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 CarefreeBeauty
Joined: 5/30/2014
Msg: 21
Robin Williams - Rest in PeacePage 2 of 2    (1, 2)
HawkingJr msg #17 in response to whippedboi#15


I have had two actual real life friends commit suicide in the past few years, knew them both fairly well. Their deaths had a much stronger impact on me than Robin Williams'. There, does that make you feel better?


Those of us in the club that no one wants to belong to, who have had close friends and acquaintances commit suicide, are once again reminded by Mr Williams untimely death that life is precious and fleeting. And that once the seed is planted and the deed is done, there are no do overs. They are just gone. And the rest of us, who maybe dealing with our own mental health issues are saddened and dismayed that, even with all the money in the world and success, even Robin Williams , who so many people loved and admired, who had a family that loved him as well, couldn't hang in there, just a little while longer till the pain passed.
 whippedboi
Joined: 3/12/2013
Msg: 22
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/13/2014 10:26:46 AM
to play devil´s advocate a moment

why is it necessarily sad that someone who owns his own life, decided to take an action, and do it?

do we not own our own lives? and did Willaims own his? or did Williams have no right to do this becasue ´´we´´..felt we owned him as a comedian and he ówed´us all more laughs?

sorry but I feel nothing..I am not of the majority school that the lives of celebrities are of more value than others

and a question..why does it seem that depression is more prevalent in more developed or ´rich´countries? is it possible that those in poor countries are too busy surviving to compare their lives of sadness or happiness to others & feel bad, sorry for themselves? I have a feeling that depression and obsession problems such as anorexia, etc. are rare in poor, less developed countries

is there a correlation between national wealth & mental health issues?
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 23
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/13/2014 12:41:07 PM
My post was not in any way intended to be “anti-suicide.” That would be highly hypocritical of me. Initially I did look at the suicide of Williams and one of my friends as cases of “He had so much going for him, why would he do this?” but ultimately, you are obviously correct in that, who are we to say “X must live!”? We really don’t know the demons going on inside other people’s heads, no matter how many of our own demons we may have. And chemically-depressed people simply cannot get happy and stay happy no matter how awesome life may be. Obviously we all feel bad for their families and close friends, especially in cases where they are left in really dire situations because of the suicide, but you know, when your mind tells you it’s time to go, it’s time to go. We don’t “own” the suicidal person and they don’t owe us their existence.

My other friend was a very different situation. He had a pretty good life going for years and was never diagnosed with depression or acted depressed. But then one day, everything started to fall apart and the next thing you know, his wife had left him, she made his kid hate him, he was several years unemployed and unable to get work due to things that happened at his last job that were beyond his control, no other women were interested in him and many of his friends and family members were abandoning him. Sometimes, you just come to realize that you are in such a downward spiral that you can never recover, and you might as well cut your losses. Some people have an extremely high tolerance for emotional pain, some don’t.

“and a question..why does it seem that depression is more prevalent in more developed or ´rich´countries? is it possible that those in poor countries are too busy surviving to compare their lives of sadness or happiness to others & feel bad, sorry for themselves? I have a feeling that depression and obsession problems such as anorexia, etc. are rare in poor, less developed countries is there a correlation between national wealth & mental health issues?”

This is probably not as simple as you make it out to be. Most poor countries are also extremely religious, and most religions are very anti-suicide (with an obvious exception, but in that case, suicide is still frowned upon unless done so in the name of that religion – in other words, don’t kill yourself for selfish reasons or you won’t get those virgins!). Western/developed countries, even the Puritan United States, are drifting away from organized religion and the suicide sin means much less to those countries than most developing countries. Nevertheless, I have no doubt that knowledge contributes greatly to depression. People who know nothing but miserable conditions probably don’t get “depressed” about it that much as they have nothing to compare it to. I wouldn’t be anywhere near as depressed as I am if I didn’t know how much better life could be and that it is nearly statistically impossible for me to ever have that better life. The lessons of Algernon.

