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Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 BelleAtlantic
Joined: 11/7/2012
Msg: 51
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to researchPage 3 of 10    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10)
I agree with the research.

I've always thought that unions benefit men more than woman, but the other caveat is that as long as you don't cohabit, things stay pretty much the same as in the beginning, as there is an element that neither need each other for survival, so you can take it or leave it at any time. When you eliminate the "taking for granted", you have people less likely to screw up.

Take Union and Private Sector. In Union jobs, it is nearly impossible to get rid of someone no matter how incompetent, the process alone is a long one, while in private sector, they don't even need a reason to fire you, they can just let you go. Who do you think is less likely to screw up? The person with a sense of job security or someone whose efforts have to show in order to remain employed?

Happy wife, happy life seems to be the underpinning of it all.
 chameleonf
Joined: 12/22/2008
Msg: 52
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 8:43:05 AM

I'm assuming most dating couples would spend time at each others place during courtship. If a woman goes to a guy's place, and he has his dirty underwear hanging on lampshades, wet clothes hanging on the blades of the ceiling fan, his other clothes all over the floor, two inches of dust on the furniture, and the woman is Miss Prim and Proper with everything put away in it's proper place and spotless, why would she agree to any co-habitation situation? Does the woman think that after saying "I do" at the altar or moving in together, the slob of a guy will suddenly put on a French maid's outfit, and spend all day, everyday cleaning and cooking?


It's seems to be a strange dynamic that takes place before, during and after co-habitation. Many (the majority) of men are perfectly capable of cleaning up after themselves when living by themselves but for some strange reason a 1950s mentality takes over when living with a woman. I don't know whether to place the blame on the men, the women or both, however, this seems to be a HUGE piece of the groundwork that lays the foundation for the beginning of the end, at least form so many women's perspective.

For instance, my ex started out always helping with housework. Every weekend we'd race around on Saturday mornings getting the bigger household chores done and then have the rest of the weekend to spend doing whatever we wanted, whether it was together or occasional pursuits without being in each other's hip pocket. It was great. Not long after, however, it slid to where it somehow became my responsibility to do all those things. Fast forward to post-divorce and he has to do everything with no help at all and it seems like a huge burden to him while I continue to do what I always did but without the contributory cleanup after him. Yup, I'm happier living in a single household while in a relationship with someone else. There's nothing to fight about. No division of responsibilities, no financial squabbles, neither person lamenting about what the other "should" be doing. The relationship is focused on the individual and not all the other "stuff" that seems to get in the way when living together daily.
 Peas_
Joined: 5/2/2015
Msg: 53
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 8:52:26 AM
True story...
I never approved of eating in any other room except the kitchen or out on the patio at the tables....


I tripped coming up the steps while carrying an immense arm load of dirty dishes from the family room.

My bunny slippers caught my bad foot on the metal step guard of that top step. I fell head first into the wall, directly across from the top of the steps. I rebroke my neck.
 Literate_Hiker
Joined: 1/1/2015
Msg: 54
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 9:36:58 AM
chameleonf:

Many (the majority) of men are perfectly capable of cleaning up after themselves when living by themselves but for some strange reason a 1950s mentality takes over when living with a woman.For instance, my ex started out always helping with housework. Every weekend we'd race around on Saturday mornings getting the bigger household chores done, and then have the rest of the weekend to spend doing whatever we wanted. It was great. Not long after, however, it slid to where it somehow became my responsibility to do all those things.

This has also been my experience. I think it's because most middle-aged men grew up in the 1950's with mothers who did all of the cooking, cleaning, childcare and housework. This conservative belief is seared in men's minds as HOW THINGS SHOULD BE. My ex-husband's idea of doing the dishes was to place a cutting board over the sink.

I never worked so hard in my life as when I was married. I did all of the housework, childcare, laundry, cleaning, yard work, leaf raking and snow shoveling... and most of the cooking. "My back!" Terry protested, clutching his lower back, whenever I asked him to do anything physical. Yet he managed to play tennis four days a week, creating more towels and laundry for me.

"Barbara Billingsley’s June Cleaver on Leave It to Beaver (1957-1963) has long been remembered as the quintessential housewife who kept an immaculate home while managing to look immaculate herself in her trademark pearls and high heels.

