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Show ALL Forums  > Off Topic  > Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place      Home login  
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 caballerosiempre
Joined: 12/5/2015
Msg: 51
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking placePage 3 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
The very best thing that hardcore environmentalists who "love the Earth" could do would be to commit suicide. And their biodegradable body mass to Dear Mother Earth. I don't think there will be many volunteers to do it themselves, but many will suggest that others should. Or others should"do without" , while they do with all..plenty of relatively fat cat north Americans and Europeans who have lived and continue to live off the rape if the earth bemoan that Asia and Africa might do likewise.." those people" should not industrialize, but continue to live subsistence lives in mud huts..better for our lovely and beloved planet Earth.
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/8/2016 5:09:34 PM


2. Humans ALSO proved repeatedly, that when they apply themselves positively, that they can also IMPROVE the environment. They turned deserts into productive croplands, learned to manage woodlands and keep them productive through careful management, and eliminated diseases and other problems which once killed humans and non-humans alike.
I will disagree here because I really don't believe humans can "manage" Mother Nature. She does things that even humans cannot truly "understand". Examples of such:

Deserts = productive croplands. They are only "productive" until Mother Nature points out certain things. Underground aquifers DO DRY UP, thus the reason why almond trees are being burned down now in California, even though they could produce, if for not the lack of water, that wasn't lacking only 10 years ago. Right now, in BC there are wolf culls going on. Why? Because the Elk herds that humans decided to transplant(because humans killed and destroyed their habitat) in certain areas, are in trouble, again, because Elk attract Wolves. It's not that the wolves are bad, but, in fact, the Elk habitat is lacking. Those trees that they need got chopped. Wasn't by the wolves but, by human "management". While we seem to solve a problem, we learn later, we created one or two more with our so called "management".

The earth is a huge ecosystem that involves many different parts and pieces. We humans, sooner or later, have to figure out we are only a little itsy piece of the big puzzle. One puzzle that would take a million zillion years to solve, if it's even solvable at all.

See what I mean? That right there. Missing what was really being said, and arguing about something else in order to steer away from a point which is legitimate.
 caballerosiempre
Joined: 12/5/2015
Msg: 53
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 4:36:11 AM
This is yet another subject in which some people can position themselves as better than, and superior to, , other people. And feel smug and superior as seems to be a human need. "I am a hard core environmentalist, therefore prima facie, I am better than you, if you don't proclaim that position. Even if in reality I am a hypocrite with a huge carbon footprint, if I talk about loving Mother Earth, I am better than you".
Like religion..like vegans who love to preach their superior morality to flesh eaters..ad nauseam..
 _babblefish
Joined: 9/23/2011
Msg: 54
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 8:39:29 AM

The very best thing that hardcore environmentalists who "love the Earth" could do would be to commit suicide.



This is yet another subject in which some people can position themselves as better than, and superior to, , other people. And feel smug and superior as seems to be a human need. "I am a hard core environmentalist, therefore prima facie, I am better than you, if you don't proclaim that position.


well then, these posts leave absolutely no doubt that Reagan's anti-intellectualism ingurgitated policies and resentment of public consciousness forces still like to assert themselves on ecological despoilment . . 'ad nauseam'

gawn, take another swig of brawndo
 funchesf
Joined: 6/27/2014
Msg: 55
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 9:20:44 AM

At the same time, those who think that it is a hoax say that climate has changed like this forever. And if you look through Almanacs, you may get that impression that they are correct.

yes they are correct that the climate has changed "forever" but what they failed to include is that "forever" stopped when the Industrial revolution took place, until then Man could not be blamed for climate change for the simple fact that "before forever" the most Man was capable of doing was setting ablaze an entire forest, but yet burning down an entire forest is something that occurs Naturally in Nature ...so no harm no foul

but due to the Industrial revolution Man has created new chemical compounds that didn't occur naturally in Nature and at this very moment millions of gallons of these artificially created compounds is being pumped into the water and into the air and of course both air and water has a direct effect on the climate

so now you have to ask yourself a question .."What effect are these new chemical compounds going to have on the Earth" and that is what climate change is about, an agreement by the countries of the world to regulate on a global scale the quantity and quality of these chemical compounds that is being sprew upon the Earth or the agreement to ban the use of some of them ..

as of now 4 new artificially created elements will be added to the periodical table ...