“sorry but I feel nothing..I am not of the majority school that the lives of celebrities are of more value than others”

Either you didn’t get what I said at all or you’re being deliberately obtuse. It’s not that he was a celebrity – it’s that people KNEW him (which was because he was a celebrity). What does it matter how you know someone? Let’s say you have an aunt you never met but your father/mother talked about her all the time and told you a million things about her, and then this aunt dies. Is her death any less meaningful to you because you never actually met her? (BTW, that actually happened to me – I never met my mother’s sister before she died a couple of years ago, as she isolated herself from her family for completely unknown reasons, but my mother told me all sorts of nice things about my aunt during the period that my mother knew her and she actually does have relationships with her children and grandchildren.)

I will say this, though: if you didn't like Williams and/or his work, then the fact that his death means nothing to you is understandable. But you're basically making the blanket statement that his death means nothing to you because he is a celebrity, and that there is no celebrity whose death could mean anything to you. So if your wife/brother/sister/child becomes a celebrity, then suddenly the death of that person would mean nothing to you?
 Your_Move
Joined: 11/12/2009
Msg: 24
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/13/2014 1:35:02 PM

Robin Williams , who so many people loved and admired, who had a family that loved him as well, couldn't hang in there, just a little while longer till the pain passed.


I don't tend to feel any connection to these "celebrities who did themselves in" (accidentally OD'd or on purpose like this), but one aspect of this one has gotten to me...this wasn't like so many of the others - "died alone in a bathtub in their hotel room" sort of thing - he was home, his wife off sleeping in the other room as this was carried out. Somehow, that just FEELS so much more ... hopeless than even the typical cases?
 natural energy
Joined: 9/23/2006
Msg: 25
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/13/2014 7:08:00 PM

why is it necessarily sad that someone who owns his own life, decided to take an action, and do it?

do we not own our own lives? and did Willaims own his? or did Williams have no right to do this becasue ´´we´´..felt we owned him as a comedian and he ówed´us all more laughs?

sorry but I feel nothing..I am not of the majority school that the lives of celebrities are of more value than others

and a question..why does it seem that depression is more prevalent in more developed or ´rich´countries? is it possible that those in poor countries are too busy surviving to compare their lives of sadness or happiness to others & feel bad, sorry for themselves? I have a feeling that depression and obsession problems such as anorexia, etc. are rare in poor, less developed countries

is there a correlation between national wealth & mental health issues?


I hope you don't mean that people should have a choice for committing "suicide" as with "euthanasia" which is continually being discussed. The only way I'd accept this is in the situation where euthanasia is being considered to avoid a painful death due to a severe illness. If a person confronted with this pain decides to commit suicide then this would come under the same acceptabilities as euthanasia for the same illness.

I don't believe that the majority of people feel that celebrities are more valuable than others. I don't believe anyone here implied that.

How do you know that depression is not prevalent in 3rd world countries or developing countries? They seem pretty destitute to me when they are starving. Would you not consider this a depression?
To most of these people, survival is paramount in their minds. I am sure that many of them simply give up after so long trying to survive, and in a sense commit suicide! How would we know? Do you think there are people keeping tabs of all these people? Many die who are "unknowns". Are they all buried in proper graves with dignity? My guess, no! Many of those countries have very corrupt governments. That is why they are in the state that they are in. To suggest that these people are not depressed is amazing to me! I suggest that you are out of touch with the realities in these countries or simply ignoring these realities since you live on this side of the world!
 natural energy
Joined: 9/23/2006
Msg: 26
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/13/2014 7:16:37 PM
... also, I don't know if any of you thought it was a weird way that he died ..... what I heard about the belt and him sitting as if in a chair does not make sense to me .....

I have to admit, the first thing I always think of when something like this happens, is whether there was any foul play involved. The investigators seemed to have ruled that out!
 mountinmann
Joined: 4/1/2014
Msg: 27
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/13/2014 9:23:04 PM
He was a nice man and it's very sad.

I wonder if they had him on psych meds, since the meds cause both suicidal and homicidal thought patterns.
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 28
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/14/2014 10:23:28 AM
i'll admit, usually when a celebrity goes, I think, "(s)/he's just another human being, why do they get special recognition over all the others who die in silence?" but this one got my attention. Perhaps b/c I like his improv humor more than I like the bathroom humor of others, and gee, who doesn't wish they were the funniest dude in the room sometimes?

