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 DonaldTrumpsGoogleHistory
Joined: 9/26/2015
Msg: 76
The POPEPage 4 of 11    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11)

IT was such a secret,it's being reported about in the media.


Because her lawyer is telling everyone who will listen, which means you should take what he said with a grain of salt considering he also said that there was a 100,000-person prayer in Peru which he later admitted was a lie.

Kim Davis’ Attorneys Finally Admit This Picture Is A Hoax
by Zack Ford Sep 29, 2015 11:04am

http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2015/09/29/3706790/liberty-counsel-kim-davis-retraction/





One of them is the definition of marriage.
Anybody who believed otherwise shows how ignorant they are of f the Catholic faith.


So correct as if you actually study the catholic faith you quickly learn that under their rules a man can rape an underage virgin and marry her regardless of her age and if you happen to kill her father in battle you get to do it without having to pay her family.
 LLove2LaughToo
Joined: 3/5/2011
Msg: 77
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 12:38:33 PM

villabolos :
IT was such a secret,it's being reported about in the media.



Kim Davis Recounts Secret Meeting With Pope Francis :
Father Benedettini from the Vatican Press office released a statement AFTER reports emerged that Davis and the pope had met.

“The Holy See is aware of the reports of Kim Davis meeting with the Holy Father. The Vatican does not confirm the meeting, nor does it deny the meeting. There will be no further information given,“ the statement reads.


http://abcnews.go.com/US/exclusive-kim-davis-recounts-secret-meeting-pope-francis/story?id=34143874
 villabolos
Joined: 7/24/2015
Msg: 78
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 12:39:55 PM
Yeah, sure, whatever you say.
 LLove2LaughToo
Joined: 3/5/2011
Msg: 79
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 12:51:29 PM

villabolos :
Yeah, sure, whatever you say.


Actually, it was Kim Davis who said it.


On Tuesday night, her lawyer, Mathew D. Staver, said that Ms. Davis and her husband, Joe, were sneaked into the Vatican Embassy by car on Thursday afternoon.

The secretiveness of the meeting, and the Vatican’s refusal to give any information, will inevitably raise questions about why Francis chose to meet with Ms. Davis — and why he kept the meeting secret.

Vatican officials initially would not confirm that the meeting occurred, finally doing so on Wednesday afternoon, while refusing to discuss any details.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/30/us/county-clerk-kim-davis-who-denied-gay-couples-visited-pope.html?_r=0
 villabolos
Joined: 7/24/2015
Msg: 80
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 1:09:47 PM
IF that is what happened, then that is what happened. I don't see the problem with them meeting at all.
They were probably plotting a way to get you into Church this Sunday.
You are upset about simple meetings. But when obama signs executive orders overruling what the people want, you are probably more than fine with that.
IF you need a minute by minute blow of what he is doing everyday, perhaps you should take it up with the Vatican and not Plentyoffish forums. You are probably not going to get anywhere here.


I am not a fan of Pope Francis.


You have a clear misunderstanding of the Catholic faith if you think they are going to change their positions on certain issues.
 trinity818
Joined: 9/1/2006
Msg: 81
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 1:21:27 PM

IF you need a minute by minute blow of what he is doing everyday, perhaps you should take it up with the Vatican and not Plentyoffish forums. You are probably not going to get anywhere here.


Well this IS a discussion forum. Sounds like you are trying to shut him down. (or rather ....up.)
 LLove2LaughToo
Joined: 3/5/2011
Msg: 82
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 1:26:46 PM

villabolos :
IF that is what happened, then that is what happened. I don't see the problem with them meeting at all.
They were probably plotting a way to get you into Church this Sunday.
You are upset about simple meetings. But when obama signs executive orders overruling what the people want, you are probably more than fine with that.

IF you need a minute by minute blow of what he is doing everyday, perhaps you should take it up with the Vatican and not Plentyoffish forums. You are probably not going to get anywhere here.
I am not a fan of Pope Francis.

You have a clear misunderstanding of the Catholic faith if you think they are going to change their positions on certain issues.


Strike two. Wrong again. I am not a fan of Pope Francis, and did NOT vote for Obama either.

