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 soo-girl
Joined: 10/22/2011
Msg: 51
Don't Drink ProfilesPage 3 of 7    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7)

I think the lamest reason of all for not drinking was given to me by the men who claimed they didn't drink just because they didn't like the taste of alcohol. Seriously??


Um, yeah, seriously. There are lots of folks who don't care for alcohol. I happen to be one of them. I don't see anything particularly strange or abnormal about that. To each his own.

Regarding the original post, I don't automatically assume someone has a problem with alcohol simply because they don't drink. Maybe they specify this in their profile so they can avoid attracting dates who like to hang out in bars and clubs. In the past, I've dated people who drink. Some of them didn't handle it well and I found it uncomfortable to be around them, so I can see where the non-drinkers are coming from.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 52
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 6:14:13 AM
Um, yeah, seriously. There are lots of folks who don't care for alcohol. I happen to be one of them. I don't see anything particularly strange or abnormal about that. To each his own.


It's not so much about it being strange or abnormal as it is about it being a major lifestyle incompatibility. I wouldn't date someone who didn't like seafood either, which happens to be my favorite food. Wine happens to be my favorite beverage.

The only people that think wine-tasting is "pretentious" are those that know nothing about it.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 53
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Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 6:18:04 AM
I’ve been a non-drinker my entire life, and it’s definitely not for religious reasons even though I grew up in the deep rural South. In fact, despite being the child of two church elders, I am about as anti-religious as a person could possibly be – just outright hostile to all religions.

However, there is not much doubt that having two parents that were non-drinkers and strongly opposed to drinking contributed to me being a non-drinker. Besides the religious factor, my mother came from a family of alcoholics with quite a few of her relatives being disturbingly and even violently drunk almost every time I saw them (which wasn’t very often) so that was off-putting to me on the drinking thing, including the knowledge that alcoholism is hereditary so I was probably inclined to become one if I started drinking. And in addition to growing up in a house that was alcohol-free, I also lived in a county that was legally dry (though all neighboring counties were wet so we had some very unattractive drunks in the area). And I had no friends at school for reasons I’ve gone over plenty of times in these forums, so I had no peer pressure at all. I do mean NONE. And then I went off to one of America’s top party schools... and still had no friends, and therefore no peers. Although I mostly lived alone, the two roommates I did have were also non-drinkers (probably the only other two non-religious non-drinkers on the entire campus – how did that randomly happen twice?). The only experience I had with drinkers there was stepping over hallmates that were lying on the floor in their own vomit. I never got invited to parties (where the drunk girls were), so drinking really didn’t seem all that fun.

So somehow I made it all the way into my early 20s without being around any (fun) drinkers, by which time I just decided I had no interest in drinking (and the alcoholism gene also continued to be a strong disincentive as a couple of uncles on my mother’s side actually died of alcohol poisoning and cirrhosis during this time, and another uncle was involved in a DUI in which he killed a guy, plus I was a chronic depressive, so I certainly realized that mixed badly with alcohol). Eventually after college I would pick up several close friends that were party girls so my attitude toward drinkers changed a lot, but not really toward myself, and I made for a highly convenient designated driver and “protector” for them, so I had a place in their world -- I wasn't just some weird guy staring at them while they drank, and I've never had any issues having a nice restaurant dinner with a drinking woman. They quickly gave up on their peer pressure – having never experienced it during my youth, I’m pretty much a rock.

In yet another sign of “self-hatred” and the old “I wouldn’t want to be in a club that would have me as a member” thing, I have not had many good experiences dating other non-drinkers and have no strong interest in doing so, though definitely non-drinkers are not a deal-breaker. Oddly enough, the model I dated was a non-drinker, but she was so loopy she seemed drunk or high all the time anyway, so that situation was the one exception, but all the other non-drinkers kinda bored me. In fact, some of the drinkers I dated bored me when they weren’t drinking. I’m sure that says something bad about me, but there’s really nothing good about me anyway.

I’m not sure at all what effect being a non-drinker has on me as far as online dating is concerned. I’m sure there are women who make assumptions (all of which would be very wrong because there is NOBODY with a story like mine on how they ended up a non-drinker; let’s face it, there’s nobody with a story like mine period). Do I get left out of some searches because some women won’t include non-drinkers in their searches? Probably. But I can pretty much guarantee you that’s not even 1% of the reason I get only 1 unsolicited view every month and have had 1 first contact email over the last year. There is pretty much no woman that is willing to date someone who looks like me that would be bothered by the fact that I am a non-drinker, with the possible exception of women who suspect I’m a non-drinker because I’m a recovering alcoholic. But I hardly think I give off a “recovering alcoholic” vibe. My best friend has frequently campaigned for me to change my drinking status on dating websites to “social” because she does think being a non-drinker is hurting me, but she’s also tried to get me to add a few inches to my height, so I don’t think she exactly has the best interests of her own gender in mind on these things. I am what I am. I try to highlight my most positive assets but there’s only so much “lying by omission” you can do – I have a lot of big, obvious negatives, and that’s just how it is, and if a woman really has a problem with non-drinkers, it will come out at some point while we’re dating and probably turn into a mess, so might as well be upfront about that, I guess.
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 54
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 8:11:59 AM

I think the lamest reason of all for not drinking was given to me by the men who claimed they didn't drink just because they didn't like the taste of alcohol. Seriously??

