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 mitchozie
Joined: 3/11/2009
Msg: 76
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Instant Old AgePage 4 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)
May I recommend the following book, to the readers and posters in this thread:

"What You Must Know About Statin Drugs & Their Natural Alternatives". It's by Jay S. Cohen, MD.

It helped me with my decision to stop taking statins.
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 77
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Posted: 12/15/2013 2:43:01 AM
Sounds good mitchozie^^^^^^

25% of the cholesterol in your body is found in your brain, where it plays important roles in such things as membrane function, acts as an antioxidant, and serves as the raw material from which we are able to make things like progesterone, estrogen, cortisol, testosterone and even vitamin D.( Grain Brain)
Your brain is about 60% fat, so what does it need to fire correctly? FAT not carbs.

Typical American diets are destroying optimal brain function ( grains, gluten and sugar) add statins on top of that and
it's appalling.
We are told Eggs are bad foods and whole grains are good. It's frustrating.
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 78
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Posted: 12/15/2013 9:26:42 AM

Your brain is about 60% fat, so what does it need to fire correctly? FAT not carbs.


The brain can only use ketones and glucose. It uses predominantly glucose. Did we not talk the blood brain barrier earlier? Fatty acids do not cross, and are not used by the brain as an energy source.

Since when did anyone ever say eggs were a bad thing? Maybe in the 1970s. Grains- whether it is rice or wheat, has been a staple for people for thousands of years. It's only the last 100yrs that obesity has arisen. There are people all over the world with predominantly carbohydrate diets who are not obese. It's not carbohydrates per se that is the problem, it's empty kilojoules from refined sugar.
 CallmeKen
Joined: 9/4/2009
Msg: 79
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Posted: 12/15/2013 10:01:42 AM

Since when did anyone ever say eggs were a bad thing?

The egg problem was one of science's "oops" back in the 80s. When a high correlation between blood cholesterol and heart disease was verified, the media went crazy with the "Cut the cholesterol" kick. Egg yolks are naturally high in cholesterol, because they are the cholesterol source for developing chicks.

The egg industry suffered greatly. Per capita consumption of eggs dropped from about 300 /year to about 178 /year. Much of the industry went out of business or consolidated due to the drop in demand.

What was worse, eggs are a natural source of the vitamin folic acid. Folic acid biochemically assists with the conversion between C5 and C6 sugars. It is also a necessary vitamin in early first trimester pregnancy.

When egg consumption decreased, the poorer population (that couldn't afford daily vitamin supplements) experienced a significant increase in miscarriages due to folic acid deficiencies. Oops.

Eventually, Harvard published a long term study proving eggs to not be the bad guy as was advertised, consumption went back up, and prenatal vitamins became standard fare. The problem largely corrected itself, though you still have huge multistate egg monopolies today.
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 80
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Posted: 12/15/2013 10:42:11 AM

Since when did anyone ever say eggs were a bad thing?


I hear it almost every day from people that are still told not to eat more than 1 egg yolk a day by their Dr. because of cholesterol.Some are told to use "egg beaters"or just the whites.Some 3 eggs a week max.
HELL, fast food companies who capitalize on everything people fear or hear in terms of marketing "health fads" are offering egg white omelets and sandwiches now.

Omega 3's (FAT) does cross the blood brain barrier and has been effective in people for Alzheimer's and esp ADD in kids.
DHA has been used a long time to treat hyperactivity in children and to help them focus.
Now it's considered "news".
Dec. 10, 2013 (Health Day News) The latest I can find.

Fat aiding neurological issues isn't news either. Parkinson’s disease, stroke, traumatic brain injury,
nerve issues,depression, epilepsy, ALD.
Dietary fat aids the brain.

I never suggest depriving oneself of healthy carbs from some fruit, lots of low glycemic veggies, some beans or wild rice unless they have health issues that suggest they should strictly limit them. Including obesity, which is a health issue.
I am not pro NO CARBS.
I am pro lower to low( healthy) carbs.

A bit of table sugar is better than most grains, esp processed.
I would have a small candy bar before 2 slices of whole wheat bread.
 allthegoodnamesrtaken1
Joined: 1/12/2012
Msg: 81
Instant Old Age
Posted: 12/15/2013 12:22:13 PM
Thank you for the tip Mitchozie :-)


Did we not talk the blood brain barrier earlier? Fatty acids do not cross...


