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 Ted0881
Joined: 6/11/2005
Msg: 69
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?Page 2 of 23    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23)
Hip Hop is king!

Think about it, born outa the seventies, and today is so present in everything we listen to from metal to electronica. Its more than the scratching and turntablism, the beats the message and the way of life. Take for instance Linkin Park, Crystal Method, Propeller Heads, genres like Trance, Downtempo, House, ambient, acid jazz, performance poetry, Gorillaz, Limp Bizkit, Aerosmith and their collabo with Run DMC which sparked off the movement, hell Public Enemy even incorporated some metal into some of their stuff. The soul that Hip Hop presents is incredible. Granted Yes Hip Hop has changed quite a bit from the Big Daddy Kane, Grand Master Flash and Furious five days, but in there among all the variations it still impacts everything we listen to. And while many people focus on the gangsta rap as being the difinative spokesman for rap which I think gives it a bad name personally, there are others out there that keep it real. I am sure you have heard of Jurassic 5 - They are current in everyway - but have an old school flavor that speaks to today's issues and challenges. Herbaliser is definately hip-hop but with an old school flava.

I grew up listening to Eric B. & Rakim, Big Daddy Kane, Paperboy, P.E. (Public Enemy), you name it, but I also spread out and spent alot time chillen with Dixie Land Jazz(New Orleans Jazz), Classical, electronica, metal, alternative, rock, and god I could keep going. And to me while they all sound different seemed to share the same one principal that hip-hop presents: soul.

Maybe I am wrong, but Gospel and R&B seem to be cohesively linked to rap in the sense that while they probably deliever a different message, they both talk about struggles within the black community and communities abroad. To dismiss hip-hop based soley on the the language they use to describe people seems to be short sited. I think hip-hop is here to stay and will continue to evolve and permeate into so many genres of music and enrich our overall experience in the long run!

I guess I say that only because I remix and create tracks that somehow always have a hip-hop nature to them - I can't escape it - its something that you either are or aren't. You either feel it and identify on whatever level or don't. But I am optimistic - expect kick ass things in the future from hip-hop and track the progress in how many genres it mixes with and influences.
 Ted0881
Joined: 6/11/2005
Msg: 71
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/9/2005 6:15:20 PM
aww sounds like you are not fan - its cool - not everyone can be... Just an open mind is all I care about - there is a world of music out there to discover :)
 muvment
Joined: 9/4/2005
Msg: 72
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/9/2005 7:10:43 PM
Hip-hop remains the only genre of music that continues to impress me. People like Eminem, Kanye West, NAS, Dre, Jay-Z, Meth, etc. are geniuses. If you actually take the time to listen to the music, it isn't simply a bunch of slang thrown together in a way that rhymes. I've never heard any rock/country/classical/jazz/etc. song that has even a fraction of the wit found in the lyrics of many hip hop classics.
 Disco Daddy
Joined: 8/10/2005
Msg: 78
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/10/2005 3:41:38 AM
I love this thread

I don't think Hip hop will die, and others disagree...but I must admit I like the way evryone is handling it.
It's not like the other forums, where everyone bashes each other. We are only bashing music, and that doesn't hurt anyone's feelings...and even when we bash the music, we get info on other great bands. That's cool.

I still say Hip Hop wont die...the more people hate it...the more others love it.
I still say turn off MTV! If anything could kill Hip Hop, it would be MTV! Seriously.

peace
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 81
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/10/2005 6:07:46 PM
Hip Hop was around long BEFORE Madison Ave. began to attempt to profit off of it. It will be and has been around DISPITE Madison Ave.

 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 83
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/10/2005 6:47:09 PM
Being a musician is in the eye of the beholder It is a debate between those who know and FULLY understand the subject matter of the thread ...... those who don't, simply post.
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 85
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/10/2005 8:30:10 PM

It is just an obsevation
that the people that are not in to hip hop on this thread are musicians...(people that make there living playing an instrument)


