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 AUTHOR
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 51
Worst Valentine's Day everPage 3 of 5    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5)
I started talking a guy on Monday and he said he was looking for friends, I told him I'm not looking for friends that I'm looking to date. He then changes his tune and asked me out for a date.

If he Said he was looking for Friends To You as a clarification -- but then changed his tune -- that's a red flag. Lower expectations at that point.

He insisted on talking to me on the phone when we had already planned a date so I was already kind of hesitant about it but we spoke on the phone.

Nothing wrong with that. I mean, if he's going to pick you up on the first date, it shouldn't be odd to talk on the phone which is normal for many -- especially if they want to see if they're for real. You shouldn't take that as a bad thing at all.

On the day of the day he just kept telling me that he was running late. ... I spoke to him on the phone he said he was only 10 minutes away, after 20 to 25 minutes go by, I told him to forget the date. He called me and he was practically begging me to still meet him and that he had gone through a lot to meet me. We basically had an argument, and hadn't even met yet, lol.

After all that, you should have just canceled it. From the Pre-Date texts he already came off as a Loser, and he f'd it up at that point Big when on top of that, wasn't showing up. Unless he was Lost the whole time, and was Constantly communicating with you getting directions, it's too big of a red flag to Even Think about going out. I hope you wanting to follow through "having a date on V-day" wasn't a motivator. Whether it was or not -- bad idea to follow-through on things. You won't get any sympathy for ending up having a bad date. :)

So, after a Really Bad Date and him furthering the notion of being an idiot with no game... and then right after it ending with an argument when you wouldn't kiss him...

He asked me if I was upset with him and I said no

Not the greatest move. You should have essentially faced confrontation and just ended the situation between you two there and said that you were upset about the situation, the date went bad, you both felt uncomfortable, and you're not interested in seeing each other again. Lying and saying you're not upset and leaving it at that -- given how he's been up until that point -- he of course thinks there's still a chance and will pursue.

As soon as I got home I blocked him on POF, there was no point in keeping any avenue open for him to talk to me, I didn't want to see him again.

Well, you guys already had phone numbers. That's only going to get him ticked. Again, saying one thing, then doing another -- while there Is an avenue open for communication. You know that sent him a signal that he was being a d!ck. Not that I have any sympathy for him whatsoever, but you were asking for the texts after -- whether he was a jerk or not.

Post-Date:

Me: I don't understand what the issue is. I don't plan to see you again so I blocked you on POF, what is the big deal? 2:00 AM

Why did you respond? It only makes one believe you were being passive aggressive in blocking him, knowing there was still an open line of communication that you were also going to communicate with him on. Also, you did totally downplay the blocking. One doesn't block someone just because they don't feel like continuing things with them anymore (and also aren't interested in becoming platonic pals either). That's not the message it sends to someone you already met. :) An ego trip for some maybe...

I don't think I'm ever going to go on a date for Valentine's Day again, it certainly lends itself to a milieu of unexpected expectations.

Valentines Day had Nothing to do with it. Do you really think that guy would have been smooth and cool with good game & dating knowledge? That his communication skills would have been better prior to and during the date? Of course not. Unless the Only real thing that freaked you out was the balloons and flowers with "Love" on it -- but otherwise the date went Great -- don't rule out V-Day.

All V-Day does is gives more allowance for the guy to choose an otherwise bit too fancy restaurant and/or atmosphere for a date. Instead of Applebees for a standard one, he may choose Olive Garden. If he knows the gal goes ga-ga about romance, he'll get her a flower where he (and most) otherwise don't do for a 1st date. Little things like that. That's the only diff V-Day will do to it.

He was a wack job -- don't associate V-Day with wack jobs. lol

(Text by You Post-Date): It is innapropriate to touch people on a first date, regardless if it's Valentine's Day or not.

You didn't mention this in the story. It IS appropriate to hug, and yes, to go in for a kiss on an evening first date, IF that's what you were referring to.

Also, about him paying. That probably should have been the point in time, since it was obvious as air, that the date Was Bad, that you brought up this not working out. He would have questioned you requesting splitting the bill. And that's when you let him know the date didn't go so well for either of you and it'd be best to split the bill. If he didn't insist on splitting the bill, at least he couldn't call ya out on "using" you. IMO, if a date goes Soundly Bad, that's when the bill (if a reasonable one) should be split -- assuming the gal is in a financial position to realistically be able to.
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 52
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/16/2014 8:47:06 PM
Princess,

I'm comfortable with any whether, any day of the week, I'm not the one all holiday-happy, but I have to keep in mind that others feel differently.

Yes, my usual time limit is 30 minutes.

Sorry mom, but I'm still not scared of getting into people's car. I know where we are going (the general area). It's not like he's gonna drive to West NY (NJ actually), the minute I gotta think of possibly boarding NJT, it's time to choose something within train distance.

Belluvthebawl,

Yeah, people pleasing didn't work out, lol. I tried giving people (who I would not hesitate not responding to) a chance to show me something different, but I'm gonna stick to my guns from now on.

Thanks, I appreciate it.

Ladymercury,

Don't let bad dates dissuade you from the whole process of dating. Bad dates may set you back in a way, but there are all those other great dates that definitely makes it all worthwhile. There are wonderful people out there, don't let a nut or two distract you.

