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Show ALL Forums  > Broken Hearts  > this ladies, is how good guys become jerks      Home login  
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 TodaysCatch
Joined: 4/12/2008
Msg: 164
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerksPage 8 of 9    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9)
So, it's interesting looking at this post years later, after the OP has left.

Everything from the title of the post to his defense of his attitudes and actions screams what many nice guys apparently desire - pure, unadulterated pity, with no smartass remarks to dilute it. That's their meat and potatoes, but a side of sympathy wouldn't be bad, either. Both are in short supply here.

There needs to be a forum where this is the rule: a nice guy puts forth how the world is unfair, and we are allowed only to give him the pity that he seeks. Seriously. Give him what he wants, 'cause life is short, it ain't fair, and we don't need any more latent serial killers feeling society has rejected them for the last time. It's no skin off our backs to type a few kind words expressing how sorry we are for him, is it? I trust you'll sleep at night if you don't really mean it.

And shame on us for discounting his past deeds, unilaterally branding them as driven by an ulterior motive, whatever that may have been. Our penance should be to commit a random act of kindness. But just one, 'cause any more and we'll be seen as nice guys or gals, and nobody wants that. Yeah, it's a hassle to do a good deed, so just imagine you'll get something you want out of the experience. Wait a minute . . .

We kinda rely on people like this, don't we? They make us feel better about ourselves. Look at that guy - he was deluded by a woman that wasn't into him. What a sucker, defending that homeless guy and getting a scar for his trouble. Eew, that woman is choking on her own barf - glad it wasn't me that helped her. At least the deeds were done. Subtract his efforts - would you have taken his place? Maybe, or maybe a homeless guy would get beat up, a drunk gal would die, a woman would have friend-zoned one less chump - we don't know, but it sure swings with popular sentiment to condemn him for his patently insincere actions. Crowd mentality online is compounded by the relative anonymity factor, innit?

The best advice I saw for him in these responses was a comment by a woman who said no matter how nice a guy is, she still had to be attracted to him. Seems simple enough, so people should realize that being nice may or may not be a component of their attractiveness, and it certainly isn't the whole of it. Let's not forget that people have proven time and again that they don't really know what they want, so why try to anticipate it? Be who you are, satisfied in the knowledge that even if you have personality traits that seem off-putting, someone may still find you attractive. And not feeling like a patsy for unrewarded effort may keep your sociopathic impulses in check. Yep, an unfair world can actually work to your advantage - imagine that.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 165
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 7/23/2017 4:06:37 PM

The OP made several mistakes. 1. he tried to move in when it was inappropriate to do so.

Wait -- I think the only inappropriate thing he did was after-the-fact (going off on her), once it became Clear she didn't really like him. Move in? She was pro-active in leading him on... in That way ("For example that night when we were making plans she said "I'll come over to your place, we'll phuck and then go dancing". How many women says stuff like that to guys?"). So it's not like he was "moving in" on her. You could say he was naive to not see writing on the wall she was f-ing with him, but to what degree is inconclusive (too little info).

2. he realised he had been friend zoned and knew the woman fancied others yet chose to ignore that and chose to carry on as he was which then will have started to get him from friendzone to creepzone.

Again, look at my quote from him on what she said when they were making plans of going out. He didn't ignore it -- he just didn't Walk as soon as she was going to kiss the guy she liked in front of him (or just not go out and say "have fun with [Brad]"). He was naive... and I think he was a fool to get ticked At Them right then when they walked away from him when he was helping out the fallen gal. And strategically in error to give ammo to someone (her) to falsely believe you were just an overall creep in the first place by Ending it like a creep (even though he had the right to be Pissed).

Nice guys (genuinely nice guys) don't carry on trying to get into a girls pants when she is clearly after someone else.

Not so fast. :) Mr Nice Guys can be quite naive... and will, when they have a crush on a gal who expresses she Likes him but is getting mixed messages, follow the trail with them, make plans about going out, etc... and even sometimes even give the outing a chance when they tell them "[Brad] is going to meet up with us", when they know she likes [Brad]. If I'm in his shoes and it was to be just she and myself, and she threw that out there, after saying we can "phuck" at my place then go out -- I'd be frustrated as heck. Not many times ya run into said situation. I'd give it a go to see if things Would kick off at my place, but have other friends to meet up with us if [Brad] was cumming out to meet her. I would have just said that hey, I don't want to be a 3rd wheel if your plans are to meet [Brad], and just not gone out (unless there was a group of mutual friends too).

Nice guys (or any brand of guys) aren't going to tell a gal they have a crush on "No my dear, you may not come over and fool around with me before going out." Many nice guys are going to be poor on picking up signals of their Real interest, and many are going to avoid Canceling plans when it has danger written all over it... because they tend to see things from an inexperienced perspective, naively assuming everyone is more or less good too (and not going to make out in front of me with a guy ya like; she may flirt a good amount at the most, but she's not my gf).