I'm a wine connoisseur and a member of a wine-tasting group that travels to different vineyards. I couldn't imagine myself having enough in common with a man who didn't appreciate fine wines.

Pfft, and I'm an elitist? You can't even understand that there's a possibility someone doesn't like the taste of something you like, much less that ONE thing preventing you from finding common ground with someone.

What does what someone else drinks have to do with what you are putting into your body? They can choose to drink something else of non-alcoholic nature, the only difference is that when someone doesn't drink and you do, you start looking sloppy and immature to the other person who can't find anything appealing about that. I will admit it's a little annoying in a situation where it's gonna lead to kissing or having sex, because the drinking person's alcohol breath may become a nuisance as well as their body odor after drinking (when you're not drinking too).

I've never been a heavy drinker because I only like drinks that are fruity, in which I can hardly taste the alcohol, while my family is into hard liquor and wines (French, Italian, Spaniard, Irish), so I participate but I don't have an appreciation for it. Wine tastes like vinegar to me, while vinegar is awesome on salads and some meats for cooking, I have no desire to drink it straight up as a beverage. I don't like the taste of rotten things and that's what alcohol (that's consumable) is, fermented bread, potato, fruits, etc. the only wines who have met my taste buds have been Moscato, White Zinfandel, Chianti (Ruffino 2008 reserve), anything sweet from Boon's farm.

Beer is mostly wheat and barley, both ingredients my body doesn't agree with (highly processed ingredients), and it all taste like urine to me. I can have cider beer though (Stella Artois, Angry Orchard). Guinness is tolerable.

My ex didn't like chocolate, he said it looks like poo, melts in your mouth, has a disgusting smell, and it looks like poo in your mouth and tongue. Fine, I'm an avid chocolate fan and have tried a wide variety because it tastes like heaven to me. When my ex used to get me boxes of chocolate or edible arrangements much to his disgust, he would always get it wrong because he has no concept in the differences there are in types of chocolate. I appreciated the gesture and ate it though unhappy, but he didn't HAVE to consume it just because I love it.

In my practice, I've had to confiscate perfume/cologne (containing alcohol), mouth wash, rubbing alcohol (and pads drenched in it), fruits from being taken to their rooms, bread, fruit peel, juice, milk, cheese, etc. I understand there is something about it that people like if willing to consume it in any form, or produce it in any form (moonshine, mamajuana, etc). I get it, I just don't have to have the same appreciation for it as the other people do.

Alcohol has no magical powers, it's a depressant, a dehydrating mechanism by which you consume more and such dehydrates you into another altered state. The less you have in your stomach to absorb the alcohol, the sooner it reaches your bloodstream. It's a game of depleting your body of the hydration it needs to function properly. There is nothing really glamorous about that, but that's why bartenders give you water in between drinks, to keep you from becoming dangerously intoxicated and keep you breathing. I used to be a bartender.

All the sh*t shows I've been a witness of have led me to believe there is nothing glamorous about it, it never made anybody look good (the person drinking it.). I had to cut off someone after two months as I noticed he always had a drink when we went out (except the first date), until our last date resulted in enough alcohol to get close enough to me, and bite my ear. When we spoke about it a few days later, I suggested there be no alcohol involved in further dates, haven't heard from him since, lol. That's fine, people have priorities, lmao.


It's not so much about it being strange or abnormal as it is about it being a major lifestyle incompatibility. I wouldn't date someone who didn't like seafood either, which happens to be my favorite food. Wine happens to be my favorite beverage.


Working out and regular exercise in the form of a schedule that is consistent, is a lifestyle, clean eating is a lifestyle, juicing is a lifestyle, being vegetarian or vegan, eating only organic produce or refraining from buying products that are tested on animals is a lifestyle, drinking alcohol is a habit. The former are attempts to increase the body's ultimate/optimum functioning and longevity, building sustainability for old age in the future or the world we live in, drinking is therefore not a lifestyle, it contributes nothing of value to the body, no nutrition whatsoever, but it can thin your blood and therefore it is not compatible with many medication and surviving a serious wound is complicated when your blood cannot coagulate.


The only people that think wine-tasting is "pretentious" are those that know nothing about it.

Or those whose family, dates, former significant others own vineyards, and you're about sick of the glamour attached to something you've already done. I've even dated sommeliers and again, nothing glamorous about knowing what pairs with what over time, and always having a bottle to crack open.

Some people have been doing things for so long, the luster wears off fairly quickly.

I don't have an issue with people who drink alcohol as long as it's responsible. Nothing sadder than ending up at my rehab because your drinking resulted in someone's death and now you can't get over it, and now you drink to forget about what you did, and no one wants to be around you. I would rather my profession become extinct than always have places to go where I can work in such an obscure field (hoping a drunk driver does not end my life as well or being deadly assaulted to get money for drugs). I'd like to see those issues, become non-issues.
 cooldog65
Joined: 6/27/2011
Msg: 55
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Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 9:04:45 AM
I think the lamest reason of all for not drinking was given to me by the men who claimed they didn't drink just because they didn't like the taste of alcohol. Seriously?? 


