. Under the auspices of Jesus.

The basketball courts, the playgrounds, the free diaper service, the charitable mitten-knitting groups in church, the rent-a-cook for lonely old people, the rent-a-wife for lonely old men, the free condom service for prostitutes, the free needle service for junkies, whatever. AA meetings are in church basements, and community meetings upstairs.

In fact, in non-religious countries the same, exactly the same things are made and worked on by volunteers who are not religious, not christian, atheists.


So it's true that Christians are good, and have the truth, but like you said, K, other types of people, like atheists, are good, and have the truth. To declare you are the only righteous one, and you support it with the reasoning that it's so because you are christian, is okay and goes down well in the USA, coz here almost everyone is christian. In Europe, however, or in Saudi Arabia, this banging of the chest would be met with wirklich different attitudes.
 sporty16
Joined: 9/17/2012
Msg: 57
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/8/2013 11:18:28 AM
Hi Jeffrey regarding message # 55 . Nobody died in those references because they are not the Gospel. Jesus never preached the Gospel as a child.. He taught it as an adult.. Besides the Gospel only means ....His Death , burial and resurrection...That is the Gospel message ! Those are all fiction and the Church has rightfully tossed them out. None of the apostles or deciples of Jesus produced them.. Only some enemies of Jesus... wonder who could that be ? Hmmm
 sporty16
Joined: 9/17/2012
Msg: 58
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/8/2013 11:25:11 AM
Hi Melody : regarding your belief in a Creator... Who do you think God is anyway He is the Creator. My goodness.
 melodyof_k
Joined: 5/2/2012
Msg: 59
Is Jesus the son of God
Posted: 2/8/2013 11:48:01 AM
yes Sporty
HE is the ONE Creator.
but I dont believe that any one religion has a handle or is privy to the truth about who or what this Creator is ,
as He is far above and beyond what any human can imagine.
so our personal beliefs may serve us well...
and bring us comfort,..or not...
but we cannot see God...
only aspects of Him.
If Jesus was THE ONLY son of GOd...
why does he seem to cross every one who doesnt believe in him off of his heavenly entrance list?
Did his FATHER in Heaven tell him to do that?
Did GOd expect everyone would believe that he sent his son down to save us?


what other religion do you know of where it says that you must believe their way or you go to hell?
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