and this is why for a lack of a better name it is called "Climate Change" due to the fact that these possible chemical mutagens are becoming part of the food chain it should be called " Dna Mutation Change"

ahhh..it's nothing like a cold glass of water with a touch of isotope flavoring, now if I could only figure out why I have 3 eyes
 caballerosiempre
Joined: 12/5/2015
Msg: 56
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 9:40:08 AM
LOL, I had long suspected that frequent posters on POFand the elite of the elite of Mensa were entirely overlapping groups. Basically oneand the same..The real movers &shakers of society. ? Posting for an audience of 20 to 25 people. ? Assuming that is, , that each regular poster reads each & every post..
?
 SunshineGirl__
Joined: 10/7/2014
Msg: 57
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 12:37:18 PM

See what I mean? That right there. Missing what was really being said, and arguing about something else in order to steer away from a point which is legitimate.


Who are you to determine what is a “legitimate” point? Why not focus on what you think is “legitimate” instead of scolding someone else for expressing an opinion you don’t like? You make no point whatsoever with that post except that you are irrationally arrogant and assume everyone reads, cares about, and agrees with your previous post(s).

If you read others the way you expect others to read you, you’d have realized there was no “arguing” going on; just a different VALID opinion, that deserves repeating:


I will disagree here because I really don't believe humans can "manage" Mother Nature. She does things that even humans cannot truly "understand". Examples of such:

Deserts = productive croplands. They are only "productive" until Mother Nature points out certain things. Underground aquifers DO DRY UP, thus the reason why almond trees are being burned down now in California, even though they could produce, if for not the lack of water, that wasn't lacking only 10 years ago. Right now, in BC there are wolf culls going on. Why? Because the Elk herds that humans decided to transplant(because humans killed and destroyed their habitat) in certain areas, are in trouble, again, because Elk attract Wolves. It's not that the wolves are bad, but, in fact, the Elk habitat is lacking. Those trees that they need got chopped. Wasn't by the wolves but, by human "management". While we seem to solve a problem, we learn later, we created one or two more with our so called "management".


I agree with you, Walts, and appreciate your post.
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 6:59:42 PM

This is yet another subject in which some people can position themselves as better than, and superior to, , other people. And feel smug and superior as seems to be a human need. "I am a hard core environmentalist, therefore prima facie, I am better than you, if you don't proclaim that position. Even if in reality I am a hypocrite with a huge carbon footprint, if I talk about loving Mother Earth, I am better than you".
Like religion..like vegans who love to preach their superior morality to flesh eaters..ad nauseam..


Who are you to determine what is a “legitimate” point? Why not focus on what you think is “legitimate” instead of scolding someone else for expressing an opinion you don’t like? You make no point whatsoever with that post except that you are irrationally arrogant and assume everyone reads, cares about, and agrees with your previous post(s).

If you read others the way you expect others to read you, you’d have realized there was no “arguing” going on; just a different VALID opinion, that deserves repeating:

Horseshit. Wah wah wah. Cry baby all you want. This ^ kind of stuff is still horseshit.
 aj7125
Joined: 11/28/2014
Msg: 59
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 9:30:26 PM
Oh no, another poster who reverts to those big bad words. msg 58, you join the others(cotter, sckoochie, joe, irish) who when someone disagrees, all hell breaks loose and you people go ballistic. Arrogance is a great definition for these posters. You people are consistent with that.
 ChaoticSphere
Joined: 11/13/2015
Msg: 60
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/9/2016 10:45:33 PM

See what I mean? That right there. Missing what was really being said, and arguing about something else in order to steer away from a point which is legitimate.

A legitimate point and a legitimate concern. Geoengineering is a controversial solution to the problem! I think it was in 2015 that MIT came out with a study expressing concerns over geoengineering and weather modification. I believe but could be wrong that it was the first in-depth study of ocean fertilization and magnified the potential dangers.
 Walts
Joined: 5/7/2005
Msg: 61
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/10/2016 10:17:59 AM

See what I mean? That right there. Missing what was really being said, and arguing about something else in order to steer away from a point which is legitimate.


Could you explain your meaning here drink??? I understood what Igor was saying, do you understand what I was trying to say?