I don't care for the taste of most alcohols except for Moscato. Champaign is not bad. I've never tasted red wine. I don't like beer and hard liquors. As for fruity drinks, I'll take a virgin strawberry daiquiri.

As I mentioned earlier, alcohol and I are not compatible.
 whippedboi
Joined: 3/12/2013
Msg: 56
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 9:15:55 AM


The only people that think wine-tasting is "pretentious" are those that know nothing about it.


some of them, closet alkies who like to pretend they are connoisseurs, who "drink only for the taste"?? drinking a bottle of the finest French wine will give you a hangover and make you puke as well as a bottle of MD 20/20 or Night Train might, the alcohol content is the same, a poison to the human body.

I have known a few wine connoisseurs who get sloppy drunk, but it doesn't count I guess because they drink the "good stuff" and can feel as though they are elite?
 ClooneysTutor
Joined: 3/30/2014
Msg: 57
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 9:35:44 AM
Definitely not a wine connoisseur or 'snob' for that matter. $2.49 from TJ's. Goes right into a tumbler with 2 ice cubes and a crazy straw. Less trips to the fridge that way.

After the third sip, it tastes just as good as the fancy sh!t from Napa:)
 Foodnmusicguy
Joined: 5/7/2014
Msg: 58
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 9:41:18 AM

I drink a bottle of wine, 1 bottle, every single damn evening before bed.

I make sure I'm in for the night so no driving impaired either.

I do make sure to turn my phone off though. Nothing worse then trying to explain a drunken text the next morning.


Everyone has their own definition of " social " drinking, lol
 ClooneysTutor
Joined: 3/30/2014
Msg: 59
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 9:47:14 AM
Nothing social about it either. Just me, myself and I. We get along great. Oh, except for those digital peeps that text me. I guess they're attempting to be social...
 Foodnmusicguy
Joined: 5/7/2014
Msg: 60
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 9:49:05 AM
^^^^ I was referring to your profile " do you drink ? "

Your answer : " socially "

When I read your post I was curious to see how you answered this profile q

I wonder what % of pof members answer socially when in fact it's WAY more often ?

lol
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 61
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 11:27:22 AM

Working out and regular exercise in the form of a schedule that is consistent, is a lifestyle, clean eating is a lifestyle, juicing is a lifestyle, being vegetarian or vegan, eating only organic produce or refraining from buying products that are tested on animals is a lifestyle, drinking alcohol is a habit. The former are attempts to increase the body's ultimate/optimum functioning and longevity, building sustainability for old age in the future or the world we live in, drinking is therefore not a lifestyle, it contributes nothing of value to the body, no nutrition whatsoever, but it can thin your blood and therefore it is not compatible with many medication and surviving a serious wound is complicated when your blood cannot coagulate.


Drinking alcohol is also a lifestyle. A moderate amount of red wine can actually be heart-healthy. I always find it amusing whenever people preach to others about nutrition and exercise and act all sanctimonious when it’s pretty obvious they don’t practice what they preach. It’s not only what one eats and drinks that counts towards a healthy lifestyle, but how much.

By exercising and eating and drinking in moderation, I manage to stay fit despite having a glass or two of red wine with dinner three to four times a week. True, drinking can be a habit, but overeating can also be a habit. Like alcohol, it can even be considered an addiction for certain people. That’s why there’s a 12-step program for food addiction, called OA. However, I have no issues with addiction, and don’t date those that do.


Or those whose family, dates, former significant others own vineyards, and you're about sick of the glamour attached to something you've already done. I've even dated sommeliers and again, nothing glamorous about knowing what pairs with what over time, and always having a bottle to crack open.


I never claimed wine-tasting was glamorous---those are your words, not mine. If you think wine enthusiasts are pretentious or boring, no one is forcing you to date them. I happen to think wine and its history is a fascinating subject---I very much enjoy the taste of wine, and choose to date like-minded people.

I don’t believe folks are elitist simply because they choose not to date others who don’t share their lifestyle—unless you want to call people that don’t date smokers elitist, or people that don’t date motorcycle enthusiasts elitist, or people that don’t date cat owners elitist, etc. I've never found any shortage of fellow wine enthusiasts---therefore, I've never had an inclination to date someone who didn't enjoy it.
 soo-girl
Joined: 10/22/2011
Msg: 62
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 11:58:13 AM

It's not so much about it being strange or abnormal as it is about it being a major lifestyle incompatibility. I wouldn't date someone who didn't like seafood either, which happens to be my favorite food. Wine happens to be my favorite beverage.


