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 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 26
Mail order brides, take 2Page 2 of 4    (1, 2, 3, 4)

Msg 24:
...only to find it that those promises are empty. Once they arrive, what is wanted is received and she is left to fend for herself without money, resources, and safety.


Using that logic, does that mean that every person who fled Syria for European countries should all be sent back to Syria, because they are not guaranteed a comfortable living standard in the country they fled to? Besides, using your personal views on what may or may not happen means nothing other than you oppose the concept, even though you say there are statistic showing What statistics-or more precisely, what accurate and non-biased statistics? Are you saying it's impossible for this type of arrangement to work?
 Seki1949
Joined: 9/4/2013
Msg: 27
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/16/2015 10:09:20 PM
Accurate and non-biased statistics are harder to find than you might imagine.

Did you know that kids with bigger feet are have better reading scores? It is absolutely true!
 LetitiaLeGrande
Joined: 3/22/2015
Msg: 28
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/16/2015 10:38:40 PM
22suzie22

The trouble is these old fools breed with these younger women and the children have a grandfather age Dad who can pop off at any time. I know a 7 year old girl in this situation who constantly worries that her Dad is not going to be around as she grows older. All very well to use the little blue pill to breed but they don't think about the consequences for these children.
 sealady111
Joined: 5/31/2015
Msg: 29
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/16/2015 11:50:00 PM
Speaking as one of the ugly old hogs....




Well you have to ask yourself, is it better to have a failed marriage with a hot beautiful Russian wife, or an ugly hog from POF. Odds are both will probably end. Might as well have had fun during that time.


You are welcome to do so.
As long as you do not expect other people's taxes to pay for her.
Or your offspring.

Or for yourself.
 baconflavoredbacon
Joined: 9/12/2015
Msg: 30
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/17/2015 3:57:23 AM
Msg. 27:

You disingenuously extracted a piece of my post -- and out of context, too -- to incite an argument that doesn't need to happen.

For that, I order you to go make me a bacon sammy with extra mayo (on rye) and do it with a smile on your face!

:)
 Blackwood85
Joined: 5/20/2013
Msg: 31
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/17/2015 4:22:10 AM

think what worries me is that we in the western world tend to infantilize certain women, because we assume by the color of their skin or nationality that they are destitute and vulnerable. Some are and others are not. Maybe the man seeking a foreign bride is familiar with the culture and people and would prefer to start a family within? No shame and exploitation in that.


Typically the men who buy brides have the money to actually fly to Japan/Russia/China/Ukraine and stay there for an extended period of time, if they're that interested in the culture they would put the effort in to fly and court a woman for an extended period of time and put some work and effort into finding a wife.

What the hell happened to people accomplishing things on their own merits? It's a novel concept nowadays I know.
 adventurejoe70
Joined: 3/1/2013
Msg: 32
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/17/2015 11:36:36 AM

Mainly because it's sexploitation of women who are looking for better lives,



Let me re phase it..do you associate willingly and give your time to persons that YOU receive no benefit from, regardless if it is activity pal, good conversation, dating, etc? I think not!

If they get what they want then it isn't exploitation or at least negative exploitation. That doesn't mean the relationship is equal but MOST relationships aren't equal. Regardless if its friendship, dating, work, etc.


nd NJGirl hit the nail on the head, 9 times out of 10 who want a "traditional woman" (Never mind that there a ton of western women who are traditional) Really what those guys want are doormats who want challenge them at all.


Haha they are in for a rude awakening. Russian women usually want dominant men. It isn't that they are submissive, it is more of them wanting someone very dominant and they will play the feminine role. Most Westerners aren't that dominant, thus the mismatch.

*married dating over 13 yrs with one.
 ClooneysMentor
Joined: 8/2/2015
Msg: 33
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/17/2015 12:14:29 PM
I'd be friggin' stoked if a gal flew me overseas to care for me...
 Blackwood85
Joined: 5/20/2013
Msg: 34
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/17/2015 2:07:45 PM


Haha they are in for a rude awakening. Russian women usually want dominant men. It isn't that they are submissive, it is more of them wanting someone very dominant and they will play the feminine role. Most Westerners aren't that dominant, thus the mismatch.

*married dating over 13 yrs with one.


The idea is that with the women being immigrants they won't challenge them because there's the risk of deportation maybe some men are upstanding citizens and wouldn't use that to their advantage but I'm willing to bet the men who would buy an mail order bride from some shady site probably aren't upstanding men. The willingness to buy love and throw money at everything for a solution, they're probably not the most emotionally healthy men in the world, I think the best description of them is Healy from "Orange is the New Black" an misogynistic, sad, pathetic, man who believes women are beneath them and thinks there's a conspiracy from lesbian woman to take over the world the classic MRA who would buy Russian mail-order bride who it turns out really hates him and just using him to get her citizenship. That's the classic definition of a guy who uses such services. These guys are well.....idiots so the idea of a woman standing up for herself, bucking stereotypes and gender roles is a foreign concept to them.