"With reruns still playing in the United States and other countries around the world and with a remake of the series, The New Leave It to Beaver, in the 1980s, the perfect image of June has been seared into the minds of millions of people. While some like June Cleaver, others loathe her and give her a lot of flak for being the archetypal 1950s woman the second wave of the Women’s Movement was trying to liberate."

From "American Memory of the 1950s Housewife" on Wikipedia.
 clooneystutor
Joined: 3/8/2015
Msg: 55
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 9:48:21 AM
June was doing something right to keep Ward smiling :)
 Tarnished_Knight
Joined: 3/5/2009
Msg: 56
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History
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 9:56:25 AM
I sense a certain level of misandrism here.
I feel for these women, and men, whose backgrounds have left them seared relationally.

Personally, while son's mom and I had our difficulties, and I've related some of my frustrations w/in these threads, I prefer to see the future through the veil of our good times and not paint all women with son's mom's failings.

TK
 IL_Capitano
Joined: 11/23/2012
Msg: 57
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Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 10:08:18 AM

This has also been my experience. I think it's because most middle-aged men grew up in the 1950's with mothers who did all of the cooking, cleaning, childcare and housework. This conservative belief is seared in men's minds as HOW THINGS SHOULD BE. My ex-husband's idea of doing the dishes was to place a cutting board over the sink.


Well, that's the popular belief amongst women, it seems, but from my perspective it has to do with something else altogether.

When I was still married, I had two jobs, one full-time and the other part-time several evenings a week. I did nearly as much cooking and cleaning as my ex. When I got home from my day job, I had to take care of kids and cook if it was my turn. I didn't mind doing any of that stuff. I did my own laundry and because we had two kids in cloth diapers at the time, I would put them in the wash whenever I saw it needed doing. She started working part-time when the two youngest were about 2 and 3.

The issue was that I rarely did anything good enough for the ex. Things always had to be on her terms around the house and on her schedule, which is why I chose to do my own laundry and the kids' laundry if there was any. On weekends, the ex would have social things and household things arranged that I was required to attend or attend to. I hated it when she would say, "Oh, by the way, I told ____ and ____ that you'd help them move some stuff this weekend." Thanks, like I had nothing else I'd rather be doing.....

Trying to please her was tiring and in the end not good enough either. I see similar things with my buddies. Every guy I know is involved in their kids and in the stuff that needs to be done around the home like cooking and cleaning, but they talk about experiences that are similar to mine.

I think it's a very rare guy these days who thinks that the woman is going to do everything around the house. I think it's much more common that guys just get tired of being told they are doing everything wrong or at the wrong time and say, "Fvck it. Why bother?"

 VolkanoKing
Joined: 8/1/2014
Msg: 58
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 11:23:02 AM
I dont think there has EVER been a fair division of labor. I was watching a BBC show on Elizabethan England, and it was describing the life of the average woman, which included not only physical labor alongside the men, but all the childcare on top of it. What are you going to do..babies come out of female bodies. You just get with the program and work with it. I dont think this is 1950's specific.

I also believe that men are more involved than ever in child care. I know many men, actually, who had very well paying jobs in my industry, and they voluntarily gave it up to raise their children. So it's not all that dire.

I never actually had this "division of labor" problem and am not interested..at all...in experiencing it. The name of the game is to put my time and money into projects, exercise and travel, not like cooking and dealing with family stuff, etc. What makes this possible? Birth control. Greatest invention ever (besides toilets!) It's my life, my choices and I prefer it child and marriage free.
 chameleonf
Joined: 12/22/2008
Msg: 59
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 12:05:56 PM

I sense a certain level of misandrism here.
I feel for these women, and men, whose backgrounds have left them seared relationally.


There's certainly no misandry on my part. The vast majority of men are great...I just don't want to live with them any more than I'd want a female roommate. I see no real reason to. I look after myself financially, own my own home, do all household/yard chores myself. I am left with time to enjoy the companionship of the same man I have for the past 10 years, which is free of any of those things that both men and women complain about regarding marriage or living together. Having experienced a relationship of 35 years (30 of it living together) and now the past 12 years living on my own, I find the latter to be extremely satisfying and stress-free. Some people have a need for marriage, which isn't wrong at all - for them - but I find that the majority of women my age do desire monogamous relationships but not necessarily those which entail living together. Just because you've lived life a certain way which conformed to society's standards doesn't mean your entire life has to follow the same pattern. Women aren't as eager to marry as they were years ago because there isn't the associated societal shaming there once was, nor is there a need due to financial reasons. Pretty sad that people partner for those reasons.