Fair enough, but what if you met a great guy who didn't like seafood or wine? Would you potentially pass him over for someone who does enjoy those things, but whom you might not like as much? The reason I ask is because my husband enjoys seafood and drinks the odd beer on occasion. I am quite happy to cook seafood for him even though I don't like it myself. He's such a great guy and I just can't imagine being without him because we have different tastes for certain things. We're still very happy together and we still enjoy eating together even if we're not eating the same food at a meal. It just doesn't matter very much to us, I guess.
 notthatclever1
Joined: 6/19/2014
Msg: 63
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 12:35:07 PM
Haha, I don't drink or smoke, I'm an athlete and it's incredible how one night can actually destroy your performance. I choose not to drink on offseason, because I don't enjoy the depressed nervous system feeling. I like to feel energized. I do feel like that may be impacting my online dating as well, now that I think of it. thank you. :-D
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 64
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Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 1:06:10 PM
“I never claimed wine-tasting was glamorous---those are your words, not mine. If you think wine enthusiasts are pretentious or boring, no one is forcing you to date them. I happen to think wine and its history is a fascinating subject---I very much enjoy the taste of wine, and choose to date like-minded people.”

One of my all-time favorite films is “Sideways,” despite the fact that I have never tasted a drop of wine. “Bottle Shock” was pretty good, too, but I think it probably helps a lot more to be an actual wine enthusiast to really get into that one because its primary focus is wine enthusiasm, whereas “Sideways” is more of relationship study of people who just happen to be wine enthusiasts. Both of them made me interested in visiting Napa Valley, whereas previously I couldn’t have cared less about the area. I have a number of friends who are wine enthusiasts (one of them moved to the Napa area and is now in hog heaven, though that’s not the main reason why she moved there) and I get dragged to wine tastings, where I’m actually pretty good at faking my way through conversations about a drink I don’t even indulge in.

I’m not sure about wine enthusiasm, but certainly I’ve run into significant issues with dating people with whom I have little in common. To date someone I have a lot in common with would be a luxury – mutual attraction is any couple’s first hurdle, but some people leap over that one pretty easily and they can then cut potential suitors loose pretty quickly for not having overwhelmingly compatible personalities. I rarely come across someone that finds me attractive so I really can’t get all that picky about their personalities and our common interests. I dated someone who hated going to the movies during the period that I was a film critic and that definitely made things very difficult, but I never really considered not dating her just because she didn’t share my #1 interest – I just had to find other things to do with her. But movie-related things consume so much of my time that it’s certainly a lot easier to date someone who likes movies (true of all 3 women I dated more than a year each).

But like I said, I don’t usually have that luxury. I have to date the handful of women with which I have mutual attraction and then hope she isn’t a drug addict or into antiquing or a baby smotherer, and even then none of those are really deal breakers. It’d be nice to be in a position to be able to say, “I will not date someone who doesn’t share my biggest passions,” but that’s just absolutely unrealistic for some of us. I just hope my romantic interest is passionate enough about my appearance (which probably makes her insane, but that’s beside the point in this discussion) that she’s willing to make some of my interests her own and I’m definitely willing to make some of her interests my own, and we can take other people with us when we indulge in passions that the other absolutely can’t tolerate. More power to you if you don’t have to make compromises.

“Fair enough, but what if you met a great guy who didn't like seafood or wine?”

I think her point is, he’s not a great guy if he doesn’t like seafood and wine. I mean, what’s the difference between a “good guy” and a “great guy”? Stronger physical attraction? More common interests? Similar political views? A “good heart,” an “amazing soul”? I mean, I’m not necessarily defending her condemnation of non-drinkers, considering that’s indirectly a condemnation of me (I’m also not big into seafood), but I suppose we do all have our own priorities about what makes a “great person” a great person. Frankly, I’ve never dated a “great person.” Been friends with a few, but being friends with great people is a lot easier than getting them to date you ("great people" realize I'm not worth dating!).
 Foodnmusicguy
Joined: 5/7/2014
Msg: 65
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 1:12:49 PM

we do all have our own priorities about what makes a “great person” a great person. Frankly, I’ve never dated a “great person.” Been friends with a few, but being friends with great people is a lot easier than getting them to date you ("great people" realize I'm not worth dating!).


One of my main criteria of how I classify a person as " great " is that they recognize me as " great " so I'm curious, if you could please indulge me .... how do YOU define a person as " great " and why do they " realize " you're not worth dating ?
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 66
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Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 3:47:51 PM
“One of my main criteria of how I classify a person as ‘great’ is that they recognize me as ‘great’”

Yes, well, I don’t agree with that, but that’s fine, because everyone has their own definition of what is “great.” I suppose we also have to make sure we are talking about “great” in the dating sense, and not necessarily just a “great” person. Because a lot of people probably think Gandhi, Mother Teresa and Pope Francis are “great” people without actually having any interest in dating them (when the former were alive).

I have to make that differentiation because my closest friends probably do think I’m a “great” person, but without any interest in dating me. Ignoring the males and the fact that most of my closest female friends are married, if I’m such a “great” guy, then why I am not worth dating? My second best friend, who is perpetually single despite being gorgeous, thinks greatly of me – we’ve spent tons of time together, gone on vacations together, party and club together, go to concerts, graduations, weddings and funerals together, bail each other out of messes – if I’m so great, why are we not dating? Lack of attraction toward me on her behalf, no doubt. (This is not something we’ve ever talked about, although she does know I had a crush on her when we first met, but that was many years ago.)