I live in Philly, and I made sure to stay as far away as possible from the Pope Circus in Philadelphia.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 83
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 3:01:37 PM

Nope, however people like yourself that think there is a conflict between science and Christianity always wheel out 500 yo historical fallacies.

"People like me"..? hahaha! & What are "People like me" like..?
Secondly, it's not a "fallacy".
& I think you'll find that almost every claim made by the catholic (other churches are available) or any other sects of the "christian" church is/are "in conflict" with science.
"Creation", "virgin births", "miracles", "resurrection" "son of god", etc etc., to name but a few 'biggies'.
I have examined it all in some detail, having been raised and schooled in a "christian" environment.
These beliefs should only ever be considered in the context and belief systems of the times of their origins.
Those people had no ideas about the causes of natural disasters or illness.

To put it into context, at the times of those myths/beliefs, the "king" ordered the deaths of every single newborn male baby, because an astrologer told him (About a new "king"). No-one batted an eyelid, because such barbarity was the norm.

I suggest you provide some evidence that HIV in Africa is a direct result of Catholicism.

Hahaha! Good one. I suggest you provide a post where I claimed it was "the cause".
Contraceptives (condoms) reduce the likelihood of transmission of sexually transmitted diseases. Fact.
The catholic church bans their use, because of religious dogma.
I don't actually have a favourite anti-christian website, which one would you suggest.?

The Catholic Church never made any comments about evolution for a Century.

How very up-to-date of them.

In 1950 the then Pope said that the theory of evolution does not conflict with the teachings of the Catholic Church.

And you believe him, do you..?
I suspect that that pope (whoever he was) also said "Don't be silly, we'd never rape children, we're celibate men of god". As did several other "popes", and they'd never lie would they, because god would get all... angry...

What is your hang up with "demonic possessions" anyway?

I don't have a "hang-up" with "demonic possessions", that's what churches do.

There is hardly been any religion that did not believe in evil sprits at some stage. Native Australians strongly believed in evil spirits. I know some that still do and they will not go to certain areas because they believe that evil spirits exist there. I have no reason to mock them for believing that though. I'm sure you would though.

Well good for you.
I bet you wouldn't even "mock" people who "believed" that banks shouldn't charge them interest, because "interest is evil"...?
You're a better man than me.
I struggle to not ridicule that which is ridiculous.

Know better about what?

Everything.

Quoting the bible! (Pfft!).

No response eh?

Perhaps they didn't object to the Exorcist because they didn't give a crap.

More likely that they just saw it as an "advert" for their exorcism services.

Yeah you said "all" because you copied that from an anti-Christian website. Well done!

No. I really, really didn't. I'll swear at a bible if you like.

Look. people can believe in whatever they like, but as I've said, religious people also demand that non-believers also follow their "rules", and that's when the problems start.

As I'm always asking "Jehova's Witnesses", when they knock on my door:
1/. If "god" really exists", why do I need a book, or another person, (or a church) to tell me about that...?
Shouldn't it be obvious?

2/. If "god"really exists, why didn't "he" (always male) tell everyone, all over the world, the same thing, at the same time..?
That would have avoided a lot of wars, conflicts, confusions, and misunderstandings.
We'd all know what to eat, and what not to eat.
We'd all know which day was the day off.
We'd all know what clothes to wear.
How to cut our hair,
We'd all know which bits of our genitals to mutilate. Etc.
"Jehova's Witnesses" and Mormons wouldn't even need to knock on doors.

Loads of advantages.

Instead of which, we seem to have a situation where a plethora (I'm not sure of the appropriate collective noun for gods, is it a "murder", or am I thinking about crows... [again])
...a plethora of different "gods", have all whispered their different "truths" into the different ears of various different "chosen" individuals, at various different times in history, in lots of different languages and amongst many different cultures.

They (the alleged "gods") then seem to leave it entirely up to those few ("chosen") individuals, to convince everyone else.
In the days before technological mass communication, before writing even existed, it seems to be an inefficient choice of transmission, if you really want everyone (as they all seem to claim) to follow your "rules".

What's the point of being "omnipotent" and "omnipresent", and all "godly" and that, if you don't use it..?