False.
Omega 3's are a fatty acid. Check Medline for Omega 3's and the Blood Brain Barrier. Your science is outdated

Ken

The egg problem was one of science's "oops" back in the 80s

Yes, similar to the oops in advocating more grains and less dietary fat.
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 82
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Posted: 12/15/2013 1:05:51 PM
"Studies" regarding omega 3' crossing the blood brain barrier are relatively new as far as what" new" is considered in medical research. The fact that eating more fat and protein than carbs, esp grains and sugar affects our nervous system function for the better, helps us lower weight (esp in the abdomen) and aid brain function/electrical properties is not news or new.Fats in food build nerve tissue including the brain (esp important in children) aid mood disorders and other nervous system "issues"and is good for heart health.
Fats can alter the chemistry and electrical properties of the brain regardless of your denial of "proof" it is crossing the blood brain barrier


False.
Omega 3's are a fatty acid. Check Medline for Omega 3's and the Blood Brain Barrier. Your science is outdated

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Omega 3's have shown to help Alzheimers in studies.No drug can prevent it, but maybe we can alter it by what we eat and do.I believe we are not destined to genetics or our DNA predisposition to a disease.



http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/12/131204090950.htm


Since fat and protein can convert to glucose if we need it to, a low carb diet isn't harmful to most people and would be beneficial to most Americans with all of "our" health woes ( a lot obesity driven) and esp those concerned with brain, heart health and diabetes.
A low carb lifestyle to me could/would be one different then you or my neighbor, mother or brother.
Our activity level,possibly gender and age and overall metabolic health/IR could all play a role in what is considered low carb for each of us.

I need more in the mornings to do and feel my best to work out and do my running around.I am the most active physically then.
I may get a slight dip in energy late in the day and feel the need for an apple, but don't feel that "sudden dip" like I used many years ago 3/ 4 times a day eating grains and sugars and now an apple will take care of it, thats aprox 20-25 grams of carbs at one time, for some vegetables may do the job..Others may just need a few nuts
There is no one formula for what is considered a low or proper carb intake for every individual.

Some people eat seasonally/regionally grown foods also, so carb intake can vary according to season.
Summers that are hot, active and humid I and many others eat more carbs in the form of watery fruits, esp melons.
In the winter less active, so less carbs and more cooked vegetables.

So a low carb, higher fat diet could indeed be just what the op needs and he has related his bad experience with statins as have others.
They now carry a new FDA warning. http://www.fda.gov/drugs/drugsafety/ucm293101.htm
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 83
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Posted: 12/15/2013 10:01:46 PM

"Studies" regarding omega 3' crossing the blood brain barrier are relatively new as far as what" new" is considered in medical research.


We are talking about energy substrates, not brain scaffolding. The cholesterol in myelin sheaths is produced within the brain tissue by glial cells. For FFAs, there are special pathways and proteins that can faciliate uptake, but they are not used as an energy substrate to any extent.

FFAs in the systemic circulation are bound to proteins which cannot cross the blood brain barrier (what's the MW of albumin???). That's why your body produces ketones when you run low on glucose- it's to keep the brain running.

Please at least read up basic physiology instead of making up whatever you like. You're getting two different processes mixed up.


I hear it almost every day from people that are still told not to eat more than 1 egg yolk a day by their Dr. because of cholesterol.


Medical training in the US leaves much wanting (it's only a 4yr degree right?). I haven't heard anyone say that since the 1980s. Unless you are eating excessive amounts of eggs, it makes little difference to cholesterol.
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 84
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Posted: 12/15/2013 10:50:52 PM

Omega 3's have shown to help Alzheimers in studies.


The jury is still out. We only have some observational studies which show a link between omega 3 consumption and incident dementia. For interventional studies, they haven't as yet shown any benefit.
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
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Posted: 12/16/2013 3:47:37 AM

Medical training in the US leaves much wanting (it's only a 4yr degree right?). I haven't heard anyone say that since the 1980s. Unless you are eating excessive amounts of eggs, it makes little difference to cholesterol.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Technically it is a 4 year degree, but they have 4 years of university that is pre med with physics, biology and chemistry.(I remember when they still took Latin) So it's usually 4 years uni with a BA, med school 4 years and residency 3 years and then fellowship 1-3 years.
It CAN take 12 years and up depending.
Also testing in between takes time.