Basically I do think a lot of my friends are “great,” but not because they think I’m “great.” They are nice, empathetic people who try to do the right things, who share my definition of “fun,” know when to have fun and know when to be serious and try to stay in touch with all of their zillions of friends. They’re smart, reasonable, hardworking and passionate about things.

I have somehow managed not to date anyone like any of my close female friends (model excepted – she’s excepted only because she actually did become my platonic friend for several years after we stopped being romantically involved – she was, however, a pretty terrible person in a whole lot of ways; admittedly, I stayed friends with her because she wasn’t terrible towards ME). And, besides the lack of physical attraction, my friends also tend to recognize I’d be a bad person to date: I work all the time, I have no experience in normal relationships, I don’t like kids, I have all my finances wrapped up in movie-related projects that will probably not pay off, I have a long history of depression problems, I basically have no future, except for the present I’m living. AKA, “not worth dating” even if there was physical attraction.

I do think I’ve dated a few women who were “great” for someone else, someone that was more attracted to them than I was, someone that had more in common with them than I did, someone that wouldn’t cause them to get disowned by their families like dating me would. Most I’ve dated weren’t “great” for anyone though, unless they’ve turned into much better human beings than when I knew them. Most of the women I’ve dated either had serious mental problems or were using me, maybe for money, maybe for revenge against all the guys that have used them. My friends are nothing like those women and always wonder what I was thinking when I dated them. I was thinking, someone I’m attracted to is willing to date me and I’d better do it or remain dateless for many years. Which, after knowing me long enough, they got. I’m not like them. No matter what they think of my “great” personality, I don’t have many options because of my physical appearance. We share the same world but somehow live in different worlds. Which is also true of you and I.
 Foodnmusicguy
Joined: 5/7/2014
Msg: 67
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 4:31:39 PM

Basically I do think a lot of my friends are “great,” but not because they think I’m “great.”


I didn't say that was the ONLY reason to think someone is great.

But for me, whether it's a friend or a gf, if they treat you with anything less then enthusiasm or a minimum level of interest they probably don't think you're great and why would you associate with someone who treats you with indifference, basically ?
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 68
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 7:54:47 PM

Drinking alcohol is also a lifestyle. A moderate amount of red wine can actually be heart-healthy. I always find it amusing whenever people preach to others about nutrition and exercise and act all sanctimonious when it’s pretty obvious they don’t practice what they preach. It’s not only what one eats and drinks that counts towards a healthy lifestyle, but how much.


You can certainly make a lifestyle out of drinking, but it is not a lifestyle. A moderate amount of anything is usually good, but it's one of those things that everyone interprets differently. I'm not preaching anything about exercise, I simply explained the difference between a lifestyle and a habit.


By exercising and eating and drinking in moderation, I manage to stay fit despite having a glass or two of red wine with dinner three to four times a week. True, drinking can be a habit, but overeating can also be a habit. Like alcohol, it can even be considered an addiction for certain people. That’s why there’s a 12-step program for food addiction, called OA. However, I have no issues with addiction, and don’t date those that do.


No one implied a decline in your health or shape, so I'm not sure what you're defending with that statement. True drinking? drinking is drinking. Overeating and under eating are addictions/deceases when they occur over a period of time, when there is a distortion about how one looks or how one is satisfied, there is treatment for that, but I'm not even sure why that was brought up. Did you battle with that earlier in life? I never implied you have an addiction to alcohol, so again, not sure where that came from. Of course you wouldn't date someone with an addiction, that would imply that they are consuming MORE than you, and you're not about to have anyone do anything you're not doing, because again, the common ground would evaporate.


I never claimed wine-tasting was glamorous---those are your words, not mine. If you think wine enthusiasts are pretentious or boring, no one is forcing you to date them. I happen to think wine and its history is a fascinating subject---I very much enjoy the taste of wine, and choose to date like-minded people.


It certainly sounded like it with the whole "I'm a wine connoisseur ....I go to vineyards.....wine tasting....", it sure sounded like it was a step above from simply having a glass a wine just because you feel like it. I never implied wine "enthusiasts" were anything, I've never thought about them at all. I happen to think wine is just wine. Like-minded people? So they have to drink the same thing to be like-minded? They have to appreciate wine to the same extent to be able to find common ground with you? Fair enough, I've got my own definition of who are ike-minded to me, so I understand.


I don’t believe folks are elitist simply because they choose not to date others who don’t share their lifestyle—unless you want to call people that don’t date smokers elitist, or people that don’t date motorcycle enthusiasts elitist, or people that don’t date cat owners elitist, etc. I've never found any shortage of fellow wine enthusiasts---therefore, I've never had an inclination to date someone who didn't enjoy it.


You believe that anyone who thinks they are above something or a group of people are elitist. So you making a distinction between simply consuming wine, to being a connoisseur , to wine-tasting at vineyards, to not dating those who don't drink (as no common ground is possible), to "I don't date those that do" in reference to addicts, as to making a separation between yourself and those you find no common ground with (a.k.a. Below you). This marked distinction for a single variable (wine consumption) seems to be rather important, same as there is marked distinction on what that variable is for me.

I may be wrong but haven't you called me an "elitist", because I do believe there is a certain distinction between people I date and people I wouldn't?