It is YOUR observation,but it is inaccurate.
After 30 yrs of Hip Hop the question itself seem TIRED and trite.
Disco in contrast,lasted in popularity about 5 yrs.Yet it was the LABEL that gained popularity,DANCE music was and has been around and will continue. The genre called Dance today some called techno is a variation of a form of disco.Disco was simply a remanufactured distored style of R&B,Funk.
Up tempo dance music is exactly what RockNRoll is/was. Disco was a sping from the same tributary that produced RockNRoll. The difference is that "disco" began to lose its "soul" due to many things.Up tempo dance will always continue for those who love to dance.
The lesson is as long as these offshoots always understand the tributary to keep the "soul" and "beat" they will be a part of the continuem of this wonderful tributary that brings life like the Nile.
 fred0606
Joined: 5/19/2005
Msg: 86
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/10/2005 9:07:29 PM
Rap to me had a meaning back when tupac was still making music. He was a good artist, after that i became more into rock. Huge fan of early KORN. The rap that is out now sucks big time, but if thats what you like then great listen to it just dont pull up next to me blasting it to my face because i blast back with some hard metal and trust me i win.
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 94
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/24/2005 8:19:46 AM
Funny,I've worked with kids all of my adult life. My observation isn't based upon 1 kid or a few of his peers.Kids are NOT turning away from Hip Hop.Why should they? If kids are EVER faced with a choice of Tom Jones the cool 1's will ALWAYS take Will Smith.Tom Jones isn't even a good singer let alone a musician

Hip Hop's kick is that it is versitle.Its OFTEN performed live with live musicians/bands.It is NOT about technology,in fact it was born out of the fact that those who began performing hip hop lacked money for more than turn tables and records.It has evolved.Now many performers use musicians in concert.

As far as HISTORY is concerned,Heavy Metal is perhaps 5yrs "older" than Hip Hop,yet it has NEVER had the popularity.When kids study the HISTORY of Rock they'll get into Wynonnie Harris,Louis Jordan,Big Red Turner,Count Basie,Duke Ellington,Cab Calloway,Louis Prima,Trixie Smith,The Boswell Sisters,Robert Johnson,Blind Boy Fuller,Ike Turner,Slim Gillard,Slam Steward,Big Momma Thorton,Ma Rainey....hell,even Chuck Berry,Little RIchard and Jimi Hendrix instead of Rod Stewart,Tom Jones and Iron Maiden!Metal is part of gaming music now,comparatively few kids are into it outside of that.

Hip Hop is mainly party music in the celebration of LIFE.....unlike Iron Maiden.Go to a club or a teen party and if only Metal is played people leave(unless they are too high or too drunk to do otherwise )...with Hip Hop....they dance
 know life
Joined: 9/7/2005
Msg: 95
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/24/2005 9:20:57 AM
hiphop is great its rap that sucks
 jaymtheprogressive
Joined: 2/9/2005
Msg: 97
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/24/2005 11:56:25 AM
Well metal and hip hop have alot in common, even if they sound totally different. And some places only play metal and I dont feel like leaving. And no I don't think hip-hops dead, but the corperations have killed alot of it by pushing right-wing biased views through the writings they write that the singers in turn sing (I'm talking about pop radio hip hop, not real hip hop here). Music doesnt really die, if hip-hop fades in popularity then another form will appear that will be popular. I say that parents shouldnt object to letting there kids listen to hip-hop, especially if the parents listen to Rush Limbaugh or Bill O' Reilly, who say much more socially inappropriate things than any "obscene" rapper.
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 102
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/24/2005 3:39:38 PM

However, the dressing like wanna be gangsters, the "hood" hand signals and words that are offensive and used by the kids into the genre of Hip Hop worry me, especially coming from little white boys. It doesn't suit them at all.


Dressing like a wannabe gangster is certainly not something that is confined to Hip Hop.Although,I wonder if all or most gangsters dress alike Do Mafia,Bloods,Latin Kings,aryannation and Triad members all dress alike? Similar? Now,more seriously some lyrics of some songs are objectionable to ALL! HOW would they(the majority of words) POSSIBLE suite little white boys any better or worse than others? This same thing can be said however of elements of Rock....cursing and foul language is certainly no more common or worse in some elements of Hip Hop than they are in some elements of Rock. I trust no 1 is foolish enough to dispute this. The same is true of style of dress.Sagging isn't something all people who listen or even perform Hip Hop are into. Are all people into metal satanist? Piereced? Tattooed?multicolor haired? Spiked? Alcoholics? Drug addicts? Womanizers? Now YOU may not like the look of oversized t-shirts and caps worn backwards or bandanas......it would seem that is fashionable to MOST. More to the point,some may not like the "grunge"look.....so what? Does that make those who are into the "grunge look"backwards fashion rejects? Fashion is an individual thing.BTW,many HipHop artist have entered the fashion world and done VERY VERY well.THe same simply cannot be said about the "metal look",based upon the opinion of the masses,certainly the "hip hop look" is FAR more fashionable.

All music (except offensive rap),

Are there no "offensive" types of Metal?

Drugs cross all boundaries, not just heavy metal lovers.

You CLEARLY missed the point.It goes to the gross generalizations and stereotypes you made.My point?ALL of these elements you talk negatively about in Hip Hop are JUST as prominent in that in which you seem to endorse.