It's still lacking . Also if they are to be good to great doctors have a good bedside manner/patience and spend time going to further education throughout their careers which should include nutritional "medicine" ( at least 2 years). Unfortunately many seminars are funded by drug companies.Drug companies and makers of products like hip "joints' and STATINS ect will pay doctors to hold seminars themselves.The perks, gifts, monies exchanged and trips are ridiculous.

No one is making money on nutrition ( natures medicine) in the reg western medical field unless they are a Dr of nutrition or a wellness center and some of those are not reputable/reliable either.


The jury is still out. We only have some observational studies which show a link between omega 3 consumption and incident dementia.

The "jury" may be out on that, but it has been shown for years a high fat, lower/ low sugar/carb diet helps mood and emotional disorders esp in children although the brain changes at all ages.
Ask the mothers of these children. That's my "jury".

As far as eggs/fat and other diet changes.It's very easy to test your own results, but most won't bother.
How do you feel physically and mentally? What does your blood work say?How clear are your arteries?
How much inflammation is in your body and why?
Could you make this change or that and re test in 3 months? Yes, if you want to know whats really going on in your body.


That's why your body produces ketones when you run low on glucose- it's to keep the brain running.

Since that was built into us ( we covert fat/protein to glucose), then how can that be bad for at least a while until you know how much carb intake your body can take and be in your OPTIMAL health state?(Not just absence of disease.)
Is 3 months ok? 6 months , a year?

I don't think each individual can go by the exact same formula to find out as I stated before.

Take a high risk patient for certain "diseases", a high carb intake is a high risk danger for and it's many.
Would you not agree a higher fat /lower/low carb diet could jump start start them on the road to recovering optimal health?
Isn't it worth finding out? I think so.
Eventually adding back more healthy carbs and monitoring health/ progress?

Also your state of mind can alter your health tremendously.
Your mind and emotional health must be functioning optimally first to improve physical health, thus fats/less sugar/grains, can help with that in most individuals.
You can take tests (blood lipids, hormone levels, blood pressure /sugar levels ect) in an agitated, stressful or unhappy state of mind one week, not change anything but that state of mind and re test and the results will change.

I also question what "normal" is (in blood work esp).
The range is to broad in some cases for an individual imo.Many can be high or low on the normal scale but not optimal for the individual and still fall in "normal" ranges on paper, thus no change is suggested in diet or lifestyle.
My/your "optimal health" verses " just in a normal range" and optimal ( exp) blood pressure and other health indicators is different than " his or hers" and and change with your state of mind and other factors.
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 86
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Posted: 12/17/2013 1:52:03 AM

.Drug companies and makers of products like hip "joints' and STATINS ect will pay doctors to hold seminars themselves.The perks, gifts, monies exchanged and trips are ridiculous.


You mean cheap plastic Dabigatran pens, Losec post-it notes, Viagra clocks and muffins for journal club? You have to be kidding :)



Since that was built into us ( we covert fat/protein to glucose), then how can that be bad for at least a while until you know how much carb intake your body can take and be in your OPTIMAL health state?(Not just absence of disease.)


I never said it was. I merely pointed out that diets high in carbohydrates are not necessarily unhealthy (again traditional Okinawan diet as an example); and carbohydrate staples (ie grains like rice) have sustained mankind for thousands of years, whereas the emergence of obesity is a relatively recent phenomenon. Even today, many cultures derive most of their kilojoules from carbohydrates/grains with little in the way of obesity related disease.

Excessive refined sugar, high energy diets, poor fruit/vegetable/fibre intake, inactive lifestyles, as well as genetic predisposition result in increased incidence of obesity, cardiovascular disease and various cancers, not the proportion of kilojoules from carbohydrates per se.


You can take tests (blood lipids, hormone levels, blood pressure /sugar levels ect) in an agitated, stressful or unhappy state of mind one week, not change anything but that state of mind and re test and the results will change.


If you're stressed you're going to have increased cortisol and catecholamines right? What does that do to plasma glucose and blood pressure?


I also question what "normal" is (in blood work esp).
The range is to broad in some cases for an individual imo.Many can be high or low on the normal scale but not optimal for the individual and still fall in "normal" ranges on paper, thus no change is suggested in diet or lifestyle.


Reference ranges for most lab tests are taken 2 SD from the mean of a 'healthy population'. You can be entirely healthy with no evidence of any disease and fall outside this range, in fact 1 in 20 people for this very reason. Or if you measured 20 different parameters, chances are one of them will be outside the reference range.

