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 NJgirl116
Joined: 7/3/2015
Msg: 790
who paysPage 32 of 58    (18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58)

You are absolutely worth putting in the work and effort to get to know

This sounds pretty condescending. Not a winning line.
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 791
who pays
Posted: 3/11/2016 9:49:50 PM

P.s. You are absolutely worth putting in the work and effort to get to know. I hope you allow me the opportunity to do just that.


It might be successful for some men with some women. But I showed this message to a few female friends. They thought that it was contrived.
 geekgrrrl
Joined: 1/28/2009
Msg: 792
view profile
History
who pays
Posted: 3/11/2016 11:31:21 PM
Yanno like most I thought that message to karma was pretty canned. But then yanno most men are dumb as sticks. You all have said that over and over. So he fed a bad line...should we give him a chance? All the men whine that we women are to picky. I say she's right to take a chance if she wants to.

I've met a lot of men I didn't think it would would out with and it didn't for one reason or another but I tried and thats all I can do.

And while a lot try to paint women like me as whores who are only out for a free meal let me say this...I usually arrive early and order what I want. If he never shows...and this happens, it's ok because I don't mind taking me out. And if he does show it's his option to tell the waiter to add my stuff to his bill. I've never had that not happen. But if it did I'd see it as a turn off and not see him again. I hate bean counters. It's indicative of things to come. With bean counters I will always be in arrears no matter how hard I try. I have no wish to engage with men like this.

Lastly I would like to say it's a shame that these forums are what they are. I'd share more but refuse to supply cannon fodder.


Carpe diem

fyi to caballerosiempre(knight always) I'm sure you will follow up because you seem to be stalking me...but honestly you nauseate me. If you were the last man alive you couldn't have me...just sayin' lol
 Coma_White
Joined: 9/15/2013
Msg: 793
view profile
History
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 1:24:10 AM

And while a lot try to paint women like me as whores who are only out for a free meal let me say this...I usually arrive early and order what I want. If he never shows...and this happens, it's ok because I don't mind taking me out. And if he does show it's his option to tell the waiter to add my stuff to his bill. I've never had that not happen. But if it did I'd see it as a turn off and not see him again. I hate bean counters. It's indicative of things to come. With bean counters I will always be in arrears no matter how hard I try. I have no wish to engage with men like this.

Lastly I would like to say it's a shame that these forums are what they are. I'd share more but refuse to supply cannon fodder.


Really? You said some of the most ridiculous things in this thread. You can't blame other people if you're part of the problem.
 ThroatLozenge
Joined: 3/2/2016
Msg: 795
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 7:23:27 AM


But then yanno most men are dumb as sticks.


I reesent you're atitude.

I have a Masturs degree.

Most folks know its you no and not yanno.



Can you write an example reflecting your style of a MSG you would send to Karma? (If not Karma, then some other imaginary profile.)


Do you have any business attire?
 ginghamgal
Joined: 2/13/2016
Msg: 796
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 7:25:52 AM
Like most others, I wasn't impressed with the message Karma received. I'm not sure if I would have been interested in him. Assuming he was attractive, it would have depended on what he wrote in his profile.
 Olivoil
Joined: 5/3/2015
Msg: 797
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 7:33:05 AM
Are we all broke here? It's only dinner, or coffee, or whatever...
I would be uncomfortable if a potential new man picked up the bill every time we went out. He would probably insist on treating the first time, then I'd pick up the bill next time... we'd figure it out if the dating progressed. Why put so much energy on this 'who pays' issue?
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 798
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 7:55:13 AM

I usually arrive early and order what I want. If he never shows...and this happens, it's ok because I don't mind taking me out. And if he does show it's his option to tell the waiter to add my stuff to his bill. I've never had that not happen. But if it did I'd see it as a turn off and not see him again. I hate bean counters. It's indicative of things to come. With bean counters I will always be in arrears no matter how hard I try. I have no wish to engage with men like this.


For the sake of argument, suppose you were at a bar. Maybe he thought that you already paid for your drink. But offered to buy you another drink or something else when he got a drink for himself. If a woman loses interest in me because of this, I would be better off without her.
 HawkingJr
Joined: 4/16/2007
Msg: 800
view profile
History
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 8:13:25 AM
NG: So you’re basically saying I should disrespect the opinions of the women involved? In most matters of romance, I think the two people have to be in agreement in order for something to be so. I cannot be the only one of the two believing something to be a “date” and it be a date, because by its very definition, a date involves the willing participation of two people. So does a meeting, but none of those women were trying to claim our meeting was not a meeting. Obviously this “rule” does not apply to everything, particularly matters of indisputable fact: if I say the world is round and a woman tells me it’s flat, then it does not matter that we are not in agreement, because there is a provable fact involved. A “date” is what the two people involved say it is. Two people can even have sex and still agree that what they were doing was not a date. Arguably a meeting with someone from POF is no different than meeting someone in a bar – is that a “date”? Walking up to someone at a bar and starting a conversation with him or her?

