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Show ALL Forums  > Australia  > Equality with DV victims      Home login  
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 bela_kiss
Joined: 11/3/2012
Msg: 36
Equality with DV victimsPage 3 of 3    (1, 2, 3)

Childish it may seem but when it opposes opinions to others, it speaks for it's self. It's impossible to count the amount of times I get attacked for exposing such data. Hopefully not here but in many cases, these types of discussions turn into attacking the messenger instead of the topic.


I wasn't referring to your opinion,nor the information in the link( I hadn't read it) as being childish, it was your opening line that I thought was infantile and antagonistic. It appeared to me that it is a case of the messenger doing the attacking.



It's because women's support is government funded while governments aren't willing to do the same for men.


Yes, this is true, but it wasn't always the case, the first women's refuges in Australia and many other western countries were set up by the victims themselves and run entirely by volunteers, with no funding what so ever.
Once they were established, the need became more visible, and with lobbying by the victims and by sympathetic, pro bono lawyers on their behalf they obtained funding from the government. This is the way many groups gain funding in our country, it may not be the best system but it works...maybe you should try it instead of venting your frustrations in a forum.
 tie_me_up81
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 37
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/2/2013 12:00:00 AM

Sometimes I have witnessed how some women conduct their conflict/resolution skills(? read utter lack of) towards their partners and I can see how much they play a part. To be totally honest OP does the same thing. Quick smack on the petulant tanty throwing botty might calm him down, stop him being so aggressive and maybe he might finally start growing up....but meh there are lots of toddler/adults running around, why should he learn anything different, afterall it is probably the only way he gets attention.


Please elaborate this nonsense.

It seems like you are desperately trying to make up things about me out of thin air just to take any old cheap shot at me.

The reason why you are doing this, it seems in your little mind, a male isn't entitled to raise gender issues that affect men...or else, he is this, that, and the thousand other childish slander tactics people come up with when they can't handle a legitimate topic that's too politically incorrect for their liking.


The pathetic excuse of being a mere male with no money should make you feel positive cos mere women with no money have done the same thing.


Absolute BS, it's either women with lots of money who can pull it off or they get government funding. A person with no money, has no power, no resources. What part of this don't you understand?

Pathetic excuse? LOL yeah like I can just wave a magic wand and get 10s of thousands of dollars to set a service up for men.

My goodness, I can't believe how people can be so simplistic.

Here's the funniest part to all of this, you or no one in here is placing any blame AT ALL towards the people who work in these DV agencies who are actually doing the discrimination against men and who are actually causing this problem!

So instead, what do you do? You blame the person who makes a thread about it.

GOTTA LARF!

This same logic is just as pathetic and stupid if I was to tell a woman that's it's all her fault and she should shut up, not say a word, not make a thread about it, not make a post about it, and magically with a wand do something about it, if she simply raised a point about discrimination against women.

So the next time a woman on this forum mentions glass ceilings or pay gaps, she's not allowed to raise the issue, right? If she does, how many people will be making out that it's all her fault because she hasn't got a magic wand to do something about it?

Would zero be the right answer?

Imagine if people blamed the woman who raises these issues and left the men who actually causes the problem out of the picture?

People would be so quick to squeal "misogyny", wouldn't they?

This is why I hate political correctness, it makes others accept and be so blithe with such obvious double standards.


Please note when utterly poverty stricken many years ago with kids to feed I went to the Red Cross for food etc., they factor in if you have a pet because they know most people will feed their animal first and so the Red Cross also provides food for the cat, dog etc regardless of the gender of the owner. In the same vein some women and more especially their children are attached to their pets and along with the trauma of having to go to a refuge, many have been refused entry and many have refused to leave a dangerous situation because of their pets.


Yes, of course, because ya know, pets come before men. Pet's are more important than men. If an organisation has so much spare money, it's better to spend it on pets instead of the other half of the human population.