As far as dance is concerned...I never said Hip Hop is the ONLY form of music to which people can dance.Yet, my POINT on THAT is still APPARENT. Put people who grew up listening to mainly metal and put them in a club and you GENERALLY get LOADS of for those who watch
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 104
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/24/2005 3:56:00 PM

the VAST majority of it SUCKS LYRIC WISE.


How would you know? Listening to club music at a club and on a rare other occasion certainly doesn't merit a statement such as that with ANY credibility...simply a an OBVIOUSLY biased opinion. Statement of " so please do not bother spending too much time posting about that" actually shows a lack of interest in viewing the OBVIOUS....you are WRONG.

Try listening to Blink's "F*ck Dogs"
Compare it to "The Message"
There are MANY THOUSANDS of examples....of stupid rock or even dumber metal lyrics. Your attempt at making a point is faulted by your lack of knowledge on the topic and obvious BIAS.
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 105
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/24/2005 3:59:14 PM
My generalization was a PARODY made due to your frequent generalizations and stereotypes. Still, you didn't answer my question or even address my point about what "suits" white boys.
Actually, you have not addressed any of my questions.

BTW,"disco" lasted 5yrs........how long has Hip Hop lasted?
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 107
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/24/2005 6:48:40 PM

The 'gangster wannabe clothing' came out by way of the african american style of dress. It came from the african american musicians and jocks who grew up in the ghettos and projects and then went on to get out and do something positive for themselves. That is why it is a popular way to dress for Hip Hoppers.

So misinformed its HILARIOUS The funniest thing is....you seem serious about these stereotypes being actual Mafioso wear suits?SOME,most don't TOO FUNNY!


As for the comment "little white boys", it wasn't meant to mean that it suits little black boys either, it was just me saying that it suits them even less than the black kids because it wasn't a style that was created by us for us, and since I have a little white boy, I used him as reference. I don't think it suits little black kids, yellow kids or purple kids any better either, but it is the fashion style for the African American group and they can carry it off better and with more style than "little white boys

Deeper into misconception and misinformation you go Its funny that you say these things. They are based upon ignorance but I appreciate the fact that you seem genuine and honest and PERHAPS interested in aquiring knowledge.

I was not offended,I simply find some of your comments funny in a "did she really think about that before saying it" way.Debate point for point is what my post have been about. Just read them. My point about lyrics and dress have GOT to be OBVIOUS,and in obvious contrast to the many stereotypes and misconceptions presented. I trust you understand
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 112
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/25/2005 2:29:44 AM

here is the deal I am very knowledgable about music
I own a professional recording studio
a guitar shop
and have been in bands for 20 years

ie
I do this music thing for a living.......

so please quit with the "obviously not knowledgable thing"


I never said you were not knowledgable about the general topic of music.....simply not about Hip Hop(which is the topic). More to the point that you make OBVIOUS baised statements without relevance and off balance. This has been noted and pointed out by yet another poster. Do I care about your opinion? To the point of pointing out its falacies.....YES. Outside of that? NO.

Based upon your statements about your experience it would seem wiser to state that the little Hip Hop you've heard has mostly been commercialized party hits.

 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 114
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/25/2005 2:52:08 AM

The 'gangster wannabe clothing' came out by way of the african american style of dress. It came from the african american musicians and jocks who grew up in the ghettos and projects and then went on to get out and do something positive for themselves. That is why it is a popular way to dress for Hip Hoppers.


This was what you posted and it is false and part of a misconception you have.Perhaps from living in BC and googling info in bits and peices.I can easily find the point in which you used your own words instead of that which you copied in this last post.


When the African American (or in this case the African-Canadian), kids see white kids dressed like this, or listening to Hip Hop, very often times they accuse them of "posing." This is why I say it suits little white boys less. .....There is nothing racial there, just fact. To tell me I am ignorant and to laugh at me is an insult.

1)African American in its purest form means mixed "race"people of African descent in the Americas........USA,Canada,Puerto Rico,Cuba,Jamaica all fit into the general umbrella,although its primarily used and embraced by AfricanAmericans USA.

2)Style of dress is a part of culture that "suits" ANYONE who embraces it! A western suit looks just as good on me as it does Conan Obrian No, BETTER The very notion that a modern style of dress suits an ethnic group better than another IS ignorant. I would NEVER call you ignorant...just some of your statements.