Thanks

Law212,

It was not entertaining while it was in motion :-P

Hmm I never thought he was looking to "save" the night with an attempt to maneuver a kiss. I mean, I also expressed my discomfort with the hug, a kiss would not an upgrade, lol.

I gave him two evenings as options and he insisted on Friday, ahhhhhh but alas, lesson learned.

The gifts were excessive but maybe he was trying to make up for the lateness.

I didn't actually texted all that much, I barely got a word in, lol. If you notice. I let him get it all out and only commented on what I thought was very much out of line with my interpretation of the event. I agree that it certainly let me into his warped sense of rejection, feeling taken advantage of, etc.

It did seem like this had happened to him before, whether or not his interpretation is accurate.

Thanks, I'm glad you enjoyed it, at least one person did, lol

Ainen,

I don't recall the post you are referring to. I did go out with someone who used two groupons (museum and dinner), which did come up to $100, but that's not the reason why I never spoke to him again (I might have blocked him, I don't remember). I didn't speak to him because he was extremely cheap, like you could see his face when they brought him the bill to pay tax (just tax), he almost lost it. Then when we got to the parking lot and they charged him $30 for parking, he scoffed and said "of course" with an attitude. It's NYC, if you don't have it to spend it, stay home, lol. He is also the guy who wouldn't enjoy the museum (he obviously "sacrificed" for me), and who also didn't give me a choice to order what I wanted to eat, because the groupon was for a specific meal, lol.

I don't know if linking forums to profile is a good idea, I certainly might go mute, lmao. I participate precisely because you know....what are the chances someone I date will enter the magical land of forums. As it is, there aren't that many people in here (posting or starting threads) who are from NYC or surrounding states.

Forumfella,

*doing the shake*, I hope this really is the ONLY bad date in 2014. It started out with a bang, and it certainly didn't sustain the momentum. Thanks.

Outmind,

I'm glad to "bring it", lol, even if for a laugh

Oh come on, you're pretty nice yourself.

You know what? I agree, but if they want to go somewhere where transportation is a bit dicey, I don't mind being driven.

I was trying not to be the b*tch I always am. I have previously asked him why he ends almost every sentence with "love", that's why he apologized.

I was trying to be more forgiving in 2014....major fail. I would have lost it (in the past) if he was even a minute late (I'm not kidding, see my posting history, lmao). Next time, someone is definitely being f*cked off.

Omg, yes, I think that's why. I don't like bad blood, leaving people's feeling as f*cked up when it comes to me. It's bad Karma.

I'm also a writer but I have not published anything yet, hmmmmm a book/diary of dates may make the shelves pretty soon :-P

You're welcome, I figured it had gotten pretty dull in the forums the last few days, so I didn't think twice about writing about what I went through. I'm not too proud to learn and face the music.

Seki,

I am like sooooooo not kidding *in the whitest voice I can make*

Freeformed,

I'm not sure he would have stopped writing, it would have probably escalated to calling incessantly to have the last word. I was hoping he would pull out the whole "don't text me again" a whole lot sooner. Yes, I responded as I was trying to reason with it, but failed.

Usmale,

Yes, a sympathy/pity date that bit my @ss.

I'm not "too nice", lol, I just can't find it in me to disregard people's feelings, especially in person.

I didn't want him to feel boxed with only offering one evening, plus I was actually available.

Yeah, I'm started to see some dirt on the whole being picked up. I have perfume (in a spray stick bottle) and rubbing alcohol in a spray bottle, anything in the eyes is bound to work. Mace is illegal in NYC.

Abmccray,

Got it, I get what you mean.

No drama was craved on my part.
 John255317
Joined: 12/28/2012
Msg: 53
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/16/2014 10:47:17 PM
Belle, I am not going to add my 1 cent worth, you have gotten enough posts and on top of that you seem to have made a point to reply to each one. You are facing the "music" and I admire that.
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 54
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 12:02:14 AM

If he Said he was looking for Friends To You as a clarification -- but then changed his tune -- that's a red flag. Lower expectations at that point.

Agreed.

Nothing wrong with that. I mean, if he's going to pick you up on the first date, it shouldn't be odd to talk on the phone which is normal for many -- especially if they want to see if they're for real. You shouldn't take that as a bad thing at all.

If we already set a date, time, and activity, what is there to talk about? Like what are we going to talk about in between the time until we meet, it doesn't make sense to me. We are meeting precisely to figure out if our live interaction would produce mutual interest. Nothing is real until we meet right? So why talk before then?

After all that, you should have just canceled it. From the Pre-Date texts he already came off as a Loser, and he f'd it up at that point Big when on top of that, wasn't showing up. Unless he was Lost the whole time, and was Constantly communicating with you getting directions, it's too big of a red flag to Even Think about going out. I hope you wanting to follow through "having a date on V-day" wasn't a motivator. Whether it was or not -- bad idea to follow-through on things. You won't get any sympathy for ending up having a bad date. :)

So, after a Really Bad Date and him furthering the notion of being an idiot with no game... and then right after it ending with an argument when you wouldn't kiss him...

Understandable

Not the greatest move. You should have essentially faced confrontation and just ended the situation between you two there and said that you were upset about the situation, the date went bad, you both felt uncomfortable, and you're not interested in seeing each other again. Lying and saying you're not upset and leaving it at that -- given how he's been up until that point -- he of course thinks there's still a chance and will pursue.

