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 csamcsog
Joined: 4/8/2013
Msg: 10
Karma / Reap What We SowPage 2 of 2    (1, 2)
karma/re incarnation means mistakes in previous lives ,can be rectified/not repeated by learning lessons.

darknight,
What lessons do these terminally ill children get to learn?

000000000000000000000

Lesson 1: not to make the same mistakes.

Lesson 2: if kids don't pass the test on lesson 1, then they are forced to learn to believe in Karma.

- I know you did not ask me, but the answer was at hand in my little card-clue collection, which i was flippin' through at the same time as I read your response, lady.
 Secondhand_Lion
Joined: 11/10/2008
Msg: 11
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Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/14/2013 10:49:18 PM
Yeah Darknight, I'm waiting for you to answer the ladies question myself. I'm mostly interested in how you phucked up in the past life.....because you didn't make it back as Brad Pitt or George Clooney. LOL
 Keeper_of_Secrets
Joined: 5/16/2012
Msg: 13
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/15/2013 6:17:03 AM
I find it to be interesting that when the topic of karma and reincarnation is brought up that past lives is often spoken of but future lives is not.
It makes sense that if one has had past lives that they would also have future lives if the concept of reincarnation is accurate.
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/15/2013 9:26:00 AM
op, I'd like to see you participate in the thread called simply "morality".
 Secondhand_Lion
Joined: 11/10/2008
Msg: 15
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Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/15/2013 2:38:04 PM
O.K. Darknight48....you win on the past life issue, because I was God in my past life....so I KNOW who you were! Just for the record, climbing up the Empire state building and getting shot down by fighter planes was your idea...not mine. Hummm....makes you wonder why you picked darknight for a username doesn't it?....you were quite a bit darker back then. Enjoy your karma! LOL
 Aristotle_Amadopolis
Joined: 12/8/2011
Msg: 16
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/15/2013 4:13:48 PM

So this reap what we sow expression annoys me to no end!

Could having to live with something that annoys you to no end, be a punishment for caring about Idioms?

So you are actually reaping what you sow.




I often wonder if it was scientifically proven that the nice guy finishes last, how many nice guys would be left??

You would first have to define the race in which he would finish last in.




Alot of people in the world are only nice because of the fear of karma!

Nice is rooted in your DNA and the environment in which you where raised, not your dogma.
 import_from_UK
Joined: 3/20/2013
Msg: 17
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/16/2013 4:09:37 AM

So this reap what we sow expression annoys me to no end! Why, because when I was younger, I would frequent the local hospital with my Nan who unfortunately suffered with cancer and has now sadly parted from us, but their was a childs ward not far and I would always sadly see very young children with no hair looking gravly ill and pale. We are talking some of them no older than 8 or 9 :(


This expression is annoying you only because you are choosing to focus on one isolated incident in a person's life to sum up their 'reward' for essentially being a good person most of the time.

Life happens. People get sick and die. It's not a reflection of them 'deserving' or 'earning' that situation and therefore the saying about reaping what we so is completely out of context.

Sure, your Nan died of cancer but before that, she had a long life, a family and likely although she would have faced difficult times during that, she had good people in her life which was reflective of the way she treated others. Likewise, it's sad that some children are terminally ill but if you have had such direct contact with them, you will also understand that for the most part, their attitude is upbeat and they are still able to laugh and see the good in others during their illnesses because of the strong role their families have had to take on.


So I am sitting with one of the lads the other night having a few beers and he said "well we reap what we sow right?", to which I could only respond with "Well would you like to go and visit all the terminally ill childrens wards in the country and explain that they are reaping what they sow?". He obviously said no lol.


Again, you are focusing on one element of those children. The opposite side of the coin is that although they have very short lives, they aren't lied to, deceived or surrounded by a pity party. They learn because they have to, to value each day and they pass that upbeat attitude onto all who surround them. Their lives are filled with quick forgiveness and don't usually end with anything left unsaid. They are surrounded by people who love them, value them and treasure the short time they have left and don't get bogged down with the stupid crap that most of us who live a longer life do.