Again, I may be wrong.
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 69
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/9/2014 7:59:50 PM

I wouldn't date someone who didn't like seafood either, which happens to be my favorite food.


I'm not a huge seafood fan. But I dated women that liked seafood. It was never a problem. When we went out to eat, sometimes we would go to a restaurant that served seafood and other things. Or when she cooked seafood, I would simply eat something else during dinner.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 70
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/10/2014 10:20:23 AM


Drinking alcohol is also a lifestyle. A moderate amount of red wine can actually be heart-healthy. I always find it amusing whenever people preach to others about nutrition and exercise and act all sanctimonious when it’s pretty obvious they don’t practice what they preach. It’s not only what one eats and drinks that counts towards a healthy lifestyle, but how much.


You can certainly make a lifestyle out of drinking, but it is not a lifestyle. A moderate amount of anything is usually good, but it's one of those things that everyone interprets differently. I'm not preaching anything about exercise, I simply explained the difference between a lifestyle and a habit.


Lifestyle encompasses lifestyle choices, some of which are habits. I think you’re quibbling over semantics and trying to muddle the issue.


No one implied a decline in your health or shape, so I'm not sure what you're defending with that statement. True drinking? drinking is drinking. Overeating and under eating are addictions/deceases when they occur over a period of time, when there is a distortion about how one looks or how one is satisfied, there is treatment for that, but I'm not even sure why that was brought up. Did you battle with that earlier in life? I never implied you have an addiction to alcohol, so again, not sure where that came from. Of course you wouldn't date someone with an addiction, that would imply that they are consuming MORE than you, and you're not about to have anyone do anything you're not doing, because again, the common ground would evaporate.


If “no one” implied a decline in my health or shape, then “no one” must be your name, for you clearly did. I’m sure you didn’t appreciate it when some male posters in another thread made negative remarks about your weight; therefore I’m surprised you’d attempt to pass negative judgment on one of my lifestyle choices, which is drinking, as being an “unhealthy habit”.

For the record, I’ve never had any weight issues that a little self-discipline didn’t take care of. You should try it sometime. And no, I wouldn’t date someone with an addiction, but not for the reasons you gave. I have dated recovering alcoholics in the past---those relationships didn’t work out for me, and I have no desire to repeat the experience.



I never claimed wine-tasting was glamorous---those are your words, not mine. If you think wine enthusiasts are pretentious or boring, no one is forcing you to date them. I happen to think wine and its history is a fascinating subject---I very much enjoy the taste of wine, and choose to date like-minded people.


It certainly sounded like it with the whole "I'm a wine connoisseur ....I go to vineyards.....wine tasting....", it sure sounded like it was a step above from simply having a glass a wine just because you feel like it. I never implied wine "enthusiasts" were anything, I've never thought about them at all.


I honestly don't give a fig how you think it sounded. The man I’m dating doesn't see it that way, and that’s what matters. I have several friends who are wine enthusiasts... connoisseurs... aficionados... (Pick the term that is least offensive to your sensibilities) that don't see it that way, either. I’m not worried.


You believe that anyone who thinks they are above something or a group of people are elitist.


What I believe is that people who have an attitude of “entitlement” are elitist. Some examples would be people who think members of the opposite sex owe them favors because of their privates: e.g. 70K cars, free meals and drinks, sex, etc. I also believe those that feel they are entitled to a certain response of their own choosing when a potential dating prospect isn't interested in them, are being elitist.


So you making a distinction between simply consuming wine, to being a connoisseur , to wine-tasting at vineyards, to not dating those who don't drink (as no common ground is possible), to "I don't date those that do" in reference to addicts, as to making a separation between yourself and those you find no common ground with (a.k.a. Below you). This marked distinction for a single variable (wine consumption) seems to be rather important, same as there is marked distinction on what that variable is for me.


I don’t consider people I share little common ground with to be "below" me. We're simply not a good match. For example, there's nothing wrong with religious people. I’m not “above” them---I just don’t believe in god, so I don’t think we'd be a good fit. I'm pretty sure the feeling would be mutual in most cases. I realize you’re attempting to equate my desire not to date non-drinkers with being an elitist, but you’re off the mark.


I may be wrong but haven't you called me an "elitist", because I do believe there is a certain distinction between people I date and people I wouldn't?

Again, I may be wrong.


If I have ever expressed an opinion in the forums that you were elitist, it was for reasons similar to the ones given above and not for the reason you just gave.
 easterparadehat
Joined: 4/14/2014
Msg: 71
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/10/2014 12:28:36 PM
Clooney I actually agree with you on that one. I buy PA wines and they are just as robust and sweet as California wines as the grapes are grown near lakes (ideal condition) and in the cooler mountain areas. My favorite is Volant Winery and it is about the best wine I've ever tasted and when I take daytrips in PA I've tried out many wines. They have this chocolate red wine that is delicious with a hint of cocoa throughout absolutely no cream taste. Yum.
 imokurok77
Joined: 6/2/2014
Msg: 72
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/10/2014 1:11:06 PM
Hawking Jr:

I know I'm way old compared to you but I've read your comments about your own appearance here over and over and over. Example:

No matter what they think of my “great” personality, I don’t have many options because of my physical appearance.