I don't think it's smart to confront a date when my goal was to end it and go home. I was not upset, I just didn't want to see him again. What is the point of arguing with someone you won't meet again?

Well, you guys already had phone numbers. That's only going to get him ticked. Again, saying one thing, then doing another -- while there Is an avenue open for communication. You know that sent him a signal that he was being a d!ck. Not that I have any sympathy for him whatsoever, but you were asking for the texts after -- whether he was a jerk or not.

I see what you're saying, and I agree that it was a different feeling after meeting in regards to being blocked.

Why did you respond? It only makes one believe you were being passive aggressive in blocking him, knowing there was still an open line of communication that you were also going to communicate with him on. Also, you did totally downplay the blocking. One doesn't block someone just because they don't feel like continuing things with them anymore (and also aren't interested in becoming platonic pals either). That's not the message it sends to someone you already met. :) An ego trip for some maybe...

Hm, so if you go on a date and it went pretty bad, to the extent of not ever wanting to see them again, you wouldn't try to disable communication, like not even the possibility of them sending you another message even weeks down the road?

I'm not saying I'm right, I'm saying I didn't want the possibility of him communicating with me through POF. By blocking him, he likely won't remember my username (to look me up in the future), or make another profile and keep at it.yeah, kinda useless when we had already exchanged numbers..

Valentines Day had Nothing to do with it. Do you really think that guy would have been smooth and cool with good game & dating knowledge? That his communication skills would have been better prior to and during the date? Of course not. Unless the Only real thing that freaked you out was the balloons and flowers with "Love" on it -- but otherwise the date went Great -- don't rule out V-Day.

All V-Day does is gives more allowance for the guy to choose an otherwise bit too fancy restaurant and/or atmosphere for a date. Instead of Applebees for a standard one, he may choose Olive Garden. If he knows the gal goes ga-ga about romance, he'll get her a flower where he (and most) otherwise don't do for a 1st date. Little things like that. That's the only diff V-Day will do to it.

Him, I still say VD could be misunderstood.

He was a wack job -- don't associate V-Day with wack jobs. lol

Lol

You didn't mention this in the story. It IS appropriate to hug, and yes, to go in for a kiss on an evening first date, IF that's what you were referring to.

I did mention the hand holding, tight hug, and both attempts to kiss me (1st by disguising as a hug when he was really aiming for my face, so he ended up hugging me, and the 2nd one, while approaching my face while I was reaching in the back for the items).

I don't think it's appropriate to violate personal space like that. The hug is not a problem but that tight of a hug? Wtf? I've been hugged before (usually by someone much taller than me), and it's comfortable, and my chest is not touching their chest, there's distance in between. With this guy being my height, it was uncomfortable, suffocating, and painful, and neck-twisting.

Also, about him paying. That probably should have been the point in time, since it was obvious as air, that the date Was Bad, that you brought up this not working out. He would have questioned you requesting splitting the bill. And that's when you let him know the date didn't go so well for either of you and it'd be best to split the bill. If he didn't insist on splitting the bill, at least he couldn't call ya out on "using" you. IMO, if a date goes Soundly Bad, that's when the bill (if a reasonable one) should be split -- assuming the gal is in a financial position to realistically be able to.

He already felt rejected by my reaction to the hug, you don't think me splitting the bill would have further emphasized it and who knows what the hell he would have done in the car? He was already blasting music, if I would have put my thumb in his eye by paying, who knows what would have ensued. You think he wouldn't have tried to kiss me anyways?

John,

Thanks, I appreciate it.
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 55
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 1:24:00 AM
If we already set a date, time, and activity, what is there to talk about? Like what are we going to talk about in between the time until we meet, it doesn't make sense to me.

My point is, it's not a red flag or an indicator that they're weird. I can understand not wanting to talk every day on the phone before meeting up -- but if you have # exchanges, many people do like to have at least A short conversation. Especially if their texts are throwing out words like "hun" and "love" so readily (and they are up for possibly meeting them). It's to get a better feel for their personality to ensure following through and to clear out the unclear. That's not my style, but I'm not going to think a girl is weird because she wishes to have a phone conversation because that's her (understandable) comfort-zone. Especially if I'm driving over to pick her up.

I was not upset, I just didn't want to see him again. What is the point of arguing with someone you won't meet again?

You were upset as you expressed in your original post -- but I understand, you just didn't want to argue. But since you already were, the cat was out of the bag anyway as far as tension was concerned. Upset doesn't mean enraged. It doesn't have to mean a whole lot.

I don't think it's smart to confront a date when my goal was to end it and go home.

It's a fear of basic "confrontation" of an elephant in the room that he may not be fully realizing. Or in your situation, there was confrontation and you avoided it. Hey, we all do it at some points, to some degrees. But my point is, you let them know you're not interested without "hints" to avoid the issue.

so if you go on a date and it went pretty bad, to the extent of not ever wanting to see them again, you wouldn't try to disable communication, like not even the possibility of them sending you another message even weeks down the road?

I'm saying you blocking him only sent him a message -- because you already knew you were Not Disabling communication altogether. If a gal has my # -- blocking her on POF, which isn't The form of communication at that point, wouldn't do anything but give her a little "f u". :) Couple that with being fake-nice and that drives people nuts -- basically passive-aggressive, right?