I am sorry if the topic is a little depressing, but you can't ignore what is truth right?


But that's exactly what you are doing. You are opting to look at the negatives of their lives rather than the positives. Just as you deem these situations as pay back for being good people, you are focusing only on the tragic side of their lives rather than the good. You are looking at only one side of the situation rather than the entire situation.


I often wonder if it was scientifically proven that the nice guy finishes last, how many nice guys would be left?? Alot of people in the world are only nice because of the fear of karma! I like to think I am a nice guy, but don't mind doing wrong for the right reasons and I don't lie down sweating that it will come back to me lol.


I don't believe in Karma.

I believe that if we are vicious, vindictive, mean spirited people we will attract those with similar values. It's nothing to do with Karma but more so, the human tendency to run in packs of like minded beings with similar views and core values. The flip side of this is if we opt (and it is completely a choice) to be respectful, help others where we are able, to be honest, to be good friends and parents and partners, we will also attract similar minded people.

This is all to do with perspective.
 m8t
Joined: 3/14/2013
Msg: 20
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/18/2013 10:34:55 PM
Philosophy goes where hard science cant, speculating about anything.
What we like to believe is one thing, and sometimes very comforting.
So who is to question the choices other make for themselves?
Live peacefully.
 Luthion
Joined: 12/1/2008
Msg: 21
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Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/19/2013 3:09:44 AM
Karma is not the literal "you reap what you sow" ideal it is so often defined it. Western society seems to take a very literal view of the concept, removing a lot of the philosophical elements and boling it down to a very simplistic and straight cut concept. As a result, a lot of people miss the point.

Karma is the belief that by committing good deeds, our kindness extends outwards towards others, will benefit their lives, and will help us find peace. Likewise, evil acts have the opposite effect on us and the lives of those around us.

It does *not* mean that we will get something back in return.

If anything, the expectation of a reward for your good deeds could be considered greedy and selfish, and could easily be viewed as a negative thing.

Kindness is its own reward.

Buddhism teaching that life is suffering. We will suffer no matter what we do. This is true of everyone. Being kind will not abolish that suffering in our lives. Being compassionate will not end it. But by removing our attachment to our own negative feelings, and by doing all we can to ensure that the suffering of others can be lessened, even by the smallest amount, it can provide us peace.
 Luthion
Joined: 12/1/2008
Msg: 23
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Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/19/2013 3:59:31 AM
Those terminally ill kids may be suffering through something horrible and tragic, but the kindness of others makes the fleeting moments of their lives that little bit easier, that little bit less gruelling and unbearable. Through that kindness, the pain and suffering of the kids and their parents and their family is lessened, the burden lighter. We find our own peace in knowing this, and knowing that those acts can invariably lead to more kindness and more generosity.

"All those who suffer in the world do so because of their desire for their own happiness. All those happy in the world are so because of their desire for the happiness of others."

-Bodhicaryavatara

That is karma.
 monocryl
Joined: 3/4/2013
Msg: 26
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/26/2013 10:39:22 PM
^^^Luthion's answers are always concise and to the point, but I'll take a stab at it while we're waiting.


what is the purpose of it (ie. what it is it in the world that suffering helps to happen, and without suffering that thing would not happen)

The short answer is: nothing. The belief that suffering teaches us something or helps us become better people is a Christian and not Buddhist belief. Desire, regret, envy, anxiety over missing out on something - these are all suffering. Beings who have stopped suffering have thereby stopped existing in the everyday sense of the word - they've gone out like the flame of a candle (achieved Nirvana). There's nothing left of them, so it's not some higher state but no state at all.


and what is the reason for it (why does this mechanism exist, and why does the universe not achieve that "happening" other ways, but via installing suffering in people)?

Again, this is a Christian way of looking at people and suffering. Nobody and nothing installed it in us. We've earned it through our attachments to the world.
 justlookingvt
Joined: 5/8/2010
Msg: 27
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/26/2013 10:48:50 PM


what is the purpose of it (ie. what it is it in the world that suffering helps to happen, and without suffering that thing would not happen)




The short answer is: nothing. The belief that suffering teaches us something or helps us become better people is a Christian and not Buddhist belief.