Likewise a disease population can still fall within the reference range (and there will almost certainly be overlap for most conditions).
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 87
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Posted: 12/17/2013 12:32:55 PM

You mean cheap plastic Dabigatran pens, Losec post-it notes, Viagra clocks and muffins for journal club? You have to be kidding :)

Well those too.^^^^^^^Some are hilarious or ridiculous "toys", "gourmet" food items ect.
You should see the huge ceramic nose sticking out of the coffee mug I inherited that a Pharmacy Rep left *BB* and he gave it to me.
I got all the junk for my kid usually.
The" stuff" is silly/cheap that the reps carry but they do get a huge kick back from the drug companies themselves .

The American way vvvvvvv
Lets say you work for Ford/Chrysler /G.M./ * other* in a parts or service dept and you can sell 3 brands of alternator belts there at 3 price points.
The more genuine (GM )alt belts at the end of the year or AC compressors*whatever*, you will get bonuses depending on how many (if you are registered to get bonuses) as the dealership usually doesn't keep it all to keep good employees. They don't want you selling NAPA belts to people.( akin to generic drugs)

Same with brand name drugs and Drs..Could be$ 5000 at some high tech catalog company, a 10,000 dollar trip or cash kick backs.
Its all the same. Physicians are in in retail sales of high profit items just as the Dealership employee. The owner of the practice/cooperation gets the kick back unless the owner/s let the physicians register to participate which is the usual here if they want to attract Drs...or keep the Drs they have. It's a perk.
There have been a few so called "restrictions" on perks by some companies since 2009 or 2010.





If you're stressed you're going to have increased cortisol and catecholamines right? What does that do to plasma glucose and blood pressure?

Cortisol raises blood sugar and blood pressure.It's a built in safety response.
RUN from that tyrannosaurus or rapist!!!
Its why we can run or fight better when confronted with fear.
( fuel muscles so you can run or fight)
Adrenaline raises blood pressure and blood sugar for the same reason fuel/energy in emergencies.

We just have it kick in for a lot of other reasons and sometimes constantly in some people..



http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/stress/SR00001
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 88
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Posted: 12/21/2013 7:47:26 PM
Huh? I don't see anyone here who accepts science-based medicine and is discouraging generic drug use.

We're getting a lot of arguments for and against "alternative" medicine and the like - coming in Petunia's case from just such a self-interested vendor as she is attacking. SHE is in a serious conflict of interest.

This thread's topic is the safe use (or not) of statin-class medications.

Science is a constant search, constant testing, and often refines, reverses or adds to existing knowledge. Some alternative therapies have been tested and accepted into common practise. This is not the case with "secret" formulae that cannot be tested, or are not made available for testing. Homeopathy (not naturopathy or other alternative therapies) is the most thoroughly debunked fraud in medical history, after over a century of failure.

Science is always willing to learn that assumptions are wrong and change practises. Homeopathy and the "cleanse brigades" are not.

Statins CAN save lives; they are measured, as has been noted, against morbidity and mortality rates, not just cholesterol levels. Like ALL medications - including "alternative ones" - they don't work for everybody and can have side effects. Every therapist has to monitor patients and decide whether a particular medication is beneficial, and if it is the best option for that patient. Telling people to watch for statin side effects is a Good Thing; telling everyone that it is a demon drug nobody should take is not.

As far as research and testing goes - to date - there is zero credible evidence that any "cleanse" is beneficial, other than for those specific items we have mentioned.

Extreme caloric restriction to lengthen life has demonstrated some success in humans, but data is sparse because the serious negative health effects have made it difficult to get approval for ethical trials; most of the data is from self-administered experimental subjects.

Oh - in PoF terms, almost every caloric-restriction trial in men has demonstrated chronic impotence among its serious negative health effects.
ED BEAR
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 89
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Posted: 12/22/2013 3:37:48 AM

self-interested vendor

^^^^^^^^

Oh please,Do you want your non existent money back for my opinions?

I am concerned with prescribing drugs that have shown no evidence in helping MOST people that it's prescribed to and the side effects when alternative options are something wise to try.
The Op is about side effects of statins and his experience.
They are expanding statin drug use to treat children when they just have high cholesterol now.
Why not change the diet and lifestyle first? Why not study the effects on children first?
The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends treatment with statins, for children age 8 and older if a child has a high level of LDL cholesterol. The effects of statins have not been studied in children.
LDL is not the cause of heart attacks/strokes unless other risks are involved.