If we weren't talking via phone lines, and POF was the *only* source -- no, I wouldn't block her just because I had no interest in never seeing her again. Delete all messages? Okay. Why block? If I was Really Upset at her and WTF about her -- yeah. But if it in and of itself went bad and have no interest? No compulsion to BLOCK somebody. Especially if I didn't tell her I never wanted to see her again. I'd let that be determined if/when she'd write me after.

I'm saying I didn't want the possibility of him communicating with me through POF

But hitting you up on your phone's okay, as POF is a more sacred and intrusive arena? :)

Him, I still say VD could be misunderstood.

I don't think that really applies to your date though. I think if he was a great guy, great date and all -- but dammit -- he threw out these balloons and flowers with "Love" on it and it just seemed to be too much for a first date -- OK. But the whole thing was a disaster all around. If VD was on Thursday or Saturday, you would have had the same experience. :)

I did mention the hand holding, tight hug and both attempts to kiss me

Which you let him on the hand holding. But, I will say that the position of "no appropriate touching on a 1st date" implies groping. The tight hug? I know it's easy to bash him on everything, but it just sounds like he just has no awareness or game when it comes to the dating field. He was just an idiot. Now if he was trying to grope you WHILE hugging, okay, I'd put that in the realm of "inappropriate touching". He wasn't touching you -- he was a dufus and accidently squashing ya. And moving in for a kiss? An end-of-the-night kiss -- that doesn't imply "inappropriate touching for a 1st date". Well, in reference to Him, sure, because he was a wackjob. But not as a 1st date rule in reference to groping.

He already felt rejected by my reaction to the hug, you don't think me splitting the bill would have further emphasized it and who knows what the hell he would have done in the car?

Oh, it would have. That's why you should have at least offered to split the bill as an appropriate measure.

You think he wouldn't have tried to kiss me anyways?

Less likely. He's more likely to kiss you and make moves for hugs & go in for a kiss when it's still up in the air if you like him or not. You're just letting That continue by keeping yourself as a possible 2nd date and avoiding a consensus.

Some people are DUMB. From the texts he gave out, he doesn't seem like a very smart individual. Some people are more dumb when their emotions get in the way. Sometimes "hints" don't work... and when they're not, if an appropriate situation arises -- like a bill -- use that to help draw the line. OR at the end of the night if he does go in for the kiss or asks if you're upset, say "No, I'm sorry, I'm sure you're a nice guy and everything but the date didn't go so well and I'm not interested in seeing each other again." Avoiding making something clear just perpetuates weirdness, is my point.
 kj521
Joined: 8/8/2012
Msg: 56
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 3:44:17 AM
Just to point out something obvious.......it is usually not the getting "in" the car that is fearful......it's the getting "out"!

Your words.....


"Sorry mom, but I'm still not scared of getting into people's car"

"He already felt rejected by my reaction to the hug, you don't think me splitting the bill would have further emphasized it and who knows what the hell he would have done in the car? He was already blasting music, if I would have put my thumb in his eye by paying, who knows what would have ensued."


Which is why not getting into a car with a stranger is one of the most basic rules we drill into our children.......and if you are fearful enough to use avoidance behaviors to prevent a confrontation, such as not offering to split the bill....it might have been better to not get back into a car with him after the restaurant. Just my 2 cents.....hope your next date has a better start and outcome! :)
 motown_cowgirl
Joined: 12/22/2011
Msg: 57
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 6:35:47 AM
No more VD dates for me

whatever you say, but you could have dated him the day before or the day after and i'll go way out on a limb here and say the outcome wouldn't have been all that different.



"Sorry mom, but I'm still not scared of getting into people's car"

not scared of getting into a sniveling stranger's car / scared of going out on a date cuz calendar sez Feb. 14.

what's next, no French kissing on halloween? if you are going to adjust your avoidance behaviors, I think you're adjusting the wrong things for the wrong reasons. but that's okay it's bound to be fodder for another entertaining thread.
 DragonBits
Joined: 1/6/2012
Msg: 58
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 7:26:44 AM

whatever you say, but you could have dated him the day before or the day after and i'll go way out on a limb here and say the outcome wouldn't have been all that different.


I am sure that is true, but not the point.

I would venture to say a higher percentage of men or women that want to date on Valentine's Day Vs some other day are flaky in some way. But to me when I was single, I didn't give the day any thought at all, which was why one time I went by myself to a fancy restaurant (traveling), I didn't really think that it would be exclusively full of couples.

But what's the ratio for flaky, 70/30? or something else?

I gave her an out with the ratio, but does that apply to our OP?
 DiezelPhoenix
Joined: 5/15/2013
Msg: 59
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 7:35:45 AM
So you blocked him on POF, but then text him for 30 minutes?

Hadn't you had enough of him by that point?
 DragonBits
Joined: 1/6/2012
Msg: 60
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 7:38:13 AM
I did read the whole text exchange.

First, I don't like when people use love or hun when they don't know me.

The guy sounded self centered, lacking confidence, whinny and clumsily manipulative. Belle let it go a lot longer than I would have now at my age.

Though when I was younger I have to admit, I often let things play out even when I thought they started off on a downhill track. Just excessive curiosity about how deep what this doodoo take me?