Yes, I can see so much intelligence in this.
 blueeyes179
Joined: 3/26/2013
Msg: 38
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/2/2013 5:36:09 AM
I am just curious Tie me up81, are you a victim of domestic vilolence yourself?
 tie_me_up81
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 39
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/2/2013 11:46:49 AM

I note you didn't argue with the first paragraph.


Because I rolled my eyes and didn't bother responding to such ignorance that's irrelevant to the topic. But as you are so wanting me to respond, sure.


Men are only needed for maybe at best a 15 min bonk to make a baby after that (possibly a further bonk or so to make sure) they are dispensable to the human race


This is absolutely laughable when looking at all the hard labouring and dangerous jobs men have died and risked their lives for to keep us ALL alive and to take us where we are today.

Here is a prime example.

http://www.warrenfarrell.com/labor_day_art.htm

If men didn't exists, would women have all the high quality infrastructure that we have today? Or would you poor women still be living in caves or straw huts?


Here's the thing, if in the case of female DV refuges with the majority of the women there having been in heterosexual relationships then by the standard powers of deduction I would suggest the social workers etc have not and are not causing the problem but da dah MEN with serious anger management issues.


You mean the men who hurt these women? What about the other men who are victims and have nothing to do with these women?

Oh, just because they share the same gender as them other men with "anger management issues", that means they can't be trusted too? They are evil too?

What does bigotry mean again?

Anyway, I can just imagine if a woman was in this forum complaining about how she's affected by a glass ceiling. Then I was to say, well piss off and make your own business/company, that way you can be the boss. The men who are discriminating you shouldn't be at fault, it's all your fault because you aren't waving a magic wand and getting all this money to make your own business.

I am sure that would go down REEEAAALLL well. I wouldn't be considered a sexist at all. heh heh

Just imagine blacks being discriminated against in DV services, it's not much different than discriminating men. After all, they are human beings too, they deserve equal consideration and support as well as the next human with a different skin colour.

Double standards galore!

There is no point discussing such things with people like you greyingred. Your mind seems to be stuck inside the box. Due to political correctness or your anti male bias, you don't seem capable to think outside the box and look at the whole picture.

The only people who are at fault for why men are discriminated against are simply the people who work in these services that make the act of discrimination. . Not any male who simply makes a thread about it.

Excluding all the generalisations and hyperbole towards this certain issue, like the legit cases where women are truly facing glass ceilings or pay gap, why blame these women? Wouldn't any logical person blame the men who are actually causing the problem? No one in here wouldn't be telling these women to shut up and make their own business, right?
 Paul9473
Joined: 2/12/2013
Msg: 40
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/2/2013 1:52:22 PM
You seem to have some misconceived notion that you are the lone warrior raising awareness fighting against the hordes of the ignorant.
Seriously have a look at all of the above posts and ask yourself ``Have I made a difference in inspiring people to do something to help men in DV or is it backfiring and more likely to increase the DV figure by one strung up OP''?

There is no point discussing such things with people like you...
As you seem to be painting everyone who has a different opinion as you in this manner, why do you see a point in opening your mouth at all?
Have a look at Bellakiss's post again. If you want something done, then that is the path to take. If you're so convinced of your own ineptitude then start getting to work on that magic wand of yours. You'll have more luck with it than your current charismatic winsome manner.
 Tah,
Joined: 11/18/2008
Msg: 41
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/2/2013 2:11:51 PM
I guess those who are shooting the messenger, have an inability to think for themselves and need to search for ways out of addressing that fact., rather than address the message. Similar reasons as to why people control others in relationships....
 peony-rose
Joined: 9/24/2012
Msg: 42
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/3/2013 12:15:24 AM
Mr Tie Me Up:

What has lead to you being so wound up and aware of this issue? Have you personally experienced DV? Have you personally been discriminated against by organisations assisting people in this field? Do you have close friends or relatives who have experienced these issues?

If it is such a major issue (as you make it sound) then why are we not hearing about it?

Perhaps your energy would be better used either supporting the people in this predicament, gaining public exposure for them, getting it in the press etc, or better still perhaps you should go and study sociology, social work or psychology at uni. That way you could become constructive instead of simply being critical of women and society. Oh and you might learn a little more about issues of power in society - particularly male/female.