Perhaps its b/c we all hear the stuff about how humor is a balm against life, and RW was the role model of humor and yet it wasn't enough of a balm for him. so, apparently, being able to laugh and being intelligent enough to cook up jokes off the top of your head, isn't necessarily the ticket to being happy in life. It kinda takes that rug out from under your feet.

maybe its b/c we all think that suicide is a cry for help, and yet, here was a guy who needed no attention. if anything, he might have needed more privacy in life.

I read someone in the paper mention meeting him in Vatican Square, and he immediately went into routine, but when he left, his shoulders were down and he looked lonely. Boy, i CAN see that. any time I saw his manic energy in a routine, it was easy to imagine it was all just a shield against life. One friend even posted she never got to see the real him, that he was "on" all the time.

yet, how can someone be that sweet, without knowing sweetness in their life? it couldn't have been an act, he must have known it at his core. he had to understand human nature, in order to present it in both the humorous way, and the sweet way, and to lecture to us on what really matters.

maybe what struck me was the talent he had, and now its no more. there will be no more attempts by him to be...him. no more movies that are funny as they are sweet, lectures on what we should be focused on in life washed down with a great humorous voice over.

and, unfortunately...it wasn't a car accident that took it away from us. it was his decision.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 29
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/14/2014 11:36:42 AM

... even with all the money in the world and success, even Robin Williams , who so many people loved and admired, who had a family that loved him as well, couldn't hang in there, just a little while longer till the pain passed.
How long would you suggest he give it? A few months? A few years? What if the pain never passes?

Depression is not the monster under the bed that disappears after you go to sleep. You go to sleep with it and wake up with it and you don't get to predict when it comes and goes ... or never goes. I've provided nursing care to people with "clinical depression", I've lived with people with "clinical depression". There's a misconception about being depressed because you lost a pet or friend or family member and having "clinical depression".

With one, you are sad and mourn your loss ... go hang out with your friends and try to distract yourself from your loss. With the other, you have a chemical imbalance that you have no control over. Some folks with that problem respond well to medication and can live relatively normal lives. Others don't always respond to conventional medications readily and so they have to keep trying different doses of this or that or combination doses and hope it keeps them alive long enough for some chemist to come up with the one medication that will help them.

Right after I lost my parents and my son within a short time frame, I sought grief counseling. That was about 8 years ago. I've given up trying to find help dealing with my grief.

I have found people (actual professionals) who advise me to just go to church and pray ... and then they invite me to join a support group and all they want to do too is pray it out of me but that's just annoying as hell since I'm not religious. I've encountered (so far) two grief counselors who refuse to work with me unless I go get a prescription and take anti-depressants. I finally told the one counselor that I'm not "clinically depressed", I'm just sad.

At one point, my PCP gave me some "anti-depressants" to see if they would help and they made me suicidal ... so I decided that wasn't a good side effect for me personally.

I realize that there are a lot of people in this world who have no real idea what "clinical depression" is ... and it's only because there just hasn't been enough PR about it. It's not about a "sadness that you're struggling with" and you just need someone to cheer you up. It's horrible and can devastate your life. It's also inherited ... unfortunately.

My patient's mother had it and looking back, his father tells me that she refused to take the pills the doctor prescribed because they made her feel like a "zombie". That's a bad side effect and she needed to report that to her doctor ... not just stop taking the pills. She drank herself to death ... self medication with alcohol is typical for people with "clinical depression".

... is it possible that those in poor countries are too busy surviving to compare their lives of sadness or happiness to others & feel bad, sorry for themselves?
Depression is not about feeling sorry for yourself. You do not have a true concept of "clinical depression". Look it up.

How do you know that depression is not prevalent in 3rd world countries or developing countries? They seem pretty destitute to me when they are starving. Would you not consider this a depression?
Being destitute has nothing to do with "clinical depression" unless you're destitute because you can't hold down a job related to your state of mind. It's a chemical imbalance ... not a life-style or reaction to being poor.

Good grief ...