"God" (/"gods" delete as applicable) could have used "skywriting", with clouds.
( -Actually, strike that, they hadn't invented writing yet.)
OK then,
"God" (/"gods" delete as applicable) could have invented writing , then taught everyone to read, (and write, obviously)
and then used skywriting, to declare himself the only (or one of several) "true god" (/"s")

If I was omnipotent, that's what I'd do. I'd do it almost every day, in case someone missed it.

It's frankly, a mess.

"God" has obviously never done any serious project management.
Which makes me very suspicious of his qualities as a "leader."
(Well, to be honest, I couldn't 'serve' under any individual "god" who insisted that "worship" of him was entirely necessary. That's just vain)

The truth is, people don't actually "worship" "gods"... at all,
they worship the people who tell them to worship.

And that's why the people who tell you to worship , want you to carry on "believing".
It keeps them in jobs.

Here endeth the Wednesday lesson.
hth

 Ouija2025
Joined: 6/11/2014
Msg: 84
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 4:56:00 PM
ah yes, so much for the word SECRET having any meaning
I would however love to get into the City to see all the treasures.
 DameWrite
Joined: 2/27/2010
Msg: 85
view profile
History
The POPE
Posted: 9/30/2015 11:55:06 PM
Let's ask the Pope about his/Vatican /Swiss "mercenary" military. Or not?

Fckn hypocrite.
 villabolos
Joined: 7/24/2015
Msg: 86
The POPE
Posted: 10/1/2015 4:43:17 AM
Ah yes, people could not of been more in love with the guy when they read a yahoo comment that was part of a much bigger interview that said...who am I to judge....
But when they find out the Church will not change to their personal way of thinking and is rooted in 2,000 years of truth according to the gospels, then they go to plentyoffish to heir their grievances.

Marriage between one man and one woman is a sacrament of the Church.
...
I attend the Catholic Church every Sunday. I believe in it, I enjoy going, and I have learned more than I ever imagined.
Much like the bishop of the southern part of Hungary, I do not believe in open borders.

The people who criticize show they don't have an ounce of knowledge about the Church.
Islam on the other hand gets a free pass. ..you mean these 23 year olds from the middle east are muslims...bring'em in. Let's take things from the people who have earned them and give them to these young innocent muslims. They are our friends. They love us and are appreciative of what we are doing for them They are murdering and cutting heads off in Europe. The French Jewish population fears for their lives and is fleeing to Israel. None of that matters. We need to bring more of them in and support them....
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 87
The POPE
Posted: 10/1/2015 5:19:39 AM
Vlad- Based on what you wrote, he is now that Donald Trump fella?
 LLove2LaughToo
Joined: 3/5/2011
Msg: 88
The POPE
Posted: 10/1/2015 6:20:51 AM

villabolos :
But when they find out the Church will not change to their personal way of thinking and is rooted in 2,000 years of truth according to the gospels, then they go to plentyoffish to heir their grievances.

The people who criticize show they don't have an ounce of knowledge about the Church.
Islam on the other hand gets a free pass. ..you mean these 23 year olds from the middle east are muslims...bring'em in. Let's take things from the people who have earned them and give them to these young innocent muslims. They are our friends. They love us and are appreciative of what we are doing for them They are murdering and cutting heads off in Europe.


Maybe you need to practice what you preach, and take your grievances with your state senator and representative and not Plenty of Fish forums.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 89
The POPE
Posted: 10/1/2015 3:40:54 PM

But God is not a person haha

The bible claims we were "made in his image"

If God was to come here~ the power alone would blow up the planet

According to the bible, he used to hang-out here, quite a lot. It never mentioned the whole planet blowing-up.
But then it is a work of fiction.

Lets look at the beautiful architecture of creation

Haha... You mean evolution (for living things), and the laws of physics for the rest.
It's often very beautiful, I agree.
Even moreso, when you delve into our comparatively recent scientific discoveries, and new understandings, of how things came to be as they are, but there are also some hideous examples, it's easy to understand how earlier, less-enlightened/educated, more 'primitive' people came to believe in concepts like "good" and "evil", to describe everything.
Volcanoes, earthquakes, droughts, flood, fires and plagues all terrified them.
So they attributed all that to "the wrath of god"(/s) , and imposed even stricter laws, and made "sacrifices" etc. to try and aapease "god's wrath".
Sometime "it worked" too.
Volcanoes do sometimes stop erupting, floods do recede, fires do go out, and diseases sometimes run their courses, leaving survivors. They misinterpreted almost everything back then.