I really do think that perhaps you just enjoy arguing with people regardless of the topic.
 blueeyes179
Joined: 3/26/2013
Msg: 43
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/3/2013 1:57:55 AM
I asked the same question Peony-Rose, but he did not answer me, maybe because my post was too short??
 tie_me_up81
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 44
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/5/2013 1:26:20 AM
I couldn't be bothered going on with more direct replies to the ignorant.

This is how it is, there are a few in here asking me "why should I care"...like this problem is not worth caring about. Does anyone else find this highly disturbing?

It seems just because "worthless" men are on the receiving end of discrimination, people, especially men, aren't expected to care about it at all. We are expected to just turn the other cheek and think "yeah discriminate my gender more and more."... How dare I call it out or say anything about it. Men are expected to shut up and remain silent and deferential.

Here we have society having all this concern for female issues and on the other hand, it's questioned why should we care about a male issue.

I don't understand why people don't find this mindset sickening.

Due to the history of the status of women, this has made political correctness gone way too far.
 blueeyes179
Joined: 3/26/2013
Msg: 45
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/5/2013 1:52:15 AM
Hmmmm As I am not ignorant and you have no idea of my story, you assume that answering a direct question is beneath you, I somehow think your idea of domestic vilolence is your mummy boxing your ears, I was actually genuinely concerned and was going to suggest you contact a counceller or perhaps Beyond Blue.. 1300 224636. good luck
 tie_me_up81
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 46
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/5/2013 1:57:55 AM
blueeyes179

You certainly don't have any concern at all with males being discriminated against in the DV industry, which clearly shows your anti male bigotry.
 blueeyes179
Joined: 3/26/2013
Msg: 47
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/5/2013 7:28:01 AM
OK Tie me up,
you win, I am anti male and on a dating site, makes perfect sence to....... no one, I would say more but as I am too busy laughing at your stupid comment I can't type anymore, I really hope you get the help you so obviously need ,as you do need some, to be straight I think your post was purely to rile up women and to get as many bites as you could, so if your in a thread from now on guarentee it will only to be trying to get a few more bites
 Moon_Rocket
Joined: 4/20/2012
Msg: 48
view profile
History
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/5/2013 4:02:21 PM
Game set and match and the winner is.......Blueeeeeeeeeyes!

(All done in big booming voice and American accent of course)

Well done guys, can we go back to being nice now?
 Tah,
Joined: 11/18/2008
Msg: 49
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/5/2013 7:19:53 PM

I don't understand why people don't find this mindset sickening.


I find it dangerous...

but isn't this issue indicitive of our society.

our policy towards drugs, is reactionary one, we react towards the most obvious target
our policy towards road saftey is exactly the same
so is our policy towards health
towards climate change
towards about everything
including family violence..

We live in a society, where its not we do, its what are seen to be doing that matters..
 MrsNaamah
Joined: 11/8/2011
Msg: 50
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/8/2013 3:47:17 PM

guess those who are shooting the messenger, have an inability to think for themselves and need to search for ways out of addressing that fact., rather than address the message.

Maybe, to an extent, (like, I don't agree with how people will often mention the OPs profile content to try to discredit him), but I think there is more to it than that in this case. There are many social issues where I think men suffer disadvantages, and this topic certainly falls into that category. These issues deserve having a spotlight shone on them with the intention of creating positive change. But I don’t think it serves any genuine purpose when they are merely brought up to be used as “weapons in the war against women” and the opening post did set that tone. The impression conveyed is that this is more about resenting women than helping men, and most people can tell the difference between someone who genuinely seeks passionate discourse about a particular subject, and someone who just wants to pick a fight. This OP repeatedly chooses to debate in a manner that favours provocation over promotion. As a result he invites reaction to his tone rather than to the issue. So reall ( and this is the part that I find disappointing) he distracts from the issue, even as he claims to be trying to increase awareness of it. He is but an antagonist in protagonist’s clothing. As such I think he does a disservice to every valid topic he touches.
 tie_me_up81
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 51
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/9/2013 12:33:44 AM

But I don’t think it serves any genuine purpose when they are merely brought up to be used as “weapons in the war against women” and the opening post did set that tone. The impression conveyed is that this is more about resenting women than helping men


Please explain in logical detail and point out posts of mine where I am somehow waging a war against women?