People kill themselves everyday related to the same diagnosis that Robin Williams suffered. It's an everyday thing ... so if you're truly sorry about the passing of this extremely popular man, go out and raise some money to help the ones who are still alive and suffering.

I dealt with people in jail on a daily basis who have "clinical depression" who (unlike Robin Williams) have no money for medications or even a doctor visit. They are in jail because they act out without the drugs they need to keep them sane and socially acceptable.

If you're truly sorry about the passing of Robin Williams ... go out and do something about the treatment of mentally ill people who have no access to help. Appeal to government to have special courts for the mentally ill so that they can get the care they need instead of being thrown in jail for being socially inappropriate.

Also, I just heard an announcement that Robin was sober when he killed himself and was dealing with the onset of Parkinson's disease ... also a very debilitating condition. I think he killed himself because he was tired of dealing with things he simply could not control. I can't say that I blame him.
 natural energy
Joined: 9/23/2006
Msg: 30
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/14/2014 12:26:50 PM




How do you know that depression is not prevalent in 3rd world countries or developing countries? They seem pretty destitute to me when they are starving. Would you not consider this a depression?

Being destitute has nothing to do with "clinical depression" unless you're destitute because you can't hold down a job related to your state of mind. It's a chemical imbalance ... not a life-style or reaction to being poor.

Good grief ...

How do you know that some of those destitute were not "clinically depressed"!
Remember "clinical depression" is a label which has a definition, which I am sure will continually change and get enhanced.
Good grief (using your words), I have to admit I am tired of your "know it all" attitude .. when you don't .... none of us do!




I read someone in the paper mention meeting him in Vatican Square, and he immediately went into routine, but when he left, his shoulders were down and he looked lonely. Boy, i CAN see that. any time I saw his manic energy in a routine, it was easy to imagine it was all just a shield against life. One friend even posted she never got to see the real him, that he was "on" all the time.

yet, how can someone be that sweet, without knowing sweetness in their life? it couldn't have been an act, he must have known it at his core. he had to understand human nature, in order to present it in both the humorous way, and the sweet way, and to lecture to us on what really matters.

Good observations and opinions. I agree with you. He certainly had a good handle on human nature, IMHO. It is that fine line between insanity and genius

IMHO, when it comes to suicide, no matter if there is any label of "clinically depressed" or not .... as we know, not everyone is in treatment and taking meds who commit suicide .... it is the way they feel at that one instant in time when they decide for whatever reason to end it! Yes, many who commit suicide do it for attention, and want to be saved .... there is no indication that Robin felt that way ...... not from what info has been released thus far .... and please spare us with anymore text book rational of what "clinically depressed" is. Most people know, and as I said this definition will continue to change .... you can't put one reason to it! There are many possibilities!

There is so much openness, and publicity on that topic now .... here in Ontario there is much movement underway in our courts system to educate and train police officers, the judicial system, teachers, and everyone in the public sector, as with the general public in the media!

 bucsgirl
Joined: 5/13/2006
Msg: 31
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/14/2014 4:24:37 PM
As someone said on TV can't remember but it was a physician, it's a chicken or egg thing but depression and addiction are often seen in patients and both are illnesses and need to be thought of AS illnesses, like we do diabetes or cancer. They can be treated and patients can find help. I don't know if either can be "cured" so to speak, but they can be coped with, with the right type of help. I don't think you get over being depressed or addicted, but you can live with the disease with the proper treatment.

Myself and my family were huge fans of Robin Williams and I wish I could say I was surprised by the news, I think more saddened. We saw many of his standup DVDs and he often made fun of his addictions as part of his routine. When it comes down to it no one knows what's going on in someone's mind and spirit except that person, some are just better at masking it. I know his illnesses took a toll on his life and those of his loved ones. These illnesses affect everyone who cares about the person and I just wish all of his family peace in going forward and that they can cherish their precious memories.

I also wanted to add, there is a Robin Williams movie that very few know of, it's absolutely hysterical and also starts Walter Matthau and Jerry Reed, it's called The Survivors and is about a survivor training camp. It you can find it, it's well worth it, I promise your sides will be sore.
 mountinmann
Joined: 4/1/2014
Msg: 32
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/14/2014 10:43:35 PM
Turns out, he had a whole host of troubles....his series was cancelled.....ex wives took millions in alimony....
his mansion wouldn't sell.....and he was just diagnosed with Parkinsons.