So I can understand letting things play out even after a decision is made about the eventual outcome.
 Ed Bear
Joined: 5/19/2007
Msg: 61
view profile
History
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 8:07:11 AM
I'm only saying this because all the negative things have already been said:

Hey, Bell Tresor, congrats on getting a date for Valentine's day!
ED BEAR
 browneyesboo
Joined: 5/19/2005
Msg: 62
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 8:37:24 AM
I didn't read all the responses that followed, but I did read the OT.

I find it hard to believe that a forum regular who routinely hands out
advice and other helpful information to other posters would a. be caught
in this situation and b. would actually post about it.

You waited HOURS for someone even though you told him on numerous
occasions you weren't going to....you were already upset but you still agreed
to meet for dinner at 9:50 p.m.? You got into a stranger's car even though
you were already uncomfortable with his texts regarding resting up for VD.

He constantly plowed through your boundaries regarding hugs and kisses
and hand holding, and you let him.

You blocked him on POF but continued to text him...even after you said bye more
than once.

The fault for this bad date had more to do with you than it did with the fact it was
Valentine's day.

This reminds me of the quote...take my advice I'm not using it...hahahahahaha!

Other than that...very nice read...very articulate and precise, who seriously places
that much interest and dedicates that much time to posting something like this?
2:27 A.M. .....I agree with "him"...I think you must have been nuts.

Bye....for now.
 motown_cowgirl
Joined: 12/22/2011
Msg: 63
Best Valentine's Day Date Thread ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 8:38:48 AM
I would venture to say a higher percentage of men or women that want to date on Valentine's Day Vs some other day are flaky in some way.

really? if he was "desperate" because it was "valentine's day", you'd think he would have been on his best behavior.... an extra splash of Old Spice and five minutes early yanno. I mean instead of making lame excuses about mom's cell phone, showing up late, parking next to a mountain of dirty snow, and not opening the door.


Hey, Bell Tresor, congrats on getting a date for Valentine's day!

congratulations on your horrible date. LOL


I find it hard to believe that a forum regular who routinely hands out
advice and other helpful information to other posters would a. be caught
in this situation and b. would actually post about it.

He constantly plowed through your boundaries

^^^ giant flashing arrow pointing thingy.
 chill78
Joined: 10/13/2013
Msg: 64
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 10:04:16 AM
Based on the texts I got after blocking him, the communication was not going to cease, since he would have still maintained contact, even when I express am not interested (by blocking). I'm aware that profiles get deleted after a number of blocks, but I didn't want the chance of him keeping in contact by POF. You don't think he would have done the same when he saw it was "deleted"?


Suppose you had responded to his post date email. Saying that you're not interested in him. If he had kept contacting you after that, then I can understanding blocking him on POF and your phone. However you blocked him on just POF and kept responding to his texts. Obviously he wasn't happy about being blocked. Responding to his texts at that point just made the situation worse.
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 65
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 11:21:07 AM

I would venture to say a higher percentage of men or women that want to date on Valentine's Day Vs some other day are flaky in some way.

I'm assuming you meant 1st date. I disagree. Him throwing out "love" and "hun" at her via text before meeting and drumming up V-Day for a 1st date to someone he didn't meet yet -- that's more a red flag. Merely preferring Friday vs Saturday, and Friday's on V-Day? If the gal is expressively wanting a Date (and not a mere 'meetup' initially implied by guy) -- there shouldn't be anything wrong with that by itself.
 Iteration77
Joined: 8/22/2013
Msg: 66
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 12:57:30 PM
First off OP, sorry you had this experience. In the past, I have been involved in phone/text/in person conversations that I should have ended, but somehow I got caught up in trying to 'reason' with someone. So I sympathize a bit with that "mess of text messages" aftermath....


I would venture to say a higher percentage of men or women that want to date on Valentine's Day Vs some other day are flaky in some way.


I'm not sure I can make that sweeping of a generalization (sweeping generalizations are not my thing really) but I did have a male friend who sent me a Happy Valentine's Day message Friday, we chatted a bit and he revealed that he had a 'first date' that night. I wondered aloud if that didn't have some built in 'higher expectations' and while he denied it, he later on in the conversation said: "Just think what a good story it will make for the grandchildren - our first date was on Valentine's Day"... Hmmmm

About 11:30 I got a barrage of text messages about what a horrible date it was, how awful this 'girl' was, entitled and just not like him at all (he never gave concrete examples of she did or said to turn him off so much (I asked specifically as I am always curious) other than he did not find her to be as cute as her pictures and she was heavier than he expected).

I felt for him, I know it's lousy to have a bad or disappointing date, but I did (and do) wonder if his expectations hadn't been unrealistic going in simply because it was Valentine's Day and he'd made the comment above.
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 67
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 2:22:21 PM

My point is, it's not a red flag or an indicator that they're weird. I can understand not wanting to talk every day on the phone before meeting up -- but if you have # exchanges, many people do like to have at least A short conversation. Especially if their texts are throwing out words like "hun" and "love" so readily (and they are up for possibly meeting them). It's to get a better feel for their personality to ensure following through and to clear out the unclear. That's not my style, but I'm not going to think a girl is weird because she wishes to have a phone conversation because that's her (understandable) comfort-zone. Especially if I'm driving over to pick her up.

He was not aiming to have a short conversation , he was going on and on about his day and what he's up to so I shifting the conversation to just confirming the date and telling him we'll talk when we meet. I'm not against talking on the phone for a short conversation, but after the meeting is established an agreed upon, I feel like f*cking off till then is appropriate.