Statins CAN save lives

Never said they NEVER do ,or that there is never a case one should take them.

If you have heart disease/more than one risk factor ( not just high cholesterol)or are male with a previous heart attack, there are studies to support that they may.
I also have never instructed anyone to stop a medication a physician has prescribed. I offer information to discuss with their physician and you don't agree that's reasonable when they ask about it.?

You have the right to disagree. I don't care Ed bear.
 satx78218
Joined: 10/30/2007
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Posted: 12/22/2013 9:11:45 AM
"caloric-restriction trial in men has demonstrated chronic impotence among its serious negative health effects."

google "overweight obesity impotence", for a MUCH GREATER, WIDESPREAD, LONG TERM risk to (men's) health (and men and women's satisfaction), than almost non-existent to extremely rare, short-term "caloric restriction.
 statemachine500
Joined: 8/25/2011
Msg: 91
Instant Old Age
Posted: 12/22/2013 1:50:23 PM
^^^^
No kidding .

I love that new Lipitor commercial,even the dog is a fan.
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
Msg: 92
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Posted: 12/23/2013 2:34:49 AM
^^^^^^

The United States and New Zealand are the only countries in the world that allow direct-to-consumer advertising of pharmaceuticals. Most countries banned the practice in the 1940s.


http://io9.com/5853356/sick-of-pharmaceutical-ads-heres-why-they-wont-go-away

If a physician wants to keep his patient happy, he will often prescribe what the patient asks for because of ads on TV.
We are bombarded with them.The increase in Rx drug profits/consumption show its working.

Are you sad? Take this
Can't sleep, Take this
High cholesterol, Take this.,"Talk to your Dr. about this drug" ect

Listen to how fast they go over some of the side effects.
Then we have ads for suing the drug companies by law firms ( class action suits) in the same hour.

Was watching an old movie on TV yesterday and saw 5 rx commercials in less than 30 minutes. The first one came on so I flipped the channel, there was another, flipped it again and another.
You cant get away from them.

From the Huffington post
For every dollar pharmaceutical companies spend on "basic research," $19 goes toward promotion and marketing.

And apparently it's been working. Drug company revenues climbed more than $200 billion in the years between 1995 and 2010, according to the website MinnPost.
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 93
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Posted: 12/24/2013 3:39:31 AM

The United States and New Zealand are the only countries in the world that allow direct-to-consumer advertising of pharmaceuticals. Most countries banned the practice in the 1940s.
http://io9.com/5853356/sick-of-pharmaceutical-ads-heres-why-they-wont-go-away

If a physician wants to keep his patient happy, he will often prescribe what the patient asks for because of ads on TV.
We are bombarded with them.The increase in Rx drug profits/consumption show its working.


There are very few direct to consumer advertisments for drugs in NZ, I can't remember the last time I saw anything apart from OTC meds like paracetamol and ibuprofen. Doctors usually prescribe what's subsidsed by Pharmac, unless the patient wants a particular brand (eg ventolin instead of salamol), but they end up paying more for it.

Prescribing in NZ also tends to be fairly uniform and driven by Pharmac, which is the central Govt agency that subsidises medicines in hospital and community. They do have a bias over generics and what gives most value for money. As a result, NZ's pharmaceutical spending is amongst the lowest in the world.
http://www.bmj.com/content/340/bmj.c2441

Compare that to Australia, where there might be ten different brands or varieties of statins, PPIs, antihypertensives- you name it. The Australian tries to emulate Pharmac with the PBS (Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme), but it is not nearly as effective.
 Skyr
Joined: 3/30/2008
Msg: 94
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Posted: 12/24/2013 3:48:07 AM

The United States and New Zealand are the only countries in the world that allow direct-to-consumer advertising of pharmaceuticals. Most countries banned the practice in the 1940s.
http://io9.com/5853356/sick-of-pharmaceutical-ads-heres-why-they-wont-go-away

If a physician wants to keep his patient happy, he will often prescribe what the patient asks for because of ads on TV.
We are bombarded with them.The increase in Rx drug profits/consumption show its working.


I can't remember the last time I saw anything direct advertising in NZ apart from OTC meds like paracetamol and ibuprofen. Doctors usually prescribe what's subsidised by Pharmac, unless the patient wants a particular brand (eg ventolin instead of salamol), but they end up paying more for it.