Very sad.
 natural energy
Joined: 9/23/2006
Msg: 33
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/14/2014 11:21:56 PM
^^^^
I have heard the same ... more and more is coming out through the media.

This makes more sense now .... I guess he just had enough!

I can understand the family having a private funeral ...... so much of his life is being critiqued to the nth degree .... as an example - what is happening in this thread ... such comes with fame!
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 34
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/15/2014 7:26:45 AM

... so much of his life is being critiqued to the nth degree ....
If a person is not a huge fan of a certain type or style of comedy, that is not critique ... it's a preference.

Robin Williams had many different styles of comedy and I think it's understandable that a person might not necessarily enjoy every aspect of it. He was also an actor and while I was not necessarily a fan of his comedy, I did enjoy his acting ability.

... what is happening in this thread ...
What is happening in this thread is not critique of Robin Williams as much as various different views of how depression affects different people.

Depression has not had enough PR ... there is no known cure. It can be treated and much like diabetes, where based on what a person eats and how much they exercise and their compliance with their medications, their glucose levels vary, it's the same for depression.

"Clinical depression" is a chemical imbalance. It can be treated with medication and therapy, but our lives are so complex that one has to take many, many different factors into consideration ... diet, activity, work, family scenarios. Some patients can go for years without any incidents and then a chemical change takes place in their body and it throws things off.

Women of childbearing age (for example) struggle with medication because the hormone levels in their bodies fluctuate monthly. Then once they reach a certain age things have a tendency to level off. We experience the same problems when dealing with children who suffer from ADD.

They can fly along perfectly fine in grade school with their medications and therapy and as soon as they go into puberty, they are all over the map. Most typical ADD medications are useless for teens going through puberty and that's why we have to fall back on therapy then. We start at an early age training them to focus for 20 minutes at a time so that when or if their medications fail them, they can sit in a classroom (for example) and at least focus for 20 minutes. Teachers are trained to give signals to ADD students to help them focus as well. Parents are trained to do the same. It's a team effort.

We do the same with patients who suffer from depression. It's a team effort and involves choreographing many aspects of a patient's life. Believe it or not, it was easier for us to tweak the medication for our inmates in jail because they were in a controlled environment. We knew what they were eating, we knew how much they were exercising and we knew they were NOT self medicating with alcohol or drugs and we also knew if they were taking their medication or not. Medication was given to them in a timely manner and they rarely missed a pill.

Life on the street is a whole different thing. Sometimes our patients begin to feel good and convince themselves they are just fine so they stop taking their pills and within a few days to a few weeks, we're right back at ZERO. Even though they're told not to consume alcohol, sometimes they think just one little drink can't hurt ... then it escalates and pretty soon, they're drinking instead of taking their medications ... WHAM ... back to ZERO.

Comments on depression and aspects of the disease should not be considered "critique" but should be considered informational. I do not think anyone in this thread "put Robin Williams down" because he had depression or any other diagnosed disease. I think it's too bad if that's how it was interpreted.

Robin is at peace now ...
 mjinict
Joined: 8/13/2008
Msg: 35
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/15/2014 8:04:24 AM
It's been said that he gave up drugs and alcohol while his kids were growing up. They were such a source of wonder and joy for him. Perhaps if he had grandkids to dote on, he might have been able to cling to more to live for.?
 _babblefish
Joined: 9/23/2011
Msg: 36
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/15/2014 12:30:06 PM

I can understand the family having a private funeral ...... so much of his life is being critiqued to the nth degree .... as an example - what is happening in this thread ... such comes with fame!


" Dirty little secrets
Dirty little lies
We got our dirty little fingers in everybody's pie
We love to cut you down to size
We love dirty laundry "

my personal distant link to Robin Williams happened when there was a knock at my front door, two
women enquiring if I was interested in my home auditioning as a set for Jumanji . . it wasn't chosen much
to my dismay..