Let me re phase it..do you associate willingly and give your time to persons that YOU receive no benefit from, regardless if it is activity pal, good conversation, dating, etc? I think not!

If they get what they want then it isn't exploitation or at least negative exploitation. That doesn't mean the relationship is equal but MOST relationships aren't equal. Regardless if its friendship, dating, work, etc.


Totally different, my time, my companionship didn't have to be bought, if I'm dating or hanging out with a girl it's because we connected and I want to. She's not using her vagina to make me do what she wants and I'm not dangling money and implying threats of deportation if she gets out of line.

Plus the whole thing is just shady as **** while the cutter didn't deal with migrant interdiction, I know people who are stationed on the East Coast on cutter that specialize in that and the stories they've told me about the women they've found are just crazy

"Mail-order brides," women who are advertised in catalogs (the most popular of which is entitled Cherry Blossoms) for marriage to American men, generally come from destitute conditions in parts of Asia. Most are born in the Philippines, a country troubled by political strife and high unemployment."Over 70% of Philippine women live in poverty, thus making them particularly vulnerable to the mail-order industry

The mail-order bride business appears to be thriving. Approximately 200 companies operate in the United States(41) and an estimated 2000 to 3500 American men find wives through these catalogs each year. In June 1990, the government of the Philippines, alarmed at reports of widespread abuse of Philippine women in other countries, outlawed bride agencies. That move simply drove the mail-order business underground without significantly affecting the international trade."

Pretty much what happens and a shipmate explained this to me is that a company goes to a economically troubled country, promising a better life, the company recruits women to join them and pose for picture so that American who are disenchanted with the changing landscape of gender roles can choose from them. Since these men still suck and couldn't get laid even if they went to an underdground sex club offering orgies, fully masked, with women offering themselves up to them, even with their penises inserted into vaginas. So they mass mail women and continually contacts one until he can "woo" them into marriage and by woo just keep offering a large sum of money. Even the chicks addresses needs to be purchased along with a translator because of the language barrier when it comes to writing letters, legal documents etc....on the other hand some men just purchase women at underground auctions.

Like I said the whole thing is shady as hell and all hell breaks loose when the woman isn't the traditional, demure woman the man thought she was.
 adventurejoe70
Joined: 3/1/2013
Msg: 35
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/17/2015 2:51:09 PM

I think the best description of them is Healy from "Orange is the New Black" an misogynistic, sad, pathetic, man who believes women are beneath them and thinks there's a conspiracy from lesbian woman to take over the world the classic MRA who would buy Russian mail-order bride who it turns out really hates him and just using him to get her citizenship.


Well that show is comedy. For one thing, the way he did it is IMPOSSIBLE. They are making fun of the process on that show. Another thing, Healy actually is WEAK. That is one of the problems. He is the " typical nice guy"(who really isn't nice). Do you remember the scene when the older women screams and yells at his wife? You are saying he is dominant? NOPE he isn't, she walks all over him.

Also they are basically online dating sites today. There matchmaking companies in America that charge much more . If you remember I wrote about how a gal working for a NYC based matchmaking service wanted me to date a few of her clients FREE of charge( meal paid for). She contacted me on POF.


These guys are well.....idiots so the idea of a woman standing up for herself, bucking stereotypes and gender roles is a foreign concept to them.

Who said it is a foreign concept? People want what they want. Most are also divorced looking for much younger in a society that has been brainwashed to not accept age differences.

You REALIZE I am a traditionalist right? I have said repeatedly I believe in gender roles. MOST of the regular women here don't think I am a misogynist. Go ask them!

Are you calling me an idiot? Do you want to compare IQ's ? ....point is I can get WHATEVER I want and whatever is OUT THERE doesn't mean I am not choosing what is BEST for ME. If one doesn't have their own identity or belief system that mens they are brainwashed.

Although most of the agencies are a bit fagazi, the vast majority of men are above average in most ways(education, height, status, wealth, looks?). I know this because I lived in that part of the world for 3 years and I met THESE guys. I am basing on experience not the media portrayal or those suckers scammed into big tours.


That move simply drove the mail-order business underground without significantly affecting the international trade."


Now it is internet dating just like anywhere else. Dragon met his wife that way. BTW FYI the majority of Filipinos married to Americans are probably to American soldiers. Your brothers are probably the largest expat community in that country. They even have hospitals that take USA military tricare insurance.