Interesting but seems a bit simplistic. I am thinking of the movie “Defiance” where a group of people endure a fair amount of suffering and derive a few life lessons from it.

If it is semantically valid to question the “purpose” of suffering, I’d say it depends on its cause.
 DameWrite
Joined: 2/27/2010
Msg: 28
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Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/26/2013 10:48:50 PM
I don't believe in karma but I do believe in reactions.

I also believe some people might believe or would like to believe in karma and some don't.
 Luthion
Joined: 12/1/2008
Msg: 31
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Posted: 4/27/2013 2:34:01 AM

Interesting but seems a bit simplistic.


Things are often only as complicated as you make them.

There isn't a "purpose" to suffering in Buddhism. It's just part of the natural order of things. You can of course learn things from your experiences, and those are great personal lessons to take away, but Buddhism only attempts to teach ways in which to detach yourself from it in the first place, to stop it for ever occurring.

Monocryl's answers are much better than I can put it.

You're overthinking it, and in the process of doing so somewhat missing the point.

We are only a part of the world as much as we choose to be.
 m8t
Joined: 3/14/2013
Msg: 32
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/27/2013 6:11:59 AM
I have learned on my life path that less is indeed more :)
 justlookingvt
Joined: 5/8/2010
Msg: 34
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/27/2013 8:31:49 PM


You're overthinking it, and in the process of doing so somewhat missing the point.


I’d say bringing Buddhism into it is overthinking it. You think Buddhism or christianity has somehow something to do with any “purpose” there may be in suffering ?



There isn't a "purpose" to suffering in Buddhism.


Is there an actual “purpose” to suffering in other frames of reference ?
 Bachelorette.Number1
Joined: 4/18/2013
Msg: 35
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/27/2013 8:49:42 PM
It's one of hundreds of possible explanations as to why you see those little kids in the hospital.
Maybe the explanations exist in order for the rest of us to not lose heart. To push forward, to actually care and do something about it.

I do believe, and I'm not a buddist, that karma has to do with several lifetimes one lives, not 1. And even a culmination of a collected mindset, if I remember correctly.

There is suffering. For what ever reason/purpose you wish to attach. Perhaps the lesson is something else entirely?
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/30/2013 11:22:00 AM
I found out about myself that I "naturally" enjoy doing for others (until the world tried to make me curb this compulsion) and honestly with no thought or motivations stemming from reciprocation, recognition, some reward or punishment in an afterlife, feeling good about myself or being able to think I'm a good person, etc. I can completely honestly say that it's a natural inclination of mine not inspired at all by any of these reasons, and I think it would be interesting to know how many other people this is true about, but they just don't know or we aren't able to realize this about them, and what implications it might have.
 lostcausein
Joined: 3/16/2013
Msg: 37
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 4/30/2013 12:54:49 PM
I wonder how many lives Hugh Hefner has lived ?

Seems to me he's done ok !
 cesska
Joined: 11/7/2011
Msg: 39
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Posted: 4/30/2013 8:47:37 PM
perhaps a reincarnated soul chose to come back to suffer so we could be taught compassion.
Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 5/2/2013 9:59:30 AM
^ It's not wrong. We just can't, or won't, all of us collectively, do things this way. That idea of paying-forward is excellent, from the movie. And the rules were what make it really work - it has to be something they can't do for themselves, that they really need, and that you can provide. But it's all about "if only". If only each person could or would do their part, continue it on. At some point, too many people are too constrained by their own concerns that they either really can't pay it forward, or just won't do it, and will just take what they received and go. And, it greatly depends on people knowing enough about the people around them in the first place. And often we don't know that much about the people around us.
 cesska
Joined: 11/7/2011
Msg: 43
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Karma / Reap What We Sow
Posted: 5/6/2013 9:27:06 PM
i no longer believe in karma
look at all the rotton people that keep coming up smelling like a rose
life is not fair and there is no way to change that
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