Getting the pootang is not the final goal.

Tell that to [Brad] who porked her silly that night. :) I don't think OP's overall goal was to "score" -- it was to solidify her interest. And if that meant heck-yeah-sure from her offer to "phuck" at his place before going out, yeah. I think OP knew this was a weird situation, but he was naive to carry out that planned outing with her after Brad's-cumming was announced.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 166
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 7/24/2017 10:05:39 AM

A sensible person would reflect on this. Learn the signs then learn to walk away when they see situations like this again.

Yeah, he should learn from it and not just have disdain toward gals and run with it (or disdain toward guys in a reverse situation). How Easy it was to "see" it though, we'd have to be there. There can be situations where you cannot blame a rookie -- or even some with some experience -- from not catching on quick enough when the other person is f'ing with them, when done unusually.

There are plenty of men who behave in exactly the same way as the girl in this scenario. They are known as "players".

Actually I disagree. This is how someone in His position -- if he's handsome enough and has good communication skills -- Become players. Disdain, "screw it" mentality after getting f'd with. Even though she played him for emotional adoration, she wasn't a "player". She was a tease. She was just f'ing with him. If she was a "player" she Actually would have "phucked" him, and nothing in a player's "handbook" would say to make out with someone you like in front of them on a pre-destined outing (in fact, if anything, Not to do that).

But I agree, although they're different animals, to learn from people screwing you over in whatever way -- and better pick up on warning signs and learn not to take those extra steps of involvement. Instead, he should have canceled the outing with her once she brought up [Brad] showing up, knowing she liked him -- and just been hurt at that point ("Why did she say she wanted to come over and phuck me and go out, then say [Brad] was going to show up with us? We're not an item, but WTF?").

Why change yourself and get nasty because of something you could avoid in the future?

Well, you should change yourself To better avoid harsh situations in the future. And everyone in his position is going to be Pissed, and rightfully so, and should. But they shouldn't have a disdain toward a whole gender due to it. Sometimes it takes a Big Sting to make people avoid it. And he has -- but hopefully not hissing at "girls" in general. One also needs to learn how Rare (or Common) a situation they fell in was. His was Rare, and should take peace of mind in that.

By pointing out the obvious perhaps they can learn to stay away from these situations in the future.

It's also learning from Non-obvious situations. His wasn't necessarily all that obvious. A gal who likes you for guy attention is rarely going to say she'd like to phuck ya then go out dancing. The hurt is that given things lining up, yeah, he could have crossed the platonic barrier. But then there was [Brad] who entered into the picture. He got a warning. That was the Obvious part to learn from, not to continue it once that was known. But he'd still be hurt pretty bad, even if he did cancel it. It sort of came swooping in quick. But he can learn to avoid a deeper wound that he had -- and that very very few girls are like that (even if she Didn't make out with [Brad] in front of him)... and to bear that in mind when it comes to the female population.
 Inicia
Joined: 4/12/2015
Msg: 167
this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 7/26/2017 7:04:29 AM
people are either jerks or not you do not become a jerk.. many people change opinions about many groups of people based on one, a few or several experiences with said group of others. That my dear friend is how stereotypes and prejudices are born and justified with supposed rationale...
you will be fine just maintain this rationale and you will find justification for your stereotypes and conclusions with a us and them or those people attitudes...
 forumslady
Joined: 12/7/2016
Msg: 168
this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 7/27/2017 10:24:55 PM
Inicia- " people are either jerks or not you do not become a jerk.. many people change opinions about many groups of people based on one, a few or several experiences with said group of others. That my dear friend is how stereotypes and prejudices are born and justified with supposed rationale...
you will be fine just maintain this rationale and you will find justification for your stereotypes and conclusions with a us and them or those people attitudes..."

Well said, although, people CAN become jerks, that weren't, but at the end of the day, that is ALWAYS their choice.
 basilisk123
Joined: 12/17/2011
Msg: 169
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 7/28/2017 12:35:46 AM
I understand frustration. Trust me, I UNDERSTAND frustration. It hurts being rejected, passed up, abused, etcetera, and it can do a number on your heart and self confidence. Some people choose to use it as a stepping stone to better themselves, some people lash out in anger, and yet others shut down. As others have said, it is a choice of what to do with these frustrations. I wish I could gloriously proclaim that I was one of the ones with the fortitude to use the pain from frustration to make myself better, but I am not. I only passed between the last two my entire life. Either lashing out at myself for being unattractively weak, or shutting down so I don't have to deal with the pain of being hurt. That is my life as of now. Some people are just so unsuccessful at finding relationships at all, they can do is feel hurt. HOWEVER, there is a choice, always a choice.
 omgherecomesb
Joined: 12/19/2017
Msg: 170
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 12/27/2017 7:13:25 AM
First of all.. you tried to friend her up to get ****

Second of all, you were her time boy and she used you exactly how you wanted to be used. She'd have respected you more if you just walked away the very first time.. but you let her use you.