So they mass mail women and continually contacts one until he can "woo" them


Sounds like POF..lol

Like I said the whole thing is shady as hell and all hell breaks loose when the woman isn't the traditional, demure woman the man thought she was.

Actually most are just incompatible. Plus the women often scam. Trust me I know what they talk about in the local papers. Somehow you are talking about the few cases of when the man was the problem but believe it or not it is a big scam. Local papers written in their foreign language sometimes have articles how to "scam the system". In my building there is a guy (Ukrainian lawyer), he practices immigration law, he has told me some crazy stories!


Plus the whole thing is just shady as **** while the cutter didn't deal with migrant interdiction, I know people who are stationed on the East Coast on cutter that specialize in that and the stories they've told me about the women they've found are just crazy


Not sure what this has to do with the subject. The sex trafficking rings perhaps can be interdicted on a cutter, but I don't see how a guy bringing a GF over will be a coast guard issue. Are you sure you aren't confused here? (RAISES AN EYEBROW)

That being said I bet I raided more houses of trafficking rings than your East Coast cutter stops "boat people". When I was a UN cop in Kosovo-Bosnia, that was a big part of the job.

Also as a side note if you are into this stuff you should read a book about the Russain mob .They used to bring the girls and weapons into the company on Aeroflot planes and land them right in JFK here. When you can buy an airline you can get away with a lot.
 HereComesYourSun
Joined: 9/7/2015
Msg: 36
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/17/2015 9:14:27 PM
I'm just curious.
Is there a place to order a groom?
 NJgirl116
Joined: 7/3/2015
Msg: 37
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/18/2015 5:34:43 PM
I'm so happy I haven't had to grow up and live in one of these immigrant neighborhoods Joe talks about, ugh. We lived in Queens for a year, then my mom, God bless her, worked her behind off to get us out of the city into a nice suburban American area to live.

HereComesYourSun: No place to order a groom, unfortunately.
 sealady111
Joined: 5/31/2015
Msg: 38
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/18/2015 5:42:28 PM

I'm just curious.
Is there a place to order a groom?



HereComesYourSun: No place to order a groom, unfortunately.


^^^ UNFAIR!!!!!!!
It is discrimination!!!
I demand equal rights.
This is just another example of ..................................................................

Physically I choose a tall, broad south sea islander, Melanesian, from somewhere like Fiji. Hubba Hubba.
 WillyT990
Joined: 7/11/2015
Msg: 39
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/28/2015 5:50:03 PM
There was a documentary made a few years ago about Caucasian men in the US and maybe the UK marrying mail-order brides from China. The film-maker was herself Asian, and one of her goals was to show that these women get exploited, and also to kinda show the guys up as old fools who couldn't get any action any other way.

One of the men was 50+ and did the Asian bride thing because his son had done it and their situation worked out. That may not be the best reason to do anything... But alot of the men had this idea that the Asian women would all be demure and submissive, and that simply wasn't the case...

Now, the 50+ guy seemed to actually want to make the marriage work, but was stymied by cultural differences and the language barrier. He knew some Chinese, but not nearly enough. To his credit, he asked the film-maker for help, and to her credit, she agreed to help them even though it kinda went against what she was trying to do with her film. I *think* they were going in a better direction at the end of the film.

But it just shows that those who do this can be playing a potentially dangerous and messy game with their life and the lives of others. Proceed with caution.
 LetitiaLeGrande
Joined: 3/22/2015
Msg: 40
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/28/2015 6:12:43 PM
clooneys

Not a fat old tart who would use you for sex and services though...lol!!!
 LetitiaLeGrande
Joined: 3/22/2015
Msg: 41
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/28/2015 6:18:12 PM
Oh yes sex to some of these women is just a trade off for what else they get. In some instances they have a child as soon as possible so as to have traction and leverage over the husband and to make sure they stay in the country that affords them a better life and get the benefits.
 474bluemoon
Joined: 9/24/2015
Msg: 42
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/28/2015 6:49:12 PM
^^^ Women have been doing that for eons. They don't even have to come from a different country. There are a lot of young trophy wives hanging onto a lot of older men and their power and wallets. Theses women want a better life too.
 sealady111
Joined: 5/31/2015
Msg: 43
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 9/28/2015 6:52:02 PM
^^^ Absolutely.

It is often said on these forums (fora?) that men do not care whether a woman is accomplished or has money as long as she is hot.

And some women do not care anything about the man other than "Does he have money?"

The world's oldest profession in action.