You were upset as you expressed in your original post -- but I understand, you just didn't want to argue. But since you already were, the cat was out of the bag anyway as far as tension was concerned. Upset doesn't mean enraged. It doesn't have to mean a whole lot.

I was upset at the situation, not at him. In his eyes, he's done nothing wrong, who am I to argue with him about what he thinks is right? According to him, he is a victim and did everything he could have possible done to please me, and I was a user who only went along with for him to buy me dinner. He said all that BS about walking away if I would have told him I was not interested, but I did tell him I no longer wanted to see him, and he begged me to meet him. Maybe someone else would have been more than flattered to have someone lie to them about their height, holding their hands , go in for a hug just because I said I was cold, when it really did look like he was trying to kiss me, then shut down then try to kiss me in the car, but not be direct about it either, waiting for me to look away to then kiss me? Maybe someone else would be thrilled. I can think of at least one forumite who MAY be thrilled not to be friend zoned, and have someone want more with them, than a spaced out hug and a kiss on the cheeks.

It's a fear of basic "confrontation" of an elephant in the room that he may not be fully realizing. Or in your situation, there was confrontation and you avoided it. Hey, we all do it at some points, to some degrees. But my point is, you let them know you're not interested without "hints" to avoid the issue.

Dude, did you not read that he shut down after I "rejected" his hug? Then he blows up in the car after I told him it's not a good idea "when he attempted to kiss me"? He acknowledged that things didn't go well and that we had already started arguing and that it wasn't a good sign and all that. It was then when he asked me if I was upset and if I'd give him a hug, which I did. I was already out of the car when he asked me for another hug and he insisted that I take the balloons, he had handed me the flowers as I was getting out of the car. I declined the second hug and he handed me the balloons.

There was no need to further go in and say "I don't want to see you again", It was more than evident that neither had a good time. I didn't think it was going to be a big deal to block him on POF.

I'm saying you blocking him only sent him a message -- because you already knew you were Not Disabling communication altogether. If a gal has my # -- blocking her on POF, which isn't The form of communication at that point, wouldn't do anything but give her a little "f u". :) Couple that with being fake-nice and that drives people nuts -- basically passive-aggressive, right?

I think it would've been passive aggressive if I would've said I had a great time and I wanted to see him again and take the flowers and the balloons and then go home and block him. We both acknowledged that it didn't go well prior to ending the date, so it wasn't like surprise surprise.

If we weren't talking via phone lines, and POF was the *only* source -- no, I wouldn't block her just because I had no interest in never seeing her again. Delete all messages? Okay. Why block? If I was Really Upset at her and WTF about her -- yeah. But if it in and of itself went bad and have no interest? No compulsion to BLOCK somebody. Especially if I didn't tell her I never wanted to see her again. I'd let that be determined if/when she'd write me after.

I really didn't think that it was that big of a deal, but what you're saying makes sense, maybe there are some deep rooted feelings in the block button.

But hitting you up on your phone's okay, as POF is a more sacred and intrusive arena? :)

I see what you did there, lmao. No, POF is not more sacred or intrusive, well......... to some extent it is, it is linked to your pictures, whereas a phone number is not really linked to anything other than perceived access to a person.

I don't think that really applies to your date though. I think if he was a great guy, great date and all -- but dammit -- he threw out these balloons and flowers with "Love" on it and it just seemed to be too much for a first date -- OK. But the whole thing was a disaster all around. If VD was on Thursday or Saturday, you would have had the same experience. :)

Lol. It was a bit much.

Which you let him on the hand holding. But, I will say that the position of "no appropriate touching on a 1st date" implies groping. The tight hug? I know it's easy to bash him on everything, but it just sounds like he just has no awareness or game when it comes to the dating field. He was just an idiot. Now if he was trying to grope you WHILE hugging, okay, I'd put that in the realm of "inappropriate touching". He wasn't touching you -- he was a dufus and accidently squashing ya. And moving in for a kiss? An end-of-the-night kiss -- that doesn't imply "inappropriate touching for a 1st date". Well, in reference to Him, sure, because he was a wackjob. But not as a 1st date rule in reference to groping.

Nah man, I don't participate in kissing on a first date. A hug (with certain chest distance) is fine, I'm a 38D-DD, there is no need to get that close, lol. The hand holding is a bit too much on a first date, I like freedom, independence, not having to synchronize with someone else's step, have my hands free if I need to reach for something in my bag or pocket. The only other person who held my hand (on a second date), was a total sweetheart, we were at the Alpine lookout past 12am and it was super dark, so he offered me his hand and walked in front of me, since he had very good night vision. He didn't force it on me, he offered, giving me a choice, I love choices.

Oh, it would have. That's why you should have at least offered to split the bill as an appropriate measure.

I was not going strip him of every single gentlemanly thing he could have done thereafter, by splitting the bill. Maybe the blasting of music was not going to be the only annoyance to endure. Btw, I f*cking detest loud music! especially rap.

Less likely. He's more likely to kiss you and make moves for hugs & go in for a kiss when it's still up in the air if you like him or not. You're just letting That continue by keeping yourself as a possible 2nd date and avoiding a consensus.

I don't know how it's still up in the air if he wouldn't even talk to me. Blasted music, to further dissuade me from making conversation, until he dropped me off. I don't see how anything was up in the air at that point. It was pretty evident to me that sh*t had gone downhill.