Prescribing in NZ also tends to be fairly uniform because it is driven by Pharmac, the central Govt agency which subsidises medicines in hospital and community. They do have a bias over generics and what gives most value for money. NZ's pharmaceutical spending per capita is amongst the lowest in the developed world.
http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/content/table/pharmexpcap-table-en
http://www.bmj.com/content/340/bmj.c2441

Compare that to Australia, where there might be ten different brands or varieties of statins, PPIs, antihypertensives- you name it. The Australians try to emulate Pharmac with the PBS (Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme), but it is not nearly as effective.
 Reality.of.Life
Joined: 1/31/2013
Msg: 95
Instant Old Age
Posted: 1/3/2014 9:36:40 AM
I have been trying to age the old fashioned way, decades of booze and sex :)
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 96
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Posted: 1/9/2014 11:45:21 PM
In Canada, one can advertise a drug ("talk to your doctor about Blitzemol," or the bouncing Viagra guy) or what it does ("do you have social anxiety disorder?" or "there may be a better medication if you're on Coumadin"), but not both in the same ad. The rules on freebies to doctors from drug reps have been dramatically tightened up in the last few years, and it's even hard to get permission to give away those simple pens with a company's name on them.

In Canada, almost all the pharmaceutical companies' money goes to getting approvals (including lobbying) and advertising. Transfer pricing to foreign parent manufacturers takes a bit, too. Precious little research done here, though we have strengths in vaccines and radiomedecine.

The excesses and greed exhibited by pharmaceutical companies is depressing and dispiriting. But their ethical standards far outstrip any detected in the "alternative medicine" camp, in my experience.
ED BEAR
 Peppermint_Petunias
Joined: 3/30/2012
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Posted: 1/16/2014 4:02:52 AM

But their ethical standards far outstrip any detected in the "alternative medicine" camp, in my experience.


So a drug is better than ........ say adding veggies, omega 3's or mineral rich foods to your diet first?

Makes perfect sense to someone I guess.
 or_current_resident
Joined: 6/3/2013
Msg: 98
Instant Old Age
Posted: 1/16/2014 3:10:59 PM

The excesses and greed exhibited by pharmaceutical companies is depressing and dispiriting.


Imo, Big Pharma are serving those first of all who actually need these drugs, etc…..
But also…… those do not care in their life style per say……..
And …………….wish to be provide with [with drugs] from Big Pharma to provide & counter react…. for them to at least something to live a little longer regardless of ones lifestyle etc……weird but hey,…thats what it is out there... till the fat lady sings a little more here…..^^^^

And then you have the Big Pill Industry [vits & minerals]……."Pills are good" is the same way for them in the big business enterprise….
gowd, how the health nuts, the Dr. Feelgoods,& snake charmers,etc must all love that Senator from Utah…Udal who made alternative pills unregulated back in the 70's…..that state is big on Pill are good…. production….. go figure….. ^^^^^

And if it says "Natural"…….they will be falling over themselves to buy it & tell their clients too…..good health to all..
 mitchozie
Joined: 3/11/2009
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Posted: 1/17/2014 4:26:30 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Incoherent, maybe too much of those big pharma drugs!
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
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Posted: 1/20/2014 2:01:58 AM
Peppermint Petuinias: "So a drug is better than ........ say adding veggies, omega 3's or mineral rich foods to your diet first?"

Maybe it is. Maybe it isn't. But there is little-to-no regulation or responsibility in the promotion of products not marketed as drugs as long as they are careful not to make claims on the packaging of their products they can't back up with science. (Those go in the self-help books, pamphlets and ads.)

A certain quick-to-litigate secret-formula cold-remedy peddler is still making claims based on a very small significant difference in hard-to-measure recovery times (less than a day - and exactly when do we declare the cold is over?) that have never been replicated, AND still fighting (last I looked) to continue putting other claims on their boxes (such as preventative benefits) that have had zero science or even explanation provided.

So I urge my fellows to question what drug companies say, read and ask questions, and hold non-medical remedy providers to the same standards. The latter have fought revelation and regulation tooth-and-nail, and have blocked a number of attempts to regulate them in the last decade.

"Alternative medicine" lobbyists in the US have consistently demanded that all drug products be 100% proven safe and effective within three months of introduction (pretty much impossible both theoretically and practically) and at the same time that all "alternative" products be completely unregulated if they can't be 100% proven dangerous in three months. Surprising?
ED BEAR
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