This is what I say in the OP "This will make the PC/feminist crowd pissed."

There is a HUGE difference between pointing my finger at the people who are PC when it comes to gender issues and/or feminists than there is to point my finger at the whole female gender.

It's like a woman saying something like... "this will piss off a men's rights activists".

Does this mean she's attacking the whole male gender?

But I guess there is once again another double standard for that one.

It seems to me that no matter what way or how a male presents such issues, plenty of people will always resort to attacking the messenger, as for he's a misogynists, he's attacking women, he's a whiner, he's pathetic etc etc etc.

That prejudice alone against a male who raises these issues is sexist within it's self. There seems to be no way possible for a male to raise male issues without being belittled for it. Thank political correctness for that.

Why can't men ever be seen the same as a feminist or any woman who raises gender issues? Why can't men ever have an equal seat to the table to voice their opinion when it comes to gender issues?

If you don't treat men the same as women when they raise gender issues, obviously you're not really interested in equality at all.

If you truly think that I'm attacking women, with no double standards in play, that would also mean feminists are attacking all men every time they raise female issues.
 tie_me_up81
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 52
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/9/2013 12:45:03 AM
The same types of double standards and social mindsets are in play when it's a white person expressing supportive views for whites. No doubt the racist card will not be far away from being pulled with slander tactic after slander tactic.

I'm just tired of the political correct mindset that gives the previously discriminated against group the "favoured" status, thus discriminating against the group that's not previously discriminated against. That isn't equal rights. It's being no better than the males/whites who are the discriminators against women/minorities.
 peony-rose
Joined: 9/24/2012
Msg: 53
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/9/2013 2:32:18 AM
You need to get that chip off your shoulder, and take a look at the tone of most of your posts towards women in general.
 qldblue
Joined: 2/4/2009
Msg: 54
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/9/2013 2:42:26 PM
Domestic Violence is a rather complex issue at best and a no go area at worst for men in that just like women fighting for the right to vote back in the early part of the 20th century.

It is the mindset of people that has created the problem of victims not being treated equal as the major theory is that men commit most of the violence therefore men should not be treated equal.

The situation of men being the victim of DV is only really very new to society perception wise, it has been around for centuries but men were taught not to show their soft/ vulunrable/ weak side just as women were taught not to show that they had a brain.

Equality for victims of DV will come about eventually as society changes.
 tie_me_up81
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 55
Equality with DV victims
Posted: 4/10/2013 12:32:36 AM

You need to get that chip off your shoulder, and take a look at the tone of most of your posts towards women in general.


Again, you are using the same old misconception to attack the messenger instead of the problem being expressed. Someone who can comprehend can clearly see that my recent posts above is being critical towards political correctness, not women in general as a gender.

Using your logic, with no double standards, that would mean feminists have a chip on their shoulder too. It would also mean that you have a chip on your shoulder, as earlier in this thread, you were discussing female issues.

It's either you don't realise your hypocrisy or you're simply a shameless hypocrite.

With this mindset, it seems that the only time it's acceptable to raise gender issues is when it's in favour of women. Other than that, shudap shudap shudap. (misspelling made in purpose)


Suggest he uses this forum to get off when he has no company. Sorry Angel of death cos you are right, his profile screams for this sort of negative reaction and should be ignored but MEH


Again, another childish ad hominem tactic to shift the focus away from the actual issues being expressed. The misogyny card and the rest of your bogus claims are simply created to change the direction of the topic towards me instead of the actual issues being raised.

Like your buddy peony-rose, you seem to think men aren't allowed to raise male issues. How dare we have the same freedom of speech that feminists or women in general are so entitled to have.

Your attitude is no better than the troglodytes that many of us complain about from the past.
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