I think it's because most middle-aged men grew up in the 1950's with mothers who did all of the cooking, cleaning, childcare and housework. This conservative belief is seared in men's minds as HOW THINGS SHOULD BE.


I believe LH is right there, whether it's 1950s or prior as VK states. Being married for some men is like being mothered and that's what they seek and/or expect - it's their comfort zone. If that's what they want, there's nothing the matter with it but it may get more difficult to find a woman willing to fill that type of role. Women may reach a certain age where, having experienced long-term marriages or even a series of them, want something different out of life when the opportunity presents itself. Whatever it is you seek has no bearing on my life and vice versa. I don't see this as cause to bash the other gender - it's just a dynamic that has evolved because life choices have evolved.
 newoldgirl
Joined: 4/16/2015
Msg: 60
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 1:13:11 PM

just because something isn't a problem for you, doesn't mean it isn't "really" a problem.
------------------
Just because something is a problem for you, doesn't mean it really is a problem.


You said that already. You don't sound smarter by saying it again.

If you didn't think it was a problem, why offer a solution?


Not doing something that he doesn't think needs to be done is not the same thing as him not doing his fair share. Before you can complain about someone not doing his fair share, you first have to agree on what needs to be done. Otherwise, "fair share" is meaningless.


For some of us, the desired outcome is a clean and tidy home, decent meals, and decently parented children. For other people, the desired outcome is plenty of free time.

Most people need to be much more clear about what is important to them, and what they are willing to accept/tolerate in terms of domestic orderliness.
 Literate_Hiker
Joined: 1/1/2015
Msg: 61
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 2:32:43 PM
il_capitano:
I think it's a very rare guy these days who thinks that the woman is going to do everything around the house.

As a 61 year-old woman that has not been my experience. I have been attracting men who never learned to cook. So far I met eight men like that.

Maybe this is because I listed "cooking real food" as one of my interests. On my profile I also wrote: "On hikes I surprise and delight people with homemade date bars or oatmeal chocolate chip cookies."

Perhaps I shouldn't say I can cook. "Don't admit you can type," working women were warned in the 1970s. This was before computers. In job interviews, women who could type were automatically shunted into low-paying, secretarial positions.
 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 62
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 2:55:23 PM
^^^Do those guys look like they're survivors of Auschwitz then? They must be doing something right to prevent starvation.
 CrookCatcher
Joined: 7/14/2014
Msg: 63
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 3:09:12 PM

I have been attracting men who never learned to cook.


LH...

Next time just fire up the charcoal or gas grill, it's like a moth to the flame. It's genetic, it can't be controlled....we have to. With absolutely no cooking experience admitted we can grill ANYTHING to perfection.

This basic instinct driven through the eon's has caused families to fragment at cook outs due to establishing dominance at the grill. :)
 07songsungblue
Joined: 7/10/2015
Msg: 64
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 3:18:06 PM
Never met a man who couldn't cook or pick up after himself. Hell, when my Dad took over looking after my Mom with Alzheimer's, he cooked. He also baked, made jam, hemmed his pants, cut my Mom's hair, cleaned toilets, vacuumed ...kept the house and the yard up. The thing is, my brothers would and could do the same as would my son. Think about this, a woman raised these men...maybe bytch at their mothers instead of them.

Some will never find a man to do ANYTHING to their standards or wishes.
 IL_Capitano
Joined: 11/23/2012
Msg: 65
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History
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 3:30:54 PM

As a 61 year-old woman that has not been my experience. I have been attracting men who never learned to cook. So far I met eight men like that.


Well, that is astounding to me.

I don't know a single buddy or male acquaintance who can't cook and you aren't much older than I am. I share recipes with my buddies. My older brother is a great cook, way better than I am and I'm no slouch.

Very odd.....