Not many people know that the "kosher" or "halal" butchery requirements are a vestige of previous "sacrificial" rituals.



I'm surprised God didn't pull plug on us thousands of years ago

Managed to wipe out dinosaurs in record time~:)))

"God" hadn't been invented until about 8,000 odd years ago. Quite recently in the scale of the millions of years we've been evolving from the other apes.
According to the bible, there were no dinosaurs.
I had a friend who was a JW., and believed in "creation" (This was back in the 70s, I don't know if she still does)
When I asked her where all the dinosaur bones, (which were on display at our local museum) came from, she told me that "god buried them in the ground, to test our faith".

Speaking of extinctions, there have been several. None of them were anything to do with "gods" though, human didn't evolve til hundreds of millions of years after that.
The Permian extinction (the one which killed the dinosaurs) about 252 million years ago, killed an estimated 96% of all species alive then. Everything which exists today, (including us) is descended from the remaining 4%, which survived. In mammals, I think they were mostley moley/micey type things, which we all descend from.
See, real life is far more interesting than the simplistic primitive mythology of the past.



It's innate someone either feels there is more or they don't feel so

No, it's entirely learned.
People believe whatever happens to be the dominant religion in their environment.
If you'd been born in India, you might well believe in Buddhism, or Sikhism, or if you'd been born in the middle east, you might be a muslim, or a zoroastrian.

It's funny to watch people "defending" christianity here, and talking about the "rights" of people to follow the rules of their faith, (by not marrying two gay people) and then those same people demonising muslims, because they want to follow their rules. And talking about them "changing our culture".
Where do they suppose "christianity" or "Judaism" came from??

Religious people abuse the trust of children, who rely entirely on adults for all the information which they learn.
Religion should only ever be an adult choice, IMO.
But religions will never agree to that, however reasonable it might sound, because they rely on indoctrination from an early age.

I'd like to see things change.
Someone once said something like "doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results, is the definition of insanity"

We've tried religions, for a long time, it didn't work then, and it's still not working now.
How many more wars do we need..?
Let's try something different.
Like science, for example.


Ps I've seen and felt presence of an Angel :)


Not that I'm doubting you, but....

The human brain (and body) is a notoriously unreliable 'measuring' instrument.
It can be easily 'fooled' with visual and/or auditory hallucinations or disturbances.
People can experience 'waking dreams', and think them quite real.
"Auto-suggestion" or self-hypnosis can also occur, it's possible to convince yourself of almost anything, without doing it deliberately. . Hypnotists exploit this all the time.

There are lots of examples of things called "optical illusions" too, which demonstrate our visual fallibility quite nicely.
The brain is also 'hard-wired', to put 'meanings' to things, eg., our brains will simply 'invent' voices, when listening to 'white noise', or invent 'patterns' in other things, where none exists.
Like seeing faces in clouds, or on toast, in bushes, or a pile of stones.etc. Our brains are hard-wired to look for patterns, which look like faces.
Probably evolved when we hunted, or were hunted, or something...
We're pretty crap really.
You literally can't always believe what you see.

We understand all this now, but they didn't at all, 2,000 years ago.
There's always a rational explanation.

 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 90
The POPE
Posted: 10/1/2015 5:30:50 PM

Religion should only ever be an adult choice, IMO.
But religions will never agree to that, however reasonable it might sound, because they rely on indoctrination from an early age.


Agree. It also brings up a subject I often wondered about. Why are babies baptized/christened, when there is no way for a baby to know what's going on? Shouldn't baptism take place when a person is old enough to know what they're getting into and decide if it's what they want? I never heard of an age limit on baptism. According to the Bible, didn't Jesus baptize adult followers who chose to be baptized?
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 91
view profile
History
The POPE
Posted: 10/1/2015 6:34:16 PM
Message 104 & 105 ...[quote
Religion should only ever be an adult choice, IMO.
But religions will never agree to that, however reasonable it might sound, because they rely on indoctrination from an early age.

Agree. It also brings up a subject I often wondered about. Why are babies baptized/christened, when there is no way for a baby to know what's going on?By my mid teens, my family was attending the First Unitarian/Universalist Church here in Columbus, Ohio.