That said, I’ve counted some first meetings as “dates” in the distant past because the woman told me it was a “date,” and I decided to agree with her, even though some of those "dates" were not greatly different from other "meetings" I've had. There was one case back in the late 90s in which a woman had me meet her at a nature park and she being an expert on the place basically became my tour guide, then at the end of my “tour,” she said to me, “Well, that was a nice first date, huh?” to which I replied “Uh, you consider that a ‘date’?” Needless to say, there was no second “date” or first “date,” depending on your opinion of the matter (oddly, she was actually fairly attractive but almost 6 feet tall and very weird or else I probably would not have gotten into a debate with her over the definition of a “date” – I only bring this up because it was the one time in my life I thought I wasn’t on a date while the woman thought we were, as opposed to the other way around, which has been quite a frequent occurrence).

Interestingly, the meeting/date debate is strongly related to the main topic of this thread. If two people both believe a first meeting is not a date, would they not each pay for themselves? But what if the man thinks it’s just a meeting but the woman thinks it’s a date? What if the man thinks it’s a date but the woman thinks it’s just a meeting? Who pays under such circumstances can get tricky. Yet, strangely, I have paid for every first “meeting” or “date” I’ve ever had from OLD, even if the woman declared that it was a “meeting” and not a “date.” I once had a first “meeting” with a woman who was adamant about it just being a “meeting” and not a “date,” literally saying it over and over again before we met and during our meeting. We met at a concert, whose tickets I paid for, and I also paid for everything we ate and drank at that concert. I don’t remember if she offered to pay for anything nor do I recall caring (it was over 15 years ago).

I should also point out in that case and 90% of most other cases, the “woman” was college-aged and had no real income while I never went on a date before graduating college and have had a stable income ever since, so I was almost always in by far the best position to be able to afford any of these “meetings.” But 2 of the 3 women I dated for a year or more made far more money than I did... yet I still almost always paid for our dates... often ridiculous amounts (including the infamous $2000 first date).

“Really? You said some of the most ridiculous things in this thread. You can't blame other people if you're part of the problem.”

Uh... I agree 100%???

Geekgrrl: Goddamn it, woman – now you’ve gone and done it. You made me agree with Coma about something, and I can never forgive you for that.

“Like most others, I wasn't impressed with the message Karma received. I'm not sure if I would have been interested in him. Assuming he was attractive, it would have depended on what he wrote in his profile.”

Isn’t that what it all comes down to: the attractiveness of the sender (both by pictures and profile content) and not the content of the initial message? I’ve seen a few guys (very few) and a few more women claim they would ignore a “Hi” message from someone that seemed awesome because they want the initiator to jump through hoops with the first message to “prove” something, but most people (especially most guys) don’t really seem to care. *I* would respond to “Hi” from an attractive woman and would not respond to absolutely brilliant, unique, individually-tailored prose from a woman I found repulsive. But I do realize most women I’m writing get dozens of emails a week from guys they consider attractive so maybe they do need some sort of differentiator, so I put the effort into differentiating myself. But I really do wish more women would NOT respond to my “cool” messages just because they’re cool if they have no real interest in dating me, because that’s become the biggest waste of time for me on this site: pointless conversations just because I’m a good writer.

Well, that and pointless debates in the forums over who pays and the definition of "date."
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 801
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 8:22:21 AM

Some people on here will say a first meeting is not a date, and some will say it is.


In my viewpoint, it is about intent. In theory, the purpose of meeting someone from OLD is determining any possible romantic interest. Thus it can considered to be a ( blind ) date. It's often a casual one though. From what I have seen, it's mostly some people on the forums that insist that it's a "meet" and not a date. Most people I have talked to ( from friends to women I have dated ) have considered the first meeting with someone from OLD to be a date.
 cassie2425
Joined: 3/4/2016
Msg: 802
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 8:55:23 AM
""Yanno like most I thought that message to karma was pretty canned. But then yanno most men are dumb as sticks. You all have said that over and over. So he fed a bad line...should we give him a chance? All the men whine that we women are to picky. I say she's right to take a chance if she wants to.""
___________

You know, the comment about men being "dumb as sticks" is just, well, its just dumb. It was dumb to even state that. This "dumb" man wrote that "dumb" message and that woman was "dumb" enough to fall all over it. So who is "dumb"? She is dumb and next week there will be comments about pick up artists, scammers, users and psychos., just because she was "dumb" enough to fall for a "dumb" line sent to her by a smart man (smart because it worked).

Good point above Clooneystutor.