Lesson learned, dont friend them, **** them
 feirene
Joined: 1/3/2017
Msg: 171
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 6/2/2018 7:41:16 PM

She just broke up with her boyfriend...so I thought if I was around and she was ready, we'd end up together.


You were a jerk before what she did.
 Inicia
Joined: 4/12/2015
Msg: 172
this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 6/2/2018 8:43:50 PM
wow- flip- wow-what th ever---wow good guy???? yuck keep it maybe when you get older a little decorum and decency will arrive..
 NewYorker58
Joined: 6/11/2013
Msg: 173
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 6/5/2018 9:36:05 PM
I think he was already a jerk for wanting to get involved with someone that was currently with someone, and for being part of that pic she took to make her bf jealous.

A problem men have, they see you're available, and think it means you should date them, just because they're interested.
 Viper1j
Joined: 2/6/2015
Msg: 174
this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 6/7/2018 5:06:48 AM
You need to embrace the power!

You'll know what she feels, when you have some poor chick crying, and through her tears she looks at you and says, "how can you treat me this way?"

You whip out a picture of the other one and say "Ask her! She taught me everything I know!" :-)
 browneyesboo
Joined: 1/17/2018
Msg: 175
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 6/7/2018 12:18:15 PM
I can see being a jerk to someone who was a jerk to you,
but I don't get passing it on to the next person.

If everyone did that, wouldn't we all be ***holes and jerks?

I can listen to an asshat at the bookie and then greet the
next person with a smile and a hello. There are a bunch of
fribbles on the forums, but that doesn't mean I dislike the
rest.

There are some people I don't care to see ever again, but
it doesn't mean I dislike ALL people...just most of them...
hahahahaha!
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 176
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 6/11/2018 10:33:26 AM

I think he was already a jerk for wanting to get involved with someone that was currently with someone, and for being part of that pic she took to make her bf jealous.

I don't think that's being a Jerk at all. Naive? Sure. Mean to her? Of course not. She wanted to take a picture with him to make her (soon to be ex?) BF jealous, and he went along with it -- understandably thinking she may Like him, so when they break up, he'd be an option at least. I think his problem was he let his gut/heart dictate everything, thinking he would ride off into the sunset with her once she broke up with her BF in the background.

He probably didn't pick up on the signs she Wasn't that into him when the rubber met the road. He was in a situation where any reasonable guy would feel a bit let down when he'd have a bit of a crush on a gal who was breaking up with her BF, when she wasn't. If I'm going to hang out with a gal I know who's flirty & newly single, and she knows I like her in that way -- I'm going to be Ticked if she meets up with a guy while out and about with me, and kisses him in front of me and brushes me off once she has more desirable company. She did give him a last-minute warning, but that doesn't make things kosher. But OP is naive and had his hopes Too High leading up to this, which led him into an emotional car-crash that was avoidable.

In response to her last-minute warning, I would have told her that if she was wanting to be out with some guy she was attracted to, that I'll leave you two be. I think OP didn't do this because he would be "giving up", and understandable frustrated to punt the ball like that. Either way, he wasn't in a happy situation -- he just made it worse for himself. As long as he understands this, and that's not how most gals are -- he won't have this angst about girls/dating, and won't be a d!ck when it comes to dating.
 SiennaBear2
Joined: 12/2/2017
Msg: 177
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 6/13/2018 3:30:26 PM
She wasn't into you, she was just enjoying having you as a friend to muck around with.
 lulz567
Joined: 7/6/2018
Msg: 178
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 7/13/2018 5:14:34 PM
Oh great takes 3 whole weeks to turn a nice man into a Jerk. Women it takes probably at least 10 years of these bad boys behaviour. The weaker sex babe .
 missvixen22
Joined: 7/28/2018
Msg: 179
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/2/2018 6:29:59 AM
You know how good women become total ****es? Men claiming to be the nice guy (so old) and men lying, cheating, using and abusing women.
 Sweet_Danimal
Joined: 10/31/2015
Msg: 180
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/4/2018 6:44:13 PM

you know how good women become total ****es? Men claiming to be the nice guy (so old) and men lying, cheating, using and abusing women.


(From Profile) I like guys who are confident (not arrogant) who never correct a woman (my mom says it's rude) even if she's wrong and who are fully and completely LOYAL.