I was married in that church and all of our children were dedicated there too. Neither ceremony had nothing to do with any "god". The wedding was a ceremony most young couples choose and was void of praying. In the dedication ceremony we chose for our children, it basically stated that we would dedicate ourselves to raising the children in the practice of freedom of religion. We promised to do our best to encourage them to visit information on all the religions in order to be able to make a balanced and educated choice. We promised to respect their religious decisions.

Shouldn't baptism take place when a person is old enough to know what they're getting into and decide if it's what they want?
YUP ... but as the other poster pointed out, without the "baby" baptism, you lose too much time waiting on the person to grow up, you lose the chance to steer them and create a good dedicated follower ... because adults have a tendency (if not earlier indoctrinated and sometimes by over-indoctrination) to choose what best suits them.

I personally have no use for religion ... I know how to be a decent and moral human being without it. But apparently there are those who just can't seem to get through life without the "religious" crutch. Some babies need security blankets too.

Can a rosary be considered a "security blanket"?
 bamagrl68
Joined: 11/14/2010
Msg: 92
The POPE
Posted: 10/1/2015 7:03:05 PM
sillygirl111-
I have read some things about him, all of it good so far, he seems progressive and kind.
As long as people understand he is a representative OF the church and NOT the church, I don't see any harm.
To bring up the issues of child molestation, hidden money, etc., is to act as if OTHER churches/religions don't have the same/similar issues and they DO.
The ONLY time I have a problem with religion is when people stand on it to justify harm, that is the antithesis of ALL religious belief, as I know it.
ALL religions have some deity, a concept of what is right and wrong, but since we are human, we WILL make mistakes and for those who do believe, they find comfort in the concept of absolution, while also having concepts of the punishment that happens if they "sin".
I do not believe such things, I believe in the very real concept of the law, but even that is debatable.
We humans seem bound to destroy ourselves over our differences, rather than embrace them, the pope can't fix that, I see no way around it except to learn from history, which seems determined to repeat itself.
But that's another debate, I suppose.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 93
The POPE
Posted: 10/2/2015 5:03:19 PM
Some people believe in ghosts, the inner child and TM.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 94
The POPE
Posted: 10/3/2015 7:21:48 AM

The three main religions have similar things
If you really look into them there are actual patterns and beliefs that are not conflicting and quite similar angels being one of many:)

Sunny, you really need to "look into" it a little more deeply.
First, there was "judaism", this seemed to have appeared around two and a half thousand years ago.
Like may of the religious beliefs held at that time, they were often 'evolutions' of earlier beliefs, such as "Zoroastrianism", which also existed in that area , at around that time (There were also many others)

Relation to other religions and cultures
The Achaemenid Empire in the 5th century BCE consisted of the largest empire in history by percentage of world population.[56]

Some scholars believe[57] that key concepts of Zoroastrian eschatology and demonology influenced the Abrahamic religions.[58][59] On the other hand, Zoroastrianism itself inherited ideas from other belief systems and, like other "practiced" religions, accommodates some degree of syncretism.[60]
Indo-Iranian origins
See also: Indo-Iranians, Proto-Indo-Iranian religion, Proto-Indo-European religion and Hinduism

Many traits of Zoroastrianism can be traced back to the culture and beliefs of the prehistorical Indo-Iranian period, that is, to the time before the migrations that led to the Indians and Iranians becoming distinct peoples. Zoroastrianism consequently shares elements with the historical Vedic religion that also has its origins in that era.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism.
Next came "Christianity", as people have mentioned, "jesus was a jew".
"Followers of jesus" (Christians) basically believe that "god" impregnated an already 'betrothed/married' virgin, called Mary. (Surely this is a contravention of "the ten commandments" regarding "adultery"..? )
There had already been other "virgin birth" myths in other religions in that area, notably in Ancient Egypt, which preceded the "christian" myth.
They ("Christians") also believed that the "jews" had previously been "doing it all wrong", and of course they blamed the "jews" for the death of "jesus".
They also believe in the myth of "resurrection", even though this myth is based ONLY on the "eye-witness" accounts of ONE woman, who according to the bible was also a drunk and a prostitute.