Supply and demand.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 44
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Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 10/1/2015 3:31:06 PM

The closest I have come to knowing any one, I have a cousin that met his Filipino wife through some sort of Catholic Church sponsered program. That doesn't seem to fit the mode of mail order bride. They are happily married and live in the USA, I should ask them more questions about how they met, but I don't often keep in contact

The concept's still the same that brings things into question: It's an "arranged marriage" -- just a different flavor, personal-ads style, instead of mom & pop (or church) doing it. Same basic concept.

Obviously with self-made arranged marriages from those overseas, it doesn't mean you Marry them as soon as you contact/connect (same goes for just about any arranged marriage in more civilized society). The issue with this flavor is -- how much are they wanting to get citizenship, and how much is it to get married and settle down? I think the underage thing is pretty easy to dodge, but one's intent from overseas to get married is kind of difficult. From what I've read/heard, it's actually Not as crazy as one would assume... much how general arranged marriages don't have as high a divorce rate as one would assume... mainly because there's more people who Are wanting to get Married, in and of itself, than ya think. Especially if they grew up kinda trapped, etc. That marriage reflects freedom (as opposed to us freedom loving US-Canadian folk).

Much the same as many people (more female than male) who are in love with being in love... who are in love with settling down. That, in and of itself is the focal point even though they deny it's not really like that (even though it truly is). It's very much just a couple steps away from an arranged marriage, without them really knowing/feeling it that way.
 bamagrl68
Joined: 11/14/2010
Msg: 45
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 10/1/2015 3:51:13 PM
dragonbytes- As with ANY relationship, there are right motives and wrong motives to get into one.
The question I ask, is what IS the motivation to seek a bride, outside of the US?
Women are women, after all.
So what WOULD a man be seeking to basically ORDER a wife?
The only motive I can see, is one of exploitation.
If they can get the woman to leave her home country, every thing she knows, her only support system, they are pretty much then helpless to do what the man wants.
Anyone is free to come back and TRY to argue differently, but if the motive were love, or anything else, I see NO reason to look to a foreign country to find it.
That type of love is available right here in the US.
And, yes, getting used for money is NOT something a man needs to seek outside of this country either.
People are free do do what ever they please, so if someone does it and it works for them, then by all means, go for it, but I CAN'T see why, other than what I stated above.
Well, yes I can, desperation, but that doesn't paint a pretty picture either.
 TrvstInKarma
Joined: 9/1/2015
Msg: 46
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 10/1/2015 9:19:49 PM
bamagrl nailed it. THere are plenty of beautiful women here in the US, of all ethnic backgrounds, there really is no need to look abroad, except for the reasons you stated.
 subhacker
Joined: 11/30/2006
Msg: 47
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Posted: 10/5/2015 12:55:49 PM
To paraphrase a radio ad that has been running a lot lately: getting a mail order bride is like choosing your wife like you would a pair of shoes.

In my mind it is a direct solution to an oversimplified problem.

1) Problem: man wants to get married and probably have kids. (Why? because society tells him it is the thing to do)
2) Man does not not want to hassle to searching and dating
3) Ergo, mail order bride save a lot of trouble.

Most people in this thread are hung up on #2 and #3 but, in my opinion it already off the rails at #1. With the structure of marriage is the goal, rather than a progression after meeting someone special, strange solutions can seem quite logical.

A friend of mine from high school has a mail order bride. He is very traditional and it very clear who is in change. Makes me cringe a little but they have been together close to 20 years now. It seems to work for them.
 baconflavoredbacon
Joined: 9/12/2015
Msg: 48
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 10/5/2015 2:05:48 PM
There are grooms sites, where you can score a hubby for the right price. (There's one of which I am aware in Australia.) No, thanks.

There isn't anything wrong on meeting people on other continents for romance and family. You don't have to find somebody, here, if you don't want. If you want somebody abroad, go for it.

As far as the senior father's breeding well into their 50s, 60s, and 70s? No, they aren't thinking about the resultant children and how this would impact them; they're thinking about themselves. It's their lives and if they have the means and the right, I suppose the do whatever the bacon they want. I won't date them.
 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 49
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 10/5/2015 2:24:56 PM

The only motive I can see, is one of exploitation.


Who is exploiting who? The woman is after something in the deal-a free ride in a new country. financially supported by the guy, end up getting citizenship and then sponsor other family members to immigrate, will have material goods she had no chance of getting before, and even love. It's foreign gold digging. So who is being exploited?
 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 50
Mail order brides, take 2
Posted: 10/5/2015 2:39:29 PM

TIK: THere are plenty of beautiful women here in the US, of all ethnic backgrounds, there really is no need to look abroad, except for the reasons you stated.


Are you willing to marry one of these guys who are thinking of going the foreign bride route?
(Just what I thought)
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