If you want a guy that's never going to correct you or your behavior, then you are getting back EXACTLY what you want for yourself - A guy who is going to do whatever the hell he wants to do. You cannot demand guys fix their own flaws while totally accepting your own. That's hypocrisy. Relationships are built on the tolerance and enjoyment of each other AS THEY ARE. If you want loyalty and honesty from a guy, that includes calling out your own bullsh1t when it shows up. Even the nicest guys don't HAVE to be nice (OR loyal) when women treat them like dogs. Behavior begets mutual behavior. Doesn't matter what you say or demand or believe - if your actions show you insist on staying independent and uncaring, then the guy is going to give back exactly what you dish out.
 missvixen22
Joined: 7/28/2018
Msg: 181
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/8/2018 7:43:15 PM
Where did I say I was interested in staying independent? I'm looking for a guy who meets my realistic criteria and that's how every women should search. And I'm the most caring person you'll ever encounter. Yup I want a guy who will not correct me or try and and change me. Any guy who does both is abusive and a control freak plain and simple. A guy shouldn't be doing what the hell he wants in a relationship. A guy with that selfish attitude is not dating or relationship material because he's not mature. Since you think men don't have to be loyal if women treat them like dogs I bet you think women should be loyal when men treat them like dogs. I say what's good for the goose is damn good for the gander. Relationships are about mutual RESPECT! People should fix their own flaws before attacking others and trying to change them. Look in the mirror! Any man who slams a woman's mother is a prick. Run along.
 oldwxman
Joined: 7/22/2018
Msg: 182
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/9/2018 12:40:10 AM
*Relationships are about mutual RESPECT!

Ahh jeez. Another one of those. Gets kinda tiresome doesn't it.
 Sweet_Danimal
Joined: 10/31/2015
Msg: 183
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/9/2018 9:48:54 AM
Very tiresome. My impression is the her view of 'Respect' and relationships is colored by far too many episodes of the Kardashians and the false reality they create with editing.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 184
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/9/2018 1:57:37 PM

I'm looking for a guy who meets my realistic criteria and that's how every women should search.

The problem is, what you believe is realistic criteria -- is not realistic. For example, Exhibit A:

Yup I want a guy who will not correct me

One shouldn't listen to their mother or father as if they're the Gods. They're not. Now, you're gorgeous -- so it Is realistic that you could find a guy to be your b!tch, where if you say 2+2=5, he'll say "You're right, honey..." I do agree you don't want nor should want a guy to instead respond by saying "No you idiot, 2+2=4!" But at the end of the day if you need the former, you're not set to be in a Healthy Relationship yet.
 flowersinthelake
Joined: 5/11/2018
Msg: 185
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/17/2018 4:55:58 AM

Relationships are about mutual RESPECT! People should fix their own flaws before attacking others and trying to change them.


I agree: there should be mutual respect. If you find yourself correcting your partners flaws every turn, you're going to drive him away. Stand up for yourself, but don't expect _him_ to change himself solely for you.
 johnfromzelie
Joined: 3/8/2018
Msg: 186
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/17/2018 8:37:46 AM
depends on what you mean by change. for the most part, I accept others as they are and expect the same in return. suggesting my clothes are not the best choice for a function would be welcomed, how a dress every day might be pushing it towards nagging and changing my lifestyle to suit your needs is out. the biggest concern on ANY change regardless how small, is it for them or me?
 oldwxman
Joined: 7/22/2018
Msg: 187
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/18/2018 5:40:59 PM
^^^ john is right.
There is a big difference between honoring a simple request and surrendering to a bully.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 188
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this ladies, is how good guys become jerks
Posted: 9/20/2018 12:55:45 PM

I agree: there should be mutual respect. If you find yourself correcting your partners flaws every turn, you're going to drive him away. Stand up for yourself, but don't expect _him_ to change himself solely for you.

But I'd also say there's another thing to note if you find yourself correcting a Partner's flaws at every turn: It may not be That so much, but that you're not that into them, and you're reaching for reasons to complain (legit or not so legit). After all, what are the chances they would be an actual Partner if that "correcting" was happening at every turn since date #2 or #3, ya know? Their "partner" could have changed over time and be very different from how they were when they were just Dating, or, not so much different, but oneself is not-so-happy underneath it all and looking for something to "grab" to.

I say this because one thing I realized over time is something that people don't talk about much. This sounds "too theoretical", but when ya think about it, IMO, it's quite Common & unfortunately normal: When we're losing feeling in our BF/GF, when you're solidified, we know we just can't say one day "Ya know, I'm just not feeling it. Good luck in your search," as if you just got done with date #1-3. So instead, we Want to find flaws... something 'solid' to grab on to to complain about. To find "reasons" to justify our feelings subsiding to alleviate the guilt about it... and/or to give it more "umph". That's why we see couples fight over nothing. WHY? I think it's an instinctual "route" to go down, because in an odd sense, they want reasons to be pissed... reasons to have subsided feelings.
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