But as I've said, these beliefs should only ever been considered in the contexts and 'mind-sets' of the times.
EG. Just how accurate was any 'diagnosis' of "death", in the absence of any doctors, or any medical knowledge..?

Then, about 600 years after the alleged death and 'resurrection' of "jesus", came "Islam", also from the same region.


Islamic holy books are the texts which Muslims believe were authored by God to various prophets throughout humanity's history All these books, in Muslim belief, promulgated the code and laws that God ordained for those people.

Muslims believe the Quran to be the final revelation of God's word to man, and a completion and confirmation of previous scriptures.[1] Despite the primacy that Muslims place upon the Qur'an as God's final word, Islam speaks of respecting all the previous scriptures, and belief in all the revealed books is an article of faith in Islam.

Among the books considered to be revealed, the four mentioned by name in the Qur'an are the Torah (revealed to Moses), the Zabur (revealed to David), the Injil (Gospel) (revealed to Jesus), and the Qur'an itself.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_holy_books

That's why they're called the three "Abrahamic" faiths, all three believe in the primitive superstitious drivel contained in the "Old testament".
And the "Old Testament" is full of direct instructions "from god" to beat and kill disobedient wives, your children etc.
Lots of obsessions with "virgins", (The younger the better, "Mary" was probably about 12 years old, hence her "purity", when "god" supposedly raped, sorry, I mean "chose" her.)
The "Old Testament" is also full of direct instructions "from god" to kill "non-believers", to take their lands, kill all the men, and enslave their women, to do what you want with, they don't matter.

People who insist that people have some sort of "right" to religious beliefs, should really make themselves aware of the contents of the bible.
These are dangerous, violent, primitive beliefs.
History has shown us what happens, when religions have power.

I don't believe it matters to god~ how you reach a higher connection or which religion you are born into or choose or if it's spiritualism even
It's the connection that matters:)

Which "god"..?
If you were born into a Hindu, Sikh or Buddhist, , you might well 'worship' several, or none at all.
Some religions believe in 'Heaven/paradise' and 'hell', and some others believe in 'reincarnation'.

The first 4 of the "ten commandments" are about "worshiping" NO OTHER GODS".

The "punishment" for breaking any of the "commandments" is death
Other religions take a similar view, that's why there have been so many wars, forced migrations, 'pogroms' etc etc.
Irrational beliefs ONLY ever lead to irrational actions.


Science and creation/Natural laws should work together ~ and one does not rule out the other

Haha!
No.
Science is the search for truth.
Science is constantly modifying it's 'beliefs', in the light of new discoveries.
Religions just get angry, if you challenge their beliefs, (as we've seen in many threads)


But it will if you take scripts literally:)

The more 'devout' a 'follower' is, the more likely they are to do this, and the more 'devour' a person is, the more 'society' encourages us to "respect" their pious beliefs.

You (and others here) are defending the catholic church, and "pope", on the basis that any form of "spirituality" is a good thing.
I've got no problems with that...
but...
The catholic church is a multi-billion pound organisation.
Google some picture of the vatican, and ask yourself how much that all cost.
"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image"
They have hundreds of billions of pounds/dollars hidden in assets.
"Thou shalt not steal"
Yet billions of people die in poverty.


When they dispose of all of their assets, when they make their "places of worship" more modest, and give the proceeds to the poor.
When they have the "faith" to not know how where their next meal is coming from.
Then they'll be truly "spiritual".
Until then, they're just another business, selling a 'snake-oil' placebo,
to make themselves even richer.

It's true that the churches DO "help people".
I've seen this myself, from talking to the people who knock on my door (and then, 3 hours later, wish that they hadn't! ) all of them former drug-addicts, alcoholics, convicts, depressives, etc etc.
"Lost souls".
I sympathise. Life can be a real beach at times.
They do "help" them, with human kindness, they help them, by simply making them realise that other people actually do care what happens to them.

But their worst "crime" in my opinion, (apart from raping children, and then covering that up, obviously)
is that once a person recovers, once they start actually feeling better again, instead of telling them the truth; that it was the person's own inner strength which pulled them through, ( with the help, encouragement and support of others) they instead tell them; that they only got better, because they believed in "god".
And that if they stop believing, they'll just get worse again.
That's a bit like when "Mother Theresa" fed the lepers. -But only if they prayed.
That's a bit like a doctor continuing to charge a patient for a placebo, long after they've recovered from any illness, on the basis that if they don't take it, they'll get ill again.