Some people are DUMB. From the texts he gave out, he doesn't seem like a very smart individual. Some people are more dumb when their emotions get in the way. Sometimes "hints" don't work... and when they're not, if an appropriate situation arises -- like a bill -- use that to help draw the line. OR at the end of the night if he does go in for the kiss or asks if you're upset, say "No, I'm sorry, I'm sure you're a nice guy and everything but the date didn't go so well and I'm not interested in seeing each other again." Avoiding making something clear just perpetuates weirdness, is my point.

I don't know how effective or how productive it would be to let people know that you're not interested in seeing them again at the end of the first date. I see how the opposite would work though.
 Confident-Realist
Joined: 2/8/2004
Msg: 68
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 3:08:41 PM

He was not aiming to have a short conversation , he was going on and on about his day

You didn't know until after the call. That's kind of what a call is about. For both sides -- to know weird stuff. Point being: Just because it's your comfort-zone doesn't mean it's The Way, and something different is a red flag. Some people do want to have a more personal exchange (a call) before meeting, just to ensure things. It's not weird, in and of itself, is all I'm saying. You could say him rambling on in the phone convo was a legit turn-off, sure.

I was upset at the situation, not at him.

Oh, come on. You were. Being upset at the situation and Not the other person would mean the person, objectively speaking, was doing things just fine but there were totally understandable misunderstandings.

In his eyes, he's done nothing wrong, who am I to argue with him about what he thinks is right?

You could say the same thing to guys who think hitting a gal is doing nothing wrong if she deserves it. Who are you to argue with what he thinks is right? :) I'm not talking about arguing with him about what's right -- I'm saying, yes, you were upset at him (and I'm sure the situation in general too, and maybe kicking yourself as well - who knows). And you had the right to be upset at him.

Maybe someone else would have been more than flattered to have someone lie to them about their height, holding their hands , go in for a hug just because I said I was cold, when it really did look like he was trying to kiss me, then shut down then try to kiss me in the car, but not be direct about it either, waiting for me to look away to then kiss me? Maybe someone else would be thrilled.

No, most people would be upset in relation to them -- not happenstance (a situation in and of itself). :) And you were, and you should have been.

he shut down after I "rejected" his hug? Then he blows up in the car after I told him it's not a good idea "when he attempted to kiss me"? He acknowledged that things didn't go well and that we had already started arguing and that it wasn't a good sign and all that.

My point is -- that may be fine for many, but not ruled out for all. He was upset & frustrated because he could see you weren't liking him -- and he was wanting to win you over. Yeah, weird. But that will happen. Drawing the line in the sand that you're not interested keeps them from wanting to "charm" you back. Then if you're not even upset or anything -- sheesh -- man, I still have a chance -- she sees this as a misunderstanding! :)

We both acknowledged that it didn't go well prior to ending the date, so it wasn't like surprise surprise.

Not going well VS no-chance-in-hell are two different things, though. Think Lloyd Christmas in Dumb & Dumber and the girl he has the crush on. Him realizing it not going well doesn't mean he lost any interest in you -- even if he was frustrated with you. Nor does it wipe away chances 100% afterward, is what I'm saying. That's why a Definite line drawn would lessen or prevent any level of WTF after. Again, not that I have sympathy for him! But at the same time, not much sympathy for you either if you technically leave it open to possibilities.

Nah man, I don't participate in kissing on a first date.

But regardless, it's not "inappropriate touching" which implies groping or crossing Universal lines. Kissing on a 1st date in the evening, in which the guy picks the girl up -- that's not classified as "inappropriate touching", is my point. It will Seem like that for anyone with a creepo, but it's not in the realm/category of groping, is what I'm saying.

I was not going strip him of every single gentlemanly thing he could have done thereafter, by splitting the bill.

If the date was bombed out -- and his fault, he could have said "You know what, I'm a man, I'm probably not the best at the dos and donts of dating, and even if we don't see each other again, I want to pay this bill as I could have handled myself better." Of course you drop your offer like a rock then! :) But as you said to him -- you wouldn't have minded if he asked to split the bill. Which means it wouldn't have been even a bit worse of an experience if he asked to split it.

Since he (not the situation itself really) was off, extremely late, and didn't handle himself well at all -- there's nothing wrong at all with him paying the whole thing. But, the offer to split it -- especially if you don't care one way or the other -- to show that you aren't interested in continuing things with him, would give you the opening to draw that line in the sand... plus, him insisting and paying the whole thing? No room for him to b!tch that you 'used' him for a VDate.
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 69
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/17/2014 6:03:13 PM
Soup,

Agreed.

Thanks for not being a moron, but that comment about women's ability to push the car out..... I don't know about that dude, lol.

Okay maybe I swept all Europe into the same dustpan but it is true in France. French men LOVE women, and I don't mean just sticking it in, they love the company of women they love and admire their bodies, even the sex itself is different, it's some sort of art. There's a lot of passion, touching, caressing, etc. I'm not sure that I agree that blowjobs are being handed out in the US I have not personally seen that in such great frequency, I personally have not participated in such with a date. If I'm going on a date with someone coming straight from Europe then that's exactly the approach, not that it has to happen, but its certainly on the table.

So your assessment of her interest would driving to split the check, interest is a requirement for you to pay for the meal? We all know that you're meeting up precisely to see if there's any interest and if it happens to be mutual but let's not forget that you still invited her out. If you already not feeling it and why go to the meal in the first place? Or its something that you're measuring during dinner?