RIP O Captain! My Captain!
 whippedboi
Joined: 3/12/2013
Msg: 37
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/15/2014 5:47:16 PM
..You do not have a true concept of "clinical depression". Look it up...

do you mean to look it up in the current DSM, which changes every few years to reflect current societal viewpoints and changing definitions and paradigms?

as in the DSM 1 of a few decades ago which stated that homosexuality was a mental illness..but now the newer DSMs do not say that?

some diseases are added as the flavor of the day while others are removed

as if medical people, esp. in psychiatry know everything now..it appears to be largely a guessing game

..oh yes back then we were wrong when we knew we knew everything,,but now we REALLY do know everything..why do I not trust that?

centuries ago leeches were in common use to suck out bad blood, then knowledge changed and that view was considered foolish and quaint, until many decades later when it was discovered that leeches can accelerate healing

years ago addiction, & alcoholism were considered weaknesses, now that is an accepted paradigm ( politically correct) to say that its a disease and no ones fault, is it surprising that there are more addicts?

and people keep saying that depression is as real as cancer

while most can accept a person with cancer and living in pain deciding to end their own lives, they cannot accept a person in depression and pain doing it?

either mental illnesses are as real as physical disesase or they are not..cannot have it both ways?
 natural energy
Joined: 9/23/2006
Msg: 38
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/15/2014 6:45:53 PM
^^^^ Thank you whippedboi for agreeing with me!

Labels are dangerous .... and the way they are interpreted even more dangerous!

... and they do change all the time! I have discussed this with professional psychiatrists ... the ones to be respected for their professionalism.
 bluemoon24_7
Joined: 4/18/2014
Msg: 39
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/16/2014 9:21:59 AM
""Perhaps if he had grandkids to dote on, he might have been able to cling to more to live for.?""
That's saying "if he didn't have a belt he would be alive today".

Geez. Depression is real and a disease and it can be very hard to treat. It is hell for those that go to a "dark place" and have a hard time coming back to the light again. I feel for them. I've seen this, I don't fully understand it but that's what professionals are for. My job is to have empathy, which I do.

It is so sad for those left behind. Suicide...geez, how terrible that this seems to be the only way out for folks in this type of pain.

Robin Williams will be missed. As an entertainer, I liked his acting more than I liked his comedy routines.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 40
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Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/16/2014 7:28:21 PM

either mental illnesses are as real as physical disesase or they are not..cannot have it both ways?
Yeah ... go figure. Unfortunately mental illnesses are very real. It's amazing to see people get the help they need and often seems like metamorphosis. The look that I see in my patient's eyes when the world finally makes sense again for them ... no words can describe it.

and people keep saying that depression is as real as cancer
Mental illnesses are very real ... chemical imbalances ... and are extremely difficult to diagnose because they have so very many faces.

while most can accept a person with cancer and living in pain deciding to end their own lives, they cannot accept a person in depression and pain doing it?
That comes through lack of knowledge and lack of a willingness to believe it exists. In some states, the court systems are finally realizing that people with mental illnesses need special treatment and are actually appointing judges to deal with just that!

Geez. Depression is real and a disease and it can be very hard to treat.
Yes it is very real and not easy to treat.

It is hell for those that go to a "dark place" and have a hard time coming back to the light again. I feel for them. I've seen this, I don't fully understand it but that's what professionals are for.
Yes it is for those of us who have been dealing with it for years.

It is so sad for those left behind. Suicide...geez, how terrible that this seems to be the only way out for folks in this type of pain.
I know ... sometimes we can see it coming and sometimes not.

As a professional, believe me it's difficult not to take it personally when we lose someone. We feel like we have failed them somehow. That's when we have to separate our hearts from our jobs. It's not at all easy because we get attached to our patients.


Geez. Depression is real and a disease and it can be very hard to treat.
Yes ... that is the point I have been trying to make.

Robin will be missed by so many ...
 HondoGal
Joined: 5/30/2014
Msg: 41
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/17/2014 5:12:51 AM

"Depression is such a cruel punishment. There are no fevers, no rashes, no blood test to send people scurrying in concern, just the slow erosion of self, as insidious as cancer. And like cancer, it is essentially a solitary experience; a room in hell with only your name on the door." Martha Manning….