Religious people do help, but they prey (not pray) on the vulnerable, the sick and the dying, the lost and the lonely, the bereaved.
There's nothing moral about that.
"Thou shalt not bear false witness"
It's just telling lies, to achieve your own objectives.
JMO
 congupnaroad
Joined: 7/22/2015
Msg: 95
view profile
History
The POPE
Posted: 10/3/2015 5:48:15 PM

Next came "Christianity", as people have mentioned, "jesus was a jew".
"Followers of jesus" (Christians) basically believe that "god" impregnated an already 'betrothed/married' virgin, called Mary. (Surely this is a contravention of "the ten commandments" regarding "adultery"..? )
There had already been other "virgin birth" myths in other religions in that area, notably in Ancient Egypt, which preceded the "christian" myth.
They ("Christians") also believed that the "jews" had previously been "doing it all wrong", and of course they blamed the "jews" for the death of "jesus".
They also believe in the myth of "resurrection", even though this myth is based ONLY on the "eye-witness" accounts of ONE woman, who according to the bible was also a drunk and a prostitute


^^^^^^^ That is incredibly funny! The Hebrew translation of Virgin means an unmarried Woman. Jesus would have been conceived just like any other Human, the angel Gabriel told Mary that the child she was carrying was Divine. No one knows who Jesus' father was. Could have been a Roman soldier. Didn't you pay attention in Sunday School?



People who insist that people have some sort of "right" to religious beliefs, should really make themselves aware of the contents of the bible.
These are dangerous, violent, primitive beliefs.
History has shown us what happens, when religions have power


Yeah and history also tells us what happens when irreligious people are in power ,of course it would have nothing to do with Human Nature eh? So what if the Old Testament describes punishments for what people perceived as crimes back then.




The "punishment" for breaking any of the "commandments" is death
Other religions take a similar view, that's why there have been so many wars, forced migrations, 'pogroms' etc etc.
Irrational beliefs ONLY ever lead to irrational actions


And blaming the ills of the World on an externality like religion is the same as blaming the ills of the World on Saturday Morning Cartoons. Would have nothing to do with evil people doing evil things now would it?



Science is the search for truth.
Science is constantly modifying it's 'beliefs', in the light of new discoveries.
Religions just get angry, if you challenge their beliefs, (as we've seen in many threads)


You are the one who seems angry.


You (and others here) are defending the catholic church, and "pope", on the basis that any form of "spirituality" is a good thing.
I've got no problems with that...
but...
The catholic church is a multi-billion pound organisation.
Google some picture of the vatican, and ask yourself how much that all cost.
"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image"
They have hundreds of billions of pounds/dollars hidden in assets.
"Thou shalt not steal"
Yet billions of people die in poverty


Billions die in poverty? You do understand that the Catholic Church and other denominations of Christianity have missions all over the World trying to alleviate poverty and disease?

Do you think that doesn't cost money?
 aj7125
Joined: 11/28/2014
Msg: 96
The POPE
Posted: 10/3/2015 6:47:03 PM
You are the one who seems angry."

^^^^^^^^ Ain't that the truth. Interesting to see that a lot of the people that are against religion are also a very angry people. Their posts are filled with anger, sarcasm, and nonsense.
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 97
view profile
History
The POPE
Posted: 10/3/2015 7:01:44 PM
And here we go again...just because you keep tossing the BS out there, doesn't make it true.
 Jo van
Joined: 5/23/2009
Msg: 98
The POPE
Posted: 10/4/2015 5:30:14 AM

^^^^^^^ That is incredibly funny! The Hebrew translation of Virgin means an unmarried Woman. Jesus would have been conceived just like any other Human, the angel Gabriel told Mary that the child she was carrying was Divine.

It would be "funny", if it weren't for the tragic consequences of people believing the same stuff that people believed 2,000 years ago.
The RC church doesn't teach that "Jesus would have been conceived just like any other Human",
they teach the "holy trinity", that "jesus is the son of god".
As for the "angel Gabriel" telling people stuff, this is simply primitive superstition and mythology.
It didn't happen.
If it had, then maybe old "Angel Gabe" might have also whispered something in the ears of all those "priests", who raped all those children.
I'll bet those priests told the children that "this is what god wants", too.