Agreed.

Kj521,

I certainly understand the concern and you're right, the issue would be getting out of the car.

I did what I thought was the best thing to do in containing the damage and not engaging in any further arguments. I realize my choices at the time were limited (time and venue), all of which I had the power to change prior to accepting to meet him after all that. I take full responsibility for that.

I actually didn't think about not getting into his car after all that but now that I think of it, it might of been the wisest choice. I was looking into a cab services around the area but there weren't any at that time, it was already past 12 AM, in a town where cabs are not as popular as they are in NYC.
Thanks.

Motown,

I want to believe that one thing has nothing to do with the other, but then there's VD and people's perceived affiliation with it, all coincidence? Hmmm

Thanks but I'm hoping to share more of those stories, wait.......let me rephrase, I hope these date disasters don't repeat themselves.

Dragon,

I'm not sure about the percentage but it may just be true.

Diezel,

If you do something and then someone questions you about it, wouldn't you answer?

Yes I did have enough at that point.

Dragon,

I don't like that either but I understand that's how some people speak.

I agree, I entertained it for longer than I should have.

Curiosity has always gotten me in trouble. I let go many things, from the stupid "hey there" message, to looking for friends, to saying "love", "Hun", the dreaded stupid phone call, to being late, and all that followed. I'd dismiss people left and right for matters even more "benign" than these, but I figured maybe I was being too rigid and missing out on great guys. *in Steve Harvey voice* survey says...............nope

Yeah, sometimes it's just the better choice to make.

Ed_Bear,

Thanks? Lol, wish I had a better story to tell but.....you already know

Browneyesboo,

I never said I was perfect.

What's wrong with posting about our mistakes? As far as I know I have not always made the best decisions in every single life situation, have you? Sorry to disappoint.

Gee, maybe I am nuts

Motown,

Thanks for the highlighting, I needed it.

Kensi,

The chocolate was delicious, lol. I'm sorry to hear you didn't get anything, wished I'd know, I would have shipped you all the stuff so you can enjoy it.

You are right, I would have offered advise, but then again, it is easier to offer advise when you're outside looking in, than in the mess.

Chill,

I agree, it made it worst.

Iteration,

Thanks. I think I wanted to "reason" as well after spilling the milk so to say.

Gee, a string of bad VD dates, ugh
 DiezelPhoenix
Joined: 5/15/2013
Msg: 70
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/18/2014 6:56:09 AM

Diezel,

If you do something and then someone questions you about it, wouldn't you answer?

Yes I did have enough at that point.


If I haven't blocked them from a messaging service/phone... yes.
If I have blocked them... no.

Then what was the point of blocking them through POF (and rightfully so), if you are just going to answer through text?
 browneyesboo
Joined: 5/19/2005
Msg: 71
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/18/2014 7:19:44 AM
Browneyesboo,

I never said I was perfect.

What's wrong with posting about our mistakes? As far as I know I have not always made the best decisions in every single life situation, have you? Sorry to disappoint.

Gee, maybe I am nuts


No one is talking about being perfect here. I merely pointed out the irony of having a counselor who often
counsels people in here about the do's and don'ts of dating and boundaries somehow getting herself in a
position of making the list of the 10 best don'ts on a date, letting someone get past most of her boundaries...
and then talking to someone AFTER she's said goodbye because he made her uncomfortable, but apparently she was hoping to give him a better ending of sorts or
felt the need to defend herself to him for whatever reason.

It's obvious the standings in these forums as I've noticed your responses to other posters as opposed to some...
for example me. I think we all know if the topic had been posted by someone not as well known in the forums,
the responses would be entirely different.

Anyway...nice topic.
I think this thread might win a record for the most usage of quotes and words.
 motown_cowgirl
Joined: 12/22/2011
Msg: 72
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/18/2014 7:27:21 AM
Motown,

I want to believe that one thing has nothing to do with the other, but then there's VD and people's perceived affiliation with it, all coincidence? Hmmm

this sounds more like your superstition and/or his neurosis than anyone's critical thought, IMO. I mean if we are going to go with "perceived affiliation" then we have to suppose that this guy's personality would be noticeably different (better) before or after the holiday. in which case, you should be giving him the proverbial benefit of the doubt instead of blocking him so heartlessly on such an important day. LOL


Thanks but I'm hoping to share more of those stories, wait.......let me rephrase, I hope these date disasters don't repeat themselves.

and you think avoiding meeting anyone on one day of the year is going to put a stop to your dating disasters? ok.

why not forget about the grim psychic impact of holidays rolling around and just stop dating people who keep working so hard to push past your boundaries? do you need assertiveness training?

repeat after me.... "NO".
 cooldog65
Joined: 6/27/2011
Msg: 73
view profile
History
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/18/2014 7:33:18 AM
Reminder to myself...Never start a thread.
 Belluvthebawl
Joined: 1/30/2014
Msg: 74
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/18/2014 8:55:54 AM
Aww cooldog..........you know you want to!! LOL
 Eric_Summit
Joined: 11/3/2009
Msg: 75
Worst Valentine's Day ever
Posted: 2/18/2014 9:13:51 AM
This is absolutely a very entertaining dating thread. Very funny stuff...well, in hindsight...anyway. :-)
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