In simplified terms, I believe we humans "think" we are smarter than we are. We seem to be on a continuous search for solutions to problems we have created. And then we define them as "management", despite the history that we have, showing that we really don't have a clue what the end result of our "management" (best guess, in my opinion). We "think" we are "fixing" but, after a certain period of time, another problem arises because of our actions to "fix".
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 62
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/10/2016 10:33:15 AM
sorta like coming out with drugs for diabetes, that have side effects, rather than doing the smart thing and cutting down on sugar intake?

an ounce of prevention still beats a pound of cure...but, oh, so difficult to stop the human nature of just being gluttonous for more, rather than deciding holding back on that which makes us sick is the smarter thing to do....
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/12/2016 3:06:41 AM

sorta like coming out with drugs for diabetes, that have side effects, rather than doing the smart thing and cutting down on sugar intake?

Saw a good PBS 2-hour show on this - Michael Pollan: In Defense of Food.
 woobytoodsday
Joined: 12/13/2006
Msg: 64
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/12/2016 1:37:47 PM
drinks, I really like Michael Pollan and Alice Waters, et al.--but it always seems to me that they imagine other people live in California where access to fresh, non-polluted food is fairly possible. Year round. It's not. While I no longer have to tell the check out clerk what an avocado is, I still do, for artichokes. I can get Lender's frozen egg bagels, but no lox. I can do a bit better at Costco, but it's a 120 mile round trip, so planning ahead, weeks ahead, is necessary.

As for cutting down on sugar? How about potatoes, sweet potatoes, pasta, bread, biscuits, turnips, parsnips, cherries? 2 slices of whole grain ("healthy") bread will raise your blood sugar higher, and faster, than a Snickers bar.
 caballerosiempre
Joined: 12/5/2015
Msg: 65
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/12/2016 2:28:38 PM
I saw a good documentary, and read the book, Silent Spring, by Rachel Carson..everybody was supposed to be dead as of 40 years ago.
But every few years there will be another Chicken Little who gains attention and prominence in the headlines.
"Woe are we!"
 DameWrite
Joined: 2/27/2010
Msg: 66
view profile
History
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/12/2016 2:44:49 PM
Dame right I do, and we better quit polluting our air, water and food supply.

BTW because of the TTP you and I will not get to know where our food comes from anymore. We won this fight before ...now it's lost under the new rules and not going to be listed on your packages anymore.

Fukushima prawns that a get super grown in bins with contaminated H2O and human waste anyone?

Stop the TTP Your tax dollars will be paying corporations to sue your gov't as well as promote/lie to you.
 caballerosiempre
Joined: 12/5/2015
Msg: 67
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/12/2016 4:04:00 PM
Malthusians were predicting the imminent end of the world, mass starvation and death to humanity, over 200 years ago, as well
 ICEMAN850
Joined: 12/22/2014
Msg: 68
view profile
History
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 1/13/2016 12:20:03 PM
Yep I sure do.

Spring Summer Fall and Winter

It's called weather people!
 LOLTrump
Joined: 3/7/2017
Msg: 69
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 8/23/2017 9:02:11 PM
Just an fyi, this may be a bit shocking to some, but it seems that a mega corporation might have known the truth but kind of, sort of held that info back with regards to climate change.



Harvard study: Exxon 'misled the public' on climate change for nearly 40 years
by Matt Egan @mattmegan5 August 23, 2017: 1:06 PM ET

"We conclude that ExxonMobil misled the public," the researchers wrote in the peer-reviewed study that was published on Wednesday.

The Harvard study could add to the controversy and legal scrutiny surrounding Exxon's (XOM) handling of climate change.

Exxon dismissed the Harvard study as "inaccurate and preposterous," saying in a statement that the research was "paid for, written and published by activists."

The Harvard researchers examined 187 public and private communications from Exxon about climate change between 1977 and 2014, ranging from internal documents and peer-reviewed studies to company pamphlets and editorial-style advertisements in The New York Times known as "advertorials."