Also, I don't think anyone was miffed about paying for a first date, at least going by the first post.
 Maleman999
Joined: 2/14/2010
Msg: 803
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 9:00:03 AM

From what I have seen, it's mostly some people on the forums that insist that it's a "meet" and not a date. Most people I have talked to ( from friends to women I have dated ) have considered the first meeting with someone from OLD to be a date.


I guess it depends on who pays. If the guy pays for the coffee/drink/any food, it's a date. If they each pay for their own, it's a meet. If a woman expects the guy to pay and he expects to go dutch since it's the first time they met, then it's neither a date or meet. It's a "bye-bye".
 Strider324
Joined: 2/17/2016
Msg: 804
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 12:57:10 PM

He would probably insist on treating the first time, then I'd pick up the bill next time... we'd figure it out if the dating progressed. Why put so much energy on this 'who pays' issue?


Zactly. I always offer to pay the first date, with the understanding that she can pay for the next one....where I order the case of Cristal. ;)

If there is no 2nd date, so what? Move on.

Now, if a woman was to stridently argue with me about who should pay, I would not consider us a good match, and again - move on. I can think of tons of more meaningful things to discuss than who buys dinner.
 IL_Capitano
Joined: 11/23/2012
Msg: 805
view profile
History
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 1:56:04 PM

About Linda
You:
Impress me.


If I were looking for someone to date and I saw this^^ on the profile, my first and only reaction would be, " Fvck off. Next!". I wouldn't give a shit how good looking the woman is or whatever other attributes she brings to the table.

And, clearly, if the guy who wrote the drivel she thinks is "how it's done" it clearly doesn't take much to impress this particular woman.

 Whatsamattababy
Joined: 12/24/2015
Msg: 806
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 2:20:27 PM
Mmm... I'm going to challenge that. I truly believe that every man his little threshold thingy: If he finds a woman physically attractive enough, it will compensate for her attitude, and he will humble himself enough to "impress" her.
 Coma_White
Joined: 9/15/2013
Msg: 807
view profile
History
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 2:33:35 PM

Mmm... I'm going to challenge that. I truly believe that every man his little threshold thingy: If he finds a woman physically attractive enough, it will compensate for her attitude, and he will humble himself enough to "impress" her.


It depends if he's good at dating or bad at dating. It's usually people that have a lack of options that end up getting taken advantage of. For every good looking woman that needs to be wined and dined there's a good looking woman that doesn't get all worked up over who pays.
 cassie2425
Joined: 3/4/2016
Msg: 808
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 2:36:04 PM
Hmmm, is that "little threshold thingy" you mentioned above the same as - he is thinking with his little head instead of his big head? I think it's the same. The "little head" thingie usually wins out until the majority reach a point where the "big head" takes over, and it does take over. :-)
 caballerosiempre
Joined: 12/5/2015
Msg: 810
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 2:43:38 PM
Emperor's new clothes? Really the subject here does not make Megan Fox look like a hound dog in comparison, not understanding all this raving..OK, decent FOR her age..but "absolutely " stunning, gorgeous. .? Well in the eye of the beholder as they say..maybe?
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 811
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 3:19:52 PM

Mmm... I'm going to challenge that. I truly believe that every man his little threshold thingy: If he finds a woman physically attractive enough, it will compensate for her attitude, and he will humble himself enough to "impress" her.


If I was just looking for casual sex or a booty call, maybe. LOL. But for a serious relationship, no.
 caballerosiempre
Joined: 12/5/2015
Msg: 812
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 3:29:39 PM
Not sure it applies only to one gender..I've seen plenty of women get all gooey in the head and accept whatever sh1tty attitude from hawt guys..
 DaYum_B1tch_My_Feet_Hurt
Joined: 3/9/2016
Msg: 813
who pays
Posted: 3/12/2016 6:57:51 PM

And while a lot try to paint women like me as whores who are only out for a free meal let me say this...I usually arrive early and order what I want. If he never shows...and this happens, it's ok because I don't mind taking me out. And if he does show it's his option to tell the waiter to add my stuff to his bill. I've never had that not happen. But if it did I'd see it as a turn off and not see him again. I hate bean counters. It's indicative of things to come. With bean counters I will always be in arrears no matter how hard I try. I have no wish to engage with men like this.

Lastly I would like to say it's a shame that these forums are what they are. I'd share more but refuse to supply cannon fodder.


Emperor's new clothes
 analovesprincesses
Joined: 3/6/2016
Msg: 814
who pays
Posted: 3/13/2016 3:12:38 AM

LOL To some of us, cheesy, yes. In the past, when replying to men from their first message, I would have thought this was a class A pick up line. A "cheesy line" would not have worked for me.
BUT, it appeals to Karma. She did respond. She may very well have a dinner date this weekend, she will enjoy herself while others here may be home alone, feeling sorry for themselves...............or not.........who knows?
Different strokes for different folks?