I've looked at your profile a number of times and I will admit I don't get it. I was involved with a guy (a few years younger than me) for over 2 years and, if your pictures are accurate, he could easily pass for your older brother. It's always a little jarring to me when your picture pops up in the forum posts. We ultimately split up because he was not able to resist the various women who were drawn to him. He was also deaf, which I'm sure would have eliminated him from some women's consideration as well, but d*mn he was incredibly charming and supremely confident.

About a month ago I went out with someone who also looked like he could be your older brother (and I will totally admit I was drawn to him because he resembled my ex - not proud of that). I'm 5'3" and I was taller than him.

We ended up not going out again -- He was simply 'too much' for me - too wildly social, too many things going on, had a younger kid. But I got a strong impression he dated all the time.

People have different tastes and while I'm not saying you have not had bad experiences, you also have 'dated a model' (perhaps she was a bad experience but I hope you get my reference). It seems a shame that you are SO convinced that your issue is insurmountable going forward. Sounds like your friends don't quite understand that either - hence, they don't know why you date questionable women.
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 73
Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/10/2014 2:15:54 PM

If “no one” implied a decline in my health or shape, then “no one” must be your name, for you clearly did.

You can go back to the post, no one implied anything about your particular health or fitness/shape, so what is it that I "clearly did"? Goodness gracious, if it's that sensitive of a topic, I'll totally keep that in mind.


I’m sure you didn’t appreciate it when some male posters in another thread made negative remarks about your weight; therefore I’m surprised you’d attempt to pass negative judgment on one of my lifestyle choices, which is drinking, as being an “unhealthy habit”.

I've long understood that there is no way to satisfy everybody and people can make negative/positive remarks about anything. The things people say only carry the importance you assign to them. In my case, it makes no sense to take what a stranger said on the internet, to heart. This is one of those "it's not real till you meet" scenarios, so none of it is "real" as none are anyone real in my life. I own a mirror and I know what I look like, since I don't have a problem with what I see, it doesn't matter if others have a problem with it.

So your way of countering my description of a habit (in reference to drinking), is to mentioned a habit you think I'm partaking in (overeating) along with the fact that there is a 12 step program for that? There are just no words for that kind of thought process.

I'm not attempting to pass negative judgement on your lifestyle choice whether it's drinking , smoking, snorting, or anything you choose to do. I drink as well, not in the same frequency as you, but nonetheless drink. You were the one who passed negative judgement on people who expressed not liking the taste of alcohol as some "lame" excuse, along with not being able to find common ground with those who do not partake in appreciating what you do.


For the record, I’ve never had any weight issues that a little self-discipline didn’t take care of. You should try it sometime. And no, I wouldn’t date someone with an addiction, but not for the reasons you gave. I have dated recovering alcoholics in the past---those relationships didn’t work out for me, and I have no desire to repeat the experience.


I should try what? doing what you do? I'm not a follower. If you have an issue with my weight, I'm gonna let you have that issue all on your own and by yourself. I like bigger guys, so it makes no sense for me to become smaller. I do not idolize fitness, never suggested to anyone in the forum to go to the gym, eat less, or attempt to lose weight, etc. But I get it, if it's not something you do, you don't understand how others simply wouldn't be into that.

I have no experience to share in terms of dating someone in recovery, as I was already a Substance Abuse Counselor before I started dating, but like you, I'd also not like to repeat things which don't work out.


I honestly don't give a fig how you think it sounded. The man I’m dating doesn't see it that way, and that’s what matters. I have several friends who are wine enthusiasts... connoisseurs... aficionados... (Pick the term that is least offensive to your sensibilities) that don't see it that way, either. I’m not worried.

I totally agree, it's only pertinent to who we wish to be with. Everything is.


What I believe is that people who have an attitude of “entitlement” are elitist. Some examples would be people who think members of the opposite sex owe them favors because of their privates: e.g. 70K cars, free meals and drinks, sex, etc. I also believe those that feel they are entitled to a certain response of their own choosing when a potential dating prospect isn't interested in them, are being elitist.

There is a lot of "entitlement" going on in the forums (from respect, to getting a "let down" message), so it seems rather normal. Most people do things with purpose, and everyone is investing what they consider valuable, hoping to gain something of more value. I've never asked any man to do anything for me, they are doing it because they want to. I can choose to decline anything I believe doesn't measure up, like you would decline dating someone who doesn't drink.

I don't quite understand the concept of "free", I don't know of anything that is "free". If and when I've paid for things (tickets, ice cream, macaroons, souvenirs, exercise planner, etc) I never thought of them as getting something for "free" just because I chose to pay for it, I did it because I wanted to. "Free" implies that someone is getting something they didn't earn, something they haven't contributed to in any fashion. No dates are sending me giftcards in the mail for me to go out and enjoy a meal and drinks on them, that would be "free".


I realize you’re attempting to equate my desire not to date non-drinkers with being an elitist, but you’re off the mark.