The study found that the more public-facing the Exxon communication, the more doubt it expressed about climate change.



http://money.cnn.com/2017/08/23/investing/exxon-misled-climate-change-harvard-study/index.html
 gtomustang
Joined: 6/16/2007
Msg: 70
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 8/24/2017 5:46:45 AM
i'm shocked--shocked!--that a business that had something to benefit, decided to take benefit over doing the right thing.

of course, one of the Seven Sisters predicted Peak Oil, and I think fracking has basically pushed the date ahead?
 Darwin1971
Joined: 1/31/2013
Msg: 71
view profile
History
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 8/25/2017 12:00:54 PM
Everyone talks about CO2 emissions and gases of all sorts. When the earth has had more CO2 in the air in the past much more and low and behold that CO2 was changed into plant life and then oil/coal/gas. Nature has far more power to change the gasses in the air. A single volcano can destroy vast areas of land and sea life along with changing the temperature a few degrees for the entire planet for years (oh colder in most historical events btw). These things are facts.

Now do we have an effect on the environment? VERY LIKELY! but not as much from gas but how we change the landscape of the world.
Think about it
VAST amounts of Black parking lots and black roofs on our buildings replacing large swaths of farmland/grassland/forest
Now these dark areas collect the suns heat and hold onto it longer than a green field. Solution how about a nice white roof or a little whiter road/parking lot. This will reflect more of the suns energy back into space and will help lower the air temp. I know you can cook an egg on a road never been able to cook an egg in a field of grass without the aid of a fire.

The environmental movement has fought for years to limit deforestation and the "let nature do its thing" movement basically saying a forest fire that is started by lightning or nature should be allowed to burn unless it endangers human life or property. But allowing more reasonable logging and forest management could allow for better control of all types of forest fires. these fires put large amounts of CO2 gases into the air.
A tree is a CO2 storage device when you cut down a tree yes the tree dies but you replace each tree you cut down with 3-5 saplings the eventual CO2 footprint will be lower. while the original tree goes into building a building that then locks that CO2 into a structure for many many years 100 years is possible and even when it is torn down most of the time it is then put into a landfill or burned for energy.

A forest is like a huge swamp cooler it converts the suns energy into plant growth instead of heat. It also holds moisture in the air that then cools the air that blows through it. The world has/is losing vast swaths of forest on every continent start with replacing some trees.

Why is it that we feel that we need to invent a way out of this. Nature solved this problem a long time ago.
Do what you can to help. Plant 2-5 trees in your back yard. Plan your trips don't drive to starbucks and sit in line for 15 min with car idling. get on your bike or walk if you need a $6 coffee.

my $.02
 LOLTrump
Joined: 3/7/2017
Msg: 72
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 8/25/2017 12:18:11 PM

Why is it that we feel that we need to invent a way out of this. Nature solved this problem a long time ago.


Because the rate of change being observed is unprecedented and as such nature is unable to deal with what we are doing to the planet.

A basic understanding of climate change would mean you would have already known this.
 2ufo2
Joined: 8/29/2016
Msg: 73
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 8/25/2017 3:08:46 PM

Why is it that we feel that we need to invent a way out of this. Nature solved this problem a long time ago.


Because humans are expendable to Nature.
 deetristate
Joined: 12/4/2014
Msg: 74
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 8/30/2017 9:31:22 AM
Natural disasters are . . . well, natural disasters.
However . . .

Texas, like places in the north in other years, have made natural disasters worse by paving over where the water would go and removing trees and their roots, wich also aid water distribution.
 BeckyHT
Joined: 1/1/2013
Msg: 75
view profile
History
Why do you believe or not believe that Climate change is taking place
Posted: 8/30/2017 9:49:37 AM


"Why is it that we feel that we need to invent a way out of this. Nature solved this problem a long time ago."

Because the rate of change being observed is unprecedented and as such nature is unable to deal with what we are doing to the planet.

A basic understanding of climate change would mean you would have already known this.

Mother nature is controlling earth much more than humans. Of course the climate changes all the time, but I'm not convinced humans are causing it to any great extent... yet. Where I live there have been forest fires over the past several years including this year, that cover 80,000 and 90,000 acres. The amount of fuel burned in these fires generates huge amounts of CO2. We can't stop these fires from occurring, because many are caused by lightening.

And you can't forget the largest controlling power... the SUN. It generates cycles affecting our planet; why don't people remember this and acknowledge it? The SUN will affect our planet for nearly an eternity.

Our biggest problem, is our growing human population. There could be a day where we can't handle all of our human waste, our clean water sources won't be sufficient, and even more so, we're pushing mother nature's other living things, plants and animals, into extinction. More of us, less of them. Somehow we think we own this planet... but if disease or nuclear war, or insufficient resources make us go extinct... mother nature will just control the planet.
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