Excellent response.
 south_city
Joined: 10/12/2013
Msg: 815
who pays
Posted: 3/13/2016 9:37:13 AM

LOL To some of us, cheesy, yes. In the past, when replying to men from their first message, I would have thought this was a class A pick up line. A "cheesy line" would not have worked for me.
BUT, it appeals to Karma. She did respond. She may very well have a dinner date this weekend, she will enjoy herself while others here may be home alone, feeling sorry for themselves...............or not.........who knows?
Different strokes for different folks?


I acknowledged some women like that type of email. But even when I was sitting in my house alone on a weekend, I wasn't feeling sorry for myself.
 norwegianguy456
Joined: 6/11/2015
Msg: 816
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History
who pays
Posted: 3/13/2016 11:49:20 AM

NG: So you’re basically saying I should disrespect the opinions of the women involved?

Hawking, I don't know which post of mine you're referring to, but no, not necessarily respect or disrespect something off the bat before consideration. But one should disrespect certain opinions that a guy or gal may have -- like the view that it makes a guy a "manly man" if he always pays 100% of any and all dates with a gal, regardless of whether anyone asked the other out, etc.

if I say the world is round and a woman tells me it’s flat, then it does not matter that we are not in agreement, because there is a provable fact involved.

Yeah, I agree.

A “date” is what the two people involved say it is. Two people can even have sex and still agree that what they were doing was not a date.

I solidly disagree with that. Them agreeing to call something the same thing doesn't make it true. Here's something related, and tell me if you disagree: Every weekend evening, Bob takes Sally out. He picks her up, brings her to romantic establishments, pays for everything, compliments her, they mutually flirt, they kiss, he drops her off, etc -- and they say they're Just Friends. No. Just because they both say they're 'just friends' doesn't make them 'just friends'. The two people agreeing to call themselves something only bears any weight when things are fuzzy and on the fence between two differing labels, and they call it one and not the other for clarification. In a nutshell, You are what you do, not what you claim. That example isn't a fuzzy line.

All a date is, is a boy-girl outing with non-platonic intentions. That's it. It's can be fuzzy on that level, but them calling it a truck or a telephone booth doesn't make it so, is my point. You can call it just a meetup, that's fine. A date is a meetup, too. Calling it sets more casual tones. A mere meetup isn't necessarily a date. I don't think the argument in this thread rides on whether it's Universally labeled as a Date that a guy only pays -- it's if it's a get-together on a more-than-platonic level. A 'date' in the very general sense. People will play word games to avoid tension & expectations and all, but it is what it is. One good litmus test: If you have a GF, and you go out with another gal 1-on-1, it was a 'date' if you're GF rightfully gets pissed. :)

I once had a first “meeting” with a woman who was adamant about it just being a “meeting” and not a “date,” literally saying it over and over again before we met and during our meeting. We met at a concert, whose tickets I paid for, and I also paid for everything we ate and drank at that concert. I don’t remember if she offered to pay for anything nor do I recall caring (it was over 15 years ago).

Yeah, that was a Date. It was also a meeting. She wanted to Avoid calling it a 'date' to avoid 'pressure'. If the guy's paying, it usually cuts thru the ambiguity. She could have called your outing/date a "family reunion", but it wouldn't make it so -- even if you agreed to call it that. :) I can understand avoiding calling something a date, or putting it out there "Well, it wasn't a date-date," or something like that, to paint a clearer picture on the motif & expectations of it all. Dates don't require candle-lit dinners or romance. Just boy-girl outing with non-platonic intentions. That's it.

You'll see the same thing when people say "No, she/he and I are just friends!" when they're not JUST friends. But they want to think of it that way to avoid pressure, so they lie to themselves. You'll also see people lie to themselves (or get fooled or some combination thereof) that they're More than just friends, when they Are Just Friends.

If he finds a woman physically attractive enough, it will compensate for her attitude, and he will humble himself enough to "impress" her.

I agree. You'll also see it on both genders to one degree or another. If he sees her out of his league and a rare catch, he's going to put up with a lot more. He's going to be in emotionally-chasing mode right off the bat, and isn't going to mind paying for everything time after time -- where he'd otherwise be raising his eyebrows after date #X if she never even motioned to contribute. Part of this isn't thinking with "the little head". The basis of it is that he's emotionally-chasing her -- and when the guy's chasing the gal and trying to win her over in a 1-sided battle, it becomes more clear that he is to pay... much like a guy asking a gal out he likes at work, begging for her to give him a chance (of course he's going to pay; that's going to be a non-issue).
 CuteandThick34
Joined: 1/5/2015
Msg: 817
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History
who pays
Posted: 3/13/2016 1:17:38 PM

None of the dates were expensive ($20-$70) but she has never offered to chip in or pay.


She may not be able to afford $20-$70 per date. Maybe this is why she cooks for you.
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