3) You initially were refering to caps worn backwards,bandanas,oversized shirts and saggy pants....NOT Bboy gear,nor the many other styles of Hip Hop clothing/Urban wear which is what the section you googled was about.
After all,Run DMC,Curtis Blow,Sugar Hill Gang,Africa Bambatta,Mellie Mel did not wear the saggy pants nor popularize it.
 stevens
Joined: 10/6/2004
Msg: 118
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/28/2005 10:32:44 PM
Let me ask you one question?
Is your money that good?
Will it buy you forgiveness?
Do you think that it could?
I think you will find
When your death takes its toll
All the money you made
Will never buy back your soul

from the wall at the local
strip joint.
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 120
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/29/2005 7:39:46 PM

I am purposely being a little extreme with my comments on this forum to get people to take sides.

Doesn't work and simply is off topic. The topic doesn't call for "sides"
The title of the thread is actually very simple.... should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?Even though the grammatical wording of the title shows the op's thought pattern and intellectual level,it seems clear that the op intends to question the vibrancy,vim and life of Hip Hop. The answer to his question is simply: NO! Sales are up! Listenership is UP! Global influence is at an all time high!....the answer is OBVIOUS.
 Lachrymal
Joined: 10/5/2004
Msg: 123
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 9/30/2005 12:42:59 PM

People who call themselves punk artists are not punk, people who call themselves rappers are not rappers. People who have talent can call themselves whatever genre they want. Whining losers who sing songs like I Miss You are not punk artists, thats called poser punk or emo in the world that I come from.


By the way, no one could possibly be punk in any sense, because punk was an era. Punk only existed back when the ramones were around and rebelious nature was existent towards the gov't then. All "punk" now, is merely just a portrait of the sound. That's All!


Oh, and I am no fan of rap or hip hop nor punk or faux punk.
 imissboston
Joined: 10/6/2005
Msg: 127
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 10/8/2005 3:39:16 PM
Hey Guitarman, thanks for getting back to me. Sad to say hip-hop is not going no where. I just took my kids to c U2, u will not be seeing them at any hip hop concerts! I have them listen to rock and anything besides hip hop. Its so scary how the girls and women who listen to hip hop think the lyrics are okay when they are degrading these women and girls. Let me tell ya, when I was a teenager and this guy had called me a ****, we pulled the car over and threw a beer bottle and his head. Nothing I am proud of, but my point is nobody is going to take away my dignity by calling me ****, hoe etc... and I think its sad that the women and girls think this shit is okay, come on, have some respect (Aretha could have not said any better) for yourselves women! I have a daugher 10 years old and she is taught by her father and I, that shit is unacceptable........ so guitarmann100 I am with ya dude!!!!!!!!!!

Robin
 Musikmaster
Joined: 9/24/2005
Msg: 128
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 10/8/2005 5:15:02 PM
It's always amusing to read/hear someone say what 'punk' or 'punk' isn't. At least, 'punk music' has an attitude or the implication of one. Two so-called genres of punk and metal always has an audience who are obsessed with defining it and arguing with others about which band "belongs" etc. Anyway, one musician, Cobain, said it best, when it was about having passion playing their instruments and may I suggest, it is about the music and not about marketing, commercialism or superficial B.S. Nor is it about professional musicianship or how well one plays. How can you not respect that?

As far as rap/hip hop goes and I'm particularly emphasizing mainstream hip hop, it's all about the money and image. In other words, it's garbage. I don't want to get into any arguments with anyone, though. If you disagree, fine. I don't care if you listen to garbage. But, I am just giving my two cents because even though I might not necessarily like the music some of you listen to, I can sympathize with those who find the popularity of mainstream hip hop and its derivatives disturbing.

Have a good day.
 play4ibanez
Joined: 9/29/2005
Msg: 131
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 10/8/2005 8:26:20 PM
Well, coming from a guitar player...Yeah, I wish the shit would die already....But then again, what does rock have to offer these days?? Remember back in the day when soloing and sweep picking were actually cool?? We need another guitar hero to pull us out of this shit! btw...Paul Gilbert is GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 marathonman11x7
Joined: 4/29/2005
Msg: 136
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 10/9/2005 10:54:45 AM
the topic is clearly a yes or no question

Which in context of my post is my point. YES or NO...is it dead? The answer is CLEARLY NO. This is FACT. All the other dribble of someones like or dislike of Hip Hop or music in general is off topic and beside the point. As is the notion of taking "sides" in the lame we don't like Hip Hop mode:For those who don't like it.....get over it,or get over yourselves(so lame and sad to be recruted to join a thread to take "sides").Its here and alive. Just answer the threads question....simple.
Over 30years of Hip Hop....get over it.
 JayTO
Joined: 5/28/2006
Msg: 142
IS it me or should HIP HOP be DEAD YET?
Posted: 5/28/2006 4:03:19 PM
Is rock dead yet? As long as little punks want to piss off their parents, hip hop or some form of it will be alive and well when you and I are not.
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