I did say I could be wrong.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 74
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Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/11/2014 12:09:38 PM
Imo: Our age difference is too wide to contact you directly thanks to POF’s draconian restrictions or I would just email you because the answer to your inquiry really has nothing to do with alcohol, but, oh, well.

The model was 18 and actually still in high school when we started dating (almost got to go to her prom after not being able to go to my own years earlier). She was still in an extremely experimental stage of her life and hadn’t settled on a big long list of what she “didn’t like” and “did like” when it came to dating. Except for money. She was pretty sure she liked that. Definitely a budding golddigger, and thought I had far more money than I did when I told her what I did for a living, because she was very young and naïve. She probably never made that mistake again (at least she didn’t in all the years I knew her). But the whole “experimental stage” thing is a common theme with the vast majority of women I’ve dated. The primary reason why I suggest the issue is “insurmountable going forward” is because I’ve long been way too old to be dating “experimental stage women.” I was on the verge of being too old when I dated that model many years ago – people were like, “She’s still in HIGH SCHOOL?!” and I’m like “But she’s legal!”

The model, interestingly, was either directly or indirectly involved in nearly all of the dates I got after her. Her “sphere of influence” disappeared 7 years ago with the dumping by my ex-girlfriend (an indirect model introduction and also still in “experimental stage” herself at our initial meeting). Prior to the “Melissa Era,” I had almost no interest from any women, first grade through several post-college years. Since the “Melissa Era” ended, I’ve had almost no interest from any women, online or real life. The model herself created a set of very positive circumstances (mostly by random luck) for me that can never be duplicated again in my life, and by coincidence, the world itself was at a point at which someone with my characteristics would most greatly benefit, and then it slowly slid back to a pre-“Melissa Era” status just as that era itself ended. A pretty bad double-whammy.

Most of this I obviously understand in retrospect, having not much else better to do with my spare time over the past 7 years than to examine my “rise” and fall, but realizing what was happening would not have stopped it from happening – these were circumstances entirely beyond my control, the most important of which was aging itself. In fact, I told my ex as she was dumping me that that night was probably the last date I would ever have (turned out I would have 3 more dates later that month with someone I knew before I even met my ex, another indirect meeting because of the model, but that month would indeed mark the end of my dating to date, so I foresaw what was happpening to me and how important that model had been, even though I hadn't even seen or heard from her in a couple years at the point).

So if we pretend Melissa never happened, I would have been dateless nearly my entire life up to this point, despite substantial, some would say Herculean, effort to prevent that. And it makes perfectly good scientific sense that this would be so, because I am in the bottom 1% of men in most physical characteristics (as far as what women prefer in their dates/significant others), I have lived only in places with very limited dating options for someone who looks like me, I have a personality that does not match my appearance at all, I have never been rich or famous, and now I am much older and still look young (which creeps out both old and young women), I don’t like kids and most women anywhere close to my age have kids or are desperate to have kids, and I am still chasing dreams instead of settling down and accepting a “normal” life, despite the fact that those dreams look pretty dead.

I think it’s pretty telling that I’ve had quite a few close female friends for many years and despite the fact that they did not understand (to begin with) why I was dating some of the women I was dating, not a single one of them ever attempted to set me up. You don’t set your friends up with people you know they wouldn’t find attractive. That’s the bottom line. And eventually most of my friends did come to understand why I dated the women I dated... quite a few of them really came around in the past 7 years, as they watched me flounder in dating desert while they dated many people or met someone awesome, got engaged, got married, had kids, blah blah blah.

I’m not saying there might not be age-appropriate, mature, non-golddigging women in this world that are willing to date me (which is not the same thing as finding me attractive) that I would also find attractive and that would have non-conflicting personalities with mine. I’m just saying, they are extremely rare and like finding needles-in-a-haystack. I actually found one of those 6 years ago and blew it almost immediately. I might have blown one or two opportunities in college. That’s like 3 in all my years of living that I’ve come across within my own proximity. Inevitably one will pop up online hundreds or thousands of miles away every once-in-a-while. The odds of me coming across such a woman are simply astronomical, and like with everyone else, they become worse every day the older I get. So without a grand deus ex machina like sudden fame and fortune, I just have to be realistic about how all this is going to work out, and that I am not "normal," and try to distract myself with other pursuits, you know, for the next 40-50 years. (I definitely wish I was dumb, so I wouldn't understand how bad my circumstances are. Algernon and Charley got it right in the end.)
 TuMuchFun
Joined: 9/29/2008
Msg: 75
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Don't Drink Profiles
Posted: 7/11/2014 11:19:34 PM
I know it's hard to believe but I don't drink (but make a killer margarita) as I never felt the need to. I have a blast being totally sober and watching all my friends get chit faced. After all if I started to drink who will help them down stairs and remind them what they did the night/day before. But number one, I will make sure my friends get home safely and not get a DWI...people who feel they can't get can't have a good time with a non-drinker are not for me as I can clearly have a blast with someone that drinks.

BTW I do feel most alcohol tastes like total crap, especially most wines and champagne. A fruit based kocktail or Sangria could taste AOK. Just don't see how someone could not sit with me and enjoy a glass of wine if in my wine glass was grape juice not fermented.
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