No one knows who Jesus' father was. Could have been a Roman soldier. Didn't you pay attention in Sunday School?

This possibility is NEVER ever "taught" at sunday schools. They only ever "teach" the superstitious, supernatural wibble, as if it were "facts".
But I agree.
There are some contemporary accounts which even name the roman soldier.
But this completely contradicts your earlier assertion that the "child was divine".

The real truth is that living in such a highly primitive and highly religious society, meant that women who got raped (and impregnated) were stoned to death.
That was probably the reason the whole "virgin birth" story came about.


Yeah and history also tells us what happens when irreligious people are in power ,of course it would have nothing to do with Human Nature eh? So what if the Old Testament describes punishments for what people perceived as crimes back then.

You seem to say "so what" every time you can't justify something.
The key words are "back then".
Why would you (or anyone else) want these beliefs "respected", and therefore perpetuated..?
"ISIS" are following the direct instructions of "god", as "commanded" in the "old testament".
"Israel" is founded on these myths, and if they can have a "jewish state", then why shouldn't "muslims" want an "islamic state" too..?
By defending religious belief, you are also mitigating all of it's extreme manifestations too.


And blaming the ills of the World on an externality like religion is the same as blaming the ills of the World on Saturday Morning Cartoons. Would have nothing to do with evil people doing evil things now would it?

And:

You are the one who seems angry.


I've seen your last few posts in the "refugee crisis" thread, and what you think about "those crazy muslims".
How do you know that YOUR religion is "right", and theirs "wrong"..??
-Don't answer that, it was entirely rhetorical.
The answer is; you don't!
(The truth is that none of them are!)

Each religion, and it's own various 'sects', splits, and 'schisms', believes that their version is the "truth", and everyone else "wrong".
Each religion, and it's own various 'sects', splits, and 'schisms' within them, believes that they should 'evangelise" , "spread the word", and "convert" other people, believers in other faiths, or non-believers, to their versions of the "truth".


Billions die in poverty?

Yup.
Sadly, Billions DO live, and die, in poverty.
I'm sorry to have to be the one to 'break' that to you.

You do understand that the Catholic Church and other denominations of Christianity have missions all over the World trying to alleviate poverty and disease?

Do you think that doesn't cost money?

Of course it does.
But why does the RC church seem have acquired so many billions in assets...?
How does that help alleviate poverty and disease..?

"Mother Teresa" believed that poverty and suffering brought people "closer to god", and so was a "good thing".
-Which probably explains why they didn't spend all the money raised, on improving the austere conditions in their missions.
I'll bet she thought that "self-flagellation" was also a good thing.
Pain and suffering can often induce hallucinations.
But it's not really "god", however much people might like to imagine so.
There are currently over 4,000 different religions.
All believing different things.
Which one(s) is/are "right"...?


You are the one who seems angry."

^^^^^^^^ Ain't that the truth. Interesting to see that a lot of the people that are against religion are also a very angry people. Their posts are filled with anger, sarcasm, and nonsense.

It's ok.
Religion is "nonsense".
But I'm not angry.

I'm crying.
<----- see?
 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 99
The POPE
Posted: 10/4/2015 6:50:40 AM

No one knows who Jesus' father was. Could have been a Roman soldier. Didn't you pay attention in Sunday School?


For that matter, there is no mention of any other family member or relatives. Did he have aunts, uncles, cousins, grandparents? What was his childhood like? Was he a troublesome teenager getting into mischief, and did he date girls? It seems like he went straight from being born in a manger to being an adult, wandering around, preaching about God. What happened to his parents? Did they just disappear after his birth? Didn't they do the standard speech that every parent tells their kids: "When are you going to provide me with grandchildren? You better not wait too long."
 SLAFFA
Joined: 8/13/2007
Msg: 100
The POPE
Posted: 10/4/2015 6:52:01 AM
Fortunately, he "get's it" and perhaps some of his conclusions will rub off on his many followers. Particularly good news for Mother Earth is that the Pope understands "Drill Baby Drill" is not a plan conducive for Humans to still be [apparently] running the show 500 years from now.
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