 Literate_Hiker
Joined: 1/1/2015
Msg: 66
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 3:35:19 PM
Men I met who never learned to cook ate at restaurants, slapped together simple sandwiches with deli meat, and often microwaved frozen dinners from the grocery store. "How do you slice a lemon?" one man asked.

I believe if you can read, you can cook. That's how I learned. Cooking well takes practice.

These men expected me to do ALL of the menu planning, grocery shopping, food prep and cooking. To me that's a burden. Cooking is a daily household chore that needs to be shared.

While visiting two of the men, I felt food-insecure in their homes. Because they lacked the mindset of feeding other people, they didn't have food in the house for me to eat. So I swung into action- filling the vacuum- shopping and cooking healthy meals for both of us. This was more difficult than it sounds. They didn't have sharp knives, cutting boards, pots, pans, baking sheets, oils, flours, spices, herbs and other supplies that a cook needs.

To my surprise, two of the men I met were extremely picky eaters with Selective Eating Disorder. This is more common that I thought. They lived on cheese, a few bland meats, white bread, crackers and white rice: NEVER touched vegetables or fruit. Food textures and smells repelled them. These picky eaters turned up their noses at foods I prepared. I'm not willing to contend with that.

I'm not willing to become some man's nurse, cook or maid. I'm not their mommy.
 Peas_
Joined: 5/2/2015
Msg: 67
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 3:38:12 PM

Think about this, a woman raised these men...maybe bytch at their mothers instead of them.


That's it! You hit it right on the head! If their mothers are still alive by now....you walk into her house, and if it's a hoarding mess, with piles here and there, and trails to walk between rooms, run for the hills!
 Whistle_Stop
Joined: 4/9/2015
Msg: 68
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 3:41:05 PM
Same here.....I have never been with a man that cooked. Sure....If I was flat out sick....a can of soup could be handled.
My 2nd husband....in his words cooked every Saturday, after a long work week...usually bring home or a meal out.....that was a bonus.
Might be the age because we are at the tail end of the traditional role thingy....it seems....I just did it.
I know....My son-in-law cooks all the time and I see it with a lot of the younger generation.
I have to admit.....If your profile mentions "chef"....I linger longer over those ones....lol.
 dragonbytes
Joined: 12/25/2014
Msg: 69
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 3:54:35 PM
Literate_Hiker
Perhaps I shouldn't say I can cook.


I agree that saying you surprise and delight with homemade date bars, etc, etc, is more likely attracting men that can't cook.

But it seems easy enough to fix by adding the following.

On hikes I surprise and delight people with homemade date bars or oatmeal chocolate chip cookies. Instant hero.

At home, my hero is a man that surprises me with a home cooked meal of my favorite foods. He is a real dish. ]


This is an positive way to tell men you expect someone who can also cook.
 purplerider1200
Joined: 9/10/2011
Msg: 70
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History
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 4:31:01 PM
I cook. I think takeout is expensive, and lousy at that. My mom insisted that I learn, and more than a few times, I made desserts also. She taught me to can, and I was put in charge of many holiday dinners. Lumpless gravy, came from me. And was I P*SSED when when my ex gave away my turkey roaster! I've killed many grills from use. When it came to buying appliances, I bought the best.

If you picked men that lost their recipe for making ice cubes, know exactly where the frozen microwave dinners are in the supermarket, buy new underwear rather than washing their own, have to borrow a vacuum cleaner for the neighbor, and figure that windows get washed when it rains, just remember one thing------------------------ YOU PICKED THEM!!!!
 Literate_Hiker
Joined: 1/1/2015
Msg: 71
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 4:43:07 PM
On a positive note, my former boyfriend, Dan- who is a lifelong friend and hiking partner- just called from the summit of Stevens Pass. We're going to hike to beautiful Spider Meadows tomorrow. Our conversation went like this:

Dan: "Hey Kathleen, I finally have a cell phone signal. I'm bringing fresh corn, cherries and tomatoes."

Me: "Wonderful. I got fresh green beans today and an organic pork tenderloin to roast. What time will you arrive?"

Dan: " I should arrive at 6:30. That sounds great.There's no need to go out for dinner tonight."