Suicide is not an act of selfishness, is an act of overwhelming pain.~Mentisnow

Well said, I agree wholeheartedly.





"but the sadness is not as great becasue they did not make us laugh?"~whippedboi


The sadness is great to those who know the deceased -- if Joe Smith kills himself, then the dozens/hundreds/thousands that know him in some capacity will be as sad as the hundreds of millions that knew Robin Williams in some capacity.

I have had two actual real life friends commit suicide in the past few years, knew them both fairly well. Their deaths had a much stronger impact on me than Robin Williams'. There, does that make you feel better?~HawkingJr

Of course Hawking…how can we grieve someone we do not know or have never heard of?



Sufferers don't think "I am depressed, and so I need to cheer myself up," they see the entire world from within a very dark place, and everything in the world serves to confirm that they have correctly assessed everything, especially themselves, as negative.

Drugs, drink, and wild behavior are often attempts at SOLUTIONS, not actually causes of the problems.~IgorFrankensteen

Alcohol, drugs are medicine for pain.




Depression is real and a disease and it can be very hard to treat. It is hell for those that go to a "dark place" and have a hard time coming back to the light again. I feel for them. I've seen this, I don't fully understand it but that's what professionals are for. My job is to have empathy, which I do.~bluemoon24_7

+100

Whipped, do you really believe that someone of sound mind who has everything going for them…family, friends, fame and fortune would end their lives? Of course not; Robin was worth millions and his Parkinson’s had not yet shown outward symptoms. He was, as are a great many talented persons, manic-depressive. Please read, “Touched With Fire” or any number or good books on the subject.

why does it seem that depression is more prevalent in more developed or ´rich´countries? is it possible that those in poor countries are too busy surviving to compare their lives of sadness or happiness to others ~whippedboi


“The same day I had a conversation with an old woman, his neighbor. I asked her if she had ever been unhappy for not understanding how her soul was made? She did not even comprehend my question. She had not, for the briefest moment in her life, had a thought about these subjects with which the good Brahmin had so tormented himself. She believed in the bottom of her heart in the metamorphoses of Vishnu, and provided she could get some of the sacred water of the Ganges in which to make her ablutions, she thought herself the happiest of women. Struck with the happiness of this poor creature, I returned to my philosopher, whom I thus addressed:
"Are you not ashamed to be thus miserable when, not fifty yards from you, there is an old automaton who thinks of nothing and lives contented?"
"You are right," he replied. "I have said to myself a thousand times that I should be happy if I were but as ignorant as my old neighbor; and yet it is a happiness which I do not desire." Voltaire
 mountinmann
Joined: 4/1/2014
Msg: 42
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/19/2014 8:38:31 PM
I wonder if Robin knew how much he was loved......
 roch64
Joined: 5/10/2014
Msg: 43
Robin Williams - Rest in Peace
Posted: 8/20/2014 2:45:07 PM

“The same day I had a conversation with an old woman, his neighbor. I asked her if she had ever been unhappy for not understanding how her soul was made? She did not even comprehend my question. She had not, for the briefest moment in her life, had a thought about these subjects with which the good Brahmin had so tormented himself. She believed in the bottom of her heart in the metamorphoses of Vishnu, and provided she could get some of the sacred water of the Ganges in which to make her ablutions, she thought herself the happiest of women. Struck with the happiness of this poor creature, I returned to my philosopher, whom I thus addressed:
"Are you not ashamed to be thus miserable when, not fifty yards from you, there is an old automaton who thinks of nothing and lives contented?"
"You are right," he replied. "I have said to myself a thousand times that I should be happy if I were but as ignorant as my old neighbor; and yet it is a happiness which I do not desire." Voltaire


Keep going just a bit further, and you'll realize that we're all automatons.

Think of nothing, and be content.

Abide.

-------

As for poor Robin Williams, he was suffering - as are nearly all suicides - from a constriction of consciousness. He had a myriad of options which would have been vastly kinder to his loved ones, but he was fixated on a "solution" that he convinced himself was inexorable.

If that can happen to someone as bright and accomplished as him, it can happen to any of us, which is why his death so fascinates and disturbs us.
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