Me: Right. I'm baking Oatmeal-Chocolate Chip Cookies right now. Remember how we talked on our last hike about adding coffee to the cookies? Today I added strong coffee and the cookies are wonderful. Even the cookie batter is delicious."

What a delight! That's my kind of guy.
 sealady111
Joined: 5/31/2015
Msg: 72
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 4:43:54 PM
I can see pictures again.... Yay it is a miracle.

For me I think the problem is cohabitating.

Apparently I am very difficult to live with.
Even as a small child I had to have my own room whilst my sisters shared.
One room sharing attempt resulted in a line literally being drawn down the middle of the room to ensure I did not encroach on my sister's side.

Whilst I adore men and love having a man who loves me around I do prefer to make and clean up my own mess.
To come home to a house the same way or better than I left it it bliss.

Better is the few times in my life when married and I would come home and be greeted at the door with a kiss, glass of wine, fire lit and dinner on the stove. HEAVEN!!!
(During this time we still needed a dual shower, separate sections of the bathroom and toiletries, laundered our own clothing and stored this clothing in separate rooms.)

Whilst I very much doubt I will ever again live under the same roof with a man, please may we have 'visiting rights' :) Mutual courtship forever?

Maybe these days there are more women, like me, and others on here, who do not fit the mould of multiple children from multiple fathers who need a man to and provide financial support and a home for their family.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have often laughing said throughout my life that I NEED A WIFE!!!
 Brave_one
Joined: 6/26/2015
Msg: 73
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 4:54:21 PM

At home, my hero is a man that surprises me with a home cooked meal of my favorite foods. He is a real dish. ]

This is an positive way to tell men you expect someone who can also cook.


Imo, true lovers,friends, companions, confidants,etc..... will both share in the mundane,cooking,cleaning , & cuddling.......but not necessary in that order.... but to give it, ad I say a 60 -40%. approach,.. making & going the extra mile of kindness nonetheless....equal.
We all have our strengths & weakness’s....but compassion & respect is key! Especially if your in a relationship with a S O.

And as for those who don’t....or can’t, or won’t..... going into the 21th century....well your clock is ticking till the fat lady sings, adios MF lol As if your one of those..... imo, who should stay very single .....

Happiness is sharing the burden & respecting each others goals if the relationship together is healthy......in which both is a a plus....

And happiness can be very single too.....to each their own.....as life is very large to enjoy.....so pick your poison or complain why it only happens to you.....cheers
 Behind-Blue-Eyes_53
Joined: 12/19/2011
Msg: 74
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 4:59:34 PM

While visiting two of the men, I felt food-insecure in their homes. Because they lacked the mindset of feeding other people, they didn't have food in the house for me to eat. So I swung into action- filling the vacuum- shopping and cooking healthy meals for both of us. This was more difficult than it sounds. They didn't have sharp knives, cutting boards, pots, pans, baking sheets, oils, flours, spices, herbs and other supplies that a cook needs.


I have all the tools needed for cooking, I just hate to cook..... Specially for one person..... Then You might not think the things I like to make are Healthy enough, too.... I don't mind shopping for food, just give me a list....

The other side is, if you don't like the way I do it, then do it yourself.... My late wife didn't like the way I cleaned the kitchen floors.... She was smart enough, to leave me alone, to do it my way..... When I was done, the floor was clean... Some of my cleaning habits comes from the US Military.....

One other thing, don't put My Knives in the Dishwasher.... Seen more Women do this, than I can remember & it's Just Wrong.......

vvvvvvv Dam Straight, I won't do that, Diana..... Don't use my good screwdrivers as a pry bar, either....
 sealady111
Joined: 5/31/2015
Msg: 75
Men happier married vs Women happier single - according to research
Posted: 7/22/2015 5:06:16 PM
OK Blue eyes.

I will not put your knives in the dishwasher if you do not use my dressmaking shears as general purpose scissors.
Deal??????


p.s. I have eaten many a magnificent meal cooked by men.
Some use one pot others every utensil available.


pps. Cooking at home. LH I do not think eating out rather than cooking at home is only men.
There are some homes / apartments that do not even have kitchens.

ppps. I have taught young exchange students how to cook. The young men have really enjoyed the praise from the young women and much more affordable.
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